Netflix cracks down on proxy streaming(bbc.com)
bbc.com
Netflix cracks down on proxy streaming
http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-35320436
111 comments
Previous discussion: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10902323
Netflix came to Kazakhstan few days ago. So far I used torrents, because there were no legal services with good enough offerings for me. I'm using Netherlands VPN almost always, because Kazakhstan bans many sites. So I subscribed to Netflix and I liked that service, I would definitely continue that subscription. But I switched off my VPN once and suddenly everything I watched just disappeared. It's blocked for me. So probably back to torrents for now. I really liked Netflix interface, it's the best experience I've ever seen. But interface doesn't worth a penny without content.
Have you seen Popcorn Time before? A friend of mine has been using it when travelling to places with restrictions on Netflix access.
AFAIK Popcorn Time uses torrents, it'll not be a problem for OP but in other countries (such as Germany, I think) it can and will cause you legal problems and fines for pirating content.
At least with proxies/VPNs + Netflix you'd not trigger those kind of penalties.
At least with proxies/VPNs + Netflix you'd not trigger those kind of penalties.
You can just use a VPN with popcorn as well (or "normal" torrents for that matter).
Didn't Popcorn Time go down?
UK subscriber here.
When using a proxy to access US content I get about double the content. If I can't do this anymore, it's not worth the price and I will be gone.
When using a proxy to access US content I get about double the content. If I can't do this anymore, it's not worth the price and I will be gone.
If going by the numbers of titles over at flixsearch.io, UK has 2983 titles whereas US has 5750 titles in its Netflix library. Which is roughly double. But I'm not sure how correct those numbers are.
South Korea apparently only has 672 titles.
South Korea apparently only has 672 titles.
Yep, it's useless. Even original Netflix content is region restricted. For the full price too.
Original Netflix content isn't inherently Netflix's content. Netflix has exclusive rights to air the content, so it's branded as original.
It's akin to a college football bowl game sponsorship here in the US. There's the Royal Purple Las Vegas Bowl, Go Daddy Bowl, Buffalo Wild Wing's Citrus Bowl, etc. The companies aren't actually in control of the bowl games, but they get the branding that's associated with it for that year.
Calling it a Netflix Original tends to be a misnomer, although I don't think this is the case with all of their shows.
It's akin to a college football bowl game sponsorship here in the US. There's the Royal Purple Las Vegas Bowl, Go Daddy Bowl, Buffalo Wild Wing's Citrus Bowl, etc. The companies aren't actually in control of the bowl games, but they get the branding that's associated with it for that year.
Calling it a Netflix Original tends to be a misnomer, although I don't think this is the case with all of their shows.
And the UK netflix is one of the best one apart from the US one, just imagine the catalogue you have in other countries...
- The French and German Netflix have 3 times less content than the US
- The Italian one, almost 5 times less content.
- The Russian one, almost 8 times less.
(numbers taken from flixsearch.io, not sure how it's accurate)
There are vast difference in catalogue between the different countries.
- The French and German Netflix have 3 times less content than the US
- The Italian one, almost 5 times less content.
- The Russian one, almost 8 times less.
(numbers taken from flixsearch.io, not sure how it's accurate)
There are vast difference in catalogue between the different countries.
And the UK film catalogue is already pretty poor. Try searching for Jack Nicholson (compared to its IMDB filmography). Double that would only be "less poor".
Whereas if they continue to let you proxy content internationally they'll lose their licenses for said content and Netflix will be gone.
Netflix don't benefit from blocking you. This move is driven by content license negotiations. Someone has told them to stop letting people outside of the US access that content, and given the fact that content acquisition is Netflix's biggest cost I can understand why they're listening.
Netflix don't benefit from blocking you. This move is driven by content license negotiations. Someone has told them to stop letting people outside of the US access that content, and given the fact that content acquisition is Netflix's biggest cost I can understand why they're listening.
Ok, good point, but what are customers supposed to do with that information? Should they feel sorry for Netflix?
The task of a vendor is to shield customers from all problems in the supply chain. If a vendor can't fulfill that task, customers may rightfully complain, or end their contract when possible.
The task of a vendor is to shield customers from all problems in the supply chain. If a vendor can't fulfill that task, customers may rightfully complain, or end their contract when possible.
They're not supposed to do anything, but some of us strive to be informed and rational about things. This is not a problem in the supply chain, this is a product that used to be available, but isn't anymore. The task of a vendor is not to make sure any product ever sold will remain available indefinitely.
By all means, cancel your subscription if it's no longer good value, no-one will argue that you have some implied obligation to give Netflix money.
You can complain all you want, but why waste your breath complaining to someone when, knowing the background, you know it's outside their powers to do anything about it?
By all means, cancel your subscription if it's no longer good value, no-one will argue that you have some implied obligation to give Netflix money.
You can complain all you want, but why waste your breath complaining to someone when, knowing the background, you know it's outside their powers to do anything about it?
Please have a look at Netflix' blog post about this issue [1]
Given the fact that they offer this little information, I think we have the right to complain. For example, this post gives no clue about what the true hurdles are in getting better licensing deals, and in what timeframe they will be resolved.
[1] https://media.netflix.com/en/company-blog/evolving-proxy-det...
Given the fact that they offer this little information, I think we have the right to complain. For example, this post gives no clue about what the true hurdles are in getting better licensing deals, and in what timeframe they will be resolved.
[1] https://media.netflix.com/en/company-blog/evolving-proxy-det...
When companies are negotiating complex agreements, one of the first rules is that you don't talk about them in public until the contract is signed. Remember that Netflix has to not only negotiate a deal which they can afford now but also that they have to renew that deal in the future.
They don't have anywhere near enough original content to risk a major content provider getting offended, particularly given how much more competition they have now.
They don't have anywhere near enough original content to risk a major content provider getting offended, particularly given how much more competition they have now.
> You can complain all you want, but why waste your breath complaining to someone when, knowing the background, you know it's outside their powers to do anything about it?
I'm sure Netflix could get more/better content if they like, as evidenced by the US site. They just choose not to in most countries. Additionally, translated content for local audiences is often only regionally available. So if your family immigrated from another part of the would, Netflix will soon become less valuable. Torrenting or other options will become more valuable.
I'm sure Netflix could get more/better content if they like, as evidenced by the US site. They just choose not to in most countries. Additionally, translated content for local audiences is often only regionally available. So if your family immigrated from another part of the would, Netflix will soon become less valuable. Torrenting or other options will become more valuable.
[deleted]
FWIW, "elsewhere" hears the same demands from the rights owners. If the number of VPN users seems large, then those demands grow loud and insistent.
Yep, also because I get most of that half content for "free" with Amazon Prime... If I quit netflix I'll save the netflix money and the vpn service money (or, at least, I can scale down to an anonymizer).
Denmark is paying 15$ per month and only getting 2151 vs. the US 8$ per month for 5751 titles.
The Americans paying $8 / mo signed up before the price increase. An American signing up today has to pay $10 / mo.
That does not of course undermine your basic point.
That does not of course undermine your basic point.
This would be a fine argument if everything else in Denmark cost the same as it does in the US.
(Also, is tax included in the $15 figure?)
(Also, is tax included in the $15 figure?)
Denmark's minimum wage is ~$20 (US minimum is $7.25).
Unfortunately, this means that I will have to reconsider my membership. Their service in Germany is just not comprehensive enough. I hope that this is just a short term problem until they a) renegotiated their licensing contracts and then stop the blocking again (more likely) or b) they actually get global licenses (less likely).
Their original content is getting more and more interesting but its just not enough to justify the price, IMHO. Maybe they should consider a package with only Netflix Originals for 50% off or something.
Their original content is getting more and more interesting but its just not enough to justify the price, IMHO. Maybe they should consider a package with only Netflix Originals for 50% off or something.
I'm using the German Netflix without a VPN or proxy, so I'm unfamiliar with the differences between the German and US offerings? Would you care to tell me more? What are you watching on US Netflix that is not available on German Netflix?
If you checkout https://flixsearch.io/ you can see the number of shows by country. Germany has 1808 and USA has 5750 shows available. I'm in Australia and there's the extremely ridiculous situation where a Netflix created show "Better Call Saul" isn't available to Australian Netflix users because Netflix sold the show's rights to a local competitor before they had a presence in Australia.
Acoording to Wikipedia, Better Call Saul is produced by Sony for AMC, not Netflix:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_Call_Saul#Development_h...
> Netflix was one of many interested distributors, but ultimately a deal was made between AMC and Breaking Bad production company Sony Pictures Television.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_Call_Saul#Development_h...
> Netflix was one of many interested distributors, but ultimately a deal was made between AMC and Breaking Bad production company Sony Pictures Television.
A better example would be maybe House of Cards. In many countries new episodes are only available with a delay. For example, in Germany they are put online six months after the US start, because they sold the rights to Sky.
> where a Netflix created show "Better Call Saul" isn't available to Australian Netflix users because Netflix sold the show's rights to a local competitor before they had a presence in Australia.
Netflix had nothing to do with creating Better Call Saul, and Netflix definitely was aware of it's plans to expand to Australia during the same timeframe as Better Call Saul being developed and sold to Stan.
Netflix had nothing to do with creating Better Call Saul, and Netflix definitely was aware of it's plans to expand to Australia during the same timeframe as Better Call Saul being developed and sold to Stan.
I use it from the Netherlands but have had American subscriptions in the past. I can say that, approximately, the American Netflix library is at least 10 times as large, in my memory and guessing. Sure I get some Dutch shows in the Dutch subscription that probably aren't in the American version (though I wouldn't be surprised if they were!), but in general, it's missing a huge range of content that only Americans get access to (and maybe some other countries too, but not us).
Does the content you get from the American version while in the Netherlands come with Dutch subtitles just as if it were the Dutch version (I mean in the cases where some content is available in both versions)? I'm asking because some memebers of my family need the subtitles, so I keep using the local version instead of the American one.
The Dutch don't rely on subtitles or dubs the way the Germans do (in fact, Germany has the largest overdub market in the world!) since the Netherlands is essentially a bilingual nation, so I've found that nearly all shows that are in English in the Dutch subscription (and most of the content is) have a Dutch subtitle option that does nothing... no subtitles.
I have not tried to connect to Netflix from NL using an American proxy, so can't comment on that.
I have not tried to connect to Netflix from NL using an American proxy, so can't comment on that.
http://unogs.com/
Gives you a search which also tells you where the content is available. You will see, that Germany is hardly ever included. In my (subjective) view, Germany has one of the thinnest catalogs.
Gives you a search which also tells you where the content is available. You will see, that Germany is hardly ever included. In my (subjective) view, Germany has one of the thinnest catalogs.
My girlfriend started watching Reign on Netflix when we were visiting the US. She is able to watch it when she visits me in the UK. At her home in Germany it is unavailable.
As my girlfriend watches it as well, I can tell you that at least Reign is now available on Netflix Germany.
With respect to the other shows: interesting - let's me question my non-use of a VPN as well.
This nationalization of the internet is ridiculous. Especially in the media business where you don't even have to torrent anymore. One-Click-Hosters or streams are all over the place. Popular shows can be found by googling.
I just can't understand how we can still move backwards facing all this. I have the feeling that the content providers just hope for the inability of their customers to google.
But hey, I taught a guy who last year didn't even use YouTube to find his favorite US shows from Germany and how to download them in 1080p without any risk. So please...wake up.
I just can't understand how we can still move backwards facing all this. I have the feeling that the content providers just hope for the inability of their customers to google.
But hey, I taught a guy who last year didn't even use YouTube to find his favorite US shows from Germany and how to download them in 1080p without any risk. So please...wake up.
This has to do with licensing and rights more than anything else.. not just "the internet"
Just because you have rights to something in one country, does not mean you have rights to that same thing in another country and so on.
Content providers are up against an amazing amount of bureaucracy, and only have limited resources to deal with these things.. especially considering we're talking about different laws and systems for virtually every country on the planet.
I'm certain Netflix would like to offer you as much content as they can, but they also have to respect existing law.
Just because you have rights to something in one country, does not mean you have rights to that same thing in another country and so on.
Content providers are up against an amazing amount of bureaucracy, and only have limited resources to deal with these things.. especially considering we're talking about different laws and systems for virtually every country on the planet.
I'm certain Netflix would like to offer you as much content as they can, but they also have to respect existing law.
And if copyright/cultural owners don't pay attention and start selling "global rights", piracy will continue to be their worry.
^ This. We can solve this problem by continuing to ensure the "fixes" don't work. Because above all Netflix proved that the convenience is worth the price of admission...but that region locks in a world with global bandwidth, paying customers and very limited distribution costs are pants-on-head stupid.
I think the problem is TV. Local networks still have power thanks to controlling TV/cable channels, and they demand exclusive rights over their region. That's why even Netflix doesn't have their own original series on many countries - they sold the rights to local cable networks.
However what is determined to be "in one country" is a matter of negotiation. Amazon considers the "account country" the country. Netflix the "IP country" the country.
Maybe that is the case for Amazon's video offerings but despite registering an account on amazon.de, I am not able to buy German Kindle e-books in the USA. You would think it wouldn't matter.. I can get most of the same books in English here.
Going to amazon.com or amazon.de?
The only "fair" thing they could do is have specific-country accounts. If you have a UK account then you get UK price and UK content everywhere in the world.
It would suck, because of course the US version is much better, but at least it would be fair.
I find it shocking that I can't access the content I'm paying them for if I'm traveling to a different country. I don't even know if it's legally sound...
That said, per-country licensing is simply stupid. However that's how the content industry works for historical reasons, and they are known to be 30 years behind in technological understanding...
Edited to add:
Ultimately, it's a war that the content providers can't win. In order to watch Star Trek via streaming from the UK, on line I have 3 options at the moment:
1) Use a VPN and Netflix USA
2) Use a VPN and torrents
If they kill the first, what options to they leave?
It would suck, because of course the US version is much better, but at least it would be fair.
I find it shocking that I can't access the content I'm paying them for if I'm traveling to a different country. I don't even know if it's legally sound...
That said, per-country licensing is simply stupid. However that's how the content industry works for historical reasons, and they are known to be 30 years behind in technological understanding...
Edited to add:
Ultimately, it's a war that the content providers can't win. In order to watch Star Trek via streaming from the UK, on line I have 3 options at the moment:
1) Use a VPN and Netflix USA
2) Use a VPN and torrents
If they kill the first, what options to they leave?
Why don't you rent/buy the movie on iTunes or Amazon? It's available. And if you were to rent it on iTunes you could start streaming it immediately.
Because their price is appaling.
Star Trek on Neflix US: part of a 6£/m subscription;
Watching a complete series (TNG) on iTunes (renting): not available;
Watching a complete series (TNG) on iTunes (buying): 280£;
Star Trek on Neflix US: part of a 6£/m subscription;
Watching a complete series (TNG) on iTunes (renting): not available;
Watching a complete series (TNG) on iTunes (buying): 280£;
I thought we were talking about a Star Trek movie, not series, my mistake. I don't think a price comparison in that way is completely fair. You make the purchase from iTunes and it's yours for life. You have to continue paying Netflix when you want to watch it. There are also other limitations (can't watch the Netflix version when flying for example). My point though is that, even though it's expensive, buying it is a viable option. You may not be able to afford to binge it in a weekend this way but it's a perfectly viable option as purchasing content for a similar price has been for people for decades.
Buying all the Star Trek series (29x40£=1160£) costs like 15 years of Netflix (6£*180=1080£)...
Because those options (Amazon in particular) only exist in a few regions. Most importantly, they're not as widely available as Netflix, I've a netflix app on my phone and on my TV, this isn't true for amazon and apple.
For people concerned, I asked the Smartflix team if it will impact their service. Here is their answer:
"Hello! Yes, we are aware about the recent statement that Netflix has published, and needless to say we are upset about it!
However this does not mean the end of Smartflix. We are constantly able to outsmart these systems, and we will continue to do so for as long as humanly possible - so fear not!"
"Hello! Yes, we are aware about the recent statement that Netflix has published, and needless to say we are upset about it!
However this does not mean the end of Smartflix. We are constantly able to outsmart these systems, and we will continue to do so for as long as humanly possible - so fear not!"
As I understand it they intend to charge their users at some point? Doesn't look like a sound plan to me as Smartflix will probably have to constantly fight against whatever measures Netflix (or its licensing partners) comes up with.
I, as a potential user, certainly wouldn't rely on that service.
I can see a lot of people I know cancelling their subs. Also I wonder if this will result in a resurgence of torrents as people find other ways to watch their shows.
From a technical standpoint, how can they actually enforce this?
I can see how they can do this for publically advertised proxies used by many people, but what about individuals with their own cloud servers hosting their own proxy or VPN? (i.e. me!)
I can see how they can do this for publically advertised proxies used by many people, but what about individuals with their own cloud servers hosting their own proxy or VPN? (i.e. me!)
Can't they just discriminate based on your billing address?
Thats the obvious solution, though how would that affect people using Netlfix while traveling?
For example, if you're locked to the US region and watch something that is only available in the US while visiting, say, the UK — would that break any of Netflix's license agreements?
For example, if you're locked to the US region and watch something that is only available in the US while visiting, say, the UK — would that break any of Netflix's license agreements?
Same thing with app stores.
Try to buy some apps in one country and download them again while in another.
Last time I read about this it wasn't possible to do so.
Try to buy some apps in one country and download them again while in another.
Last time I read about this it wasn't possible to do so.
Not true (at least with Apple), my main Apple ID is Italian, but I live in the UK, and I use with no problem...
Can you delete an app bought in the italian app store while in Italy and then install the same app via the UK app store while in UK?
This was the issue I read about, just the example was from a guy in Europe that moved back to Canada.
This was the issue I read about, just the example was from a guy in Europe that moved back to Canada.
That only applies if you change the country your account is linked to (since for some reason in 2016 most companies have yet not figured out people move...), but all you need is a valid payment method for the country you wish to use and you can use that account anywhere you want
Apple does not care one tiny bit where you are when making purchases. All you need is an account with a valid payment method in that country. Your account is linked to one country, regardless of where you are or what SIM card is in your phone.
This whole topic is probably not inititated by Netflix, but by the contracts they sign with the distributors.
Distributors don't care about this, they care about geographically determined licenses. And apparently they want to see that this is technically enforced to some degree.
Distributors don't care about this, they care about geographically determined licenses. And apparently they want to see that this is technically enforced to some degree.
Amazon streaming only works when you're in your home country, no matter where your billing address is. At least for Amazon UK. When I'm in America, I have to VPN back to the UK to download content for the flight back.
> how would that affect people using Netlfix while traveling?
"Tough"
"Tough"
No, it all still comes back to licensing. They offer different catalogs per country because they are not legally allowed to distribute certain content in certain places, because they don't have the rights. If they go "oh you live in the US, have some US content while on vacation in AU!", then they are actively distributing that content in AU. If they don't have rights to do that, it's illegal.
They'll never do this based on billing address because they don't care where you're FROM, they care where you ARE.
They'll never do this based on billing address because they don't care where you're FROM, they care where you ARE.
I wish they would do that. I have many friends who share accounts internationally (I'm one of them, I live in Denmark and my account is shared with a friend in the Netherlands and a couple who lives in Portugal) and this would mean that they no longer need a vpn to get content from catalogues better than their countries'. The Portuguese catalogue in particular is incredibly limited.
If they did that all it'd is have one of our mates living in the US to make us an account and we'd never have to VPN again.
If they did that all it'd is have one of our mates living in the US to make us an account and we'd never have to VPN again.
1. Check where your billing info is located
2. Block VPS providers
Probably block the IP address of VPN services. Maybe even block IPs that are from hosting companies.
Yes, in theory, smart people can set up their own VPN and work around it. But they'd probably be happy if the average user can't access it. I doubt their goal is 100% coverage, they'd be happy with 90%.
Yes, in theory, smart people can set up their own VPN and work around it. But they'd probably be happy if the average user can't access it. I doubt their goal is 100% coverage, they'd be happy with 90%.
Some thoughts:
1.They don't need to stop you on sight, nor cur your connection every time you connected through VPN. But if they can eventually detect your pattern, then disrupt it, which will lead to great inconvenience for you, and it will be sufficient to stop most of the users from using VPN.
2.They can surely use your billing information for this purpose, as it is case with Google Play.
3.Another thing to be remind of, a international user might not always use VPN for Netflix, likely they will switch back for their local content at some point. If such traffic switch happens, it is easy to detect for further action.
4.Again, it is quite complicated process I believe, and like all softwares, there are loopholes. But I believe their goal is to stop MOST common users from using VPN for cross-regional content easily, not ALL of them. This is quite achievable.
1.They don't need to stop you on sight, nor cur your connection every time you connected through VPN. But if they can eventually detect your pattern, then disrupt it, which will lead to great inconvenience for you, and it will be sufficient to stop most of the users from using VPN.
2.They can surely use your billing information for this purpose, as it is case with Google Play.
3.Another thing to be remind of, a international user might not always use VPN for Netflix, likely they will switch back for their local content at some point. If such traffic switch happens, it is easy to detect for further action.
4.Again, it is quite complicated process I believe, and like all softwares, there are loopholes. But I believe their goal is to stop MOST common users from using VPN for cross-regional content easily, not ALL of them. This is quite achievable.
There are people who travel internationally. What happens then? Do they get mistreated due to the changing country where they happen to be watching? Currently they have their catalog limited and have to resort to a VPN to resolve the issue.
It is possible that Netflix will just let it be. I am not sure as how the terms and agreement going, but the copy-right holder might only provide access to their content within certain region, so if you are out of that region, you cannot access it, even you are member of Netflix.
It is just my speculation, but as consider the same practice is actually enforced before, e.g. DVD region codes.
It is just my speculation, but as consider the same practice is actually enforced before, e.g. DVD region codes.
With Prime, at least, that is exactly what happens. I travel frequently, and Prime just straight up tells me that the content is not available in my region. US citizen, set up the account and everything in the US, but the last time I left the country, it was pretty much watching Prime a few hours before the flight, land in Helsinki 7 hours later, Prime tells me "Sorry, content not available in your region"
Then Netflix should work on expanding their catalog in other countries.
I'd image they'd just block access to anyone connecting from a Datacenter/Cloud Provider, using a dataset like this one https://github.com/client9/ipcat. I'm sure there are more complete paid for datasets out there - probably from someone like https://www.maxmind.com. That would likely block 95% or more of the VPN/proxies out there. It will probably be a bit of a whack a mole approach to the get the rest but you'll get pretty fed up signing up to some obscure and possibly slow/expensive vpn provider to find it blocked 2 days later.
What's actually interesting is that they are now openly admitting that they have been turning a blind eye to this before when 1. it's relatively simple and 2. it has always been a requirement of the content rights holders.
What's actually interesting is that they are now openly admitting that they have been turning a blind eye to this before when 1. it's relatively simple and 2. it has always been a requirement of the content rights holders.
That will also catch a lot of legit users that use a VPN to avoid ISP snooping as well.
Edit: Apparently I've been working on AWS VPCs so long I no longer remember how to spell VPN
Edit: Apparently I've been working on AWS VPCs so long I no longer remember how to spell VPN
> That would likely block 95% or more of the VPN/proxies out there.
And that's probably good enough. I imagine (but have zero proof) that they need to be seen to be taking reasonable efforts to stop out-of-region people from accessing their services, rather than having some system that absolutely blocks 100% of out-of-region accesses.
And that's probably good enough. I imagine (but have zero proof) that they need to be seen to be taking reasonable efforts to stop out-of-region people from accessing their services, rather than having some system that absolutely blocks 100% of out-of-region accesses.
How do they spot proxies? Do they have lists of known proxy IPs? Or do they have a way to tell from the incoming connection? I wouldn't be very hard to fire up a VM in a cloud service to watch a movie, switch it off when done. The cost should be fairly marginal, and you would come from a new unique IP every time.
Good point. There might even be a business for that, transient proxy vm's.
From NF's viewpoint however, nobody has their living room in Amazon or Azure, so any connections from cloud providers can be safely dropped also.
From NF's viewpoint however, nobody has their living room in Amazon or Azure, so any connections from cloud providers can be safely dropped also.
If this is indeed forced by content creators, I think it is counter productive. They will just give more incentive to Netflix (and Amazon and others) to create they own content, as third part content lose them money.
Perssonal view: the "Original Netflix Content" sign already give me a more value perception. Between a recycled TV show and a new one by Netflix, I always chose the new on by Netflix. So far I watched all of: Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Making a Murderer, House of Cards, Narcos, Sense8, Bloodline, Orange is the new black, Master of None, Better Call Saul.
And I'll probably keep watching the next seasons of all of them.
Outside of Netflix, I only follow the very best ones (IMO): Game of Thrones, Breaking Bad (that's over) and Walking Dead.
What this means? I consume only the very best hits that these other content creators produce. For casual, day-to-day entertainment, that covers 90% of the time, I stay with Netflix.
Perssonal view: the "Original Netflix Content" sign already give me a more value perception. Between a recycled TV show and a new one by Netflix, I always chose the new on by Netflix. So far I watched all of: Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Making a Murderer, House of Cards, Narcos, Sense8, Bloodline, Orange is the new black, Master of None, Better Call Saul.
And I'll probably keep watching the next seasons of all of them.
Outside of Netflix, I only follow the very best ones (IMO): Game of Thrones, Breaking Bad (that's over) and Walking Dead.
What this means? I consume only the very best hits that these other content creators produce. For casual, day-to-day entertainment, that covers 90% of the time, I stay with Netflix.
So here's the thing -- vendors of DVDs used to constrain who could view (and when) the various cuts of their product based on where the viewers (or rather, purchasers) were located.
Someone [1] worked around this and subsequently the idea of region-locked DVD discs & players became a historical footnote.
Why is the same industry evidently repeating the same mistake?
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Lech_Johansen
Someone [1] worked around this and subsequently the idea of region-locked DVD discs & players became a historical footnote.
Why is the same industry evidently repeating the same mistake?
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Lech_Johansen
It's a slightly different technology being dealt with here and to some degree I have sympathy for Netflix and other stream providers (mostly Amazon).
The difference between the DVD region locking and the stream region locking is that the powers that be never stood a chance at locking down the DVDs. It's like the old saying about physical access to a machine - all bets are pretty much off at that point. The DVD region locking cases were more just a desperate attempt to get some legal teeth to hit people with rather than actually stop the issue. After all, once the DVDs are in the wild and the crack is live, you can't really stop people from removing the region lock, you can just sue them after the fact.
With streamed content, it's a different ball-game since the providers technically can control the delivery and experience all the way through the content. If Netflix et. al. can create a successful means of blocking VPN and proxy access, then you sure bet that the rights-holders are going to double-down on the region blocking. The rights-holders already are getting their cut from Netflix et. al., so it's not like they're losing a huge chunk of change, and if people up and up ditch the streaming sites, that falls more in line with what the rights-holders likely want anyways.
I really enjoy Prime's video selection, and from what I've seen with Netflix, it's nice. I'm in Russia right now and I really wish that I could watch the shows I've paid for access to on Prime. But I don't really hold any disillusionment as to where the fault lies here. The rights-holders made dozens upon dozens of distribution agreements about what can be shown where and by who, and Netflix and its kin are pretty much just stuck.
Hopefully they can show that their model is more profitable as a global library rather than regional libraries, and the content holders will loosen their grip. Maybe I'll win the lottery.
The difference between the DVD region locking and the stream region locking is that the powers that be never stood a chance at locking down the DVDs. It's like the old saying about physical access to a machine - all bets are pretty much off at that point. The DVD region locking cases were more just a desperate attempt to get some legal teeth to hit people with rather than actually stop the issue. After all, once the DVDs are in the wild and the crack is live, you can't really stop people from removing the region lock, you can just sue them after the fact.
With streamed content, it's a different ball-game since the providers technically can control the delivery and experience all the way through the content. If Netflix et. al. can create a successful means of blocking VPN and proxy access, then you sure bet that the rights-holders are going to double-down on the region blocking. The rights-holders already are getting their cut from Netflix et. al., so it's not like they're losing a huge chunk of change, and if people up and up ditch the streaming sites, that falls more in line with what the rights-holders likely want anyways.
I really enjoy Prime's video selection, and from what I've seen with Netflix, it's nice. I'm in Russia right now and I really wish that I could watch the shows I've paid for access to on Prime. But I don't really hold any disillusionment as to where the fault lies here. The rights-holders made dozens upon dozens of distribution agreements about what can be shown where and by who, and Netflix and its kin are pretty much just stuck.
Hopefully they can show that their model is more profitable as a global library rather than regional libraries, and the content holders will loosen their grip. Maybe I'll win the lottery.
Well there goes my subscription.
My question is: how can they tell (and block) if a user is streaming through VPN? Do they systematically block all major VPN provider domains? Anyone know how this is done?
I believe the first step would be associating your method of payment with the country whose content you are eligible to see.
So, a Brazilian citizen living in the US would pay the Netflix account using his Brazilian Credit card. And that would block him into Netflix Brazil content? The origin of the CC is the issue? What about 'generic' CC you can buy at stores?
The reality of it is, that they don't want to do this but they are being forced to. I suspect they'll put some measures in place but nothing ironclad.
It does occur to me that this was probably a lot like Comedy Central's ridiculously easily circumvented geo-blocking. I suspect the sysadmins said "what's the laziest thing we can do?"
My parents recently moved to Turkey, and I set them up with NordVPN (good service and easy to use for non-technical people). All they really wanted to watch was Star Trek: TNG anyway, which, even after the big availability push, is not available via Turkish Netflix. Without being able to do that, they will certainly cancel that subscription.
I recently resubscribed, but I had forgotten the lack of content without proxies and since I'm mostly just streaming to Chromecast from my phone I'm not sure I can even use a proxy anymore. I probably should unsubscribe either way. I haven't really watched anything new since I resubscribed
So if I'm traveling WITHIN the united states, I can't use my VPN on the shady hotel wifi? Lame.
Sounds like more Netflix through hotel set top boxes is in the works (e.g., http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2487505,00.asp).
This seems weird, it'll just increase piracy and lose them money? The people who are using proxies etc. really aren't doing anything wrong are they and they are paying for the service presumably in the locale they are proxying to?
Assuming that this is going to work by just blocking known proxy IPs, I suppose it can be worked-around simply by setting up your own VPN server, which really isn't that difficult.
I am wondering how blocking VPN services/proxies will work in IPv6. Seems to me like the sheer amount of IPv6 addresses would make blocking by address completely impossible
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I guess they "crack down" on their prices also then,
I mean I'd love to pay the same price from my eastern-european salary for the fraction of the US content,
if I would be bats#!t crazy.
I mean I'd love to pay the same price from my eastern-european salary for the fraction of the US content,
if I would be bats#!t crazy.
you mean Netflix will TRY to crack down on proxy streaming
They'll probably succeed for the most part, too. Who's going to spend their time playing cat and mouse when they can just unsubscribe and torrent? If you're not seeding, you're breaking the same law of unlicensed access to content either way.
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