CA Restaurant Owner In Tears Over Outdoor Dining Ban(twitter.com)
twitter.com
CA Restaurant Owner In Tears Over Outdoor Dining Ban
https://twitter.com/KyleTibbitts/status/1335028370321469440
42 comments
Page 11.
35-39 year olds 99.91% survival rate.
65-69 year olds 98.61% survival rate.
https://spiral.imperial.ac.uk:8443/bitstream/10044/1/83545/8...
https://spiral.imperial.ac.uk:8443/bitstream/10044/1/83545/8...
"99.91%" survival rate means "1 in a thousand chance of dying". Those aren't odds people ordinarily enjoy taking. Applied to the entire United States, it would still be 300,000 dead -- about the number of American dead in World War II.
Those 9s look great until you realize we're talking about dying. (And that's before we take into account the possibility of long-term disability.) "Low odds" times "Maximally bad outcome" means "take significant efforts to avoid".
Like maybe minor lifestyle changes, such as not going out to restaurants. Even if that's bad for restaurant owners because, ya know, death.
Those 9s look great until you realize we're talking about dying. (And that's before we take into account the possibility of long-term disability.) "Low odds" times "Maximally bad outcome" means "take significant efforts to avoid".
Like maybe minor lifestyle changes, such as not going out to restaurants. Even if that's bad for restaurant owners because, ya know, death.
How many require hospitalization? Because that number will easily overflow the available healthcare services increasing death of all other conditions.. It’s not that hard to understand
"""I get it but leaning on rapid tests is pretty much a step or two above tempature checks. It doesn't catch many positives. Every White House super spreader event occurred with rapid testing in place.
Then the city went on a rampage telling families last week they could not rely on the far greater and accurate PCR TESTING + isolation to see each other. That it is where it all falls apart for me
I do have sympathy for officials BUT you either fully lock down or you don't. This middle ground is a mess"""
https://www.reddit.com/r/LosAngeles/comments/k6y5f5/comment/...
Then the city went on a rampage telling families last week they could not rely on the far greater and accurate PCR TESTING + isolation to see each other. That it is where it all falls apart for me
I do have sympathy for officials BUT you either fully lock down or you don't. This middle ground is a mess"""
https://www.reddit.com/r/LosAngeles/comments/k6y5f5/comment/...
It also isn't a good look when the restrictions happen to fall on apparent political lines, even if it isn't intentional.
Hollywood productions, Amazon warehouses, protests in line with democratic party values, abortion clinics and pot shops = D leaning voters = Allowed, if not encouraged
Small businesses, churches, protests of lockdown measures, gun ranges, Musk and Tesla = R leaning voters = Forbidden, shun them, they are going to kill grandma
Add to that the many of the people advocating for these policies fail to follow them themselves (Nancy Pelosi, Gavin Newsom, London Breed, Dianne Feinstein just to name a few) and you can see how many especially those who are losing their livelihoods see this as a attack and are frustrated. The optics are extremely bad, though that might be the point.
Hollywood productions, Amazon warehouses, protests in line with democratic party values, abortion clinics and pot shops = D leaning voters = Allowed, if not encouraged
Small businesses, churches, protests of lockdown measures, gun ranges, Musk and Tesla = R leaning voters = Forbidden, shun them, they are going to kill grandma
Add to that the many of the people advocating for these policies fail to follow them themselves (Nancy Pelosi, Gavin Newsom, London Breed, Dianne Feinstein just to name a few) and you can see how many especially those who are losing their livelihoods see this as a attack and are frustrated. The optics are extremely bad, though that might be the point.
Tesla was deemed an essential business and remains open...
Outdoor gun ranges are also still open.
Churches are still open.
Also, most of Amazons warehouses are in conservative areas like San Bernardino and largely white employ right leaning voters.
Simply put, while the latest lockdowns follow the same ineffectual policies of the earlier lockdowns, they're not based on targeting ideological opponents and protecting political allies.
Outdoor gun ranges are also still open.
Churches are still open.
Also, most of Amazons warehouses are in conservative areas like San Bernardino and largely white employ right leaning voters.
Simply put, while the latest lockdowns follow the same ineffectual policies of the earlier lockdowns, they're not based on targeting ideological opponents and protecting political allies.
Musk had to fight tooth and nail for months to reopen and he's now moving to Texas because of this.
Chruches are only open because the highest court in the land, the surpreme court, overruled the Gov of Cali executive branches restrictions.
Outdoor gun ranges? Almost everything out door is still open...
Amazon is from Seattle and Bezos owns the WaPo. It's not conservative.
https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-ceo-elon-musk-reported...
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/03/us/coronavirus-supreme-co...
Simply put, Corona restrictions can easily be viewed as being ideologically based and also be viewed as having been weaponized against opposing political groups in California to hurt them, and its very concerning to see.
Chruches are only open because the highest court in the land, the surpreme court, overruled the Gov of Cali executive branches restrictions.
Outdoor gun ranges? Almost everything out door is still open...
Amazon is from Seattle and Bezos owns the WaPo. It's not conservative.
https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-ceo-elon-musk-reported...
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/03/us/coronavirus-supreme-co...
Simply put, Corona restrictions can easily be viewed as being ideologically based and also be viewed as having been weaponized against opposing political groups in California to hurt them, and its very concerning to see.
No, under the original orders, factories were always going to reopen with social distancing as as soon as practical once appropriate health measures were put into place (filters, fans, etc). Musk's antics actually delayed the reopening of factories in California because health officials hadn't contemplated that a billionaire would care so little about his workers or ad PR that he would try to force his workers back into a factory without even attempting the bare minimum to protect their health.
Chruches are only open because the highest court in the land, the surpreme court, overruled the Gov of Cali executive branches restrictions.
Churches have been reopened for indoor services (with limited capacity) since May. The SCOTUS didn't rule on the CA case for the second time until a week ago. Notably, you are ignoring the first time SCOTUS ruled on CA church restrictions, when it upheld the restrictions on indoor services earlier during the lockdowns.
Amazon is from Seattle and Bezos owns the WaPo. It's not conservative.
I do not claim that Amazon or its CEO are conservative. But the overwhelming majority of Amazon's CA employees, it's warehouse workers and delivery drivers,are conservative and live in areas of CA that still have conservative supermajorities.
Simply put, Corona restrictions can easily be viewed as being ideologically based and also be viewed as having been weaponized against opposing political groups in California to hurt them, and its very concerning to see.
Yes, in the same way that HTML5 can be seen as a supercomputer. Notably, conservative governors have issued the same restrictions in red states, which is overwhelming evidence that these restrictions are not ideologically motivated.
I think we both agree that the new restrictions are problematic. You, for ideological reasons, and me, because they're clearly not based on any sort of scientific or empirical evidence. (There is absolutely no reason for subjecting counties like SLO or the OC to the same restrictions as LA County, which has one of the highest spread rates in the world.)
Chruches are only open because the highest court in the land, the surpreme court, overruled the Gov of Cali executive branches restrictions.
Churches have been reopened for indoor services (with limited capacity) since May. The SCOTUS didn't rule on the CA case for the second time until a week ago. Notably, you are ignoring the first time SCOTUS ruled on CA church restrictions, when it upheld the restrictions on indoor services earlier during the lockdowns.
Amazon is from Seattle and Bezos owns the WaPo. It's not conservative.
I do not claim that Amazon or its CEO are conservative. But the overwhelming majority of Amazon's CA employees, it's warehouse workers and delivery drivers,are conservative and live in areas of CA that still have conservative supermajorities.
Simply put, Corona restrictions can easily be viewed as being ideologically based and also be viewed as having been weaponized against opposing political groups in California to hurt them, and its very concerning to see.
Yes, in the same way that HTML5 can be seen as a supercomputer. Notably, conservative governors have issued the same restrictions in red states, which is overwhelming evidence that these restrictions are not ideologically motivated.
I think we both agree that the new restrictions are problematic. You, for ideological reasons, and me, because they're clearly not based on any sort of scientific or empirical evidence. (There is absolutely no reason for subjecting counties like SLO or the OC to the same restrictions as LA County, which has one of the highest spread rates in the world.)
After seeing the extremes to which you're trying to spin what happened
"Musk antics delayed reopening"
What a hoot.
I have a feeling that you might actually have an extreme ideological bent youre not even aware of.
"Musk antics delayed reopening"
What a hoot.
I have a feeling that you might actually have an extreme ideological bent youre not even aware of.
Whats it going to take for people to freak out and revolt, it's time. It's clearly extremely bad.
It's going to take the people not getting distracted by red herrings. So much outrage has been channeled into destructive memes like denying that Covid is a problem and rebelling against simple measures to stop the spread.
The real problem is the unsustainable structure of the economy. I don't think this woman is being driven to tears because she really wants to be running her restaurant right now, but rather because she's going to lose it completely when she falls off the debt treadmill. Instead of small businesses and individuals getting recurring stimulus and suspended rent/mortgages/taxes, we got peanuts. Meanwhile trillions of dollars were given to Wall St to make sure the magic Line keeps going up. That was a massive theft from the public to the plutocrats. But until the outrage stops getting divided and derailed by distractions, I'm afraid it will only continue.
The real problem is the unsustainable structure of the economy. I don't think this woman is being driven to tears because she really wants to be running her restaurant right now, but rather because she's going to lose it completely when she falls off the debt treadmill. Instead of small businesses and individuals getting recurring stimulus and suspended rent/mortgages/taxes, we got peanuts. Meanwhile trillions of dollars were given to Wall St to make sure the magic Line keeps going up. That was a massive theft from the public to the plutocrats. But until the outrage stops getting divided and derailed by distractions, I'm afraid it will only continue.
> So much outrage has been channeled into destructive memes like denying that Covid is a problem and rebelling against simple measures to stop the spread.
Here's the problem, it has been a do as I say not as I do attitude from the leadership in this country and even people who were supposed to remain non-political made moves that were suspect. For example early on when Fauci was asked if we should limit the BLM protests, he refused to make a recommendation. Now keep in mind during that same hearing he made recommendations about all kinds of other things from restaurants to sporting events. If you agree with him it's easy to overlook that, however take a moment and walk a bit in someone elses shoes, someone who has spent the past decade working to build a business or trying to support a family and was impacted by those measures and if you are honest you'll admit that it would probably piss you off to see that.
Leaders need to understand that people react on a emotional level to things and if you are asking for someone to make great personal sacrifices you need to be above reproach when making those requests.
To illustrate it from the other side there is a new anti-vax movement that popped up among progressives due to the fact that these new covid vaccines are being produced under a Trump presidency. When I read about the concerns they tend to have more to due with Trumps personality than the science. Again if Trump conducted himself in a more socially acceptable way and spent more time considering how his words and choices appeared to others, I suspect this new vaccine would encounter less resistance.
In the scheme of history much of the suffering caused by covid can be placed squarely on a lack of leadership. It has been a long time since the United States has had a threat like this to deal with and we have learned that our leadership is woefully unprepared. If we were smart they wouldn't be our leadership for much longer.
Here's the problem, it has been a do as I say not as I do attitude from the leadership in this country and even people who were supposed to remain non-political made moves that were suspect. For example early on when Fauci was asked if we should limit the BLM protests, he refused to make a recommendation. Now keep in mind during that same hearing he made recommendations about all kinds of other things from restaurants to sporting events. If you agree with him it's easy to overlook that, however take a moment and walk a bit in someone elses shoes, someone who has spent the past decade working to build a business or trying to support a family and was impacted by those measures and if you are honest you'll admit that it would probably piss you off to see that.
Leaders need to understand that people react on a emotional level to things and if you are asking for someone to make great personal sacrifices you need to be above reproach when making those requests.
To illustrate it from the other side there is a new anti-vax movement that popped up among progressives due to the fact that these new covid vaccines are being produced under a Trump presidency. When I read about the concerns they tend to have more to due with Trumps personality than the science. Again if Trump conducted himself in a more socially acceptable way and spent more time considering how his words and choices appeared to others, I suspect this new vaccine would encounter less resistance.
In the scheme of history much of the suffering caused by covid can be placed squarely on a lack of leadership. It has been a long time since the United States has had a threat like this to deal with and we have learned that our leadership is woefully unprepared. If we were smart they wouldn't be our leadership for much longer.
> take a moment and walk a bit in someone elses shoes, someone who has spent the past decade working to build a business or trying to support a family and was impacted by those measures and if you are honest you'll admit that it would probably piss you off to see that
Obviously that would piss anybody off. Which is why it was pumped in their face 24/7 to keep them angry at the other group of plebs, and distracted from the professional looting. The proper response was to demand a pause to the finance that was actually responsible for threatening their businesses and families. Instead they fell right into the trap of thinking that being unable to pay rent is a character flaw.
> Leaders need to understand that people react on a emotional level to things and if you are asking for someone to make great personal sacrifices you need to be above reproach when making those requests.
Ends meet should have never been a sacrifice anyone was asked to make. This isn't a failure of leadership, but rather outright corruption by the plutocrats. Continually lowering interest rates over the past two decades to keep The Line going up, and then no relief for people squeezed in the debt vice when a hiccup occurred and the calls came due.
> Again if Trump conducted himself in a more socially acceptable way and spent more time considering how his words and choices appeared to others, I suspect this new vaccine would encounter less resistance.
The problem with Trump isn't just a lack of presentation, but that he's an empty conman. Covid is back with urgency and yet he's focused on his latest con of "stop the steal". Given his constant politicking and general rejection of expertise, being skeptical of corruption at the FDA is completely understandable. The problem runs much deeper than a lack of leadership - it's a failure of institutions.
Obviously that would piss anybody off. Which is why it was pumped in their face 24/7 to keep them angry at the other group of plebs, and distracted from the professional looting. The proper response was to demand a pause to the finance that was actually responsible for threatening their businesses and families. Instead they fell right into the trap of thinking that being unable to pay rent is a character flaw.
> Leaders need to understand that people react on a emotional level to things and if you are asking for someone to make great personal sacrifices you need to be above reproach when making those requests.
Ends meet should have never been a sacrifice anyone was asked to make. This isn't a failure of leadership, but rather outright corruption by the plutocrats. Continually lowering interest rates over the past two decades to keep The Line going up, and then no relief for people squeezed in the debt vice when a hiccup occurred and the calls came due.
> Again if Trump conducted himself in a more socially acceptable way and spent more time considering how his words and choices appeared to others, I suspect this new vaccine would encounter less resistance.
The problem with Trump isn't just a lack of presentation, but that he's an empty conman. Covid is back with urgency and yet he's focused on his latest con of "stop the steal". Given his constant politicking and general rejection of expertise, being skeptical of corruption at the FDA is completely understandable. The problem runs much deeper than a lack of leadership - it's a failure of institutions.
There's only been around 20,000 Covid deaths this year in the under 55 age group this year. The under 55 age group is 80% of the population. That's less than car accidents.
So this is a disease that is very low risk for 80% of the American population.
If the vulnerable 20% of the population can't stay in quarantine, this is not societies problem anymore.. this is that minority 20%'s problem.
And these crushing social restrictions destroying lives, jobs, businesses, enslaving people to debt, and putting people into poverty need to stop.
If the vulnerable 20% of the population can't stay in quarantine, this is not societies problem anymore.. this is that minority 20%'s problem.
And these crushing social restrictions destroying lives, jobs, businesses, enslaving people to debt, and putting people into poverty need to stop.
The situation is evolving rapidly with regards to rapid testing. The White House super-spreader event was in September. Since then, new methods have been rolled out:
https://health.ucdavis.edu/health-news/newsroom/new-cutting-...
https://health.ucdavis.edu/health-news/newsroom/new-cutting-...
It's still unfair to selectively allow certain non-essential businesses to operate and ban others.
There's only been around 20,000 Covid deaths this year in the under 55 age group this year. The under 55 age group is 80% of the population.
That's less than car accidents.
So this is a disease that is very low risk for 80% of the American population.
They have a right to be upset.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/
So this is a disease that is very low risk for 80% of the American population.
They have a right to be upset.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/
The death rate is low because we have managed to keep it somewhat under control. If the ICUs fill up, the death rate for all age groups will greatly increase.
>If the ICUs fill up, the death rate for all age groups will greatly increase
Can you explain the mechanism? Because hospitalization does _zero_ for survivability. We have no medicine that works, incubation turned out to straight up harm and kill patients. All you get at ICU is oxygen. You can get same thing at home. Two of my family members received portable units and isolated at home, third didnt get anything other than some pills for inflammation, last one stayed at the hospital and didnt receive anything other than oxygen and some random probably useless antibiotics.
This is how it looked 8 months ago in Italy:
"Italy Cremona https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfkbv_WQtn0 Italy Bergamo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_suhYeWEcJg Two hospitals, not a single patient survived ventilation/ecmo to date" Those hospitals were accepting 100 patients per day, and simultaneously producing same amount of body bags.
Can you explain the mechanism? Because hospitalization does _zero_ for survivability. We have no medicine that works, incubation turned out to straight up harm and kill patients. All you get at ICU is oxygen. You can get same thing at home. Two of my family members received portable units and isolated at home, third didnt get anything other than some pills for inflammation, last one stayed at the hospital and didnt receive anything other than oxygen and some random probably useless antibiotics.
This is how it looked 8 months ago in Italy:
"Italy Cremona https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfkbv_WQtn0 Italy Bergamo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_suhYeWEcJg Two hospitals, not a single patient survived ventilation/ecmo to date" Those hospitals were accepting 100 patients per day, and simultaneously producing same amount of body bags.
They've been saying hospitals are going to fill up for almost a year and they haven't.
Didn't happen in Houston, didn't happen in Miami even after the news media spread all kind of fear based reporting about it. The heads of all the major hospitals in Houston got together and did a press conference to dispel the false press.
Hospitals also havent filled up in numerous places with virtually no Covid restrictions like Sweden.
The flat curvers are looking to be as wrong as the flat earthers.
I'd also like to see stats on hospitalization and age that you casually threw out there.
Only 500 people died of Covid under the age of 24 while over 200,000 have died above the age of 55.
It would stand to reason that hospitalization stats are wildly skewed towards the older generations.
Didn't happen in Houston, didn't happen in Miami even after the news media spread all kind of fear based reporting about it. The heads of all the major hospitals in Houston got together and did a press conference to dispel the false press.
Hospitals also havent filled up in numerous places with virtually no Covid restrictions like Sweden.
The flat curvers are looking to be as wrong as the flat earthers.
I'd also like to see stats on hospitalization and age that you casually threw out there.
Only 500 people died of Covid under the age of 24 while over 200,000 have died above the age of 55.
It would stand to reason that hospitalization stats are wildly skewed towards the older generations.
From The U.S. Has Passed the Hospital Breaking Point in The Atlantic [1]:
In South Dakota, a network of 37 hospitals reported sending more than 150 people home with oxygen tanks to keep beds open for even sicker patients. A hospital in Amarillo, Texas, reported that COVID-19 patients are waiting in the emergency room for beds to become available. Some patients in Laredo, Texas, were sent to hospitals in San Antonio—until that city stopped accepting transfers. Elsewhere in Texas, patients were sent to Oklahoma, but hospitals there have also tightened their admission criteria.
[1] https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/12/the-worst...
Edit: typesetting
In South Dakota, a network of 37 hospitals reported sending more than 150 people home with oxygen tanks to keep beds open for even sicker patients. A hospital in Amarillo, Texas, reported that COVID-19 patients are waiting in the emergency room for beds to become available. Some patients in Laredo, Texas, were sent to hospitals in San Antonio—until that city stopped accepting transfers. Elsewhere in Texas, patients were sent to Oklahoma, but hospitals there have also tightened their admission criteria.
[1] https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/12/the-worst...
Edit: typesetting
The Atlantic was one of the media outlets that was drumming up fear that Houston was running out of room back in July and it never happened. Actually all of the heads of the hospital in Houston came together and said that was false reporting and there was plenty of capacity.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.khou.com/amp/article/news/h...
The Atlantic has been drumming up fear about Covid this entire time with numerous fear-mongering articles.
Just look at the headlines of the Atlantics reporting of Covid.
Everything is dire or a disaster or a death knell. Super sensationalist. The Atlantic has become the NY Post and they're probably making tons of money with fear-based articles.
https://www.theatlantic.com/category/coronavirus-covid-19/
I would love a real actual data set.
The news media is not a scientific reference to me.
It actually scares me that ppl use the news media as a scientific reference.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.khou.com/amp/article/news/h...
The Atlantic has been drumming up fear about Covid this entire time with numerous fear-mongering articles.
Just look at the headlines of the Atlantics reporting of Covid.
Everything is dire or a disaster or a death knell. Super sensationalist. The Atlantic has become the NY Post and they're probably making tons of money with fear-based articles.
https://www.theatlantic.com/category/coronavirus-covid-19/
I would love a real actual data set.
The news media is not a scientific reference to me.
It actually scares me that ppl use the news media as a scientific reference.
> The Atlantic was one of the media outlets that was drumming up fear that Houston was running out of room back in July and it never happened.
I call BS. I had a family member who was hospitalized in late June in Houston, for non-coronavirus reasons, at the #1 rated hospital in Texas for general medical care. They were literally hospitalized the night when our county judge put out the emergency alert on all mobile phones to stay home and isolate because the hospitals were going to go over capacity. The hospital was my family member was at was absolutely inundated. The pharmacy would hang up on the nurses because they were so swamped. Sometimes meals would come nearly 3 hours late. Nurse calls were not answered at times for over an hour.
My family member was also hospitalized in October, for non-coronavirus reasons, and it was actually worse than in late June.
These hospitals are basically now running two hospitals in one: a coronavirus hospital and a non-coronavirus hospital--that are not supposed to mix (everybody admitted to this hospital gets tested for coronavirus) but this still happens anyways.
This is such a huge undertaking and requires tremendous amounts of work by all of the healthcare staff.
Dude, you are being so disrespectful towards the people who are literally working non-stop under tremendous pressure. They are our last line of defense, for saving lives, and you are just totally blowing the whole situation off like it is no big deal.
I call BS. I had a family member who was hospitalized in late June in Houston, for non-coronavirus reasons, at the #1 rated hospital in Texas for general medical care. They were literally hospitalized the night when our county judge put out the emergency alert on all mobile phones to stay home and isolate because the hospitals were going to go over capacity. The hospital was my family member was at was absolutely inundated. The pharmacy would hang up on the nurses because they were so swamped. Sometimes meals would come nearly 3 hours late. Nurse calls were not answered at times for over an hour.
My family member was also hospitalized in October, for non-coronavirus reasons, and it was actually worse than in late June.
These hospitals are basically now running two hospitals in one: a coronavirus hospital and a non-coronavirus hospital--that are not supposed to mix (everybody admitted to this hospital gets tested for coronavirus) but this still happens anyways.
This is such a huge undertaking and requires tremendous amounts of work by all of the healthcare staff.
Dude, you are being so disrespectful towards the people who are literally working non-stop under tremendous pressure. They are our last line of defense, for saving lives, and you are just totally blowing the whole situation off like it is no big deal.
So are the heads of the hospitals then apparently?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.khou.com/amp/article/news/h...
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.khou.com/amp/article/news/h...
For future reference in your discussions anecdotal evidence is actually considered a logical fallacy.
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/anecdotal
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/anecdotal
If this isn't over by summer 2021 it's time to quarantine the olds an allow the rest of citizens to return to normal life. We gave it a year. we can't go on expecting younger folks to give up all social life, development, sex and so on so old people can sit on Facebook alone at home or in nursing homes.
This could even work unless another genius governor sends covid patients straight to nursing homes, cough Cuomo cough
https://eu.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/politics/alba...
https://eu.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/politics/alba...
The young and reckless are why it continues to spread. There have been numerous reports of frat parties and college keggers being super spreader events. They lack discipline.
Only 500 people have died of Covid in the under 24 crowd since Covid started.
They have virtually no risk and they don't crowd hospitals because their symptoms are minimal.
Maybe if the old people who are actually vulnerable to the disease stayed in quarantine instead of going to Starbucks...we could keep the economy going and keep deaths to a minimum and hospitals from overflowing.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm
They have virtually no risk and they don't crowd hospitals because their symptoms are minimal.
Maybe if the old people who are actually vulnerable to the disease stayed in quarantine instead of going to Starbucks...we could keep the economy going and keep deaths to a minimum and hospitals from overflowing.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm
More "mature" person blames immature people acting immaturely. The only solution to that is time and experience...
That’s a nice narrative, but for every one of those that died from C19 there are many that didn’t. Unlike a car accident, those that survived do contribute to the spread of the virus and expose people who are at higher risk of a far more fatal outcome. Additionally every person that contracts this has a chance of needing supplemental oxygen and an intensive care bed. These are already in short supply and the people to manage these intensive care facilities aren’t an infinite resource. It is just reckless to expose more people to this virus when we have vaccines on the way to inoculate the highest risk communities.
While people certainly have a right to be upset, they don’t have a right to willfully endanger others.
While people certainly have a right to be upset, they don’t have a right to willfully endanger others.
The thing is...if the vulnerable 20% of the population can't stay in quarantine... but 80% of the population is low risk...this is not societies problem anymore.. this is that 20%'s problem.
What's the upper limit on the percentage of people you're happy to throw under the bus? Are problems only problems if they affect 51% or more of the population?
You've got it wrong. The people being thrown under the bus are the people being sent into poverty because 20% of the population can't seem to stay in quarantine.
Would you put 100 million people into poverty to save 1 life of a person who wants to go to Starbucks to get a Peppermint Mocha?
Would you put 100 million people into poverty to save 1 life of a person who wants to go to Starbucks to get a Peppermint Mocha?
Should be. lockdowns should be total or none. Masks are stupid and honestly have so little evidence supporting them it's pathetic, and the lockdowns have two champion countries and everyone else is statistically insignificant when you compare with their annual expected flu response curves
Plenty of evidence for the effectiveness of masks exists. The WHO published their guidelines on mask use with more than 16 cited studies from across the world[1]. Just because you feel like masks are stupid does not mean you should go spreading heresay without backing up your claims.
1. https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/advice-on-the-use-of...
1. https://www.who.int/publications/i/item/advice-on-the-use-of...
Then perhaps she needs to spend some time screaming at the idiots who won't take precautions seriously.
We didn't have to be here. Covid keeps spreading because enough people simply won't take the commonsense actions. Put a damn mask on--especially when visiting people.
We didn't have to be here. Covid keeps spreading because enough people simply won't take the commonsense actions. Put a damn mask on--especially when visiting people.
> I bartend. Im constantly surrounded by people who deem dining out for pleasure to be a smart choice during a pandemic. This group consists roughly of 20% responsible people who take outdoor dining rules seriously, 40% Covid truthers who take a weird pride in breaking the rules, and 40% people in their 20s/30s who think the rules don’t apply to them because they are invincible. And that’s before you even add the effects of alcohol to the equation.
> Neither me or anyone I work with was ever provided with a Covid test by management or even asked by management to go get independently tested.
> One of these things is not like the other. I understand this bar owner’s frustrations but “extremely controlled production sets are allowed to be open/eat food so why aren’t bars open” isn’t exactly sound logic.
https://www.reddit.com/r/LosAngeles/comments/k6y5f5/bar_owne...