Best radios to use in an emergency (2021)(plannedemergency.com)
plannedemergency.com
Best radios to use in an emergency (2021)
https://plannedemergency.com/best-radios-for-emergency-use/
104 comments
I think you meant this for point #2 but its important to clarify: you should be carrying PAPER maps —- preferably laminated if your environment calls or at least stuffed in a gallon zip lock bag.
So many things can and do go wrong with gadgets.
This comment posted while on a remote backpacking trip with somehow just enough coverage to load HN.
So many things can and do go wrong with gadgets.
This comment posted while on a remote backpacking trip with somehow just enough coverage to load HN.
The person I mentioned actually meant just digital maps installed on the gps/smartphone. He completely agreed with you on how important it was to have paper maps, but he said most people either didn't see the point, or thought he was recommending them (paper maps and compasses) because he was old.
> Third, take 3 hours to study for a ham license.
Yep, Technician is pretty easy. With privileges available to techs, I was able to get into a repeater 70 miles away with 5 watts on an HT (Yaesu FT-70D) using Fusion (a digital voice mode). This is in an area with precisely zero cell coverage, but plenty of elevation. Also, because it was digital voice, it was as clear as a phone call.
Yep, Technician is pretty easy. With privileges available to techs, I was able to get into a repeater 70 miles away with 5 watts on an HT (Yaesu FT-70D) using Fusion (a digital voice mode). This is in an area with precisely zero cell coverage, but plenty of elevation. Also, because it was digital voice, it was as clear as a phone call.
In an extreme emergancy (eg: captured in a POW camp) you might just have to build your own:
Queensland Prisoners secret radio revealed
>> Two Queensland brothers, Ernest and Charles Hildebrandt, built a secret wireless radio receiver which they operated in the camp near Bandoeng in Java which was overran by Japanese soldiers in 1942.
>> Constructed of parts scrounged from the internment camp where they were held prisoner in Java during the war, the transmitter was built into a Dutch gas-mask container and hidden under a square of concrete measuring 12 by 7 inches.
[*] https://blog.qm.qld.gov.au/2019/11/12/on-this-day-queensland...
Queensland Prisoners secret radio revealed
>> Two Queensland brothers, Ernest and Charles Hildebrandt, built a secret wireless radio receiver which they operated in the camp near Bandoeng in Java which was overran by Japanese soldiers in 1942.
>> Constructed of parts scrounged from the internment camp where they were held prisoner in Java during the war, the transmitter was built into a Dutch gas-mask container and hidden under a square of concrete measuring 12 by 7 inches.
[*] https://blog.qm.qld.gov.au/2019/11/12/on-this-day-queensland...
Scanning that article I was blown away to see it said "the transmitter..." - then I realized the author is play fast and loose with the terms transmitter and receiver (surprise! They aren't interchangeable!).
It looks like a tube-based regen receiver.
In Europe, Allied POWs would build "foxhole radios" which had no selectivity and you'd hear the strongest signals best - and during WW2, that was the BBC.
In Europe, Allied POWs would build "foxhole radios" which had no selectivity and you'd hear the strongest signals best - and during WW2, that was the BBC.
> which had no selectivity
All of the foxhole radio designs I've seen actually do have an (albeit very crude) way to select a frequency. Maybe all the designs I've seen aren't faithful to the ww2 versions?
All of the foxhole radio designs I've seen actually do have an (albeit very crude) way to select a frequency. Maybe all the designs I've seen aren't faithful to the ww2 versions?
I mean, if you could get your hands on a variable capacitor, you're in business. That was unlikely to be an item you could scrounge up though.
The guys in the article managed to find a tube and other parts, so that's quite impressive, but you can still get more minimalist.
The most basic is a length of wire wound around a coil form (toilet paper tube, plastic bottle, etc), the "detector" was a blued steel surface (DE safety razor blade), a safety pin to act as a "cats whisker" (bonus if you can use graphite pencil lead attached to it), some high impedance headphones (WW2 tanker/air crew headsets usually fit the bill), a good ground and as much wire for an aerial/antenna as you could get away with.
Using the length of the coil, and where you connected the antenna, you could kinda-sorta tune for better efficiency at different parts of the band (be it SW or AM). (Longer coil = lower freq)
I made a few of them years ago, and posted the results on my now-defunct blog. The DB is still intact with my files and findings, but my code base is hosed (need to remake it).
The most basic is a length of wire wound around a coil form (toilet paper tube, plastic bottle, etc), the "detector" was a blued steel surface (DE safety razor blade), a safety pin to act as a "cats whisker" (bonus if you can use graphite pencil lead attached to it), some high impedance headphones (WW2 tanker/air crew headsets usually fit the bill), a good ground and as much wire for an aerial/antenna as you could get away with.
Using the length of the coil, and where you connected the antenna, you could kinda-sorta tune for better efficiency at different parts of the band (be it SW or AM). (Longer coil = lower freq)
I made a few of them years ago, and posted the results on my now-defunct blog. The DB is still intact with my files and findings, but my code base is hosed (need to remake it).
I woke up yesterday to: no home internet; no mobile connection. I own no broadcast tv service. (Why yes, I am a Canadian Rogers customer).
I literally started searching through my junk to see if I owned a radio of any kind, just to try to hear news of what the hell was going on.
Eventually I gave up and walked to the library instead, discovering 500 other people in the same situation sharing the wifi.
Time to invest in a nice radio for emergencies.
I literally started searching through my junk to see if I owned a radio of any kind, just to try to hear news of what the hell was going on.
Eventually I gave up and walked to the library instead, discovering 500 other people in the same situation sharing the wifi.
Time to invest in a nice radio for emergencies.
> Eventually I gave up and walked to the library instead, discovering 500 other people in the same situation sharing the wifi.
Hopefully librarians can use this incident to lobby for funding, as "community internet access of last resort".
Hopefully librarians can use this incident to lobby for funding, as "community internet access of last resort".
No car with a radio?
.... Dammit.
The car is in the basement garage of the condo and basically "out of sight, out of mind". It literally never occurred to me.
The car is in the basement garage of the condo and basically "out of sight, out of mind". It literally never occurred to me.
Since he walked to the library, I am going to guess "no car at all".
Nah, I just live in a very walkable area of Toronto and use my car maybe once a week at most, and then just to get groceries. Otherwise, I use transit and walk everywhere.
Driving to the library would be more of a hassle than just walking. It's maybe 7 minutes away.
Driving to the library would be more of a hassle than just walking. It's maybe 7 minutes away.
Whether or not this is a good list, I find the topic very
interesting. For more exercise I've started to increase the range of
my usual hikes, from just mooching around a 10 mile radius of home to
some much more ambitious yomps out into wilderness. Being alone out
there obviously raises thoughts about safety.
Everyone knows I hate "smartphones" with a passion. For possible emergencies I carry a powered-down (battery flipped) Nokia wax-sealed in a dry-sack. Regardless, the cell coverage can't be relied upon and I don't fully trust it.
Lately I started looking at alternatives, and considering the fascinating array of features some devices have.
Stand alone GPS devices with loadable OSM maps seem really useful. Emergency beacons seem to fill a need for the bad case where you really need rescue. But there's also powerful handheld radios and sat phones. The landscape of affordable civilian RF gear seems to be changing fast.
What kit do people pack for hiking? Or what gadgets do you wish existed?
Everyone knows I hate "smartphones" with a passion. For possible emergencies I carry a powered-down (battery flipped) Nokia wax-sealed in a dry-sack. Regardless, the cell coverage can't be relied upon and I don't fully trust it.
Lately I started looking at alternatives, and considering the fascinating array of features some devices have.
Stand alone GPS devices with loadable OSM maps seem really useful. Emergency beacons seem to fill a need for the bad case where you really need rescue. But there's also powerful handheld radios and sat phones. The landscape of affordable civilian RF gear seems to be changing fast.
What kit do people pack for hiking? Or what gadgets do you wish existed?
Get a Garmin inReach mini: https://www.garmin.com/en-US/p/592606 The key feature of the Garmin is that it has two way communication (on the cheap model you can use a slow character at a time typing, or link to your smartphone with BLE for a proper keyboard).
Two way communication with rescuers is an absolute game-changer in real emergencies. You can tell rescuers exactly what happened and the conditions of people, the environment, etc. to expect. Without two way comms rescuers only see a ping from a beacon and have to first send out a small team to recon the area and find you, then they have to radio back to get a proper rescue going. With two way comms you can short circuit that recon and tell them exactly how many people are injured, if you need a helicopter right now, if you're safe to spend a night, etc. Rescuers can keep you in the loop of progress too like if they're delayed from weather, etc.
I listen to a great podcast about climbing accidents (the sharp end: https://www.thesharpendpodcast.com/2022 ) and every single episode that involves a rescue mentions that having two way communication with the search and rescue team was critical in getting a fast and safe rescue. Don't bother with anything else beside a satellite communication device that can talk both ways IMHO.
Two way communication with rescuers is an absolute game-changer in real emergencies. You can tell rescuers exactly what happened and the conditions of people, the environment, etc. to expect. Without two way comms rescuers only see a ping from a beacon and have to first send out a small team to recon the area and find you, then they have to radio back to get a proper rescue going. With two way comms you can short circuit that recon and tell them exactly how many people are injured, if you need a helicopter right now, if you're safe to spend a night, etc. Rescuers can keep you in the loop of progress too like if they're delayed from weather, etc.
I listen to a great podcast about climbing accidents (the sharp end: https://www.thesharpendpodcast.com/2022 ) and every single episode that involves a rescue mentions that having two way communication with the search and rescue team was critical in getting a fast and safe rescue. Don't bother with anything else beside a satellite communication device that can talk both ways IMHO.
Two-way communication is great even outside of emergencies. A couple times, I’ve used it to tell my check-in person that I was going to miss my scheduled return time, but didn’t need help. Another time, I used it when I was at home to text my partner about a flash flood warning in their area (backcountry).
Another vote for the InReach here.
I'm a ham operator but I don't bring my radio for emergency purposes. In Europe ham usage is so low it's hard to find someone to talk to at the best of times. Not something I'd rely on in an emergency.
Perhaps in the US things are better. But here no. The InReach is a better option and it didn't even require a license (most 400Mhz PLBs do over here!)
I'm a ham operator but I don't bring my radio for emergency purposes. In Europe ham usage is so low it's hard to find someone to talk to at the best of times. Not something I'd rely on in an emergency.
Perhaps in the US things are better. But here no. The InReach is a better option and it didn't even require a license (most 400Mhz PLBs do over here!)
I'm amazed that people willingly go on multi day hikes or sailing trips, regularly, without satellite communication.
Some of them might be wearing multiple hundred dollar jackets and boots and can probably afford them without even needing to think of the cost.
I can only assume they either don't know they exist or don't particularly want them? Do they enjoy the extra adrenaline of not having one?
Some of them might be wearing multiple hundred dollar jackets and boots and can probably afford them without even needing to think of the cost.
I can only assume they either don't know they exist or don't particularly want them? Do they enjoy the extra adrenaline of not having one?
I don't know about the adrenaline, but certainly part of the attraction of hiking in the backcountry was acceptance of that risk. Not much different than skateboarding, if there was a perfectly safe way to do it, I would have done something else.
When I hiked alone, I never told anyone where I was going, and I wasn't going to ask someone to come rescue me in a helicopter from my poorly advised climb or snowshoe hike. If I got hurt, I was in trouble.
You took the gear you thought you needed to make it back alive, meaning backups for most of that gear, and you knew how to use them. A compass and map isn't a drop in replacement for a GPS, if you're going to use a compass you need to know how to use it. And so on.
But yeah, the risk was certainly part of the fun of it.
DNR.
When I hiked alone, I never told anyone where I was going, and I wasn't going to ask someone to come rescue me in a helicopter from my poorly advised climb or snowshoe hike. If I got hurt, I was in trouble.
You took the gear you thought you needed to make it back alive, meaning backups for most of that gear, and you knew how to use them. A compass and map isn't a drop in replacement for a GPS, if you're going to use a compass you need to know how to use it. And so on.
But yeah, the risk was certainly part of the fun of it.
DNR.
Afaik, historically they were prohibitively expensive with service.
Only in the last ~10(?) years have companies cut offerings in a price point catering to the backcountry crowd.
Only in the last ~10(?) years have companies cut offerings in a price point catering to the backcountry crowd.
True but PLBs have always been affordable. Unlike InReach they don't even have a service fee. Though in some countries a local telecom license is needed but I know a lot of folks just ignore that. After all the only time you use it is when you're alone in an emergency and if there's a telecom regulator around you'd be happy to see them :)
I've never used a PLB myself. I have my ham licence and these days I use an InReach because hams are spread too thin these days.
I've never used a PLB myself. I have my ham licence and these days I use an InReach because hams are spread too thin these days.
Honestly... Baofeng UV-5R is still my go-to for emergency usage... program in GMRS/FRS/Coast Guard frequencies as well as the simplex HAM frequencies.
Sadly the new generation ones and the GT-5R which is cleaner spectrum-wise are all software limited to only HAM frequencies so in case of an emergency that one would less useful.
Sadly the new generation ones and the GT-5R which is cleaner spectrum-wise are all software limited to only HAM frequencies so in case of an emergency that one would less useful.
While I still prefer more expensive, weatherproof ham handhelds, the UV-5R is almost throw-away cheap, making it easy to keep a couple on hand to hand out. Also program in at least any local NOAA weather stations.
A bonus is FM broadcast reception. Was a real help keeping my mother-in-law occupied once we lost power and internet during a tropical storm.
A bonus is FM broadcast reception. Was a real help keeping my mother-in-law occupied once we lost power and internet during a tropical storm.
It’s illegal to have a radio that transmits on both FRS/GMRS as well as the ham bands. FCC Part 95 (GMRS) & Part 97 (Amateur) spell this out quite well. Baofeng has played fast and loose with these requirements in the past. The newer radios just fall in line with FCC rules.
For an emergency I personally would disregard FCC regs. I don't think the rescuers will care either. Certainly local law enforcement won't care. Out in the wilderness it is unlikely one will be causing interference using a few extra watts. I say this as someone who used to pump out a few thousand extra watts. People generally get into trouble when they are playing around on frequencies they should not be on and causing interference, especially with businesses or law enforcement. Prolonged interference is what draws the attention of the FCC via complaints, usually because of harmonics from cheap radios. I should add that the FCC are few in number and spread very thin. It is extremely difficult to get them to respond to interference complaints unless the complainant are a big business.
The hams tend to be "lawful good"[0] types. It's pretty alien to my way of thinking[1] but that sort would rather follow the law to a bad outcome as opposed to violating it to achieve a good one. If you are in mortal danger please do whatever you can to obtain help.
[0]https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LawfulGood
[1]https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ChaoticGood
[0]https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/LawfulGood
[1]https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ChaoticGood
I am a pragmatic minimalist and have +2 to agility.
But I agree that ham's tend to be "lawful good" as you say. That is why I generally do not get along with them but have always had ham gear. I've had the FCC sitting right next to me monitoring what I do and to my surprise they did not care at all that my friends and I were running power since we did not interfere with anyone. I have also had the FCC suggest/imply that we resolve issues with locals that were shutting down some trucker channels since they were too busy. This was in the 70's and 80's. I'm sure they must have evolved by now.
But I agree that ham's tend to be "lawful good" as you say. That is why I generally do not get along with them but have always had ham gear. I've had the FCC sitting right next to me monitoring what I do and to my surprise they did not care at all that my friends and I were running power since we did not interfere with anyone. I have also had the FCC suggest/imply that we resolve issues with locals that were shutting down some trucker channels since they were too busy. This was in the 70's and 80's. I'm sure they must have evolved by now.
You can use any freq in a legit emergency. But it requires “safety of life and protection of property”. You can’t just use it willy nilly.
The reason hams are anal about this is because the FCC grants us frequencies as a privilege. If we abuse that privilege they can easily take it away.
The reason hams are anal about this is because the FCC grants us frequencies as a privilege. If we abuse that privilege they can easily take it away.
You can’t just use it willy nilly.
Agreed, that is what I was trying to convey.
As an aside, I sat in police dispatch while two of the senior officers were playing light-sabers with their HT's on transmit to create feedback "music" for the dispatcher yes on the repeater main frequency of whom was the biggest software pirate I knew at the time. Kids will be kids.
Agreed, that is what I was trying to convey.
As an aside, I sat in police dispatch while two of the senior officers were playing light-sabers with their HT's on transmit to create feedback "music" for the dispatcher yes on the repeater main frequency of whom was the biggest software pirate I knew at the time. Kids will be kids.
It's not illegal to have but it is illegal to misuse. However, this is a post about radios for emergency use and most readings of the HAM and GMRS rules state that emergency use is allowed.
It is illegal to have. Part 95 requires GMRS radios to have pre-programmed frequencies (no keypad) and a non-removable antenna. No ham radio meets those requirements.
Since people are having trouble believing this, here are some relevant regulations:
CFR § 95.1761 GMRS transmitter certification.
(a) Each GMRS transmitter (a transmitter that operates or is intended to operate in the GMRS) must be certified in accordance with this subpart and part 2 of this chapter.
CFR § 95.1761 GMRS transmitter certification.
... No GMRS transmitter will be certified for use in the GMRS if it is equipped with the capabilities to operate in services that do not require equipment certification, such as the Amateur Radio Service....
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-47/chapter-I/subchapter-D...
CFR § 95.1761 GMRS transmitter certification.
(a) Each GMRS transmitter (a transmitter that operates or is intended to operate in the GMRS) must be certified in accordance with this subpart and part 2 of this chapter.
CFR § 95.1761 GMRS transmitter certification.
... No GMRS transmitter will be certified for use in the GMRS if it is equipped with the capabilities to operate in services that do not require equipment certification, such as the Amateur Radio Service....
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-47/chapter-I/subchapter-D...
Incorrect, there is no such requirement under the law. Here's a GMRS capable device with a keypad and pre-programmed frequencies.
https://www.amazon.com/BAOFENG-UV-5X-Repeater-Rechargeable-H...
It is completely legal to own a Baofeng UV-5R or purchase a GMRS version of it which has a keypad. It is completely legal to program GMRS/FRS frequencies into either radio and it is legal to broadcast on either one in case of emergency due to Part 95 Subpart E (c) (3) which states:
> Any individual who holds an individual license may allow anyone to operate his or her GMRS station if necessary to communicate an emergency message.
https://www.amazon.com/BAOFENG-UV-5X-Repeater-Rechargeable-H...
It is completely legal to own a Baofeng UV-5R or purchase a GMRS version of it which has a keypad. It is completely legal to program GMRS/FRS frequencies into either radio and it is legal to broadcast on either one in case of emergency due to Part 95 Subpart E (c) (3) which states:
> Any individual who holds an individual license may allow anyone to operate his or her GMRS station if necessary to communicate an emergency message.
Garmin’s InReach products are great for this. Emergency button, two-way texts, all satellite based, so basically full global coverage. They can also allow you to share your semi real-time location with friends and family, if that’s useful to you.
Yes the Garmin stuff looks great. For some of those features you seem
to need a renewable monthly subscription. I'm looking for products
that build the connection cost into the one-off price, not out of
cheapness but for more reliability/security than a subscription. Would
be awful to finally need an emergency device and find the data plan
had expired (as is now the case with phone networks that destroy your
number when it goes unused regardless of how much credit you've
charged it with). That's specifically one of the cost models I want to
move away from. The only thing I should need to pack is some spare
batteries.
It's annoying but Garmin has a plan where you can pause it when you're not using it. It's something like $5 a year when not in use, then you flip it on (just go to the website) and it charges you the rate and gives you full service again. So if you're not using it in the winter you don't have to pay the big regular monthly cost.
Unfortunately you will not find a satellite comm device without some kind of monthly service plan, it's how they base their business models.
Get the Garmin inreach, it is absolutely worth it and two way communication is critical in a real rescue situation.
Unfortunately you will not find a satellite comm device without some kind of monthly service plan, it's how they base their business models.
Get the Garmin inreach, it is absolutely worth it and two way communication is critical in a real rescue situation.
Kinda wish there was a pricing model along the lines of "top-up with $X of credit that is guaranteed not to remain valid for 5+ years, and charge it $100 for the first message, and $0.10/message thereafter for the next month, with the ability to send a predetermined test to the company server at a cost of $1/test", or something like that. Surely this kind of a model must be viable at some price point?
I prefer a standalone PLB (personal locator beacon) when backcountry skiing. Smaller, lighter, more reliable, no subscription fee.
That's what I got as well: ACR ResQLink -- you register it with NOAA every 2 years, I can't find anywhere listing the price, I think it's $50 or $75. It then talks to NOAA satellites to send out your distress call and location. The device itself when I got it was $250, looks like they are $350ish now.
The downside is there is basically nothing other than "I need rescue" that you can do with the device. You turn it on and a rescue team shows up.
The downside is there is basically nothing other than "I need rescue" that you can do with the device. You turn it on and a rescue team shows up.
Do people get charged after they get rescued? I'd imagine it's pretty expensive to send a team out into the wilderness, do they recoup the costs from the rescued?
UK: pretty sure you dont get charged for anything execpt possibly ambulance/hospital if you are not from UK or EU, but I suspect it’s so unusual most NHS staff wouldn’t know how to bill you. Definitely no charge for sea rescue by the RNLI even though a typical shout for a Severn class ALB will burn £1-2k in diesel fuel.
Rescue insurance isn't hard to come by or particularly expensive for the group of people who spend a lot of time outdoors. The American Alpine club, for instance, offers rescue insurance with a membership, dollar amounts vary with membership "type."
I believe if it's a legit emergency, then no. If they find you obviously were clowning around, yes.
Most SAR teams are not dedicated to SAR, but do other tasks (firefighting, soldiering, etc) so SAR operations kinda fall under training.
Most SAR teams are not dedicated to SAR, but do other tasks (firefighting, soldiering, etc) so SAR operations kinda fall under training.
If anyone is thinking about buying a two-way radio and you see something like "35-mile range!" on the package, know that this is pure marketing. Yes, if you have a clear, as in unobstructed, as in "I can see you from my binoculars" view of the other person you want to talk to, then yes, you can do it. If there are trees, hills or anything else, forget about it. Invest the time to learn basic ham radio operation, learn to use repeaters, and with a handheld you can reach longer distances than that.
The list is appears to be a random mix of AM/FM radios (receiver only), walkie talkies for different frequency bands, etc. Without any context, this list is not helpful at all - or outright confusing.
It's also noteworthy that different countries have different allowed frequency bands and usage restrictions.
I suppose those who have an interest in emergency communication may want to have a look at what their national amateur radio society has to offer.
It's also noteworthy that different countries have different allowed frequency bands and usage restrictions.
I suppose those who have an interest in emergency communication may want to have a look at what their national amateur radio society has to offer.
If you really want to be prepared to use a radio in an emergency you need to know how to use it well. Being able to construct an improvised antenna and knowing the basics of RF and propagation will make all the difference.
The US MCRP 8-10b.11 Antenna Handbook is a great starting point.
The US MCRP 8-10b.11 Antenna Handbook is a great starting point.
Thanks, found a copy and read a good chunk of it today.
There are one or two competing and/or converging standards for texting over ham radios and I find them very interesting…
But as I have said again and again - the handsets are missing.
I’m not going to take a laptop with a serial link to a yaesu into the woods, nor am I going to 9key in my texts on one of the two models that support it.
Where is a teenage engineering for radio handhelds ?
Where is a qwerty ham handheld ?
But as I have said again and again - the handsets are missing.
I’m not going to take a laptop with a serial link to a yaesu into the woods, nor am I going to 9key in my texts on one of the two models that support it.
Where is a teenage engineering for radio handhelds ?
Where is a qwerty ham handheld ?
Spot on. I don't know why we can't have an HT with a Blackberry-like hardware keyboard to send text. Or maybe something Psion-like (90's micro laptop thing made by Sony). I'd be very satisfied with Blackberry dimensions, as Psion would add bulk.
I'd take a rugged HT with a sleek and intuitive UI. The companies that make ham gear seem obsessed with complex and cryptic UIs. My Yaesu FT-3D is a good radio and isn't that hard to use, but its UI is still pretty clunky and the imprecise resistive touch screen feels like it's stuck in Y2K.
I used my friend's FT-3D a few times. Very good radio feature-wise, but I also shared your views on the UI and the touch screen. My HT is still the FT-60r and I just love the physical buttons.
PicoAPRS, Moblinkd, likely some others I believe will Bluetooth pair to your phone. As will the icom 705 with wifi I think.
I’ve sent messages just fine with the built in pad on a th-d72 and d710g.
I’ve sent messages just fine with the built in pad on a th-d72 and d710g.
If you’re going to use a radio in an emergency, the radio is less important than the skill of the operator. So, if you’re serious, go do the test and get the license so that you can practice.
Radios don’t work like in the movies. There’s a lot to know. You’re not likely to get help in a timely manner by slapping 146.52 into that shitty Baofeng spurious emissions potato.
Radios don’t work like in the movies. There’s a lot to know. You’re not likely to get help in a timely manner by slapping 146.52 into that shitty Baofeng spurious emissions potato.
> You’re not likely to get help in a timely manner by slapping 146.52 into that shitty Baofeng spurious emissions potato.
Why not? What should you do instead?
Why not? What should you do instead?
Get an amateur radio license (or, in Canada - it's a "Certificate of Proficiency"), and then spend a couple of years participating in exercises with a local club.
That way you'll learn about propagation, what makes a good radio cost 10x as much as a Baofeng, antenna systems, signalling modes, communication protocols, handheld channel programming, what local repeater systems are around and what their capabilities are.... You'll also learn who are the other hams around you, and where and what time they tend to be listening.
Or, assuming a 911 call from your cellphone isn't an option, you could pay for a Garmin InReach device.
That way you'll learn about propagation, what makes a good radio cost 10x as much as a Baofeng, antenna systems, signalling modes, communication protocols, handheld channel programming, what local repeater systems are around and what their capabilities are.... You'll also learn who are the other hams around you, and where and what time they tend to be listening.
Or, assuming a 911 call from your cellphone isn't an option, you could pay for a Garmin InReach device.
Not a ham operator and this definitely isn't the correct answer, but if you find yourself in an emergency with a radio you don't know how to use, 121.5 mhz is monitored by almost every airliner and a lot of general aviation aircraft.
Having no experience and some quick googling.
1. It depends where you are and who's monitoring.
2. If you're near a city or busy highway this may be "good enough" but the range can the big limit (One number thrown out was ~10 miles)
I'm guessing from the parent that they wanted immediate help and this frequency would not get you directly to emergency services
1. It depends where you are and who's monitoring.
2. If you're near a city or busy highway this may be "good enough" but the range can the big limit (One number thrown out was ~10 miles)
I'm guessing from the parent that they wanted immediate help and this frequency would not get you directly to emergency services
~430 questions and tested on 35 of them.
If you're going to buy a radio "just in case" Make sure you know how to use and maintain
If you're going to buy a radio "just in case" Make sure you know how to use and maintain
And not a single mention of the BaoFeng UV5R, what a shame.
The great thing about the ubiquitous cheap Baofengs is that they operate on frequencies that regular legit radios generally won't let you receive and transmit on due to local laws.
For an unknown emergency situation at that price point they seem ideal. You never know what band you might need to communicate on and CB has its own limitations.
For an unknown emergency situation at that price point they seem ideal. You never know what band you might need to communicate on and CB has its own limitations.
> For an unknown emergency situation at that price point they seem ideal.
No, they are the worst thing you can buy "for an emergency."
Sometimes people buy them with no intention of transmitting, they see the Baofengs as cheap VHF/UHF scanners. But they make terrible scanners. Their frequency range is very limited, their scanning is very slow, their selectivity is poor, and they are missing almost all of the bells and whistles that come with modern hand-held scanners.
If you think you might want to transmit during an emergency, then just grabbing a Baofeng or three off the jungle site and hoping for the best is a TERRIBLE plan.
A popular line of thinking is, "but during an emergency, you can use any radio and frequency necessary." Yes, that is logically true but those who say it are conveniently ignoring several aspects of reality: Unless you have a business license or an amateur radio license, you are not allowed push the Transmit button on a Baofeng. If you cannot transmit with the radio, then you cannot practice using it. If you cannot practice using it, you are NOT PREPARED to use it in an emergency and your own incompetence with it could lead to loss of life.
You also have to consider what kind of emergency you are likely to face. If you're out in the back country where there is no cell service, then a VHF/UHF radio is very unlikely to do you any good either. You need something with satellite capability in this case.
If you want to be prepared for an urban emergency (tornado, flooding, terrorist attack, war) then you want TWO radios: a scanner for receiving weather, listening in on emergency services (if not encrypted), and listening to others on various services. To communicate: a CB, FRS, or MURS radio. A $25 Baofeng CANNOT be used as any of these.
Potentially the best option is to learn about radio, get an amateur radio license, AND THEN purchase a Baofeng or higher-quality amateur radio. Then you will have the skills and license to actually operate the thing correctly when needed and legally when not.
Disclaimer: I own a Baofeng and use it legally.
No, they are the worst thing you can buy "for an emergency."
Sometimes people buy them with no intention of transmitting, they see the Baofengs as cheap VHF/UHF scanners. But they make terrible scanners. Their frequency range is very limited, their scanning is very slow, their selectivity is poor, and they are missing almost all of the bells and whistles that come with modern hand-held scanners.
If you think you might want to transmit during an emergency, then just grabbing a Baofeng or three off the jungle site and hoping for the best is a TERRIBLE plan.
A popular line of thinking is, "but during an emergency, you can use any radio and frequency necessary." Yes, that is logically true but those who say it are conveniently ignoring several aspects of reality: Unless you have a business license or an amateur radio license, you are not allowed push the Transmit button on a Baofeng. If you cannot transmit with the radio, then you cannot practice using it. If you cannot practice using it, you are NOT PREPARED to use it in an emergency and your own incompetence with it could lead to loss of life.
You also have to consider what kind of emergency you are likely to face. If you're out in the back country where there is no cell service, then a VHF/UHF radio is very unlikely to do you any good either. You need something with satellite capability in this case.
If you want to be prepared for an urban emergency (tornado, flooding, terrorist attack, war) then you want TWO radios: a scanner for receiving weather, listening in on emergency services (if not encrypted), and listening to others on various services. To communicate: a CB, FRS, or MURS radio. A $25 Baofeng CANNOT be used as any of these.
Potentially the best option is to learn about radio, get an amateur radio license, AND THEN purchase a Baofeng or higher-quality amateur radio. Then you will have the skills and license to actually operate the thing correctly when needed and legally when not.
Disclaimer: I own a Baofeng and use it legally.
Thats a very good point. It reminds of me the first time I pulled out bear spray, thumb off the clip, and prepared to use it. I didn't have to because yelling, making yourself big, and stomping can go a long way. When it was over I noticed I was actually holding it backwards. Embarassing but this was because of exactly this: I've never practiced using it and the situation require reflexived actions.
> Unless you have a business license or an amateur radio license, you are not allowed push the Transmit button on a Baofeng.
So absurd to read this, as "not allowed" to does by no means translate to "cannot practice". You can do things you're not allowed to do.
There might be consequences for you if you get caught, but choosing to ignore a law is always a choice that can be made.
So absurd to read this, as "not allowed" to does by no means translate to "cannot practice". You can do things you're not allowed to do.
There might be consequences for you if you get caught, but choosing to ignore a law is always a choice that can be made.
The technical (rather than legal) problem with the baofeng is the lack of input filtering. This means if you are near a strong transmitter on any nearby band you won't hear anything!
Since in the UK it is common to put radio masts on a hill top this can make them useless on adjacent hill tops. Adding a decent antenna makes it worse. In fact the only way to get clear receive is to use an input notch filter or a narrow band and highly directional aerial like a yagi
Edit: if you really want to use it on 2m or 70cm amatuer spend another £40 and get a yaesu
Since in the UK it is common to put radio masts on a hill top this can make them useless on adjacent hill tops. Adding a decent antenna makes it worse. In fact the only way to get clear receive is to use an input notch filter or a narrow band and highly directional aerial like a yagi
Edit: if you really want to use it on 2m or 70cm amatuer spend another £40 and get a yaesu
Probably because it’s illegal to use one without a license.
This is not technically true. These radios can — and most commonly do — use the unlicensed UHF bands (PMR446 in the EU, FRS 462Mhz in the US.)
Even if used on the unlicensed bands it’s still illegal to transmit in those frequencies without a license as the UV5R doesn’t comply with the restrictions of license free radios. I.e it exceeds the max allowed power and has a detachable antenna.
However, there’s nothing illegal about using the uv5r to receive. And in reality if you only use it on the pmr446 frequencies you’re very unlikely to get busted.
However, there’s nothing illegal about using the uv5r to receive. And in reality if you only use it on the pmr446 frequencies you’re very unlikely to get busted.
I am licensed up to 10W but this is still good to know!
Nobody cares about the ism band, I doubt anyone has ever been "busted" using under a watt.
You're probably not going to be busted, but FRS is very much not ISM band
Can vs will. Usually idiots turn up on 2m with them.
Nobody cares in an emergency...
Other than the legit licensed responders who now have to traffic manage a pile of morons with no operating experience.
That's fair especially now.
You’re allowed to use any frequency in an actual emergency.
No you can’t. You can only frequencies within the allocated spectrum for amateur radio. And it must be for the specific purpose of emergency comms. And that’s not universally true everywhere.
My point wasn't a legal question, if it's life or death you do what you whatever you can to survive.
... and it's also crap.
Can you elaborate? I'm interested in having an emergency radio which can listen to (and send on) frequencies I'm not allowed on, I have no intention of transmitting on the prohibited channels, and I have a Baofeng. Is there some obviously better radio I should have instead, and why?
Honestly the Baofeng is mostly fine. Just use it. 90% of it is elitism. The harmonic suppression of the transmitter is crap which is the issue but the radiated power is constrained by the antenna so not usually a problem unless you’re testing it in a lab. Most of the problem is just sinophobia.
If you want something actually with decent capability then the Yaesu FT818 is a good bet. It does all amateur bands, UHF, VHF, airband, FM broadcast all modes. But it costs money.
I’m not an active ham anymore but I keep an 818 around.
As for why I’m not a ham anymore, spend some time with some hams and you will get the idea.
If you want something actually with decent capability then the Yaesu FT818 is a good bet. It does all amateur bands, UHF, VHF, airband, FM broadcast all modes. But it costs money.
I’m not an active ham anymore but I keep an 818 around.
As for why I’m not a ham anymore, spend some time with some hams and you will get the idea.
> spend some time with some hams and you will get the idea
Also a former ham (age 14!).
Nearly all conversations:
"We read you loud and clear here. What kind of equipment are you using? Mine is blah blah blah. How do I sound? Ok, over and out."
Also a former ham (age 14!).
Nearly all conversations:
"We read you loud and clear here. What kind of equipment are you using? Mine is blah blah blah. How do I sound? Ok, over and out."
I'm also an ex-ham, I sometimes wish I had renewed my license because it would be nice to have access to a good radio sometimes, but not so nice that I'm willing to go through the exam process again. So I have 4 GMRS radios that I just have to have one license for the whole family to use.
"sinophobia"
That translates to "fear of china" which is almost always incorrectly applied. Were there a single word for "boycotting china" that would be more appropriate.
That translates to "fear of china" which is almost always incorrectly applied. Were there a single word for "boycotting china" that would be more appropriate.
It’s definitely fear based on the crap I’ve heard.
“Why would I buy a radio from communists. It’s probably bugged”
I facepalmed so hard I nearly imploded my skull on that.
“Why would I buy a radio from communists. It’s probably bugged”
I facepalmed so hard I nearly imploded my skull on that.
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I wrote a longer comment about this elsewhere in these comments but the short version is: a Baofeng is a terrible scanner and can't be used to transmit on ANYTHING without a license of some kind. If you can't transmit, then you can't practice, and if you can't practice, you aren't prepared for an emergency.
If you just want to listen, a handheld scanner would be a far better option than a Baofeng (but of course cost a bit more).
If you just want to listen, a handheld scanner would be a far better option than a Baofeng (but of course cost a bit more).
> implying anyone actually cares about the "radio laws" besides HAM's.
The FCC cares a lot, to the tune of $25k: https://www.fcc.gov/document/fcc-fines-ca-amateur-radio-oper...
Anyone who makes a habit of transmitting on a frequency they are not authorized on WILL be caught eventually, especially if they are interfering with police, emergency services, business users, and broadcasters. And all of these are very easy to do if you own a Boafeng and don't know how to use it.
Anyone who makes a habit of transmitting on a frequency they are not authorized on WILL be caught eventually, especially if they are interfering with police, emergency services, business users, and broadcasters. And all of these are very easy to do if you own a Boafeng and don't know how to use it.
Emergency types & context vary and the appropriate radio will depend on the situation. Sometimes it’s not just about the hardware, but knowing where & when to get a signal — and the best way to use the signal while you have access to it.
Beyond that, having apps, systems and data that are available offline and have appropriate plans for powering them without grid power is also critical.
Beyond that, having apps, systems and data that are available offline and have appropriate plans for powering them without grid power is also critical.
The biggest flaw of all prepper radio lists is that they do not contain knowledge about how easy it is to locate a radio transmitter. Every radio user should do at least one "radio fox hunt" to understand how to locate other people and / or how easy it is to be located.
You can do that even with radios on this list, no special equipment needed.
You can do that even with radios on this list, no special equipment needed.
The problem with prepper anything is that preppers tend to be out to justify buying cool stuff they don't need based on exciting fantasies. I am not personally that different, just self-aware.
The short preparedness lists prepared by the Red Cross, FEMA, local government, etc will have you ready for actually likely disaster scenarios.
The short preparedness lists prepared by the Red Cross, FEMA, local government, etc will have you ready for actually likely disaster scenarios.
I have a windup radio (receive-only). Being not all that serious about prepping, I just got interested in GMRS. Yeah, go ahead, make fun of me. I live in a developed area, so I think it'll be pretty easy to find help, and I do know a lot of the neighbors.
Since the GMRS radios are reasonably cheap, I was thinking of getting one and just trying it out, to see who's normally on. Also so I don't have a panicky read-the-manual moment in a real emergency. Thoughts?
Since the GMRS radios are reasonably cheap, I was thinking of getting one and just trying it out, to see who's normally on. Also so I don't have a panicky read-the-manual moment in a real emergency. Thoughts?
You can always just get a Baofeng to scan around UHF and VHF. I recently got some basically just for fun. They’re $25ish so basically a toy but pretty capable and programmable. They’re technically fairy illegal to actually broadcast with but as an emergency system I think they’d be fine.
the answer IMO as an amateur radio enthusiast is a portable shortwave.
you get FM for local stations to rebroadcast EAS, am for longer distance in the event the emergency affects multiple counties or provinces, and shortwave if your dumpster fire communications monopoly just wrecked the country.
you also have antennae options that can be spooled from most cheap household wire to boost the signal
you get FM for local stations to rebroadcast EAS, am for longer distance in the event the emergency affects multiple counties or provinces, and shortwave if your dumpster fire communications monopoly just wrecked the country.
you also have antennae options that can be spooled from most cheap household wire to boost the signal
> It is a common conception or misconception that the more moving parts that something has the more it may unreliable that something could be. This is true (...)
Is not a great start when the second line contradicts the first one...
Is not a great start when the second line contradicts the first one...
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I have an assortment of Icom handhelds that I collected dirt-cheap on Craigslist a decade ago. They seem to have appreciated quite a bit since then. They're extremely well made kit.
Good discussion point but the list is a little weak. You can probably google up better. My power was out for a week earlier this summer, so here's my hot take:
Once cell coverage was restored I was charging my phone and calling in to meetings in my air-conditioned car. Not too long after that I was able to borrow a generator and keep my freezer from defrosting. I would rank the generator and a good cooler over fancy radios even though I am the sort of person who occasionally buys radios he doesn't need.
You probably don't need anything more than a decent portable AM/FM radio: one with a speaker and conventional analog dial controls and that runs on batteries. You'll want a good supply of batteries, which are another topic. You will possibly benefit from a way of telling time that doesn't plug into the wall so you can turn the radio on for scheduled broadcasts to save batteries. A wall supply for normal use of the radio is also nice. You will want to listen to the station that broadcasts baseball games in the summer and high school football games in the fall and agricultural commodity prices at 5:00AM.
If you need a weather radio, you probably know it already and already have one. Otherwise they are merely nice to have, and inexpensive enough. If you want one you should get one. A dedicated weather radio with alerts that plugs in the wall and has a battery backup is ideal. I don't own one, though I would have to stop to count the radios I own that can receive weather band. I tuned in to the weather band maybe once while the power was out. We got weather alerts on our phones during the actual storm.
FRS/GMRS radios beat shouting by at least a quarter mile. You probably don't need a set. Some people get irritated, upset, tired, offended, or embarassed by shouting though, and they do let you avoid that. I like mine, which live in my toolbox and allow me to say "is it on now?" in a normal tone of voice. They're also nice for comms on multiple-car road trips and have a number of other use cases. I did not use mine while the power was out.
Scanners: mine are outdated and not much use. Useful ones that will cover digital modes and trunked systems are kind of expensive. I have found scanners nice on occasion for situational awareness beyond CB on road trips. I would have liked to have had a handheld one ready but I didn't suffer for not having one.
Ham radio: I am licensed but don't operate. I did not find my HT useful. It's a nice hobby and if you are interested at all in it you should get licensed and get a cheap radio and have fun.
CB: I have a portable CB and mag mount antenna for road trips. Great for finding out from truckers why the interstate is backed up and the best local road detour to take. It was not useful while the power was out.
Shortwave: hahah. Just not what it was since the big international broadcasters have mostly shut down. I like mine, but I don't listen to SW on it much. I cannot imagine the catastrophe that would bring back SW broadcasting in the USA. It's my favorite FM radio though so it did technically see use.
Once cell coverage was restored I was charging my phone and calling in to meetings in my air-conditioned car. Not too long after that I was able to borrow a generator and keep my freezer from defrosting. I would rank the generator and a good cooler over fancy radios even though I am the sort of person who occasionally buys radios he doesn't need.
You probably don't need anything more than a decent portable AM/FM radio: one with a speaker and conventional analog dial controls and that runs on batteries. You'll want a good supply of batteries, which are another topic. You will possibly benefit from a way of telling time that doesn't plug into the wall so you can turn the radio on for scheduled broadcasts to save batteries. A wall supply for normal use of the radio is also nice. You will want to listen to the station that broadcasts baseball games in the summer and high school football games in the fall and agricultural commodity prices at 5:00AM.
If you need a weather radio, you probably know it already and already have one. Otherwise they are merely nice to have, and inexpensive enough. If you want one you should get one. A dedicated weather radio with alerts that plugs in the wall and has a battery backup is ideal. I don't own one, though I would have to stop to count the radios I own that can receive weather band. I tuned in to the weather band maybe once while the power was out. We got weather alerts on our phones during the actual storm.
FRS/GMRS radios beat shouting by at least a quarter mile. You probably don't need a set. Some people get irritated, upset, tired, offended, or embarassed by shouting though, and they do let you avoid that. I like mine, which live in my toolbox and allow me to say "is it on now?" in a normal tone of voice. They're also nice for comms on multiple-car road trips and have a number of other use cases. I did not use mine while the power was out.
Scanners: mine are outdated and not much use. Useful ones that will cover digital modes and trunked systems are kind of expensive. I have found scanners nice on occasion for situational awareness beyond CB on road trips. I would have liked to have had a handheld one ready but I didn't suffer for not having one.
Ham radio: I am licensed but don't operate. I did not find my HT useful. It's a nice hobby and if you are interested at all in it you should get licensed and get a cheap radio and have fun.
CB: I have a portable CB and mag mount antenna for road trips. Great for finding out from truckers why the interstate is backed up and the best local road detour to take. It was not useful while the power was out.
Shortwave: hahah. Just not what it was since the big international broadcasters have mostly shut down. I like mine, but I don't listen to SW on it much. I cannot imagine the catastrophe that would bring back SW broadcasting in the USA. It's my favorite FM radio though so it did technically see use.
-First, have a Personal Locator Beacon. If funds allow, have one with two-way messaging (there's a monthly subscription fee). Needless to say, be mindful of battery condition.
-Second, have a GPS with maps from your area, or the equivalent smartphone app. Learn basic map reading, a good Youtube video about it will do.
-Third, take 3 hours to study for a ham license. Pass the easy exam and get a reliable, easy to use HT (Amateur radio's name for walkie talkie). Learn to use the repeaters in your area.
You're good to go.
P.S. this is concerning a getting lost scenario. He also recommended taking a First-Aid course.
edit: My recommendation for an HT is still, after 10 years, the Yaesu FT-60r. Pros: Very solid build, easy to learn and operate (compared to others), reliable. Cons: Bigger and heavier than newer models, battery not as good but can be upgraded. Also, analog only, but to me this is a plus as I want simple, reliable comms and don't want to invest time in zillion other features.