Ask HN: About to have a child, completely burnt out at my job, what do I do?
109 comments
If you're able to take Paternity, take it. It's going to be a whirlwind, especially if this is your first child, and this is likely the first real stretch of time you've had off in your entire adult life. It's hard to bond with a week-old child, but spend as much time as you can with the baby and make yourself available to help mom with anything she might want help with.
The good news is that the baby sleeps... a lot. You can only fill up so much time doing laundry, cleaning bottles, and doing dishes. You will have some free time, especially at the start. Use some of this time dusting off your resume and learning some things that interest you that you haven't had the chance to dig into previously. You should be free from the typical day-to-day work stresses so, if you're like me, this might actually be enjoyable. If you're already confident you dislike your job, maybe even try to get an interview or two scheduled during this time.
Once you're back to work you can evaluate with a clear head just how much you (dis)like your current job, and you should have a clearer idea of how close to the chopping block you truly are. Some employers have a knack for making you feel worthless even if you're incredibly valuable.
Make sure you're prioritizing your family; it's a lot easier to find another job. This is an very exciting time- enjoy it!
The good news is that the baby sleeps... a lot. You can only fill up so much time doing laundry, cleaning bottles, and doing dishes. You will have some free time, especially at the start. Use some of this time dusting off your resume and learning some things that interest you that you haven't had the chance to dig into previously. You should be free from the typical day-to-day work stresses so, if you're like me, this might actually be enjoyable. If you're already confident you dislike your job, maybe even try to get an interview or two scheduled during this time.
Once you're back to work you can evaluate with a clear head just how much you (dis)like your current job, and you should have a clearer idea of how close to the chopping block you truly are. Some employers have a knack for making you feel worthless even if you're incredibly valuable.
Make sure you're prioritizing your family; it's a lot easier to find another job. This is an very exciting time- enjoy it!
The baby will sleep a lot.. in two hour chunks with crying in between. That said, yes the beginning part isn't actually that many hours you're really doing anything for the baby and you'll (hopefully) be stuck at home, so it is a good time to apply for jobs and do interviews. Good luck and congrats!
> The good news is that the baby sleeps... a lot. You can only fill up so much time doing laundry, cleaning bottles, and doing dishes. You will have some free time, especially at the start.
I guess your child is very different to mine or you are very different to me, but for at least the first two weeks there's really not enough time for everything, certainly not to get enough sleep. Doing some side work as well seems incomprehensible to me.
I guess your child is very different to mine or you are very different to me, but for at least the first two weeks there's really not enough time for everything, certainly not to get enough sleep. Doing some side work as well seems incomprehensible to me.
Kids can be very different. Even siblings can have totally different behavior.
Some sleep like... er... babies, and some wake up every 1.5-2 hours and drive you crazy. :-)
Some sleep like... er... babies, and some wake up every 1.5-2 hours and drive you crazy. :-)
> Some employers have a knack for making you feel worthless even if you're incredibly valuable.
Saving this wisdom. I have worked for a few of them.
Saving this wisdom. I have worked for a few of them.
[deleted]
Dude! Congrats! This is a magical time. Don't waste it by worrying.
Stay at your job. Milk them for whatever paternity leave they will give you. And if you announce you are going on a long paternity leave, they are not going to fire you right before you leave. DO NOT SWITCH JOBS NOW.
When the hospital sends you the bill - argue, argue, argue. They did stupid stuff to us like bill both my wife and the child for all the same delivery line items ("guys, it was the same procedure!"). Get it to a reasonable number and put it on a payment plan.
Use the paternity leave to start looking for jobs. You'll have time and a clear head. And a much bigger perspective on life. You may even find that with the change, you were missed at work and that the burnout seems far and distant.
After that, having a kid is cheap. (At least at first). Get yourself a Costco membership. The first year we spent maybe $35 a month on diapers and $45 a month on formula. Clothes and furniture and toys other people will be stoked to provide for you. At tax season, enjoy getting a few thousand extra dollars back.
Welcome to the next phase of your life. I wish you and your growing family much happiness.
Stay at your job. Milk them for whatever paternity leave they will give you. And if you announce you are going on a long paternity leave, they are not going to fire you right before you leave. DO NOT SWITCH JOBS NOW.
When the hospital sends you the bill - argue, argue, argue. They did stupid stuff to us like bill both my wife and the child for all the same delivery line items ("guys, it was the same procedure!"). Get it to a reasonable number and put it on a payment plan.
Use the paternity leave to start looking for jobs. You'll have time and a clear head. And a much bigger perspective on life. You may even find that with the change, you were missed at work and that the burnout seems far and distant.
After that, having a kid is cheap. (At least at first). Get yourself a Costco membership. The first year we spent maybe $35 a month on diapers and $45 a month on formula. Clothes and furniture and toys other people will be stoked to provide for you. At tax season, enjoy getting a few thousand extra dollars back.
Welcome to the next phase of your life. I wish you and your growing family much happiness.
Agreed, it’s not expensive to start. Just wanted to add that if you don’t inherit or are not gifted stuff from friends and family for your kid that you need, check second hand stores and/or kijiji/Craigslist/etc first. Many items are 1/5 of the cost of buying it new, and a lot of the time it’s brand new anyways.
It does get expensive if you have to pay for care. Not sure where you live OP, or what your support system is like from family, so that may or may not be an issue.
It does get expensive if you have to pay for care. Not sure where you live OP, or what your support system is like from family, so that may or may not be an issue.
The wife wanted to stay at home for the first few years anyway and we made it work. Infant care is fundamentally inefficient and expensive, but people too easily dismiss some of the tax benefits you may be eligible for. At least at our income level, almost half of daycare expenses we get back at tax time.
Just to add another data point. This last year due to the shortage, we’re spending 200/mo on formula alone.
To this point, consider breastfeeding. I won’t comment on nutritional differences, but you save money at the cost of time/flexibility.
Pumping. It ended up that I had to do it if I wanted my kid to have my milk (would he have starved 100 years ago? No idea!) but it had the excellent side benefit of being able to separate output from input, and my husband was able to pop the bottle into the little gaping mouth, and I got to where I could get all the little guy could drink and some extra in three long blocks per day.
Even if direct nursing is going well, I highly recommend doing some pumping along the way from early on so that if/when she needs to be away from the baby for a few hours, it's not as big a deal.
Even if direct nursing is going well, I highly recommend doing some pumping along the way from early on so that if/when she needs to be away from the baby for a few hours, it's not as big a deal.
I know you mean well with this comment but I doubt there's anyone who gives birth these days who doesn't consider breastfeeding. The hospital's push it HARD and we couldn't leave the hospital without a literal class in it.
Not everyone has an easy time of it though. They either can't produce any or not enough and the combination of this pressure and post-partum depression can be life-threatening. There's a lot more that goes into the decision to formula feed than cost.
Not everyone has an easy time of it though. They either can't produce any or not enough and the combination of this pressure and post-partum depression can be life-threatening. There's a lot more that goes into the decision to formula feed than cost.
I see what you mean, but my point was around the cost saving aspect of it. Maybe everyone considers that aspect, but I figured it’s worth mentioning since once you go down the formula path, it’s hard/impossible to go back.
Oof. I've heard. Is it still that bad at Costco? I was under the impression they were rationing out their supplies well enough now and keeping prices reasonable.
> When the hospital sends you the bill - argue, argue, argue.
As someone who comes from a country with single-payer healthcare, this sentence made me feel really sad. I knew some people around the world have to pay for hospital trips, but for some reason I never even considered that having a baby could cost the parents money.
As someone who comes from a country with single-payer healthcare, this sentence made me feel really sad. I knew some people around the world have to pay for hospital trips, but for some reason I never even considered that having a baby could cost the parents money.
Often times it's thousands of dollars even with insurance. We were lucky in that we only had a $20 copay I think.
I second the part about having a kid is cheap. I was so afraid of the expenses, but the child caused us to experience significant lifestyle changes that in turn saved us significant money.
The bad: This is what it means to be a man, a father. You are Atlas, and you will hold up your kid's world. No one will be on your side. Some will curse you. Even your kid will probably curse you when they're in their teens.
The good: You will have the power to make your kid's life a good one. You'll make a difference that no one else can make. Probably the decisive difference. Even if no one ever acknowledges it, you'll know it.
What to do: Think about what you have to do to keep reasonable income coming in. But also, think about what you can do to cut unnecessary expenses to the bone. No new cars. No getting hair done. No eating out. No vacations. Etc.
Within that framework, consider changing jobs. If you're living in an expensive city, leave. This is the golden era of remote work. If your current job makes you want to step in front of a train, find a new one. You can program, and there will always be someone willing to pay for that.
Your kid is everything. Start with that principle and work the problem. Godspeed.
The good: You will have the power to make your kid's life a good one. You'll make a difference that no one else can make. Probably the decisive difference. Even if no one ever acknowledges it, you'll know it.
What to do: Think about what you have to do to keep reasonable income coming in. But also, think about what you can do to cut unnecessary expenses to the bone. No new cars. No getting hair done. No eating out. No vacations. Etc.
Within that framework, consider changing jobs. If you're living in an expensive city, leave. This is the golden era of remote work. If your current job makes you want to step in front of a train, find a new one. You can program, and there will always be someone willing to pay for that.
Your kid is everything. Start with that principle and work the problem. Godspeed.
Also... herculean efforts become a lot easier when you need to succeed for your kid's sake.
If you have felt like you were on the verge of being fired for a full decade, I think that might be a sign that you are actually indispensable despite how they feel about you. And because of that, they have piled the work onto your plate. The only way to break free is to find a new job, at least eventually. My advice is to try to relax&sleep now while you can, enjoy the new addition to your family, update your resume, start looking for new employers, and do the bare minimum at work to get by. At least you can use the “baby kept me up all night” excuse now to hide your lack of motivation.
You need parental leave. Not only for your mental health, but so you can support mama and baby. You should not be thinking about work AT ALL for the first 90 days of baby's life.
Do whatever you can to get as much parental leave as you possibly can. Be there for baby and mama, and then -- only then, after baby is a few months old and your partner has healed a bit -- should you start worrying about your job and finances.
Thinking about caring for your new infant and partner's perinatal health are enough work already, and are far more important right now than your job anxieties.
The only solution for you right now is to understand your priorities. At the moment, the only thing that really and truly matters is your wife/partner's health and your baby. Focus on those for the first month.
After that, focus on the job.
Do whatever you can to get as much parental leave as you possibly can. Be there for baby and mama, and then -- only then, after baby is a few months old and your partner has healed a bit -- should you start worrying about your job and finances.
Thinking about caring for your new infant and partner's perinatal health are enough work already, and are far more important right now than your job anxieties.
The only solution for you right now is to understand your priorities. At the moment, the only thing that really and truly matters is your wife/partner's health and your baby. Focus on those for the first month.
After that, focus on the job.
Isn't it inefficient for both mom & dad to take their parental leave at the same time? Wouldn't it be better to alternate like 8 months + 2/4 months so that atleast one person is available for basically a full year? Rather than both having to go back to work in 6 months.
Carrying a baby and giving birth is a physical and emotional trainwreck. A C-section involves literally cutting you open. If you're lucky enough to have a vaginal birth you're still going to have a tear or -- if your ob is still in the stone age -- an episiotomy. And there's a whole roller coaster ride of hormones and pressure to do everything perfect or you'll ruin your child for life.
The partner who didn't give birth is there to take care of two mostly helpless human beings, one who just came into to the world and one who needs rest and TLC so they can rejoin the world quickly.
The partner who didn't give birth is there to take care of two mostly helpless human beings, one who just came into to the world and one who needs rest and TLC so they can rejoin the world quickly.
This is the most HN comment of all time. Sigh.
We're talking about human beings. Efficiency is not part of the equation. The perinatal period is the most physically (and very often mentally as well) dangerous period in a woman's life. Women to this day die from complications in childbirth.
The first six months after birth are incredibly difficult on a woman's body and mind. Women NEED their partners' help at this time, efficiency be damned.
We're talking about human beings. Efficiency is not part of the equation. The perinatal period is the most physically (and very often mentally as well) dangerous period in a woman's life. Women to this day die from complications in childbirth.
The first six months after birth are incredibly difficult on a woman's body and mind. Women NEED their partners' help at this time, efficiency be damned.
>> At the moment, the only thing that really and truly matters is your wife/partner's health and your baby.
Maybe it’s just the phrasing of this and it’s intended differently, but it seems like terrible advice. You should never put your own mental health last. If you’re in a hole you’re not going to be able to help anyone else. If OP has just found out they’re having a baby they likely have some time. If they use that time to focus on themselves and get themselves in a better position they can be in a much better mental state to help when the baby actually arrives. The statement I quoted reads like the OP doesn’t matter and he should accept that. But maybe I’m not understanding your intention fully.
Maybe it’s just the phrasing of this and it’s intended differently, but it seems like terrible advice. You should never put your own mental health last. If you’re in a hole you’re not going to be able to help anyone else. If OP has just found out they’re having a baby they likely have some time. If they use that time to focus on themselves and get themselves in a better position they can be in a much better mental state to help when the baby actually arrives. The statement I quoted reads like the OP doesn’t matter and he should accept that. But maybe I’m not understanding your intention fully.
My intention was to convey that OP needs to prioritize his baby and partner over worrying about his job/job performance.
His post expresses a great deal of anxiety over his financial circumstances and job performance -- which are valid, and, importantly, are problems that can be solved later. My intention was to convey that fretting about finding a new job or improving current job performance are NOT where OP's energy should be going right now, even if it seems on the surface like a new job will solve all of his problems.
OP should focus that mental energy on:
a) getting parental leave so that he can b) improve his mental health and c) support his partner and his new baby.
Good luck, OP! Just remember that you are not the only person who has ever become a new Dad, and you are going to get through this! I'm wishing you all the best for your family!
His post expresses a great deal of anxiety over his financial circumstances and job performance -- which are valid, and, importantly, are problems that can be solved later. My intention was to convey that fretting about finding a new job or improving current job performance are NOT where OP's energy should be going right now, even if it seems on the surface like a new job will solve all of his problems.
OP should focus that mental energy on:
a) getting parental leave so that he can b) improve his mental health and c) support his partner and his new baby.
Good luck, OP! Just remember that you are not the only person who has ever become a new Dad, and you are going to get through this! I'm wishing you all the best for your family!
Well put. Take advantage of parental leave as much as you can. Once you’re about a month or two in and are able to “breathe” a bit more, you can think about looking for a new job.
Agree with this one 100%. Don't listen to the "bootstraps" and antis in the thread.
Definitely agree with this - in 2022 this just seems humane more than anything.
Send me your resume and I will help you polish it up. There are also free training courses you can take that I can point you to. [email protected] and put GiftedZebra in the subject. FWIW, I've got 20+ years as a software engineer working for large consulting companies. If it's not clear, this is free, no strings attached. This is also a thing for you, as an expectant parent so hopefully I won't get flooded with resumes.
May I email you a few resume questions too? I am in a pickle myself as a SE, and struggling to get out. (I won't email you without your permission, and if you are not interested, I will take no offense.)
Go ahead and happy to. No one else please. This is a business concept, polishing resumes and not a bad one, but it's not a business I am looking to be in.
Could you perhaps please list the courses you're referring to?
* don’t quit your job just yet. Having multiple balls in the air all at the same time will add to your anxiety
* if your baby is healthy, the first 2-3 years are not the most expensive years. You’ll predominately need to be present and support. This will give you time to change jobs and your lifestyle if necessary to increase your finances
* pre-school and primary school is expensive
* parenting is not terribly difficult however, if you are attentive and willing to have regular conversations with you partner (setting goals together, etc), you’ll be fine
I’m a dad with adult kids. Treat everything above as advice. Use what you want, throw out what’s not useful for you. All the best of luck mate!
* if your baby is healthy, the first 2-3 years are not the most expensive years. You’ll predominately need to be present and support. This will give you time to change jobs and your lifestyle if necessary to increase your finances
* pre-school and primary school is expensive
* parenting is not terribly difficult however, if you are attentive and willing to have regular conversations with you partner (setting goals together, etc), you’ll be fine
I’m a dad with adult kids. Treat everything above as advice. Use what you want, throw out what’s not useful for you. All the best of luck mate!
First things first: take vacation days near the due date, take parental leave after the birth.
Caring for a newborn is a lot of waiting for something to happen, then responding, then more waiting. Get good at resting during the waiting, when the baby sleeps you sleep kind of stuff... When you start feeling well rested, hopefully you still have some leave left and you can worry about your job situation then.
To be brutally honest, assuming a newborn without special circumstances, once you adapt to the care routine, they get real boring. Closer to about three months, they get interesting and if you can arrange to have time off then, that would be great.
I left a job of 7 years when my child was six months old, after returning to work, my outlook had changed and I wasn't as willing to stay where I was --- and I got recruited by two different former bosses at the same time.
If you want to put in some groundwork towards looking for a new job now, make a list of people you have worked with in that you would like to work with again, and a list of people that you would be ok working with again (shouldn't just be people with your job, include managers and other cross-functional teammates), and try to get their personal contacts. When you're ready to look, contact them and ask them how they're doing, where they're working, if they like it there, and if they know anybody who is hiring because you're thinking of a change. Networking will help avoid some of the pain of a job search.
Caring for a newborn is a lot of waiting for something to happen, then responding, then more waiting. Get good at resting during the waiting, when the baby sleeps you sleep kind of stuff... When you start feeling well rested, hopefully you still have some leave left and you can worry about your job situation then.
To be brutally honest, assuming a newborn without special circumstances, once you adapt to the care routine, they get real boring. Closer to about three months, they get interesting and if you can arrange to have time off then, that would be great.
I left a job of 7 years when my child was six months old, after returning to work, my outlook had changed and I wasn't as willing to stay where I was --- and I got recruited by two different former bosses at the same time.
If you want to put in some groundwork towards looking for a new job now, make a list of people you have worked with in that you would like to work with again, and a list of people that you would be ok working with again (shouldn't just be people with your job, include managers and other cross-functional teammates), and try to get their personal contacts. When you're ready to look, contact them and ask them how they're doing, where they're working, if they like it there, and if they know anybody who is hiring because you're thinking of a change. Networking will help avoid some of the pain of a job search.
When you have people who depend on you to provide, how you manage risk changes.
A baby needs everything!
Frankly, you CAN take time to improve your situation, and you will need to do that.
Don't worry about being ready. Almost nobody is and those who attempt to plan it all out, prep up and the like, frequently end up refactoring all that work and planning as life happens!
Do worry about giving this your best. That counts.
Do worry about your health. Others really need you, and they really matter and that is all a beautiful thing!
Regarding your job, work it best you can. They may keep people on edge for a ton of reasons. Just do what it takes to stay in the game, but do avoid letting all that get too far into your head.
Ask for help. The other people you know are worth a lot!
Now to fun stuff. Congratulations! You're going to be a dad!
Having done it, I can tell you there is so much good fun love and beauty and all of this to appreciate. Try to get a hold of that as soon as you can and never let go.
And I would have a talk with your spouse too. You need their support. And I'm sure they're ready to give it, so get all that lined up talk it through.
And then I would lower some expectations. Go take a look at life. What you are doing what you're not, what you need what you don't, what you want, and just minimize all those things make room for having a kid, and once you get settled in and running good, build it back up then, but you can let a lot of that fall away right now and you'll be better for it.
A baby needs everything!
Frankly, you CAN take time to improve your situation, and you will need to do that.
Don't worry about being ready. Almost nobody is and those who attempt to plan it all out, prep up and the like, frequently end up refactoring all that work and planning as life happens!
Do worry about giving this your best. That counts.
Do worry about your health. Others really need you, and they really matter and that is all a beautiful thing!
Regarding your job, work it best you can. They may keep people on edge for a ton of reasons. Just do what it takes to stay in the game, but do avoid letting all that get too far into your head.
Ask for help. The other people you know are worth a lot!
Now to fun stuff. Congratulations! You're going to be a dad!
Having done it, I can tell you there is so much good fun love and beauty and all of this to appreciate. Try to get a hold of that as soon as you can and never let go.
And I would have a talk with your spouse too. You need their support. And I'm sure they're ready to give it, so get all that lined up talk it through.
And then I would lower some expectations. Go take a look at life. What you are doing what you're not, what you need what you don't, what you want, and just minimize all those things make room for having a kid, and once you get settled in and running good, build it back up then, but you can let a lot of that fall away right now and you'll be better for it.
1) Don't make a rash career move now. Knowing you are about to be responsible for another human can be frightening, but you want to run towards your future, not away from fear. After adding a baby to your family, your time at work will be rough, and you may underperform; that is normal. As a general rule, it is better to do that in a job you know versus a new one, where this is the first impression you get of people.
2) (Assuming you are in the US) If you can choose health insurance plans (annual enrollment this year and baby next year), check how your health insurance handles birth. There can be a massive difference in how much you pay out of pocket.
3) Plan to take parental leave. If your company offers it, take it... all of it. If it doesn't, budget to take three months off (but seriously, not less than half that). You and the mother won't be getting much sleep, there will be more to do, and last but not least, this is the only time your child will be a baby. This period is not something you can redo later.
4) Get your mental health in check. Your constant fear of losing your job and a low view of your worth suggests you may have some things to work through. Talk to mental health professionals, not just a friend or family member. You owe it to your child and family to be present and a positive influence.
Good luck.
2) (Assuming you are in the US) If you can choose health insurance plans (annual enrollment this year and baby next year), check how your health insurance handles birth. There can be a massive difference in how much you pay out of pocket.
3) Plan to take parental leave. If your company offers it, take it... all of it. If it doesn't, budget to take three months off (but seriously, not less than half that). You and the mother won't be getting much sleep, there will be more to do, and last but not least, this is the only time your child will be a baby. This period is not something you can redo later.
4) Get your mental health in check. Your constant fear of losing your job and a low view of your worth suggests you may have some things to work through. Talk to mental health professionals, not just a friend or family member. You owe it to your child and family to be present and a positive influence.
Good luck.
Relax, you will be fine. Everyone is scared before they have kids and then it all works out, there are a couple of billion kids on this world, how hard can it be.
Right? People make it seem like having a child is THE trial of life. Chill out and enjoy, folks. They are much more resilient than we think and our ability to mold them into something we consider positive is veeeery limited. They are going to be whatever they are going to be; your style of parenting doesn't really matter much.
It does not all work out for a lot of people actually but they don't tend to be on hackernews giving reassurances.
Please lawd let this be sarcasm. OP needs to treat this and respond like the emergency it is or is in for a world of pain. Buckle down, clean up the resume, and start getting in front of anyone who will employ someone competent enough to sling code.
Hope is not a strategy and “it’ll work out” is naivety and survivorship bias’ love child. 12 million kids live in poverty in the US, for example.
Hope is not a strategy and “it’ll work out” is naivety and survivorship bias’ love child. 12 million kids live in poverty in the US, for example.
OP seems to currently be employed as a programmer, on the verge of having a kid and very stressed. He is not into abject poverty yet. Relaxing is a good advice actually. People don’t take good decision under intense stress. That’s why burnout is so pernicious. It removes your ability to objectively look at what’s happening.
Even if the situation requires actions, calming down and taking the time necessary to realise you actually have space to work on solutions is always a good first step.
Even if the situation requires actions, calming down and taking the time necessary to realise you actually have space to work on solutions is always a good first step.
Relaxing is probably the wrong word. You should approach the situation like you’re a first responder arriving at the crash scene: prepared to act and stowing your emotion. Maybe they can take time? Depends on burn rate, savings, and estimated time to next role. Can’t know without insight into OPs finances.
I agree panicking doesn’t help; it’s a call to action. When not at their day job, their job is to find a new job outside of business hours.
(I would propose different advice for someone not in the US, who might have parental leave available and a more robust social safety system)
I agree panicking doesn’t help; it’s a call to action. When not at their day job, their job is to find a new job outside of business hours.
(I would propose different advice for someone not in the US, who might have parental leave available and a more robust social safety system)
> Relaxing is probably the wrong word. You should approach the situation like you’re a first responder arriving at the crash scene: prepared to act and stowing your emotion.
I don’t think that’s a good advice. Life is not a crash scene where minutes count.
Realistically we are talking about weeks here. The situation is not that different today than yesterday and will be mostly the same tomorrow.
OP has time to take a breath, remember that they have a partner having the kid with them and who they can talk to, take a calm look at the situation as a whole which is highly unlikely to be as bad as he paints it (realistically how unemployable can be someone who currently holds a steady job) and then plans actions for the next few months.
The original comment was spot on in a lot of way. Having a kid is indeed a life changing event but it’s good remembering plenty of people went through it and survived.
I don’t think that’s a good advice. Life is not a crash scene where minutes count.
Realistically we are talking about weeks here. The situation is not that different today than yesterday and will be mostly the same tomorrow.
OP has time to take a breath, remember that they have a partner having the kid with them and who they can talk to, take a calm look at the situation as a whole which is highly unlikely to be as bad as he paints it (realistically how unemployable can be someone who currently holds a steady job) and then plans actions for the next few months.
The original comment was spot on in a lot of way. Having a kid is indeed a life changing event but it’s good remembering plenty of people went through it and survived.
Based on how it's going with some of my friends now, the next few months/year might just end up being a blur until things stabilize a little.
I suspect you're better at your job than you think. I certainly wouldn't suffer having someone on the team I wanted to fire for 10 years. It does sound like you're tired of your job though.
Take whatever paternity leave you can. If you can afford one, look into getting a night nurse, which can help relieve the stress for you and the mother.
Since you've been at the job for 10 years, my guess is that if you can find another one, you'll likely be paid more. Interviewing is intimidating, but not everyone has a nightmare parade of leetcode questions. You're absolutely going to strike out at interviews. You just have to accept that, there are likely companies that you'd be a perfect fit for.
I don't know anything about your work now, but if you're looking for a place that gives you a little more breathing room, why not look into City/State/University jobs? Former classmates who took jobs working on city systems may not be making the most, but they got great benefits, good wlb, and a pension coming to them.
I suspect you're better at your job than you think. I certainly wouldn't suffer having someone on the team I wanted to fire for 10 years. It does sound like you're tired of your job though.
Take whatever paternity leave you can. If you can afford one, look into getting a night nurse, which can help relieve the stress for you and the mother.
Since you've been at the job for 10 years, my guess is that if you can find another one, you'll likely be paid more. Interviewing is intimidating, but not everyone has a nightmare parade of leetcode questions. You're absolutely going to strike out at interviews. You just have to accept that, there are likely companies that you'd be a perfect fit for.
I don't know anything about your work now, but if you're looking for a place that gives you a little more breathing room, why not look into City/State/University jobs? Former classmates who took jobs working on city systems may not be making the most, but they got great benefits, good wlb, and a pension coming to them.
This is a hot take from another new parent.
Let them fire you and collect unemployment while you recover. Go get a survival job that’s covers insurance and rent if needed. Sell stuff, get rid of your extra car etc. Your goal is to survive the next year with your baby and partner.
You need to forget about work, the most important thing will be helping your partner. It’s easy for fathers to conveniently choose to work (or stress over work- be present, fuck work!) while the mother bears the burden. Having a job is not an excuse to be lazy or to avoid responsibility for the child. My brother’s both took the easy way out, letting their wife’s become the childcare leader, shouldering the emotional burden, and their wives have to plan/delegate everything. That has fostered resentment and eroded their relationships.
The next year is going to be super challenging but you will grow new muscles, the baby will settle into a rhythm and you’ll be able to poke your head up to find a better job. In the grand scheme, you can write code and you’ll be middle class (or better). A 1 year gap is not going to break you.
Let them fire you and collect unemployment while you recover. Go get a survival job that’s covers insurance and rent if needed. Sell stuff, get rid of your extra car etc. Your goal is to survive the next year with your baby and partner.
You need to forget about work, the most important thing will be helping your partner. It’s easy for fathers to conveniently choose to work (or stress over work- be present, fuck work!) while the mother bears the burden. Having a job is not an excuse to be lazy or to avoid responsibility for the child. My brother’s both took the easy way out, letting their wife’s become the childcare leader, shouldering the emotional burden, and their wives have to plan/delegate everything. That has fostered resentment and eroded their relationships.
The next year is going to be super challenging but you will grow new muscles, the baby will settle into a rhythm and you’ll be able to poke your head up to find a better job. In the grand scheme, you can write code and you’ll be middle class (or better). A 1 year gap is not going to break you.
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If you've been there for 10y and felt like you were always about to be fired, odds are they're not going to fire you as you're about to have a child. If their intent had been to fire you, they'd already have. The fact that they didn't shows that either you're paranoid or they've got a conscience. If they kept you due to their conscience, they're not going to fire you as an expecting new dad.
In any case perhaps do try to get another job. You've got more time now than you'll have for the coming two years. Pay it now or suffer later.
In any case perhaps do try to get another job. You've got more time now than you'll have for the coming two years. Pay it now or suffer later.
You don't need to be a fast talker to get a job as a programmer. If you haven't left your job in 10 years you might be able to double your salary with a move.
Send me your resume, my email is in my profile. Happy to take a look.
Being a dad is a lot of work, but caring is the most important part. For the first few months finding sleep is very difficult, and supporting your spouse will be important, but other than that it's pretty simple.
It's good that you are freaking out now, it means you need to freak out less later.
Send me your resume, my email is in my profile. Happy to take a look.
Being a dad is a lot of work, but caring is the most important part. For the first few months finding sleep is very difficult, and supporting your spouse will be important, but other than that it's pretty simple.
It's good that you are freaking out now, it means you need to freak out less later.
Are you able to get some paternity leave through your current job? Maybe some leave could help buy you some time, both to relax with your baby and get your resume into shape.
Agreed. Go on paternity leave, it'll provide some distance and maybe some time to interview.
First off, it sounds like a very stressful time for you. I hope it all works out.
As everyone else suggested, parental leave may give you a bit of time to recover. Your job may also offer unpaid leave you can take on top of that, if you can afford it.
Now might be a time to think creatively about how to move forward with your life. Sometimes, I've gotten boxed in by my own assumptions of what I should be doing. When I've been able to take a much broader perspective of what's possible, and accept that my idealized view of my life isn't materializing, I've been able to accept the opportunities that are in front of me and find a lot of joy and success outside of my original plans for myself. And over time, that has taken be way beyond what I could have imagined.
Do you or your partner have any family you can lean on? If you're able to eliminate housing expenses, would you be able to take some time to recover from burnout and find your next gig?
When I've read biographies of some of the most celebrated people of the past couple years, a large number of them talk about periods where someone had dealt with nervous breakdown. Not saying that's what you're dealing with, but just that mental health issues can affect anyone BUT they need not constrain your whole future.
As a father, one thing that might bring you a little comfort is that if the baby is healthy, the learning curve to being a dad is very gradual. In the beginning, it's true that it's hard to come by long stretches of sleep, but the things you need to master are very limited. Changing diapers, basic newborn safety stuff, soothing, and helping with nursing/feeding.
As everyone else suggested, parental leave may give you a bit of time to recover. Your job may also offer unpaid leave you can take on top of that, if you can afford it.
Now might be a time to think creatively about how to move forward with your life. Sometimes, I've gotten boxed in by my own assumptions of what I should be doing. When I've been able to take a much broader perspective of what's possible, and accept that my idealized view of my life isn't materializing, I've been able to accept the opportunities that are in front of me and find a lot of joy and success outside of my original plans for myself. And over time, that has taken be way beyond what I could have imagined.
Do you or your partner have any family you can lean on? If you're able to eliminate housing expenses, would you be able to take some time to recover from burnout and find your next gig?
When I've read biographies of some of the most celebrated people of the past couple years, a large number of them talk about periods where someone had dealt with nervous breakdown. Not saying that's what you're dealing with, but just that mental health issues can affect anyone BUT they need not constrain your whole future.
As a father, one thing that might bring you a little comfort is that if the baby is healthy, the learning curve to being a dad is very gradual. In the beginning, it's true that it's hard to come by long stretches of sleep, but the things you need to master are very limited. Changing diapers, basic newborn safety stuff, soothing, and helping with nursing/feeding.
First off, congratulations! I know you're nervous about the whole ordeal but take a step back and breathe. You're bringing a brand new person into the world. Medical science understands the process so we'll these days but it still feels magical, doesn't it?
When you talk about being a dad in your post, it sounds like you're focused on your career but right now that's less important. Being a parent is your number one job. You have to clothe and feed and change and love this new person and they are going to look up to you as this amazing person who makes them feel comfortable, happy, and safe.
(Don't forget your partner here either. They're going to be recovering from giving birth and needing your presence and support.)
Take all the parental leave you're legally entitled to. And if the company offers more, take it!
I remember when my little bean was born and I'd spend like half an hour bottle feeding them in the kitchen bored off my butt. So I started responding to Stack Overflow questions other people were ignoring. And I would talk to my kid about it and why it was so important to help these people, and a little about the technology, and why I chose this career for myself. Babies don't understand any of that, but I was giving them my attention, I was making sounds they eventually learned to copy, and I think the best part is they got to see Mama excited about something.
We would spend hours cuddled up on the nursery floor with a pile of pillows, some Tangerine Dream albums, and stories about people I've met and things I've done.
Parental leave is a great opportunity to look at things through new eyes. I feel like I learned so much about being a manager by trying to explain it to a newborn. I hope you find it to be a positive experience as well.
When you talk about being a dad in your post, it sounds like you're focused on your career but right now that's less important. Being a parent is your number one job. You have to clothe and feed and change and love this new person and they are going to look up to you as this amazing person who makes them feel comfortable, happy, and safe.
(Don't forget your partner here either. They're going to be recovering from giving birth and needing your presence and support.)
Take all the parental leave you're legally entitled to. And if the company offers more, take it!
I remember when my little bean was born and I'd spend like half an hour bottle feeding them in the kitchen bored off my butt. So I started responding to Stack Overflow questions other people were ignoring. And I would talk to my kid about it and why it was so important to help these people, and a little about the technology, and why I chose this career for myself. Babies don't understand any of that, but I was giving them my attention, I was making sounds they eventually learned to copy, and I think the best part is they got to see Mama excited about something.
We would spend hours cuddled up on the nursery floor with a pile of pillows, some Tangerine Dream albums, and stories about people I've met and things I've done.
Parental leave is a great opportunity to look at things through new eyes. I feel like I learned so much about being a manager by trying to explain it to a newborn. I hope you find it to be a positive experience as well.
> I can't quit my job, I can't take time to look for another job
Don't leave now -- definitely take advantage of any family leave they offer first. But then after that, why can't you quit? Why can't you look for another job? It seems like that's something that you _must_ do -- if not for yourself, then for the sake of your kid.
> I'm not a fast talker, my resume looks like shit, the only thing I know how to do is program, and we're about to have a baby. What do I do?
Don't learn to be a fast talker. It seems like you can write well enough, so I'm guessing you think well too. Learn to be comfortable with gaps in the conversation while you consider what you're going to say. You don't have to respond immediately to every question.
There are other offers here to help you polish your resume, but throwing my hat in the ring too -- me at my username dot net. Send over a resume and I'll help you clean it up. If there's alignment on technologies, I can also put in a referral with my current employer (we're hiring for several roles rn). Happy to help with interview practice too!
Don't leave now -- definitely take advantage of any family leave they offer first. But then after that, why can't you quit? Why can't you look for another job? It seems like that's something that you _must_ do -- if not for yourself, then for the sake of your kid.
> I'm not a fast talker, my resume looks like shit, the only thing I know how to do is program, and we're about to have a baby. What do I do?
Don't learn to be a fast talker. It seems like you can write well enough, so I'm guessing you think well too. Learn to be comfortable with gaps in the conversation while you consider what you're going to say. You don't have to respond immediately to every question.
There are other offers here to help you polish your resume, but throwing my hat in the ring too -- me at my username dot net. Send over a resume and I'll help you clean it up. If there's alignment on technologies, I can also put in a referral with my current employer (we're hiring for several roles rn). Happy to help with interview practice too!
[deleted]
I am in a similar situation to you - 2 year old and a newborn and feeling a little burnt out at work.
The way I have been coping is just realizing that at this stage the timelines for pretty much everything shrink from months or years to hours and days. You need to focus on getting through the day at work, keeping sane, and being present for your partner and kiddo. Your work might not be pleasant, but you have been there for ten years so you should have a good idea of what your MVO (minimum viable output) is.
I think the Kanban approach of reducing the Work In Progress is the way to go.
I have made a conscious effort to not worry too much about big picture "career questions" and just focus on the task at hand.
Our first kid is young enough for me to know that things become more manageable once the kid is sleeping 5-6 hours at a time. For us, this happened around 4 months in.
Good luck, and I wish you and your family well!
Everyone has a different story. For me, my wife and I had almost given up on having a child and then a miracle happened. Being a dad is a rewarding experience; it gave purpose to my life.
Nevertheless, there are challenges. Your wife will be in pain after labor. She will also be in pain from breast feeding. She will have no sleep. You support her by changing diapers and be lightning-fast when preparing infant formula. (A keurig or hot water dispenser is what I used. Put the infant formula powder in the bottle, dispense a little hot water, stir until the powder is completely mixed, dispense COOL water, stir, and TEST the formula on yourself before giving it to baby). Your wife may get post partum depression and will take out all her frustrations on you. Deal with it; you are partners for life. Eventually, you will want a job with work-life balance. Finances will be tight. But nothing can replace a happy family life.
Nevertheless, there are challenges. Your wife will be in pain after labor. She will also be in pain from breast feeding. She will have no sleep. You support her by changing diapers and be lightning-fast when preparing infant formula. (A keurig or hot water dispenser is what I used. Put the infant formula powder in the bottle, dispense a little hot water, stir until the powder is completely mixed, dispense COOL water, stir, and TEST the formula on yourself before giving it to baby). Your wife may get post partum depression and will take out all her frustrations on you. Deal with it; you are partners for life. Eventually, you will want a job with work-life balance. Finances will be tight. But nothing can replace a happy family life.
Take a deep breath. It's all very hard but somehow manageable. For example, I used to be dead without my 9 hours of sleep. I found out that, with screaming children, I can do with 6-7. One step at a time. It's one of those where climbing a mountain seems impossible, but taking one step is OK.
No one is prepared to be a parent, really, unless you've had 2 kids already. People forget the tough stuff when they tell you their war stories from 20+ years ago. Truth is, everyone makes it up as they go along. Being a passable parent is somehow baked into our DNA, so with a little effort you'll make a good one, and with dedication a great one.
See if you can somehow coast at work. I don't mean, take advantage of anything, but the first 12-18 months of a child's life is not ideal for pushing hard on career. For the same reason, if you'd be thinking about changing jobs, I'd take it into account.
No one is prepared to be a parent, really, unless you've had 2 kids already. People forget the tough stuff when they tell you their war stories from 20+ years ago. Truth is, everyone makes it up as they go along. Being a passable parent is somehow baked into our DNA, so with a little effort you'll make a good one, and with dedication a great one.
See if you can somehow coast at work. I don't mean, take advantage of anything, but the first 12-18 months of a child's life is not ideal for pushing hard on career. For the same reason, if you'd be thinking about changing jobs, I'd take it into account.
You could try to change jobs before kiddo arrives, and line up start date 2 months or however long you want to take off. Start by having conversations and not putting so much pressure on yourself, plenty of teams need someone with experience.
I left a job with a few weeks to go until birth, which allowed me to prep in a different way, by fixing things around the house, preparing food, getting baby stuff etc. I accepted an offer back at BigCo the week baby arrived with a start date that was about two months out.
I definitely leaned into my savings, but I kind of valued not having my first kids birth being held over my head at a job that I wasn’t thrilled with.
Of course this was possible because my wife and I were both working and had solid savings cushions.
Happy to talk if you want, our kiddo is 3months this week and it’s been an amazing ride. Plenty of people have done it with fewer resources, you can do it OP!
I left a job with a few weeks to go until birth, which allowed me to prep in a different way, by fixing things around the house, preparing food, getting baby stuff etc. I accepted an offer back at BigCo the week baby arrived with a start date that was about two months out.
I definitely leaned into my savings, but I kind of valued not having my first kids birth being held over my head at a job that I wasn’t thrilled with.
Of course this was possible because my wife and I were both working and had solid savings cushions.
Happy to talk if you want, our kiddo is 3months this week and it’s been an amazing ride. Plenty of people have done it with fewer resources, you can do it OP!
Start saving. Live frugally if you have to. You did not plan before having the kid. Don’t make the same mistake while raising the child.
Plan. Plan. Plan. Before you plan your money, plan your time. Stay healthy. Expand your friends circle and take whatever help comes your way from them…baby sitting, clothes/toys trading, barter etc. There are some things you can’t buy with money. Relationships matter.
Don’t quit your job. Economy is only going to get bleaker. I don’t think employees have any bargaining power regardless of industry and anywhere in the world. All you can do is plan from your end..best case scenario, mixed case scenario and worst case scenario.
Enjoy the time with your child. Be calm. Again..planning is everything. Take it in 5 year chunks. Savings should be for at least 6-12 months expenses. In the US, there is social net support for necessities. It’s the other stuff.
Plan. Plan. Plan. Before you plan your money, plan your time. Stay healthy. Expand your friends circle and take whatever help comes your way from them…baby sitting, clothes/toys trading, barter etc. There are some things you can’t buy with money. Relationships matter.
Don’t quit your job. Economy is only going to get bleaker. I don’t think employees have any bargaining power regardless of industry and anywhere in the world. All you can do is plan from your end..best case scenario, mixed case scenario and worst case scenario.
Enjoy the time with your child. Be calm. Again..planning is everything. Take it in 5 year chunks. Savings should be for at least 6-12 months expenses. In the US, there is social net support for necessities. It’s the other stuff.
Congratulations! Sounds like a stressful situation. In my opinion:
It sounds like you need a break and need a bit of a mental adjustment: you've likely spent a decade being undervalued (new hires almost always make more than long-serving employees).
Take what pat leave you can, max out vacation time, and sick days if you need to, decompress, and adjust to being a dad.
As soon as you feel ready, talk to management / owners and express these feelings. You'll get good feedback either way. Your goal is either to take a sabbatical and come back refreshed, with a raise, or take your notice period to find a new job.
Maybe it's time to move into management or shift into something slower, like government. Maybe it's time to move nearer to family -- grandpa and grandma might enjoy helping with childcare.
Calm down, face your fears, and change what you need to change in order to take care of your responsibilities.
Best of luck!
It sounds like you need a break and need a bit of a mental adjustment: you've likely spent a decade being undervalued (new hires almost always make more than long-serving employees).
Take what pat leave you can, max out vacation time, and sick days if you need to, decompress, and adjust to being a dad.
As soon as you feel ready, talk to management / owners and express these feelings. You'll get good feedback either way. Your goal is either to take a sabbatical and come back refreshed, with a raise, or take your notice period to find a new job.
Maybe it's time to move into management or shift into something slower, like government. Maybe it's time to move nearer to family -- grandpa and grandma might enjoy helping with childcare.
Calm down, face your fears, and change what you need to change in order to take care of your responsibilities.
Best of luck!
Congratulations! Allow yourself to be excited about your baby. All they need at first is food, sleep, and clean diapers. They will fill you with joy that you've never experienced before.
Work will seem ever more trivial. Allow that as well, it is trivial. Now that you have a baby to take care of, you can worry less about taking care of your boss, and the wealth they need you to create for them, and the vacations they need you to pay for them, and the big house they need you to build for them, etc. Let them sucker some other young engineer into building their dreams.
You are the result of an unbroken line of millions of years of successful reproduction. You are the product of an uncountable quantity of computation and evolution. The power and intelligence behind you is infinitely greater than the obstacles that lay before you.
Work will seem ever more trivial. Allow that as well, it is trivial. Now that you have a baby to take care of, you can worry less about taking care of your boss, and the wealth they need you to create for them, and the vacations they need you to pay for them, and the big house they need you to build for them, etc. Let them sucker some other young engineer into building their dreams.
You are the result of an unbroken line of millions of years of successful reproduction. You are the product of an uncountable quantity of computation and evolution. The power and intelligence behind you is infinitely greater than the obstacles that lay before you.
We just had our first. Take your paternity if you have it. I felt that weight and a bit of burnout before the baby came and paternity was the first time I'd fully unplugged in years. Even though that time was a whirlwind it really helped my mental health and I came back to work feeling pretty good. Some other people have suggested using paternity to look for jobs or do side work. I would say don't do this. Just enjoy and soak in that time. Recharge and be ready to hit the ground running when you come back. I did spend some time learning some new stuff while I was taking night shift with the baby and couldn't sleep myself, but that's just because I enjoy that. You should do whatever you enjoy in those moments.
I feel like I was in a similar position 20 years ago, except that it was my second child. I had gone through dotcom boom/bust and the job market was terrible. I had given all my working moments to the company I was working for, and my skill set was unmarketable, and I was emotionally spent, and my self confidence was void.
I ended up leaving the company and taking a sizable pay cut to do so. It was hard, super hard. The company I moved to was in chaos, we absorbed a bunch of new debt to keep up with things.
20 years later, I am so grateful I made this move. Not because things turned out great (which they did), but because I learned how to say no, and set boundaries for myself and how I let companies treat me.
Keep your head up, and focus on the stuff that really matters.
I ended up leaving the company and taking a sizable pay cut to do so. It was hard, super hard. The company I moved to was in chaos, we absorbed a bunch of new debt to keep up with things.
20 years later, I am so grateful I made this move. Not because things turned out great (which they did), but because I learned how to say no, and set boundaries for myself and how I let companies treat me.
Keep your head up, and focus on the stuff that really matters.
You have ten years experience as a programmer and it sounds like you've been working your ass off. Get some help preparing your resume and you'll have no trouble finding another job. I agree with another comment that you might be severely underpaid unless you've been getting hefty raises.
I just had my first kid earlier this year and I won't lie - the first three months were rough - but it's true what everyone says: sleep gets better, you and the mom support each other and learn together, and it starts to get fun and rewarding.
Hopefully your work provides some parental leave for fathers but even if they do, it sounds like you should at least update your resume and look into what other jobs are available.
I just had my first kid earlier this year and I won't lie - the first three months were rough - but it's true what everyone says: sleep gets better, you and the mom support each other and learn together, and it starts to get fun and rewarding.
Hopefully your work provides some parental leave for fathers but even if they do, it sounds like you should at least update your resume and look into what other jobs are available.
I don't know the specifics of your situation but I can relate to always feeling like I am about to get the axe. I get my bonuses every year, I have never been laid off even though others who I thought more accomplished were, and I always get decent to good reviews, but still on the day to day I rarely feel like I am doing well.
Maybe really have a hard think or even talk with your manager about this? I have bluntly asked exactly where I stand when I feel like I am underperforming. It is part of their job to make you feel secure, if you are afraid of being fired they are doing a poor job at management. Up until the second they axe you your managers job is to make you feel as comfortable as possible.
Maybe really have a hard think or even talk with your manager about this? I have bluntly asked exactly where I stand when I feel like I am underperforming. It is part of their job to make you feel secure, if you are afraid of being fired they are doing a poor job at management. Up until the second they axe you your managers job is to make you feel as comfortable as possible.
I was in a situation not unlike yours when my wife got pregnant but I was unemployed, and hadn't had a W2 job for a long time.
You have a job, take a deep breath - but clearly you will want a new job sometime soon.
My advice is to focus on people - don't be shy or embarrassed about reaching out to everyone you've ever worked with or been friends with in the industry about how you're interested in new opportunities.
I found a job while my wife was preggers through the husband of an employee of a freelance client from years back. Most people like to help people when they can!
Apply the same belief in your dad abilities to your job abilities and I trust you'll land on your feet.
You have a job, take a deep breath - but clearly you will want a new job sometime soon.
My advice is to focus on people - don't be shy or embarrassed about reaching out to everyone you've ever worked with or been friends with in the industry about how you're interested in new opportunities.
I found a job while my wife was preggers through the husband of an employee of a freelance client from years back. Most people like to help people when they can!
Apply the same belief in your dad abilities to your job abilities and I trust you'll land on your feet.
After being a long time lurker on this forum , I felt compelled to leave a comment as I found myself in a very similar situation.
Background : Was burnt out having spent ten years working in a FAANG company, father was undergoing treatment for cancer and my wife was due with twin boys!
Couple of thoughts:
Talk to friends: Two months before the boys were due - I sent a text to three of closest friends to say that I was feeling overwhelmed by life and needed to chat to someone. This was by far the best thing I did . They had great advise but more importantly I was able to get my concerns put in the air and examine them in the cold light of day. If you are not comfortable talking to a friend , reach out to a therapist or even a helpline. It really is good to talk.
Take to mgmt in another department or in your industry: Taking a step back and thinking about your scenario from the companies perspective. Talk to managers in other departments or outside your company to discuss how best to manage this situation. They will give you a steer on how best to navigate this scenario for your mutual benefit. For example if you know you are expecting a child - have a plan in place for how you will ensure your work can be completed in your absence , who could take over etc. Have a plan and communicate that plan on a regular basis.
Priorities your family / depriortise work : For me I made the decision to move horizontal and to put off making a significant career move for a year. Making the decision not to make a change freed me from the background stress of feeling I was stuck. If you can - take what ever time is available for you to be with your family.
Surf the wave: By nature I am a problem solver but something's can't be solved in the short term or require trade offs in the long term. During the most stressful periods I visualised myself surfing the wave ! If I tried to fight it , I would be crushed - but by going with the flow and enjoying the ride - it helped me cope.
Finally - here is the secret no one tells you. We are all laughably under prepared ! I was worries about not being the type of father I had but what you realises is Parenthood is a journey not a destination . You learn on the job.
Background : Was burnt out having spent ten years working in a FAANG company, father was undergoing treatment for cancer and my wife was due with twin boys!
Couple of thoughts:
Talk to friends: Two months before the boys were due - I sent a text to three of closest friends to say that I was feeling overwhelmed by life and needed to chat to someone. This was by far the best thing I did . They had great advise but more importantly I was able to get my concerns put in the air and examine them in the cold light of day. If you are not comfortable talking to a friend , reach out to a therapist or even a helpline. It really is good to talk.
Take to mgmt in another department or in your industry: Taking a step back and thinking about your scenario from the companies perspective. Talk to managers in other departments or outside your company to discuss how best to manage this situation. They will give you a steer on how best to navigate this scenario for your mutual benefit. For example if you know you are expecting a child - have a plan in place for how you will ensure your work can be completed in your absence , who could take over etc. Have a plan and communicate that plan on a regular basis.
Priorities your family / depriortise work : For me I made the decision to move horizontal and to put off making a significant career move for a year. Making the decision not to make a change freed me from the background stress of feeling I was stuck. If you can - take what ever time is available for you to be with your family.
Surf the wave: By nature I am a problem solver but something's can't be solved in the short term or require trade offs in the long term. During the most stressful periods I visualised myself surfing the wave ! If I tried to fight it , I would be crushed - but by going with the flow and enjoying the ride - it helped me cope.
Finally - here is the secret no one tells you. We are all laughably under prepared ! I was worries about not being the type of father I had but what you realises is Parenthood is a journey not a destination . You learn on the job.
You said: "I've been here since 2012, and I've never felt like I wasn't just about to be fired."
Imagine someone terrified of having a car accident every time they drove. "Have you ever been in an accident?" "No, never."
Or someone constantly worried about having left the oven on at home, so much so that they have to check it multiple before they leave. But they've never actually left it on.
This isn't an attack or a criticism, but sometimes it can be difficult to notice our own unhelpful patterns of thoughts, even though we'd notice them straightaway in others.
Imagine someone terrified of having a car accident every time they drove. "Have you ever been in an accident?" "No, never."
Or someone constantly worried about having left the oven on at home, so much so that they have to check it multiple before they leave. But they've never actually left it on.
This isn't an attack or a criticism, but sometimes it can be difficult to notice our own unhelpful patterns of thoughts, even though we'd notice them straightaway in others.
To go on from this, I'd suggest OP look for a therapist. This does not sound like a good attitude towards a job (that you have been successfully working at for 10 years), and becoming a parent will need you to make a lot of big changes. You can either go in blindly, or go in with someone to help you.
From the outside my wife and I had a pretty good childhood and were living successfully, but inside there were some deep traumas and we started to notice our first child exhibiting the same behaviours. Working with a therapist helped us to understand ourselves what was happening and learn how not repeat the same mistakes for our children that our parents made. My only regret is not doing it sooner.
From the outside my wife and I had a pretty good childhood and were living successfully, but inside there were some deep traumas and we started to notice our first child exhibiting the same behaviours. Working with a therapist helped us to understand ourselves what was happening and learn how not repeat the same mistakes for our children that our parents made. My only regret is not doing it sooner.
If you're about to have a kid, and your work knows this, they would be somewhat less likely to fire you. You've given them 10 years, and if they fire you right before you take your first parental leave, it looks bad for them.
Of course, if they can document reasons why they're letting you go, they can still do it. But if you start asking questions and indicate that you're looking at getting a lawyer to review the termination agreement they offer, they would probably get nervous and make a better offer.
Of course, if they can document reasons why they're letting you go, they can still do it. But if you start asking questions and indicate that you're looking at getting a lawyer to review the termination agreement they offer, they would probably get nervous and make a better offer.
My wife and I met at 14 and had a kid by 15. Life was (and in many ways continues to be) hard. We could do it at 15, you can do it as an adult with an income. We never could take a chance. We've been in dire straits and financial black holes and despite that, here we are. Be a team, help each other, communicate, prioritize basic needs, the baby, then your relationship with your significant other, then work and all the other things. You got this.
Not sure where you are - but in my situation having my 2nd son right in March 2020, I had (and still have) a job with the government. I had 6 months paid pat leave (full salary) and relatively low stress.
Wouldn't even consider taking a more stressful job until the kids are older, as the trade-off isn't worth it.
All that being said, you need to factor in your partners job, and cost of living wherever you are.
For me, being a dad has been awesome, even through COVID, I hope you can find a way to enjoy it.
Wouldn't even consider taking a more stressful job until the kids are older, as the trade-off isn't worth it.
All that being said, you need to factor in your partners job, and cost of living wherever you are.
For me, being a dad has been awesome, even through COVID, I hope you can find a way to enjoy it.
“the only thing I know how to do is program”.
Ok, you’re employable. Put out some feelers. You don’t need the perfect job, and probably people hiring for “non perfect” jobs are having trouble hiring. Maybe that’s your opportunity. Look for a stable and “boring” gig.
But also, 10 years is a solid track record. Maybe it’s a bit of imposter syndrome. Maybe management likes it when employees feel they aren’t doing enough. Maybe… don’t worry about it until there’s something to worry about.
Ok, you’re employable. Put out some feelers. You don’t need the perfect job, and probably people hiring for “non perfect” jobs are having trouble hiring. Maybe that’s your opportunity. Look for a stable and “boring” gig.
But also, 10 years is a solid track record. Maybe it’s a bit of imposter syndrome. Maybe management likes it when employees feel they aren’t doing enough. Maybe… don’t worry about it until there’s something to worry about.
I will echo what all the guys have said, as the mother of a toddler: paternity leave is the best gift you can give your child, your partner, and even yourself those first few months. I don't know what I would have done had my husband not been off work those first few weeks.
The baby will keep you busy, but it will be a different sort of busy. My husband got some cool projects done, while still being the main changer of midnight diapers.
The baby will keep you busy, but it will be a different sort of busy. My husband got some cool projects done, while still being the main changer of midnight diapers.
A baby is scary and nobody is prepared - read all the books and attended classes but we were still lost.
Fortunately my mother-in-law stayed with us for a month just to help out and show mainly my wife the ropes to speak with when kiddo cries and you have no idea what to do and you know it somehow all comes together.
And be understanding with your partner - the house is going to be a mess cause she now sleeps on baby time - it get's better - really it does.
Fortunately my mother-in-law stayed with us for a month just to help out and show mainly my wife the ropes to speak with when kiddo cries and you have no idea what to do and you know it somehow all comes together.
And be understanding with your partner - the house is going to be a mess cause she now sleeps on baby time - it get's better - really it does.
I'm in a slightly similar situation. I have a job that's fine, but not my dream. Working on my dream on the side. But wife is currently pregnant, so my wife quit her job and we moved in with my parents. I know that might not be everyone's cup of tea, but I love my parents and they're getting older and need help anyway, so it's a win-win situation for me. Have you considered anything similar?
Are you sure the feeling is accurate? You might just not trust your coworkers/feel secure in the environment. There's a good chance you've built up more goodwill than you realize, and the people at your job would be happy to cover for you or at least cut you some slack.
I'd go to your manager or whoever you trust, share how you feel (overwhelmed, afraid of being fired), and listen to what they say.
I'd go to your manager or whoever you trust, share how you feel (overwhelmed, afraid of being fired), and listen to what they say.
So confused on how you can feel that was for 10 years. That being said happy to take a look at your resume. Was a tech recruiter for 6 years before becoming an engineer.
Leetresume will make one for you for free as well. enhance.cv can give you a pretty template for free that you just need to fill in.
Take a week or two off as parental leave and smash some interviews in there.
Email is in my profile.
Leetresume will make one for you for free as well. enhance.cv can give you a pretty template for free that you just need to fill in.
Take a week or two off as parental leave and smash some interviews in there.
Email is in my profile.
After being a long time lurker on this forum , I felt compelled to leave a comment as I found myself in a very similar situation.
Background : Was burnt out having spent ten years working in a FAANG company, father was undergoing treatment for cancer and my wife was due with twin boys!
Couple of thoughts:
Talk to friends: Two months before the boys were due - I sent a text to three of closest friends to say that I was feeling overwhelmed by life and needed to chat to someone. This was by far the best thing I did . They had great advice but more importantly I was able to get my concerns out in the air and examine them in the cold light of day. If you are not comfortable talking to a friend , reach out to a therapist or even a helpline. It really is good to talk.
Take to mgmt in another department or in your industry: Taking a step back and thinking about your scenario from the company's perspective. Talk to managers in other departments or outside your company to discuss how best to manage this situation. They will give you a steer on how best to navigate this scenario for your mutual benefit. For example if you know you are expecting a child - have a plan in place for how you will ensure your work can be completed in your absence , who could take over etc. Have a plan and communicate that plan on a regular basis.
Priorities your family / depriortise work : For me I made the decision to move horizontal and to put off making a significant career move for a year. Making the decision not to make a change freed me from the background stress of feeling I was stuck. If you can - take what ever time is available for you to be with your family.
Cut yourself some slack - Before the boys arrived I trained everyday, went to the theatre , did self study and had a number of commitments outside of the house. I decided to depriortise a number of things and dial down the pressure I was putting on myself.
Surf the wave: By nature I am a problem solver but something's can't be solved in the short term or require trade offs in the long term. During the most stressful periods I visualised myself surfing the wave ! If I tried to fight it , I would be crushed - but by going with the flow and enjoying the ride - it helped me cope.
Finally - here is the secret no one tells you. We are all laughably under prepared ! I was worried about not being the type of father I had but what you realises is Parenthood is a journey not a destination . You learn on the job.
Background : Was burnt out having spent ten years working in a FAANG company, father was undergoing treatment for cancer and my wife was due with twin boys!
Couple of thoughts:
Talk to friends: Two months before the boys were due - I sent a text to three of closest friends to say that I was feeling overwhelmed by life and needed to chat to someone. This was by far the best thing I did . They had great advice but more importantly I was able to get my concerns out in the air and examine them in the cold light of day. If you are not comfortable talking to a friend , reach out to a therapist or even a helpline. It really is good to talk.
Take to mgmt in another department or in your industry: Taking a step back and thinking about your scenario from the company's perspective. Talk to managers in other departments or outside your company to discuss how best to manage this situation. They will give you a steer on how best to navigate this scenario for your mutual benefit. For example if you know you are expecting a child - have a plan in place for how you will ensure your work can be completed in your absence , who could take over etc. Have a plan and communicate that plan on a regular basis.
Priorities your family / depriortise work : For me I made the decision to move horizontal and to put off making a significant career move for a year. Making the decision not to make a change freed me from the background stress of feeling I was stuck. If you can - take what ever time is available for you to be with your family.
Cut yourself some slack - Before the boys arrived I trained everyday, went to the theatre , did self study and had a number of commitments outside of the house. I decided to depriortise a number of things and dial down the pressure I was putting on myself.
Surf the wave: By nature I am a problem solver but something's can't be solved in the short term or require trade offs in the long term. During the most stressful periods I visualised myself surfing the wave ! If I tried to fight it , I would be crushed - but by going with the flow and enjoying the ride - it helped me cope.
Finally - here is the secret no one tells you. We are all laughably under prepared ! I was worried about not being the type of father I had but what you realises is Parenthood is a journey not a destination . You learn on the job.
You are thinking too much before even experiencing it. You will get tired but a lot of people is also stressing out by envisioning too much.
Let it come to you, be extra strong for the kid, and realize you will get tired from late night wakings, but let your bosses know. Ppl are more compassionate than you think if you are up front.
Let it come to you, be extra strong for the kid, and realize you will get tired from late night wakings, but let your bosses know. Ppl are more compassionate than you think if you are up front.
This is great advice. So many dads told me what it was going to feel like to be a dad. By the time I arrived there myself, I found the experience to be completely different and that I had spent lots of mental energy preparing for an experience that wasn't my own.
The best thing about becoming a parent is that the "why"-questions about your life becomes absolutly irrelevant. You look at your newborn child and you know why you're doing this.
It will unlock some power reserve in you you didn't know you have it.
By the way congratulations.
If your wife works, seriously consider her not working. This makes a lot of financial sense actually, because if you are in a high marginal income tax bracket, and her salary is low, it might cost more money for her to work and to send your kid to childcare than for her to not work and stay home with the kid.
It sounds like this is not something you planned on, are prepared for, or currently want. I am seriously surprised that nobody has mentioned it so far, as surely this should be the top comment: have you considered abortion? That sounds like the most responsible option to me.
I don't have children, but what helped me was to realize that life is a gift. It's inherently magical. The cognitive dissonance we all feel as creatives working in a dog-eat-dog world that isn't designed for us is normal.
Mindfulness meditation (prayer in a religious context), the quieting of my inner monologue through shadow work + self-cognitive-behavior-therapy (CBT) to nurture my inner child, and noticing the presence of the divine through studying synchronicity (magic) really helped me.
In other words, you've correctly identified that no solution may be possible within your current reality. But as human beings, we can consciously shift into the reality we wish to live in. That might look like getting a different job, moving somewhere else, or even just communicating our feelings and setting boundaries. I've found that the more I stand up for the dignity of myself and others, the more the universe realigns to support my existence. I believe that this spiritual work in service to ourselves and especially others, is what brings about Heaven on Earth.
Mindfulness meditation (prayer in a religious context), the quieting of my inner monologue through shadow work + self-cognitive-behavior-therapy (CBT) to nurture my inner child, and noticing the presence of the divine through studying synchronicity (magic) really helped me.
In other words, you've correctly identified that no solution may be possible within your current reality. But as human beings, we can consciously shift into the reality we wish to live in. That might look like getting a different job, moving somewhere else, or even just communicating our feelings and setting boundaries. I've found that the more I stand up for the dignity of myself and others, the more the universe realigns to support my existence. I believe that this spiritual work in service to ourselves and especially others, is what brings about Heaven on Earth.
Is normal to be afraid but you can do this. Take in mind that babies are the best cure known to man against feeling burnt or trapped in a useless life.
About being tired, well, this is a different situation... be afraid, very afraid. Some babies are very quiet, other not so much. One step at a time.
About being tired, well, this is a different situation... be afraid, very afraid. Some babies are very quiet, other not so much. One step at a time.
1. Survive until paternity.
2. Paternity will be exhausting but there will be downtime (baby sleeps during day) use this time to polish your resume and apply to jobs
3. Interview and change your job you shouldn't be somewhere you feel like you are going to be fired for a decade.
2. Paternity will be exhausting but there will be downtime (baby sleeps during day) use this time to polish your resume and apply to jobs
3. Interview and change your job you shouldn't be somewhere you feel like you are going to be fired for a decade.
Fortunately you've already got experience in a field where pay is relatively high. I switched jobs right when my first kid was born and it was fine but every situation is different, if you want to compare notes feel free to e-mail me.
Move to Europe where healthcare is free? One less thing to worry about/pay for.
No one is ever fully prepared for becoming a parent. Good luck - it is a rough ride (or at least it was for me). Use as much leave as you have available to you.
No one is ever fully prepared for becoming a parent. Good luck - it is a rough ride (or at least it was for me). Use as much leave as you have available to you.
I'd be willing to bet your resume looks better than you think, but maybe you can put that out there and get some advice. Do you have a safety fund that would let you walk away from a job for a little while?
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Smile. Go for it blindly. Share the good news. Be extra kind. Be your best self even if you find it unrealistic. Go ahead, the path will clear for you.
I got nothing to add, I just want to say congrats and everyone I've seen who's started a family and has needed help, finds it. Good luck!
Have you tried using the correct npm module for that?
Get some rest bro chill out, it's being a daddy anxiety it is normal for first time fathers.
Get some rest bro chill out, it's being a daddy anxiety it is normal for first time fathers.
Take whatever benefits you have and then quit.
It will be hard. Find some way to reward yourself or you'll go insane.
You'll be happy down the line.
It will be hard. Find some way to reward yourself or you'll go insane.
You'll be happy down the line.
Congratulations! I'm burnt out without any family or prospects of having one. I wish I had your problems.
> I can barely afford my health insurance
You might consider asking for a raise. Nicely, and with justification of course.
You might consider asking for a raise. Nicely, and with justification of course.
Congratulations! That is difficult but very exciting. I suggest praying for God's help.
Where do you live? US? If so, which coast?
The last thing you want to do is freak out and have a panic attack or worse.
> I've been here since 2012, and I've never felt like I wasn't just about to be fired.
Your job sounds like it sucks, are you being bullied? You sound like an engineer co-worker who was fired and then re-hired for the same position after they couldn't get someone to replace him at the same cost. So after he returned he felt that he could be fired at a moments notice when the opposite was true. And they knew that and kept the pressure on him. That was 4 years ago and he still works harder than anyone yet they still are up his ass. They know he is a quiet person who wont speak up and the manager is a hot headed gym rat who is an imposing bully so it doesn't stop.
I told them years back to fuck off and die and wound up getting a raise and as much time off as I want. Don't let those fucks bully you into feeling like you have to sacrifice yourself when they wont. They wont respect you until you fight back.
If they fire you then they didn't need you to begin with and have been fucking you since 2012. No loss, but you need the paycheck.
> When it was just "me" in the world, I could afford to be cavalier and take chances, but now I feel completely dependent on a group of people that demonstrably DNGASFF about me.
By group I assume you mean work or family? Speaking of family, do you have family near by? The modern thing to do is to split up all over and have kids with zero familial support network. Not saying it can't be done but my friends with kids and ample family support can easily do leisurely things when two sets of grandparents or a sibling can watch the kids for free without worry. Otherwise you have to pay some stranger to do it. If you are not on good terms with your family then it will be difficult.
If your family doesnt give a fuck then oh boy...
> I'm not a fast talker, my resume looks like shit, the only thing I know how to do is program, and we're about to have a baby.
You and a million others pal. Everyone goes through this shit and then some. Your skills pay bills so don't fret, you just need a change in scenery. The longer you sit in shit the harder it becomes to clean up.
> What do I do?
Don't panic. Its easy to freak out while running around waving your hands and screaming while do nothing. Its harder to sit down and buckle up. Time to fix up your resume; have friends/family/trustworthy coworkers review it and then start applying. Nothing will change if you do nothing and accept abuse.
This comment might mean nothing but I sympathize with the panic and workplace bullying.
> I've been here since 2012, and I've never felt like I wasn't just about to be fired.
Your job sounds like it sucks, are you being bullied? You sound like an engineer co-worker who was fired and then re-hired for the same position after they couldn't get someone to replace him at the same cost. So after he returned he felt that he could be fired at a moments notice when the opposite was true. And they knew that and kept the pressure on him. That was 4 years ago and he still works harder than anyone yet they still are up his ass. They know he is a quiet person who wont speak up and the manager is a hot headed gym rat who is an imposing bully so it doesn't stop.
I told them years back to fuck off and die and wound up getting a raise and as much time off as I want. Don't let those fucks bully you into feeling like you have to sacrifice yourself when they wont. They wont respect you until you fight back.
If they fire you then they didn't need you to begin with and have been fucking you since 2012. No loss, but you need the paycheck.
> When it was just "me" in the world, I could afford to be cavalier and take chances, but now I feel completely dependent on a group of people that demonstrably DNGASFF about me.
By group I assume you mean work or family? Speaking of family, do you have family near by? The modern thing to do is to split up all over and have kids with zero familial support network. Not saying it can't be done but my friends with kids and ample family support can easily do leisurely things when two sets of grandparents or a sibling can watch the kids for free without worry. Otherwise you have to pay some stranger to do it. If you are not on good terms with your family then it will be difficult.
If your family doesnt give a fuck then oh boy...
> I'm not a fast talker, my resume looks like shit, the only thing I know how to do is program, and we're about to have a baby.
You and a million others pal. Everyone goes through this shit and then some. Your skills pay bills so don't fret, you just need a change in scenery. The longer you sit in shit the harder it becomes to clean up.
> What do I do?
Don't panic. Its easy to freak out while running around waving your hands and screaming while do nothing. Its harder to sit down and buckle up. Time to fix up your resume; have friends/family/trustworthy coworkers review it and then start applying. Nothing will change if you do nothing and accept abuse.
This comment might mean nothing but I sympathize with the panic and workplace bullying.
It takes a village. Use your network.
Sleep every chance you get
Try to worry a little less. You obviously cannot and will not stop worrying (welcome to parenthood!). But remember that far less well equipped people than you have been figuring it all out for thousands of years. You will too.
Ask for paternity and flexible hours. Work less, and care less about work. If you lose your job, you will get another one. Ask family and friends for help if you really need it. Do not worry about the future. One step at a time, one bridge at a time. It will all work out.
Ask for paternity and flexible hours. Work less, and care less about work. If you lose your job, you will get another one. Ask family and friends for help if you really need it. Do not worry about the future. One step at a time, one bridge at a time. It will all work out.
It's OK, just pull your strap, man. A happy childhood will not buy itself. Having children ought to be hard, otherwise population of Earth would grow much faster.
While true in itself I find that it is mean to say this to someone who is going through a crisis. Having children is not easy but not super hard either if as a parent you have things in order. However, sometimes without doing anything wrong things go off track. I burned out in the past and while at it , it felt like a place of no return. I now look at it from a place of insight, I learnt to never go down that path again and avoid it at all costs. But I was not expecting a child during the crisis and am aware how this would've made the situation worse.
Things turned out slightly differently for me and could see the OP taking some useful cues from it. When I burned out I eventually quit my job(the sooner the better or an extended vacation with the possibility of returning just for safety). I then took a complete break from anything technology related, in all honesty I was forced to, my focus was all over the place. I walked a lot during those days and tried not to linger in static helplessness but do something minimal but with a purpose. I figured that I wanted to walked our friends dog, as stupid as it sounds it helped. My mind started clearing of negative thoughts after about a month and some hope started creeping in but was still not able to simply jump into another job, that required about 3-4 months. That's when I found out I was going to be a dad and though a bit stressed out some new determination kicked in. And some luck too, someone, an old manager I had moved to a new company and looked for me for a job. I explained I was going to be a dad and in addition to congratulations there was some promise of work-life balance. And it actually worked out, i'm still here now 5 years later.
The takeaway is that time is needed to recover and that this process can be extremely scary but could be eventually overcome by most of us. The reason I did burn out was because I did not have the intuition to quit that job earlier but at the time I did not know what that messy stressful job was about to do to me, now I know.
Things turned out slightly differently for me and could see the OP taking some useful cues from it. When I burned out I eventually quit my job(the sooner the better or an extended vacation with the possibility of returning just for safety). I then took a complete break from anything technology related, in all honesty I was forced to, my focus was all over the place. I walked a lot during those days and tried not to linger in static helplessness but do something minimal but with a purpose. I figured that I wanted to walked our friends dog, as stupid as it sounds it helped. My mind started clearing of negative thoughts after about a month and some hope started creeping in but was still not able to simply jump into another job, that required about 3-4 months. That's when I found out I was going to be a dad and though a bit stressed out some new determination kicked in. And some luck too, someone, an old manager I had moved to a new company and looked for me for a job. I explained I was going to be a dad and in addition to congratulations there was some promise of work-life balance. And it actually worked out, i'm still here now 5 years later.
The takeaway is that time is needed to recover and that this process can be extremely scary but could be eventually overcome by most of us. The reason I did burn out was because I did not have the intuition to quit that job earlier but at the time I did not know what that messy stressful job was about to do to me, now I know.
> Having children is not easy but not super hard either if as a parent you have things in order.
I wish it to be super hard and not cool tbh. If you want to get that kind of coolness then go 996 and stop complaining, please. Somebody might be disgusted about overpopulation of the Earth, btw.
I wish it to be super hard and not cool tbh. If you want to get that kind of coolness then go 996 and stop complaining, please. Somebody might be disgusted about overpopulation of the Earth, btw.
Great, meanwhile some of us want to have fun while tending to our responsibilities.
And this baby is going to be here, like, imminently. It's always been my dream to be a dad, and now I realize how laughably unprepared I am to be bringing somebody into this world. I can barely do my job, and now, it's so, so serious. I can't quit my job, I can't take time to look for another job, I can't _do_ my job.
When it was just "me" in the world, I could afford to be cavalier and take chances, but now I feel completely dependent on a group of people that demonstrably DNGASFF about me.
I'm not a fast talker, my resume looks like shit, the only thing I know how to do is program, and we're about to have a baby. What do I do?