A four-decade secret: One man’s story of sabotaging Carter’s re-election(nytimes.com)

78 pointsby dr_dshivvor 3 Jahren46 comments

A four-decade secret: One man’s story of sabotaging Carter’s re-election

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/18/us/politics/jimmy-carter-october-surprise-iran-hostages.html

50 comments

roughlyvor 3 Jahren

It’s staggering the degree to which this may have bent the course of the nation. To call Reagan a departure from his predecessor is an understatement second only to saying his influence on the course of politics and society in this country was substantial.

MandieDvor 3 Jahren

Ever since I spent enough time outside of the world I grew up in (semi-rural, very Evangelical Texas), I've been a bit sad at the loss of what we could have been had Carter managed to stay in office, and increasingly in the last few years as I think about how far we could have gotten with green energy if we'd stayed on the path we were on when he put those solar panels up on the White House.

Now I burn with rage when I think about what was taken from my own child while I was still a baby.

But of course the oil barons back home couldn't let us and the rest of the world get off the petroleum drug. Of course we couldn't have a center-left stream of Evangelical Christianity in the US - Carter, for those of you who are unaware, is a devout Christian who was teaching Sunday School at a Baptist church until around 2019 or so. The late 70s were also when the Fundamentalists started their fight with the Moderates (like Carter) in the Southern Baptist Convention.

Georgelementalvor 3 Jahren

Carter's ban on nuclear waste reprocessing and general de-emphasis of nuclear power did more to harm the cause of "green" energy than anything Reagan ever did.

oildynastybvor 3 Jahren

hunglee2vor 3 Jahren

US comes out with revelations of this type 40 years after the fact, by routine. Can't wait to see the confirmations in 2060, if we're all still around to muse over it

av3csrvor 3 Jahren

I watched the Ken Burns' Vietnam documentary a few weeks ago, this reminds me of the claims that the Nixon campaign pretty much did the same thing in '68 with the Republic of Vietnam and the peace talks (i.e. our guy will get you a better deal.)

LBJsPNSvor 3 Jahren

PicassoCTsvor 3 Jahren

The day the CIA had proof and evidence that the soviet union was in a slow downward spiral and "containable", that was the day the carot of middle class shared progress was packed away and it was back to the stick in the salt-mines of the gilded age again.

It may be hard to fathom, but the "golden" age of capitalism was in actual competition with a actual "socialism" aka a rivaling empire. The nice past we remember, was given to us at gunpoint and is now clawed back. Some societies take longer on this course, because they found the outcome pleasant and want to keep it. But the forces of the market, drag it towards a economic singular entity, which owns politics, with democracy on the label or not.

The figureheads were exchanged accordingly.

euroderfvor 3 Jahren

Yup, capitalism was much better behaved when it had some real competition. I guess China could maybe play the same role except that it is just too easy to pigeonhole China's experience as foreign and inapplicable to the West.

InTheArenavor 3 Jahren

“None of that establishes whether Mr. Reagan knew about the trip, nor could Mr. Barnes say that Mr. Casey directed Mr. Connally to take the journey. Likewise, he does not know if the message transmitted to multiple Middle Eastern leaders got to the Iranians, much less whether it influenced their decision making. But Iran did hold the hostages until after the election, which Mr. Reagan won, and did not release them until minutes after noon on Jan. 20, 1981, when Mr. Carter left office.”

We actually can read histories on this - from the Iranian side. After the failed invasion/raid the chance that the Iranians ever would have worked with carter is nil. Zero. Nada.

mbgerringvor 3 Jahren

What this and so many other sordid tales from America’s recent history should tell you is that however cynical and suspicious you might be about whatever is happening in American foreign policy, there’s always room for more.

Kukumbervor 3 Jahren

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jtothehvor 3 Jahren

So, Team Reagan left the hostages there longer, sold arms to an enemy and subverted the POTUS - why is there a statue of that !@# at Washington National Airport?????

kadobanvor 3 Jahren

Because Republicans are not at all interested in the failings of their leaders.

lockhousevor 3 Jahren

That’s not a quality that is unique to Republicans.

funstuff007vor 3 Jahren

I agree that it's a reasonable approximation to say the Republicans are the bad guys, but that in no way makes it true that the Democrats are the good guys. In fact, the more odious the R's behave the worse the D's can do say and still say, "well, at least we're not them.".

lockhousevor 3 Jahren

Life isn’t a Marvel comic book. There aren’t good guys and bad guys in Washington, DC, just corrupt self serving politicians on both sides of the aisle that say what they think their constituents want to hear while doing the bidding of their campaign donors.

atoavvor 3 Jahren

Sadly the politicians manage to distract anybody from wanting tougher campaign financing and lobbying laws.

I am not too deep into US politics, but if you wanna vote for tougher regulations on that there is one party that is not like the other based on the bills they proposed.

But hey, that won't stop the majority from waving their stupid party-political flags and go full "but the other side"-mode.

michaelmrosevor 3 Jahren

In the last 55 years they've had Nixon Reagan Bush Sr Bush Jr and Trump. Compare this to Carter Clinton Obama and Biden.

4 of the 5 on team red blatantly attempted to subvert Democracy. One legalized indefinite detention and torture and Another outright attempted to take the government after losing.

They might as well be comic book villains.

rendallvor 3 Jahren

There won't be any reasonable, principled government in the US while people voluntarily divide themselves into these two arbitrary tribes and shout about how they are better than the other side. People actually believing this is how the Duopoly is maintained. If you can take a hard look at your own side, a really hard look, you'll see rot there too. Better to see it, know it, be aware of it. Support those who oppose it irrespective of the arbitrary label they choose to call themselves.

atoavvor 3 Jahren

Karl Popper described democracy as a system that is not defined by giving you the chance of getting people you like into power, but by giving you the chance to remove those you disliked.

A duopoly that is this far apart in terms of ideology and goals is preventing that part. What needs to happen for a convinced Dem/Republican to vote for the opposing party to pu ish bad behaviour within their own party? This is much easier with more parties with more nuanced choices.

rendallvor 3 Jahren

> A duopoly that is this far apart in terms of ideology and goals

I don't know that I would be able to convince you otherwise. Just, if you think that GW's extraordinary renditions set a dangerous precedent but Obama's Disposition Matrix was an unfortunate necessity (or vice versa, as but two examples), you just may be distracted by tribal affiliation. As another example, if you were to get close to passing meaningful election reform that would enable effective multiple "third" parties, you would see the polarized duopoly close ranks in unified attacks on the idea - and on you, personally - pretty darn quick!

My advice to anyone who will listen is to really pay attention to the sins of your own side, really listen to your opposition without reflexively what-abouting. Eye opening. It doesn't mean the other side is better! It's just helpful to know. Also, shows a way forward, as slim as that may be.

atoavvor 3 Jahren

> My advice to anyone who will listen is to really pay attention to the sins of your own side

I am not from the US and do nopt plan to ever live there. With the distance of a European perspective I'd even phrase this more harshly: Don't pick a side. you don't have to. Judge political actors by their actions, that means by what they get done and by what they prevent from getting done. It is also okay to stand behind single political individuals if they do a compelling job and shine through their integrity and endurance.

Your job is to remove people from office if they fuck up. And that includes people on "insignificant" levels of politics, be it your town, city, province or whatnot.

What baffles me most about the US, is that you guys can elect somebody as a head of state who has millions less absolute votes than the other candidate and not completely loose your shit about that fact alone. Where I am from this would cause riots in the streets for weeks.

rendallvor 3 Jahren

You're referring to the Electoral College. I won't get into much detail about it, but it serves the purpose of ensuring that the rural vote is not swamped by the urban vote. Shockingly, those who are of the urban clans believe it should be abolished, but it has long tradition.

Personally, I think the Electoral College is not nearly as bad as the first-past-the-goalpost-winner- take-all electoral system for every single office from President to town council. Your best strategy will always be to put all of your resources behind one of the two front-runners in any election. Voting for anyone else makes it a certainty that your opposition wins. Fixing that somehow to be a more proportional representation system would at last break the duopoly and calm everyone down. People would finally feel like their values are represented in government, rather than compromising or settling.

FooBarBizBazzvor 3 Jahren

> Personally, I think the Electoral College is not nearly as bad as the first-past-the-goalpost-winner- take-all electoral system

Agreed. This even has a name, Duverger's Law:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duverger%27s_law

[deleted]vor 3 Jahren

dr_dshivvor 3 Jahren

Bring back ostracism? It was a key part of Athenian democracy…

rendallvor 3 Jahren

Make Athens Great Again!

lapcatvor 3 Jahren

> 4 of the 5 on team red blatantly attempted to subvert Democracy

Wait, which 1 do you think didn't?

michaelmrosevor 3 Jahren

It's possible I'm less aware of the exploits of Bush Sr due to being very young then and it not being as notable as Nixon or Reagan.

lapcatvor 3 Jahren

First of all, Bush was Director of the CIA before he was VP, which is bad enough by itself. (Operation Condor, etc.) Bush was also close to Bill Casey (mentioned in the article), who ran Reagan's campaign, recruited Bush for the ticket, and became Reagan's Director of the CIA. Bush and Casey were both knee deep in Iran-Contra, a massive subversion of democracy and constitutional crisis in which the Reagan administration disobeyed an act of Congress. When Bush left office, he pardoned a bunch of Iran-Contra conspirators, thus covering his own ass too.

20after4vor 3 Jahren

Failings? Seems he was rather successful. I mean, he got away with it.

P_I_Stakervor 3 Jahren

I think this illustrates the problem. You can't seem to recognize that failures of character are concrete failings.

20after4vor 3 Jahren

My apologies, I was being facetious. Of course he had failings but our society rewards rather than punishing them.

P_I_Stakervor 3 Jahren

Plus let people die of AIDS, because he thought it was gay. Then straight people started dying and it was a problem.

Gay lives don't matter to Republicans.

kroldenvor 3 Jahren

Dont forget flooding america with cocaine to pay for those weapons.

MandieDvor 3 Jahren

Heck, the airport was even renamed for him, as a special slap in the face to the air-traffic controllers.

jtothehvor 3 Jahren

I live there, I still try and refer to it as National Airport.

dickeyratvor 3 Jahren

Keep in mind, the proceeds from the weapons sales to Iran were used to finance Nicaragua's Contras, in the Amerikan attempt to create a right-wing puppet state in Central America.

mcdonjevor 3 Jahren

Paywall. Summary?

rayladvor 3 Jahren

Ben Barnes, a former Texas political figure, has revealed that his political mentor, John B. Connally Jr., who served three US presidents, went on a mission to the Middle East in 1980 to sabotage President Jimmy Carter's re-election campaign. Connally, who had just lost his own bid for the White House and wanted to become Secretary of State or Defense in a new administration, was determined to help Ronald Reagan beat Carter. He met with regional leaders and delivered a blunt message to be passed to Iran: Don't release the hostages before the election, and Reagan will win and give you a better deal. Shortly after returning home, Connally reported to William J. Casey, chairman of Reagan's campaign, and later the director of the CIA, briefing him about the trip in an airport lounge.

Barnes, who accompanied Connally on the trip, identified four people he had confided in over the years, including the president of the L.B.J. Foundation, a former aide to Lyndon Johnson, a former aide to Connally and Johnson, and a University of Texas historian. All four confirmed that Barnes shared the story with them years ago. Records at the Lyndon Baines Johnson Library and Museum confirmed part of Barnes's story. An itinerary found last week in Connally's files showed that Connally left Houston on July 18, 1980, for a trip that would take him to Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Israel before returning to Houston on Aug. 11. Barnes was listed as accompanying him.

The October surprise theory has been long debated, with Carter's camp long suspecting that someone in Reagan's orbit sought to secretly torpedo efforts to liberate the hostages before the election. Congressional investigations have debunked previous theories of what happened, but Connally did not figure in those investigations. With Carter now 98 and in hospice care, Barnes said he felt compelled to come forward to correct the record. Confirming Barnes's account is problematic after so much time, as Connally, Casey, and other central figures have long since died, and Barnes has no diaries or memos to corroborate his account.

mcdonjevor 3 Jahren

Thank you!

mud_daubervor 3 Jahren

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dickeyratvor 3 Jahren

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