Google Is on the Wrong Side of History(eff.org)
eff.org
Google Is on the Wrong Side of History
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2025/02/google-wrong-side-history
48 comments
Naive people think that people are fundamentally good. We need military, weapons and surveillance to keep people safe.
Typically the naive people are just sheltered and/or young.
Typically the naive people are just sheltered and/or young.
No, it's typically old people that are pro military
Just where do all those young soldiers, sailors and pilots come from I wonder?
Poverty.
You're saying the same thing?
People are fundamentally good.
It's just a few assholes that keep us from having nice things.
It's just a few assholes that keep us from having nice things.
The people are not good, as soon as the shaping circumstances get ugly. If the world decides to run you out of life, because you are poor while the chunk of world society eats every day shrinks (aka resource window aka surplus bribe) very few will accept this.
And as we have spent millenia in this situation,this cycle of strife , our gut instincts have developed to optimize society towards it.
No science, No music, says gut. Just many offspring . No peace upon neighbours says gut, if war dont be civil. No mercy says gut, Gut willz it! And it must be divine, for its still inside and nore than instinctive gametheory with a wig. Imagine, you had a waking moment , stumbling back from the battlefield towards the vally of plenty. About being stuck in eldritch horrors, about how you could make, that good moment last forever if rocks were bread. How you could excise the horror from the history books. How some of home stumblers seem to miss their part of the horror already, adapted in mind towards their part of the loop. Never again says gut, the forever again, a exponential fly, bumping against the glass roof.All is gut with the world!
Idealizations of reality prevents the handling of reality, thus feeds the beast, thus is a retardation .
And as we have spent millenia in this situation,this cycle of strife , our gut instincts have developed to optimize society towards it.
No science, No music, says gut. Just many offspring . No peace upon neighbours says gut, if war dont be civil. No mercy says gut, Gut willz it! And it must be divine, for its still inside and nore than instinctive gametheory with a wig. Imagine, you had a waking moment , stumbling back from the battlefield towards the vally of plenty. About being stuck in eldritch horrors, about how you could make, that good moment last forever if rocks were bread. How you could excise the horror from the history books. How some of home stumblers seem to miss their part of the horror already, adapted in mind towards their part of the loop. Never again says gut, the forever again, a exponential fly, bumping against the glass roof.All is gut with the world!
Idealizations of reality prevents the handling of reality, thus feeds the beast, thus is a retardation .
The two worldviews can be reconciled: people are generally good but a relatively few bad people turn the world in a dangerous place that requires counterbalancing in order to bring the stability needed for the majority of good people to thrive
I wholeheartedly disagree. The VAST majority of people are extremely greedy and will kill if necessary (when things get hard). It's only when things are good that people think people are fundamentally good. Trust me, if the power went out (permanently), it won't be many days before your wife says, ok, you can kill the neighbors and take their food storage. It might be 3 weeks - but in the end you will trust people so little that it will be extremely challenging to decide to come together as a community and grow food - which is the only way that it would work.
If only we got rid of <group>, we'd have a utopia because they wouldn't be around to ruin it.
We could do this by putting them on the B ark.
We could do this by putting them on the B ark.
People are fundamentally good.
No.
A person is fundamentally good.
People are responsible for most of the bad things that happen in human society. Including war.
No.
A person is fundamentally good.
People are responsible for most of the bad things that happen in human society. Including war.
"Person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals" - Agent K, Men In Black
Long term, everything that happens in civilization happens with the consent of the people.
You'd be surprised how insanely bad things people are willing to do, as long as you package those bad things as "for good".
It's usually a few assholes that know how to change the definition of what's that "good" and get away with what they want.
It's usually a few assholes that know how to change the definition of what's that "good" and get away with what they want.
That reminds me of this quote, modified:
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night because rough robots stand ready to do violence on their behalf.”
It’s got a bit different of a vibe from “Don’t be evil.”
“People sleep peaceably in their beds at night because rough robots stand ready to do violence on their behalf.”
It’s got a bit different of a vibe from “Don’t be evil.”
Naive people think surveillance is there to keep them safe. Naive people think the ones using these new AI weapons will be the good guys, for good purposes.
Governments and states fall apart all the time . The chilling effect of the panopticon has been found to keep things more "pleasant" even in their absence. Google lynching statistics in africa and then hold the spread of smartphones besides that . Turns out vigilanteism is not so fun, if its recorded for all eternity .
> Naive people think that people are fundamentally good. We need military, weapons and surveillance to keep people safe.
These two are not mutually exclusive.
Being fundamentally good as a species doesn't mean that we would never do anything bad, or that psychopaths don't exist.
These two are not mutually exclusive.
Being fundamentally good as a species doesn't mean that we would never do anything bad, or that psychopaths don't exist.
Naive people think that things are the way they are because they need to be. We need education and to disincentivize evil to keep people safe.
Typically the naive people are just pseudo-intellectuals and/or young.
Typically the naive people are just pseudo-intellectuals and/or young.
The fate of any sufficiently large American company is to become an instrument of American foriegn and domestic policy. More specifically, any big tech company at this point is a defense contractor, no different to Boeing, Lockheed Martin, Raytheon or Northron Grumman.
At one point the British Empire controlled a quarter of the globe. The source of Britain's power was that it was a drug dealer empire, first tobacco, later opium.
American empire is arguably larger and more influential than the British Empire but instead of direct colonial control, the influence is economic through puppet regimes. The US is an arms dealer empire. WWI, WW2 and beyond greatly enriched the US.
You want to see what an arms dealer empire does with AI? Look no further than Lavender [1]. You may think you're removed from this, probably being in the imperial core. Unfortunately, the imperial boomerang [2] should make you question that assumption.
[1]: https://www.972mag.com/lavender-ai-israeli-army-gaza/
[2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_boomerang
At one point the British Empire controlled a quarter of the globe. The source of Britain's power was that it was a drug dealer empire, first tobacco, later opium.
American empire is arguably larger and more influential than the British Empire but instead of direct colonial control, the influence is economic through puppet regimes. The US is an arms dealer empire. WWI, WW2 and beyond greatly enriched the US.
You want to see what an arms dealer empire does with AI? Look no further than Lavender [1]. You may think you're removed from this, probably being in the imperial core. Unfortunately, the imperial boomerang [2] should make you question that assumption.
[1]: https://www.972mag.com/lavender-ai-israeli-army-gaza/
[2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imperial_boomerang
A single entity that has the world mapped down to the street, that knows your search history, that has a device in your pocket and that owns a number of robotics interests is not one to be trifled with.
Despite this, and despite how USA is fumbbling right now internationally, Google is still on our side against actually harmful elementa of humanity.
For example: https://cloud.google.com/blog/topics/threat-intelligence/rus...
For example: https://cloud.google.com/blog/topics/threat-intelligence/rus...
I think it's a serious stretch to say Google is on "our side". They support some efforts that benefit us, and they also support some efforts that harm us.
Counter point: https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-ai-weapons-43...
Imagine the US military being ordered to, let’s say, kill some group X. Think Google is gonna deny them access to their tech?
Imagine the US military being ordered to, let’s say, kill some group X. Think Google is gonna deny them access to their tech?
When there's a global war brewing, we'll need future historians to tell us which side is being more correct today.
I was always queasy about mega corps saying "look at us, we are so good, we have outreach/pronouns/ESG", for reasons I couldn't quite put my finger on. I much preferred that companies comply with regulation, without necessarily doing extra, and instead for the regulation to reflect values that the society needs from them.
Well, voila. The wind changed a month ago and this entire system of voluntary goodness seems gone with the wind.
But then again, I suppose, we've also been shown that regulation can be changed on a whim, at least in the current climate. Perhaps my preferred way would work with less extreme illiberals, but not this.
Well, voila. The wind changed a month ago and this entire system of voluntary goodness seems gone with the wind.
But then again, I suppose, we've also been shown that regulation can be changed on a whim, at least in the current climate. Perhaps my preferred way would work with less extreme illiberals, but not this.
busterarm(4)
Google drops pledge not to use AI for weapons or surveillance
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42938125