Ask HN: Need a career advice
12 comments
I'm a software engineer who has spent most of my career working for medical device companies. My advice may not be a good short-term fix and it's just one of many paths, but it's based on my experience.
Be a doctor. A good one. The more specialization, the better. Gravitate towards a specialization where technology either plays or will play a big role (surgery, radiology, etc.). Get experience with these technologies (new or old), such that you know what works and what needs improving/replacement. If you can, write cases and do research that influences your field. Work at a hospital with a strong bio-tech research element and find ways to collaborate (hint: collaborating clinicians are always in demand). Through collaboration, you'll inevitably be exposed to spin-off and startup opportunities. You'll work with all sorts of programmers and engineers, who will drop everything to spend time with you when you have a free moment.
Once you've got some good experience under your belt and perhaps have built a small name for yourself, congrats, you are now a relatively hot commodity for a multitude of medical device companies. We often use the term KOL (key opinion leader) for certain clinicians - they command big bucks and get huge influence on product development. If you network well, you'll get early access to new technologies, perhaps the ability to work with the engineers during the design phase, your opinions will be treated as gold when it comes to product development.
This all hinges on you actually practicing medicine in a fairly active fashion for at least a few years if not a decade. I know that's a big commitment, but you should know that it comes with a lot of non-monetary rewards. It opens doors.
Even as a relatively unknown MD, a few years of active practice are invaluable in your back-pocket. If you ever decide to do a medical-based startup, investors will surely value your credentials.
To be perfectly honest, I'm an engineer, I love software and technology, but if were to do it all over again, I'd go to med-school first!
Be a doctor. A good one. The more specialization, the better. Gravitate towards a specialization where technology either plays or will play a big role (surgery, radiology, etc.). Get experience with these technologies (new or old), such that you know what works and what needs improving/replacement. If you can, write cases and do research that influences your field. Work at a hospital with a strong bio-tech research element and find ways to collaborate (hint: collaborating clinicians are always in demand). Through collaboration, you'll inevitably be exposed to spin-off and startup opportunities. You'll work with all sorts of programmers and engineers, who will drop everything to spend time with you when you have a free moment.
Once you've got some good experience under your belt and perhaps have built a small name for yourself, congrats, you are now a relatively hot commodity for a multitude of medical device companies. We often use the term KOL (key opinion leader) for certain clinicians - they command big bucks and get huge influence on product development. If you network well, you'll get early access to new technologies, perhaps the ability to work with the engineers during the design phase, your opinions will be treated as gold when it comes to product development.
This all hinges on you actually practicing medicine in a fairly active fashion for at least a few years if not a decade. I know that's a big commitment, but you should know that it comes with a lot of non-monetary rewards. It opens doors.
Even as a relatively unknown MD, a few years of active practice are invaluable in your back-pocket. If you ever decide to do a medical-based startup, investors will surely value your credentials.
To be perfectly honest, I'm an engineer, I love software and technology, but if were to do it all over again, I'd go to med-school first!
That's the hardest part, the stress and the depression of the job will surely drive me nuts in couple more years, that's the main reason I want a change as the stress, night shifts, working with patients listening to their problems all day all night is depressing and frustrating.
Thanks I've never thought of that path of working at a medical device company. Good that you mentioned it :)
Thanks I've never thought of that path of working at a medical device company. Good that you mentioned it :)
If you are comparing salary of a physician to a tech related field it is going to be hard to find something on pair with out a lot of schooling.
Yes, indeed, and because of this, I'd suggest you not rule out bioinformatics before talking to someone who does it.
I'm a bioinformatician, I love it, and having both an M.D. and skill in programming would be a huge competitive advantage. Take a look at the work of Atul Butte, who is a M.D. that has got into bioinformatics at Stanford, and is very successful.
It is true that until you reach high levels of the research hierarchy, (where salaries can be $250K+), the pay is not good. However, if you get into bioinformatics for industry, or do clinically-oriented startups using bioinformatics methods, you can do quite well. It is a career that combines the ability to use computer science to solve real-world biomedical problems with an environment of high intellectual freedom. To me, those things are worth the opportunity cost in pay. Also, I would not pay that much attention to "average" salaries as you can do better if you are exceptionally skilled, and your M.D. probably would also command some kind of premium.
But I can easily see how I might think differently if I had a lot of student debt from pursuing an M.D.
I'm a bioinformatician, I love it, and having both an M.D. and skill in programming would be a huge competitive advantage. Take a look at the work of Atul Butte, who is a M.D. that has got into bioinformatics at Stanford, and is very successful.
It is true that until you reach high levels of the research hierarchy, (where salaries can be $250K+), the pay is not good. However, if you get into bioinformatics for industry, or do clinically-oriented startups using bioinformatics methods, you can do quite well. It is a career that combines the ability to use computer science to solve real-world biomedical problems with an environment of high intellectual freedom. To me, those things are worth the opportunity cost in pay. Also, I would not pay that much attention to "average" salaries as you can do better if you are exceptionally skilled, and your M.D. probably would also command some kind of premium.
But I can easily see how I might think differently if I had a lot of student debt from pursuing an M.D.
I have two people in my close circle who made jump between medical profession and information technology and vice-versa.
[1] My cousin became a medical doctor and practiced for a year. He just couldn't disconnect himself from his patients sickness and that was causing him depression. Long term, he just couldn't see himself around sick people without becoming mental nut-case himself. He was very interested in Technology but couldn't see himself starting from entry level. He decided to go for MBA at a top 5 school. It seems not many medical doctors apply for MBA so it was easy for him to get admission. After MBA, he initially worked in healthcare technology consulting. He found his medical degree, Dr before his name and MD and MBA after his name very valuable since then in his career. Today, he leads healthcare technology practice for a major technology service provider and responsible for over billion dollar in revenue and P&L for his division.
[2] My eye doctor has graduate Electrical Engineering degree and worked for about ten years in development with SoCal defense contractors and NorCal technology companies before quitting to go to medical school. He is now a successful Eye Surgeon. While working in technology, he didn't like the politics of the workplace and overall work environment and expectations of technology companies. He has been very happy since becoming Eye Doctor and enjoys working with his patients. He still gets his technology fix by getting involved in medical technology innovations. He says his EE + Medicine qualifications makes him quite a desirable person in medical device industry.
It might take you a decade in technology to even get to the level of starting salaries of medical doctors. If you have high medical school debt, you may want to consider this in your decision to switch career.
You may benefit from your medicine background in a "relevant" technology company if you slide into the company at mid-level where you medical background is valued. Entry-level developer or IT person may not offer you any extra credit for being a medical doctor. Also in a non-medical technology company, you may be at a disadvantage compared to a person with CS degree with promotions and being taken seriously.
Unless you are interested in going to Business School, personally I will not recommend switching field from medicine to technology. You can always continue as medical physician while being involved with technology on the side.
[1] My cousin became a medical doctor and practiced for a year. He just couldn't disconnect himself from his patients sickness and that was causing him depression. Long term, he just couldn't see himself around sick people without becoming mental nut-case himself. He was very interested in Technology but couldn't see himself starting from entry level. He decided to go for MBA at a top 5 school. It seems not many medical doctors apply for MBA so it was easy for him to get admission. After MBA, he initially worked in healthcare technology consulting. He found his medical degree, Dr before his name and MD and MBA after his name very valuable since then in his career. Today, he leads healthcare technology practice for a major technology service provider and responsible for over billion dollar in revenue and P&L for his division.
[2] My eye doctor has graduate Electrical Engineering degree and worked for about ten years in development with SoCal defense contractors and NorCal technology companies before quitting to go to medical school. He is now a successful Eye Surgeon. While working in technology, he didn't like the politics of the workplace and overall work environment and expectations of technology companies. He has been very happy since becoming Eye Doctor and enjoys working with his patients. He still gets his technology fix by getting involved in medical technology innovations. He says his EE + Medicine qualifications makes him quite a desirable person in medical device industry.
It might take you a decade in technology to even get to the level of starting salaries of medical doctors. If you have high medical school debt, you may want to consider this in your decision to switch career.
You may benefit from your medicine background in a "relevant" technology company if you slide into the company at mid-level where you medical background is valued. Entry-level developer or IT person may not offer you any extra credit for being a medical doctor. Also in a non-medical technology company, you may be at a disadvantage compared to a person with CS degree with promotions and being taken seriously.
Unless you are interested in going to Business School, personally I will not recommend switching field from medicine to technology. You can always continue as medical physician while being involved with technology on the side.
Thanks, I think I'm more like your cousin. I just can't take the stress of working at a hospital and with patients, heavy night sifts sleep deprivation just drives me nuts.
Well since I get the education at medical school for free I don't have any debt to pay. I think I've made the wrong decision in entering medical school in the first place, here getting in to a med school for free is like a once in a life time opportunity at they young age I couldn't resist it but now older I feel I made the wrong decision.
None of my friends who are outside of med school believes in the stress and depression as they only see the high salaries and good life doctors are living but doesn't see the stress until you enter the field,
Well since I get the education at medical school for free I don't have any debt to pay. I think I've made the wrong decision in entering medical school in the first place, here getting in to a med school for free is like a once in a life time opportunity at they young age I couldn't resist it but now older I feel I made the wrong decision.
None of my friends who are outside of med school believes in the stress and depression as they only see the high salaries and good life doctors are living but doesn't see the stress until you enter the field,
"None of my friends who are outside of med school believes in the stress and depression as they only see the high salaries and good life doctors are living but doesn't see the stress until you enter the field,"
Grass is always greener on the other side. I will encourage you to explore more your options between medicine and IT and make sure you are not afflicted with same syndrome as your friends.
Medical profession has a good reputation and doctors are held in high regards in non-medical professions. I will suggest leveraging this reputation and respect to get yourself into a good position in non-medical profession if you don't want to practice as a medical doctor. Don't squander it away by becoming an entry level drone in technology industry.
Another alternative may be to consider medical profession as means to achieving the end you want. Tough it out for a few years, achieve financial independence as quickly as possible and then do what you want to do in technology whether medical related or not.
Have you heard of White Coat Investor http://whitecoatinvestor.com? He is an ER doctor who started blogging about personal finance from doctor's viewpoint. He seems to have become quite popular in finance area with books and speaking engagements specially targeted at medical professionals. It seems he is drawing almost $200K from his finance-related side activities on top of whatever his ER compensation is. You could follow on his footsteps. Suck up and be a medical doctor for a few years, keep technology as side activity until your side activities become as big as being medical doctor then do whatever you like.
Grass is always greener on the other side. I will encourage you to explore more your options between medicine and IT and make sure you are not afflicted with same syndrome as your friends.
Medical profession has a good reputation and doctors are held in high regards in non-medical professions. I will suggest leveraging this reputation and respect to get yourself into a good position in non-medical profession if you don't want to practice as a medical doctor. Don't squander it away by becoming an entry level drone in technology industry.
Another alternative may be to consider medical profession as means to achieving the end you want. Tough it out for a few years, achieve financial independence as quickly as possible and then do what you want to do in technology whether medical related or not.
Have you heard of White Coat Investor http://whitecoatinvestor.com? He is an ER doctor who started blogging about personal finance from doctor's viewpoint. He seems to have become quite popular in finance area with books and speaking engagements specially targeted at medical professionals. It seems he is drawing almost $200K from his finance-related side activities on top of whatever his ER compensation is. You could follow on his footsteps. Suck up and be a medical doctor for a few years, keep technology as side activity until your side activities become as big as being medical doctor then do whatever you like.
Thanks, no i'm not giving up on my current degree, as I'm going to graduate by the end of this year I'll be a doctor anyhow, it's after getting the degree I'm thinking of following an alternative field with the use of my medical degree.
I was reading this article on the Atlantic, that talks about following MBA together with the MD degree http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/09/the-ris...
Although I love computers and technology it doesn't mean I want to work in a software company, what I need is an alternative field so I can have a good family life and I don't have to work in a depressing environment and committing suicide few years later.
Thanks for the suggestions they are really helpful
I was reading this article on the Atlantic, that talks about following MBA together with the MD degree http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/09/the-ris...
Although I love computers and technology it doesn't mean I want to work in a software company, what I need is an alternative field so I can have a good family life and I don't have to work in a depressing environment and committing suicide few years later.
Thanks for the suggestions they are really helpful
Reach out to some of the participants at Medicine X, they may have some helpful perspective > http://medicinex.stanford.edu/2014-schedule/
Why limit to something that relates to the medical field? Just focus on programming as a career.
Well I was not sure whether if I can get into a company without any degree in computer field, there are times I wonder if it would have been better me doing CS than medicine from the beginning
Focusing on making it medical related won't increase your chances by much if at all, only to narrow your opportunities. If you can code, it shouldn't matter. Speaking from experience and from people I know personally, your lack of a degree isn't the main deterrent from getting a job programming in most cases
I'm passing out from medical school at the end of this year. However I'm not interested in working the rest of my life in a hospital as a regular doctor. I love programming and computers since childhood and even while at medical school I learn new stuff and make mobile and web apps and stuff for learning and for fun. Also I learn different languages and frameworks whenever I have free time. And also does freelance stuff for my friends doing IT and CS at college. And I have basic knowledge in CS. Although I don't have any degree in computer science I can try to get one in the future.
Is there a way for me to work in the computer industry with the experience I got from medical school and using the computer knowledge I have?
I checked bio-informatics field and from the things I found on the internet the salary in bio-informatics profession is half in that of a physician in US.
Are there any other fields other than bio-informatics where I can follow an alternative career other than becoming a doctor and also because I'd love to work in the computer field.
Thanks