> Their government are an evil, theocratic, messianic cult who care nothing about their people but do care about promoting barbarism internally and terrorism externally to further their dispicable agenda. There are few more evil governments on the planet right now.
>You are not supporting a thing, you are supporting keeping that thing from someone else.
Here lies the crux of the debate. You think straight people are keeping something away from gays. But I think its gays trying to take something from straight people.
Let's say I lived in a country that banned marriage entirely. I would still get married and it would be enough for me and my family to recognize that we are married. Gays can do the same thing - they're not restricted at all in what they can do these days. But they want something more - they want everyone to be forced to recognize their marriage. They get infuriated when straight people don't want to recognize them. So they are taking something - our freedom to interpret our own reality. This is a kind of rabbit hole type revelation that spans many other issues and underpins my fundamental opposition to statism/slavery.
It's changing the definition of the word, so yes there is something to stand for. If you don't believe marriage needs defending, look at the rates of marriage. Now the meaning of marriage has been diluted so much, no one wants to get married anymore - there's no point except to possibly get benefits from the state.
I could have just as easily said people who use the term "homophobic" automatically lose the argument, as there's no fear involved. This is a battle of semantics - and if we want a quality debate then we need to keep definitions consistent.
You arguments are good but not airtight. I'll pick out the ones I disagree with.
> To be clear, there are difference in say how gay couples reproduce
Straight couples can reproduce with their spouse - gays cannot. That's not just a difference, but a complete opposite.
>Let's be honest - opposition to gay marriage is based on religion, ignorance, or personal aesthetics.
I agree that most people oppose gay marriage because of religion, but religion may have underlying logical reasoning for it. I don't think ignorance/personal aesthetics is a reason, because if someone is intuitively disgusted by two males sodomizing, there may be a biological reason for it. Ignorance is better than false beliefs.
The reason I'm against gay marriage is that I don't want the definition to change, and I don't want my children having gay propaganda pushed on them. That's it. These are good reasons in my opinion.
>I've never seen a resume where the candidate listed anti-gay or anti-gay marriage advocacy groups.
This very fact should concern people. You rarely see people advertising their support for traditional marriage (especially in california/new york. There is a common misconception that supporting gay marriage is somehow a proud rebellious cause against the status quo. But the reality couldn't be further from the truth - virtually the entire media and up to the president support gay marriage. Organizations supporting traditional marriage will immediately be called "intolerant, bigoted, hate groups" and shouted out of the debate. There is something seriously wrong with that.
So no, I would not put any political organizations on my resume for a software engineering job. I rarely discuss politics/religion at work. I hope you wouldn't hire such people who jump on the bandwagon issue de jour.
That is not at all what I said. He suggested that he supports me going away and dying out, and I think shouting out your opposition is intolerant.
>Irrelevant. If your grounds for opposing marriage equality are on purely biological grounds, you must also oppose all forms of birth control and support compulsory reproduction for married couples.
I agree it's not relevant. I was responding to an equally irrelevant comment.
>I'm justice noticing that you're not even bothering to respond to the messages that completely disprove your points
I'm responding very frequently.
>"traditional marriage" is a nebulous term
Somewhat. But I have a webster's dictionary from the 60's and the definition of marriage quite clearly reads between a man and woman. Marriage having that meaning dates back centuries (millenia even?), back to its original conception. So it's pretty obvious that the "traditional" meaning is the original and longest standing one.
I agree completely. But this is a tactic mainly used by the other side of the debate. Homosexual groups often fly under the banner of tolerance (literally, their flag is an inclusive rainbow of colors).
A straight person has the same rights as a homosexual person. They can both get married. That's equal protection under the law. What you want to do is change the definition of marriage, which I think is like missing a soccer goal but arguing to move the goal posts to make you win. Make a new word for gay marriage if you want - but leave the definition of marriage alone as changing it would break a lot of legacy code.
Much of the value of Tumblr was its huge stash of amateur porn (and Yahoo overpaid for even that). And the first thing they do is gut it? Oh wow, Marissa could not have failed harder on this decision.
How do you know I'm not right? Do you provide any evidence? Also what is your obsession with calling me a bigot, when I'm open to dialogue. You are the one who is glad that I'm a "dying breed", so I would say you're the bigot. Also, if you want to talk about literally being a dying breed, I would think homosexuals who do not have children fit that definition better. Also, I'm 19 years old. Much how there was a reactionary swing to the left in the 1960/70's, there could very well be a reactionary swing back to the right that is emerging. (I'm using the archaic "left/right" metaphors just for sake of argument)
I didn't use my appeal to the majority as a support to my argument. My argument was simply not to conflate the issues. If I would have said "The majority of people are opposed to gay marriage, therefore it should be banned", then that would have been a fallacy.
I'm a bigot? Please, look up the definition of bigot and then look in the mirror. I even explicitly said I was tolerant of gays. You are the one intolerant of others' opinions.
These are the kinds of attacks that people who stand for traditional marriage have to face. A bigoted army of people who can't muster a better argument than vulgar name calling. The irony is that they claim to stand against intolerance...
The main reason is that people don't understand science, but they will still appeal to it as if it were the law of the universe. It's an appeal to authority: Much like people used to say "X is true because God said it", it is now "X is true because Science proved it". Science is a continual work in progress towards an objective understanding of the universe. But it's so easy to see a news story saying: "A new study shows that global warming will melt the ice caps before 2012! More at 11". People have been lied to before and don't trust these studies, because they may have faulty conclusions. We need to look at the data and make our own conclusions, because we may all have different perspectives on what caused a result.
This is a discussion on Iran, not Israel.