Mort de la mise à jour du statut : pourquoi 55 % des Américains ont arrêté de publier sur les réseaux sociaux(ca.pcmag.com)
ca.pcmag.com
Death of the Status Update: Why 55% of Americans Stopped Posting on Social Media
https://ca.pcmag.com/social-media/16790/the-death-of-the-status-update-why-55-of-americans-stopped-posting-on-social-media
164 comments
The terminology explains what happened.
The Zuckerberg movie was called The Social Network. At the time we saw the likes of Facebook as networks intended to build 1-1 communications.
Since then, it’s become social Media. It’s now about centralized structures broadcasting messages to subscribers and followers. The only difference from the past is who the broadcasters can be, but it’s no longer about building networks between people.
The Zuckerberg movie was called The Social Network. At the time we saw the likes of Facebook as networks intended to build 1-1 communications.
Since then, it’s become social Media. It’s now about centralized structures broadcasting messages to subscribers and followers. The only difference from the past is who the broadcasters can be, but it’s no longer about building networks between people.
Maybe bloggers are professionals and make better content than random people?
The blogosphere was all about random people writing whatever they felt like: blogging died after the professionals took over and tried to make money at it.
It died when google made it impossible to find those blogs. At some point, it stopped returning blogs that did not SEO hard and normal writing people just were not doing SEO.
I would say they create more addictive content than people with lives away from social media.
But that doesnt help with building 1:1 connections.
But that doesnt help with building 1:1 connections.
Yeah, that’s absolutely true. And thats exactly my point.
Social media is about “generating content”. Social networks were about connecting with people, not about consuming the content they generated.
Heck, the original version of Facebook didn’t even have content. The only interaction you could have with someone else was giving them a “poke”.
Social media is about “generating content”. Social networks were about connecting with people, not about consuming the content they generated.
Heck, the original version of Facebook didn’t even have content. The only interaction you could have with someone else was giving them a “poke”.
More so that they are more prolific.
And they often don't mind ads attached to their every post. Especially if they earn a little bit from each.
There is nothing wrong with the bulletin board at the student center
It works
It's kinda sad that members of a club have to share their private details with some remote third party focused on surveillance, data collection and targeting ads in order communicate with other members or potential members. Not to mention the possibility of "age verification"
When used for public notice, the benefits, if any, of "social media" over the bulletin board at the student center are probably not worth the hassles
It works
It's kinda sad that members of a club have to share their private details with some remote third party focused on surveillance, data collection and targeting ads in order communicate with other members or potential members. Not to mention the possibility of "age verification"
When used for public notice, the benefits, if any, of "social media" over the bulletin board at the student center are probably not worth the hassles
I love bulletin boards. We had one in the apartment I used to live in. There is something about getting help/helping out super local people.
South African here. Just about all notifications have moved to WhatsApp. Most school classes have a group for the parents, extended family group, immediate family group, residents association group, high school classmates group, gym class group, home town group ... the list goes on. Sounds like a lot but most groups tend to have few messages.
Canadian here.
I have a WhatsApp account and the app on my phone with zero contacts in it. Nobody here uses it. But every time I leave the country I need it for some service or business or who knows what. It seems like the rest of the world all agreed to use this app and Canada (and I think the US) just said “naw thanks…” and have no common app or method.
I have a WhatsApp account and the app on my phone with zero contacts in it. Nobody here uses it. But every time I leave the country I need it for some service or business or who knows what. It seems like the rest of the world all agreed to use this app and Canada (and I think the US) just said “naw thanks…” and have no common app or method.
N=1 but I'm Canadian (BC) and everyone I know uses WhatsApp exclusively.
I always hated how everything moved off independent forums and onto facebook. Zuckerberg was right about with his early idiots comment.
The other big problem is, group notifications went from 100% success rate, to nearly 0%. I bought a budget model sainsmart/genmitsu cnc thing to goof around with, as a hobby/assist other hobbies, and 98% of their user community is on Facebook, but Facebook doesn't show me their posts most of the time, because sainsmart isn't paying to promote their group. This group would be a wealth of information every time I opened the fb app, but unless I explicitly remember to go visit their "community" by searching for it, I'll never see those posts. There's an enormous Cyclekart (vintage-ish go karts with proportionally correct wheels) community on fb as well but unless that's the ONLY thing you use their app for, they won't show you that stuff.
TL;DR FB is worthless for social networks, because if they showed you the groups you were there to check on, nobody would pay to promote their own things.
Once an avid user, I go 1-2 weeks at a time with the app uninstalled now unless there's something specific I need to check on.
TL;DR FB is worthless for social networks, because if they showed you the groups you were there to check on, nobody would pay to promote their own things.
Once an avid user, I go 1-2 weeks at a time with the app uninstalled now unless there's something specific I need to check on.
I have Facebook and follow about a dozen of journalist accounts. Almost daily I'm asked "should we show you more of this" for their posts - darnit that's THE reason I'm here, why asking me continuously??? And what's the alternative, bimbos doing little content creator dances?
I think we’re seeing a similar thing pan out with AI. When the barrier for something is too low, people realize that it’s not actually worth the other party’s effort to communicate it to them.
For me, physical communication is quickly becoming a signal that someone actually put effort into things.
For me, physical communication is quickly becoming a signal that someone actually put effort into things.
Today it's discord, we just don't call it social media because it's private by default with no intent to force you into a networking & self-disclosure hell hole
Google Groups still exists. Easy enough for organizations to use for sharing announcements.
True. Here in Europe WhatsApp is the new social media. Especially WhatsApp groups.
In that sense it was a smart decision of meta to buy it.
Most of my friends are on Instagram too but nobody really communicates there. The chance of missing something important is way too high.
In that sense it was a smart decision of meta to buy it.
Most of my friends are on Instagram too but nobody really communicates there. The chance of missing something important is way too high.
Why not group emails?
There's a guy that runs multiple sports teams at a local recreation center, in multiple adult divisions (wide age/culture rage), and he has been using email to great effect for over a decade that I have known him. I get 2-3 weekly emails about teams that need a sub for a game and those spots continue to fill up quickly. He probably has the majority of regulars (in the hundreds) at that sports center on his various email list. It just works. They tried chat groups once and that was a disaster.
There's a guy that runs multiple sports teams at a local recreation center, in multiple adult divisions (wide age/culture rage), and he has been using email to great effect for over a decade that I have known him. I get 2-3 weekly emails about teams that need a sub for a game and those spots continue to fill up quickly. He probably has the majority of regulars (in the hundreds) at that sports center on his various email list. It just works. They tried chat groups once and that was a disaster.
I've never seen "group emails" working, even when amongst technical people.
Part of it is just how emails work, part of it is how each clients work, part of it is people not knowing/caring.
Part of it is just how emails work, part of it is how each clients work, part of it is people not knowing/caring.
You'll have:
- the guy that don't use the group email address as recipient, but personal email address
- the guy that change the subject which starts a new thread/discussion
- the guy that include all previous emails in their answer
- the guy with a signature that takes two screens to scroll
- the guy with an awful text font/color
- the guy that CC their whole address book, including the group email address, for personal stuff
- ...
I move into a neighbourhood of new houses in 2007. One of the guys there worked IT at a university and set up a mailing list of the neighbourhood. It was used successfully for all sorts of coordination, neighbourhood watch, internal news, etc.
There's always someone mis-using it, and the same applies to every other platform. There's always someone hijacking forum threads, or asking questions in comments instead of starting a new topic. None of this is exclusive to email.
There's always someone mis-using it, and the same applies to every other platform. There's always someone hijacking forum threads, or asking questions in comments instead of starting a new topic. None of this is exclusive to email.
I have.
For hackerspaces, tech meetups, book clubs, cycling clubs, city cleanup volunteer groups…
It works fine.
Don’t let your bad experience ruin it for everyone. Especially with an administrative backend, email-based distribution and comms works great for smaller groups!
For hackerspaces, tech meetups, book clubs, cycling clubs, city cleanup volunteer groups…
It works fine.
Don’t let your bad experience ruin it for everyone. Especially with an administrative backend, email-based distribution and comms works great for smaller groups!
Subject lines shouldn't be relied on to identify emails. In-Reply-To / References exists in most clients if the mailing list specifies a Message-ID...
Subject lines have always been the best way and most emails could be nothing but subject line if blank bodies were allowed.
But because subject lines are more work and people who love sending email tend to love it because it is very low effort, the venn of email senders and those who write subject lines is small.
But because subject lines are more work and people who love sending email tend to love it because it is very low effort, the venn of email senders and those who write subject lines is small.
Here’s how you do it: <https://www.jwz.org/doc/threading.html>
Threading does not change the ways email sucks.
That site seems to serve offensive images¹.
(¹yes, it seems like you can work around it by going to the URL de novo, … but IDK, doesn't seem worth it.)
(¹yes, it seems like you can work around it by going to the URL de novo, … but IDK, doesn't seem worth it.)
even in the best scenarios, a well organized group of people is not using all the features of email "properly" to say nothing of groups that are supposed to have the general public.
> Why not group emails?
Yes, email is the absolute best for opimal reach. All the proprietary platforms are inherently fragmented and gatekeeped by their corporations. Trying to find a common denominator is hard. Email is standard, not owned by anyone and thus universal.
Yes, email is the absolute best for opimal reach. All the proprietary platforms are inherently fragmented and gatekeeped by their corporations. Trying to find a common denominator is hard. Email is standard, not owned by anyone and thus universal.
Why not group emails?
Email is a push technology. And the receiver has to manage their inbox for the sender’s enthusiasm.
2-3 weekly emails
A web page could update in real time. It would be more work for the sender. And less work for everyone else.
Email is a push technology. And the receiver has to manage their inbox for the sender’s enthusiasm.
2-3 weekly emails
A web page could update in real time. It would be more work for the sender. And less work for everyone else.
That doesn't track. As a recipient, checking one location for updates (my inbox) is easier than polling N websites for updates. If I had to recall all the various websites for everything I need updates for, I'd quickly miss updates.
discourse combines web forum and email, people can use either one as they see fit.
https://github.com/discourse/discourse
https://github.com/discourse/discourse
I absolutely detest email; it’s already a shit show with personal email and don’t get me started about work email. How the fuck the defacto king of search can’t reliably find Workspace emails in GMail, I’ll never know.
That said: the fracturing of reasonable alternatives and the diversification of available channels is extensive and just as annoying.
While there’s no real good answer here, I wish we could more effectively solve this problem for the masses.
That said: the fracturing of reasonable alternatives and the diversification of available channels is extensive and just as annoying.
While there’s no real good answer here, I wish we could more effectively solve this problem for the masses.
This is what the Bluesky “AT Protocol” is meant to solve, though I fear it might be a bit too late.
Except AT Protocol can't do the very thing that made Facebook the commons: privacy.
There's a proposal to add privacy to the protocol (private posts, private groups), but I don't think anyone has solved the real root problem with trying to implement privacy in a federated system (as opposed to P2P), which is the bad administrator problem. The proposal I saw still relied on trustworthy app administrators to respect a post's privacy settings. And that's a huge flaw.
Friendica and Diaspora both have the same problem, and to my knowledge don't have a good solution for it. They both just sort of hand wave it away.
I'm waiting to see if someone comes up with a good solution for the unsafe admin problem, but so far I haven't seen one.
There's a proposal to add privacy to the protocol (private posts, private groups), but I don't think anyone has solved the real root problem with trying to implement privacy in a federated system (as opposed to P2P), which is the bad administrator problem. The proposal I saw still relied on trustworthy app administrators to respect a post's privacy settings. And that's a huge flaw.
Friendica and Diaspora both have the same problem, and to my knowledge don't have a good solution for it. They both just sort of hand wave it away.
I'm waiting to see if someone comes up with a good solution for the unsafe admin problem, but so far I haven't seen one.
For privacy you should be using Matrix private chat with E2EE, no? So maybe we just need to add channels like in Telegram to Matrix?
for events specifically, Partiful seems to be the thing in my area finally displacing the Facebook events model, and it's a lot less bloated.
It comes from Palantir though, so some people don't want to use it for that reason.
I tried hard but am failing to see how what you say couldn't just be fulfilled by a chat group today (or even back then).
But which one - SMS/RCS? iMessage? WhatsApp? Signal? Telegram? Discord?
Funny, every time I've joined a new group for dancing or art classes or DnD or anything it's always 100% of the time a WhatsApp group, no questions asked. (This is in Ireland).
Never occurred to me that Americans wouldn't have a common group chat app everyone uses. Do Americans not all use iMessage, since pretty much everybody has an iPhone there?
Never occurred to me that Americans wouldn't have a common group chat app everyone uses. Do Americans not all use iMessage, since pretty much everybody has an iPhone there?
>Do Americans not all use iMessage, since pretty much everybody has an iPhone there?
I'm Irish and travel back and forth a lot. First, not everyone has iPhones, Android has 40% of the market.
Older generations use Facebook to manage their clubs. I'm increasingly seeing Whatsapp and occasionally Signal for younger and more tech-savvy social circles. Facebook is non-existent in sub 35 year olds. Its just taking longer to switch over (or away from) Facebook given how tech savvy older folks are here compared to Ireland.
I'm Irish and travel back and forth a lot. First, not everyone has iPhones, Android has 40% of the market.
Older generations use Facebook to manage their clubs. I'm increasingly seeing Whatsapp and occasionally Signal for younger and more tech-savvy social circles. Facebook is non-existent in sub 35 year olds. Its just taking longer to switch over (or away from) Facebook given how tech savvy older folks are here compared to Ireland.
Around 58% of American smartphone users are iPhone. It's a lot, but not enough to be universal. In my family there's 5 iPhone users and 4 Android users, amusingly similar to the national ratio.
Apple has famously made its strategy to use iMessage to enforce exclusivity. If you want to reach everyone, it's not iMessage. And Whatsapp in the US is worse, closer to 1/3.
Apple has famously made its strategy to use iMessage to enforce exclusivity. If you want to reach everyone, it's not iMessage. And Whatsapp in the US is worse, closer to 1/3.
What people miss about the US phone market is that while it's almost 60% iPhones, the vast majority of the top half of the income spectrum use them. I'm not sure if it's the same as it was a decade ago, but being excluded from iMessage group chats was a real exclusionary move for many teenagers.
at least in the US, most people are fine with iMessage/SMS since
* pretty early on the vast majority of phone plans started bundling unlimited text messaging, which IIRC was a big motivator for using messaging apps abroad
* because of the vast scale of the country, domestic coverage results in no roaming for the places Americans spend most of their time, unlike in Europe where there are multitudes of countries you'd be passing in a one to two hour flight. Roaming charges in the EU were only abolished in 2022, late enough that everybody has settled on apps as the best way to manage that now.
* many American plans extend unlimited messaging to Canada and Mexico, the two likeliest places that Americans would go to abroad
* pretty early on the vast majority of phone plans started bundling unlimited text messaging, which IIRC was a big motivator for using messaging apps abroad
* because of the vast scale of the country, domestic coverage results in no roaming for the places Americans spend most of their time, unlike in Europe where there are multitudes of countries you'd be passing in a one to two hour flight. Roaming charges in the EU were only abolished in 2022, late enough that everybody has settled on apps as the best way to manage that now.
* many American plans extend unlimited messaging to Canada and Mexico, the two likeliest places that Americans would go to abroad
That's a weird perspective. Certainly not everyone has an iPhone. As for other messaging apps, I also see widespread use of GroupMe for certain domains like sports teams. Some clubs also run their own Slack channels.
I'm probably the wrong person to answer since I don't and never have used any social media, but it seems like groups here mostly use Instagram.
Or just iMessage with fallback to SMS for those not on iPhones. Unlike most of the rest of the world, iPhones dominate in the USA.
Or just iMessage with fallback to SMS for those not on iPhones. Unlike most of the rest of the world, iPhones dominate in the USA.
Americans primarily use iMessage/SMS/RCS. You only need one messaging app and everyone has it pre-installed on both iOS and Android.
WhatsApp does not solve any problems for the typical American user. Most Americans don't install WhatsApp unless they spend a lot of time overseas some place where it is required to do anything. Even international group chats seem to be more Discord-based in recent years.
WhatsApp does not solve any problems for the typical American user. Most Americans don't install WhatsApp unless they spend a lot of time overseas some place where it is required to do anything. Even international group chats seem to be more Discord-based in recent years.
SMS/RCS doesn't work for any group larger than a few people. You always end up with multiple parallel streams going that each include different subsets of the group, and sometimes other random people outside the group.
This is empirically false. I am on many groups that have (at least) several dozen people over SMS/RCS/iMessage. It isn’t ideal but it definitely works adequately.
I use Signal with some groups but that is a minority. I use WhatsApp daily but only people overseas use it. Many Americans have no idea what WhatsApp is.
The practical reality is that iMessage is a legitimately superior experience to other messaging apps, and the penetration is high enough in the US that many group chats never fall back to RCS or SMS. You can’t control that but as an observation that is commonly the case. Even when it does fallback to SMS/RCS, it mostly works for many use cases.
I’ve used every messaging app under the sun, having spent a lot of time overseas. But I totally understand why Americans don’t bother with WhatsApp (or Signal) even though I do. The value-add is non-existent in the US since almost no one else uses it and the alternatives just work.
I use Signal with some groups but that is a minority. I use WhatsApp daily but only people overseas use it. Many Americans have no idea what WhatsApp is.
The practical reality is that iMessage is a legitimately superior experience to other messaging apps, and the penetration is high enough in the US that many group chats never fall back to RCS or SMS. You can’t control that but as an observation that is commonly the case. Even when it does fallback to SMS/RCS, it mostly works for many use cases.
I’ve used every messaging app under the sun, having spent a lot of time overseas. But I totally understand why Americans don’t bother with WhatsApp (or Signal) even though I do. The value-add is non-existent in the US since almost no one else uses it and the alternatives just work.
What I like about WhatsApp is that I don't need a Google account to use it on the computer. I don't use Google messages or even a Google account on my android phone. So I have no RCS and I don't even look at SMS.
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When I ran a student society we used an email mailing list.
You can have two if necessary, one only for announcements and one for discussion.
You can have two if necessary, one only for announcements and one for discussion.
This tends to run into problems with people not actually reading their email, especially when the messages are falsely classified as spam. That might not be a problem if all the members are on the same school mail server but it's problematic for general usage.
Many people don't read their email anymore. When I send an email I often have to send a text message to the person telling them I sent an email or they won't see it.
> Many people don't read their email anymore.
I don't see how that would work as in many jurisdictions, email is an accepted legal way to communicate between a company and a customer. So when you don't year your email that's like not reading your snail mail in the 90s. It might go well for some time, until you miss that one message about a late payment or something...
I don't see how that would work as in many jurisdictions, email is an accepted legal way to communicate between a company and a customer. So when you don't year your email that's like not reading your snail mail in the 90s. It might go well for some time, until you miss that one message about a late payment or something...
A large number of services that send various billing etc things via snail mail and email also send text messages. The other part of this is that almost everything is automated these days for most people. Bill payment etc happens automagically. Most necessary notifications occur via phone apps.
Ignoring email works just fine, as evidenced by the fact that the majority of people I know don't check email unless it is for their work. Zero impact on their lives. It is the same with snail mail. I think I check my snail mail 6-8 times per year mostly so that the letter box doesn't physically overflow with junk.
Ignoring email works just fine, as evidenced by the fact that the majority of people I know don't check email unless it is for their work. Zero impact on their lives. It is the same with snail mail. I think I check my snail mail 6-8 times per year mostly so that the letter box doesn't physically overflow with junk.
Exactly this.
Plus the notifications for chat groups are basically:
- show me everything
- don't notify me at all
Plus the notifications for chat groups are basically:
- show me everything
- don't notify me at all
Discord is a bit better about that with "pings"
WhatsApp is paramount here in Spain. Telegram a strong second. The rest non-existent. Though I use discord for global reach interest groups. Never for local communities. Small ones are always on WhatsApp. Big ones usually telegram.
E-Mail! :)
I think there is less cost to being in multiple chat platforms than multiple social media platforms.
Whatsapp, that’s the one everyone uses
Whatever the group owner picks, same as it's always been.
No one cares about the actual choice, only that it is made.
No one cares about the actual choice, only that it is made.
> No one cares about the actual choice, only that it is made.
If the actual choice requires me to install an app then I care quite a lot and will probably decline to join in.
I don't think that I am the only one who feels this way.
If the actual choice requires me to install an app then I care quite a lot and will probably decline to join in.
I don't think that I am the only one who feels this way.
Then life moves on without you in the club.
Unless they are chosing something super obscure and sketchy, most club members are going to be fine with the leader just saying, we're picking whatsapp, either join or dont.
Unless they are chosing something super obscure and sketchy, most club members are going to be fine with the leader just saying, we're picking whatsapp, either join or dont.
I have Messager app fatigue at this point (where I live).
- Doctors offices and official services use SMS.
- Some of my close family and friends use Signal (on my pressure).
- The distant boomers use Facebook Messenger
- With the younger people they use Snapchat.
- Almost everyone else in the country uses Whatsapp as that's the dominant messaging app.
- My friends who live in Berlin use Telegram
- Online communities for tinkering and foss projects require Discord.
God I miss the 2000s.
- Doctors offices and official services use SMS.
- Some of my close family and friends use Signal (on my pressure).
- The distant boomers use Facebook Messenger
- With the younger people they use Snapchat.
- Almost everyone else in the country uses Whatsapp as that's the dominant messaging app.
- My friends who live in Berlin use Telegram
- Online communities for tinkering and foss projects require Discord.
God I miss the 2000s.
> God I miss the 2000s.
Exactly! Having to check 27 different places for messages (also add individual sites like linkedin, etc, where people message), it is completely ridiculous.
Just send me email. It's universal, standard, no corporation owns it (thus no corportation can shut me out unlike facebook or all the proprietary solutions).
Exactly! Having to check 27 different places for messages (also add individual sites like linkedin, etc, where people message), it is completely ridiculous.
Just send me email. It's universal, standard, no corporation owns it (thus no corportation can shut me out unlike facebook or all the proprietary solutions).
Pidgin had it so good. Have you tried Beeper?
https://www.beeper.com/
https://www.beeper.com/
The subtext of a status feed is that it lets you signal to loose ties. You can't form a group chat with the girl you had a crush on in high school but you can post a status update and hope she sees it. I would guess that this is one of the main uses of social media.
Instagram recently added a "See what Reels your friends liked". It's not a status feed, but it lets you signal taste to loose ties.
Instagram designers know what people use social media for.
In OPs case the point of a college group status feed is so that college students can signal desirability to each other. Guys post things that make them look smart, women post things that make them look cool etc.
The actual subject of the club takes distant second to the call of the wild.
Instagram recently added a "See what Reels your friends liked". It's not a status feed, but it lets you signal taste to loose ties.
Instagram designers know what people use social media for.
In OPs case the point of a college group status feed is so that college students can signal desirability to each other. Guys post things that make them look smart, women post things that make them look cool etc.
The actual subject of the club takes distant second to the call of the wild.
?!
The commons became the commons again, instead of being partially or completely trapped on Facebook,
and you’re upset?
Bulletin boards are awesome.
Physical assembly is awesome.
The commons became the commons again, instead of being partially or completely trapped on Facebook,
and you’re upset?
Bulletin boards are awesome.
Physical assembly is awesome.
> Part of me hopes that we got back to the late 1990s dedicated websites/forums. That seems to be the Discord model but let's see.
Well, thanks for lobbying, that's got regulated away. One must be mad today to run a forum.
Well, thanks for lobbying, that's got regulated away. One must be mad today to run a forum.
Social media companies became so obsessed about maximizing ROI on short form video content that they stopped being a platform to share with friends and turned into Temu Youtube. You won’t see your friends stuff on any of them because it’s designed to work that way. Group chats are the only way to have a meaningful conversation if you a casual non-technical Internet dweller.
All of that is intentional. There isn't enough money to be made connecting people. Revenue streams are driven by ads attached to media interaction. Connecting people is low engagement. We, as consumers, have rewarded this revenue model by proving that it works. If you don't want to contribute to it then don't use these large platforms.
This is so sadly true. I nostalgically remember early social media with the linear feed of things directly from friends as being a fun and positive place.
Not everyone has blogger friends who like travelling, writing and posting so the feed would be empty and boring without algorithmic content.
Bsky actually uave linear followed accounts only feed.
Facebook has it too, or at least they did as of last year when I last used Facebook.
On the desktop version of the website, click on the "Friends" "Feed" (and there might have been a sort by date as well you had to then click on).
On the desktop version of the website, click on the "Friends" "Feed" (and there might have been a sort by date as well you had to then click on).
It’s gone, but it was already too late.
Out of ten items on your feed, five would be adverts, three are reposts of some crappy influencer’s video or a meme or something, one is a friend’s marketplace listing, and if you’re lucky, the last one is a photo actually taken by a friend who you actually know.
Out of ten items on your feed, five would be adverts, three are reposts of some crappy influencer’s video or a meme or something, one is a friend’s marketplace listing, and if you’re lucky, the last one is a photo actually taken by a friend who you actually know.
Nope, it's gone.
You don't get sorting options for that Feed. And depending on your luck that might be three clicks off the home page to even that (See More > Feeds > Friends).
You don't get sorting options for that Feed. And depending on your luck that might be three clicks off the home page to even that (See More > Feeds > Friends).
Twitter has it, too.
So does instagram actually but it is sort of hidden.
Mine stopped working that way some time after Musk tool over - I started to get complete crap from people I did not followed.
it still works in the web app - following -> recent - though I think I've got some browser extension to force that to be the default, otherwise it tended to revert to other tabs and ordering.
Back to 2015, I stopped posting on Facebook when I noticed that it’s no longer about connecting with my friends, but a never ending stream of boring posts from groups and people that I don’t know or care to follow.
All my “social” life just moved to direct communication in WhatsApp (meta owned as well)
All my “social” life just moved to direct communication in WhatsApp (meta owned as well)
We really need a real facebook app again, something we only use with close friends or people we meet irl to become friends
I am currently building something where you can post once per day. If you want to post again within the 24 hour window, the prior post gets replaced with the new one and it also shows at the old post's timestamp in the chronological feed.
As for connecting to people, you drag and drop the connect button into a folder name which you want their posts to show in. For example, You can create custom folders for friends, family, coworkers etc. After that, you drag the connect button into that folder. And each folder creates a custom feed from only those people for you.
I am open to brainstorming more ideas.
As for connecting to people, you drag and drop the connect button into a folder name which you want their posts to show in. For example, You can create custom folders for friends, family, coworkers etc. After that, you drag the connect button into that folder. And each folder creates a custom feed from only those people for you.
I am open to brainstorming more ideas.
My 2c: the problem I see is not about unbounded post frequency, it’s about ads
2015 for me too. I wonder if there was some early day over juicing of the attention mechanism that put people off in that year, before they tuned it to reduce churn…
It was a big year for the culture war. People who had previously been cordial suddenly needed to fight each other over politics and other controversies of the day. The rest of us watched this happen, then slowly backed away.
It wasn’t even that for me. No one was posting anything political right or left back then. Just one day the newsfeed went from chronological posts of friends to littered with the bs you see today. Why even post when no one is going to see it. And then of course the natural march of life where people have less time to bother with that and no longer care if Stacy from English class liked the homecoming photos or not.
Yeah but I think it just took some year for ppl to notice.
2013-2014 the algorithm got more foused on non-friend posts aswell as making the prioritzation less about "likes" from friends and instead some opaque engagement metrics. Groups had to "promote" post to get their prior reach to subscribers.
Also videos started to be posted around that time?
2013-2014 the algorithm got more foused on non-friend posts aswell as making the prioritzation less about "likes" from friends and instead some opaque engagement metrics. Groups had to "promote" post to get their prior reach to subscribers.
Also videos started to be posted around that time?
I remember I left around that time too because they started aggressively trying to defeat adbockers. I'd rather just leave the platform completely than see a single ad.
Tinfoil hat time but I think they definitely did _something_ at that time that "changed" the system. It's the Cambridge Analytica/Trump time and I believe that FB definitely "changed" at the same time.
After Cambridge Analytica, my "intelligent" friends basically abandoned the platform, while my distant conspiracy inclined uncles started posting baseless slop.
Its simple. Nobody is posting because nobody is going to read your posts. The intense dive into algorithmic feeds over chronological ones sourced from your friends means that nobody is going to see your posts. Nobody is going to comment on them. Nobody is going to acknowledge they even exist. Everyone understands this, at least subconsciously, so nobody's gonna post. Besides, all that stuff moved into group chats anyways.
I noticed last year that FB did some change to their recommendations engine, that they’ll show posts by random people based things you’ve searched. A friend was diagnosed with cancer last year, I searched extensively, and now I’m exclusively getting posts from random people with cancer on my feed.
It’s often very good at finding posts that I might theoretically want to read, except that I never want to read them on Facebook, because it would get in the way of seeing posts from friends.
Isn't that how it has been?
No, it used to be a shuffled timeline of the posts and likes your connections/friends have made but I guess when half your platform are bots, you don’t want to store that metadata anymore.
To keep people engaged, social media platforms have shifted from showing you content from people you know to prioritizing viral content. The algorithms know viral content offers an endless stream of entertainment that keeps people scrolling longer.
"Viral content" got nerfed to oblivion in 2013-2014 something when Facebook made companies pay up for group exposure. (Promoted post)
Before that a popular article could be shared among different friends networks to like total exposure to like everyone logged in that were somewhat interested in the article.
I was kinda a journalist then it was a really obvious flip.
Before that a popular article could be shared among different friends networks to like total exposure to like everyone logged in that were somewhat interested in the article.
I was kinda a journalist then it was a really obvious flip.
Fb is clearly hated by its owners, Meta. Its been monitized to the max and deeply neglected. They desperately want to move on to virtual reality or AI - ANYTHING to escape from having to make their money off fb.
Makes one wonder what it would be like if someone else had built and maintained it who really belived in the vision of connecting communities instead of sucking them dry.
Makes one wonder what it would be like if someone else had built and maintained it who really belived in the vision of connecting communities instead of sucking them dry.
Like the writer I'm also a 'boomer' still keeping connected to an older friend group using Facebook and Instagram. For Facebook, I use the plugin "FB Purity" to filter out the generated cr*p posts and force chronological order. It's shocking too see how few posts are left, by agressive algorithm filtering and FB then deciding that "You're all caught up", refusing to show more posts. So my FB time is about 20 seconds every day...
That’s Reddit for me: I subscribe to the sub for my city, and that’s it. It’s a finite scroll that usually takes 5 minutes, and then I move on
Yes because people no longer post they realised they need to show you their “explore” feed.
I've noticed that a lot of my friends switched from text based status updates (Facebook) to image based status updates (Instagram stories). Personally, I got tired of going on Facebook because it was all rage baiting political stuff, and that was all from friends, not even ads.
Instagram stories seems to be dieing too, except for the professional and business accounts I follow
The bar is just so high, everywhere.
I want to fire off a quick quip and have a conversation.
Reddit is probably the only place where this works any more, but you have to be prompted by the right thread and early.
So people throw up their hands and go, "why bother?"
I want to fire off a quick quip and have a conversation.
Reddit is probably the only place where this works any more, but you have to be prompted by the right thread and early.
So people throw up their hands and go, "why bother?"
Reddit is so negative though. There was an event I went to, and according to Reddit it was a shit show, but checking my Facebook, everyone that went had a wonderful time!
I stopped using Facebook back in 2021 when the majority of my feed was reshared political content with 20+ comments from my friends fighting about divisive social/political issues. It wasn't fun, and it wasn't fostering community, so I left. A few years later I logged in again to see that most of my Facebook friends had also stopped engaging.
This is an ad for Incogni
Like every pcmag article, there’s a corporate sponsor
It is pretty obvious, but as far as I can see, this article has not been disclosed as advertising or sponsored content. I'm in Europe, and I'm no expert on FTC advertising requirements, but this specific content arrangement doesn't feel super legal to me. My ad blocker did not pick it up either.
Social media as it was born touched a novel point of contact that didn't quite exist before. It was a powerful shift from what we had before.
Social media allowed you to be in touch with people in a way that wasn't possible with phone calls, text messages, instant messaging, email, or domain-specific forums.
What I could do in Facebook in 2010 was stay "friends" with selected acquaintances such as old classmates with whom I never was in email terms, messaging terms, or any other terms except having known them in school (or at work or at a hobby or...) I could follow their life via their posts, and I could leave a comment, sometimes, without any expectation that we should ever talk, meet, chat, or become more than old classmates. I haven't sent email to anyone in my school that I didn't know outside of school, as a friend. I don't have their numbers and it would be awkward to even consider calling someone with whom we didn't necessarily even talk much in school. But it was perfectly okay to ask someone to be your friend on Facebook (like, Hey, I know you? and if he did remember he would accept) and follow their postings and maybe (re)kindle something with no pressure to grow it into anything more than that.
We had that. Now... we no longer do. Or we still have Facebook and we can send friend requests to old acquantainces that I'd like to follow but there's nothing to follow because they aren't posting and because Facebook wouldn't show me their posts. So we're back to the point where actually making contact with another person (on Facebook) basically requires sending them a message in Facebook. Which already goes beyond what's expected from an old acquantaince on Facebook.
I recall a site for classmates where you could register to your school years and see your classmates there. But that was before social media and there weren't any posts that you could comment. You could just see your classmates listed there, and one in ten might have written a few words in their profile. And that was classmates only, not ex-work colleagues or other people you've passed behind in your life. Facebook was really good at the time it became a thing.
We still have email, instant messaging, etc. but what's the platform today where I can keep in touch with people I'm not emailing or talking with? Is there one?
Social media allowed you to be in touch with people in a way that wasn't possible with phone calls, text messages, instant messaging, email, or domain-specific forums.
What I could do in Facebook in 2010 was stay "friends" with selected acquaintances such as old classmates with whom I never was in email terms, messaging terms, or any other terms except having known them in school (or at work or at a hobby or...) I could follow their life via their posts, and I could leave a comment, sometimes, without any expectation that we should ever talk, meet, chat, or become more than old classmates. I haven't sent email to anyone in my school that I didn't know outside of school, as a friend. I don't have their numbers and it would be awkward to even consider calling someone with whom we didn't necessarily even talk much in school. But it was perfectly okay to ask someone to be your friend on Facebook (like, Hey, I know you? and if he did remember he would accept) and follow their postings and maybe (re)kindle something with no pressure to grow it into anything more than that.
We had that. Now... we no longer do. Or we still have Facebook and we can send friend requests to old acquantainces that I'd like to follow but there's nothing to follow because they aren't posting and because Facebook wouldn't show me their posts. So we're back to the point where actually making contact with another person (on Facebook) basically requires sending them a message in Facebook. Which already goes beyond what's expected from an old acquantaince on Facebook.
I recall a site for classmates where you could register to your school years and see your classmates there. But that was before social media and there weren't any posts that you could comment. You could just see your classmates listed there, and one in ten might have written a few words in their profile. And that was classmates only, not ex-work colleagues or other people you've passed behind in your life. Facebook was really good at the time it became a thing.
We still have email, instant messaging, etc. but what's the platform today where I can keep in touch with people I'm not emailing or talking with? Is there one?
I think this is really well said. Instagram is probably the closest for me though I use it far less.
Meanwhile IG has hugely alienated -its- original target audience. My feed: "Reels. Suggested for you. Ad. Threads. Suggested for you. Ad. Followee. Ad. Threads." and 90% of it is short form video content, and even more annoying still content which is for some reason a 10s video.
I consider Facebook to be the worst of all worlds. Frankly
They don't show you what your friends actually post. Someone saying "hey - I'm in the parking lot at some place, I need help moving this thing" 5 minutes ago? You might see it on your feed in a week
They engage in reputational decay https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1775182 (see also, photo tagging)
They've cut off access to your friends https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4151433
It's a company involved in lots of OTHER things which don't make it a good netizen https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10791198 (oh and their own cryptocurrency in Libra, that's fun)
"Dumb fucks" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1692122
Edit: You get banned at any time while the obviously horrible thing you report doesn't get taken down. That's not sustainable. It's not a thing where you can actually physically keep in touch with people, either nominally strangers or the best of friends
They don't show you what your friends actually post. Someone saying "hey - I'm in the parking lot at some place, I need help moving this thing" 5 minutes ago? You might see it on your feed in a week
They engage in reputational decay https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1775182 (see also, photo tagging)
They've cut off access to your friends https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4151433
It's a company involved in lots of OTHER things which don't make it a good netizen https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10791198 (oh and their own cryptocurrency in Libra, that's fun)
"Dumb fucks" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1692122
Edit: You get banned at any time while the obviously horrible thing you report doesn't get taken down. That's not sustainable. It's not a thing where you can actually physically keep in touch with people, either nominally strangers or the best of friends
Probably a crazy though, but I sometimes wonder if the pandemic/lockdowns did a number on social media activity too. Maybe a lot of people got burnt out on the whole thing after spending 2-3 years stuck inside with social media as their only way to communicate with friends and family.
That seems to be the point where most communities and social sites I'm on lost a lot of their activity/enjoyment, and where people seemed to start fading away.
Of course, increasing polarisation, an increasingly aggressive/selfish population and worries about privacy probably hit hard too.
That seems to be the point where most communities and social sites I'm on lost a lot of their activity/enjoyment, and where people seemed to start fading away.
Of course, increasing polarisation, an increasingly aggressive/selfish population and worries about privacy probably hit hard too.
Where did pandemic restrictions stay in effect for 2-3 years? SF took restrictions fairly seriously and by March 2022 they seemed non-existent
Emotions experienced chart - that is insightful and matches my anecdata.
I think you get bad emotions when you have high expectations about social media and it is your main source of social life. Where positive happen when you have low expectations about social media and it is just addon to your life.
Example of gaps is being lonely, low self esteem, low self worth, no work network, no business network. So you stay glued to FB to build your life, to keep online friends, because you may have not many in life. Or you have no real work network so you need to stay current on LI because your next job is there.
I think you get bad emotions when you have high expectations about social media and it is your main source of social life. Where positive happen when you have low expectations about social media and it is just addon to your life.
Example of gaps is being lonely, low self esteem, low self worth, no work network, no business network. So you stay glued to FB to build your life, to keep online friends, because you may have not many in life. Or you have no real work network so you need to stay current on LI because your next job is there.
Discord seems like the way. Sometimes, Signal groups (also popular in the White House).
Not sure if I see a bad thing in this. I'd like too know what old friends are currently up to and checking their social media has been a way to do so during the golden age of facebook.
Lately I feel more value in connecting with them personally, talking and letting them now, that I am still interested in what's going on for them.
Lately I feel more value in connecting with them personally, talking and letting them now, that I am still interested in what's going on for them.
That's great if you're cultivating a very small group of friends who are local.
Social media is how I keep vaguely aware of what's going on with my friends who now live scattered across the planet and get to see in person once per decade or so.
Social media is how I keep vaguely aware of what's going on with my friends who now live scattered across the planet and get to see in person once per decade or so.
I’m gonna break it to you bud, the people you see only once a decade or so aren’t your friends. Those are shallow acquaintances that you’re letting drag on for too long. They’re not a part of your life and you’re not a part of theirs.
At most, you can call them professional contacts whom you hope to get some value out of in the future, and in that sense I’d agree — social media makes it possible to keep in touch with people whom you have a transactional relationship with.
At most, you can call them professional contacts whom you hope to get some value out of in the future, and in that sense I’d agree — social media makes it possible to keep in touch with people whom you have a transactional relationship with.
They dont drag me. They add positive stuff to my life, once in a while, and that is super cool. And they dont ask much in exchange, just for me to not be a jerk in that situation.
And all of them are relationships with someone I already know, can ve safer around then random and some of them grow again into more active friendships in right situation.
And yes, that friendship happens again thing is real.
And all of them are relationships with someone I already know, can ve safer around then random and some of them grow again into more active friendships in right situation.
And yes, that friendship happens again thing is real.
"Drag on for too long" Who are you to dictate how other people connect. The word friend is not well defined, but a person I know from my past that I'm able to keep in contact with, thanks to the magic of technology, that I want to have some communication with, is a something.
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. At the very least, it should be used occasionally to post things as a kind of "public memory," not to expose your entire life just for likes and exhibitionism.
I wonder what would happen if: if I post 2 pieces of content, my friend would have to comment on the first one to see the next one.
I suppose the app will then mostly be full of throwaway comments in the form of "Cool" or "Wow". But maybe add a modifier that if the poster doesn't have any meaningful reply to a commenter's (let's name him Elon) comment, then the poster's next content will not be shared with Elon next time.
I suppose the app will then mostly be full of throwaway comments in the form of "Cool" or "Wow". But maybe add a modifier that if the poster doesn't have any meaningful reply to a commenter's (let's name him Elon) comment, then the poster's next content will not be shared with Elon next time.
Out of curiosity, I checked my FB profile
my last post is from 2018, the last post I was tagged in is from 2020
6 years of nothing
my last post is from 2018, the last post I was tagged in is from 2020
6 years of nothing
It seems like so much of social media is just individuals shouting into the void.
It would be better if it was that. It is like for any given topic there is a bullet point of a couple takes you will find anywhere about that topic. Just parroting bots I guess since that probably snowballs engagement from other bots.
We're all in small groups on discord or in signal now. FB feed is just not the best medium for keeping up with friends.
Idea of keeping up with friends while being public to the whole world does not resonate with me. Internet was a different place indeed.
No one really had a public account though. Last thing you wanted was parents seeing you holding a solo cup in pictures.
I stopped because I was forced to. "Something Happened" - never explained to me - and my FB public commenting was indefinitely suspended. No great loss.
Really sad. I used to love staying connected with people but now I'm fed content from people I don't follow to keep me on the platform. I'm over it.
> Eventually, I left almost all my groups behind, keeping only the ones tied to genuine relationships.
That's why my only social media is WhatsApp, if that's a social media.
That's why my only social media is WhatsApp, if that's a social media.
Twitter and Reddit went hostile to their users in 2023 with their respective API and other changes. A small percentage of leaders sought out newer and better options and this time the followers stayed where they were, not wanting to start over again. But everyone talks about hating social media now and they're going slowly inactive. It's the most expected outcome.
Social media these days is 80% psyop, 20% attention grind. That 55% of Americans stopped posting would be a healthy thing.
4chan realized this decade+ ago. HN has no self awareness its being used as a plaything.
I think we stopped posting because it's a miserable, unnecessary experience made worse by miserable unnecessary technology
email mailing list should be back - but people's brains have been turned to mush.
Social media mostly polarise people (both women and men, in different ways) and generally speaking what you post will be used against you at some point.
So yeah, no wonder that social media is dying. People are just catching up to the fact that the best way not to lose is to just not play the game.
So yeah, no wonder that social media is dying. People are just catching up to the fact that the best way not to lose is to just not play the game.
Strava is now the preferred app in my social network. And no "status update" is necessary as it does that automatically.
sounds conservative
We started out using forum software to co-ordinate what we were doing but eventually (2008-ish) switched to Facebook as the president of the club pointed out "Alex, everyone is already on Facebook and the notifications from us are in the middle of the notifications for when the next party is" etc.
Fast forward to today and the club is rebooting again. I asked the current club president "What social network is everyone on these days?" His response: "Really there is no one place where everyone goes anymore." I then asked him how clubs share their info etc and he says "The bulletin board at the student center?"
While social media definitely has its downsides (echo chambers, extremism etc) I do feel like it's a bit of a net loss to not have a "commons". That model makes it super easy to start up new organizations, get the word out etc.
Part of me hopes that we got back to the late 1990s dedicated websites/forums. That seems to be the Discord model but let's see.