The Impact of Meditating Every Day(pascalprecht.github.io)
pascalprecht.github.io
The Impact of Meditating Every Day
https://pascalprecht.github.io/posts/meditating-every-day
213 comments
Huh, I went to UW and never heard about the Center for Healthy Minds. This is really interesting, thanks!
Where does transcendental meditation fall?
Where does transcendental meditation fall?
I think TM's basic mantra practice would qualify as an Attentional practice. I don't now much about more advanced practices in that school, so I'm not sure.
It's good to point out there are many different types of meditation, as some work better than others, depending on the individual. However, this article doesn't seem to be advocating Vipassana, rather, it states: "Meditation is all about being aware of how your body feels and the thoughts that go through your head without judging or getting caught up in them. Often, this is done by focusing on a certain part of your body, like the breath or your feet, legs, arms, hands and chest etc. At the end of the day, what you’re aiming for is to keep bringing your attention back to what you’re focusing on, everytime you notice your mind has drifted off."
The book is called The Mind Illuminated, and is an absolutely fantastic book on meditation. Super cheap too: https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Illuminated-Meditation-Integrati...
The book is called The Mind Illuminated, and is an absolutely fantastic book on meditation. Super cheap too: https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Illuminated-Meditation-Integrati...
I always mention to people that meditation is an umbrella term just like sport or exercise is, and I also tell them it is at least as diverse.
I recently finished the Book of Joy (great read), an interview by Douglas Abrams of Desmond Tutu and the Dalai Lama, which ends with an appendix full of different types of meditation and mindfulness practices.
I am intrigued to practice the Dalai Lama's usual practice of analytical meditation (listed in parent's linked paper alongside Vipassana), but it's certainly an advanced practice. Most resources I can find recommend a daily practice of Shamatha for some months before undertaking analytical meditation.
I found this poetic description of the thought process one might go through during analytical meditation: https://www.lotsawahouse.org/tibetan-masters/mipham/wheel-of...
I am intrigued to practice the Dalai Lama's usual practice of analytical meditation (listed in parent's linked paper alongside Vipassana), but it's certainly an advanced practice. Most resources I can find recommend a daily practice of Shamatha for some months before undertaking analytical meditation.
I found this poetic description of the thought process one might go through during analytical meditation: https://www.lotsawahouse.org/tibetan-masters/mipham/wheel-of...
And don't forget about Zen, where according to some you think about...not thinking. But, yeah, it's a pretty broad term along the lines of "church". That word is a good start, but is often not descriptive enough to be used as an umbrella term.
> Another form of meditation that's traditionally talked about in Buddhism is shamatha, which translates to something like "concentration" or "tranquility." In this type of practice, the meditator works with a meditation object, commonly the breath, but possibly a sound, mental image, etc. The meditator learns to stabilize the mind and remain fully aware of the object, and in the process learns to debug the mechanisms that direct (and destabilize) conscious attention.
I don't know how similar it is, but I was recently part of a "mindful lunch" at work. We all (3 + the person leading) had lunch in a small conference room in silence. We were told to concentrate fully on the food we were eating the texture, taste, smell, sound, and generally experience it as fully as possible. It was even suggested (and I went with it) to put your silverware down with each bite to give it as full of your attention as possible. It was an incredibly interesting experience to be sure.
I don't know how similar it is, but I was recently part of a "mindful lunch" at work. We all (3 + the person leading) had lunch in a small conference room in silence. We were told to concentrate fully on the food we were eating the texture, taste, smell, sound, and generally experience it as fully as possible. It was even suggested (and I went with it) to put your silverware down with each bite to give it as full of your attention as possible. It was an incredibly interesting experience to be sure.
I strongly recommend Shambavi mahamudra Kriya taught by Sadhguru
https://www.innerengineering.com/
I’ve been practicing their 18 minute meditation for almost a year and it has been quite amazing.
I’ve been practicing their 18 minute meditation for almost a year and it has been quite amazing.
In my experience, apps (like Headspace) mostly distract you from witnessing. Any type of guided mediation has an entertaining aspect to it - you have to follow the guidelines instead of pure witnessing.
Would you mind elaborating a bit more on that?
I've been meaning to get into the meditating for a quite a while now. But never seem to find time/motivation to research how to start.
I've been meaning to get into the meditating for a quite a while now. But never seem to find time/motivation to research how to start.
I started meditating using some written guide/books and Headspace.
An app is helpful to guide you at the beginning, but past a certain point having someone talking during most of the session seems a bit detrimental to your actual focus or awareness. I even wonder if there isn't some sort of Pavlovian response, whenever you listen to Andy Puddicombe voice, you want to meditate.
The core of the issue is that there is a conflict of interests between an app that want to keep you subscribed forever, and the idea of teaching something universal. In any app, I have never heard the teacher saying that you don't need the app to actually meditate (which is obviously true). By making you dependent of an app, you are actually less free than before.
Understand that these meditation apps (Headspace/Calm) are mostly VC funded , and they don't only want to teach you something, their investors also want some hockey stick curves. There is nothing wrong with that but it also explains how some features are designed.
That being said I think it was helpful to use them, they provide some value so I would rather recommend them, just not forever.
An app is helpful to guide you at the beginning, but past a certain point having someone talking during most of the session seems a bit detrimental to your actual focus or awareness. I even wonder if there isn't some sort of Pavlovian response, whenever you listen to Andy Puddicombe voice, you want to meditate.
The core of the issue is that there is a conflict of interests between an app that want to keep you subscribed forever, and the idea of teaching something universal. In any app, I have never heard the teacher saying that you don't need the app to actually meditate (which is obviously true). By making you dependent of an app, you are actually less free than before.
Understand that these meditation apps (Headspace/Calm) are mostly VC funded , and they don't only want to teach you something, their investors also want some hockey stick curves. There is nothing wrong with that but it also explains how some features are designed.
That being said I think it was helpful to use them, they provide some value so I would rather recommend them, just not forever.
Interestingly, in his book outlining the technique he teaches, Andy doesn’t directly recommend people do any sort of guided meditation. Rather, he talks about it like a sort of skill people can learn.
There are probably diminishing returns once you are able to focus through the technique, however, even in monasteries with experienced meditators simple cues like bells are used because everyone gets distracted once in a while!
There are probably diminishing returns once you are able to focus through the technique, however, even in monasteries with experienced meditators simple cues like bells are used because everyone gets distracted once in a while!
thanks, I think now I have no excuse not to try it out.
I would also suggest that if you want to try doing it without an app, try something like:
Wait for a free moment at home, maybe after work, set a timer on your phone for ten minuites, and sit cross legged if you can, or in a comfortable position if not, and just try to focus on your breathing for that time.
It's surprisingly difficult. You may find that its suddenly a lot easier to think about all the things you have to do later, and want to do them now, but resist the urge. This ability to bring things to your head easier is one of the benefits of meditation, and is suprisingly immediate.
Wait for a free moment at home, maybe after work, set a timer on your phone for ten minuites, and sit cross legged if you can, or in a comfortable position if not, and just try to focus on your breathing for that time.
It's surprisingly difficult. You may find that its suddenly a lot easier to think about all the things you have to do later, and want to do them now, but resist the urge. This ability to bring things to your head easier is one of the benefits of meditation, and is suprisingly immediate.
I even wonder if there isn't some sort of Pavlovian response,
whenever you listen to Andy Puddicombe voice, you want to
meditate
Understand that these meditation apps (Headspace/Calm) are
mostly VC funded , and they don't only want to teach you
something, their investors also want some hockey stick
curves. There is nothing wrong with that but it also explains
how some features are designed.
Anyways -- that's just all to say that achieving hockey stick growth in a B2B model should create better alignment and it shouldn't mean that they don't want to teach you something, I'm sure lots of people with good hearts are working there & want to do good for people/users.
Please don't use code formatting for quotes. It makes your text unreadable on mobile.
I can't speak for meditation apps in general, but Headspace managed to introduce millions to meditation. They have a bunch of guided meditations for beginners, but as you progress the amount of guidance is gradually reduced.
Headspace certainly helped me pick up meditation again after a decade long hiatus, in part because of their excellent & gentle progression.
Granted, it's a bit silly to keep paying for a daily 30 minutes of silence.
Headspace certainly helped me pick up meditation again after a decade long hiatus, in part because of their excellent & gentle progression.
Granted, it's a bit silly to keep paying for a daily 30 minutes of silence.
I had always had some kind of anxiety or ocd for as long as I can remember. I'd searched for various ways to deal with it but only discovering meditation really worked for me.
After meditating for 6 months every day (starting with 5 minutes daily, ending with 20-30) I've completely got rid of it. A nice side effect was that I got to be a happier person overall (though that wasn't ever a problem for me), and learned to deal with any kind of stress whatsoever.
I'll happily recommend the, oh so often mentioned on hn, book "the mind illuminated" it really is great to start with: https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Illuminated-Meditation-Integrati...
Recently I haven't been meditating as much as I'd like to unfortunately (I'm trying to get back to it), but the effects are lasting nevertheless. And I still know how to calm myself in a matter of minutes or get more distanced to the situation.
After meditating for 6 months every day (starting with 5 minutes daily, ending with 20-30) I've completely got rid of it. A nice side effect was that I got to be a happier person overall (though that wasn't ever a problem for me), and learned to deal with any kind of stress whatsoever.
I'll happily recommend the, oh so often mentioned on hn, book "the mind illuminated" it really is great to start with: https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Illuminated-Meditation-Integrati...
Recently I haven't been meditating as much as I'd like to unfortunately (I'm trying to get back to it), but the effects are lasting nevertheless. And I still know how to calm myself in a matter of minutes or get more distanced to the situation.
Would you recommend an app like Calm or Headspace to get started with meditation?
I haven't used any of them. I've heard good things about them though from other people using them.
I myself think that meditation is the hardest - and for me the most effective - when I do it with as few external stimuli as possible.
I myself think that meditation is the hardest - and for me the most effective - when I do it with as few external stimuli as possible.
I've recently started using Headspace, and am a big fan.
To get started. Absolutely. Headspace has been instrumental in dealing with a very hard time in my life. For a secular, scientific look at mindfulness meditation read the book “Why Buddhism is true.”
Thanks for the feedback. I'm going to give it a try.
Haven't read that one, but "Buddhism without Beliefs" is also a great read on Buddhism without the supernatural stuff people have attached to it over the centuries.
Here is a podcast with the author:
https://samharris.org/podcasts/is-buddhism-true/
https://samharris.org/podcasts/is-buddhism-true/
Of course, Sam Harris himself has a meditation app (Waking Up). I think might be the best option for the HN crowd.
Thanks. Didn’t know that. On my second listen of the book but will check out the app for sure now.
Here [1] is the Exodus Privacy report for this app. To be fair, I did like the FAQ on the website.
[1] https://reports.exodus-privacy.eu.org/en/reports/38025/
[1] https://reports.exodus-privacy.eu.org/en/reports/38025/
Fwiw, Waking Up gets better marks by those metrics than the other popular meditation apps mentioned in these comments: Headspace and Calm.
(Lower is better)
- Waking Up (3+11=14)
- Headspace (11+16=27)
- Calm (9+15=24)
(Lower is better)
- Waking Up (3+11=14)
- Headspace (11+16=27)
- Calm (9+15=24)
I've tried the Harris app. Everyone can do better than 10-20 minute sessions with Harris rambling in the background, acting as a constant distraction by going on and on about free will and the nature of consciousness.
IMO the HN crowd doesn't have to limit itself to any specific apps. We all have access to books that discuss the hows and whys in much greater detail than any app currently does.
IMO the HN crowd doesn't have to limit itself to any specific apps. We all have access to books that discuss the hows and whys in much greater detail than any app currently does.
I started with Headspace, but feel like I get significantly higher returns without it. Something about having to concentrate on someone else's voice that makes the whole experience a little bit less effective for me.
That said, I'd certainly recommend an app vs nothing, and perhaps as a good way to dip your toes in. I'd just also recommend trying it without the app after you've gotten comfortable with it.
That said, I'd certainly recommend an app vs nothing, and perhaps as a good way to dip your toes in. I'd just also recommend trying it without the app after you've gotten comfortable with it.
How do you meditate without the app. I tried headspace. It's great but it is too expensive for me.
Not sure what your practice is like with the app. But for a stability practice which is the more common type, I would set a timer and sit with good posture so your skeleton is supporting itself. Focus on your breathing especially within the body. It's important not to meditate from the head but from the body. When your attention wanders and you notice it go back to concentrating on your breathing.
Basically listening what to do - mostly it is focusing on breath. Let go of thoughts. Bodyscan. Well this.
I am not sure why I don't just do it on my own but somehow I dont without a primer
I am not sure why I don't just do it on my own but somehow I dont without a primer
It sounds to me like you will reach a better practice without the app regardless of cost. I would force myself to do it without the app for 20 or 25 minutes, just wait for the timer to go off. Do that a few times and it will get easier. From my experience you will get better results this way as the guides are ultimately a distraction.
You can actually repeat the Basics course infinitely - 10 free sessions. I do one per day, it’s always fresh thanks also in part to the varying “clouds in the sky”.
For beginners, I would recommend two things: ambient noise (with headphones/noise-cancelling works best for me), and a soft alarm for the timer. I used to DIY it, but I find the InsightTimer app is a free & customizable solution filling both these needs.
I use the Chimes tone on my iPhone at a low enough volume. Quite gentle to wake up to after a session of meditation.
I've used apps and various bell tones, but now I generally choose Moonlight Sonata: it's quiet and gentle and beautiful and very gradually drags you out of the place you were.
Oak app on iOS is pretty good for these requirements. It is very minimalistic and does not try to push paid features.
Sure--I recommend whatever gets you to practice every day. If that's an app, then use an app. If it's a book or an in-person class/group or a meditation buddy, use that.
I started with an in-person class and audio guided meditations, and then "graduated" to Insight Timer (just white noise with a bell at the end) once I felt like I was getting the hang of it. In the beginning it felt like the spoken guidance was helpful, then after a while it started to feel like it was distracting me or holding me back, so I stopped using it.
I started with an in-person class and audio guided meditations, and then "graduated" to Insight Timer (just white noise with a bell at the end) once I felt like I was getting the hang of it. In the beginning it felt like the spoken guidance was helpful, then after a while it started to feel like it was distracting me or holding me back, so I stopped using it.
since 2014 I am using Muse https://choosemuse.com/
It helped me.
It helped me.
Yes, I’d recommend Headspace, to start. It makes it EASY, and really breaks down the technique in simple parts! I was arrogant before that and thought I don’t need a “guided” meditation, but I was wrong. I’ve also been using Waking up recently, though that definitely has a steper learning curve. Headspace is like a “elementary school” while waking up is “middle school” in terms of difficulty. I don’t think I would have been able to form a lasting habit had I started with Waking up. Headspace is so well curated. Today I use both- one session per day each.
I haven’t tried Calm and have no opinion it.
I haven’t tried Calm and have no opinion it.
The waking up app was more to my taste personally. I’m not a consistent practitioner however
I’m going to be the contrarian here: no, I do not recommend ever using an app to meditate. Using an app vs simply sitting is (potentially strange analogy here) sort of like being in a restaurant with TV’s vs without. When there’s TV’s, it’s much harder to keep a conversation going because they suck our attention like bugs to a light. Without TV’s, you feel more present, more “there.” Given that, very often, the “point” of meditation (if there is one) is to cultivate a sense of being right here right now, an app seems to me a very uncomfortable and unnecessary middleman.
There is nothing to “do,” no way to make starting “easier.” Just sit, and see what happens, and proceed from there.
There is nothing to “do,” no way to make starting “easier.” Just sit, and see what happens, and proceed from there.
[deleted]
Brain.fm works extremely well.
A simple timer is all you need, and that's of course optional as well.
It is good to provide a bit of structure to your practice, and the duration of the sit is important. To get started, I think it's much better to offload that worry (have I sat long enough? etc.) to a simple timer. Then you just sit until it sounds.
Directed meditation is fine, too. Try it out if you like; it's usually best to try a few approaches and learn from each.
It is good to provide a bit of structure to your practice, and the duration of the sit is important. To get started, I think it's much better to offload that worry (have I sat long enough? etc.) to a simple timer. Then you just sit until it sounds.
Directed meditation is fine, too. Try it out if you like; it's usually best to try a few approaches and learn from each.
Headspace is too bossy.
I have some very good audio [1] guided meditations (in my own language). I guess they're called podcast in popular culture? Not sure, as they're not publicly available.
Anyway, they're from mindfulness teachers. One teacher my partner had, the other one I had. These can absolutely help. It can teach you the methods of the different meditations without further help or reading (though it was recommended to read up on them in a complimentary book). The ones I have also have a friendly, calm voice. One's even specifically for people with autism (I have a diagnosis).
With regards to apps, I'd mind my privacy. I'd rather pay for an audio fragment than that.
I also do yoga weekly which is concluded with a 10-15 min long meditation. My yoga teacher also has a friendly voice. Sometimes I find his visualization techniques rather... flighty? but then I just follow my own flow and ignore him. Doing it in a group has the advantage that you're into it together, but it has the disadvantage that other people can be noisy at times. One guy in my group falls asleep and snores which enforces pressure on staying calm, as it can upset me, but you could consider that part of the exercise.
Anyway, they're from mindfulness teachers. One teacher my partner had, the other one I had. These can absolutely help. It can teach you the methods of the different meditations without further help or reading (though it was recommended to read up on them in a complimentary book). The ones I have also have a friendly, calm voice. One's even specifically for people with autism (I have a diagnosis).
With regards to apps, I'd mind my privacy. I'd rather pay for an audio fragment than that.
I also do yoga weekly which is concluded with a 10-15 min long meditation. My yoga teacher also has a friendly voice. Sometimes I find his visualization techniques rather... flighty? but then I just follow my own flow and ignore him. Doing it in a group has the advantage that you're into it together, but it has the disadvantage that other people can be noisy at times. One guy in my group falls asleep and snores which enforces pressure on staying calm, as it can upset me, but you could consider that part of the exercise.
I. love. Headspace. Life changing.
I've been interested in learning more about meditating and Raja yoga meditation specifically. I hesitate to read the book in parent as it seems that Buddhist meditation is focused on love, compassion, empathy or some kind of goal. I don't think the positive emphasis of Buddhism is bad. Rather I've been more interested in "abstraction of the mind" and the general non-religious approach of raja yoga.
(I am sorry if the previous comparisons are naive/incorrect)
I'd love to know of any western oriented books on Raja yoga, however.
I'd love to know of any western oriented books on Raja yoga, however.
I don't think the first chapters focus on any kind of goal. They were mostly mechanical stuff that would probably apply to any kind of meditative activity.
I haven't really gone beyond the first few chapters. I think the book, if you really want to go with it all along, gives a few years content of practicing for most people.
It's true there's some spiritual content in it, but I was largely ignoring it and it didn't bother me at all.
I haven't really gone beyond the first few chapters. I think the book, if you really want to go with it all along, gives a few years content of practicing for most people.
It's true there's some spiritual content in it, but I was largely ignoring it and it didn't bother me at all.
TMI is pretty secular - the author treats Buddhism more as a source of sophisticated ideas about meditation than a religion with goals that readers should adopt. I think there's a chapter in the appendix about loving-kindness practice but most of it is a non-religious guide to how to meditate. It is focused on the goal of enlightenment, but you can still benefit from it even you're not aiming for that.
>it seems that Buddhist meditation is focused on love, compassion, empathy or some kind of goal.
You may like Mastering the Core Teachings of The Buddha, it ditches all the woo-woo fluff that many people in the US want more than the actual meditation. The book certainly believes enlightenment through meditation is possible (otherwise it'd just be a meditation book with no Buddhist connection). But the author doesn't pull any punches when he shoots down at all the ways people over complicate and brand buddhist meditation as something it's not.
Slate Star Codex review of the book: https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/09/18/book-review-mastering-...
the book: http://integrateddaniel.info/book
You may like Mastering the Core Teachings of The Buddha, it ditches all the woo-woo fluff that many people in the US want more than the actual meditation. The book certainly believes enlightenment through meditation is possible (otherwise it'd just be a meditation book with no Buddhist connection). But the author doesn't pull any punches when he shoots down at all the ways people over complicate and brand buddhist meditation as something it's not.
Slate Star Codex review of the book: https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/09/18/book-review-mastering-...
the book: http://integrateddaniel.info/book
For non-religious, more "empty mind" meditation, you can also look at Zen Buddhism if you haven't already. Zen meditation techniques usually involve focusing on breath or using simple visualizations.
I recommend the book, "Zen mind, beginner's mind" for an introduction to non-religious meditation, written for a western audience.
FWIW, my personal opinion is that meditation is a type of mental training. The specific techniques you should use depends on what you want to train. "Empty mind" meditation is good for training "mental silence", impulse control, and focus. Love meditation trains love, including loving humanity and loving yourself, and shouldn't be underrated. If you have specific goals for self-change, IMO you should use that to create your own "training program" by altering the visualizations used when meditating.
I recommend the book, "Zen mind, beginner's mind" for an introduction to non-religious meditation, written for a western audience.
FWIW, my personal opinion is that meditation is a type of mental training. The specific techniques you should use depends on what you want to train. "Empty mind" meditation is good for training "mental silence", impulse control, and focus. Love meditation trains love, including loving humanity and loving yourself, and shouldn't be underrated. If you have specific goals for self-change, IMO you should use that to create your own "training program" by altering the visualizations used when meditating.
Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind is so wonderful, I highly second this recommendation.
Not related to Yoga, but I'm currently reading "The Mindful Geek" [1]:
The Mindful Geek details how to derive the benefits of mindfulness meditation without having to join a religion or drink metaphysical Kool-Aid.
I've recently started meditating myself using the Headspace app. It's still pretty early for me to say I've seen any benefits though.
[1] https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/26261124-the-mindful-...
The Mindful Geek details how to derive the benefits of mindfulness meditation without having to join a religion or drink metaphysical Kool-Aid.
I've recently started meditating myself using the Headspace app. It's still pretty early for me to say I've seen any benefits though.
[1] https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/26261124-the-mindful-...
I’m so confused about why you’d lift spiritual exercises from a tradition you’re so wary of that you compare the propagation of its metaphysics to the Jonestown massacre
I recommend the book "Inner Engineering". The book is written by a man that goes by the name Sadhguru. He's spent the last 30 or so year spreading classical yoga around the world. He founded the Isha Foundation. They initiate people into classical yogic practices that involve asanas, kriyas, and different types of meditation. The movement has grown a lot of steam in recent years. Recently Sadhguru initiated 5000 people in Australia in an inner engineering mega program. Usually the programs are much smaller and led by teachers that he has trained for several years. I started my journey with Isha a couple of years ago when I found him on YouTube. He has a ton of content. I recommend watching his [Ted talk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rETWfA3Sq8) if you're interested.
To give you a little background about myself, I'm a 27-year-old male software engineer. Before Isha I wasn't religious or spiritual, but I always thought some of the Eastern stuff (buddhism, taoism) I heard sounded interesting. I also had experiences with psychedelics that were very profound to me.
Anyway I found Sadhguru on YouTube one day and everything he was saying just really vibed with me. He's explaining millenia-old yogic ideas in modern terms, and it really resonated with my intellect as well as with my own personal experiences with psychedelics. They talk about nature in terms of space, time, and energy. They talk about the human mechanism and consciousness. They talk about yoga as a method of liberation or enlightenment, the end of suffering.
So then I started going to the programs and doing yoga. I've attended and volunteered at several programs. The people that go to these programs are all regular people like me. Maybe around two thirds are Indian, which makes sense because that's where yoga originated and where Sadhguru is from. I've met other engineers, physicians, professors, businessmen, etc. I would say that the common factor among all of us is that we each have a desire to have some deeper understanding of life, so we are willing to listen to Sadhguru and try out yoga.
It's been an awesome journey. Sadhguru and his foundation have had a huge effect on my life, and I'm very thankful for it.
To give you a little background about myself, I'm a 27-year-old male software engineer. Before Isha I wasn't religious or spiritual, but I always thought some of the Eastern stuff (buddhism, taoism) I heard sounded interesting. I also had experiences with psychedelics that were very profound to me.
Anyway I found Sadhguru on YouTube one day and everything he was saying just really vibed with me. He's explaining millenia-old yogic ideas in modern terms, and it really resonated with my intellect as well as with my own personal experiences with psychedelics. They talk about nature in terms of space, time, and energy. They talk about the human mechanism and consciousness. They talk about yoga as a method of liberation or enlightenment, the end of suffering.
So then I started going to the programs and doing yoga. I've attended and volunteered at several programs. The people that go to these programs are all regular people like me. Maybe around two thirds are Indian, which makes sense because that's where yoga originated and where Sadhguru is from. I've met other engineers, physicians, professors, businessmen, etc. I would say that the common factor among all of us is that we each have a desire to have some deeper understanding of life, so we are willing to listen to Sadhguru and try out yoga.
It's been an awesome journey. Sadhguru and his foundation have had a huge effect on my life, and I'm very thankful for it.
I second this. I have been practicing Isha's meditation technique 'Shambhavi' which I learnt at Inner Engineering program. No matter what, I set aside 45-60 mins everyday for doing basic yoga and meditation for the last 5 months.
Firstly, daily yoga made me very aware of my posture(work/excercise/sports) and it has helped me gain discipline in life.
Secondly, the inner peace after meditating lasts very long and it mellows down my entire day. I am more aware of my emotions and thoughts. I am very grateful for this.
Second this. I've never binge watched anything on Youtube like Sadhguru videos. You can search for "Sadhguru <just about any kind of difficult life problem>" and he has a take on it that brings you deeper than the one dimensional way you were thinking about it in the first place.
There is also the simpler "Isha Kria" guided meditation available online:
https://www.youtube.com/embed/K4hCvdDn7Zc (important introduction)
https://www.youtube.com/embed/wHnl_XugJyE (instructions and guided meditation).
I practised this twice a day for about 2 months before completing the Inner Engineering program and it was a very good experience. I have now switched to Shambavi but that takes longer and comes with more strict practice conditions.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/K4hCvdDn7Zc (important introduction)
https://www.youtube.com/embed/wHnl_XugJyE (instructions and guided meditation).
I practised this twice a day for about 2 months before completing the Inner Engineering program and it was a very good experience. I have now switched to Shambavi but that takes longer and comes with more strict practice conditions.
> I recommend the book "Inner Engineering".
The book does not teach anything. It's largely an upsell to Sadhguru's cultish meditation programmes.
Meditation instructions in the book are something like: a) pay attention to your heartbeat, or your breath, or your little finger for 11 minutes three times a day, b) eat less food, mostly raw, c) draw mandalas on the floor and place a ghee lamp in it and notice how the energy of the room subtly changes. This is a joke, right? It reads like somebody who doesn't know anything about meditation is lampooning meditation.
Sadhguru himself is an aspiring cult leader who teaches pseudoscentific twaddle like drinking happy water (because he claims water carries emotional memory [1]), how he can trap evil spirits in boxes with obscure tantric rituals (like Ghostbusters), encountering the frozen spirits of Native American soldiers in a forest [2], etc. He also claims his wife died by attaining Mahasamadhi [3] (allegedly you can meditate really hard and make your soul leave your body). Regardless of the murder charge, having to believe this nonsense to get with his programme seems hardly worth it.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6C1p4HUHlfE
[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBKvFnABpcA
[3] https://ksmphanindra.wordpress.com/2017/11/02/the-controvers...
The book does not teach anything. It's largely an upsell to Sadhguru's cultish meditation programmes.
Meditation instructions in the book are something like: a) pay attention to your heartbeat, or your breath, or your little finger for 11 minutes three times a day, b) eat less food, mostly raw, c) draw mandalas on the floor and place a ghee lamp in it and notice how the energy of the room subtly changes. This is a joke, right? It reads like somebody who doesn't know anything about meditation is lampooning meditation.
Sadhguru himself is an aspiring cult leader who teaches pseudoscentific twaddle like drinking happy water (because he claims water carries emotional memory [1]), how he can trap evil spirits in boxes with obscure tantric rituals (like Ghostbusters), encountering the frozen spirits of Native American soldiers in a forest [2], etc. He also claims his wife died by attaining Mahasamadhi [3] (allegedly you can meditate really hard and make your soul leave your body). Regardless of the murder charge, having to believe this nonsense to get with his programme seems hardly worth it.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6C1p4HUHlfE
[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBKvFnABpcA
[3] https://ksmphanindra.wordpress.com/2017/11/02/the-controvers...
For an Analytical Approach to the study of the Mind based on Patanjali Raja Yoga, you might find the following helpful;
* Yoga and Western Psychology: A Comparison by Geraldine Coster - https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.189086/page/n1 - This is an old book so the "psychology" part might be outdated but nevertheless the approach taken to look at Raja Yoga as Practical Applied Psychology is something i believe is the correct way.
* Samkhya Darshan: Yogic Perspective on Theories of Realism by Swami Niranjananda Saraswati - https://www.amazon.com/Samkhya-Darshan-Perspective-Theories-... - The model of the mind in Raja Yoga is based on the earlier Samkhya Philosophy. The "Mind" is considered a layered model with layers called "Mahat, Buddhi, Ahamkara, Manas etc." This book is one of the best on Samkhya.
* Yoga and Western Psychology: A Comparison by Geraldine Coster - https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.189086/page/n1 - This is an old book so the "psychology" part might be outdated but nevertheless the approach taken to look at Raja Yoga as Practical Applied Psychology is something i believe is the correct way.
* Samkhya Darshan: Yogic Perspective on Theories of Realism by Swami Niranjananda Saraswati - https://www.amazon.com/Samkhya-Darshan-Perspective-Theories-... - The model of the mind in Raja Yoga is based on the earlier Samkhya Philosophy. The "Mind" is considered a layered model with layers called "Mahat, Buddhi, Ahamkara, Manas etc." This book is one of the best on Samkhya.
> I try to meditate every morning for about 15 minutes and been doing that for quite some time now.
I find that doing any Self-Imposed Daily Challenging Healthy Activity will improve your life tremendously, meditation being just one type of SIDCHA.
While the benefits differ slightly, the magnitude of benefit from other SIDCHAs -- like exercising, drawing a picture, writing a blog post, writing three business ideas, cooking a meal from scratch, etc every day -- can be just as great. You develop discipline, ability to overcome internal resistance, self-awareness, etc.
I'm a big fan and practitioner of SIDCHAs and wrote them up: http://joshuaspodek.com/sidchas-the-series.
I find that doing any Self-Imposed Daily Challenging Healthy Activity will improve your life tremendously, meditation being just one type of SIDCHA.
While the benefits differ slightly, the magnitude of benefit from other SIDCHAs -- like exercising, drawing a picture, writing a blog post, writing three business ideas, cooking a meal from scratch, etc every day -- can be just as great. You develop discipline, ability to overcome internal resistance, self-awareness, etc.
I'm a big fan and practitioner of SIDCHAs and wrote them up: http://joshuaspodek.com/sidchas-the-series.
Thanks for you feedback! I'll have a look at that.
I love the approach of digging into the underlying pattern rather than fixating on the details of the routine.
I used to struggle with Agile and daily standups at $JOB until I started keeping a private journal daily. Now I have several years of daily notes across several jobs that I can refer back to and use for reflection, avoiding common pitfalls, revisiting particularly difficult challenges with a different perspective. The most valuable entries I have beyond technical details or company idiosyncrasies are about arguments I've gotten into or interpersonal dynamics I've noticed.
The biggest benefit I've noticed is that I feel much more resilient to both stress and change, and I don't sink near as much time and effort into distractions or rabbit holes. Random ideas get written down and set aside for monthly review and I can get back to work.
I used to struggle with Agile and daily standups at $JOB until I started keeping a private journal daily. Now I have several years of daily notes across several jobs that I can refer back to and use for reflection, avoiding common pitfalls, revisiting particularly difficult challenges with a different perspective. The most valuable entries I have beyond technical details or company idiosyncrasies are about arguments I've gotten into or interpersonal dynamics I've noticed.
The biggest benefit I've noticed is that I feel much more resilient to both stress and change, and I don't sink near as much time and effort into distractions or rabbit holes. Random ideas get written down and set aside for monthly review and I can get back to work.
It sounds like you do something more comprehensive, but I thought I'd share my experience with journaling at work.
I pretty much try to write (with pen and paper) for 10 minutes a day to sort my thoughts out and figure out what do focus on, perhaps think about what has affected my performance lately (good and bad, to do more of the good and get less of the bad). Occasionally, I'll stop doing it for periods of time, until I notice that my recent work has started to seem less effective.
The 10 minutes of writing increases the chance that I'll feel like I've accomplished something by the end of the day by like 200%. So you'd think I'd never skip it, but of course, when actually doing it, it feels like wasting 10 minutes at any given time, so sometimes, I just don't.
I pretty much try to write (with pen and paper) for 10 minutes a day to sort my thoughts out and figure out what do focus on, perhaps think about what has affected my performance lately (good and bad, to do more of the good and get less of the bad). Occasionally, I'll stop doing it for periods of time, until I notice that my recent work has started to seem less effective.
The 10 minutes of writing increases the chance that I'll feel like I've accomplished something by the end of the day by like 200%. So you'd think I'd never skip it, but of course, when actually doing it, it feels like wasting 10 minutes at any given time, so sometimes, I just don't.
“I find that doing any Self-Imposed Daily Challenging Healthy Activity will improve your life tremendously, meditation being just one type of SIDCHA.”
That’s how I feel about diets too. Most people have such terrible nutrition that almost any diet will make things better because it gives people some structure around eating habits.
That’s how I feel about diets too. Most people have such terrible nutrition that almost any diet will make things better because it gives people some structure around eating habits.
Well, not sure if this is related to the actual topic (meditation), but I would agree with this.
For the last one month, I have been sticking to intermittent fasting (16:8) and giving up on sugar entirely and redcuded carb intake to very small amounts.
Can say that the diet is almost keto although I think I do go over the 30gm of prescribed carbs. However I do notably experience the metallic taste in mouth regularly indicating ketosis.
I have noticed...
- Drop in anxiety
- Improved self confidence
- Goes without saying, lost about 5/6 kg weight
To me it seems like this is a permanent lifestyle change which I look forward to continue with.
For the last one month, I have been sticking to intermittent fasting (16:8) and giving up on sugar entirely and redcuded carb intake to very small amounts.
Can say that the diet is almost keto although I think I do go over the 30gm of prescribed carbs. However I do notably experience the metallic taste in mouth regularly indicating ketosis.
I have noticed...
- Drop in anxiety
- Improved self confidence
- Goes without saying, lost about 5/6 kg weight
To me it seems like this is a permanent lifestyle change which I look forward to continue with.
>“ While the benefits differ slightly, the magnitude of benefit from other SIDCHAs -- like exercising, drawing a picture, writing a blog post, writing three business ideas, cooking a meal from scratch, etc every day -- can be just as great.“
I’m not sure how you can equate meditations benefits to drawing pictures, or writing three business ideas. They are fundamentally different activities that produce vastly different outcomes, some being much more valuable.
In the case of meditation it’s the ability to pause the incessant thinking mind, glean insights into the nature of consciousness and be able to enter the present moment more frequently. Those things alone are worth far more than being able to draw pretty pictures or bench your body weight.
I’m not sure how you can equate meditations benefits to drawing pictures, or writing three business ideas. They are fundamentally different activities that produce vastly different outcomes, some being much more valuable.
In the case of meditation it’s the ability to pause the incessant thinking mind, glean insights into the nature of consciousness and be able to enter the present moment more frequently. Those things alone are worth far more than being able to draw pretty pictures or bench your body weight.
Meditation may have specific benefits. But having a fit body and knowing how to draw, write or cook is also nice.
But the important common part is that you take steps to better your life. Even activities that have no proven benefits by themselves such as magic rituals, "alternative medicine", prayer, etc... can work.
The idea is that such activities can create a positive chain of events: you going to the gym, your training calls for better nutrition so you eat better, you also sleep better and the workout schedule can impose a healthy work/life balance. You may want to start meditation to improve your focus.
With meditation you realize your body doesn't feel well so you eat better, sleep better, that pause helps you maintain a good work/life balance. You may even consider exercising.
Notice the recurring themes. Once you are in a self improvement mindset things start to support themselves.
But the important common part is that you take steps to better your life. Even activities that have no proven benefits by themselves such as magic rituals, "alternative medicine", prayer, etc... can work.
The idea is that such activities can create a positive chain of events: you going to the gym, your training calls for better nutrition so you eat better, you also sleep better and the workout schedule can impose a healthy work/life balance. You may want to start meditation to improve your focus.
With meditation you realize your body doesn't feel well so you eat better, sleep better, that pause helps you maintain a good work/life balance. You may even consider exercising.
Notice the recurring themes. Once you are in a self improvement mindset things start to support themselves.
The issue I take is saying the benefits differ slightly.
It's difficult for me to appreciate the equivalent benefits of being able to draw nice pictures vs having mastery over ones mind.
It's difficult for me to appreciate the equivalent benefits of being able to draw nice pictures vs having mastery over ones mind.
I wrote a post about just this topic: http://joshuaspodek.com/choice-sidcha-isnt-important. It has a bunch of pictures or I'd copy it here, but the upshot is that more value comes from doing something self-imposed healthy and active every day than from the specific activity.
In my experience, a lot of mental mastery comes from discipline, focus, dedication, and such from consistently overcoming challenges.
From how you characterize creating art as drawing "nice pictures", I suspect you might underestimate the value of artistic self-expression, fitness, and other things, but I might be misinterpreting.
In my experience, a lot of mental mastery comes from discipline, focus, dedication, and such from consistently overcoming challenges.
From how you characterize creating art as drawing "nice pictures", I suspect you might underestimate the value of artistic self-expression, fitness, and other things, but I might be misinterpreting.
The one that you missed, and that works incredibly well to give me a good day, is practicing a musical instrument.
Hindu sages have advocated meditating for thousands of years, they do this in a specific time called Brahmamuhurtha in the morning when its most potent. Its the same sages that promote Yoga and Ayurveda
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahmamuhurtha
It won't be long before the West I hope catches onto the next phase which is learning about Mudras - kind of an accupressure to target certain nerves.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahmamuhurtha
It won't be long before the West I hope catches onto the next phase which is learning about Mudras - kind of an accupressure to target certain nerves.
> It won't be long before the West I hope catches onto the next phase which is learning about Mudras - kind of an accupressure to target certain nerves.
Mudras are awesome! I discovered them accidentally because I'd get spots on my fingers that felt "heavy" and would make me jerk and shiver when touched.
Pressing them can clear the tension, but it's always a temporary relief. If I can shiver then the energy release is much better.
I've tried various mudras but not known what to expect from them, or how best to use them. And never seen an explanation (or anyone else) experiencing what I do.
Mudras are awesome! I discovered them accidentally because I'd get spots on my fingers that felt "heavy" and would make me jerk and shiver when touched.
Pressing them can clear the tension, but it's always a temporary relief. If I can shiver then the energy release is much better.
I've tried various mudras but not known what to expect from them, or how best to use them. And never seen an explanation (or anyone else) experiencing what I do.
Western psychotherapy has developed a specific ritual for activating this kind of shivering focused on releasing traumatic energy. It's called a TRE (Trauma Release Exercise) and particularly when done in the presence of someone who can help guide through energetic blocks, I've found it to be a transformative experience.
https://traumaprevention.com/
https://traumaprevention.com/
As alanberg says, go for a indian qualified teacher, people do yoga retreats for this stuff in India. Or ask a pandit at a Hindu temple
The Mudras are also specific yoga asanas, which are often referred to as poses or exercises in the west. These Mudras are an advanced practice and should be done with the guidance of a qualified teacher.
Absolutely
Good start. It becomes even more beneficial with more time and by learning from a real live person.
My life has improved dramatically doing TM for the last 15 years.
I have been meditating 20 years now (zazen). I do 2-4 hours a day. Several 7 day retreats per year.
My starting motivation was philosophical and academic interest. I was curious how it affects the mind. Then I did it because it seemed so hard to do, mind seemed like a buggy device I had no control over. I also had self improvement goals at some point. And feeling balanced is a good feeling.
But there is no way I can justify the amount of time I spend meditating with any of those. Meditation teachers say that first you start to work with meditation, then it starts to work with you. The whole view of the world changes.
I'm completely secular humanist but meditation has turned into spiritual practice. If I worship something, it's this moment. Asking why I meditate is like asking why people go surfing. Staying in the moment and balancing on the wave between the past and the future is not a activity you do for gaining any other goals. Being alive and experiencing the raw existence is something you sacrifice other things in your life.
My starting motivation was philosophical and academic interest. I was curious how it affects the mind. Then I did it because it seemed so hard to do, mind seemed like a buggy device I had no control over. I also had self improvement goals at some point. And feeling balanced is a good feeling.
But there is no way I can justify the amount of time I spend meditating with any of those. Meditation teachers say that first you start to work with meditation, then it starts to work with you. The whole view of the world changes.
I'm completely secular humanist but meditation has turned into spiritual practice. If I worship something, it's this moment. Asking why I meditate is like asking why people go surfing. Staying in the moment and balancing on the wave between the past and the future is not a activity you do for gaining any other goals. Being alive and experiencing the raw existence is something you sacrifice other things in your life.
how do you find the time - sorry for asking personal questions but do you work full time, what about kids stuff?
I try but unable to consistently commit more than 20 min on an off.
I work part time. I work in a small company that is very accommodating.
It seems relatively common that people who work full time can do 2 hours if that's really what they want to do. You cut down other activities, like watching Netflix etc.
It seems relatively common that people who work full time can do 2 hours if that's really what they want to do. You cut down other activities, like watching Netflix etc.
Thanks, hope to get inspired by you and progress with practice.
how did you start? did you take a course?
I did first six months Vipassana. Mindfulness in Plain English by Ven. Henepola Gunaratana is absolute classic. https://www.vipassana.com/meditation/mindfulness_in_plain_en...
Then I traveled around a little bit and visited zen monastery and started to train there with a teacher.
Then I traveled around a little bit and visited zen monastery and started to train there with a teacher.
> I do 2-4 hours a day.
Just reading this gave me anxiety.
Just reading this gave me anxiety.
What is this anxiety? Does it come from the fear of non-existence? I will be dead some day, and I surely don't want to spend my limited existence staring into the void. Gotta keep moving!
On the right time scales, is there even any difference between "staring into the void" or "moving"?
What difference will it make anyways after you're dead?
What difference will it make anyways after you're dead?
Start small then, just 10, minutes or even 5. Anything is infinitely better than nothing.
I knock out 30 minute sittings daily. I wish I a) had that kind of time to devote and b) had the wherewithal to regularly sit that much. All-day sesshin is a killer for me after about two sittings.
I do 4 minutes a day and find it good. 2 minutes just trying to blank my mind and 2 visualising nice stuff.
The point is to keep your mind focused on one still thought. Letting your mind wander around won't do much. Complexity of the thought should match your ability. Lam-rim says that more short meditations is better than one long meditation. Ideally, one would meditate 16 times a day. And again, the whole point is to stay focused on one thought.
> I do 2-4 hours a day. Several 7 day retreats per year.
I did the same in my 20s, but then slowly, my interest in sitting for hours a day, long retreats, faded. Not sure why, the experience itself is obviously deep, but it became a kind of attachment like coffee, and gradually I returned to the world.
> If I worship something, it's this moment
Wonderfully put.
May I ask, if you didn't sit, would this moment cease? Put differently, without practice would something be lost?
I did the same in my 20s, but then slowly, my interest in sitting for hours a day, long retreats, faded. Not sure why, the experience itself is obviously deep, but it became a kind of attachment like coffee, and gradually I returned to the world.
> If I worship something, it's this moment
Wonderfully put.
May I ask, if you didn't sit, would this moment cease? Put differently, without practice would something be lost?
You can learn to make your whole day a meditation, so that sitting becomes a way of strengthening your practice.
I can testify to the benefits of meditation
When I don't meditate, I feel restless, I doubt myself more and always feel empty.
After meditating, I feel at peace.
And I only meditate once every 15days.
Meditation also helped me reverse acid reflux.
When I don't meditate, I feel restless, I doubt myself more and always feel empty.
After meditating, I feel at peace.
And I only meditate once every 15days.
Meditation also helped me reverse acid reflux.
I have the habit now of meditation for 1 hour each morning and then for 20-30 minutes before laying my head to pillow. It's really helpful to me to get myself in a space to start a productive day and end it with a good relaxing sleep. I usually get 4.5 to 5.5 hours each night. Up at 4:30am without an alarm and to bed by 11-midnight usually.
I attended a 10 day silent meditation retreat last year and it really had an impact of my technique and focus along with realizing my life is what I indeed make of it.
If anyone wants to start meditating, start slow. maybe just 10 minutes of trying to do basic breathing exercises.
I attended a 10 day silent meditation retreat last year and it really had an impact of my technique and focus along with realizing my life is what I indeed make of it.
If anyone wants to start meditating, start slow. maybe just 10 minutes of trying to do basic breathing exercises.
4.5 to 5.5 hours sounds ridiculously low. I thought humans need at least 8 hours of sleep to function well? Have you tried sleeping for longer and if you did, what difference did it make to your wellbeing?
Everybody is different, but 4.5 hours feels pretty low.
I'd be tempted to trade my hour of mediation for another hour of sleep.
I'd be tempted to trade my hour of mediation for another hour of sleep.
Sleep is indeed important. Especially if you need it. By comparison my wife requires 8-10 hours each night.
Many people find that meditation reduces their need to sleep. A few months ago when I was meditating for around 1.5 hours per day (a mixture of walking and formal sitting meditation) I felt well rested on 5.5 to 6.5 hours of sleep, when my normal needs are 7.5 - 8 hours
Sometimes when I have insomnia I sort of daydream instead of sleeping. When I get up, I am more rested than the 3-4 hours or actual sleep would suggest. I had wondered if the daydreaming was similar enough to sleep to be a poor substitute
I find the opposite. On the nights where I dream a lot, I do not wake up well rested. The best rest I get is when you fall asleep, next moment open your eyes, and it's morning. But I haven't had much of that kind of sleep since I was a kid.
Apparently a non trivial percent of the population gets by with 5-6 hours due to having a certain gene. I had assumed it was quite rare, but found out that I know several of them.
They are more awake during the day than I am.
They are more awake during the day than I am.
It is weird to say hi to my co-workers in the morning and they are all yawning and sucking down coffee, saying how tired they are. I just grin and realize I got around 1/2 the amount of sleep and drove 1.5 hours to work and not a drop of coffee has touched my lips.
actually, I'm older now than I used to be. (42) As a child, teenager, early 20's, etc I used to only get 3 hours each night. I spend my nights reading books, coding, etc. I have been told that this was really hard on my parents and grandparents as they didn't expect a child to need so little sleep.
Edit typo corrected 2 to 3.
Edit typo corrected 2 to 3.
I meditate 20 minutes twice a day and struggle to stay asleep for 8 hours. i am normally up after 6 hours sleep
10 minutes of guided meditation per day is the only non-medical option that helps my ADHD other than removing caffeine and getting more sleep.
It's insane how little I need to feel much more in control of my thoughts.
It's insane how little I need to feel much more in control of my thoughts.
I dropped my scrip when I realized a long morning sit has about the same effect but without the side effects of stimulants - which were considerable. Not to get down on stimulants, those can be amazing drugs.
I've tried in the past, but I wonder: how do you know if you've successfully meditated or not?
So in the kind of meditating he's talking about, you sit there focusing on your breath. When you notice your thoughts doing something else, you non-judgementally bring them back to your breath.
That's it. If you're doing it, you're succesfully meditating. It doesn't matter how often your thoughts go somewhere else, or for how long before you notice. No matter, if when you notice you focus on the breath, you're doing it successfully. Really, that's the whole thing.
If you're just starting out, you might find some introduction guidance helpful, either from an online video or app (there are many, OP mentions a couple), or from someone in person (If there's a Shambala temple in your area, they probably have intro to meditation sessions; there are other options).
That's it. If you're doing it, you're succesfully meditating. It doesn't matter how often your thoughts go somewhere else, or for how long before you notice. No matter, if when you notice you focus on the breath, you're doing it successfully. Really, that's the whole thing.
If you're just starting out, you might find some introduction guidance helpful, either from an online video or app (there are many, OP mentions a couple), or from someone in person (If there's a Shambala temple in your area, they probably have intro to meditation sessions; there are other options).
(It can be "hard" to do because it can be an uncomfortable or "boring" thing to do, that you don't really want to do. But if you just do it anyway, it's "easy", it doesn't take any skill, anybody can do it, you just have to do it. It is sort of a kind of exersize for your mind, like going to the gym for your mind. You are practicing: a) noticing what your mind is doing, self-reflection in the moment; and b) directing your attention).
Compare it to going for a walk. How do you know if you've gone for a walk successfully?
Did you walk a mile or ten?
Did you walk slowly or quickly?
Did you stumble or stride firmly?
Whatever happened, you went for walk.
Meditation is just as simple. Sit and focus on your breath. That's really all there is too it.
Did you walk a mile or ten?
Did you walk slowly or quickly?
Did you stumble or stride firmly?
Whatever happened, you went for walk.
Meditation is just as simple. Sit and focus on your breath. That's really all there is too it.
I agree with the other responses you've got, but to make this point explicit: each meditation session is an exercise. Any definition of "success" has to be in the long term. If you're having a rough day, sitting calmly and breathing is going to help in the moment, of course. But the ongoing practice and its spillover into awareness in daily life is the goal. And, like learning any new skill, you can't necessarily see that development day-to-day, just in retrospect over months.
I also posted this the other day, about "failing" at the exercise: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20675811
I also posted this the other day, about "failing" at the exercise: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20675811
Act itself is a success because like many healthy activities you don’t get the results right away. Do it for 2 weeks and you will see the results.
Approaching meditation as a goal to be completed according to some measurable standard is orthogonal to many traditions of meditation.
There are techniques, such as observing your breath, thoughts, emotions, and/or somatic sensations.
Depending on a multitude of factors, our capacity to maintain this level of observation and awareness will vary. Another part of the technique is, when you notice that you've strayed from your point of observation, is to meta-notice that noticing, and gently return to the foci of observation. If you never do that, you still haven't failed. There is no failure, and there is no success -- the path is the goal.
Other techniques simply invite you to sit or lay in a comfortable position (e.g. be careful of attempting to fit your body into one of the classical meditation poses, it's more important to find something that you are truly comfortable being in for 15 - 60 minutes at a time), and "do nothing" at all, to simply Be. This is perhaps one of the most somatically oriented forms. No technique is the highest form of technique.
After all, when you haven't had any thoughts for some period of time, can you remember that specific period? How would you actually know? Other than perhaps remembering when it vaguely began, and when that period ended by the re-emergence of mental content?
There are techniques, such as observing your breath, thoughts, emotions, and/or somatic sensations.
Depending on a multitude of factors, our capacity to maintain this level of observation and awareness will vary. Another part of the technique is, when you notice that you've strayed from your point of observation, is to meta-notice that noticing, and gently return to the foci of observation. If you never do that, you still haven't failed. There is no failure, and there is no success -- the path is the goal.
Other techniques simply invite you to sit or lay in a comfortable position (e.g. be careful of attempting to fit your body into one of the classical meditation poses, it's more important to find something that you are truly comfortable being in for 15 - 60 minutes at a time), and "do nothing" at all, to simply Be. This is perhaps one of the most somatically oriented forms. No technique is the highest form of technique.
After all, when you haven't had any thoughts for some period of time, can you remember that specific period? How would you actually know? Other than perhaps remembering when it vaguely began, and when that period ended by the re-emergence of mental content?
Whenever I hear about a particular technique that is supposedly backed by evidence I wonder what specific protocol was used in the studies supporting it. I also wonder how many studies have been conducted and for how many years.
For those of you who want an actual evidence-based practice check out Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction (MBSR). It's the most frequently studied protocol and it's been studied for decades. When you read stories about studies showing how meditation does XYZ and ABC, it's almost always MBSR that the researchers are using.
"Meditation" is a huge category, there's a lot of stuff in there. Some of it probably works, a lot of it doesn't (other than the placebo effect).
What you think of as "meditation" may not be what actually has been researched in a given study.
Of course, all of the above is only applicable to those of you who want to pursue evidence-based techniques. If you're just satisfied with trying stuff you read about on random blogs and HN posts then go ahead and try anything: prayer, astrology, witchcraft, etc - you'll probably realize a little positive benefit as long as you genuinely believe it will work.
For those of you who want an actual evidence-based practice check out Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction (MBSR). It's the most frequently studied protocol and it's been studied for decades. When you read stories about studies showing how meditation does XYZ and ABC, it's almost always MBSR that the researchers are using.
"Meditation" is a huge category, there's a lot of stuff in there. Some of it probably works, a lot of it doesn't (other than the placebo effect).
What you think of as "meditation" may not be what actually has been researched in a given study.
Of course, all of the above is only applicable to those of you who want to pursue evidence-based techniques. If you're just satisfied with trying stuff you read about on random blogs and HN posts then go ahead and try anything: prayer, astrology, witchcraft, etc - you'll probably realize a little positive benefit as long as you genuinely believe it will work.
For those interested in evidence based meditation for treating mental illness, I suggest the following video and book.
The mindful way through depression: Zindel Segal at TEDxUTSC https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1A4w3W94ygA The book that the talk is based on: https://www.amazon.com/Mindful-Way-Through-Depression-Unhapp...
The mindful way through depression: Zindel Segal at TEDxUTSC https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1A4w3W94ygA The book that the talk is based on: https://www.amazon.com/Mindful-Way-Through-Depression-Unhapp...
Why would you need studies ? It's not like trying to introduce a new medication on the market.
If I like knitting 30 mins a day and I feel relaxed after that I'm not going to wait for a study to tell me it's actually making me feel better or not.
Because it may be harmful.
See for example the idea of giving people involved in road traffic accidents a bit of psychological therapy afterwards.
That seems like it'd help, and most people would say that it can't hurt, but when you look at the people 3 years later we see the group randomised to talking therapy have worse outcomes than the group randomised to no talking therapy.
(I'll try to find a reference).
Here's the reference: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/10974967/
See for example the idea of giving people involved in road traffic accidents a bit of psychological therapy afterwards.
That seems like it'd help, and most people would say that it can't hurt, but when you look at the people 3 years later we see the group randomised to talking therapy have worse outcomes than the group randomised to no talking therapy.
(I'll try to find a reference).
Here's the reference: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/10974967/
Which may only generalize to a specific group of people, in a specific country, at a specific period of time. All subject to change when we tweak a couple of variables.
That point, while valid, is only against this study; it doesn't speak to studies in general.
If we're speaking in the context of social sciences I would say it applies to nearly all of them.
Possibly. While I'm definitely sympathetic to the idea that social science (at least as it's actually practiced) is relatively soft, I don't know how we'd go about discounting it all. Seems to me like we'd be throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
At the very least, I don't know what we could do differently, short of improving the practice of social science in various ways. The questions it would purport to investigate (i.e. social questions) are of course critical questions, but I'm not sure how we'd better answer them. More specifically, I'm not sure how we'd better answer them now. Sure, maybe if we had some Grand Unified Theory or even sufficiently sophisticated computer models. But we don't have those. (In the case where we did have them, it seems almost tautological that social science as such would have participated in their creation--but I digress.) What we've got now are social questions worth asking, and an admittedly imperfect practice of answering those questions. What do we do now?
At the very least, I don't know what we could do differently, short of improving the practice of social science in various ways. The questions it would purport to investigate (i.e. social questions) are of course critical questions, but I'm not sure how we'd better answer them. More specifically, I'm not sure how we'd better answer them now. Sure, maybe if we had some Grand Unified Theory or even sufficiently sophisticated computer models. But we don't have those. (In the case where we did have them, it seems almost tautological that social science as such would have participated in their creation--but I digress.) What we've got now are social questions worth asking, and an admittedly imperfect practice of answering those questions. What do we do now?
We realize that scientific studies that are in the social sciences may only generalize to a specific group of people, in a specific country, at a specific period of time. All subject to change when we tweak a couple of variables.
The counter argument would be- just because you enjoy knitting 30 minutes a day and it relaxes you, does that mean it will work the same for anyone/everyone else?
If there was a study that empirically proved knitting for 30 days made you happier, then it would be a lot easier for people to say "OK, I'll take the time to learn how to do this and do it for X amount of the day".
Given that I still see your point. No reason to be so skeptical, just try out meditation and if it works great if not oh well.
If there was a study that empirically proved knitting for 30 days made you happier, then it would be a lot easier for people to say "OK, I'll take the time to learn how to do this and do it for X amount of the day".
Given that I still see your point. No reason to be so skeptical, just try out meditation and if it works great if not oh well.
Why do you need studies to give you permission to do something?
Particularly when science is facing a crisis of reproducibility, I would not put so much emphasis on them. It’s really no different than the religious dogma of previous centuries, where scientists act as priests, and scientific studies as scripture.
Particularly when science is facing a crisis of reproducibility, I would not put so much emphasis on them. It’s really no different than the religious dogma of previous centuries, where scientists act as priests, and scientific studies as scripture.
>Why do you need studies to give you permission to do something?
No one said that.
>Particularly when science is facing a crisis of reproducibility, I would not put so much emphasis on them
Err.. science is facing a crisis of reproducibility? Excuse me? If you can't reproduce something- that means you haven't proved it scientifically, thus the science is telling you that it can't tell you anything.
>It’s really no different than the religious dogma of previous centuries, where scientists act as priests, and scientific studies as scripture.
Ok now, hold up. You are saying scientific studies is the same as religious dogma....? Do you honestly need me or someone to explain to you the difference?
No one said that.
>Particularly when science is facing a crisis of reproducibility, I would not put so much emphasis on them
Err.. science is facing a crisis of reproducibility? Excuse me? If you can't reproduce something- that means you haven't proved it scientifically, thus the science is telling you that it can't tell you anything.
>It’s really no different than the religious dogma of previous centuries, where scientists act as priests, and scientific studies as scripture.
Ok now, hold up. You are saying scientific studies is the same as religious dogma....? Do you honestly need me or someone to explain to you the difference?
2/3rd of social sciences cannot be replicated [1]. 52% of scientists think there is a significant reproducibility crisis [2] If that doesn't signal a reproducibility crisis I don't know what does.
Dogma is dogma, no matter the origin. Many people who are today dogmatic about the scientific method, would be the same people that would be dogmatic about religion in the 16th century. At the end of the day it is merely one lens of looking at reality, not the only lens. This isn't even touching on the fact that the scientific method is riddled with issues and ill equipped to tackle certain problems. Paul Feyerabend explores this nuanced issue in Against Method, which I recommend reading if you ever want to take off the pro-scientific method spectacles [3]
[1] https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/08/27/6422183... [2] https://www.nature.com/news/1-500-scientists-lift-the-lid-on... [3] https://www.amazon.com/Against-Method-Paul-Feyerabend/dp/184...
Dogma is dogma, no matter the origin. Many people who are today dogmatic about the scientific method, would be the same people that would be dogmatic about religion in the 16th century. At the end of the day it is merely one lens of looking at reality, not the only lens. This isn't even touching on the fact that the scientific method is riddled with issues and ill equipped to tackle certain problems. Paul Feyerabend explores this nuanced issue in Against Method, which I recommend reading if you ever want to take off the pro-scientific method spectacles [3]
[1] https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/08/27/6422183... [2] https://www.nature.com/news/1-500-scientists-lift-the-lid-on... [3] https://www.amazon.com/Against-Method-Paul-Feyerabend/dp/184...
Well I don't think the argument is that you need academic justification before implementing something in your own life. Obviously not the case.
But at the same time, for people like myself, who are surrounded by people offering millions of self-reported miracle-cures, I have to ignore the vast majority of self-reported and look to systematic study as a way to find reliable patterns when decided what to try with my limited time.
But at the same time, for people like myself, who are surrounded by people offering millions of self-reported miracle-cures, I have to ignore the vast majority of self-reported and look to systematic study as a way to find reliable patterns when decided what to try with my limited time.
MBSR is well studied and proven, but it’s worth noting that meditation has only recently become an area of medical research. If we insisted on the rule that we only try what is proven through research, meditation would have “gone extinct” thousands of years ago and nobody would benefit from it today
I began meditating every day after I wake up four years ago and it has been the most beneficial change I ever introduced into my life, quitting cannabis securing a stable second place.
I began with five min and worked my way up to 15. Now I have an iOS shortcut “hey Siri, start meditation” which sets a timer randomly between 15 and 20 min to counteract the body clock expectation of a fixed duration.
I began with five min and worked my way up to 15. Now I have an iOS shortcut “hey Siri, start meditation” which sets a timer randomly between 15 and 20 min to counteract the body clock expectation of a fixed duration.
You mentioned quitting cannabis. If you don't mind elaborating, I'm curious what benefits you have experienced and why you ended up quitting. Thanks!
Ex cannabis user here, so I thought I'd give you my empirical perspective & and opinion.
I will tell you what I would tell my own child:
Cannabis, like any recreational drug, steals the most precious resource we have: our time. I've been on benders in my life that I simply can not remember what I did during that period, sure, but that's not what I'm talking about.
What I am talking about is the time any person needs to become a well adjusted, functioning adult. When you are taking a recreational drug, you are not dealing with life, you are on a 'get away'.
Life is the best teacher and recreational drugs are how you forfeit that precious, amazing, education.
You don't have to go far to see this in action. Think of someone who is a habitual drug user and ask yourself 'are they emotionally mature?'. They aren't. They are taking an escape. Recreational drugs are antithetical to emotional growth.
This type of behavior is ESPECIALLY harmful if you are taking recreational drugs early in life. It simply puts you behind.
I wasted 20 years of my life 'partying' even on a casual basis. Time slips away and being high puts time on a damn bullet train.
I heard recently that the fastest way for an addict to relapse is a windfall of money. Money doesn't help them get out of their situation because money is hard to manage, particularly if you are emotionally immature.
tl/dr: Recreational drugs make you immature which will prevent you from going very far in life.
I will tell you what I would tell my own child:
Cannabis, like any recreational drug, steals the most precious resource we have: our time. I've been on benders in my life that I simply can not remember what I did during that period, sure, but that's not what I'm talking about.
What I am talking about is the time any person needs to become a well adjusted, functioning adult. When you are taking a recreational drug, you are not dealing with life, you are on a 'get away'.
Life is the best teacher and recreational drugs are how you forfeit that precious, amazing, education.
You don't have to go far to see this in action. Think of someone who is a habitual drug user and ask yourself 'are they emotionally mature?'. They aren't. They are taking an escape. Recreational drugs are antithetical to emotional growth.
This type of behavior is ESPECIALLY harmful if you are taking recreational drugs early in life. It simply puts you behind.
I wasted 20 years of my life 'partying' even on a casual basis. Time slips away and being high puts time on a damn bullet train.
I heard recently that the fastest way for an addict to relapse is a windfall of money. Money doesn't help them get out of their situation because money is hard to manage, particularly if you are emotionally immature.
tl/dr: Recreational drugs make you immature which will prevent you from going very far in life.
I really like this. I never thought about it this way before and am glad you wrote this. I can't think of a single habitual drug user who is an emotionally mature adult.
I'm going to save this and say something similar in the future when I have kids.
I'm going to save this and say something similar in the future when I have kids.
On mobile and don't have time for a substantive reply, but in my experience this comment is misleading. Rec drugs can be a waste of time, depending on how used and particularly when abused, but when used to supplement meditation, I find the experience much more informative than plain meditation.
This is not my experience at all.
I am more motivated to eat healthier, exercise, and so on when I smoke regularly. I spent most of my 20's sober and the opposite in my 30's and overall, my experience in my 30's was much better. I remember about as much either way - at least in the long term. I also learned a second language while mostly stoned.
Overall, I'm much more motivated.
And I'll state that overall, my life is full of wasted time. I don't have children nor much responsibility, really, and I'm over 40. I'm happy, though, and that isn't just the beer talking.
Edit: I can go either with or without and have taken semi-regular breaks from time to time. I'm mostly at weekends now, but that's mostly to save money rather than life stuff.
I am more motivated to eat healthier, exercise, and so on when I smoke regularly. I spent most of my 20's sober and the opposite in my 30's and overall, my experience in my 30's was much better. I remember about as much either way - at least in the long term. I also learned a second language while mostly stoned.
Overall, I'm much more motivated.
And I'll state that overall, my life is full of wasted time. I don't have children nor much responsibility, really, and I'm over 40. I'm happy, though, and that isn't just the beer talking.
Edit: I can go either with or without and have taken semi-regular breaks from time to time. I'm mostly at weekends now, but that's mostly to save money rather than life stuff.
Keep in mind different amounts of THC and CBD lead to different effect, and also different individuals (which gives both of your stories credibility, but also devalues them).
I've had multiple psychosis's due to cannabis as I am sensitive to it (possibly related to autism). Therefore, what I will say to my kid (same genepool) is be very careful with alcohol, cannabis, and other drugs. Please, don't.
I've had multiple psychosis's due to cannabis as I am sensitive to it (possibly related to autism). Therefore, what I will say to my kid (same genepool) is be very careful with alcohol, cannabis, and other drugs. Please, don't.
I too am autistic and had an experience similar to yours, although I'm not sure if the effect on productivity was nearly as much, but still definitely there and it was a form of escapism.
Still, I had plenty of time to reflect and mature while not really getting very high due to very high tolerance, although I also had anxiety problems almost like psychosis. Still managed to get out, sort of interview although probably much worse than sober, and barely work on some code. Eh, been a few weeks now and I still barely code. Only did what was required for school after burning out, before becoming addicted.
Almost got CHS after dabbing plenty of CBD (which can also cause CHS, although rare) as well as hash oil. Thankfully I only puked until my stomach was empty, didn't last long and wasn't painful, but I had most of the pre-CHS symptoms. Sometimes I think I could just do a tiny amount as a reward here and there... that it wasn't that hard to quit... maybe I'm fooling myself.
Still, I had plenty of time to reflect and mature while not really getting very high due to very high tolerance, although I also had anxiety problems almost like psychosis. Still managed to get out, sort of interview although probably much worse than sober, and barely work on some code. Eh, been a few weeks now and I still barely code. Only did what was required for school after burning out, before becoming addicted.
Almost got CHS after dabbing plenty of CBD (which can also cause CHS, although rare) as well as hash oil. Thankfully I only puked until my stomach was empty, didn't last long and wasn't painful, but I had most of the pre-CHS symptoms. Sometimes I think I could just do a tiny amount as a reward here and there... that it wasn't that hard to quit... maybe I'm fooling myself.
Maybe find some prescription drugs that would give you some benefits you desire? They are more regulated and if you find a doctor you like you won’t be going at it alone. I wish you the best.
Do you want a family? It’s not too late. Kids these days would do well to have a conscientious person like you as a parent. Also seeing a child learn is underrated as one of the greatest joys in life.
No. And I never have. I would have been sterilised when I was 20, but they don't really like to sterilise young, childless women. Or sometimes not childless women. Luckily, my spouse is.
The only real thing I've kept on the table is foster children or adopting an older child. I did keep an open mind about dating men with children back when I was dating.
The only real thing I've kept on the table is foster children or adopting an older child. I did keep an open mind about dating men with children back when I was dating.
> Recreational drugs make you immature which will prevent you from going very far in life.
Put a "may" before "make" and a replace "will" with "may", and you have a truthful statement. However, as it stands, it's simply false. Some of us "well adjusted, functioning adults" just use drugs safely and responsibly, because it can make life just a bit more interesting.
Put a "may" before "make" and a replace "will" with "may", and you have a truthful statement. However, as it stands, it's simply false. Some of us "well adjusted, functioning adults" just use drugs safely and responsibly, because it can make life just a bit more interesting.
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Ahh, so if you take away the recreational drug, you remove the part of you that has the ability to find life more interesting? Turns out it was the drug the whole time.
Cannabis is just a substance, if I drink kombucha and eat broccoli while at a party it’s still going to be a “waste of time”. If I get high and go for an 8 mile hike and meditate at the top of a hill it’s going to be a great experience and really feel like an important and memorable use of my time.
Granted alcohol and weed hinder self discipline but don’t blame the substances for your actions. Have you ever done a long run or bike ride and had a beer or two at the end? It is pure joy!
Granted alcohol and weed hinder self discipline but don’t blame the substances for your actions. Have you ever done a long run or bike ride and had a beer or two at the end? It is pure joy!
I don't really enjoy exercise at all, at least when I'm sober. Get stoned, use an app to tell me where I'm walking, and wind up at a picturesque spot with music in my ears, though? Or go on a scenic route to a grocery store that is a bit further? These are wonderful things.
My point exactly. Imagine if we actually developed the discipline to not only exercise but to also enjoy it. Think of how competent and emotionally strong we would feel. We could have all the wonderful things we crave and more. Or we can take a shortcut and learn nothing.
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Have worked with very successful people who smoke cannabis daily. Had no idea until they told me after we were no longer working together. Moderation in all things.
> Cannabis, like any recreational drug, steals the most precious resource we have: our time.
Everything 'steals time'... watching TV, reading books, listening to music, working a job, etc.
> Life is the best teacher and recreational drugs are how you forfeit that precious, amazing, education.
Not at all. It really depends on which drugs, how you use them, etc.
> You don't have to go far to see this in action. Think of someone who is a habitual drug user and ask yourself 'are they emotionally mature?'. They aren't. They are taking an escape. Recreational drugs are antithetical to emotional growth.
I've met plenty of people who regularly use recreational drugs and who seemed wise, calm and content.
> I wasted 20 years of my life 'partying' even on a casual basis.
Cannabis is not really a party drug.
There are vast differences between various 'recreational drugs'. It's how you use them that matters.
Everything 'steals time'... watching TV, reading books, listening to music, working a job, etc.
> Life is the best teacher and recreational drugs are how you forfeit that precious, amazing, education.
Not at all. It really depends on which drugs, how you use them, etc.
> You don't have to go far to see this in action. Think of someone who is a habitual drug user and ask yourself 'are they emotionally mature?'. They aren't. They are taking an escape. Recreational drugs are antithetical to emotional growth.
I've met plenty of people who regularly use recreational drugs and who seemed wise, calm and content.
> I wasted 20 years of my life 'partying' even on a casual basis.
Cannabis is not really a party drug.
There are vast differences between various 'recreational drugs'. It's how you use them that matters.
Yes, everything 'steals time,' but the biggest time stealers are those things which chemically alter your brain, such as alcohol, cannabis or other drugs. They alter the organs of perception in ways that reading a book or walking a dog do not.
Of course this is the fun of them. But also the downside.
Of course this is the fun of them. But also the downside.
Depends how you define 'biggest time stealers' - tv and video games are huge time stealers for many people. And the fact that drugs have a chemical effect on the brain does not mean they are necessarily worse than, say, watching some braindead tv show while stuffing your face with fast food, or sitting in a classroom for hours listening to a monotone voice regurgitate some dull bullshit you don't care about. Many people have had beneficial experiences with drugs, for example Steve Jobs with LSD.
It frustrates me that the tech scene seems to accept such behaviours as smoking weed quite easily. Note the numerous replies to your comment clamouring to it's defence!
I've not known a single long-term user of cannabis to be a happy, healthy adult. Quite the opposite. I think the dangers of cannabis are quite understated and the current trend toward mass-legislation concerns me. It should be noted that I live in England, where we are renown for having stronger strains... This perhaps affects my outlook.
I've not known a single long-term user of cannabis to be a happy, healthy adult. Quite the opposite. I think the dangers of cannabis are quite understated and the current trend toward mass-legislation concerns me. It should be noted that I live in England, where we are renown for having stronger strains... This perhaps affects my outlook.
Add alcohol, gaming addiction, lack off a social support group, and underlying undiagnosed mental health disorders to the list of things that hold you hostage from entering balanced adulthood.
Wish I was more self aware or had family to help support me in my younger years in seeking help. It's hard not to beat yourself up in hindsight when things seem so crystal clear now when you have traded all your vices for positive routines. In my case it took falling in love with the right person who had their shit together personally and professionally to pull me from the grips of substance abuse hell and my self destructive risk taking and addictive personality.
Mediation and mindfulness was key in my recovery as a dependable tool to shut my brain impulsivity down and regain control over the negative neural pathways I've reinforced for years abusing substances. Don't knock it until you try it and see it through until you can start to think clearly without craving your vices and giving into them. Push back hard and you'll be rewarded with clarity and control over your life to set up positive routines. Good luck.
Wish I was more self aware or had family to help support me in my younger years in seeking help. It's hard not to beat yourself up in hindsight when things seem so crystal clear now when you have traded all your vices for positive routines. In my case it took falling in love with the right person who had their shit together personally and professionally to pull me from the grips of substance abuse hell and my self destructive risk taking and addictive personality.
Mediation and mindfulness was key in my recovery as a dependable tool to shut my brain impulsivity down and regain control over the negative neural pathways I've reinforced for years abusing substances. Don't knock it until you try it and see it through until you can start to think clearly without craving your vices and giving into them. Push back hard and you'll be rewarded with clarity and control over your life to set up positive routines. Good luck.
It's not a causal study, but there's a correlational link between low trait Conscientiousness and chronic cannabis use. It might just be that slackers are more OK with being high all the time, but the worrying risk is that cannabis use damages your ability to organize and self-motivate yourself.
I used to smoke a bowl almost every night. I quit because it had a number of affects on me I didn’t like: (1) it made me sleep poorly. (2) it made me paranoid/anxious, as in I would become hyper focused on all the ways my life could hypothetically fall apart (3) I couldn’t manage to do much besides sit on the couch and watch tv or game (4) I would basically become paralyzed by overanlysis, to the extent that I couldn’t really talk to people.
Friends of mine smoke regularly have basically the opposite experience. It really appears to me that weed affects people in really different ways, so it’s hard to make a general statement.
Friends of mine smoke regularly have basically the opposite experience. It really appears to me that weed affects people in really different ways, so it’s hard to make a general statement.
What's your meditation routine? As in, how do you actually meditate, do you use something like Headspace?
I bat you don’t need the timer now. I have been doing this for more than a year now and these days I open my eyes right around 20 mins mark. It’s freaky, try it.
Have you tried meditating at other times of the day? I would be afraid that I would fall back asleep if I tried meditate after waking up. :)
I find the morning to work best for me but my girlfriend does it before she goes to bed. If I would add another session each day that would be it to help me sleep better.
I sit on a chair and try to keep good posture so falling asleep has never been anything I’ve worries about.
I sit on a chair and try to keep good posture so falling asleep has never been anything I’ve worries about.
Thanks for sharing your experience. I'll probably stick to (trying to) meditate after work. It gives me a nice break to switch brain modes. Plus I'm not a morning person so I don't have time in the morning. :)
I find that any after-work meditation is necessarily prepended with 5-10 minutes of reflection/decompression - just fyi
Did meditation help you quit cannabis? How so? Any tips? I've been trying for a while but it hasn't been the easiest thing to kick.
For me those two changes weren’t directly related but I believe meditation can be very helpful in strengthening willpower and regaining focus on long term goals which is very helpful in the pursuit modifying patterns of behavior. For me it certainly works that way.
I was “lucky” in the sense that cannabis began having very negative effects on my mind so quitting was fairly easy. I know from other friends it’s not always like that so I wish you all the luck in your attempts to quit or cut down on your consumption.
I was “lucky” in the sense that cannabis began having very negative effects on my mind so quitting was fairly easy. I know from other friends it’s not always like that so I wish you all the luck in your attempts to quit or cut down on your consumption.
I've been meditating for about 3 months now. Mostly focussing on building the habit part of it.
I could definitely recommend 10% happier book, It's a fun read, and a kind introduction to meditation. I had an easier time connecting with that author then all the other writers that have all have been meditating for 20+ years with countless 10/30 day retreats.
This week I finished Waking up from sam harris. Have been listening to his podcast for ages. If you are interested in meditation, from a non-religion perspective I would definitely recommend it. I'm still having a tough time understanding what all this no-self and no-ego is about. That will just take some time I guess.
For me personally I've been mixing meditation and stoisism a bit to find some peace and acceptance for my very critical self image. But it's hard to find good stoic teaching, most of it just seems written by sleazy marketeers.
Last thing I would recommend for anyone interested in meditation, starting with tools like headspace a good way to get into the habit. But to be honest, I'm having a hard time still getting value out of their teachings. I went from
headspace > just settings a timer with the Oak app for 20-30 min > back to headspace.
I feel if made less progress then the simple timer. of course I'm not 100% sure if it the headspace app, or me just simply plateauing but my I think I'm going to go back to a simple timer. The headspace app is just so damn noisy.
I could definitely recommend 10% happier book, It's a fun read, and a kind introduction to meditation. I had an easier time connecting with that author then all the other writers that have all have been meditating for 20+ years with countless 10/30 day retreats.
This week I finished Waking up from sam harris. Have been listening to his podcast for ages. If you are interested in meditation, from a non-religion perspective I would definitely recommend it. I'm still having a tough time understanding what all this no-self and no-ego is about. That will just take some time I guess.
For me personally I've been mixing meditation and stoisism a bit to find some peace and acceptance for my very critical self image. But it's hard to find good stoic teaching, most of it just seems written by sleazy marketeers.
Last thing I would recommend for anyone interested in meditation, starting with tools like headspace a good way to get into the habit. But to be honest, I'm having a hard time still getting value out of their teachings. I went from
headspace > just settings a timer with the Oak app for 20-30 min > back to headspace.
I feel if made less progress then the simple timer. of course I'm not 100% sure if it the headspace app, or me just simply plateauing but my I think I'm going to go back to a simple timer. The headspace app is just so damn noisy.
You need to know how to progress. The book The Mind Illuminated which has allready recommended here helps with this. One commenter in another thread on hn allready practised for years, that book got him further.
I started meditating in the beginning of the year and it really has helped me with a lot of things. It has helped me the most with anxiety and my ADHD/concentrating.
Ive been using Waking Up with Sam Harris, which is talked about in the article. It has a ton of learning materials, self-timers. It follows vipassana meditation and the app offers metta as well.
Ive been using Waking Up with Sam Harris, which is talked about in the article. It has a ton of learning materials, self-timers. It follows vipassana meditation and the app offers metta as well.
In my humble opinion, meditation is the only way. There is no substitute for meditation. There is a nice app for free called Plumb Village. It’s by Thich Nhat Hanh, who I think gave a talk at Google once.
This reminds me of an article shared here on the value of doing nothing.
How does walking around with a clear head compared to meditation practically speaking?
How does walking around with a clear head compared to meditation practically speaking?
Meditation as I understand it involves specifically directing your mental focus to something. Sometimes breath, sometimes a visualization, sometimes an examination of a particular thought or situation.
You can do a walking meditation, where you will likewise be focused on something: one possibility being the physical sensations of walking (arms swinging, feet hitting ground), or the experience of the surroundings (light, breeze, sounds, and so on).
The difference to just walking around, or just sitting calmly, is that you are putting some effort into maintaining that particular focus, whatever it is. You will always get distracted by something else, but when you notice, you switch back. And keep on doing that for the length of the exercise.
You can do a walking meditation, where you will likewise be focused on something: one possibility being the physical sensations of walking (arms swinging, feet hitting ground), or the experience of the surroundings (light, breeze, sounds, and so on).
The difference to just walking around, or just sitting calmly, is that you are putting some effort into maintaining that particular focus, whatever it is. You will always get distracted by something else, but when you notice, you switch back. And keep on doing that for the length of the exercise.
Why not both ? Both are hard to achieve in long term..thanks to chatty mind.
I'd liken it to the difference between exercise and training. Exercise is certainly good for you, but if you want to achieve high performance, you need structure and discipline.
Meditation isn't clearing your head, it's changing it. It's developing the faculties of attention and awareness in a deliberate way. Ultimately, these are the tools you use to develop insight.
Meditation isn't clearing your head, it's changing it. It's developing the faculties of attention and awareness in a deliberate way. Ultimately, these are the tools you use to develop insight.
I just want to share that I'm finding the practice of Zen meditation in the context of its overall philosophy to be profoundly helpful. I've read a substantial number of books on the subject. Books are only useful as pointers for how to practice; knowledge alone is useless in Zen. You have to practice, period. But the best books are useful as pointers for how to practice. And if anyone here is interested in exploring Zen, the single book that I feel does the best job of giving you what you need to really practice is "Opening the Hand of Thought: Foundations of Zen Buddhist Practice" by Kosho Uchiyama Roshi[1]. "Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind" [2] is also a wonderful book, and it's where I started. Its poetic manner of expression made me feel there was something there that I needed to explore. But the Uchiyama book just takes the cake for being very clear and down-to-earth, without watering down either the practice or the philosophy. After that it's helpful to read commentaries on writings by Dogen. And, ideally, sitting regularly with other folks in a Zen center is extremely helpful. Avoid overly simplistic beginner's Zen books. I can't recommend them because they seem to distort the essence in an attempt to make it seem as approachable as possible.
[1] https://www.amazon.com/Opening-Hand-Thought-Foundations-Budd...
[2] https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Mind-Beginners-Informal-Meditatio...
[1] https://www.amazon.com/Opening-Hand-Thought-Foundations-Budd...
[2] https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Mind-Beginners-Informal-Meditatio...
I have been meditating for sometime now however lately I have been thinking that this is one more attempt at managing the stress of daily life. Its not the cure and definitely does not help in finding out why we need to do this to begin with.
I might argue that it is precisely a route to figuring out why we need to do this to begin with.
This notion that somehow all this suffering and stress is generated by external factors is a trap, in my experience.
This notion that somehow all this suffering and stress is generated by external factors is a trap, in my experience.
I didn’t mean that all our troubles are based on external factors but it does impact our day to day.
I think the thing is that in our past lives we had a lot more time to do nothing. Have you ever sat and stared into a fire for an extended period of time? These kinds of calm moments of reflection happened far more often in times gone past, especially for tens of thousands of years before significant we developed civilisation.
Presumably because this time was abuntantly available, evolution found ways to do some kind of bookkeeping that is very important for our survival, in a similar manner to why sleep is important.
This is of course speculation, but in the absence of definative research about the human brain, which is a ways off just yet, this is almost the best we have.
Presumably because this time was abuntantly available, evolution found ways to do some kind of bookkeeping that is very important for our survival, in a similar manner to why sleep is important.
This is of course speculation, but in the absence of definative research about the human brain, which is a ways off just yet, this is almost the best we have.
Mindfulness meditation is absolutely great, a miracle, a root. I don't meditate regularly but every time that I do it again (and if properly), the thought that opens is something like "where have you been so long / why have you denied this to yourself for so long" type of question.
And yet, I feel like doing that every day is not fully compatible with the type of consciousness which is optimal to get me from day to day in my life as a software engineer.
Meditation sharpens your senses -- you may then find yourself distracted by sounds of road traffic that you previously didn't care about, you may discover that the air in your area smells bad to you from time to time, you may realize how locked most people are in their own patterns (that includes you). You may find yourself thinking about going to a Buddhist monastery somewhere and trying this for a longer time. I'm just saying it's really _that_ good.
Whereas, if I do what I love, and I let my consciousness to its own momentum, I feel like it's auto-tackling the daily roughness of life more on its own and not bothering me with otherwise unimportant things that much. In essence, you were born into this physical reality to be a thought / to have thoughts, not to be thoughtless / formless.
That said, mindfulness meditation as a consciousness-momentum modification tool, applied (even daily) within the proper bounds, can a venerable weapon for life.
I guess I just find it to be an extra overhead to manage if everything else in my life goes really well even without it.
p.s. If you use meditation as a daily crutch(?)/bandage(?) to something that _really_ bothers you, there are much more effective weapons to try (one-off, by no means regular use): Ayahuasca, Shrooms, Family Constellations -- after healing with these, the meditation itself can provide you with much more, as a cherry on the top.
And yet, I feel like doing that every day is not fully compatible with the type of consciousness which is optimal to get me from day to day in my life as a software engineer.
Meditation sharpens your senses -- you may then find yourself distracted by sounds of road traffic that you previously didn't care about, you may discover that the air in your area smells bad to you from time to time, you may realize how locked most people are in their own patterns (that includes you). You may find yourself thinking about going to a Buddhist monastery somewhere and trying this for a longer time. I'm just saying it's really _that_ good.
Whereas, if I do what I love, and I let my consciousness to its own momentum, I feel like it's auto-tackling the daily roughness of life more on its own and not bothering me with otherwise unimportant things that much. In essence, you were born into this physical reality to be a thought / to have thoughts, not to be thoughtless / formless.
That said, mindfulness meditation as a consciousness-momentum modification tool, applied (even daily) within the proper bounds, can a venerable weapon for life.
I guess I just find it to be an extra overhead to manage if everything else in my life goes really well even without it.
p.s. If you use meditation as a daily crutch(?)/bandage(?) to something that _really_ bothers you, there are much more effective weapons to try (one-off, by no means regular use): Ayahuasca, Shrooms, Family Constellations -- after healing with these, the meditation itself can provide you with much more, as a cherry on the top.
There's more to meditation than just mindfulness. Look into samatha practice.
There's a small urban park 5 minutes away from my apartment, I live in Oregon so the greenery is very lush and evergreen. It's the perfect spot for a quick 10 minute headspace session.
The mind is an incredible thing, it's difficult to know if tech has reduced my mind's ability to remain still -- but it's quite something to sit and realize that my mind goes it's own way and I struggle to keep up, like a dog walking it's master.
The mind is an incredible thing, it's difficult to know if tech has reduced my mind's ability to remain still -- but it's quite something to sit and realize that my mind goes it's own way and I struggle to keep up, like a dog walking it's master.
I've been meditating for the last 2 years, and I've found many benefits. Stress reduction, better control of feelings, better understanding of self, and joy are just a few.
It's really simple to start out:
1) Devote 10 minutes of each day to meditation time. Early morning is best, as your mind is fresh and not as distracted.
2) Find a quiet/non-distracting place to sit in a comfortable position. Legs crossed on the floor or in a chair are fine. You want to keep your back straight to help keep from falling asleep.
3) Focus on the sensation of your breath, wherever it is strongest. Typically this is the tip of the nose, or in the nostril, but chest can work as well. Your mind will become distracted with work, worries, thoughts of food, etc. When this happens, congratulate yourself on noticing that it happened, and bring your attention back to your breath.
That's it! It blows my mind how developing concentration can have such a profound impact on your life.
Here are some good resources for those interested:
http://dharmatreasure.org/wp-content/uploads/beginning-medit...
https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Illuminated-Meditation-Integrati...
https://www.reddit.com/r/TheMindIlluminated/wiki/index#wiki_...
It's really simple to start out:
1) Devote 10 minutes of each day to meditation time. Early morning is best, as your mind is fresh and not as distracted.
2) Find a quiet/non-distracting place to sit in a comfortable position. Legs crossed on the floor or in a chair are fine. You want to keep your back straight to help keep from falling asleep.
3) Focus on the sensation of your breath, wherever it is strongest. Typically this is the tip of the nose, or in the nostril, but chest can work as well. Your mind will become distracted with work, worries, thoughts of food, etc. When this happens, congratulate yourself on noticing that it happened, and bring your attention back to your breath.
That's it! It blows my mind how developing concentration can have such a profound impact on your life.
Here are some good resources for those interested:
http://dharmatreasure.org/wp-content/uploads/beginning-medit...
https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Illuminated-Meditation-Integrati...
https://www.reddit.com/r/TheMindIlluminated/wiki/index#wiki_...
Personally, I find meditating on a daily basis for longer periods (months), the most difficult.
Whenever I go through a "down" phase in life, I start meditating and observe it being really beneficial, but the routine quickly starts to bore me.
When I feel good and energized, I jump out of bed, enjoy a day at work and fill the evening with stuff I enjoy.
I totally forget to meditate and (digital) reminders are easily dismissed.
(It doesn't help that I'm an evening person, so most of the time I tried to do as less as possible in the morning in order to arrive at a "normal" time at work)
How do other people cope with this?
Whenever I go through a "down" phase in life, I start meditating and observe it being really beneficial, but the routine quickly starts to bore me.
When I feel good and energized, I jump out of bed, enjoy a day at work and fill the evening with stuff I enjoy.
I totally forget to meditate and (digital) reminders are easily dismissed.
(It doesn't help that I'm an evening person, so most of the time I tried to do as less as possible in the morning in order to arrive at a "normal" time at work)
How do other people cope with this?
Same for me. Keeping up the routine is very hard.
What are your meditation goals?
Some people treat it as a chance to sit and relax, perhaps process a bit of mental backlog, and generally 'open up'.
Others treat meditation as a disciplined and very deliberate form of mental training. This is a process that takes years and thousands of hours to achieve a degree of mastery, such as attaining single-pointed attention, jhana absorbtions, etc.
The latter is not easy, but it is also not boring.
Some people treat it as a chance to sit and relax, perhaps process a bit of mental backlog, and generally 'open up'.
Others treat meditation as a disciplined and very deliberate form of mental training. This is a process that takes years and thousands of hours to achieve a degree of mastery, such as attaining single-pointed attention, jhana absorbtions, etc.
The latter is not easy, but it is also not boring.
Same for me. Though i am very "advanced" having been a yogi for over 50 years. What really helped me was meditating hourly, on chimes. i have found the practice mentioned a few times, eg Thich Nat Han recommends. Content wise, length wise etc etc there are many variations. Pick one. Maybe graduate to another. Or out, or on infinite repeat. Taking control of yourself, at all times, even when not "meditating" is to be awake.
I'm sold on meditating being beneficial. This article is a reminder that I need to start doing it regularly again. How difficult it is for me is probably a reflection of how much I need it.
I wonder about some of the _negative_ effects of meditation. Actually, I don't even mean negative, but just effects period. For example, does it make you less aggressive? In many ways this is a good thing but there are also benefits to being aggressive.
I wonder about some of the _negative_ effects of meditation. Actually, I don't even mean negative, but just effects period. For example, does it make you less aggressive? In many ways this is a good thing but there are also benefits to being aggressive.
Oysters can be eaten, but don't ignore the pearl.
I can recommend meditation for people with social anxiety. When I meditate on a regular basis, the way I interact changes completely. It's more intuitive and I say and do things I wouldn't do otherwise, yet people are completely fine with it and like me more. Like I am really authentic
In the Viniyoga tradition of Krishnamacharya and Desikachar, yoga poses/exercises (asana) are used to prepare the body for meditation. The meditation is a process of exercises while focusing on an object. The object could be gross, such as a mountain, or subtle such as a concept. The teacher chooses the object for the student.
For those interested, there is also Suizen [1] meditation which involves playing shakuhachi bamboo flute.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suizen
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suizen
> Meditation can open up surprisingly many doors when it comes to being more aware, mindful, focused and just at piece with yourself
"At piece with yourself" reminds me of Iron Maiden's album Piece of Mind. Which is also good for mindfulness and focus.
"At piece with yourself" reminds me of Iron Maiden's album Piece of Mind. Which is also good for mindfulness and focus.
i tried meditating myself but ended up with taking a short nap, 15-20 minutes that is, no need to go to bed though, but seems nap-taking recovers the most energy for me for the rest of the day.
I had been reading articles (like this one) that raves about the benefits of meditation and so I decided to try it for 30 days every day.
I did not see any improvements in any areas. Could I be doing something wrong? I really don't get meditation and I feel like I'm the only person who feels this way.
All the benefits that this article specifically talks about is my default state. I'm never stressed and I don't feel anxiety unless I drink alot.
Is it be possible that meditation simply have no effect for some people?
I did not see any improvements in any areas. Could I be doing something wrong? I really don't get meditation and I feel like I'm the only person who feels this way.
All the benefits that this article specifically talks about is my default state. I'm never stressed and I don't feel anxiety unless I drink alot.
Is it be possible that meditation simply have no effect for some people?
Try asking someone close to you if they notice a difference. I went through a long stint of daily meditation a few years ago but I eventually lost the habit. A while afterwards my wife randomly said, "I wish you still meditated. You were nicer when you did." I was taken aback.
Meditating daily has helped with my focus. I can now follow conversations in work meetings a lot longer, without my mind drifting away.
Does anyone know what is the history of the Ohmm sound? What is the desired effect?
The correct way to say is AAAUM and not Om
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Om
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Om
Check this video
https://youtu.be/-HMgaToaEac
Meditation sometimes reveals itself through meditation. It's kinda like recursion in programming. I come from Vietnam. Meditation in Vietnamese is translated literally to "sitting zen" (ngồi thiền). Sitting seems like the optimal balance point for meditation. Standing/walking has more distraction. Lying down makes you prone to sleeping. Now, I haven't figured out which sitting position is more optimal. Perhaps, the lotus position is popular for a reason.
The Tibetan Texts on "Mind Training" (called Lojong) maybe helpful for people looking for instructional techniques;
* Mind Training: The Great Collection - https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Training-Collection-Library-Clas...
* Essential Mind Training (subset from the above book) - https://www.amazon.com/Essential-Mind-Training-Tibetan-Class...
* Mind Training: The Great Collection - https://www.amazon.com/Mind-Training-Collection-Library-Clas...
* Essential Mind Training (subset from the above book) - https://www.amazon.com/Essential-Mind-Training-Tibetan-Class...
I personally don't find it useful. But it might be my own problem because I cannot get rid of the idea of questioning meditation itself.
However if you are in doubt like me try take a nap. I find 20mins nap at noon also works great.
However if you are in doubt like me try take a nap. I find 20mins nap at noon also works great.
I strongly recommend Shambavi mahamudra Kriya taught by Sadhguru https://www.innerengineering.com/
I’ve been practicing their 18 minute meditation for almost a year and it has been quite amazing.
You can listen to this article here:
https://www.listle.io/#/article/3127906797
https://www.listle.io/#/article/3127906797
But it's not the only one, and shouldn't be called merely "meditation" without regard to the vast body of practices that exist.
Another form of meditation that's traditionally talked about in Buddhism is shamatha, which translates to something like "concentration" or "tranquility." In this type of practice, the meditator works with a meditation object, commonly the breath, but possibly a sound, mental image, etc. The meditator learns to stabilize the mind and remain fully aware of the object, and in the process learns to debug the mechanisms that direct (and destabilize) conscious attention.
A recently published book called _The_Mind_Illustrated_ by John Yates is fa fantastic resource for this kind of practice.
If you're interested in scientific attempts to categorize and study meditation, the Center for Healthy Minds at UW-Madison does some fantastic neuroscience & psychology research.
https://centerhealthyminds.org/assets/files-publications/Dah...
In the scientific terminology that is emerging these days, Attentional, Constructive, and Deconstructive types of meditation are mapped onto various types of traditional practices (there's a handy chart in the paper).