The Future of Farming? No Sun, No Soil, but Lots of Data(fortune.com)
fortune.com
The Future of Farming? No Sun, No Soil, but Lots of Data
https://fortune.com/2019/09/05/future-farming-vertical-sun-soil-data-aerofarms/
20 comments
After getting my masters in ag science and spending a decade working in hydroponics and field agriculture I am glad to see someone else identifying the hubris here.
Multiple times a month I have to endure a pitch or presentation from some upstart tech company assuming that all farmers are toothless hicks who just need to be shown the light. I've had hundreds of conversations with growers about every single one of the topics he thinks he's going to fix. The only people swayed by his arguments are those who know even less than he does.
Multiple times a month I have to endure a pitch or presentation from some upstart tech company assuming that all farmers are toothless hicks who just need to be shown the light. I've had hundreds of conversations with growers about every single one of the topics he thinks he's going to fix. The only people swayed by his arguments are those who know even less than he does.
I have had the same experience and I have given up trying to explain the nuances of Ag to technical engineering type of people. I do really think they solve problems differently and it’s not always compatible with Ag solutions
One situation that makes a great deal of sense on paper and is very difficult to effectively implement on commercial scales is aquaponics. In theory, being able to produce both fish and vegetables should be a good value proposition.
In reality, instead of trying to balance two biological systems (hydroponic plants and integrated pest management biocontrols) you now have to balance 4: plants, insects, fish, and algae/bacteria.
Suddenly the farmers potential for very costly cascade failures increases exponentially. If your algae dies, your plants die. If you fish die, your algae dies. If any of your solutions to dying fish/algae/insects impacts another biological system the whole farm collapses and you need to sterilize and start over.
And yet, so many of the people pitching this idea wonder why there is so little commercial interest in pursuing such an integrated system.
In reality, instead of trying to balance two biological systems (hydroponic plants and integrated pest management biocontrols) you now have to balance 4: plants, insects, fish, and algae/bacteria.
Suddenly the farmers potential for very costly cascade failures increases exponentially. If your algae dies, your plants die. If you fish die, your algae dies. If any of your solutions to dying fish/algae/insects impacts another biological system the whole farm collapses and you need to sterilize and start over.
And yet, so many of the people pitching this idea wonder why there is so little commercial interest in pursuing such an integrated system.
Yes, you are right. Altho’ having said that, indoor/vertical/aqua/hydroponics systems must include the entire supply/value chain and be decentralized. Traditional models of economies of scale won’t operate here.
Aquaponics is an infinitely better system as it can be truly organic. It has to be tackled entirely differently..lots of AI/automation for constant monitoring and systems control.
Major expense in traditional Ag is labour. This can be optimized and minimized with indoor Ag.
As an outdoor farmer, the control of variable factors in indoor systems is appealing to me but I can also see how being risk averse is better. Small indoor farms are better than the broad acre mind set we have with outdoor Ag. Taking everything indoor except fruit and grains and fiber and spices etc is very attractive to me. But a new supply chain and control of markets has to be in place.
I am not even worried about energy long term as we would go nuclear at some point eventually. Impending climate change should require us be mindful of alternative Ag systems. I am particularly interested in saline agriculture. I think it would be useful research.
Aquaponics is an infinitely better system as it can be truly organic. It has to be tackled entirely differently..lots of AI/automation for constant monitoring and systems control.
Major expense in traditional Ag is labour. This can be optimized and minimized with indoor Ag.
As an outdoor farmer, the control of variable factors in indoor systems is appealing to me but I can also see how being risk averse is better. Small indoor farms are better than the broad acre mind set we have with outdoor Ag. Taking everything indoor except fruit and grains and fiber and spices etc is very attractive to me. But a new supply chain and control of markets has to be in place.
I am not even worried about energy long term as we would go nuclear at some point eventually. Impending climate change should require us be mindful of alternative Ag systems. I am particularly interested in saline agriculture. I think it would be useful research.
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It's my understanding that the biggest thing other than energy demands holding vertical farming back is the lack of ability to grow staple crops such as wheat, rice and soy. Sure you can grow plenty of low density high water plants, but you can't feed the planet let alone a city on crunchy water.
We can grow rice indoors. It’s from the grass family and we grow them in flooded irrigated plains anyways.
40% of all food crops is wasted somewhere along the supply chain. It’s a damn shame! I really hope our Ag and food systems change to reforest and rewind existing land for carbon sequestration as we take a much larger percent of food production indoors.
40% of all food crops is wasted somewhere along the supply chain. It’s a damn shame! I really hope our Ag and food systems change to reforest and rewind existing land for carbon sequestration as we take a much larger percent of food production indoors.
That is some IYI shit right there. Gell-Mann, remember it.
Plants have evolved over millions of years under sun/soil constraints, and I predict there will be 2nd order effects they‘ll soon become aware of. Not to speak of the fact that artificial light will never be cost competitive with the free thing.
Plants have evolved over millions of years under sun/soil constraints, and I predict there will be 2nd order effects they‘ll soon become aware of. Not to speak of the fact that artificial light will never be cost competitive with the free thing.
There is some value in certain conditions for some of the items he has indicated. His most egregious error is thinking that no one is investigating or leveraging them.
Generating specific taste profiles of fruits and vegetables based on inputs is fascinating and very real. What is being completely glossed over is the difficulty in creating a branded customer experience that permits any additional value to be extracted from the effort.
For example, it's great you can make a tomato that has a unique taste, but most customers who purchase a tomato want it to taste like a traditional tomato, and those that don't really like the traditional taste of tomatoes aren't going to try it because they already dislike tomatoes.
Generating specific taste profiles of fruits and vegetables based on inputs is fascinating and very real. What is being completely glossed over is the difficulty in creating a branded customer experience that permits any additional value to be extracted from the effort.
For example, it's great you can make a tomato that has a unique taste, but most customers who purchase a tomato want it to taste like a traditional tomato, and those that don't really like the traditional taste of tomatoes aren't going to try it because they already dislike tomatoes.
On a side note, indoor hydroponics is a super fun DIY project that combines tech and gardening. Having a decent amount of fun with it, whole yielding produce to cook every week.
What’s the best way to learn more about it? I’ve been poking around the hydroponics subreddit(s), but I don’t yet feel confident enough to invest in/start making any equipment.
Youtube has a lot of videos around this. One of the things that I think Ive read, but have not verified is that hydroponic plants dont have as much nutritional value as plants grown in soil.
The part they don't discuss in the article is the cost. Sunlight is free, but you must pay for the electricity if you use LEDs. Water is cheap where most farms are. So this can't be used to produce potatoes or corns or other plant with a very low price.
You're absolutely correct. There are very few situations where the benefit of only using artificial light outweighs the cost of ignoring free sunlight. Most hydroponics will transition with supplemental lighting, not exclusive LED lighting.
EDIT:not only does sunlight provide energy for photosynthesis but it also provides free heat for the growing facility, and in many locations heat is not an insignificant expense. Even the choice of lighting (i.e. sodium vs LED) impacts the need for supplemental heating and/or cooling as traditional highouput bulbs are very hot, whereas LED is cool. In winter, that lack of heat must be augmented by supplementary sources. But, on the flip side, LEDs permit closer placement to the plants, offering additional lighting regime options and don't add to the temperature when the facility gets too hot.
EDIT:not only does sunlight provide energy for photosynthesis but it also provides free heat for the growing facility, and in many locations heat is not an insignificant expense. Even the choice of lighting (i.e. sodium vs LED) impacts the need for supplemental heating and/or cooling as traditional highouput bulbs are very hot, whereas LED is cool. In winter, that lack of heat must be augmented by supplementary sources. But, on the flip side, LEDs permit closer placement to the plants, offering additional lighting regime options and don't add to the temperature when the facility gets too hot.
Lots of work going on with Quantum/Nano dots in greenhouse tech. Mostly with cannabis production because it’s the only crop that will justify the costs involved.
I agree—even though solar electricity prices are falling fast, they aren't going to beat a greenhouse; I explored the question in more quantitative detail yesterday: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20905366
Obviously the issue is most pressing for sun-loving crops like corn, but I think it applies even to leaf crops like lettuce.
Obviously the issue is most pressing for sun-loving crops like corn, but I think it applies even to leaf crops like lettuce.
Not everything can be grown indoors. But most can be grown inside..covered cropping is a good compromise between row cropping and indoor hydroponics/vertical Ag. In fact, better returns and productivity than either of those ..capital costs are higher but easy to recover.
Are the obstacles to indoor growing just a matter of energy requirements, or is there something else I don't know about?
Supply chain would be a big issue. Current system is optimized for field Ag and built in losses due to food wastage.
"Rosenberg said that farmers usually apply fertilizer once, water the crop and hope it grows. AeroFarms, meanwhile, applies fertilizers many times, adjusting along the way to optimize plant growth"
Not true. Most farmers I grew up around follow the recommended fertilization guidelines provided by their local coop, it's not a one time and "hope it grows" thing.
“I’ve learned how ignorant we are about how to make plants grow.”
Who is we? People who use "we" like this always use it to assume and judge things they feel.
“A plant doesn’t necessarily need 10 hours of darkness,” said Rosenberg. “Maybe it needs 10 minutes.”
Yes it does if the plant is photoperiodic. Many are.
“When you can really play with those environmental factors and all these tools in a big data way in a farm the size of [a] building, it really becomes illuminating of how plants react in different ways.”
Indoor and greenhouse growers have already been doing this forever. Welcome to the club.