Loss of sense of smell a marker for Covid-19 infection(entuk.org)
entuk.org
Loss of sense of smell a marker for Covid-19 infection
https://www.entuk.org/loss-sense-smell-marker-covid-19-infection
113 comments
You had a fever and shortness of breath and you didn’t suspect coronavirus? No offense, but have you been living under a rock?
A few weeks ago, in a location where the virus had not been confirmed yet, that could easily happen. The situation is changing so fast that a few weeks - or even days - can make a huge difference.
It might of been more than a month now. The virus was in the news on January and then kind of disappeared out of the news. The way it was being reported too was that it was contained in China and hasn't made it out. I thought maybe I had it but it I thought it was unlikely considering the news.
Fair enough. I guess the idea that a disease which had exploded in the way it did in China could ever possibly be contained doesn't really make sense to me, but maybe you don't live in a place with a lot of asian immigrants. I'm on the west coast of the U.S. and there are just huge numbers of asian immigrants here. There's just no feasible way a disease in China could somehow not make its way here. Way too many flights and way too many people here with connections to China.
I'm in Philly, my wife travels through phl (intl airport) quite often for work and we have a sizable Asian population. I was just naive to think we had a handle on this thing.
My kids (3 year old and 6mo) and I had the exact same set of symptoms in Berlin around the 12th of February, except that we had lower fever. My wife showed no symptoms. We went to the pediatrician and it was diagnosed just as a standard flu + bronchitis. The baby was prescribed an inhaler with Salbumamol. I am already asthmatic so I just treated it as it getting temporarily out of control. We all had about rough 3-4 days but nothing that ever made us feel like an extraordinary case. When you have a 3 year old going to the Kita, you just assume that they will always bring something home.
I am working from home and we already had a flight scheduled for the end of February, so even after the kid got better we didn't take her to the Kita to avoid getting anything else. Now, I still think that what we had was just a seasonal flu, but I really would like to get some test to remove all doubt.
I am working from home and we already had a flight scheduled for the end of February, so even after the kid got better we didn't take her to the Kita to avoid getting anything else. Now, I still think that what we had was just a seasonal flu, but I really would like to get some test to remove all doubt.
My wife only coughed a lot for a week. I was semi bed ridden for about 3 days. It was definitely not the worst flu I've had. I did feel very tried for a week and slept a lot more than usual after those 3-4 days
Pretty much the same. The one thing that is really making me wonder now is that I got anosmia and that never happened before. It was so novel to me that I spent a good part of an hour reading about anosmia caused by flu and commented with my wife how weird it was. I usually have a very good appetite, even when sick. The anosmia caused appetite loss and all I wanted was to drink water + vitamin C
Yeah I've never had it before either after reading this it feels like a red flag. I also lost my appetite and lost about 5 pounds, but that just may have been from anxiety.
It may still have been flu; a 102 fever is higher than expected for covid, although definitely not excluded
Yes. I agree. None of us were tested for the flu either so we don't really know. We all did have our flu shots however in November. I've never had the loss the smell taste though with the flu. This also didn't hit me like the flu. I felt kind of tired for a few days before I got really sick. My wife ended up with just a dry cough for a week. She would be very tied randomly some nights.
I am guessing it is 10x more likely to be Covid19 (and Baysian is even higher if you know community transmission is currently occurring in your area).
While Anosmia is commonly caused by flu, the flu doesn’t commonly cause anosmia.
If anyone can find what percentage of people with flu/cold present with Anosmia as a symptom (without having a blocked nose), I would love to know,
While Anosmia is commonly caused by flu, the flu doesn’t commonly cause anosmia.
If anyone can find what percentage of people with flu/cold present with Anosmia as a symptom (without having a blocked nose), I would love to know,
Did your baby get sick? With a one year old, that’s my biggest fear.
Yes. He was 11 months at the time. He had 102 fever and I thought he was breathing a bit heavily when sleeping but he didn't seem to care during the day and was running around happy the most of the time. He was only really tied for one day. We both took small doses of Tylenol to keep the fever at 100. He had slightly runny nose too which made me think it might of been something else.
Thank you for replying. Not that we know 100% you had COVID, but this is helpful. There is next to zero information regarding very young children ... like under 3. I hope it truly is because it isn’t affecting them but at the same time, I think how strong can a 22 month olds immune system really be.
Purely anecdotal but my wife is a doctor and plugged into a lot of other uk doctor moms and it feels like new children are doing relatively well thankfully. A friend had her 6 week old contract it and she's already back home and out of hospital now after just a few days of readmission. Never safe but hope this can give you a slight bit of good news.
KY has had 2 young cases so far (8 mo old and 6yr old). The 8mo old didn't need to be hospitalized and the 6yr old was in the hospital for a handful of days and is now at home. Both are expected to recover AFAIK.
I remember getting that a few years ago with some bad infection.
It is awful - nothing has any "taste" (using quotes as we often confuse taste and smell. I could taste sweet/salty etc but this is a very small part of the overall sensory experience compared to smells)
I would eat blue cheese and raw garlic to try to get some kind of taste, because everything was insipid. So I would barely eat anything, unless I felt hungry. Then, I would mostly eat pasta, because at least the texture was nice. Only texture mattered.
Spices helped. Lots of them, put directly over the pasta. Meat felt like old bubblegum, something hard to chew and without any flavoring.
In my case, it took more than a month to heal. I believe my sense of smell was permanently altered because since then, I don't like anymore many things with a faint taste that I loved before.
Raw mozarella for example still tastes like chewing boiled spaghettis. Only the texture is different. I loved the aftertaste of mozarella before, but I can't find any taste to it anymore.
It is awful - nothing has any "taste" (using quotes as we often confuse taste and smell. I could taste sweet/salty etc but this is a very small part of the overall sensory experience compared to smells)
I would eat blue cheese and raw garlic to try to get some kind of taste, because everything was insipid. So I would barely eat anything, unless I felt hungry. Then, I would mostly eat pasta, because at least the texture was nice. Only texture mattered.
Spices helped. Lots of them, put directly over the pasta. Meat felt like old bubblegum, something hard to chew and without any flavoring.
In my case, it took more than a month to heal. I believe my sense of smell was permanently altered because since then, I don't like anymore many things with a faint taste that I loved before.
Raw mozarella for example still tastes like chewing boiled spaghettis. Only the texture is different. I loved the aftertaste of mozarella before, but I can't find any taste to it anymore.
This seems like a potentially game-changing discovery - if we could trivially diagnose 30%+ of cases, that could drastically diminish growth rate.
Are there standard anosmia tests? I'm wondering how to make this actionable in the most efficient way.
Are there standard anosmia tests? I'm wondering how to make this actionable in the most efficient way.
30% is a big number.
Reducing number of silient carriers would be great.
I am also wondering if, in general, our societies would benefit from a periodic self-quarantine, as a prophylactic measure.
I guess, if, after this pandemic is over -- we see fewer cases of H1N1 and other upper-respiratory transmittable viruses -- we could conclude that periodic, world-wide self quarantine should be written into laws of public health.
May be every 5 years or so, for 1.5 months stop all non-essential travel, work commute, public gatherings and so on.
Do not know if the above idea has any historical precedent, but, clearly our world has developed into very inter-connected, redundant, essentially unbreakable pathogen re-transmission network. So we need to respond to this.
I am also wondering if, in general, our societies would benefit from a periodic self-quarantine, as a prophylactic measure.
I guess, if, after this pandemic is over -- we see fewer cases of H1N1 and other upper-respiratory transmittable viruses -- we could conclude that periodic, world-wide self quarantine should be written into laws of public health.
May be every 5 years or so, for 1.5 months stop all non-essential travel, work commute, public gatherings and so on.
Do not know if the above idea has any historical precedent, but, clearly our world has developed into very inter-connected, redundant, essentially unbreakable pathogen re-transmission network. So we need to respond to this.
Alternatively, just mandate giving service workers more paid sick days and actually enforce the laws against making them come in while sick. Allow telecommuting to be the norm. Implement better, universal healthcare.
As it turns out, lots of crazy leftist policies are actually good for the public health.
As it turns out, lots of crazy leftist policies are actually good for the public health.
As unemployment is about to skyrocket during this pandemic, America's tight coupling of healthcare with purchasing power is going to be revealed as a poor design for keeping maximal citizens healthy. Spain has nationalised all its private hospitals.
I am not sure that >"mandate giving service workers more paid sick days and actually enforce the laws against making them come in while sick" ,
is an alternative to what I suggested earlier
> "... word wide self quarantine should be written into laws of public health. May be every 5 years or so, for 1.5 months stop all non-essential travel, work commute, public gatherings and so on...".
With regards to your note on >"... lots of crazy leftist policies .. ."
In my view, centralized control of public health, appears to be a bottleneck to rapid response (not just because of process structuring, but also because massive centralization of money appropriation mandate, becomes a mechanism for unstoppable corruption spread, and non-meritocracy based promotions).
I never heard that conservatives are against telecommuting...
If anything there is, probably, a conservative sentiment against massive urbanization and globalization of supply lines.
is an alternative to what I suggested earlier
> "... word wide self quarantine should be written into laws of public health. May be every 5 years or so, for 1.5 months stop all non-essential travel, work commute, public gatherings and so on...".
With regards to your note on >"... lots of crazy leftist policies .. ."
In my view, centralized control of public health, appears to be a bottleneck to rapid response (not just because of process structuring, but also because massive centralization of money appropriation mandate, becomes a mechanism for unstoppable corruption spread, and non-meritocracy based promotions).
I never heard that conservatives are against telecommuting...
If anything there is, probably, a conservative sentiment against massive urbanization and globalization of supply lines.
Ahh, indeed. Unlike the meritocratic private insurance industry, which definitely doesn't benefit from and encourage corruption, "centralized control of public health" would be a total waste of taxpayer money! It's not as if every country with a system like that is exponentially more functional and livable than those without!
I doubt it would stop the flu, etc. Maybe slow it down for a little bit, but well there are different strains of flu every year, it stands to reason that every year it starts from just a small group and rapidly spreads. I think the effect on the flu will be negligable shortly after quarintine ends.*
*IANA-person who knows about this subject.
*IANA-person who knows about this subject.
Supposedly, the February break that New England school districts follow was designed to stop the flu. Take everyone out of school for a week to stop the spread, hope that everyone that shows symptoms by the end of the week stays home.
Of course, that doesn't work when kids still go to school when sick, which they do. When I was a kid the school used to give awards to kids with perfect attendance. Now February break seems to be an annoyance for most parents and they find daycare alternatives, as well as sending marginal (or even outright sick!) children to school.
Of course, that doesn't work when kids still go to school when sick, which they do. When I was a kid the school used to give awards to kids with perfect attendance. Now February break seems to be an annoyance for most parents and they find daycare alternatives, as well as sending marginal (or even outright sick!) children to school.
with the institutionalized, periodic prophylactic quarantine -- I was thinking, we could break/slowdown the pathogen re-transmission network (at least temporary).
I was thinking that the above realization, could come as outcome of 'what could be done better' analysis, at the end of this pandemic.
I was thinking that the above realization, could come as outcome of 'what could be done better' analysis, at the end of this pandemic.
Here is the problem. I'm suffering with what appears to be mild Covid-19 and I have experienced a mild loss of taste. Therefore it could be dismissed as 'just a cold' for people like me.
From ""Rapid Clinical Evaluation of Anosmia - The Alcohol Sniff Test" (https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaotolaryngology/article-...):"Standard 70% isopropyl alcohol preparation pad is opened such that 0.5 cm of the pad itself is visible. The alcohol pad is placed beneath the patient's nostrils while the patient inspires twice, to familiarize himself or herself with the alcohol odor, and the subject is asked if he or she detects an odor. Odor thresholds for alcohols are 2 or more orders of magnitude lower than trigeminal thresholds for the same stimuli.6 Thus, an anosmic will detect the presence of alcohol trigeminally only when it is extremely close to the nose. The alcohol pad is withdrawn and the threshold test begun. The subject is asked to close the mouth and eyes, breathe normally, and indicate when the odor is detected. Active sniffing and deep inspiration are discouraged. The basic procedure follows the method of limits. A standard metric tape measure is extended downward from the patient's nares and held in place (Figure I ). The alcohol pad is placed 30 cm below the nose and, with each expiration, is moved 1 cm closer to the nares until the subject detects the presence of odor. The distance from the anterior nares to the alcohol padis measured in centimeters at the point at which the subject first detects the odor. The procedure is repeated 4 times and the mean distance defines the threshold.Butanol ThresholdFor purposes of comparison, all of the subjects completed a standard olfactory threshold test. A series of 10 concentrations of butanol ( -butyl alcohol) was used to determine absolute olfactory threshold sensitivity. The highest butanol concentration consisted of 4% vol/vol in distilled water. Each successive dilution was one third of the preceding dilution. Two "blanks," containing only distilled water, were also prepared. All bottles, including blanks, contained 60 mL of liquid. Olfactory threshold was assessed with a modified version7 of a 2-alternative, forced-choice,ascending method of limits procedure.8 The subject was presented with 2 bottles, one containing the odorant and the other consisting of distilled water. Each nostril was tested separately. The spout of the bottle was inserted into the nos tril of interest. The subject was asked to squeeze the bottleto generate a puff of air. The subject did this with both bottles. Subjects were asked to identify which of the 2 bottles contained the stronger odor.All subjects began at the lowest concentration to avoidadaptation.9 Incorrect choices led to presentation of a higher concentration and correct choices led to continued presentation of the same concentration to a criterion of 5 successive correct responses. The presentation of the odorantand blank were randomized for each comparison trial and the nostril to be tested first was also randomly determined. There were approximately 45 seconds between trials to allow time for recovery of the olfactory system and for the odor molecules to collect in the head space of the bottle."
However, this test has been called imprecise (https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.2500/ajra.2017.31.44...).
If the paper is true, one could do spot checks today to estimate the true IFR in every country tomorrow on a shoestring budget.
https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/17/a-fiasco-in-the-making-a...
Depending on the results that might save trillions of dollars.
However, this test has been called imprecise (https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.2500/ajra.2017.31.44...).
If the paper is true, one could do spot checks today to estimate the true IFR in every country tomorrow on a shoestring budget.
https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/17/a-fiasco-in-the-making-a...
Depending on the results that might save trillions of dollars.
It seems this test would be extremely sensitive to air currents in the room, like an air vent anywhere near the person.
Tell people not to test in an obvious draft? It would only be indicative on a population scale anyway, surely. Seems worth trying; an experiment that some of the millions of school kids at home could easily do once a week over the next 6 weeks or so.
So, we need a data collection website?
So, we need a data collection website?
The testing for Covid doesn't help anyone that has it, it helps all of us as a community. The health agencies need to know how many people have it and where to direct resources and understand if they need to increase (or are able to decrease) the restrictions to movements and gatherings.
There is no special treatment yet available for Covid, so whether or not your doctor knows you have it won't change how they treat you.
There is no special treatment yet available for Covid, so whether or not your doctor knows you have it won't change how they treat you.
I couldn't read the article, but of course the usefulness of this test also depends on the time of onset of the symptoms wrt the disease.
My sense of smell is 100% gone as this is written
One needs no formal test it is blatantly obvious when the smell is gone
People often lose smell when they have a cold. Is this loss different?
The researcher who first described this symptom said that some mothers said they couldn't smell the full diapers of their kids, so: yes
https://www.faz.net/aktuell/gesellschaft/gesundheit/coronavi...
A severe cold can definitely do that too.
I had the virus. This happened to me. The loss of smell and taste is as if someone completely cut off that function from your body. No stuffy nose during the illness, pre, during or post. It started coming back after about a week.
Isn't that due to mucus buildup in the nose? I think Covid doesn't have that.
I had a cold once that led to a total anosmia that lasted for over a week after my nose had cleared. It was very disturbing. I couldn’t smell anything at all. Not peanut butter, ammonia, gasoline, anything. Then like a light switch it all turned back on.
It's a possible symptom but not a primary symptom, at 30~40% the anosmia seems way more frequent than nasal congestion.
[deleted]
I had lost my sense of smell, had a very mild fever for 3 weeks that started to turn into a dry cough. But yesterday all symptoms seem to have stopped. Hopefully I’ve already had it but impossible to say...
Take care of yourself over the next few days. I've seen reports from people where this was phase 1. Phase 2 a few days later was flu-like symptoms, and phase 3 a few days after that was difficulty breathing (and yes, they felt better between phases). Anecdotal, but IMO worth baring in mind!
Did you get your sense of smell back???
It seems fine now, but cough has returned, was getting worse but a really good deep sleep seems to have helped (5htp + zinc + phosphatidylserine + 1mg melatonin).
This whole covid-insanity has a huge knowledge hole about the mild cases, which do not require hospitalizations and would show what the vast majority of the population can expect: nothing.
but I guess if you don't die it won't generate clicks and viral shares, so nobody care about your recovery. kthxby. just kidding. glad to know you are fine. just remember that recurring infections by variations is what killed young brave doctors. continue to take care.
but I guess if you don't die it won't generate clicks and viral shares, so nobody care about your recovery. kthxby. just kidding. glad to know you are fine. just remember that recurring infections by variations is what killed young brave doctors. continue to take care.
~50% will be asymptomatic, of the remaining 50% you'll see a range of issues from "mild" illness, to feeling like a truck hit you, to hospitalization, to critical care.
I do not think however that COVID is sensationalized. If nothing is done, we would see 100ks - >1M deaths. That is traumatic for a society. Those numbers of course, would result from 100M+ people infected.
I do not think however that COVID is sensationalized. If nothing is done, we would see 100ks - >1M deaths. That is traumatic for a society. Those numbers of course, would result from 100M+ people infected.
Can we get a source for the 50% asymptomatic claim?
Not doubting you just never heard it before
Not doubting you just never heard it before
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8109829/Half-infect...
Here's a news article about the Diamond Princess. There's an accompanying paper, but it might take me some time to find it. Another paper about the experience in Wuhan reported a similar figure.
edit:
https://cmmid.github.io/topics/covid19/severity/diamond_crui...
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.03.20030593v...
Here's a news article about the Diamond Princess. There's an accompanying paper, but it might take me some time to find it. Another paper about the experience in Wuhan reported a similar figure.
edit:
https://cmmid.github.io/topics/covid19/severity/diamond_crui...
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.03.20030593v...
I know this is not research, but two friends of mine that are reporting symptoms of covid19 and report anosmia are also reporting ageusia (loss of taste), not sure if this has been or will be confirmed by research though. It's been around 4 days since they started complaining about this already.
From what I understand, the sense of taste is intertwined with the sense of smell.
https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-connection-between-taste-a...
https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-connection-between-taste-a...
It definitely is. I know a relative who lost their sense of smell and they also report being unable to taste anything other than plain salt, sweet, pepper-heat, sour, and bitter. They have lost the ability to taste spices, recognize different types of sour, etc.
I had an infection that's not unlikely to have been Covid-19 last week, and lost both taste and smell for ~5-6 days (otherwise relatively mild symptoms, strong cough and fever for a few days, but no severe impact on breathing).
The loss was so complete that I couldn't smell household garbage, taste strong blue cheese or get anything from extremely spicy chilis except for the physical sensation - it was quite eery and very unlike the reduced senses you'd get with the common cold.
The loss was so complete that I couldn't smell household garbage, taste strong blue cheese or get anything from extremely spicy chilis except for the physical sensation - it was quite eery and very unlike the reduced senses you'd get with the common cold.
I had the same thing like a week ago. I couldn’t even smell an orange, directly under my nose, or my 1 year old’s poopy diaper. Never happened before in my life. I actually googled what could cause it at the time. Lasted for 3-4 days.
Other symptoms included an intermittent headache and nausea. Nothing else except for coughing very rarely and a fever that never topped 100.
Other symptoms included an intermittent headache and nausea. Nothing else except for coughing very rarely and a fever that never topped 100.
> not sure if this has been or will be confirmed by research though
Definitely not research but I've read several comments on /r/italy that were mentioning just that, i.e. loss of smell combined with loss of taste for some of the commenters in there or their friends/acquaintances (who also had other covid-related symptoms). I've first read this 3 or 4 or days ago, so it was not written as responses to articles like these (which have started showing up in the last two or so days).
Definitely not research but I've read several comments on /r/italy that were mentioning just that, i.e. loss of smell combined with loss of taste for some of the commenters in there or their friends/acquaintances (who also had other covid-related symptoms). I've first read this 3 or 4 or days ago, so it was not written as responses to articles like these (which have started showing up in the last two or so days).
> loss of smell combined with loss of taste
It could be related to the fact that Spring is starting in the Northern Hemisphere, and thus, the body reacts to the increased amount of polen in the air.
I'm allergic, so it's normal for me to suffer those symptoms every Spring.
It could be related to the fact that Spring is starting in the Northern Hemisphere, and thus, the body reacts to the increased amount of polen in the air.
I'm allergic, so it's normal for me to suffer those symptoms every Spring.
Yea, why are you just guessing random stuff? You can't smell when you are having allergies because your sinuses are full of snot and your nose is clogged, not because your smell receptors stop working.
The German researchers who first described these symptoms grouped loss of smell together with loss of taste. They saw this in 2/3 of their cases.
When they report ageusia, do they specifically mean sweet/salty/bitter/etc?
I had COVID-19 and lost almost all smell senses (no symptoms of a stuffy nose or mucus). I could still taste sweet, salty, bitter, sour, umami. But I could not tell you where those tastes came from. It was difficult to cook in that time, and food was very bland and meaningless. Lasted for about a week.
I could smell laundry detergent very faintly so I know I had not completely lost the sense. I also felt a pain in the back of my nose/top of head as if I had water go up it, so I assume something was irritating that part of my nose. A dry cough has started to take place only after the fever stopped and I noticed my breathing is a bit harder than before the virus took over.
I could smell laundry detergent very faintly so I know I had not completely lost the sense. I also felt a pain in the back of my nose/top of head as if I had water go up it, so I assume something was irritating that part of my nose. A dry cough has started to take place only after the fever stopped and I noticed my breathing is a bit harder than before the virus took over.
an Italian doctor infected with the virus reported and warned for those symptoms.
Full text: (site is going up and down):
Post-viral anosmia is one of the leading causes of loss of sense of smell in adults, accounting for up to 40% cases of anosmia. Viruses that give rise to the common cold are well known to cause post-infectious loss, and over 200 different viruses are known to cause upper respiratory tract infections. Previously described coronaviruses are thought to account for 10-15% cases. It is therefore perhaps no surprise that the novel COVID-19 virus would also cause anosmia in infected patients.
There is already good evidence from South Korea, China and Italy that significant numbers of patients with proven COVID-19 infection have developed anosmia/hyposmia. In Germany it is reported that more than 2 in 3 confirmed cases have anosmia. In South Korea, where testing has been more widespread, 30% of patients testing positive have had anosmia as their major presenting symptom in otherwise mild cases.
In addition, there have been a rapidly growing number of reports of a significant increase in the number of patients presenting with anosmia in the absence of other symptoms – this has been widely shared on medical discussion boards by surgeons from all regions managing a high incidence of cases. Iran has reported a sudden increase in cases of isolated anosmia, and many colleagues from the US, France and Northern Italy have the same experience. I have personally seen four patients this week, all under 40, and otherwise asymptomatic except for the recent onset of anosmia – I usually see roughly no more than one a month. I think these patients may be some of the hitherto hidden carriers that have facilitated the rapid spread of COVID-19. Unfortunately, these patients do not meet current criteria for testing or self-isolation.
While there is a chance the apparent increase in incidence could merely reflect the attention COVID-19 has attracted in the media, and that such cases may be caused by typical rhinovirus and coronavirus strains, it could potentially be used as a screening tool to help identify otherwise asymptomatic patients, who could then be better instructed on self-isolation.
Given the potential for COVID-19 to present with anosmia, and the reports that corticosteroid use may increase the severity of infection, we would advise against use of oral steroids in the treatment of new onset anosmia during the pandemic, particularly if it is unrelated to head trauma or nasal pathology (such as nasal polyps).
There is potential that if any adult with anosmia but no other symptoms was asked to self-isolate for seven days, in addition to the current symptom criteria used to trigger quarantine, we might be able to reduce the number of otherwise asymptomatic individuals who continue to act as vectors, not realising the need to self-isolate. It will also be an important trigger for healthcare personnel to employ full PPE and help to counter the higher rates of infection found amongst ENT surgeons compared to other healthcare workers.
Post-viral anosmia is one of the leading causes of loss of sense of smell in adults, accounting for up to 40% cases of anosmia. Viruses that give rise to the common cold are well known to cause post-infectious loss, and over 200 different viruses are known to cause upper respiratory tract infections. Previously described coronaviruses are thought to account for 10-15% cases. It is therefore perhaps no surprise that the novel COVID-19 virus would also cause anosmia in infected patients.
There is already good evidence from South Korea, China and Italy that significant numbers of patients with proven COVID-19 infection have developed anosmia/hyposmia. In Germany it is reported that more than 2 in 3 confirmed cases have anosmia. In South Korea, where testing has been more widespread, 30% of patients testing positive have had anosmia as their major presenting symptom in otherwise mild cases.
In addition, there have been a rapidly growing number of reports of a significant increase in the number of patients presenting with anosmia in the absence of other symptoms – this has been widely shared on medical discussion boards by surgeons from all regions managing a high incidence of cases. Iran has reported a sudden increase in cases of isolated anosmia, and many colleagues from the US, France and Northern Italy have the same experience. I have personally seen four patients this week, all under 40, and otherwise asymptomatic except for the recent onset of anosmia – I usually see roughly no more than one a month. I think these patients may be some of the hitherto hidden carriers that have facilitated the rapid spread of COVID-19. Unfortunately, these patients do not meet current criteria for testing or self-isolation.
While there is a chance the apparent increase in incidence could merely reflect the attention COVID-19 has attracted in the media, and that such cases may be caused by typical rhinovirus and coronavirus strains, it could potentially be used as a screening tool to help identify otherwise asymptomatic patients, who could then be better instructed on self-isolation.
Given the potential for COVID-19 to present with anosmia, and the reports that corticosteroid use may increase the severity of infection, we would advise against use of oral steroids in the treatment of new onset anosmia during the pandemic, particularly if it is unrelated to head trauma or nasal pathology (such as nasal polyps).
There is potential that if any adult with anosmia but no other symptoms was asked to self-isolate for seven days, in addition to the current symptom criteria used to trigger quarantine, we might be able to reduce the number of otherwise asymptomatic individuals who continue to act as vectors, not realising the need to self-isolate. It will also be an important trigger for healthcare personnel to employ full PPE and help to counter the higher rates of infection found amongst ENT surgeons compared to other healthcare workers.
Normally, my wife has a far superior sense of smell than I do. Today we were driving behind a car burning oil and as I searched for the recirc button to close off the vents she was perplexed as to why. Now I'm a bit concerned.
Oh no is this a permanent loss of sense of smell?
This has been a personal fear, the death toll is significant, however being in a younger demographic I am more readily concerned (personally, not trying to be callous) with permanent disability. After seeing what SARS left people with I had a new appreciation for the other side of "recovered". It seems too early to tell long term effects, hopefully everything is temporary.
No, it seems not.
Copy of article: https://beta.trimread.com/articles/8606
Oh man. The girl I'm seeing just came back from traveling to Peru for spring break last week. She said she hasn't been able to smell for about a week, and most of the others in her group are reporting the same symptom.
The girl you "were" seeing >:/
Starting to emerge that anorexia (loss of appetite) is a symptom in many cases, might be related to not being able to smell or taste.
Google Trends shows a massive spike as well https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&q=...
March 15 shows an uptick in "loss of smell" in USA
https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&ge...
https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&ge...
I had this starting around March 6th and it lasted for approximately a week.
I could barely smell some things like say peppercorns, or coffee beans, but the intensity was 1/100th of what it should have been.
I never had a fever or a cough but I did feel a bit more tired than usual.
I could barely smell some things like say peppercorns, or coffee beans, but the intensity was 1/100th of what it should have been.
I never had a fever or a cough but I did feel a bit more tired than usual.
I lost my sense of smell when I took a zinc tablet to prevent covid-19 (serious but funny). Maybe I shouldn't have dissolved it in my throat (as was suggested). Zinc is really bitter! My sense of taste is off too - nothing tastes good.
Thanks to this thread, I won't know whether my diminished smell is from the zinc tablet or I've contracted Covid-19!
Time will tell, maybe.
Thanks to this thread, I won't know whether my diminished smell is from the zinc tablet or I've contracted Covid-19!
Time will tell, maybe.
I had these symptoms back in early December. This was before we even really knew about it in the US.
I was really sick for about 2 weeks, which included a mild fever for a couple of days.
I remember thinking that I can't remember being this sick in a long time and I wonder now if I had the Covid-19 infection.
I was really sick for about 2 weeks, which included a mild fever for a couple of days.
I remember thinking that I can't remember being this sick in a long time and I wonder now if I had the Covid-19 infection.
What about a headache and/or body aches? Been having mild symptoms of this for the last week+ and I'm in a corona hotspot (NYC). Smell seems to be ok, but I'm not sure of a good way to test other than smelling something strong.
Headaches and muscle aches are typically symptoms of normal flu and not COVID if what I read online yesterday is correct (can't recall the source sorry).
I saw this image with a table of symptoms and how common they are with COVID-19, a cold, the flu, and allergies:
https://i.imgur.com/83fu3XR.jpg
(I can't vouch for the accuracy)
https://i.imgur.com/83fu3XR.jpg
(I can't vouch for the accuracy)
I read that a headache is a COVID symptom.
Well Coronaviruses also are sometimes behind " the common flu". Headaches are not unique to Corona.
As many people are taking zinc supplements it's worth noting zinc in high doses causes this effect too so hard to say the effect being driven by covid or zinc popping or both.
Is this full loss or partial? (article isn't loading for me)
For me I could still smell strong laundry detergent very faintly. But the sense of smell appeared to be completely gone as if my olfactory nerve had been snipped.
Wow, thank you for sharing. I assume you're thankfully fine now? Can I ask how long it took, how bad things got, etc.?
Is this loss of scent permanent or temporary?
It's probably temporary as it is basically being listed as a symptom.
The significance here is that it may be a symptom of infection in those who are otherwise asymptomatic. Thus it potentially serves as a quick and dirty test for who should err on the side of self isolating even if they don't feel sick to try to stop the spread.
The significance here is that it may be a symptom of infection in those who are otherwise asymptomatic. Thus it potentially serves as a quick and dirty test for who should err on the side of self isolating even if they don't feel sick to try to stop the spread.
In my case, full loss was temporary, but the reduction permanent and still lasting to this day several years later
Maybe it will be different for covid?
Maybe it will be different for covid?
I am no expert but I believe that when caused by an infection it is usually temporary.
The virus only existed since ~November or December last year. There's no way anyone could reasonably tell you if its temporary or permanent.
If most of the people that noted the loss from the infection also reported that they got it back, that would be decent evidence that it was temporary.
This is dumb. Loss of sense of smell (and changes in the perception of taste) is also a "marker" for cold, flu, and _allergy_. Allergy season is ramping up as we speak.
Case in point: I had this a week ago. I'm pretty sure I don't have COVID19 though, even though I'm in Wuhan, WA.
Case in point: I had this a week ago. I'm pretty sure I don't have COVID19 though, even though I'm in Wuhan, WA.
Why don’t you think you’ve had it?
No symptoms whatsoever. No rise in temperature (as measured from the forehead using IR thermometer), no cough, no tightness of chest, no tiredness. My wife and son had the sniffles shortly before (which is not a symptom of COVID19), but also no fever or cough. I didn't even have the sniffles. I also work from home, so I barely get out of the house even without a quarantine, other than to go for a hike or to buy groceries. I've embraced social distancing years ago. :-)
Isn't a large proportion of cases asymptomatic?
yes.
I have these symptoms (loss of smell and partial loss of taste) every spring. _Millions of people_ have these symptoms every spring.
Let's not create even more panic than there already is. That, above all, was my point.
Let's not create even more panic than there already is. That, above all, was my point.
The desired effect of telling people about temporary anosmia symptoms that go along with infection is to help them make more informed decisions about when they may be infected and to quarantine themselves. The point is not to cause "panic", but sometimes a little fear is actually necessary to motivate people into action. In this particular case, slightly more fear is probably better.
The "desired effect" here is Internet brownie points. Unfortunately this time those brownie points could cost lives.
Surely people who have hayfever and get anosmia every year would realise that they therefore can't get an indicative result from such a test?
If healthcare surveys are being done one would expect questions on any recurring/existing conditions, and if people have any history of anosmia already.
If healthcare surveys are being done one would expect questions on any recurring/existing conditions, and if people have any history of anosmia already.
Under normal conditions? Yes. While shitting their pants from panic? Hell no. These people will now go out there and take up the limited testing capacity that could be better spent elsewhere.
[deleted]
Loss of smell from allergies is entirely different than the total binary switch off people are talking about here. It's not a stuffy nose issue.
Edit: i looked back and it was the 16th of February