Svalbard's Alcohol Quotas(sysselmannen.no)
sysselmannen.no
Svalbard's Alcohol Quotas
https://www.sysselmannen.no/en/alcohol/
162 comments
Anyone know the reasoning? I'm assuming its attempting to prevent alcoholism? I know Greenland and Iceland (to a lesser extent) suffer somewhat perhaps due to the light and isolation being contributing factors.
iceland taxes the heck out of it, and there are only a few stores where you can buy
But not, weirdly, at the airport. And they're proud of that. There are all kinds of signs up about how you can buy it at the airport on arrival and carry it in, duty free.
I paid $20 apiece for shots at a bar in Reykjavik. I paid (IIRC) $5 for a bottle at the airport.
(The bars are especially expensive. I'm told that all the Icelanders pre-game before going out drinking. If you plan to drink while in Iceland, pick it up on your way in.)
I paid $20 apiece for shots at a bar in Reykjavik. I paid (IIRC) $5 for a bottle at the airport.
(The bars are especially expensive. I'm told that all the Icelanders pre-game before going out drinking. If you plan to drink while in Iceland, pick it up on your way in.)
lots of airports do duty free. it's a good way to get regional hooch on the cheap.
You are mostly right, it is to prevent alcoholism like other attempts are still made in different countries to limit or ban soda and sweet drinks, cigarettes, some drugs, some or all guns. It is in general good for public health and bad for average IQ.
Why would preventing alcoholism be bad for average iq?
Could mean users are mostly low IQ and will die early.
Brain needs challenges and stimulation to develop; when people are taken care of, average IQ of society decreased over time. If you check the numbers there are several metrics where we regressed in the past hundreds of years, including reaction time, testosterones production, fertility etc. Good times create mediocre people and the times were better and better in the past centuries, while people got more and more mediocre.
Alcohol is purely bad for you, there's not much hormesis effect aside from the social ones - studies finding things like red wine is good for you have reverse causation issues. If you want to challenge people then give them useful challenges. Just randomly poisoning everyone is not useful.
The testosterone effect is not true (it went down in Finland and then went back up), and might've been positive (getting married causes both low testosterone and more children). Less children is due to being less religious.
Remember, eugenics isn't real!
The testosterone effect is not true (it went down in Finland and then went back up), and might've been positive (getting married causes both low testosterone and more children). Less children is due to being less religious.
Remember, eugenics isn't real!
> Good times create mediocre people
This is not even remotely true I don't know what you're basing this on.
This is not even remotely true I don't know what you're basing this on.
What’s wrong with being mediocre?
we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!
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Not mediocre compared to some hyper-competitive person, but mediocre compared to your potential. It seems pretty obvious that fully self-actualized people are happier. They get more of what they want, and feel fulfilled for doing so.
Your potential is an utterly subjective objective. I'm not arguing for or against, but feeling "fully self-actualized" is equally accomplished by achieving your goals or lowering your goals until they're easily achievable. It's more a function of self-esteem than it is any kind of objective challenge. Those with healthy self-esteem feel self-actualized, those with poor self-esteem will feel as though they're never at their best.
> Your potential is an utterly subjective objective
Good one.
> but feeling "fully self-actualized" is equally accomplished by achieving your goals or lowering your goals until they're easily achievable.
It's more correlated with finishing what you set out to do. But there's definitely a useful component of comparing yourself with others - if your bar is too low you'll know it even if you don't have the courage to raise it.
> Those with healthy self-esteem feel self-actualized, those with poor self-esteem will feel as though they're never at their best.
Why with the worst way to interpret this? Those who feel accomplished build self-esteem. Yes, it is circular, but it needs to start with something real. You can't just wait to feel good without doing anything to cause it.
Good one.
> but feeling "fully self-actualized" is equally accomplished by achieving your goals or lowering your goals until they're easily achievable.
It's more correlated with finishing what you set out to do. But there's definitely a useful component of comparing yourself with others - if your bar is too low you'll know it even if you don't have the courage to raise it.
> Those with healthy self-esteem feel self-actualized, those with poor self-esteem will feel as though they're never at their best.
Why with the worst way to interpret this? Those who feel accomplished build self-esteem. Yes, it is circular, but it needs to start with something real. You can't just wait to feel good without doing anything to cause it.
Yes, I’m sure increased, abusive consumption of a neurotoxin is sure to raise average IQ.
Nobody said that, you just put words in my mouth. Decreasing alcohol consumption is a positive thing, no doubts. Governments nanny-sitting people makes them dumb.
Some of the hardest drinkers I know are Finns. I'm not sure exactly why that would be, i.e. why Finns might drink more than Norwegians or Swedes, but this has been my observation. Keep in mind, n=low (I'd have to think about it, and I don't want to expend the brainpower right now).
The statistics link in a sibling comment says Danes consume most among the nordics.
The Danes drinks every day while the Finns drink it all in one sitting.
OK, but Finns aren't Nordics.
Oh they are:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_countries
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_countries
Oops, my bad. (Finns are not considered Scandinavians, and I conflated Scandinavians with Nordics.)
Thanks for correcting my mistake.
Thanks for correcting my mistake.
That Scandinavian thing isn't so cut and dried. Culturally Finns pretty much are Scandinavian. The only thing different really is the language. It's probably best to refer to Finland as Nordic, but calling it Scandinavian isn't such a terrible error, either
Rather common mistake, even among Scandinavians.
Finn here, can confirm. My username even reflects it.
Norway seems to have the lowest consumption per capital among the Nordics: https://www.statista.com/statistics/693505/per-capita-consum...
I can't speak for Svalbard specifically, but Norway in general has a long history of heavily taxing and regulating alcohol.
Alcohol stronger than beer can only be purchased at the state-run "wine monopoly", alcohol percentage stronger than 60% classified as narcotics and illegal, opening hours for alcohol sale (beer included) are mandated to be much shorter than for stores in general, no alcohol sales allowed on public holidays, Sundays or Saturdays after 3pm/6pm (wine+ and beer, respectively), etc.
Culturally, you can trace this back to the Protestant Christian heritage, where excessive alcohol consumption was considered both sinful and destructive. I'm certain there was something to the heavily negative view on the health- and socioeconomic effects of alcohol at the time (combined with poverty, hunger, cold, dark winters, isolation and the need for cooperating to thrive in such a climate), so I don't think it just boils down to unsubstantiated religious feelings.
There is still consensus that this is a good way of doing things, although the minority Christian conservative political wing are loudest about it.
Alcohol stronger than beer can only be purchased at the state-run "wine monopoly", alcohol percentage stronger than 60% classified as narcotics and illegal, opening hours for alcohol sale (beer included) are mandated to be much shorter than for stores in general, no alcohol sales allowed on public holidays, Sundays or Saturdays after 3pm/6pm (wine+ and beer, respectively), etc.
Culturally, you can trace this back to the Protestant Christian heritage, where excessive alcohol consumption was considered both sinful and destructive. I'm certain there was something to the heavily negative view on the health- and socioeconomic effects of alcohol at the time (combined with poverty, hunger, cold, dark winters, isolation and the need for cooperating to thrive in such a climate), so I don't think it just boils down to unsubstantiated religious feelings.
There is still consensus that this is a good way of doing things, although the minority Christian conservative political wing are loudest about it.
To be fair, excessive alcohol consumption (as in alcoholism) is very destructive.
However I don't think it's fair to punish everyone for this. Many people have no issues limiting their alcohol and a once-in-a-while binge is not an issue.
But anyway I would never want to go near Svalbard, wayyy too cold for me anyway :) And I couldn't cope with 3 months of continuous darkness.
However I don't think it's fair to punish everyone for this. Many people have no issues limiting their alcohol and a once-in-a-while binge is not an issue.
But anyway I would never want to go near Svalbard, wayyy too cold for me anyway :) And I couldn't cope with 3 months of continuous darkness.
What's interesting about this?
Do you know a lot of places with monthly alcohol purchase quotas?
Well, there are not that many tax-free places. If they didn't have quotas, there would no doubt be thriving businesses buying alcohol in Svalbard and selling it in the rest of Norway.
Transport costs might put a damper on that. Also, it sounds like it would also be subjected to import restrictions, even if it's the same country.
Smuggling is a thing, though. And transport costs tend to reduce as volume increases, and alcohol is a popular product...
Well, if we are talking illegal activities, Norway shares a long, marginally patrolled border with Sweden where alcohol is significantly cheaper. So if you are into smuggeling, I would try that first, before trying to arrange something up in the arctic sea.
Pre-covid, this was a thriving and mostly legal industry. There are quotas on how much may be imported for personal consumption.
Meanwhile, the Swedes go to Denmark for cheap alcohol, the Danes go to Germany, the Germans to Poland and the Poles to Ukraine. Thus Ukraine is the fixed point of the alcohol-flow function. This theorem was proven when I was a PhD student in a research group which contained a Norwegian, a Swede, a German, a Pole and a Ukrainian - we extrapolated the Danish connection point.
Meanwhile, the Swedes go to Denmark for cheap alcohol, the Danes go to Germany, the Germans to Poland and the Poles to Ukraine. Thus Ukraine is the fixed point of the alcohol-flow function. This theorem was proven when I was a PhD student in a research group which contained a Norwegian, a Swede, a German, a Pole and a Ukrainian - we extrapolated the Danish connection point.
Qatar has "alcohol license" for residents. Not sure about that but what i heard your employer has to say how much you get to drink.
https://www.angloinfo.com/how-to/qatar/lifestyle/food-drink/...
EDIT: yes article mentions this
The letter must be addressed to the Qatar Distribution Company, be stamped and signed by an authorised person within the company, and include the following information:
https://www.angloinfo.com/how-to/qatar/lifestyle/food-drink/...
EDIT: yes article mentions this
The letter must be addressed to the Qatar Distribution Company, be stamped and signed by an authorised person within the company, and include the following information:
The applicant's position within their company
The applicant's basic salary. The word 'basic' must be used. To get a permit a minimum salary is needed (4,000 riyals or 1,100 US dollars)
Whether the applicant receives an accommodation entitlement or has free accommodation
Whether the applicant is married
When applying for a permit an individual must fill in an application form, pay a returnable deposit and state their religionI remember something like this in Oman as well, back when I lived there in the late 80s/early 90s.
Looking at the situation now though, it looks like it might be a very tiny bit more liberal, in that you still need a "personal consumption licence", but the quota appears to have been done away with.
Looking at the situation now though, it looks like it might be a very tiny bit more liberal, in that you still need a "personal consumption licence", but the quota appears to have been done away with.
Maybe that the quotas are very low, or that there are quotas at all. Mainland Norway definitely doesn't have quotas like this; rather alcohol is simply made to be quite expensive.
When I read this my first thought was something like, "I bet that those who don't drink are making a bit of profit on the side by selling their allowances." However, I'm guessing that for Svalbard's dedicated drinkers ...they're finding a way around the import restrictions.
It would be interesting to hear how folks deal with the restrictions by someone that lives on Svalbard or has spent significant time there.
When I read this my first thought was something like, "I bet that those who don't drink are making a bit of profit on the side by selling their allowances." However, I'm guessing that for Svalbard's dedicated drinkers ...they're finding a way around the import restrictions.
It would be interesting to hear how folks deal with the restrictions by someone that lives on Svalbard or has spent significant time there.
> Mainland Norway definitely doesn't have quotas like this; rather alcohol is simply made to be quite expensive.
If you don't mind the higher price I'm sure you can still import it as long as you pay the duty. (The linked page merely says that you cannot import tax-free.) So ultimately it's the same situation as in (the rest of) Norway, but with some small allowance of cheaper tax-free alcohol. If they didn't have the quotas, people would arbitrage it.
If you don't mind the higher price I'm sure you can still import it as long as you pay the duty. (The linked page merely says that you cannot import tax-free.) So ultimately it's the same situation as in (the rest of) Norway, but with some small allowance of cheaper tax-free alcohol. If they didn't have the quotas, people would arbitrage it.
Maybe that the quotas are very low
24 bottles of liquor, 6 bottles of fortified wines, nearly 300 cans of beer, and unlimited wine annually is low? I'd hate to be the liver of anybody drinking that much.
24 bottles of liquor, 6 bottles of fortified wines, nearly 300 cans of beer, and unlimited wine annually is low? I'd hate to be the liver of anybody drinking that much.
Annually? Everything sounds high when you say it annually!
Looking at the numbers on a smaller scale, if you don't count the unlimited wine, the monthly quota works out to be about 2.2 drinks / night - about 1.5 shouts of liquor and less than 1 light beer a night.
Thats a pretty resonable amount of alcohol to consume - just slightly higher than the 14 drinks / week maximum that many health authorities recommend.
How would you feel if the government regulated how much sugar or salt you can eat, how many hours of video games you can play, or maybe even forced you to exercise 400 hours (per year)?
Looking at the numbers on a smaller scale, if you don't count the unlimited wine, the monthly quota works out to be about 2.2 drinks / night - about 1.5 shouts of liquor and less than 1 light beer a night.
Thats a pretty resonable amount of alcohol to consume - just slightly higher than the 14 drinks / week maximum that many health authorities recommend.
How would you feel if the government regulated how much sugar or salt you can eat, how many hours of video games you can play, or maybe even forced you to exercise 400 hours (per year)?
> How would you feel if the government regulated how much sugar or salt you can eat, how many hours of video games you can play, or maybe even forced you to exercise (400 hours / year)?
That's actually an interesting idea... Not saying I'd recommend it, but I'd be interested in how this affects a population at a large scale.
Requiring physical activity might lead to population demand for parks, more social interaction, less isolationism, less conflict. And I've had times where a hard limit on video games would've been nice. Incentivizing a society to not fall to their vices doesn't sound too bad.
That's actually an interesting idea... Not saying I'd recommend it, but I'd be interested in how this affects a population at a large scale.
Requiring physical activity might lead to population demand for parks, more social interaction, less isolationism, less conflict. And I've had times where a hard limit on video games would've been nice. Incentivizing a society to not fall to their vices doesn't sound too bad.
[deleted]
Two per day is not quite what the US government recommends:
Adults of legal drinking age can choose not to drink or to drink in moderation by limiting intake to 2 drinks or less in a day for men and 1 drink or less in a day for women, when alcohol is consumed. Drinking less is better for health than drinking more.
2/day is a recommended upper bound, applied on days where alcohol is consumed. Not the same as "you can drink 2/day year -round without consequence."
Adults of legal drinking age can choose not to drink or to drink in moderation by limiting intake to 2 drinks or less in a day for men and 1 drink or less in a day for women, when alcohol is consumed. Drinking less is better for health than drinking more.
2/day is a recommended upper bound, applied on days where alcohol is consumed. Not the same as "you can drink 2/day year -round without consequence."
> How would you feel if the government regulated how much sugar or salt you can eat,
One reason this would be bad is there is actually very little evidence that salt is bad for you. It's entirely possible most people don't get enough salt.
One reason this would be bad is there is actually very little evidence that salt is bad for you. It's entirely possible most people don't get enough salt.
I believe for the Bathurst weekend (V8 Car race) in Australia, people are limited to a carton of beer or a bottle of liquor a DAY per person.... Not sure if that says more about the Svalbard limits or my countrymen.
How is that a low quota? 24 cans of beer is a six pack every week. Plus four bottles of wine? And two bottles of liquor?
So a bottle of wine, a six pack, five shots, every week.
Gives me a headache just thinking about it.
I believe that there are studies that show that amount of alcohol significantly reduces life expectancy.
So a bottle of wine, a six pack, five shots, every week.
Gives me a headache just thinking about it.
I believe that there are studies that show that amount of alcohol significantly reduces life expectancy.
I find the law that requires you to carry a firearm more interesting: https://www.sysselmannen.no/en/weapon/
Being a remote town in the far north with unusual day/nighy cycles does require some strange laws to keep everyone safe and sane I guess.
Also, Tom has been there ofc: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFJ-ze2-SqU
Being a remote town in the far north with unusual day/nighy cycles does require some strange laws to keep everyone safe and sane I guess.
Also, Tom has been there ofc: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFJ-ze2-SqU
Gives me a bit of a Skyrim vibe, haha.
> I find the law that requires you to carry a firearm more interesting
That's not quite what it says. Firearms are only a recommendation.
> Due to the polar bear threat in Svalbard, anyone travelling outside the settlements must be equipped with appropriate means of frightening and chasing off polar bears.
> The Governor of Svalbard also recommends having firearms with you.
That's not quite what it says. Firearms are only a recommendation.
> Due to the polar bear threat in Svalbard, anyone travelling outside the settlements must be equipped with appropriate means of frightening and chasing off polar bears.
> The Governor of Svalbard also recommends having firearms with you.
There are levels of risk I am not prepared to accept. I'll carry an assault shotgun, an assault rifle, and a dedicated ammunition-hauling dog with me if I go outside a town in Svalbard.
I hope not: although, say, an M16 is a good weapon, you'd do better with something chambered in a full rifle cartridge (e.g. .30-06) against a bear rather than an intermediate cartridge
Alright, fine, then an FGM-148.
If a polar bear is charging me, I want his ancestors to feel what I'm going to do to him.
If a polar bear is charging me, I want his ancestors to feel what I'm going to do to him.
You can skip the dog. A polar bear can sprint at 40 km/h, so if you're attacked by one, you'll be lucky if you can squeeze off more than one or two shots.
Interesting. When I visited a few years ago I was told that you were required to carry a rifle outside of town to protect from the bears and that a handgun wouldn't be sufficient to protect from a mature polar bear. I guess the guide exaggerated.
That isn't necessarily a contradiction.
A handgun may well not have the stopping power. But something like pepper spray (bear mace) might.
A handgun may well not have the stopping power. But something like pepper spray (bear mace) might.
Requiring citizens to keep arms was actually quite common up until the 1800s, with some municipalities actually purchasing firearms for residents, with the expectation that they would be paid back as was manageable.
In which countries?
Nearly all of them, at least up through the end of the Napoleonic Wars.
I believe it became less popular with the popular revolutions of 1848 and the advent of universal conscription.
I believe it became less popular with the popular revolutions of 1848 and the advent of universal conscription.
I'm not a historian, but this doesn't match my understanding; that true weapons like swords and crossbows tended to be restricted, and peasants used scythes, clubs, etc. instead.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/268dmc/how_w...
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/268dmc/how_w...
Arround 1400, the King proclaimed that "every Englishman or Irishman dwelling in England must have a bow of his own height", at one point Tennis was banned to give more time to bow practice. By 1500s every man had to buy his 7 year old son a bow and teach him how to use it, and a bow+arrows must be kept in everyones house.
Crossbows on the other hand were practically banned, but this was more because a highly skilled longbowman was more deadly
Crossbows on the other hand were practically banned, but this was more because a highly skilled longbowman was more deadly
That's fairly unique to England, though, whose military power relied on longbows in a way not matched by rivals.
England and Switzerland come to the top of my mind, I’ll need to dig for a comprehensive list.
Killing polar bears there is prohibited though (they're a protected species). It's only allowed if it's the absolute last resort.
So it's not like people are going around shooting up polar bears for fun or anything :)
So it's not like people are going around shooting up polar bears for fun or anything :)
Maybe that there is a customs border internal to Norway?
Wikipedia on Svalbard:
“While part of the Kingdom of Norway since 1925, Svalbard is not part of geographical Norway; administratively, the archipelago is not part of any Norwegian county, but forms an unincorporated area administered by a governor appointed by the Norwegian government, and a special jurisdiction subject to the Svalbard Treaty that is outside of the Schengen Area, the Nordic Passport Union and the European Economic Area.”
“While part of the Kingdom of Norway since 1925, Svalbard is not part of geographical Norway; administratively, the archipelago is not part of any Norwegian county, but forms an unincorporated area administered by a governor appointed by the Norwegian government, and a special jurisdiction subject to the Svalbard Treaty that is outside of the Schengen Area, the Nordic Passport Union and the European Economic Area.”
Do you know of any other place that has quotas on alcohol consumption?
Sounds rather much for one person in one month.
2 cans a beer a day would not be excessive by most standards, that would add up to 60 cans a month.
24 cans of beer consumed in one sitting would be excessive.
24 cans of beer consumed in one sitting would be excessive.
Is it really so common to drink alcohol every day?
Depends on culture, both national and local. In some it's very common (like my dad has a beer every day after work, or France / Italy where a glass of wine at lunch is not uncommon).
Light wine was specifically exempt from the rules
I suspect it's not uncommon to find people who have wine nearly every day. Someone who is drinking two beers on many days is likely to have six on some days, making up for the odd day that they have zero.
The actual quota is less than one can per day, though, which seem too strict to me (with respect to a government restriction, I mean).
The actual quota is less than one can per day, though, which seem too strict to me (with respect to a government restriction, I mean).
A glass of wine after work to wind down is pretty popular no? (Culture: scandinavia)
It’s not in the UK at any rate, the average varies between 12 and 17 units of alcohol per week depending on age with most of that falling on Fridays and Saturdays. 2 cans of beer per day works out at 28 units, so is certainly substantially more than average. I would guess there is a bubble affect though, most of my friends drink only on special occasions line parties, and regular drinking at home would be perceived as alcoholic behaviour by most of them.
Well either its has changed since I lived there or your friends are not big drinkers. Regular drinking was not seen as anything out of the ordinary in the west country and London.
Editing to add - it is a good thing if it has changed.
Editing to add - it is a good thing if it has changed.
There was a post here where having a cocktail after work every day (in NYC IIRC?) was mentioned, the consensus seemed to me like that is a normal amount while for me that would have been too much even when I was a student and could tolerate a lot more alcohol (of course, purely by amount I’d have made it up on the weekend).
I almost feel the opposite: drinking every day is too much. One night out once a month is okay. (not drinking 24 bottles a night, though, except when celebrating Russ)
Same here.
Last time I drank alcohol was pre-COVID. I only drank 1-3 a month and only 2-4 beers and 2-4 shots.
Last time I drank alcohol was pre-COVID. I only drank 1-3 a month and only 2-4 beers and 2-4 shots.
I've known plenty of daily drinkers and I have no idea how they do it. If I have even one drink I can notice the effects the next day. Not that I'll be hung over per se, but just a little more tired, little less focused, little less patient with my kids.
So, I don't drink very often (I don't abstain completely either). Drinking every day seems like something that would really take a lot out of me.
So, I don't drink very often (I don't abstain completely either). Drinking every day seems like something that would really take a lot out of me.
It’s one bourbon, one scotch, and one beer per day, swapping for wine on Sundays.
More than I get through, but low for a serious boozer.
More than I get through, but low for a serious boozer.
24 cans of beer? Depending on the size that's between 8 and 14 litres a month, about 1.8-3.2 litres a week. At 4% that's at most 13 UK units per week (assuming you buy large cans) -- guidelines are 14 units per week. For say 330ml cans of Tiger it's 8 units a week, that's not a lot for one person.
Maybe you are confusing the word "guideline" here with actual recommendation. You are not suppose to be drinking 14 units per week. You are not suppose to even be drinking every week. In any case you still as much light wine as you can reasonably consume. 2 bottles of liquor and half a bottle of fortified wine on top of your beer. If you consume even that much everyone month I'd be calling you an alcoholic.
Someone drinking an average of 6x 33ml cans of 4.3% beer a week would not be called an alcoholic in any normal conversation. That's 4.4 litres of alcohol a year - less than half the US intake (9.8l), less than Norway (7.5l) and would fit well in the bottom half of countries by alcohol intake.
The ability to drink other things (scotch, wine, etc) is irrelevant if you only drink beer.
The ability to drink other things (scotch, wine, etc) is irrelevant if you only drink beer.
If only there was people who only drank one beer everyday and never more, however it is these same people who have the need to drink one beer every day that drink most at parties and get togethers or just in general over the week end.
Maybe it is just the lives I've seen ruined by alcohol that as made me grumpy about alcohol consumpsion, but I would be concerned if someone is drinking enough to have a hangover every weekend.
Maybe it is just the lives I've seen ruined by alcohol that as made me grumpy about alcohol consumpsion, but I would be concerned if someone is drinking enough to have a hangover every weekend.
I don't see how you could get a hangover from drinking 6x330ml cans of beer in a single evening, let alone across a week. You evidently have a chip on your shoulder over alcohol
Seems designed to move people from beer to wine and spirits? Or into home brewing?
Probably a thriving market in non-drinkers selling their quotas, too
Probably a thriving market in non-drinkers selling their quotas, too
I imagine that's the idea. Enough for one person with some margins. If you start buying beyond the quota, i.e. presumed to be buying for other people, then you'll have trouble.
A month? You couldn't keep a Royal Navy seaman in grog for a week on that.
Headline fooled me. To me quota usually means "you must do this much", this appears to be a limit.
I only know this from AWS, where it means "limits".
Disk quotas are common in all sorts of multiuser systems.
I think quotas work in both directions.... you have to do this many in certain time, or you only get this many in certain time.
Here is the definition....
:a proportional part or share
especially : the share or proportion assigned to each in a division or to each member of a body
Here is the definition....
:a proportional part or share
especially : the share or proportion assigned to each in a division or to each member of a body
Yeah, perhaps my life experience just had a lot of the "have to do this many" quotas, and the others were presented to me as limits. TIL.
Interestingly, XIX century Poland has exactly the "minimum amount consumed" kind of quotas of alcohol... It was legislated by nobles who were producing alcohol from their grain and figured they'd force peasants to but it from them, to periodically extract whatever monetary surplus the peasants (serfs) managed to build up. One of the result was of course rampant alcoholism, since the peasants now owned buckets of vodka and they figured they might as well drink it if they paid for it...
Considering how the only other thing I can think of to do with buckets of vodka in 19th century Poland is burn it, I'd probably go with drinking it, too. I'm not even sure burning it would work out well, either.
Vodka is great for washing clothes!
high proof alcohol works great in a lamp
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_burner
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_burner
Oh, yeah, I forgot about that. I was thinking more of burning it in an engine or for heat.
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IIRC that is one of the most shameful things I'm aware that Norwegians have done the last few centuries, forcing Sámi people to take booze as part of the payment for their work.
I always understood a quota to be a limit. Only in sales have I heard it used as you describe. For example look at EU milk quotas.
There are lots of examples outside of sales. Diversity hiring quotas, citation quotas for police, gender quotas for board of directors, survey quotas, productivity quotas, recruiting quotas (military, MLM orgs, etc), electoral gender quotas, factory production quotas, Amazon delivery driver quotas, and so on.
Fair point. I’m surprised I never thought about this before today.
Depends. I clicked through to read about mandatory alcohol consumption, but thinking about it further, consider the case where you have "1 GB of disk quota". In that case, it obviously means that you can use no more than 1 GB of disk, it definitely doesn't mean that you must use 1 GB of disk.
Wow: reading 1GB disk quota reminds me how far we have come: when I was in university we got a base quota of 1 MB (plus additional amounts of varying sizes for each course we were registered for, depending on how much space we were expected to need, but typically totalling less than 5MB).
This sounds very much like the Swedish alcohol importation laws.
You can bring a tax free quota into Sweden (and many other places for that matter) but you can’t buy tax free inside Sweden, can you?
Airports often have duty free shops just inside customs, so you technically might be able to on a return trip.
Yes, this is possible and legal in Sweden.
The other way to obtain cheap alcohol is to take a cruise via the island of Åland, which is not in the EU. If you plan to visit Åland, make sure to pick a ferry that actually stops there as opposed to just symbolically tossing out a mooring rope for a few minutes to satisfy the legal requirements.
Åland is in the EU, but the EU tax rules don't apply: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_member_state_territori...
> Private individuals resident in Svalbard must purchase their alcohol quota in Svalbard and are not able to import tax-free alcohol from the mainland to Svalbard.
I doubt local shops have particularly good assortment to choose from, do they?
I doubt local shops have particularly good assortment to choose from, do they?
same goes for Iceland, only place you can buy alcohol outside of a bar is from a government shop that closes at 18:00.
Iceland has their own breweries and i think you can get very reasonable beer, for example domestic ones
I can get very reasonable beer where I live... I make my own beer, wine, and mead.
ye but you have to buy them from the government shop don't you? They don't sell alcohol in corner shops like the rest of the anglosphere.
I guess that’s just for hard alcohol? Iceland has beer in tourist shops at least, if not grocery stores. But in tourist shops it’s expensive enough that you wouldn’t want to stock up there. I saw individual bottles for $10 (cheap beer) and $20 US (nice beer), for example, at the Gullfoss store.
Iceland does not have beer in tourist shops or grocery stores. Alcohol is only sold at the state run monopoly, bars and restaurants. What they sell at grocery stores and tourist shops is non alcoholic or with a very low (<2.25%) alcohol content, and they're mostly produced to circumvent the ban on alcohol advertising.
Iceland is not in the anglosphere :)
AFAIK Svalbard is weird in both immigration laws and a distinct tax structure from Norway. My guess is it has to do with tax avoidance schemes rather than consumption.
Svalbard's legal status is deeply weird. It's administered by Norway, but not subject to a lot of Norwegian law, and people from all Svalbard Treaty signatories including the US can legally rock up and work and stay as long as they like.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svalbard_Treaty
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svalbard_Treaty
This is not weird, this is awesome. There should be more places like this.
Throughout Norway, pretty much all sales of alcoholic beverages over 4.7% happens through state-run liquor stores (Vinmonopolet).
Their selection is pretty great, but obviously imposes limits vs. a totally open import arrangement. And if a local store doesn't have something in stock, you can order it for later pickup, much like at a library with multiple branches. I don't know how that works in Svalbard, since it's so remote, but I wouldn't be surprised if they follow more or less the same procedures.
Interestingly, since they are a single buyer for millions of people, the Vinmonopolet purchasers get some great deals. And, since it's state-owned and very regulated, there are rules about how much they can mark up a bottle vs. their purchase price. So, you see this weird phenomenon in which people from elsewhere in Europe will fly to Norway to buy a case of some vintage that turned out really well and as a result is super-expensive everywhere else.
Their selection is pretty great, but obviously imposes limits vs. a totally open import arrangement. And if a local store doesn't have something in stock, you can order it for later pickup, much like at a library with multiple branches. I don't know how that works in Svalbard, since it's so remote, but I wouldn't be surprised if they follow more or less the same procedures.
Interestingly, since they are a single buyer for millions of people, the Vinmonopolet purchasers get some great deals. And, since it's state-owned and very regulated, there are rules about how much they can mark up a bottle vs. their purchase price. So, you see this weird phenomenon in which people from elsewhere in Europe will fly to Norway to buy a case of some vintage that turned out really well and as a result is super-expensive everywhere else.
Interesting! Do you have any examples of wines like that? I tried to search and found nothing.
https://www.aperitif.no/artikler/frankrike-er-kanskje-ikke-b... Is an article from 2015. It mentions Petrus 2012, at that point available for nok 9500 at vinmonopolet, while winesearcher.com had it at nok 22000.
Interestingly, almost all "plain" European beers have either 5% or 4,9% of alcohol (Pilsners, Lagers etc.)
It seems this may also be a measure to boost local sales?
It seems this may also be a measure to boost local sales?
You don't know a lot about Norwegian politics on this subject if you'd even suggest that. In short it's a way for the government to limit and control the damages associated with alcohol consumption. While this would probably rub the average american the wrong way, most norwegians, including myself, approve of the system.
Other posters have given more detail but here is some reading:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinmonopolet#Foundation
https://www.vinmonopolet.no/social-responsibility
Other posters have given more detail but here is some reading:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinmonopolet#Foundation
https://www.vinmonopolet.no/social-responsibility
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About the selection in the state shops: It is better than what I could get in Indiana (US). If the local places don't stock it, they'll order it for you, and it is really, really easy. I'm gonna guess it takes longer to order to Svalbard, but it probably isn't too bad either.
In Sweden the monopoly shops have a really good assortment since they have no profit interest and can afford to provide shelf space for less popular beverages.
For the same reason they also are one of the better places in the EU to buy rare and expensive items (particularly wine due to lower taxes, but liquor as well) because they have country-wide buying power and the markup that the monopoly takes is a flat rate mandated by law. Example: https://www.thelocal.se/20181012/systembolaget-sells-rare-wh...
Norwegian here. The reason for the quotas is historical and were put in place to limit miners' consumption of beer and liquor. Interestingly there's practically no quota on wine, presumably because miners didn't care much for that.
You can't buy wine and liquor at local stores in Norway Svalbard, but there is a great selection in the state run monopoly stores (Vinmonopolet). In Longyearbyen there's one called Nordpolet (The North Pole, a pun on "pol" meaning both pole and being an abbrevation for monopoly).
You can't buy wine and liquor at local stores in Norway Svalbard, but there is a great selection in the state run monopoly stores (Vinmonopolet). In Longyearbyen there's one called Nordpolet (The North Pole, a pun on "pol" meaning both pole and being an abbrevation for monopoly).
Pennsylvania has monopoly state stores for liquor too.
When weddings used to last for days, the mine bosses here would go to the beer and liquor stores and tell them to stop selling to that group of people. Then when the drinks ran out, the wedding would end and the miners would go back to work.
When weddings used to last for days, the mine bosses here would go to the beer and liquor stores and tell them to stop selling to that group of people. Then when the drinks ran out, the wedding would end and the miners would go back to work.
More recently, the PA state-run liquor stores shut down for weeks during the covid scare and when they did open up, they only took a very limited number of orders online and over the phone. It was basically impossible to buy hard alcohol here for over a month. People were driving to other states to get it.
I could see it coming. I rarely buy anything, but picked up a bottle or two about 2 days before they announced the closure.
I guess technically it's not a full monopoly since they do allow distillers in the state to sell thier own product on premise. The place near me was selling some premixed handles for $60-80. Talk about price gouging.
I guess technically it's not a full monopoly since they do allow distillers in the state to sell thier own product on premise. The place near me was selling some premixed handles for $60-80. Talk about price gouging.
[PA Resident] You could (and still can) order liquor from PA distillers and have it shipped to your home! I remember not having to sign for anything and thinking sub-21 year old me would have loved this information. A nice workaround during the shutdowns
The US has a wild variety of drink laws that vary by state.
Many states have government run stores, some states allow beer and wine at grocery stores, but liquor must be sold in a separate store. Some states have laws that ban sales after 8pm, some 2am.
Utah is the worst because they limit the alcohol percentage in beer (Mormons don't drink and pushed for these laws) so the companies have to make special shittier Utah beers.
In some states you're not allowed to see the drink being made (maybe also Utah - can't remember) so they make it out of sight and bring it out.
Some counties are dry and you have to drive to the one over (usually lots of stores at the county line). I think some southern states have drive through liquor stores.
One reason I was happy to move to California is the lack of these 'blue laws' [0]. California may have a lot of signs warning you that everything causes cancer (and make it really hard to order a new shower head), but their alcohol laws are pretty permissive.
I don't know if there are any states that don't have open container laws - which is too bad, drinking PIMs in the park in the UK was great fun, and beers outside talking to people is a nice part of the London pub culture that would go well in American cities.
[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_law
Many states have government run stores, some states allow beer and wine at grocery stores, but liquor must be sold in a separate store. Some states have laws that ban sales after 8pm, some 2am.
Utah is the worst because they limit the alcohol percentage in beer (Mormons don't drink and pushed for these laws) so the companies have to make special shittier Utah beers.
In some states you're not allowed to see the drink being made (maybe also Utah - can't remember) so they make it out of sight and bring it out.
Some counties are dry and you have to drive to the one over (usually lots of stores at the county line). I think some southern states have drive through liquor stores.
One reason I was happy to move to California is the lack of these 'blue laws' [0]. California may have a lot of signs warning you that everything causes cancer (and make it really hard to order a new shower head), but their alcohol laws are pretty permissive.
I don't know if there are any states that don't have open container laws - which is too bad, drinking PIMs in the park in the UK was great fun, and beers outside talking to people is a nice part of the London pub culture that would go well in American cities.
[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_law
In south Carolina, right after prohibition up until a few decades ago, you were not allowed to advertise any signs (taller than 3 inches) on a liquor store that indicated you were a liquor store. So they marked themselves with big red circular dots instead (starting around 1940s). The laws have since relaxed but many liquor store still use the red dot and are often referred to as "red dot stores"
> I don't know if there are any states that don't have open container laws - which is too bad, drinking PIMs in the park in the UK was great fun, and beers outside talking to people is a nice part of the London pub culture that would go well in American cities
That's a big thing in Spain too, they even have a word for it (botellón). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Botell%C3%B3n
Here there's a big square where people sit in the sun during the day in small groups and drink.. Nothing wrong with that IMO.
That's a big thing in Spain too, they even have a word for it (botellón). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Botell%C3%B3n
Here there's a big square where people sit in the sun during the day in small groups and drink.. Nothing wrong with that IMO.
> California may have a lot of signs warning you that everything causes cancer, but their alcohol laws are pretty permissive.
Bars still close at 2am, though, which is lame.
Bars still close at 2am, though, which is lame.
Yeah true - they've tried to pass a 4am law a couple of times I think, but it's failed.
The Svalbard link reminds me of these stories about the volunteer bar in the research base in antarctica:
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/07/on...
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/aug/10/experie...
The Svalbard link reminds me of these stories about the volunteer bar in the research base in antarctica:
https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/07/on...
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/aug/10/experie...
>I don't know if there are any states that don't have open container laws
Louisiana is one. Most people associate New Orleans with drinking in public, but I believe there's no statewide law against it.
Louisiana is one. Most people associate New Orleans with drinking in public, but I believe there's no statewide law against it.
Random, but Longyearbyen should be on the "List of things that are surprisingly named after people." (e.g. German Chocolate Cake isn't from Germany, it's named after Samuel German).
I always thought it was named because staying at in such an isolated place, with month-long days and nights, for even a short period would feel like a "long year", but found on the Wikipedia page that it's actually named after John Munro Longyear.
I always thought it was named because staying at in such an isolated place, with month-long days and nights, for even a short period would feel like a "long year", but found on the Wikipedia page that it's actually named after John Munro Longyear.
Glad I don't live there, sod that.
For a sense of scale, the Svalbard archipelago has a population of about 3,000.
Antarctica's seasonal peak is around 5,000.
Antarctica's seasonal peak is around 5,000.
When I was in McMurdo station in Antarctica on the way to the South Pole I happened to be there at the same time as the Navy cargo unloading crew. McMurdo banned all alcohol sales while the Navy was in town.
For another sense of scale, Svalbard has 61,022 km^2 and Antarctica 14,200,000 km^2.
So even when Antarctica might have more people at times, its population density is still way lower.
So even when Antarctica might have more people at times, its population density is still way lower.
In Kangerlussuaq (Greenland), the price of booze goes way up after 6 pm.
Interesting... how exactly does this work? Like Happy Hours? Or do shop owners also have to pay more to distributors?
I was talking about bars/restaurants. I think it's banned at shops after 6 pm completely.
Also, from what I remember, there is a weekly quota at the store at McMurdo station in Antarctica, but I think that probably has more to do with limited supply than rampant alcoholism (there is also a quota for soda and LaCroix...).
Also, from what I remember, there is a weekly quota at the store at McMurdo station in Antarctica, but I think that probably has more to do with limited supply than rampant alcoholism (there is also a quota for soda and LaCroix...).
I don't get it. I read it as -
You have to pay tax on what you drink in Svalbard like the rest of the world.
You also get a small tax free quota.
You have to pay tax on what you drink in Svalbard like the rest of the world.
You also get a small tax free quota.
In case anyone is interested in Finland, a neighboring country's alcohol policies:
Alcohol has 1.2 to 80% ABV, anything less is classified as low in alcohol and different rules apply. Anything above isn't meant for consumption.
5.5% ABV drinks are the strongest you can buy in a normal grocery store. It used to be 4.5% and the drinks had to be fermented, no liquor blends for example were allowed. These days they're allowed.
Anything above 5.5% can only be bought from the state run monopoly, Alko, or ordered, which in itself is a complex issue and Finland is breaking the EU directives currently when it comes to that.
Anyone over the age of 18 can buy alcohol up to 22% ABV, you have to be over the age of 20 to buy stronger. Selling >22% stuff to an 18 year old is illegal.
Alcohol has 1.2 to 80% ABV, anything less is classified as low in alcohol and different rules apply. Anything above isn't meant for consumption.
5.5% ABV drinks are the strongest you can buy in a normal grocery store. It used to be 4.5% and the drinks had to be fermented, no liquor blends for example were allowed. These days they're allowed.
Anything above 5.5% can only be bought from the state run monopoly, Alko, or ordered, which in itself is a complex issue and Finland is breaking the EU directives currently when it comes to that.
Anyone over the age of 18 can buy alcohol up to 22% ABV, you have to be over the age of 20 to buy stronger. Selling >22% stuff to an 18 year old is illegal.
One of the first Swedish words I learned was Systembolaget, the state run liquor store. I you want something with more than 3.5% alcohol, they're you're store, as long as you have the foresight to show up before they close at 6 PM (1 PM on Saturdays). The booze cruise to Finland was the other place people get alcohol.