US bans dog imports from more than 100 countries(bbc.com)
bbc.com
US bans dog imports from more than 100 countries
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-57478076
130 comments
There are so many countries, hard to tease out which countries are still allowed. Their alphabetized lists grouped in odd categories are not very user friendly. From what I gather these are the allowed countries:
- Canada and Mexico
- Chile, Argentina, Uruguay
- All of western Europe, most of Eastern Europe except Ukraine (and Turkey if that's EE)
- Israel
- Japan, South Korea, Singapore
- Australia, New Zealand, Fiji
Who did I miss?
- Canada and Mexico
- Chile, Argentina, Uruguay
- All of western Europe, most of Eastern Europe except Ukraine (and Turkey if that's EE)
- Israel
- Japan, South Korea, Singapore
- Australia, New Zealand, Fiji
Who did I miss?
Hong Kong and Taiwan were explicitly excluded from the banned countries and political units.
Argentina where my wife’s new stud male is coming from is still ok. Thank god.
I don't get the downvote. What's wrong with being relieved one's partner's new pet will be allowed through?
I think some are interpreting it as a 'wife's boyfriend'/'cuck' joke meme comment?
Cuz people are assholes I guess.
Each year, approximately 1.5 million shelter animals are euthanized (670,000 dogs and 860,000 cats).
Breeding is cruel. Adopt.
Breeding is cruel. Adopt.
And just where are you going to get the specialized service, and search and rescue dogs?
We have 3-4 pups doing active SAR work, and countless ones doing ACTUAL service work (not ESA).
You don’t get that consistently from shelter mutts
We have 3-4 pups doing active SAR work, and countless ones doing ACTUAL service work (not ESA).
You don’t get that consistently from shelter mutts
A vast majority of dog breeders aren’t doing it for service work. They do it for profit. This is cruel and unnecessary.
Of course breeding dogs for work makes sense, because those dogs are needed and, due to the price, the market helps ensure there are few abandoned.
Of course breeding dogs for work makes sense, because those dogs are needed and, due to the price, the market helps ensure there are few abandoned.
Any reputable breeder will always take the dog back versus allowing it to goto a shelter. Most of the breed clubs insist on that as part of membership.
If people would stop buying from backyard breeders that don’t do any health testing, or post sakes support the canine world would be a lot better off.
Examples: a year ago we took back a dog that is 11 years old, he was a service dog for an old guy whose dementia got too bad to be able to even have a service dog. Then did 2k in dental work that he needed. And last we we found out he has cancer.
More? How bout the bitch that kept getting sick with giardia, that was coming from the grounds where her owners lived. They couldn’t move, due to a lease, we took her back, for 6-8 months patched her back into shape and kept her until her people could move. She’s happy and healthy now.
Don’t blame “breeders” for the over population problem though. If people wouldn’t buy crap dogs from the paper or ads on the street from shitty back yard breeders and other irresponsible owners there wouldn’t be this issue.
If people would stop buying from backyard breeders that don’t do any health testing, or post sakes support the canine world would be a lot better off.
Examples: a year ago we took back a dog that is 11 years old, he was a service dog for an old guy whose dementia got too bad to be able to even have a service dog. Then did 2k in dental work that he needed. And last we we found out he has cancer.
More? How bout the bitch that kept getting sick with giardia, that was coming from the grounds where her owners lived. They couldn’t move, due to a lease, we took her back, for 6-8 months patched her back into shape and kept her until her people could move. She’s happy and healthy now.
Don’t blame “breeders” for the over population problem though. If people wouldn’t buy crap dogs from the paper or ads on the street from shitty back yard breeders and other irresponsible owners there wouldn’t be this issue.
Purebreds are more desirable for a reason. They are better at whatever they were specifically bred to do.
Im sure pugs and bulldogs would disagree with you, if only they could breathe properly.
Pugs were bred to be lap dogs and they are very good it. They are small (poop less, less food, easier to handle) short fur, small jaws (less threatening)
High-Risk Dog Ban FRN : https://www.cdc.gov/importation/bringing-an-animal-into-the-...
The list of countries: https://www.cdc.gov/importation/bringing-an-animal-into-the-...
The list of countries: https://www.cdc.gov/importation/bringing-an-animal-into-the-...
Off topic but what an odd an inefficient way to organize and display the information. A bullet point list of countries grouped by continent (sort of?) and then one bullet point per first letter of country name.
> Asia and the Middle East, Eastern Europe
> • Afghanistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan
> • Bangladesh, Belarus, Bhutan, Brunei
> Asia and the Middle East, Eastern Europe
> • Afghanistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan
> • Bangladesh, Belarus, Bhutan, Brunei
Makes sense if you're just looking for a country. Find the group that kind of mentions your area then check alphabetically.
It includes India, China, Indonesia, Pakistan, Brazil and Russia, or most of the world by population. The largest nation in population not included is the U.S. itself. The next largest is Mexico at #10. So 8 of the 10 most populous countries are on the list, and one isn't eligible.
> Probably most of the dogs too
TFA says that those countries represent 6% of dog imports.
TFA says that those countries represent 6% of dog imports.
So where do imported dogs come from? Canada?
Also,
> Hundreds of these dogs had fraudulent rabies certificates,
Isn't this most easily fixed by requiring a post-immigration rabies shot?
Also,
> Hundreds of these dogs had fraudulent rabies certificates,
Isn't this most easily fixed by requiring a post-immigration rabies shot?
Probably people moving to the US from places like Europe (which is quite big, even though the individual countries in it are small - I know the US press used the small size of individual countries to play some slimy games with their Covid-19 related comparisons from time to time).
I assume it's mostly people who treat their pets as children, which is largely a Western phenomenon. So, yeah, Canada's probably a large source, as would be most of Western Europe.
We're talking about people that are moving? You don't have to treat your pet like a child to take it with you when you move...
The counterpoint I'd use is the way my grandparents treated their dogs: they were working animals, not pets. Never to be let in the house; their job is to watch the sheep in the barn or the fields, and being in the house is counterproductive for that. And, presumably, if you were moving transoceanic, you'd just get new guard dogs at your destination just like you'd get new sheep at your destination.
I know some working livestock dogs; they'd be upset to be taken from their herd, they wouldn't be to worried about switching people.
"not even a pet" is a level all on its own.
If it is a pet, an extra hundred to couple hundred dollars is not much compared to all the other costs of moving. Just vaccinations and neutering could be as much for a replacement.
If it is a pet, an extra hundred to couple hundred dollars is not much compared to all the other costs of moving. Just vaccinations and neutering could be as much for a replacement.
There's, apparently, a really interesting world of dog importing. I wonder if this was the paper that prompted this decision.
http://www.naiaonline.org/uploads/WhitePapers/USDA_DogImport...
http://www.naiaonline.org/uploads/WhitePapers/USDA_DogImport...
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I think you will find that dog (pet) importation is more highly correlated with higher income, thus while the highest population countries are listed, in % wise, higher migration will be from Europe.
In outside the covid pandemic, I think you will find that there is significant international travel for breeding and show purposes. Additionally, while I am unsure of the cost in the US, in a place like Australia the quarantine costs to bring pets into the country make it something more likely to be done by wealthier migrants.
In outside the covid pandemic, I think you will find that there is significant international travel for breeding and show purposes. Additionally, while I am unsure of the cost in the US, in a place like Australia the quarantine costs to bring pets into the country make it something more likely to be done by wealthier migrants.
Bolivia is on that list. When I moved to the states from Bolivia I brought my wife and children and our little pet.
I can imagine how much stress it would have added not being able to bring him with us.
This sucks but I can see why they are doing it. Very shitty situation.
I can imagine how much stress it would have added not being able to bring him with us.
This sucks but I can see why they are doing it. Very shitty situation.
I would not have relocated, period.
You can apply for an exemption, though, if you are a "lawful US resident" (their wording). Which adds to the already large documentation pile you need to submit.
You can apply for an exemption, though, if you are a "lawful US resident" (their wording). Which adds to the already large documentation pile you need to submit.
Wouldn't this be trivial, although maybe a little expensive, to circumvent by sending the dog through a layover to an allowed country? Dogs don't routinely carry passports indicating their origin, although that would be amusing.
I guess if the goal is to statistically minimize the spread of disease, it still works by decreasing the number of dogs coming in, though. I suppose it would depend on the replication rate of the disease in question whether that is effective.
I guess if the goal is to statistically minimize the spread of disease, it still works by decreasing the number of dogs coming in, though. I suppose it would depend on the replication rate of the disease in question whether that is effective.
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I wonder if your dog was born in America and has had all of his rabies shots in America, and you were just a digital nomad traveling.
I wonder if you could bring him back in or what would happen in that situation.
I wonder if you could bring him back in or what would happen in that situation.
According to the CDC you can, but you have to apply for a permit.
You won't be required to submit tithers if the shots have been done in the US. Which requires that this digital life of yours is less than 3 years long, as it's usually the max duration between rabies shots.
You won't be required to submit tithers if the shots have been done in the US. Which requires that this digital life of yours is less than 3 years long, as it's usually the max duration between rabies shots.
I wonder if I left in the next year or so with valid rabies shots, if the dog could travel with me.
> The pandemic-driven jump in dog adoptions was linked to a spike in dogs brought in to the US with falsified or fraudulent rabies certificates. During 2020, the CDC found more than 450 dogs arriving in the US with fake certificates - a 52% jump compared to the previous two years - Dr Emily Pieracci of the CDC told NPR.
So a million dogs are imported into the U.S. every year and the CDC is banning all importation because of 450 fraudulent cases?
So a million dogs are imported into the U.S. every year and the CDC is banning all importation because of 450 fraudulent cases?
googling shows that there is no good test for rabies, yet there is a test showing that vaccine had actually been done. I wonder why such an outright ban instead of the test requirement. Not being able to bring your dog may really be a big pain for people relocating to US (and i think it makes for the wrong filter as the people who would forego relocation in favor of staying together with their dog are the best kind of people).
This is likely less about rabies and people moving with their beloved pet, and more about protecting US-based breeders. The price difference for purebred dogs (and cats) can be as much as 10x inside the US vs outside. I know people who specifically traveled to get the pet they wanted at a discount.
There is thriving business by various rescue groups that are importing dogs. They can charge as much under the guise of travel costs and vetting. There is no reason to import STRAY dogs from other countries while there are millions of dogs in local shelters unadopted/rescues and are being euthanized daily.
There is thriving business by various rescue groups that are importing dogs. They can charge as much under the guise of travel costs and vetting. There is no reason to import STRAY dogs from other countries while there are millions of dogs in local shelters unadopted and rescues and are being euthanized daily.
This is about rabies. It's a horrible disease, the stuff of nightmares for three thousand years.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabies
And the chicken tax is about chickens. Cute velociraptors that cluck and lay eggs. Even though it is actually about installing fake seats in trucks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax
And condescension is about pretending the other person is dumb and explaining to them that the sky is blue and water is wet.
And American superiority is about somehow assuming that people in other countries don't know how to vaccinate against rabies.
And condescension is about pretending the other person is dumb and explaining to them that the sky is blue and water is wet.
And American superiority is about somehow assuming that people in other countries don't know how to vaccinate against rabies.
People are importing dogs with forged rabies certificates. This isn't some conspiracy to gouge dog lovers.
Well, not a conspiracy exactly, but I seriously doubt that someone paying $2000 for a puppy would refuse to pay $100 for all the necessary shots and an international veterinarian pet passport.
Why are they going abroad in the first place? Because the same puppy goes for $20000 in the US. $3000 (with vaccines and round trip flight) is still less than $20000.
This is not in any way theoretical by the way. People do this. Most will still go to the vet and comply with all the regulations once in the US. They are just looking to save a few bucks.
Why are they going abroad in the first place? Because the same puppy goes for $20000 in the US. $3000 (with vaccines and round trip flight) is still less than $20000.
This is not in any way theoretical by the way. People do this. Most will still go to the vet and comply with all the regulations once in the US. They are just looking to save a few bucks.
Sorry for being condescending.
I really don't know anything about the international dog trade so I can't comment on what people would or wouldn't do. (Twenty thousand dollars for a dog? Does it talk or grant wishes or something!?)
My response was more based on the hope I have that the CDC hasn't been compromised by the profit motive over their mission to prevent disease.
I really don't know anything about the international dog trade so I can't comment on what people would or wouldn't do. (Twenty thousand dollars for a dog? Does it talk or grant wishes or something!?)
My response was more based on the hope I have that the CDC hasn't been compromised by the profit motive over their mission to prevent disease.
That kind of money (and I'm approximating here) is for a dog with all the documents and one that can be used for breeding (not neutered/spayed). So in a way it's an investment.
I'm very skeptical of the motivations in this case. Many countries use disease control as an excuse to implement economic policies. I doubt that the US is immune.
I'm very skeptical of the motivations in this case. Many countries use disease control as an excuse to implement economic policies. I doubt that the US is immune.
> That kind of money (and I'm approximating here) is for a dog with all the documents and one that can be used for breeding (not neutered/spayed). So in a way it's an investment.
I see.
> I doubt that the US is immune.
Ugh, that pun! I'm slain. :)
I see.
> I doubt that the US is immune.
Ugh, that pun! I'm slain. :)
Glad you enjoyed it :)
I'm not into purebred dogs myself, just heard about this. One other thing that breeders must do is periodically "refresh" the gene pool. In order to do this they track down other breeders with dogs/cats of the same breed but with distant lineage (so usually in another country) and buy an animal. I've heard stories of an inexperienced breeder buying a puppy whose parents actually came from a kennel in the same town (and of course paying a ton to import said dog). You can imagine how much this new regulation is going to hurt the gene pool of the purebreds.
I'm not into purebred dogs myself, just heard about this. One other thing that breeders must do is periodically "refresh" the gene pool. In order to do this they track down other breeders with dogs/cats of the same breed but with distant lineage (so usually in another country) and buy an animal. I've heard stories of an inexperienced breeder buying a puppy whose parents actually came from a kennel in the same town (and of course paying a ton to import said dog). You can imagine how much this new regulation is going to hurt the gene pool of the purebreds.
I have always wondered why rabies vaccination is not given standard in childhood.
Rabies is incredibly scary -- you camp outside, a bat nips you in your sleep, and by the time you know anything has happened, it's too late.
Rabies is incredibly scary -- you camp outside, a bat nips you in your sleep, and by the time you know anything has happened, it's too late.
The number of human rabies cases in the US for humans is so incredibly low.
You're more than ten times as likely to die of E. coli.
https://www.cdc.gov/rabies/location/usa/surveillance/human_r...
You're more than ten times as likely to die of E. coli.
https://www.cdc.gov/rabies/location/usa/surveillance/human_r...
Who is getting nipped by bats in their sleep while camping? This seems like a very rare problem to have.
> I have always wondered why rabies vaccination is not given standard in childhood.
Because the side effects from the rabies vaccine are far more likely than you getting rabies unknowingly in the US.
We're talking 25 total cases from 2009 to 2018--about 2 per year.
If you start jabbing a couple million children willy-nilly, 1 or 2 of them will die of anaphylaxis or a secondary infection from the needle prick every year on the best of vaccines. And rabies vaccines aren't particularly modern or sophisticated.
Because the side effects from the rabies vaccine are far more likely than you getting rabies unknowingly in the US.
We're talking 25 total cases from 2009 to 2018--about 2 per year.
If you start jabbing a couple million children willy-nilly, 1 or 2 of them will die of anaphylaxis or a secondary infection from the needle prick every year on the best of vaccines. And rabies vaccines aren't particularly modern or sophisticated.
I had the rabies shot to travel a few years ago when I knew I’d be spelunking around bats. I think I’ve had just about every travel-related vaccine possible and rabies was by far the worst in terms of side effects.
I also didn’t know until after I was given the vaccine rundown but getting the shot doesn’t protect you like most vaccines do. The way it was explained to me was if you get bit without the shot you have hours to get to a hospital to get the vaccine for the first time but if you’ve had the shot and you get bit you have maybe a day to get to a hospital and get the vaccine again. When you’re in a remote area that extra time is crucial but I hadn’t realized rabies was still such a serious risk of potential infection even after vaccination.
I also didn’t know until after I was given the vaccine rundown but getting the shot doesn’t protect you like most vaccines do. The way it was explained to me was if you get bit without the shot you have hours to get to a hospital to get the vaccine for the first time but if you’ve had the shot and you get bit you have maybe a day to get to a hospital and get the vaccine again. When you’re in a remote area that extra time is crucial but I hadn’t realized rabies was still such a serious risk of potential infection even after vaccination.
That's not the case with me. I got the shots several days after exposure, and was told that if I was exposed anytime in the next 5 (10?) years I would need one booster shot only.
Our vet told us that there was no reason for concern when the dog caught a visibly sick bat. He was current on his shots, and he said vaccination was exceedingly effective to prevent rabies.
Basically, because we don't want to give kids unnecessary vaccines (contrary to what _some_ people say). We don't give yellow fever vaccines to everyone, only to people in high-risk areas.
Also, post-exposure treatment is almost 100% effective, so the vaccine goes down in priority
Also, post-exposure treatment is almost 100% effective, so the vaccine goes down in priority
>Also, post-exposure treatment is almost 100% effective,
Only if you know about the exposure before symptoms appear. In the parent's example you don't realize you were actually bit by a bat in your sleep.
Only if you know about the exposure before symptoms appear. In the parent's example you don't realize you were actually bit by a bat in your sleep.
I suppose it is possible, but is it really likely that you'll get bitten by a bat who draws blood and not wake up to the pain of such a bite? Is it likely you'll even get bitten by a bat at all? I thought you have to really fuck with them and be in like a cave or something to be exposed to that kind of risk. I mean, they hang upside down from high vantage points right? Unless you're sleeping in a tree and also flailing around your hands to try to beat the shit out of a bat in your sleep, I don't think any bat would come near you let alone attempt to bite your skin, let alone when you're just laying down and not moving around much.
Apparently the current risk calculus is that if you know you were sleeping in an enclosed area with bats, the vaccine will be recommended, because they can indeed occasionally bite relatively painlessly. (Source: I had two friends who slept in a barn and discovered the next day that there were bats living in the barn; they were then given the vaccine even though they didn't feel anything.)
It's a weird case of very large numbers being multiplied by very small numbers. Like, you're very unlikely to be bitten by a bat even if you're near one, a given bat is very unlikely to have rabies, if you did somehow get bitten by a rabid bat you're almost certain to die unless you get the vaccine (but the vaccine is almost certain to save you if so), and the vaccine is very expensive (and, in its older formulation, very unpleasant, though much less so more recently). So that's a lot of things that point in all different directions in terms of the decision.
It's a weird case of very large numbers being multiplied by very small numbers. Like, you're very unlikely to be bitten by a bat even if you're near one, a given bat is very unlikely to have rabies, if you did somehow get bitten by a rabid bat you're almost certain to die unless you get the vaccine (but the vaccine is almost certain to save you if so), and the vaccine is very expensive (and, in its older formulation, very unpleasant, though much less so more recently). So that's a lot of things that point in all different directions in terms of the decision.
When I was bit by a bat, I didn't feel it and only noticed the bite until I saw the tiniest amount of blood. I was awake too... Not saying it's a common occurrence, but rabies is such a terrible way to go.
Vampire bats specialized in drawing blood from sleeping victims without waking them. It is rare for them to find human targets, but it happens sometimes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vampire_bat#Human_health
My understanding is that a bat trapped in a building with humans can get dehydrated, and they try to get moisture from people's mouths when they're sleeping.
Not every one is super informed and insured. Millions of people would wait it out a while before seeking care.
Not commenting on the likelihood of rabies, but bats hang out at around human-height well away from caves all the time (at dusk/night, anyway). Not uncommon at all. Aside from hearing and seeing them flying low fairly often (which one does), it's not unusual for them to hit things like barbed wire fences and get killed, which means they must have been flying at that height.
Sure, I'm not arguing that it's impossible to get bitten by bat, but you'd have to be extremely unlikely to get bitten by one in your sleep, unless you sleep standing up and a bat flies straight into you somehow.
Ordinarily, yeah. Dunno whether bats do the same thing other mammals (including humans) do when they're symptomatic with rabies, though. Might get paranoid and aggressive like the rest of us. Still, agreed that being bitten in one's sleep doesn't seem super likely. Regardless, I'd bet the knowledge that we (effectively) cannot cure rabies once it's symptomatic and that it's (more or less) a slow, horrifying death sentence isn't as widespread as one might hope. I'd expect there's a greater risk of someone being bitten and not knowing they absolutely need to go get treated ASAP, than of someone getting bitten and not realizing it.
No. Wrong. Incorrect on all accounts. A rabid bat absolutely will bite a human, will fly into a home seeking water, will be down at a human level because they no longer fly well, and most bats are so small that the bite won’t be noticed if it happens while sleeping.
The vaccine doesn't last your lifetime, you get a booster when exposed [1], and is super expensive (in US it's ~$1000 [2]).
But about the article, if < 0.05% of dogs have fake rabies certificates out of millions of dogs is this actually a problem? (Not to condone the behavior) Just because your dog doesn't have a rabies vaccine doesn't mean it does has rabies.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabies_vaccine#After_exposure [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabies_vaccine#Cost
But about the article, if < 0.05% of dogs have fake rabies certificates out of millions of dogs is this actually a problem? (Not to condone the behavior) Just because your dog doesn't have a rabies vaccine doesn't mean it does has rabies.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabies_vaccine#After_exposure [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabies_vaccine#Cost
It's only expensive in USA because USA human healthcare system is crazy. It's €100 for humans in Europe, and it's cheap enough to give to every domestic dog several times.
It’s maybe $40 for my cat to have a 2 year rabies vaccine. In the US we do a good enough job of animal vaccination that we don’t need to do human rabies vaccination, as another poster down thread said, 2 deaths per year per 350 million, the vaccine itself is more likely to cause death than the disease.
Wouldn't a simpler solution just be to ask people importing dogs to get them a new rabies vaccination?
The main exposure route is people getting rabies from their dog. The dog is bitten by a rabid animal (especially if it's a guardian dog for livestock) and then one or more family members get it from the dog.
So - much more important to get the dog vaccinated.
So - much more important to get the dog vaccinated.
A lot of the people I hear about who get exposed to rabies in the US is because they are ignorant. I've seen and heard of many people picking up baby animals, like raccoons and later being required to have post-exposure prophylaxis treatment.
The rabies vaccine is the most intimidating/uncomfortable shot I've ever had - it's a huge vial of bright pink/purple fluid!
https://www.reddit.com/r/mildlyinteresting/comments/5qnq82/t...
It also doesn't provide full protection - you still need to get multiple shots if you're ever actually exposed to rabies.
https://www.reddit.com/r/mildlyinteresting/comments/5qnq82/t...
It also doesn't provide full protection - you still need to get multiple shots if you're ever actually exposed to rabies.
Not sure what you are talking about... I was exposed to rabies 3ish years ago and received the PEP (post-exposure prophylaxis). The most painful shot was the rabies immunoglobulin, merely because it was a fairly large volume, maybe a couple cc's IIRC. That shot is only needed after exposure and is not a vaccine. The vaccine came as several shots spaced apart by days/weeks, and each individual shot was smaller and less painful than the seasonal flu vaccine. In fact, I literally did not feel the nurse give me one of them.
In America [and most other countries that have done a similarly good or better job of suppressing rabies] the wildlife are the ones getting vaccinated against it. Vaccinating the wildlife by baiting them with an oral vaccine is very effective and can eradicate rabies from a region (vaccinating the general public cannot do that, since person-to-person transmission is not really the concern.)
They should ban traveling too because I have heard of many fake vaccine certificates...
Rabies is a lot more lethal and it’s fortunately very rare in the US. The ban makes a lot of sense to me.
25 cases in a decade
You are more likely to die by crossing the street
You are more likely to die by crossing the street
>Each year, rabies causes approximately 59,000 deaths worldwide.
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/68/wr/mm6823e1.htm
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/68/wr/mm6823e1.htm
Rabies cases in America are rare specifically because the authorities take it seriously. If authorities stop taking rabies seriously, expect:
> An estimated 31,000 human deaths due to rabies occur annually in Asia,[2] with the majority – approximately 20,000 – concentrated in India.
> An estimated 31,000 human deaths due to rabies occur annually in Asia,[2] with the majority – approximately 20,000 – concentrated in India.
If you have been bit by a dog that cannot be located anymore, or that has an uncertain vaccination record, health care providers will initiate the rabies protocol regardless.
That's one of the reasons why it is rare in the US.
That's one of the reasons why it is rare in the US.
It is an absolutely horrible way to die. This may appear to be over the top for 25 cases, but should the vector be via puppies who very much chew and bite their owners, it would certainly be more than 25 cases. It is very prevalent in raccoons, squirrels and skunks — things that attract the attention of dogs.
Did I mention, it is an awful way to die because of a puppy and its forged vaccination papers?
Did I mention, it is an awful way to die because of a puppy and its forged vaccination papers?
Squirrels very rarely have it.
Is that globally? Or is that in the US, with restrictions/vaccinations/etc?
Edit: why downvote?
Edit: why downvote?
From TFA:
> rabies remains widespread across the world, killing some 59,000 people annually
So no, 25 / year is not globally.
> rabies remains widespread across the world, killing some 59,000 people annually
So no, 25 / year is not globally.
That's basically my point. The restrictions and vaccinations seem to be working.
I would be interested to know what it was at its peak. You have to wonder how much of the rabies "scare" of the 90s was manufactured.
> Rabies is a lot more lethal
which virus are you talking about?
which virus are you talking about?
All of them? Per the CDC, "to date less than 20 cases of human survival from clinical rabies have been documented"
I would think HIV. It won't kill you quickly, but it will eventually contribute to one's death. There have only been maybe one or two people cured (I forget if it came back or not).
Once you show symptoms of rabies, you are dead in about 10 days, with 100% percent certainty. You might live 100 years after contracting HIV (we don't know because we haven't known about HIV for 100 years.)
Sure, but some people survive rabies. You're talking lethality with a 99.9% kill rate for rabies vs 100% kill rate for HIV. They're just different timeframes.
Not to mention, you are liking about symptomatic cases. It's possible to cure non symptomatic cases of rabies, but that's not possible with HIV.
Not to mention, you are liking about symptomatic cases. It's possible to cure non symptomatic cases of rabies, but that's not possible with HIV.
Somewhere on the order of 1-to-10% of people have an innate resistance to HIV. HIV, untreated, is very deadly, but not nearly as deadly as rabies.
Resistance isn't immunity. It's possible there are some people with innate 'resistance' to rabies.
"HIV, untreated, is very deadly, but not nearly as deadly as rabies."
You might want to look up the definition of deadly. They both lead to death at a high rate - HIV at 100% eventual fatality and 99.9+% for symptomatic rabies. Again, pre and post exposure treatments for rabies are much more effective than for HIV. HIV has a higher fatality rate and less effective pre and post exposure curative treatment. It's pretty easy to compare 100% to 99.9% and know which one is bigger.
"HIV, untreated, is very deadly, but not nearly as deadly as rabies."
You might want to look up the definition of deadly. They both lead to death at a high rate - HIV at 100% eventual fatality and 99.9+% for symptomatic rabies. Again, pre and post exposure treatments for rabies are much more effective than for HIV. HIV has a higher fatality rate and less effective pre and post exposure curative treatment. It's pretty easy to compare 100% to 99.9% and know which one is bigger.
> HIV at 100% eventual fatality
You are simply wrong about that. Even without any treatment at all, you are wrong about that. I'm getting the sense that HIV being the worst possible is some matter of ideology to you, as though you think rabies being worse somehow diminishes the importance of addressing HIV. I suggest you go read the wikipedia page for both of these viruses with an impartial attitude.
You are simply wrong about that. Even without any treatment at all, you are wrong about that. I'm getting the sense that HIV being the worst possible is some matter of ideology to you, as though you think rabies being worse somehow diminishes the importance of addressing HIV. I suggest you go read the wikipedia page for both of these viruses with an impartial attitude.
I think you're comment is a little over the top. But it is true that many pathogens spread through global travel. It's just that most people are either unaware of the risks or feel that they are acceptable.
I could be wrong, but I don't think the comment you are replying to is completely serious. I think they are saying that the disease risk of global human travel seems similar to, or higher than, the disease risk of global dog travel and that similar challenges exist. Given this, banning global dog travel and not banning global human travel seems inconsistent.
If banning human travel due to disease risk is over the top, is banning dog travel over the top as well?
I think the difference, as you say, is that the benefits are not equal.
If banning human travel due to disease risk is over the top, is banning dog travel over the top as well?
I think the difference, as you say, is that the benefits are not equal.
It seems the benefits of a ban would be greater with human bans.
It was a bit of a sarcastic comment... they should probably fix the certificates' authenticity problems instead.
I think covid is a very poor example - it's already endemic through out the world. The real risk will be from things like zika, chikenguya, and things we don't even know about (and that we don't have vaccines or great treatments for).
You don't need to be vaccinated to enter the US, you only need a negative COVID test done within 72 hours before traveling.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/travelers/internat...
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/travelers/internat...
But you do need to be vaccinated to get permanent residency.
(which is an interesting requirement for those cases where the person has been living as a 'temporary resident' for years already)
(which is an interesting requirement for those cases where the person has been living as a 'temporary resident' for years already)
There are so many dogs already in America, I see absolutely no reason to ever import more.
It helps to expand the gene pool of specialized breeds if you seek mates internationally. This is necessary to continue to select for desired traits without resorting to inbreeding or drastically reducing the amount of breeding that's done.
"Specialized breeders" have zero sympathy from me; the only reason they have problems with their gene pool size is because of their own stupid breeding habits and objectives. Go get a mutt from the pound if you need to expand the gene pool of your dogs. The reason German Shepards in America are fucked up is not because import of dogs from Germany is banned, it's because American breeders of German Shepards are fucking idiots [generally speaking.]
The main reason to allow dog imports is probably to accommodate people relocating or returning to the US.
As a matter of fact, though, the reason the ban has been introduced has been a consequence of a dog shortage. Because many people are spending more time at home alone, demands for pets has gone up. Apparently there aren't enough dogs in the US to fulfill current demand.
As a matter of fact, though, the reason the ban has been introduced has been a consequence of a dog shortage. Because many people are spending more time at home alone, demands for pets has gone up. Apparently there aren't enough dogs in the US to fulfill current demand.
There are millions of dogs waiting to be adopted, It is not about shortage of dogs but some rescues specially importing stray dogs from other countries.
Just go on petfinder and see how many dogs are available
Just go on petfinder and see how many dogs are available
Some people move to the US from different countries. For most, a dog becomes part of the family, and they want to bring it with them.
A family member that you buy a replacement for every 10 years? I like dogs too, but please get a grip.
I tried for months to adopt a dog -- none of the dogs I applied for were available for adoption the moment I submitted the application. Not sure if it was my luck, but after 20 applications I gave up.
edit: typo
edit: typo
How many more "laws" will the CDC write with its new found power?
This action has been unambiguously authorized by Congress.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/42/265
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/42/264
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/42/265
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/42/264
I don't know why we don't have a permanent ban on this anyway. We don't need to be supporting overseas puppy mills.
We have more than enough dogs in the US to adopt.
We have more than enough dogs in the US to adopt.
I think a major use may be people relocating to the US with their dogs.
Those folks can still apply for a permit. Service dogs and dogs brought for 'or science, education, or exhibition' can also still get import permits.
From the article: "The announcement comes amid a jump in dog importation, linked to the surge in dog adoptions throughout the pandemic."
More than enough puppy mills as well, and amateur breeders that have no idea what they are doing. Leads to very brutal lives for the mothers (who do not receive adequate healthcare), and dogs with serious socialization issues.
I used to think pit bulls all had anxiety issues. Two years after adopting a rescue (not a pit bull), I think it's much more likely that most pit bull breeders do little to nothing to properly socialize those dogs in their early months.
I used to think pit bulls all had anxiety issues. Two years after adopting a rescue (not a pit bull), I think it's much more likely that most pit bull breeders do little to nothing to properly socialize those dogs in their early months.
Pit bulls (which is a problematic overly broad term in itself) get a bad rap largely because the worst dog owners disproportionally choose Pit bulls.
I have a friend of a friend with a pit bull that bit me on the neck and broke skin causing a minor bleed when I leaned over the dog while it was sitting on the couch next to me. Apparently that's one of its triggers (why didn't you tell me this before she bit me?). This dog has bitten nearly a dozen people and the owner still thinks that every bite is the victims fault, and I used to see her posting on FB groups about how all Pit Bulls are lovely cuddly nuggets that get a bad reputation for no reason until I unfollowed her.
Pit bulls can be lovely animals, but their destructive capabilities mean they need more training and socialization than the average dog because the potential outcomes are more severe. Lots of chihuahua owners are negligent too, but the tiny terrors they raise usually can't maim or kill people.
I have a friend of a friend with a pit bull that bit me on the neck and broke skin causing a minor bleed when I leaned over the dog while it was sitting on the couch next to me. Apparently that's one of its triggers (why didn't you tell me this before she bit me?). This dog has bitten nearly a dozen people and the owner still thinks that every bite is the victims fault, and I used to see her posting on FB groups about how all Pit Bulls are lovely cuddly nuggets that get a bad reputation for no reason until I unfollowed her.
Pit bulls can be lovely animals, but their destructive capabilities mean they need more training and socialization than the average dog because the potential outcomes are more severe. Lots of chihuahua owners are negligent too, but the tiny terrors they raise usually can't maim or kill people.
I've had two America Bull Dog/Staffordshire terrier mixes.
The were two brothers. I like the combination because I figured with the Bull Dog genes, they would be on the smaller side. I had no idea American Bull dogs were different that English.
I had everything planned out. Got them neutered, and vaccinated. The vet told me to wait 6 weeks before socialization, and doggy training.
By 6-8 weeks they were huge. I took them to a class, and the people freaked out. They didn't growel, but I could tell I wasen't welcome.
I realized I would just have to keep them away from all dogs. They were just too big, and if their ever was an incident--the other dog wouldn't stand a chance.
I love them both, and they were my best friends. Two 140 lb happy dogs. One has some kinda psychological condition. He was a bit moody, and I needed to keep a close watch over him.
I was lucky I had a yard, and a 8 foot fence.
My point is some breeds grow so quick, socialization is not always possible. The bigger one Chester grew so quick, he had three weeks of growing pains. I remember calling the vet thinking my dog had a stroke because he was walking so weird, and the vet said, "It's just growing pains. Nothing to worry about.".
Oh yea, because they were a mixed breed, they had much less health problems than my pedigrees. I will never buy another pedagree again. It's not fair to the dog.
I loved every one of my dogs so much.
I don't think I will ever get another though. I can't take another dog aging, and dying. I felt worse over my dogs deaths than my fathers. Crazy?
The were two brothers. I like the combination because I figured with the Bull Dog genes, they would be on the smaller side. I had no idea American Bull dogs were different that English.
I had everything planned out. Got them neutered, and vaccinated. The vet told me to wait 6 weeks before socialization, and doggy training.
By 6-8 weeks they were huge. I took them to a class, and the people freaked out. They didn't growel, but I could tell I wasen't welcome.
I realized I would just have to keep them away from all dogs. They were just too big, and if their ever was an incident--the other dog wouldn't stand a chance.
I love them both, and they were my best friends. Two 140 lb happy dogs. One has some kinda psychological condition. He was a bit moody, and I needed to keep a close watch over him.
I was lucky I had a yard, and a 8 foot fence.
My point is some breeds grow so quick, socialization is not always possible. The bigger one Chester grew so quick, he had three weeks of growing pains. I remember calling the vet thinking my dog had a stroke because he was walking so weird, and the vet said, "It's just growing pains. Nothing to worry about.".
Oh yea, because they were a mixed breed, they had much less health problems than my pedigrees. I will never buy another pedagree again. It's not fair to the dog.
I loved every one of my dogs so much.
I don't think I will ever get another though. I can't take another dog aging, and dying. I felt worse over my dogs deaths than my fathers. Crazy?
> On "an extremely limited basis" some pet owners and other animal lovers may be granted exceptions to the ban by seeking written approval from the CDC at least 30 days before planned entry to the US, the agency said.
Good. Hopefully it will become less limited soon.
It's easy to imagine a situation in which someone needs to move to the US and needs to have their dog with them. All I have to do is imagine someone who needs to move to the US for some family or business-related reason, and someone who is inseparable from their dog, irrespective of their immigration status, and figure that these are common enough that they could overlap.
Good. Hopefully it will become less limited soon.
It's easy to imagine a situation in which someone needs to move to the US and needs to have their dog with them. All I have to do is imagine someone who needs to move to the US for some family or business-related reason, and someone who is inseparable from their dog, irrespective of their immigration status, and figure that these are common enough that they could overlap.
https://www.cdc.gov/importation/bringing-an-animal-into-the-...