Deta Cloud – Developer-friendly cloud platform(deta.sh)
deta.sh
Deta Cloud – Developer-friendly cloud platform
https://www.deta.sh/
67 comments
The front page says "Unlimited storage" for the NoSQL solution; yet the terms mention a hard limit of 10 GB. Is there a typo?
That's for "file storage", aka Deta Drive. Deta Base, our NoSQL doesn't have a limit.
How credible is this, in the long term? Can i use it to build the next Dropbox with unlimited file storage and give it away for free to my users?
I think you've got it backwards.
File storage is free up to 10GB, NoSQL is free forever
Their point is they could store the files in the NoSQL solution if they so please.
I’d suspect the free tier has limited performance and bandwidth.
I’m curios: If you have funding that gives you multiple years of runway (as stated earlier ITT), why didn’t you raise the contribution to EUR 25k and turn the UG (Haftungsbeschränkt) into a fully limited liability company (GmbH)? Wouldn’t that be one of the first moves when funding is in, to give the founders peace of mind regarding personal liability concerns?
What kind of concerns are you talking about here?
UG is like GmbH with a difference that, afair, 25% or 30% of the profit has to be put aside towards GmbH conversion. Also, you’d do the conversion typically at the end of fiscal year.
For investors putting serious money in, what’s the difference if they can recover €5k or €25k? Stammkapital is the maximum liability for both UG and GmbH.
UG is like GmbH with a difference that, afair, 25% or 30% of the profit has to be put aside towards GmbH conversion. Also, you’d do the conversion typically at the end of fiscal year.
For investors putting serious money in, what’s the difference if they can recover €5k or €25k? Stammkapital is the maximum liability for both UG and GmbH.
GmbH looks more serious though
Both are the same from the legal point of view. UG eventually ends up as GmbH, if company makes profit.
There's more to this than one would think :)
What do you think you can do to succeed where Meteor failed?
I remember Meteor as a framework first. Deta is a platform and allows devs to build apps using their favorite frameworks (mostly) and then deploy & monetize them without any ops.
I trust you heard "no ops" before but Deta uses a new approach that allows us to scale millions of apps to billions of users efficiently. Take a look at our pilot here: https://deta.space/
I trust you heard "no ops" before but Deta uses a new approach that allows us to scale millions of apps to billions of users efficiently. Take a look at our pilot here: https://deta.space/
In the docs I see Go SDKs for Base and Drive, but doesn't look like deta-cli supports Go for Micros. Can we write services in Go?
We don't support Go on Micros yet. Not enough demand atm but we love Go and planning to support it once we have the capacity.
The market is actually pretty small for super focussed with PaaS with a specialized business model. Trust me, been there, done that. You have to not only communicate why your PaaS is better than others out there in the market but Also de-mystify why they should adopt your pricing model too.
My argument is that most of the small business and startups struggle to make revenue from get go. Asking for revshare, when it is day-0/day-1 kind of situation can hit the startups, small business, individuals really hard.
To me the your model looks very close to a royalty structure. Which I do not think many orgs and serious startups would like.
Another argument is that, Major cloud providers give away a lot of credits for various services. It can go upto $100k. I would even argue that you don't need devops or specialized team from you are a small org, startup and your operations are small.
Anyways, Looks like a fun project. I actually think the Micro, Base and Drive looks very promising and I wouldn't mind paying based on usage. I think, It can be a fun place to host apps for indie hackers. Would love to list Deta Cloud on Awesome Paas[1] list.
[1] https://github.com/debarshibasak/awesome-paas
My argument is that most of the small business and startups struggle to make revenue from get go. Asking for revshare, when it is day-0/day-1 kind of situation can hit the startups, small business, individuals really hard.
To me the your model looks very close to a royalty structure. Which I do not think many orgs and serious startups would like.
Another argument is that, Major cloud providers give away a lot of credits for various services. It can go upto $100k. I would even argue that you don't need devops or specialized team from you are a small org, startup and your operations are small.
Anyways, Looks like a fun project. I actually think the Micro, Base and Drive looks very promising and I wouldn't mind paying based on usage. I think, It can be a fun place to host apps for indie hackers. Would love to list Deta Cloud on Awesome Paas[1] list.
[1] https://github.com/debarshibasak/awesome-paas
When I read
"free"
"free, no credit card"
"free, forever"
"free, unlimited"
I tend to stop processing what is on the page since I get this acute feeling of being taken for a ride, and whatever is hiding somewhere in all that marketing babble is going to rear its ugly head at some inconvenient time.
The first thing I look for on a new product site is if this looks at all interesting. I am willing to put some effort into that.
If I decide that this might be interesting I go looking for the "Pricing" page.
If I cant find it, I move on real quick.
If it says "Call talk to our salespeople" I move on real quick.
If says "free", "free", "free" I wonder what's the catch and that is something I dont spend a lot of time trying to figure it out.
If there is a pricing page, it seems up front, honest, realistic I will invest a lot more time into figuring out how it could be used.
Please just put a pricing page up and make it is easy to find.
I tend to stop processing what is on the page since I get this acute feeling of being taken for a ride, and whatever is hiding somewhere in all that marketing babble is going to rear its ugly head at some inconvenient time.
The first thing I look for on a new product site is if this looks at all interesting. I am willing to put some effort into that.
If I decide that this might be interesting I go looking for the "Pricing" page.
If I cant find it, I move on real quick.
If it says "Call talk to our salespeople" I move on real quick.
If says "free", "free", "free" I wonder what's the catch and that is something I dont spend a lot of time trying to figure it out.
If there is a pricing page, it seems up front, honest, realistic I will invest a lot more time into figuring out how it could be used.
Please just put a pricing page up and make it is easy to find.
"We'll take cut."
How that will work? If someone is using display advertising, how the cut can be calculated? Or do you force to have your script included in header that delegates such requests?
Further, someone taking PayPal or other payment processing, will you be hooking yourself in middle by having your own SDK for monitization I suppose?
Might work or might not, basically the apps that make significant amount of money don't won't to give away 5% of their revenue.
Imagine an app making one million USD a month would end up paying 50,000 USD as cut. But pretty sure, if they host it themselves, the bill would be far below something like 5000 USD or so. Equation becomes obvious and they would tend to migrate.
How that will work? If someone is using display advertising, how the cut can be calculated? Or do you force to have your script included in header that delegates such requests?
Further, someone taking PayPal or other payment processing, will you be hooking yourself in middle by having your own SDK for monitization I suppose?
Might work or might not, basically the apps that make significant amount of money don't won't to give away 5% of their revenue.
Imagine an app making one million USD a month would end up paying 50,000 USD as cut. But pretty sure, if they host it themselves, the bill would be far below something like 5000 USD or so. Equation becomes obvious and they would tend to migrate.
Apps published on Deta Space will use our own payment solution; we will process the payment and send the dev their cut. For now, Ad-supported apps will not be published on Space. Space apps are reviewed manually.
We will offer either a simple purchase/subscription mechanism & our own SDK (for more complex use cases).
Offering a 0-ops & 0-liability experience for any dev globally is pretty attractive. There's more to this that I cant talk about yet unfortunately.
We will offer either a simple purchase/subscription mechanism & our own SDK (for more complex use cases).
Offering a 0-ops & 0-liability experience for any dev globally is pretty attractive. There's more to this that I cant talk about yet unfortunately.
Cloud and developer setups are super sticky. If they have technical lock-in, then that switching cost is not just server vs revshare, but server + devops team + time spinning wheels on infra not focused on product + unknown glitches of a new environment vs revshare.
Essentially, the same business model as heroku -- free and affordable to start, but $$$$ at a medium scale. It will work until the business becomes an enterprise, which it seems Deta Cloud is adamant about not serving.
Essentially, the same business model as heroku -- free and affordable to start, but $$$$ at a medium scale. It will work until the business becomes an enterprise, which it seems Deta Cloud is adamant about not serving.
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This looks neat and all but Delta Space (the "production" version of this) has zero pricing info that I can find and I've scoured their site and docs, even tried going to /pricing, /plans, etc nothing.
In the comments the CEO keeps talking about "we're working on Deta Space, which helps devs publish & monetize their web apps with no ops, and we take a small cut" but it's not clear at all what that "small cut" is and if it comes from payment processing or some other fee.
Can we please get some info on pricing for Space?
In the comments the CEO keeps talking about "we're working on Deta Space, which helps devs publish & monetize their web apps with no ops, and we take a small cut" but it's not clear at all what that "small cut" is and if it comes from payment processing or some other fee.
Can we please get some info on pricing for Space?
Hi, Deta Space is very new and a lot is still is happening behind the scenes. We're mostly running a closed alpha with some devs from our community. Once we launch Space in beta/GA, we will be announcing more about "the cut". It's likely to be <15% (no infra cost, etc).
I understand this is all vague atm but everything is still WIP. We're not ready for prime-time yet.
(btw, this is not a "show hn", a kind person thought to share us here)
I understand this is all vague atm but everything is still WIP. We're not ready for prime-time yet.
(btw, this is not a "show hn", a kind person thought to share us here)
Having lived a similar path (Uffizzi was initially a Heroku-like PaaS before we pivoted) I’ll offer some lessons learned that I wish I could have had a crystal ball to see.
-First I’ll reference Peter Thiel’s 10x rule - is your product or experience much, much better than the alternatives?
-The market is pretty saturated with free and low cost options for hosting. Heroku being the 1st and most ubiquitous and then Digital Ocean launching their PaaS in 2020. I’m sure there’s others.
I’ll concede that Render seems to have gotten some traction despite some significant odds against doing so.
-We got $100k in credits from GCP
-You’ll likely have trouble attracting serious start-ups or businesses because they will worry that you won’t be here in 1 year or even 3 years. If you don’t attract businesses you’ll have a hard time getting to monetization.
Your monetization plan is unique and I love anything that simplifies the Dev experience. Best of luck to you.
Your monetization plan is unique and I love anything that simplifies the Dev experience. Best of luck to you.
I host https://applesilicongames.com on deta, deploys are almost instant, for similar apps I used firebase in the past but I prefer python to javascript
> You agree that Abstract Computing UG (haftungsbeschränkt), in its sole discretion, may use your trade names, trademarks, service marks, logos, domain names and other distinctive brand features in presentations, marketing materials, customer lists, financial reports and Web site listings (including links to your website) for the purpose of advertising or publicizing your use of the Deta Services.
This is pretty common in a lot of ToS, if you use their stuff (especially for free) they want to be able to use you on their nascar page of logos, or in their pitch decks. I don't really see what's wrong with that?
This is for our "app marketplace" (WIP) which we use to promote the apps themselves. We also say look at these cool apps running on Deta.
More about our "marketplace": https://deta.space/ & https://www.deta.sh/space
More about our "marketplace": https://deta.space/ & https://www.deta.sh/space
What's the catch?
Deta Cloud (deta.sh) is a playground for independent devs, it's not a full-fledged cloud platform. For production scale and monetization, we're working on Deta Space: https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
ceo here btw
ceo here btw
So what are the limitations for individual developers? Is the network throttled somehow? Or there is limited life time of application to prevent usage for production (for small projects anyway)?.
It seems like there should be more information and a clear explanation of the business model.
It seems like there should be more information and a clear explanation of the business model.
We're working on this atm and will be sharing soon. Have been running for a while without official limits with very little issues. (99% of our devs don't reach our planned limits).
Absolutely, while I'm very grateful for free services I can sometimes wind up avoiding using them because I'm concerned about my privacy or the longevity of a setup
I'd rather pay a modest subscription fee than have the rug suddenly pulled from under me due to funding issues
I'd rather pay a modest subscription fee than have the rug suddenly pulled from under me due to funding issues
That's a valid concern. We're well funded, so you don't have to worry for a few years. The way we will monetize is through Deta Space. Deta Space helps devs scale & monetize their apps without ops and we take a small cut.
check out https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
check out https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
There's info on VM limitations here: https://docs.deta.sh/docs/micros/about#important-notes
Super excited about this space, but not sure how another player is going to make firecracker/docker/gvisor/whatever based VMs cheaper/free-er than big cloud providers. Would be nice to see more attempts at alternate runtimes like WASM/V8/etc
Super excited about this space, but not sure how another player is going to make firecracker/docker/gvisor/whatever based VMs cheaper/free-er than big cloud providers. Would be nice to see more attempts at alternate runtimes like WASM/V8/etc
It's an exciting Space in its infancy (IMO). We will be looking into WASM soon!
There is no free lunch, I would assume the plan is to either first take over the market and then introduce pro plans and make the free plans have usage limits due to "abuse".
Or the plan is to sell user data or something shady like that.
There is no way a company can offer a free unlimited cloud service, it is to ripe for abuse.
Or the plan is to sell user data or something shady like that.
There is no way a company can offer a free unlimited cloud service, it is to ripe for abuse.
> I would assume the plan is to either first take over the market
Step 1: Introduce free product
Step 2: ???
Step 3: Take over market
In their docs, they have mentioned they plan to monetize through a parallel product: https://docs.deta.sh/docs/home/
Step 1: Introduce free product
Step 2: ???
Step 3: Take over market
In their docs, they have mentioned they plan to monetize through a parallel product: https://docs.deta.sh/docs/home/
Yes, Deta Space (WIP) is the way we will make money. We help devs monetize their apps and we take a small cut.
Deta Cloud (deta.sh) is a playground for independent devs, it's not a full-fledged cloud platform. For production scale and monetization, we're working on Deta Space: https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
Deta Space is the way we will make money. We help devs monetize their apps and we take a small cut.
Space is still WIP and we will be announcing more soon. We don't sell data.
ceo here btw
Deta Space is the way we will make money. We help devs monetize their apps and we take a small cut.
Space is still WIP and we will be announcing more soon. We don't sell data.
ceo here btw
Have used it for a small work project. I love the simplicity. I haven't found a cloud provider that has this limited scope/battery included feel.
I love services like digital Ocean. But everything is designed to deploy and scale "the right way". For projects with small scope this really fits the bill.
Improvement: add something like nodemon -e "deta deploy" I end up reruning that command alot.
Something like "deta -w ./my-awesome-project"
The comments remind me of the inflection point with any opensource/ startup company dev: "great product, id love to use it, but can I trust it?"
Aside: this reminds me of anvil.app but different. This has that same omg it comes with a sql db editor interface (not very fancy but it works)
I love services like digital Ocean. But everything is designed to deploy and scale "the right way". For projects with small scope this really fits the bill.
Improvement: add something like nodemon -e "deta deploy" I end up reruning that command alot.
Something like "deta -w ./my-awesome-project"
The comments remind me of the inflection point with any opensource/ startup company dev: "great product, id love to use it, but can I trust it?"
Aside: this reminds me of anvil.app but different. This has that same omg it comes with a sql db editor interface (not very fancy but it works)
Awesome, thanks for sharing! You are looking for "deta watch" ;)
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Most of the docs mention Python and Node.js micro-frameworks, but the Deta Base SDK has example code also for Go. Is it possible to deploy (self-contained) binaries compiled from Go on Deta? On Deta Space?
We don't support Go on Micros yet. Not enough demand atm but we love Go and plan to support it once we have the capacity.
How does it pay it's bills?
I don't Know
We will make money via Deta Space which helps devs scale & monetize their apps without ops and we take a small cut.
https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
> How are you going to make money?
> We're working on a big, parallel product that we will be announcing soon. This product will be responsible for generating revenue. Stay tuned!
From https://docs.deta.sh/docs/home/
> We're working on a big, parallel product that we will be announcing soon. This product will be responsible for generating revenue. Stay tuned!
From https://docs.deta.sh/docs/home/
I bet this will be web3 / crypto / etc.
We're a crypto-free company. We will make money via Deta Space which helps devs scale & monetize their apps without ops and we take a small cut.
https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
Description by author: https://www.producthunt.com/posts/deta-cloud-1-0
It provides a marketplace so perhaps Deta plan to take a cut of sales: https://deta.space/
It provides a marketplace so perhaps Deta plan to take a cut of sales: https://deta.space/
First that comes to mind is selling user info. But this is only my thoughts.
We don't sell any data. We will make money via Deta Space which helps devs scale & monetize their apps without ops and we take a small cut.
https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
Great! Thank you for clarification.
We will make money via Deta Space (WIP) which helps devs scale & monetize their apps without ops and we take a small cut.
https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
https://www.deta.sh/space & https://deta.space/
there is no pricing info and difficult to understand the business model if not by reading through the comments on here.
wow I love how simple it seems to do database and file storage... definitely taking a look this weekend!
love the UI/UX, very snappy and simple; good work!
Deltacloud[1][2] was a library which abstracted differences of various cloud provider APIs, maintained from 2009 till about 2015. Btw I you need something like that today, there is libcloud[3], which is actively maintained library with a similar goal.
[1] https://deltacloud.apache.org/ [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deltacloud [3] https://libcloud.readthedocs.io/
[1] https://deltacloud.apache.org/ [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deltacloud [3] https://libcloud.readthedocs.io/
Every single product launch on HN has someone pointing out some sort of naming collision. It gets old.
This product is named Deta Cloud, not Delta Cloud, and in addition to that Apache Deltacloud is retired. Today's namespace is so crowded that all posts like this have convinced me of is that it's impossible not to collide with something.
This product is named Deta Cloud, not Delta Cloud, and in addition to that Apache Deltacloud is retired. Today's namespace is so crowded that all posts like this have convinced me of is that it's impossible not to collide with something.
Ah, you are right, I'm misreading the name. Sorry for confusion.
Hah, it wasn't until your comment did i realize the product was Deta cloud. I was reading Delta Cloud lol.
Because many of you are wondering about our business model: we're working on Deta Space, which helps devs publish & monetize their web apps with no ops, and we take a small cut. Deta Space is still in the early pilot stage.
Learn more about Space here: https://www.deta.sh/space & here https://deta.space/.
Have a great day!