Why I love Formula 1 (and why you might like it too)(jorisroovers.com)
jorisroovers.com
Why I love Formula 1 (and why you might like it too)
https://jorisroovers.com/posts/why-i-love-formula-1
84 comments
F1 lived for decades (and still does, to an extent) on money provided by tobacco companies. IIRC they even raced in apartheid SouthAfrica during boycott times.
Thank you for highlighting this. As I fan, I hold my nose watching the sport while knowing how deep the corruption runs.
> A Formula 1 race weekend is never boring: even when a specific team or driver is a clear favorite
F1 weekends are frequently extremely boring. They are 3 day long events where you're waiting for moments that last seconds and more than often don't occur. Confirmation bias tends to make people think F1 is an exciting thing, and the owners of the sport would like to keep it that way.
I spent the last decade shooting a photo project on this very thing, that F1 is actually pretty mundane, visiting 25 races in the process: https://www.formulanon.com/ # I'd followed the sport for 20 years prior to that, so had run out of enthusiasm for it, the project kept that interest going for a little while longer.
F1 weekends are frequently extremely boring. They are 3 day long events where you're waiting for moments that last seconds and more than often don't occur. Confirmation bias tends to make people think F1 is an exciting thing, and the owners of the sport would like to keep it that way.
I spent the last decade shooting a photo project on this very thing, that F1 is actually pretty mundane, visiting 25 races in the process: https://www.formulanon.com/ # I'd followed the sport for 20 years prior to that, so had run out of enthusiasm for it, the project kept that interest going for a little while longer.
Yes, this struck me as a weird sentence, specially given the amount of rule tinkering that went on in the recent years to make it a little bit less boring.
My favourite parts of F1 are the parts which don't occur anywhere near a track. The ingenious rule bending which goes into trying to get an advantage and the politics when people try to get it banned. Things like the f-duct where a driver used the back of their hand to close a passage which reduced the areodynamics drag of the rear wing because movable surfaces aren't allowed; the two pedal system which allowed differential braking through a corner; or the blown defuser which used the exhaust from the engine to enhance the downforce generated by the defuser.
For those who aren't aware, the rules have banned movable aerodynamic devices for years (recent exception: DRS). The F-duct was so delightfully cheeky because it used the driver's body as the moving component in a system that would have otherwise been wildly against the regs.
Renault's mass damper was also banned on the basis that it was a moving aerodynamic device perplexingly, IIRC.
I completely agree. Some of the most entertaining engineering Olympics.
The best part about the fan example [1] is that they claimed it was there for "cooling" purposes.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brabham_BT46
The best part about the fan example [1] is that they claimed it was there for "cooling" purposes.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brabham_BT46
One of my favourite bit of cheekiness was red bull turning up to FP1 with the camera mounted inside the car.
and DAS, the dual-axis steering system Merc used to warm the tyres.
I'm not sure it was that much of an advantage, but it was a great system.
I'm not sure it was that much of an advantage, but it was a great system.
You missed the golden age of F1 in late 80's and the early 90's. Today's version is like watching a computer simulation where the team with the most money is almost guaranteed to win.
Teams aren’t really racing 10 teams against each other. The top 2-3 teams are competing, then there is a middle 2-3 teams competing for the spots behind the top pair or trio. There are drivers and teams that would celebrate a 10th spot more than one in the top teams would celebrate a podium.
I think this aspect is important and the sport can be exciting if one accepts these conditions. A field of 10 teams where anyone could take the title is probably not even a “design goal” for the regulations.
It all requires some luck with the “pairings” however. Last season was a great example of how it should be with thrilling fights between teams 1..2 and 3..5 and so on. Previous years Mercedes was unfortunately alone in #1 and a fight for 2..3 is obviously not as exciting.
I think this aspect is important and the sport can be exciting if one accepts these conditions. A field of 10 teams where anyone could take the title is probably not even a “design goal” for the regulations.
It all requires some luck with the “pairings” however. Last season was a great example of how it should be with thrilling fights between teams 1..2 and 3..5 and so on. Previous years Mercedes was unfortunately alone in #1 and a fight for 2..3 is obviously not as exciting.
> .. then there is a middle 2-3 teams competing for the spots behind the top pair or trio ..
Commonly referred to “Formula 1.5” (the Best of the Rest).
Commonly referred to “Formula 1.5” (the Best of the Rest).
I didn't pay attention to it in 20 years because it got incredibly boring by the late 90s. Basically investing a few hours of your life to see whose mechanics will mess up the pit stop and lose 4 precious seconds.
80's and 90's was the golden age of many sports like boxing, rallying and football (the international one)
Good old days where people dying was a part of the sport.
“There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.”
― Ernest Hemingway
― Ernest Hemingway
By the 80s, F1 safety had improved significantly and the fatal accident rate was on par with today’s rate. The 50s and 60s held significantly higher danger to participants.
But that was part of the point - old-school motor-racing attracted the sort of (wealthy white male) characters who lived every day to the max, and hence were pretty fun to follow inside and outside the car.
Nowadays they're a bit less white, don't die or get maimed nearly as often (last death in 2015), but they have largely become a set of meticulous and obsessive kids who spend most of their life in front of simulators.
Nowadays they're a bit less white, don't die or get maimed nearly as often (last death in 2015), but they have largely become a set of meticulous and obsessive kids who spend most of their life in front of simulators.
Fair point although many of those who died were fully aware of the risk and took extreme risks regardless.
And 2000 years ago was the golden age of human dogfighting.
Group B is past the line on its way to being gladiator combat. TBIs are non-lethal so American football is tolerated.
Group B is past the line on its way to being gladiator combat. TBIs are non-lethal so American football is tolerated.
You could say the same about the English Premier League, or soccer today. I'll specifically call out Man City and PSG.
But luckily we still have the magic of the FA Cup, and also soccer is full of surprises!
But luckily we still have the magic of the FA Cup, and also soccer is full of surprises!
Budget caps were introduced recently, but it’ll take some time before it gets reflected in results.
Well we also missed out on football (soccer), but what can you do.
I find Formula 1 boring. I think it is overreglemented. All cars are basically the same, and at the same time there are huge differences between the cars, if that makes sense. Only a few teams have a chance of winning. But the time differences are often fractions of a second. And the teams are nowadays mostly unlikable.
What I'd like to see is a race with more variation, and surprises. The only rules should be something like:
- The car must cost less than, say, $1 million in material
- The plans must be opened to competitors after some time
- You have to take care of the drivers' safety
And then just get from A to B or do the laps by any means necessary. The race courses would change regularly, so you would have to build new cars. One year they would be very curvy, next year they are short and straight so you need better acceleration, another year there are short stretches of rallye, and so on. I think that would lead to some very interesting cars. And it would shift the focus away from the shaving milliseconds aspect that I find so boring with modern sports, back to the exploratory feeling I imagine motorsports used to have.
What I'd like to see is a race with more variation, and surprises. The only rules should be something like:
- The car must cost less than, say, $1 million in material
- The plans must be opened to competitors after some time
- You have to take care of the drivers' safety
And then just get from A to B or do the laps by any means necessary. The race courses would change regularly, so you would have to build new cars. One year they would be very curvy, next year they are short and straight so you need better acceleration, another year there are short stretches of rallye, and so on. I think that would lead to some very interesting cars. And it would shift the focus away from the shaving milliseconds aspect that I find so boring with modern sports, back to the exploratory feeling I imagine motorsports used to have.
I understand the appeal of constrictive environment of rules, but what would we get to see if there are no rules or there's only:
- no weapons - no deliberate damage of opponents
or maybe even without those. We might get real life version of wipeout.
- no weapons - no deliberate damage of opponents
or maybe even without those. We might get real life version of wipeout.
I used to watch F1 back in 90s until beginning of 00s, it was interesting, there were not that significant differences between cars and you could see actual driving skills and overtaking, over the time it turned into siesta lullaby where overtaking happens at best in the pitstop and that's it, pretty much boring from start to finish and you really need to stay extremely focused to not fall asleep.
What F1 really needs is one monopost for all drivers when only driving skills will make difference and not how much money will someone throw at car R&D.
Later I switched to Moto GP, much more dynamic, you can see multiple changes to positions within few laps and it's about actual skills.
Please correct me if I am wrong and F1 is now dynamic with lot of overtaking since I haven't seen one GP in last 10-15 years.
Btw. do yourself a service and don't watch the new documentary Schumacher, it's just waste of time with NO new information for anyone who watched F1 during Schumacher times.
What F1 really needs is one monopost for all drivers when only driving skills will make difference and not how much money will someone throw at car R&D.
Later I switched to Moto GP, much more dynamic, you can see multiple changes to positions within few laps and it's about actual skills.
Please correct me if I am wrong and F1 is now dynamic with lot of overtaking since I haven't seen one GP in last 10-15 years.
Btw. do yourself a service and don't watch the new documentary Schumacher, it's just waste of time with NO new information for anyone who watched F1 during Schumacher times.
>> Please correct me if I am wrong and F1 is now dynamic with lot of overtaking since I haven't seen one GP in last 10-15 years.
I would say that you are wrong, but with caveats. Firstly, it's dependent on the track. some tracks provide more opportunities to overtake than others. Monaco is one extreme (where overtaking is basically impossible) - on the other end of the scale is Bahrain where overtaking is "easy".
Actually having all cars the same would lead to less overtaking though - because it's not enough to "be a bit faster" than the car in front, you have to be close enough, at the right time, and have enough of a performance advantage to make the overtake in the time available. DRS makes a big difference to this giving an advantage to a trailing car which makes overtaking "easier". But you still need the track to play ball.
Like all sports, F1 goes through periods of boring races, and typically there are then rule tweaks to try and tighten up racing. This year there are all new cars, designed (hopefully) to make following easier and hence overtaking easier.
Of course making overtaking easier is perhaps not the best goal - close racing happens when a faster car is behind a slower car, and overtaking is hard. The defense of the slower car, and the effort required to maintain that position can be enthralling. Letting the faster car pass easily, and disappear into the distance may not actually lead to better racing.
I would say that you are wrong, but with caveats. Firstly, it's dependent on the track. some tracks provide more opportunities to overtake than others. Monaco is one extreme (where overtaking is basically impossible) - on the other end of the scale is Bahrain where overtaking is "easy".
Actually having all cars the same would lead to less overtaking though - because it's not enough to "be a bit faster" than the car in front, you have to be close enough, at the right time, and have enough of a performance advantage to make the overtake in the time available. DRS makes a big difference to this giving an advantage to a trailing car which makes overtaking "easier". But you still need the track to play ball.
Like all sports, F1 goes through periods of boring races, and typically there are then rule tweaks to try and tighten up racing. This year there are all new cars, designed (hopefully) to make following easier and hence overtaking easier.
Of course making overtaking easier is perhaps not the best goal - close racing happens when a faster car is behind a slower car, and overtaking is hard. The defense of the slower car, and the effort required to maintain that position can be enthralling. Letting the faster car pass easily, and disappear into the distance may not actually lead to better racing.
>> What F1 really needs is one monopost for all drivers when only driving skills will make difference and not how much money will someone throw at car R&D.
That would no longer be F1. There are lots of other categories that follow that formula (e.g. F2/3 and IndyCar) if that’s what you’re looking for. Engineering genius is an important part of F1, even historically (e.g. the “fan car”).
That would no longer be F1. There are lots of other categories that follow that formula (e.g. F2/3 and IndyCar) if that’s what you’re looking for. Engineering genius is an important part of F1, even historically (e.g. the “fan car”).
The problem is we don't need a full race to see engineering genius. Certainly not a full season.
I've been watching F1 since Senna burst out. Naturally as a kid I loved seeing him win and could care less about most other drivers of the time, certainly the bottom half. As an adult however, I wish things were more equal.
F1 could do with less of a gap between the poor and rich and showcase drivers who have to constantly make choices and perform at their best to maintain vs car A vs car B where car A is always going to be superior.
I've been watching F1 since Senna burst out. Naturally as a kid I loved seeing him win and could care less about most other drivers of the time, certainly the bottom half. As an adult however, I wish things were more equal.
F1 could do with less of a gap between the poor and rich and showcase drivers who have to constantly make choices and perform at their best to maintain vs car A vs car B where car A is always going to be superior.
But there are already series that do that, and they've been doing it more and more. And honestly even in those series' it's hardly a surprise which teams are finishing at the top all the time because they snag the most expensive drivers and just have a more well-oiled operation.
Why can't there be 1 open-wheel series that is more about the engineering?
Why can't there be 1 open-wheel series that is more about the engineering?
Even better aspect of Moto GP, IMO, is you often get 8 or 9 different winners during a season, even when MM93 or VR46 were winning consecutive championships. This year's 1st race podium had 3 riders on it who were not amongst the top picks to podium.
Bonus: watching the aliens hit 220 MPH on 2 wheels is pretty awesome, too.
Bonus: watching the aliens hit 220 MPH on 2 wheels is pretty awesome, too.
> over the time it turned into siesta lullaby where overtaking happens at best in the pitstop and that's it
Data says otherwise, in general https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/nf4jkq/f1_overtak...
The late 90s/early 00s had the least amount of overtakes on avg
Data says otherwise, in general https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/nf4jkq/f1_overtak...
The late 90s/early 00s had the least amount of overtakes on avg
that's interesting data, but I wonder whether this applies also to top positions, I'd like to see these stats filtered just for top positions
is there also some stat showing diversity of top positions over years or team/driver points required to win championship? though because of changing points system it's difficult to compare unless converted to percentage
According this championship decided by one point was last time in 2008, 2007 and 1994 with 2007 extremely balanced between top 3 https://www.autoweek.com/racing/formula-1/g36279865/formula-...
Judging by this, last year was from start to finish just race between Verstappen and Hamilton https://www.formula1points.com/season/season-progression/202...
is there also some stat showing diversity of top positions over years or team/driver points required to win championship? though because of changing points system it's difficult to compare unless converted to percentage
According this championship decided by one point was last time in 2008, 2007 and 1994 with 2007 extremely balanced between top 3 https://www.autoweek.com/racing/formula-1/g36279865/formula-...
Judging by this, last year was from start to finish just race between Verstappen and Hamilton https://www.formula1points.com/season/season-progression/202...
There is a budget cap now, so teams have no difference in how much money they have to spend on R&D.
All cars the same would be boring and overwhelming, the sport is in large part about the teams and the engineering, the upgrades they bring and the sway between which team is the best. I watch it because I love seeing this excellence at work and i'm not even into cars, I don't drive, so i care less about that.
All cars the same would be boring and overwhelming, the sport is in large part about the teams and the engineering, the upgrades they bring and the sway between which team is the best. I watch it because I love seeing this excellence at work and i'm not even into cars, I don't drive, so i care less about that.
> one monopost
Does that word even exist in English? Nobody uses it in the anglo word. Monoposto is an Italian / Spanish word really, where posto is a seat (hence single-seat car).
Does that word even exist in English? Nobody uses it in the anglo word. Monoposto is an Italian / Spanish word really, where posto is a seat (hence single-seat car).
I thought it's international word since it's also used in Czech/Slovak, can't find it in English, though they mention "monoposto" here
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open-wheel_car
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open-wheel_car
There are HUGE differences in the cars this year. The mercedes literally doesn't have sidepods whereas all the others do.
I prefer Formula E nowdays because of the much tighter competition between the manufacturers. Almost every single team is running its own EV engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021%E2%80%9322_Formula_E_Worl... Also it's streamed for free on Youtube, much easier to follow
The only thing I don't like is the engine "sound". You can watch and hear it here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CX8ItCZz04 Not sure something to be "fixed" or not but the engine sound was always a big part of motorsport and it's simply gone in electric car races.
The only thing I don't like is the engine "sound". You can watch and hear it here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CX8ItCZz04 Not sure something to be "fixed" or not but the engine sound was always a big part of motorsport and it's simply gone in electric car races.
For me also: community. I love the F1 community discussing the off-track banter, the drama, the memes, that has grown immensely since Drive to Survive. Here's a shout-out to www.reddit.com/r/formula1! It has maybe become my favorite subreddit on that site. Professionally moderated with semi-regular appearances of drivers or team representatives for Q&A's as well. Every practice session, qualification, race also gets a live thread so that if you're Forever Alone in this interest, there are friendly people with reactions and jokes over there in those live chats! :)
Eh, it's kinda a cess pit. It's good for following news though.
Certainly don't follow the race weekend live threads, when sorted by new which is the default for those, it's Toxic as hell, in a lot of other threads most people repeat the same nonsense as if they don't know anything about the sport.
As you mention it's grown a huge amount since the hugely fake and misleading drive to survive which means sadly it's a lot of those clueless people that have come and it's suffered from it, constantly repeating the same nonsense narratives, i perfer just to see it as a way to aggravate news and then switch off and just enjoy the races.
Certainly don't follow the race weekend live threads, when sorted by new which is the default for those, it's Toxic as hell, in a lot of other threads most people repeat the same nonsense as if they don't know anything about the sport.
As you mention it's grown a huge amount since the hugely fake and misleading drive to survive which means sadly it's a lot of those clueless people that have come and it's suffered from it, constantly repeating the same nonsense narratives, i perfer just to see it as a way to aggravate news and then switch off and just enjoy the races.
What, no mention of r/formuladank ? Once you look past the neofascist sympathies of moderators, it can be a pretty good source of content. All r/formula1 memes are born there first. The Alphamaxnova1 shorts were <chef kiss>!
Formuladank used to be much better before the sport exploded a few a years ago.
/r/formula1 is one of the worst communities I have ever encountered. Every comment on every post is the lowest low effort garbage you can imagine and it suffers hugely from that tunnel vision effect where only one opinion is allowed per topic and anything deviating from the hivemind is quickly buried.
>every post is the lowest low effort garbage you can imagine and it suffers hugely from that tunnel vision effect where only one opinion is allowed per topic and anything deviating from the hivemind is quickly buried
Honestly, this happens in every on-line community with a rabid fanbase. I see it here too, way more often than I would like.
Honestly, this happens in every on-line community with a rabid fanbase. I see it here too, way more often than I would like.
"New drivers typically also only get a dozen or so races to prove themselves..."
Unless you're a pay driver who's bringing enough money to almost wholly fund the team. Nikita Mazepin is surely one of the most talentless people to ever set foot in an F1 car, but he brought Russian Oligarch money with him so we'd have had to endure him for another season had Russia not invaded Ukraine. I'm genuinely curious to see if Haas can last the season now that they've shown him the door.
Incidentally, I believe technically we could have as many as 26 cars on the grid (13 teams), but because even being epically uncompetitive at formula 1 is ruinously expensive, and the fact that only the top 10 teams get any prize money at the end of the season, the grid has been 20 cars for a while.
Unless you're a pay driver who's bringing enough money to almost wholly fund the team. Nikita Mazepin is surely one of the most talentless people to ever set foot in an F1 car, but he brought Russian Oligarch money with him so we'd have had to endure him for another season had Russia not invaded Ukraine. I'm genuinely curious to see if Haas can last the season now that they've shown him the door.
Incidentally, I believe technically we could have as many as 26 cars on the grid (13 teams), but because even being epically uncompetitive at formula 1 is ruinously expensive, and the fact that only the top 10 teams get any prize money at the end of the season, the grid has been 20 cars for a while.
F1, from an excitement point of view, suffers from the same issue as European footie: unequal budgets. Every team is only really judged against how much resource they brought. Witness Man Utd, everyone is saying what an awful season they're having. They're in 5th place. Watch an F1 race and it's the same, everyone is on a money ladder and are doing well when they're up a little based on where you expect from their budget.
The truly interesting thing about F1 is hidden from sight: engineering. Yes, your driver matters a bit but if you have money you will have a good car as well, which you need to attract a good driver. I guess it's easier to exaggerate the importance of the driver than the dozens of engineers who are doing new things all the time. Quite hard to do a TV show I guess.
There's also the issue that driving is basically a plutocracy. You can't be a driver without huge, huge amounts of money. You _can_ be a driver if you've only got huge amounts of money. Either you have to be unusually good at driving so that someone sponsors you (an even narrower eye of the needle than pro footie), or you have to be unusually wealthy so that mom and dad can sponsor you. Is this a truly global sport? Top drivers seem to come from a small range of countries that either have a motoring tradition or absurd wealth inequality, or just rich countries.
Finally the races seem to happen in all sorts of places that are to motorsports as Qatar is to football.
The truly interesting thing about F1 is hidden from sight: engineering. Yes, your driver matters a bit but if you have money you will have a good car as well, which you need to attract a good driver. I guess it's easier to exaggerate the importance of the driver than the dozens of engineers who are doing new things all the time. Quite hard to do a TV show I guess.
There's also the issue that driving is basically a plutocracy. You can't be a driver without huge, huge amounts of money. You _can_ be a driver if you've only got huge amounts of money. Either you have to be unusually good at driving so that someone sponsors you (an even narrower eye of the needle than pro footie), or you have to be unusually wealthy so that mom and dad can sponsor you. Is this a truly global sport? Top drivers seem to come from a small range of countries that either have a motoring tradition or absurd wealth inequality, or just rich countries.
Finally the races seem to happen in all sorts of places that are to motorsports as Qatar is to football.
There are now quite reasonable budget caps ($145m last year, $140m this year, $135m next year).
This is about a third to a quarter of what Ferrari, Mercedes, and Red Bull were spending per year prior to the cap.
Also, freezing the power unit formula until 2025 has evened the playing field on that front. All of the PUs have as close of parity as they have in the turbo hybrid era.
Lastly, the new 2022 car regs have the potential to shake up the grid.
It's not like the sporting body doesn't recognize this as a problem. How do you balance the field without turning it into a spec racing series?
This is about a third to a quarter of what Ferrari, Mercedes, and Red Bull were spending per year prior to the cap.
Also, freezing the power unit formula until 2025 has evened the playing field on that front. All of the PUs have as close of parity as they have in the turbo hybrid era.
Lastly, the new 2022 car regs have the potential to shake up the grid.
It's not like the sporting body doesn't recognize this as a problem. How do you balance the field without turning it into a spec racing series?
> Also, freezing the power unit formula until 2025 has evened the playing field on that front. All of the PUs have as close of parity as they have in the turbo hybrid era.
I think this is speculation, and we wont actually know if this is true until tomorrow & Sunday.
I think this is speculation, and we wont actually know if this is true until tomorrow & Sunday.
All of the reasons the author likes F1 also apply to MotoGP motorcycle racing, which I feel is a purer sport with more emphasis on the rider, less margin for error, and more exciting racing.
I'm not much of a Formula 1 fan (although I followed it more or less regularly at times) but I once was at the track when they had a training session and I had goosebumps. Actually, I now have goosebumps thinking about it. So, what was so special? Just the sheer sound of the machines. You hear it kilometers away from the track and once you're there you are totally engrossed by the sounds of the machines - basically vibrating through your body. I'm having trouble to describe it (maybe someone else can do it) but it's definitely a total different experience than watching on TV and I recommend it to anyone to hear for yourself just once.
If you like F1 because of "Drive to Survive", I am sorry but F1 is not at all like that. I have been follower of F1 for more than 20 years now. But not because of only racing. Racing is just 20%. It's more a team game, team politics, engineering, team strategies etc that keeps my interest in F1. If you just follow live racing, I can guarantee you, it's more boring than 5 day cricket test matches. There are lot times a team gonna keep leading for ages. Like mercs for almost 7 years now. But behind doors there are teams who try to do politics to makesure they comeback on top.
Yeah a lot of these comments definitely sound like they are from a new fan who picked up the vibe from Drive to Survive, with its made-up rivalries and over-editorializing. I find the items laid out in the article to be some of the most untrue or frustrating things about the sport.
But hey if you're in the HN crowd / an engineer and this piques one's interest, I really enjoy the Tech Talk show with Sam Collins and following Craig Scarborough on social media because they both dive into the technical innovation (one might say "hacking" of the regulations) the teams are doing to try and eek out new advantages.
But hey if you're in the HN crowd / an engineer and this piques one's interest, I really enjoy the Tech Talk show with Sam Collins and following Craig Scarborough on social media because they both dive into the technical innovation (one might say "hacking" of the regulations) the teams are doing to try and eek out new advantages.
> Like mercs for almost 7 years now
Uh, I think you mean "almost 10 years now". Hamilton joined in 2013, which is when they got second in WCC. They have effectively dominated since then.
Uh, I think you mean "almost 10 years now". Hamilton joined in 2013, which is when they got second in WCC. They have effectively dominated since then.
I have been watching F1 for >20years and my 2 cents:
Pros: most advanced cares, if you like engineering. the 'best' drivers.
Cons: Lack of wheel to wheel race Some money-driven decisions. Some boring races
Regardless of that, since Liberty Media acquired F1 it is going in a good direction: A bit less rapid cars, more fights It seems to have found its place in the sustainability space.
In terms of Human Rights and so on, you have double-edge situations here, such as visiting S.Arabia and at the same time solid movements of gender equality and others like black liver matters
Pros: most advanced cares, if you like engineering. the 'best' drivers.
Cons: Lack of wheel to wheel race Some money-driven decisions. Some boring races
Regardless of that, since Liberty Media acquired F1 it is going in a good direction: A bit less rapid cars, more fights It seems to have found its place in the sustainability space.
In terms of Human Rights and so on, you have double-edge situations here, such as visiting S.Arabia and at the same time solid movements of gender equality and others like black liver matters
Is there something similar to F1 but with autonomous cars ?
Just a race between autonomous cars, pitting teams of engineers directly against each other instead of via the human pilot.
I guessed that would involve some pretty different design of the cars, since without the human much of the current designs around safety wouldn't apply. Cars could go faster, slow less, take more risky trajectories.
There's RobotWars, but these always seem (currently) like a weird RC toys competitions.
Just a race between autonomous cars, pitting teams of engineers directly against each other instead of via the human pilot.
I guessed that would involve some pretty different design of the cars, since without the human much of the current designs around safety wouldn't apply. Cars could go faster, slow less, take more risky trajectories.
There's RobotWars, but these always seem (currently) like a weird RC toys competitions.
This already exists, it's called Roborace (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roborace)
Thanks :) that was why I asked here
I think the largest attempt at something like that is Roborace - a spinoff from Formula-E (Formula 1 - for electric vehicles).
But they lack the human aspects, personalities etc, which is a huge part of Formula 1.
After many years away from Formula 1 (because it became boring), which I loved as a kid, I started following it again last year, and absolutely love it again.
But they lack the human aspects, personalities etc, which is a huge part of Formula 1.
After many years away from Formula 1 (because it became boring), which I loved as a kid, I started following it again last year, and absolutely love it again.
In addition to what other's mentioned, there's also this:
https://www.indyautonomouschallenge.com/
Idk if it's going to be recurring, but they had a second race for CES22.
https://www.indyautonomouschallenge.com/
Idk if it's going to be recurring, but they had a second race for CES22.
This is a really good summary. Much like the author I was hooked by Netflix's "Drive to Survive" a few years back, and have since found myself watching every race hence (although I have yet to attend a Grand Prix). In case you're interested in checking it out, the first race of the 2022 season is this weekend and should be broadcast on ESPN in the US.
And if you don't already pay for ESPN, F1TV has a 7-day trial or $26 for the year (if you don't mind waiting 2 days after the race - there's a higher package that lets you see stuff live) that let's you watch on-demand and has a lot of content besides the race, etc.
If you like sports in the service of pushing technology, and you care about the environment, you should be watching Formula E instead.
For a good intro: https://youtu.be/EUyHyk6bq0I
For a good intro: https://youtu.be/EUyHyk6bq0I
This article failed to mention what seems to me like one of the most important aspects of the competition: team dynamics.
Mercedes is the only team (as far as I know) that says things like "we win as a team and lose as a team", try to hold blame-free retrospectives, open collaboration between various sub-teams, and so on.
Every other team goes for cut-throat competition between individuals. "You have to prove yourself or you're out", mistakes are held against you, and so on.
Guess which team has won the last 8 constructor's championships?
I can't believe people aren't talking more about this.
Mercedes is the only team (as far as I know) that says things like "we win as a team and lose as a team", try to hold blame-free retrospectives, open collaboration between various sub-teams, and so on.
Every other team goes for cut-throat competition between individuals. "You have to prove yourself or you're out", mistakes are held against you, and so on.
Guess which team has won the last 8 constructor's championships?
I can't believe people aren't talking more about this.
If you believe what you see in Drive To Survive then you think the above (which is a big problem with the series). In reality it’s not true. Mercedes are successful because they had a huge head start on the new hybrid engine regs and hired one of the most talented drivers in history. Management is important but “we win and lose as a team” is marketing. The Hamilton/Rosberg era illustrated a lot of cracks in that marketing.
Interesting! Do you have further reading I can look into?
Do you know why the Drive To Survive authors would slant things this way?
Do you know why the Drive To Survive authors would slant things this way?
Yeah just so you know that show twisted all kinds of things to add to the drama. More drivers speak out every season about how audio clips of them were edited to make them sound more adversarial to their team mate, etc. and they really don't feel that way. Look at the social media comments about it from fans, and everyone feels like they ignored the big stories everyone really talked about and just fixated on drama.
But a lot of teams have historically had this "we win as a team" vibe and done things like expect the #2 driver to obey team orders and give up position to let the #1 driver score more points and increase the odds of the driver's championship going to a driver from that team. I don't have further reading on this topic specifically, but if you're wanting to learn more and you're in the HN crowd, Steve Matchett's books are awesome and Adrian Newey's autobiography is also pretty good and covers a lot of the last couple of decades with a ton of cool technical detail.
But a lot of teams have historically had this "we win as a team" vibe and done things like expect the #2 driver to obey team orders and give up position to let the #1 driver score more points and increase the odds of the driver's championship going to a driver from that team. I don't have further reading on this topic specifically, but if you're wanting to learn more and you're in the HN crowd, Steve Matchett's books are awesome and Adrian Newey's autobiography is also pretty good and covers a lot of the last couple of decades with a ton of cool technical detail.
That's it's whole purpose, to get people watching that wouldn't normally watch F1.
When F1 had the idea, Amazon offered them more money, but they went with Netflix because it was more about getting eyeballs on the show so they would then come and watch the sport.
It's entirely marketing and designed to bring people into the sport, also a lot of the top teams/drivers don't provide a huge amount of access as they get in the way / give away secrets / make crap up that makes them look bad, so they focus more heavily on smaller teams and have to invent stories there to make it seem exciting.
When F1 had the idea, Amazon offered them more money, but they went with Netflix because it was more about getting eyeballs on the show so they would then come and watch the sport.
It's entirely marketing and designed to bring people into the sport, also a lot of the top teams/drivers don't provide a huge amount of access as they get in the way / give away secrets / make crap up that makes them look bad, so they focus more heavily on smaller teams and have to invent stories there to make it seem exciting.
Because it makes the "story" more interesting? It's not an f1 documentary. It's a show based on f1. There is a difference.
> says things like "we win as a team and lose as a team"
This is pretty common amongst teams that are on a strong winning streak. Red Bull were very much this way during Vettel's dominance years too.
Ferrari in recent years are extremely this way as well, it just presents in a different way. If a driver speaks out negatively about the team, they're shown the door pretty quickly.
This is pretty common amongst teams that are on a strong winning streak. Red Bull were very much this way during Vettel's dominance years too.
Ferrari in recent years are extremely this way as well, it just presents in a different way. If a driver speaks out negatively about the team, they're shown the door pretty quickly.
That's in no way completely true. You're essentially 100% buying into the Mercedes propaganda.
Mercedes talk a mean game but whenever they are under pressure they play just as nasty as everyone else on the grid.
What about the environmental impact?
They have Formula-E. Ultimately, it should overtake F1 and replace it.
Missed out on the fact that it is prohibitively expensive to watch it in the UK
And not just in Russia & Saudi Arabia, F1 is hosted by lot’s of other dictators, human rights abusers countries. Just like FIFA:
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/feb/25/uefa-and-fi...