Katskhi pillar in Georgia: One of the world's most isolated churches(cnn.com)
cnn.com
Katskhi pillar in Georgia: One of the world's most isolated churches
https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/katskhi-pillar-georgia/index.html
35 comments
> before church there was a remnants of pre-Christianity worship (phallic pillars were popular) of fertility up there, asking for archeological works, but he either destroyed or removed artefacts completely.
> nothing should go higher than worshiping of his imaginary gods.
So he should leave the remnants of everyone else's imaginary Gods? You can't really have it both ways here.
> nothing should go higher than worshiping of his imaginary gods.
So he should leave the remnants of everyone else's imaginary Gods? You can't really have it both ways here.
He shouldn't leave the remnants of everyone else's imaginary gods. He should leave archeological artifacts intact so that they can be studied and displayed.
By the same logic, should the monks of medieval times have burnt texts from antiquity instead of copying them for preservation?
By the same logic, should the monks of medieval times have burnt texts from antiquity instead of copying them for preservation?
Christus vincit!
გაიხარე
I can highly recommend Georgia to visit, lovely place, friendly people, amazing food, amazing wine.
Unfortunately the cigarette smoking is out of control. If that kind of thing bothers you, skip the whole country.
That's changed a bit in recent years. No more smoking inside, but yeah, it's a tobacco loving place.
You know I count that as a plus. I can't possibly go back to smoking, but enjoy it when others smoke, enjoy second-hand smoke, am a smoker sympathizer, have romantic memories of smoking, sometimes feel closeness to women while they smoke.
But don't smoke myself. I also think cigarette companies--especially American and British--should develop minimally-addictive cigarettes, like with no cadmium, and actually clean out the radiation from radium, which they're capable of but didn't decide to do. Just more freedom in the cigarette, the choice of whether to smoke or not for every single item in the pack. More choice.
Georgia sounds perfect.
But don't smoke myself. I also think cigarette companies--especially American and British--should develop minimally-addictive cigarettes, like with no cadmium, and actually clean out the radiation from radium, which they're capable of but didn't decide to do. Just more freedom in the cigarette, the choice of whether to smoke or not for every single item in the pack. More choice.
Georgia sounds perfect.
> minimally-addictive cigarettes, like with no cadmium, and actually clean out the radiation from radium
I'm rather confused what you're proposing here. The presence of cadmium has nothing to do with the addictive properties of cigarettes, which are largely mediated by nicotine.
As far as I'm aware, cigarettes do not generally contain any meaningful amount of radium.
I'm rather confused what you're proposing here. The presence of cadmium has nothing to do with the addictive properties of cigarettes, which are largely mediated by nicotine.
As far as I'm aware, cigarettes do not generally contain any meaningful amount of radium.
No, cadmium is there, it's supposedly for getting it to stay lit longer. But it's there to be addictive too, it gives them the metallic flavor they have when you smoke one after a long abstinence. Like smoking a battery or some shit. That's the cadmium, battery metal by the way, and it is apparently a naturally addictive element.
There's cadmium there, yeah.
But cadmium is not addictive, and is not a reason for cigarettes being addictive.
Removing the cadmium will not make cigarettes less addictive.
Tobacco plants pull metals in from the soil, which includes cadmium, and radioisotopes of polonium and lead.
Tobacco plants pull metals in from the soil, which includes cadmium, and radioisotopes of polonium and lead.
So while I was off cigarettes I would vape, then still craved cigarettes. But I was getting all this nicotine, right? Then I smoked one, as planned, one per season while quitting, which changes the self-talk from "I can never smoke again" to "I gotta hold out for Autumn." Then I smoke it, it's so metallic. Incredible. I personally craved the metal, and in particular I did find a study rats preferred some dosage of something with cadmium in it.
Yeah I think the main health concern with cigarettes (other than nicotine) is tar, and I'm not sure how possible it is to make a cigarette without that
Nah. Arsenic is also on the package. I've read it.
Fat-ass chunk of the table of elements, honestly. Yeah polonium like someone else said...I think. Radium for sure. Like the tobacco plants have these weird sticky hairs that suck in radioactive elements, suck in poison.
And they could filter all those poisons out. But they don't. Although like I said before, it's the only legal form of suicide. Shrinks can say nothing against it. That gives the toxicity legitimacy.
Fat-ass chunk of the table of elements, honestly. Yeah polonium like someone else said...I think. Radium for sure. Like the tobacco plants have these weird sticky hairs that suck in radioactive elements, suck in poison.
And they could filter all those poisons out. But they don't. Although like I said before, it's the only legal form of suicide. Shrinks can say nothing against it. That gives the toxicity legitimacy.
Second this! Went there sking some years back, one of the most remarkable and amazing places I have been.
Resort of Gudauri offers amazing skiing, with the possible do some short hikes to do some world class offpist runs.
Transitioned to other side of the country to Mestia, equal amazing skiing but even more amazing place.
Me and some friends are planning a skiing trip for winter and were considering Italy, Slovakia and Austria (or just going somewhere in Czech Rep). I never thought to consider Georgia, though! Thanks for the tip, just checking it now :D
- "A number of local legends surround the pillar. One of them has it that the top of the rock was connected by a long iron chain to the dome of the Katskhi church, located at a distance of around 1.5 km from the pillar.[1]"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katskhi_pillar
Is that plausible, for medieval engineering? Are there other examples like this?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katskhi_pillar
Is that plausible, for medieval engineering? Are there other examples like this?
> for medieval engineering? Are there other examples like this?
Nails. This single Roman fort in Scotland had nearly a million iron nails, all of them hand made:
> When it was excavated in the 1950s by Richmond, a large pit was found in the summer of 1960 containing 875,400 complete iron nails (Square shaft) ranging from 50–410 mm (2–16 in) plus another 28 (round shaft nails) weighing 7 tons, together with other iron objects, including cartwheel rims weighing a combined total weight of ten tonnes (Inchtuthil Nails by “Roddy Fraser”).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inchtuthil
That's just one fort in a remote frontier of the empire. They were mass producing stuff like this, by hand.
Nails. This single Roman fort in Scotland had nearly a million iron nails, all of them hand made:
> When it was excavated in the 1950s by Richmond, a large pit was found in the summer of 1960 containing 875,400 complete iron nails (Square shaft) ranging from 50–410 mm (2–16 in) plus another 28 (round shaft nails) weighing 7 tons, together with other iron objects, including cartwheel rims weighing a combined total weight of ten tonnes (Inchtuthil Nails by “Roddy Fraser”).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inchtuthil
That's just one fort in a remote frontier of the empire. They were mass producing stuff like this, by hand.
According to Google, a typical chainmail hauberk could have as many as 45,000 10mm rings - if we assume that 2cm rings are not excessively more difficult to make than 10mm rings, then 45,000 2cm rings linked end-to-end would stretch around 900m long.
Even assuming the chain didn't float in the air and instead draped down the rock and along the ground, it would likely take "only" 3-5 chainmail hauberks' worth of rings to cover the distance.
It wouldn't be an easy task, but there were far more than 5 people in medieval times with full sets of chainmail armor, so it's definitely not outside the realm of possibility.
Even assuming the chain didn't float in the air and instead draped down the rock and along the ground, it would likely take "only" 3-5 chainmail hauberks' worth of rings to cover the distance.
It wouldn't be an easy task, but there were far more than 5 people in medieval times with full sets of chainmail armor, so it's definitely not outside the realm of possibility.
It feels like it would snap under its own weight well before that, though, unless it was suspended from multiple points.
> it would likely take "only" 3-5 chainmail hauberks' worth of rings to cover the distance.
It would take a lot more metal, though!
It would take a lot more metal, though!
Connecting the two in a zip-line fashion?
I don't know enough about materials science, but a 1/4" welded steel chain has a working load of 3150 lbs and weighs 0.63 lbs per foot. 1.5km is roughly 4900 feet, a chain that long would weigh 3100 lbs. So it would hold until the first wind or rain -- keeping in mind that these specs are for a modern forge-produced chain.
I don't know enough about materials science, but a 1/4" welded steel chain has a working load of 3150 lbs and weighs 0.63 lbs per foot. 1.5km is roughly 4900 feet, a chain that long would weigh 3100 lbs. So it would hold until the first wind or rain -- keeping in mind that these specs are for a modern forge-produced chain.
If you are interested in remote churches here is a list of the ones in Antarctica https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Antarctic_churches
Apparently the stylite tradition is still around.
If you're not particularly fond of Christian churches, there are also loads of shrines and temples perched on top (or sticking out of the side) of impressive cliffs and pillars in China.
https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/hanging-temple-hengshan
https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2019/04/a-photo-visit-to-m...
https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/hanging-temple-hengshan
https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2019/04/a-photo-visit-to-m...
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There are very similar formations in the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia. Well worth a side trip from I-81. But no monks or stylites to be seen.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_Chimneys
https://gohikevirginia.com/natural-chimneys/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_Chimneys
https://gohikevirginia.com/natural-chimneys/
This video is a little hectic / terrible music, but shows some decent aerial shots of the site: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLira5kkIaw
There's at least one church in Ethiopia where people are hoisted up.
I’m surprised a rope and platform hoist was never added to move supplies up.
IceMetalPunk(1)
Next to that pillar, there was rock climbing route sponsored by government of Germany for Georgians, rock climbers worked for years to install it - he fought them physically to remove it, by his words - nothing should go higher than worshiping of his imaginary gods.
So, yeah - while Georgia is super underrated religious people like him ruin everything.