Literacy in the U.S. has fallen to 79%, down from 96% in the late 1980's(thenationalliteracyinstitute.com)
thenationalliteracyinstitute.com
Literacy in the U.S. has fallen to 79%, down from 96% in the late 1980's
https://www.thenationalliteracyinstitute.com/post/literacy-statistics-2024-2025-where-we-are-now
38 comments
I think there must be nuances here that are not being made clear.
What is the level below which one is no longer literate (it seems to be 5th grade level, which I think is 10 yo?)
Is this English (as opposed to perhaps a higher literacy rate in other languages (ie literacy is high, just America has a lot more non native speakers than we expect)
Just confused
What is the level below which one is no longer literate (it seems to be 5th grade level, which I think is 10 yo?)
Is this English (as opposed to perhaps a higher literacy rate in other languages (ie literacy is high, just America has a lot more non native speakers than we expect)
Just confused
think this says it all:
The state with the lowest adult literacy rate was California.
Must be immigration..
In fact. I had a really shocking encounter at my house with some young men (maybe as young as 16, hard to tell) who were digging a ditch for my sewer line as subcontractors to my plumber. I was trying to communicate with them in Spanish but I was having a hard time so I pulled out google translate. I realized they couldn't read Spanish. I used the text to speech in the app but that was quite a sobering realization just how little education they had experienced.
The state with the lowest adult literacy rate was California.
Must be immigration..
In fact. I had a really shocking encounter at my house with some young men (maybe as young as 16, hard to tell) who were digging a ditch for my sewer line as subcontractors to my plumber. I was trying to communicate with them in Spanish but I was having a hard time so I pulled out google translate. I realized they couldn't read Spanish. I used the text to speech in the app but that was quite a sobering realization just how little education they had experienced.
>I realized they couldn't read Spanish.
They're from indigenous tribes from the highlands in Mexico and further south. We are allowing in illegal aliens who aren't even literate in their home countries' dominant language.
They're from indigenous tribes from the highlands in Mexico and further south. We are allowing in illegal aliens who aren't even literate in their home countries' dominant language.
Perhaps those people risk their lives to cross our border _so that_ they can learn how to read.
Also, you interact with and work amongst many, many, many more undocumented people than you think you do. Be kind.
Also, you interact with and work amongst many, many, many more undocumented people than you think you do. Be kind.
It is quite obviously good for the people doing it. No one would ever debate that. It is incumbent upon supporters to explain why this is good for the native population. Shouldn't that be the priority?
Yup.. I'd love to start a general contracting business but I don't want to in an environment I have to compete with people that are hiring illegal immigrants and children. Not because of any moral reasons but I'd like to pay a fair wage and provide benefits. I can't compete with under the table pay and I'm not breaking the law.
That's certainly one example of a counter-argument. One might even consider the literacy rate falling from 96% to 79% as another.
but hey the GDP is going up!
We are the wealthiest country in the world. Our founding credo is that everyone belongs here. [0] We should stand behind that. Nobody wants to immigrate into a country illegally.
[0] The Founding Fathers had the right idea even if "everyone" didn't mean "actually everyone" at the time the country was founded.
[0] The Founding Fathers had the right idea even if "everyone" didn't mean "actually everyone" at the time the country was founded.
>Our founding credo is that everyone belongs here.
This is an absurd falsehood. It is an indefensible assertion based on nothing but modern moralism.
>We are the wealthiest country in the world
This wealth can be squandered by catering to the desires of outsiders that want to come here. We should stand behind maintaining that wealth, power, and quality of life for our dependents and pass along that prosperity to them.
Turning the country from 96% literate to 79%, and all the associated degradation that comes along with that, is not the morally honorable position. The demographics in 1980, let alone 1776 were very specific and narrow.
I'll note that no one supporting this seems to be claiming the country will be better or stronger or this will benefit the citizens already here. Only that it is good for the people coming in. This is not how politics is done well or national interest is defended. Leaders that pursue this are abdicating their responsibility towards the people they are supposed to serve.
This is an absurd falsehood. It is an indefensible assertion based on nothing but modern moralism.
>We are the wealthiest country in the world
This wealth can be squandered by catering to the desires of outsiders that want to come here. We should stand behind maintaining that wealth, power, and quality of life for our dependents and pass along that prosperity to them.
Turning the country from 96% literate to 79%, and all the associated degradation that comes along with that, is not the morally honorable position. The demographics in 1980, let alone 1776 were very specific and narrow.
I'll note that no one supporting this seems to be claiming the country will be better or stronger or this will benefit the citizens already here. Only that it is good for the people coming in. This is not how politics is done well or national interest is defended. Leaders that pursue this are abdicating their responsibility towards the people they are supposed to serve.
A significant amount of that wealth is built on the backs of those very people.
Further, insinuating that this literacy drop (putting aside changes to how literacy was measured during that time) is entirely the fault of undocumented persons is careless.
Further, insinuating that this literacy drop (putting aside changes to how literacy was measured during that time) is entirely the fault of undocumented persons is careless.
I keep expecting the French to demand the Statue of Liberty back. Or at least tell us to change the sign to "Huddled masses: keep out".
That poem was added to the statue 17 years after it's opening, by an American. It has nothing to do with the French, and the statue was not designed to symbolize "immigration" but liberty and enlightenment.
Maybe they'll suggest chaining the sign, but they never created it in the first place.
Maybe they'll suggest chaining the sign, but they never created it in the first place.
I’m not from California but why did you not report this immediately? Child labor is very bad and having it occur on your property is even worse!
A quick search indicates that 14-18 year olds can obtain a permit to work in the state of California.
> 54% of adults have a literacy below a 6th-grade level
Plenty of comments will call out demographic changes and immigration, but if 54% of adults don't have literacy rates of 6th grade, then there are some serious other things to talk about.
Plenty of comments will call out demographic changes and immigration, but if 54% of adults don't have literacy rates of 6th grade, then there are some serious other things to talk about.
This article really piqued my interest, so I did some further research into these claims.
- The source of the "illiteracy costs $2T/year": https://www.barbarabush.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/BBF_A...
- Literacy is a global problem. There are myriad reasons why people don't learn how to read. It is very difficult to learn _anything_ when your housing is at risk, for example.
- Literacy in general is relatively new. We've been illiterate as a species for _way_ longer than we haven't, and reading/writing was an activity reserved for the elite for a long, long time. Literacy as a metric for social progress really started in the 1800s!
- UNESCO is responsible for collecting global literacy levels, but countries can choose how this data is collected. Self-reporting is very popular, as you can imagine. (This is a catch-22; to participate in these surveys, you have to be able to read...)
- The metric for how literacy was reported changed in the 2000s, and I'm not sure if data from prior years was normalized retroactively
As an aside, I think _this_ is the biggest reason why photo and video based social media took off. 1 in 3 people can't read beyond a fifth-grade level. Reading is HARD for a lot of people.
- The source of the "illiteracy costs $2T/year": https://www.barbarabush.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/BBF_A...
- Literacy is a global problem. There are myriad reasons why people don't learn how to read. It is very difficult to learn _anything_ when your housing is at risk, for example.
- Literacy in general is relatively new. We've been illiterate as a species for _way_ longer than we haven't, and reading/writing was an activity reserved for the elite for a long, long time. Literacy as a metric for social progress really started in the 1800s!
- UNESCO is responsible for collecting global literacy levels, but countries can choose how this data is collected. Self-reporting is very popular, as you can imagine. (This is a catch-22; to participate in these surveys, you have to be able to read...)
- The metric for how literacy was reported changed in the 2000s, and I'm not sure if data from prior years was normalized retroactively
As an aside, I think _this_ is the biggest reason why photo and video based social media took off. 1 in 3 people can't read beyond a fifth-grade level. Reading is HARD for a lot of people.
The ‘fifth grade level’ they use is a much higher bar than you likely assume.
They include being able to write fairly well as part of the standard not just read and understand material. Quantitative literacy includes things like figuring out the correct tip split on a bill, something many successful people absolutely fail at.
Calling those illiteracy is IMO abusing a term well outside the ordinary definition.
They include being able to write fairly well as part of the standard not just read and understand material. Quantitative literacy includes things like figuring out the correct tip split on a bill, something many successful people absolutely fail at.
Calling those illiteracy is IMO abusing a term well outside the ordinary definition.
I am sure some of this can be explained by demographic change
Of native born peoples?
It says 34% of adults lacking literacy proficiency were born outside the US, but not how many born outside the US are lacking literacy proficiency, and neither how many born inside the US are.
It seems a bit misleading to state two similar facts (total rate vs rate of outside born) in such an incomparable way.
It seems a bit misleading to state two similar facts (total rate vs rate of outside born) in such an incomparable way.
Agreed, the presentation of summarized statistics in the web page seems intended to shock, and it’s hard to reconcile some numbers:
According to the Census 2020 Current Population Survey[1]:
* There are 44.9 MM foreign-born in the US, of which 95.9% are age 15 or more. Of the 39.5 MM (88% of foreign-born) age 25 and over: 13.6% do not have/86.4% have at least 8th-grade education; 75% have at least high-school diploma. * Total population of US is 331.45 MM, of which 81.4% are age 15-and-older, so foreign-born is 13.5% of total, or 16% of 15-and-older.
If we believe that 21% of 15-and-older lack literacy proficiency, and 34% of those are foreign-born, then we multiply to get: 7% of 15-and-older are both foreign-born and lack literacy proficiency.
But then comparing with the CPS, 7% of 15-and-older is nearly half of the 16% foreign-born fraction of 15-and-older, and seems inconsistent with the CPS statistic that more than 69% of 15-and-older foreign-born (75% of 25-and-older, which represent 88% of all foreign-born) have at least high school education.
There are some basis risk problems (literacy statistics vs educational attainment; 2024 data vs 2020 data); but I would think those are probably rounding errors. I suspect the top-line 21% number is inflated.
[1]: https://www.census.gov/data/tables/2020/demo/foreign-born/cp... , particularly tables 2.1 and 2.5
According to the Census 2020 Current Population Survey[1]:
* There are 44.9 MM foreign-born in the US, of which 95.9% are age 15 or more. Of the 39.5 MM (88% of foreign-born) age 25 and over: 13.6% do not have/86.4% have at least 8th-grade education; 75% have at least high-school diploma. * Total population of US is 331.45 MM, of which 81.4% are age 15-and-older, so foreign-born is 13.5% of total, or 16% of 15-and-older.
If we believe that 21% of 15-and-older lack literacy proficiency, and 34% of those are foreign-born, then we multiply to get: 7% of 15-and-older are both foreign-born and lack literacy proficiency.
But then comparing with the CPS, 7% of 15-and-older is nearly half of the 16% foreign-born fraction of 15-and-older, and seems inconsistent with the CPS statistic that more than 69% of 15-and-older foreign-born (75% of 25-and-older, which represent 88% of all foreign-born) have at least high school education.
There are some basis risk problems (literacy statistics vs educational attainment; 2024 data vs 2020 data); but I would think those are probably rounding errors. I suspect the top-line 21% number is inflated.
[1]: https://www.census.gov/data/tables/2020/demo/foreign-born/cp... , particularly tables 2.1 and 2.5
This claims that literacy in the US in 2024 was 79%. Unless I am missing something, the latter half of this post ("down from 96% in the late 1980's") is absent from the linked article, and is seemingly entirely unsourced.
"Black American students have average literacy scores below students from Russia and Chile.
U.S. Asian students, however, topped the global ranking, with White students not far behind" - Bloomberg [0][1]
In 1980, the US was ~80% non-Hispanic White. In 2020, it was ~58% [2]
[0] https://twitter.com/opinion/status/1282703557146419202
[1] https://archive.is/tzsAg
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-Hispanic_whites
U.S. Asian students, however, topped the global ranking, with White students not far behind" - Bloomberg [0][1]
In 1980, the US was ~80% non-Hispanic White. In 2020, it was ~58% [2]
[0] https://twitter.com/opinion/status/1282703557146419202
[1] https://archive.is/tzsAg
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-Hispanic_whites
>"Black American students have average literacy scores below students from Russia and Chile.
>U.S. Asian students, however, topped the global ranking, with White students not far behind"
Americans do well on PISA compared to their ethnic relatives. <https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-new-2018-pisa-school-test-sco...> Asian Americans do better than Asians; whites do better than Europeans; Latinos do better than Latin Americans; and blacks do better than Africans.
Hispanics and especially blacks' scores (as you note) drag the US average down. Both white and Asian Americans score higher than Canada (and white+Asian is essentially Canada's racial makeup), and higher than New Zealand, Australia, the Netherlands, Belgium, Germany, France, Norway, and the UK; Estonia is below US Asians but above white Americans. Norway is by far the wealthiest Nordic state but its average is only two points higher than the US national average, despite not having a demographic that is 13% of the population and scores 85 points below the white American average.
>U.S. Asian students, however, topped the global ranking, with White students not far behind"
Americans do well on PISA compared to their ethnic relatives. <https://www.unz.com/isteve/the-new-2018-pisa-school-test-sco...> Asian Americans do better than Asians; whites do better than Europeans; Latinos do better than Latin Americans; and blacks do better than Africans.
Hispanics and especially blacks' scores (as you note) drag the US average down. Both white and Asian Americans score higher than Canada (and white+Asian is essentially Canada's racial makeup), and higher than New Zealand, Australia, the Netherlands, Belgium, Germany, France, Norway, and the UK; Estonia is below US Asians but above white Americans. Norway is by far the wealthiest Nordic state but its average is only two points higher than the US national average, despite not having a demographic that is 13% of the population and scores 85 points below the white American average.
Interesting. There is a huge unanswered question about how the students were selected.
Who would flag this?
Reminder that statistics are useless without granular demographics dimensions. Also why you should never take medical statistics seriously, they dont break the numbers out by the variables that matter most: race, income, age, height, weight, substance use etc. Large scale psyop across most disciplines
A reminder that US life expectancy dropped two years in a row before covid19.
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We’ve seen this several times when definition of literacy A hits 99% people start counting something else.
In many nations, the ability to read a simple sentence suffices as literacy, and was the previous standard for the U.S. The definition of literacy has changed greatly; the term is presently defined as the ability to use printed and written information to function in society, to achieve one's goals, and to develop one's knowledge and potential.[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literacy_in_the_United_States