PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers(wsj.com)
wsj.com
PayPal is planning an ad business using data on its shoppers
https://www.wsj.com/articles/paypal-is-planning-an-ad-business-using-data-on-its-millions-of-shoppers-cc5e0625
35 comments
True, but it's still a great reason to stop using PayPal.
It's not widely known but lookup "Level 3 Data" when processing credit card transactions.
Your whole receipt is sent to the CC companies, and used for ... well whatever you agreed to let them use it for. You read all the fine print, right?
Your whole receipt is sent to the CC companies, and used for ... well whatever you agreed to let them use it for. You read all the fine print, right?
I looked it up, and it seems L3 is only used by Visa and MC, and only for B2B/B2G.
Could you link a source supporting your claims?
Could you link a source supporting your claims?
For obvious reasons, businesses are usually mum about this, but I've seen some reports that Amex takes L3 data for B2C stuff:
https://www.thecreditchronicles.com/blog/tips-and-tricks-for...
> Another suggestion is to watch out for whether your store shares Level 3 (L3) data with your credit card company. These levels indicate how much information about your transaction is shared with the credit card company. L3 data includes the most amount of information, including itemized data about exactly what you purchased. If the store shares L3 data, your credit card company will be able to easily determine that you have been purchasing gift cards.
> Whether a store shares L3 data may be different for Visa and Amex transactions. For Amex transactions, you can look at your statement history on the web (not mobile) Amex website to see if they include an itemized list of what you purchased. If not, then no L3 data has been shared. Thus, we suggest starting by making a small purchase at the retailer to determine if they share L3 data, and only scale up if they do not.
The infrastructure is clearly in place, it's just a matter of if the agreement is in place and if the store is ready to sell out their customers for the discounted interchange rate. I was hoping to find a better link than a CC points hacking site discussing "manufactured spending", but that's what I could find easily. Grocery stores supporting EBT/SNAP/Benefits must have the infrastructure in place to support L3 data: that's how they determine if you the transaction is eligible or not.
https://www.thecreditchronicles.com/blog/tips-and-tricks-for...
> Another suggestion is to watch out for whether your store shares Level 3 (L3) data with your credit card company. These levels indicate how much information about your transaction is shared with the credit card company. L3 data includes the most amount of information, including itemized data about exactly what you purchased. If the store shares L3 data, your credit card company will be able to easily determine that you have been purchasing gift cards.
> Whether a store shares L3 data may be different for Visa and Amex transactions. For Amex transactions, you can look at your statement history on the web (not mobile) Amex website to see if they include an itemized list of what you purchased. If not, then no L3 data has been shared. Thus, we suggest starting by making a small purchase at the retailer to determine if they share L3 data, and only scale up if they do not.
The infrastructure is clearly in place, it's just a matter of if the agreement is in place and if the store is ready to sell out their customers for the discounted interchange rate. I was hoping to find a better link than a CC points hacking site discussing "manufactured spending", but that's what I could find easily. Grocery stores supporting EBT/SNAP/Benefits must have the infrastructure in place to support L3 data: that's how they determine if you the transaction is eligible or not.
For one, when purchasing a Delta ticket with an Amex card, they know exactly where your origin and destination are.
I thought that was only if you accept a "points plan" of some sort, which, of course we all do. :-/ Aeroplan is a great example of this too. No one ever asks what they are giving up for aeroplan. The answer is your entire purchase history!
People often focus on how the internet allows cross-site tracking and other privacy invasions, but generally don't get vocal about things like credit cards and points plans that have done this since time before the internet!
People often focus on how the internet allows cross-site tracking and other privacy invasions, but generally don't get vocal about things like credit cards and points plans that have done this since time before the internet!
It's worth noting that you can opt out of that too. You should have received a privacy disclosure with every credit card you've opened containing instructions on how to opt out. Usually you have to make a phone call - you won't find the option in your online banking portal.
Is there any credit card or banking company that doesn't do this?
Another reason to stop using credit card companies
PayPal is the last of my "dirty internet habits" that I've been whittling down. I think this provides me with more than enough motivation to finally get rid of it entirely.
I haven't put any effort in whittling down my use of PayPal, but my usage has dropped precipitously anyway, with online merchants adopting Shopify or Stripe, or consolidating to large marketplaces.
What are you going to replace it with for internet purchases?
I've already dramatically reduced the amount of stuff I buy online. For things I have to buy online, I can just use one-time-use cards.
Like store bought gift cards, or an online service? If the latter, you're just shofting your trust somewhere else (which may be what you want, but it's worth making that explicitly understood).
Store bought, if I have planned ahead. A temporary card that's a feature of my bank if I haven't.
> If the latter, you're just shofting your trust somewhere else
Of course -- I'm shifting it to a bank that I already use. So, it still represents a privacy gain in that I'm cutting PayPal out and not bringing anybody new in.
> If the latter, you're just shofting your trust somewhere else
Of course -- I'm shifting it to a bank that I already use. So, it still represents a privacy gain in that I'm cutting PayPal out and not bringing anybody new in.
Quite a few banks, like Capital One, let you create one-time-use or temporary cards in their apps. So, not really shifting trust outside of the bank providing the account to begin with.
Well before the bank would only see your transfers to PayPal, rather than where you're actually spending your money. You're shifting trust in the sense that it used to be PayPal seeing where you're spending your money to your bank seeing where you're spending your money.
Yes, but my bank already has deep insight into my spending habits anyway. Eliminating PayPal reduces the number of companies surveilling me by one. That seems like a net gain to me.
And that's not even taking into account that I trust my bank more than I trust PayPal.
And that's not even taking into account that I trust my bank more than I trust PayPal.
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Manually typing credit card numbers?
Autofill makes it a lot easier as well.
Autofill makes it a lot easier as well.
Unless you also don't use Visa/Mastercard/Amex, you're being hypocritical. PayPal is a better choice than any of those.
Hypocritical, or just haven't got that far in my efforts yet? Paypal is much easier to jettison than the others. Just because the others also spy on me doesn't mean I have some sort of responsibility to allow PayPal to do it as well.
That said, I do indeed avoid using credit cards when I can. That's not always possible. However, it is always possible to avoid using PayPal.
That said, I do indeed avoid using credit cards when I can. That's not always possible. However, it is always possible to avoid using PayPal.
Just for clarifications, the same applies for debit cards as well.
I guess they get to squeeze more money out of my transactions. I miss the days of boring ads that were contextual on the site you were on and not trying to pry into my life in creepy ways.
Ugh. Increasingly what bothers me about stuff like this is that we’re endlessly organizing more and more and more of our economic activity around marketing and advertising, and it chokes off the air-supply for so many other business models, products, and innovation pursuits.
The data privacy part? Sure, that’s annoying and troublesome, but God help me… can there be more of a point to everything than targeting & delivering ads? It’s just depressing.
The data privacy part? Sure, that’s annoying and troublesome, but God help me… can there be more of a point to everything than targeting & delivering ads? It’s just depressing.
> we’re endlessly organizing more and more and more of our economic activity around marketing and advertising
That is the predictable result of a business model based on overproduction and obsolescence. There are already too many products and services compared to the number of pockets that could or want to buy them, therefore businesses struggle for potential customers attention. I don't see any sign of a change in the near future and am well prepared to see more and more space and time filled with advertising of some sort.
That is the predictable result of a business model based on overproduction and obsolescence. There are already too many products and services compared to the number of pockets that could or want to buy them, therefore businesses struggle for potential customers attention. I don't see any sign of a change in the near future and am well prepared to see more and more space and time filled with advertising of some sort.
Very typical for a American company to just assume their non American customer are equal to their American counterparts (+ regulation etc.)
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I’m surprised they weren’t doing this already . This is standard for CC companies afaik.
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Paypal is playing catch-up.