Hertz continues EV purge, asks renters if they want to buy instead of return(arstechnica.com)
arstechnica.com
Hertz continues EV purge, asks renters if they want to buy instead of return
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2024/12/hertz-is-asking-ev-renters-if-they-want-to-buy-their-rentals/
15 comments
Getting a model 3 for under $20k is something I may have considered a few years ago when I was in the market. It will be interesting to see how they age. A right to repair would ironically be very good for Tesla long term.
Which is funny because — Tesla has some of the most open service documentation of any automaker. Trying to get service documentation on any of my vehicles in fleet is a nightmare, but Tesla just has it wide open without even a login.
https://service.tesla.com/en-US/vehicle-models/Model3
Plus the amount of onboard diagnostics is quite amazing for what you get in the built in service menus you can freely hop in and out of, and they keep adding more service routines into the onboard service menu as they go along. (Even things like being able to just… reinstall all the software in all the ECUs at the tap of a button.)
https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/2046/tesla-service-mode-ho...
https://service.tesla.com/en-US/vehicle-models/Model3
Plus the amount of onboard diagnostics is quite amazing for what you get in the built in service menus you can freely hop in and out of, and they keep adding more service routines into the onboard service menu as they go along. (Even things like being able to just… reinstall all the software in all the ECUs at the tap of a button.)
https://www.notateslaapp.com/news/2046/tesla-service-mode-ho...
Buying a car from rental car inventory as your daily driver is usually inadvisable.
Buying a rental mustang or minivan might be a bad idea, but most rental vehicles are totally fine purchases.
They actually have preventative maintenance done on them, and are sold at below market value.
They actually have preventative maintenance done on them, and are sold at below market value.
Also, at least at Enterprise, there’s no haggling, just a fair sticker price and Kelly Blue Book value for your trade in. There are a couple of the usual upsells like extended warranties, but that’s it. It’s a way less stressful experience compared to dealing with a traditional dealership.
I’ve bought my last 2 vehicles through them and have nothing but good things to say about the whole experience.
I’ve bought my last 2 vehicles through them and have nothing but good things to say about the whole experience.
What makes EVs more expensive to service compared to ICE vehicles? Are the components more expensive? Or is it labor, because it's still considered somewhat niche? Or something else?
(Asking as someone who has no idea about car servicing realities, I don't even have a driving license, let alone a car)
(Asking as someone who has no idea about car servicing realities, I don't even have a driving license, let alone a car)
To answer your question directly: EVs aren't more expensive to service than ICE vehicles. If you piece together the quotes from various high level Hertz people, the problem is just that repair costs for accidents for Teslas are around 2x the cost for other comparable cars. And the reason for that is largely that Tesla doesn't have the large parts and repairs network that the traditional dealers have.
>According to Johann Rawlinson, Hertz VP of Investor Relations, "collision and damage repairs on an EV can often run about twice that associated with a comparable combustion engine vehicle."
>In fact, according to Stephen Scherr, Hertz's CEO, "there's quite a bit of the cost element that relates to the Teslas as opposed to others." Scherr pointed to GM's EVs, which benefit from a larger parts and repair network nationally and lower parts and labor costs for repairs. Note that a full 80 percent of Hertz's EV fleet is Tesla models.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/hertz-ev-fleet-sale-tesla-re...
>According to Johann Rawlinson, Hertz VP of Investor Relations, "collision and damage repairs on an EV can often run about twice that associated with a comparable combustion engine vehicle."
>In fact, according to Stephen Scherr, Hertz's CEO, "there's quite a bit of the cost element that relates to the Teslas as opposed to others." Scherr pointed to GM's EVs, which benefit from a larger parts and repair network nationally and lower parts and labor costs for repairs. Note that a full 80 percent of Hertz's EV fleet is Tesla models.
https://www.motortrend.com/news/hertz-ev-fleet-sale-tesla-re...
Seems like they were bitten by repair costs according to the article. Which might be due to them being relatively new, crash repairers being unwilling to work on EVs (battery), EV crashes resulting in more severe body damage due to increased weight, etc. not to mention batteries
It's more nuanced than just that.
Repairs? Rivian on at least their first gen pickups used massive single-body-panels. This shot repair costs to the moon because you had to pay freight to ship massive car-sized body panels and also paint and handle attaching them. Other EVs have done similar bone-headed BUT IT LOOKS COOL bullshit.
The other problem besides body, is there will probably never ever be aftermarket manufacturers for things like batteries, motors, inverters, etc. Because they all require tight integration with the rest of the car's system. And electronics/EVs make it too easy for a manufacturer to custom tailor the electronics per car and per model even on a yearly basis. And the real problem, the design of things like motors on the EV are highly patented and custom. So no different than engines for a ICE. This gives manufacturers the ability to make extreme profit on replacement parts.
Repairs? Rivian on at least their first gen pickups used massive single-body-panels. This shot repair costs to the moon because you had to pay freight to ship massive car-sized body panels and also paint and handle attaching them. Other EVs have done similar bone-headed BUT IT LOOKS COOL bullshit.
The other problem besides body, is there will probably never ever be aftermarket manufacturers for things like batteries, motors, inverters, etc. Because they all require tight integration with the rest of the car's system. And electronics/EVs make it too easy for a manufacturer to custom tailor the electronics per car and per model even on a yearly basis. And the real problem, the design of things like motors on the EV are highly patented and custom. So no different than engines for a ICE. This gives manufacturers the ability to make extreme profit on replacement parts.
Imo they are trying to turn cars into a disposable consumer products.
Sure, they may gain some me minor manufacturing cost drops with those large castings.
As for EV motors I think this is a temporary state of things. We've been making electric motors for 290 years now. EV transition has just started and there's going to be so many OEM suppliers of motors. Motors aren't nearly as large as ice engines. And patents expire.
Sure, they may gain some me minor manufacturing cost drops with those large castings.
As for EV motors I think this is a temporary state of things. We've been making electric motors for 290 years now. EV transition has just started and there's going to be so many OEM suppliers of motors. Motors aren't nearly as large as ice engines. And patents expire.
Also, tight vertical integration in general may be a temporary state of things in EV manufacture in the longer run. The "inefficiencies" of a multi-vendor supply network eventually get outweighed by the usefulness of redundancy and competitive bidding. As patents expire and vertical integration "secret sauce" loses its shine, there will be a growing use for an expanded parts network.
To some extent you even see that in the competition between Tesla/Rivian and Ford/GM today because the old, classic manufacturers have less (but not no) "secret sauce" in vertical integration and more existing parts networks they want to keep friendly/allied/fed/bidding.
Also, yeah, especially EV motors have a lot more possibility/potential than ICE ever did for "off the shelf" whole parts suppliers, because they are smaller, because they are a "relatively simple", well researched technology with a lot of known characteristics/trade-offs that can be simplified into a relatively small list of "SKUs", but also, and maybe most importantly, we're already seeing that so much of their "power train" and "driving feel" is virtual and software/firmware-defined and any "secret sauce" can be applied as such easily to a programmable enough off-the-shelf part.
Similarly with batteries. We have centuries of knowledge in how to standardize battery units and the production of such. Both GM and Ford already see battery plants as eventual external suppliers and their plants are only partially-owned subsidiaries with co-owners in LG and SK Group, respectively.
To some extent you even see that in the competition between Tesla/Rivian and Ford/GM today because the old, classic manufacturers have less (but not no) "secret sauce" in vertical integration and more existing parts networks they want to keep friendly/allied/fed/bidding.
Also, yeah, especially EV motors have a lot more possibility/potential than ICE ever did for "off the shelf" whole parts suppliers, because they are smaller, because they are a "relatively simple", well researched technology with a lot of known characteristics/trade-offs that can be simplified into a relatively small list of "SKUs", but also, and maybe most importantly, we're already seeing that so much of their "power train" and "driving feel" is virtual and software/firmware-defined and any "secret sauce" can be applied as such easily to a programmable enough off-the-shelf part.
Similarly with batteries. We have centuries of knowledge in how to standardize battery units and the production of such. Both GM and Ford already see battery plants as eventual external suppliers and their plants are only partially-owned subsidiaries with co-owners in LG and SK Group, respectively.
>As patents expire
20 years.
20 years.
Seeing how people drive rentals I wouldn't be surprised if brakes/tires were a big issues, they also seem to be more expensive to repair in general, given that a lot of renters are occasional drivers I assume fender benders are common. I also imagine managing the charge level of so many vehicles can be problematic.
Personally I only rent cars for longer trips, 400+kms, and for these I'd much rather have a gas car
https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1144187_ev-collision-re...
Personally I only rent cars for longer trips, 400+kms, and for these I'd much rather have a gas car
https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1144187_ev-collision-re...
Anyone know if they're doing this in Canada too?