Kindle is removing download and transfer option on Feb 26th(old.reddit.com)
old.reddit.com
Kindle is removing download and transfer option on Feb 26th
https://old.reddit.com/r/kindle/comments/1inr9uy/fyi_amazon_is_removing_download_transfer_option/
225 comments
> (2) The ability to transfer books from your computer to your Kindle using a USB cable is not affected.
Well, it kinda is. If you can no longer download the books you paid for, you can't upload them over USB. That's what that feature on their website was meant for, in fact.
Of course you can still upload non-Amazon content yes. Which is probably what I'll end up doing. I won't buy books on Amazon anymore if I can't remove the DRM.
Well, it kinda is. If you can no longer download the books you paid for, you can't upload them over USB. That's what that feature on their website was meant for, in fact.
Of course you can still upload non-Amazon content yes. Which is probably what I'll end up doing. I won't buy books on Amazon anymore if I can't remove the DRM.
You can still download books you paid a license to Amazon for, you just have to use a Wi-Fi or 4G LTE-enabled Kindle to do it.
Which may or may not be possible. For 2G Kindles like the Kindle 2 there is no more 2G service and there is no Wifi. Download and Transfer was the only remaining way to load books on from Amazon without ironically removing the DRM.
Accurate info, edited my comment to specify.
Not suggesting it as a good option but does the Kindle app on Windows and macOS not work with these devices?
Nope. Kindle for PC can't send books to devices.
Elsewhere here and Reddit it seems the trick is to use the Kindle app plus Calibre.
Good luck with it.
Good luck with it.
Yes, but this is a different method. Using the encrypted books downloaded by the app for PC viewing.
Right now they use an old version of the app though, that can easily be blocked by Amazon. I'm surprised it wasn't.
The good thing about the download option on the web was that some older Kindles don't support any newer DRM methods so it would always work.
Right now they use an old version of the app though, that can easily be blocked by Amazon. I'm surprised it wasn't.
The good thing about the download option on the web was that some older Kindles don't support any newer DRM methods so it would always work.
It's partially blocked. The old version of Kindle for PC won't let you download books published after Jan. 2023.
Assuming that you have Wi-fi and that your Kindle is compatible with it. Someone with a hardwired-only connection, an older Kindle that doesn't support Wi-fi at all, or one that doesn't support WPA3 will be stymied.
(The models that don't support Wi-fi at all originally had cellular service for wirelessly downloading books, but that was sunset a few years ago. So there will be literally no way to copy new books to those devices anymore.)
(The models that don't support Wi-fi at all originally had cellular service for wirelessly downloading books, but that was sunset a few years ago. So there will be literally no way to copy new books to those devices anymore.)
Yeah and Amazon stopped supporting those kindles too. My Kindle 4th gen no longer connects to the hive even with WiFi. It's not a cellular model (and I think they had dropped that option by then anyway). It's still the old non-touch UI though.
Apparently it needs to be "up to date" but because Amazon no longer publishes firmware updates, it is not.
Apparently it needs to be "up to date" but because Amazon no longer publishes firmware updates, it is not.
Speaking as someone who’s pretty happy with his still-working DX — and values hardware longevity — this is half the issue precisely.
(the other half of course being what happens when material is pulled when it’s only cloud-resident and vendor administered)
(the other half of course being what happens when material is pulled when it’s only cloud-resident and vendor administered)
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Yes but not over USB of course. Another thing that bothers me about that, is that Amazon could block my account for whatever reason and I'd lose access to all my content. Of course this goes for many such services. Like Apple's app store, google play, steam, microsoft store (not like anyone ever uses that lol), content bought on itunes etc.
“Just” - my gen 2 kindle only has 2G connectivity so this removal effectively renders it unable to get Amazon-purchased books in any way. “Just” implies buying an entirely new kindle “just because”.
I mean, you’re not wrong, but Woot has them on sale for ~$30 fairly often. Your Gen 2 is about sixteen years old at this point.
That’s $30 that I shouldn’t have to spend. (And I mean, no worries, I won’t, I’ve had enough with Amazon rendering perfectly good kindles obsolete, and I can get plenty of books for free elsewhere - still, it’s not a choice I should have to make just so Amazon can save the cost of what’s essentially an app to check your permissions and set up a pre signed s3 download link for you).
Or their app, on any platform where you can get access to its file store (e.g. Android, Windows, macOS...).
This is far worse for me than the other possible interpretation - that you could download books but not transfer them. I buy Amazon e-books to read them on other e-readers, but now it looks like I can't.
That’s the bottom line. Kindle books will now be fully locked into the Kindle ecosystem and if Amazon decides to take back something you’ve “purchased,” you’ll have no recourse. I’m done purchasing ebooks from Amazon because of this.
TIL that Kobo integrates with libraries, that means you can download and read library ebooks on your Kobo.
Yes but in their US integration, it's actually a bit more glitchy than Kindle especially if you're juggling multiple library cards. You can still make it work, and I do bother with that because my Kobo is such a better device than my Kindle, but it's more of a headache than using Libby to send to Kindle.
Kobo is owned by Rakuten who used to own Overdrive/Libby.
yep, that's exactly why I got a Kobo, so much better
Kindle does this too via Libby.
Only in the U.S.
I'm using a library card outside of the U.S. with Libby and send all my loans to my Kindle via amazon.de, works fine
Is it a U.S library card? Or a library card from outside the U.S (e.g., a German one)? That's not clear from how you wrote it. I believe it's a U.S library only thing. Libby's own FAQ says it's U.S only but perhaps they just haven't updated it.
It's a German library card
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my solution is to buy a basic kindle with wifi and use that to download the books, then transfer them to calibre directly from the kindle
Well yes, Amazon wants you to buy kindles.
It's rather pushing me away from kindle books because of they will be restricted. I am more likely to get ebooks from other sources and read them in my kindle.
They wish to increase sale of Kindles, but will end up decreasing sale of Kindle ebooks.
They wish to increase sale of Kindles, but will end up decreasing sale of Kindle ebooks.
I was reading a Reddit thread on this, and not a single person there understood this. It isn’t good news, but it’s being severely misinterpreted.
Thanks. I feel like the commentary and “news blogs” around this have been very confusing.
I like my Kindle because it was cheap (nobody can beat that price) but I've never bought a book from Amazon nor do I plan to.
If they aren't interfering with (2) Amazon can do what it wants.
If they aren't interfering with (2) Amazon can do what it wants.
I spent yesterday morning downloading ALL my (~2400) Kindle books using the command line utility from https://github.com/yihong0618/Kindle_download_helper
In case anyone else needs to do something similar: Log in to your Amazon account > Manage Your Content and Devices
Copy the cookie and save it to a file ('cookie.txt'): https://github.com/yihong0618/Kindle_download_helper?tab=rea...
Execute the Python utility (this example accesses amazon.co.uk):
I also extracted a list of cover URLs from the JSON file using a basic Python script (with output redirected to a file 'covers.txt'):
In case anyone else needs to do something similar: Log in to your Amazon account > Manage Your Content and Devices
Copy the cookie and save it to a file ('cookie.txt'): https://github.com/yihong0618/Kindle_download_helper?tab=rea...
Execute the Python utility (this example accesses amazon.co.uk):
python kindle.py --cookie-file cookie.txt --uk -o DOWNLOADS --device_sn [Your Kindle serial no.] --mode all
python kindle.py --cookie-file cookie.txt --uk --list --device_sn [Your Kindle serial no.]
I also extracted a list of cover URLs from the JSON file using a basic Python script (with output redirected to a file 'covers.txt'):
import json
with open('book-list.json') as f:
json_data = json.load(f)
for i in range(len(json_data)):
print(json_data[i]['productImage'])
wget --wait=3 --random-wait --input-file=covers.txt
I have error in each book. Asin: B0CNNDLFC5 download failed.
I follow the steps you mentioned. I have json file and I downloaded the image files. But I have an issue with the books themselves. each download line gives error "Asin: .... download failed"
All I get is:
``` Exception: Can't get the csrf token, please refresh the page at https://www.amazon.co.uk/hz/mycd/myx#/home/content/booksAll and retry ```
Can someone give explicit instructions about the content of the cookie.txt?
The README instructions are unclear.
``` Exception: Can't get the csrf token, please refresh the page at https://www.amazon.co.uk/hz/mycd/myx#/home/content/booksAll and retry ```
Can someone give explicit instructions about the content of the cookie.txt?
The README instructions are unclear.
Firefox Web Developer Tools:
- Go to the 'Network' tab, refresh the page, and select a POST request.
- In the 'Headers' tab, scroll down and look for 'Cookie'. Right-click on this, and 'Copy Value'.
- Paste the value into a new text file, called 'cookie.txt'.
For reference, here's an example value of my cookie:
- Go to the 'Network' tab, refresh the page, and select a POST request.
- In the 'Headers' tab, scroll down and look for 'Cookie'. Right-click on this, and 'Copy Value'.
- Paste the value into a new text file, called 'cookie.txt'.
For reference, here's an example value of my cookie:
session-id=152-5779672-8150522; session-id-time=2072187201l; i18n-prefs=USD; ubid-acbuk=259-0623959-6435953; lc-acbuk=en_US; x-acbuk="@fcSz1?ZoidPtV8iWFAT7S17q2buySBbi4OwMLzIatTX959dMWVcBs49BIYMKXwJ"; at-acbuk=Atza|IwEBILEDqYWReiVGyOpmljozmQfD84EYR493RQmb81gnR8CQajM2fpFmD7Ctc_db6aZ4e_ERI-VUHdji6-7tbYD6CGd10XzLG0hkvc2o5fl_OoT-SeDq_RvSygSUBzSd490Rg9gcUgDnEdUail7DvN0azO8a-aCtP1OZLk3YybpWL8rvCmlUGZeOWdF38FqGK61ne-HIUbXyU2Iy76995hLRebGrWRC3itESiiqYK0_fROUAUQ; sess-at-acbuk="6TNr+KYPYOzhQzHqyVoy91Xuq46dx4JxZmhWLgMTazs="; sst-acbuk=Sst1|PQGAuJ4uN8jtkdj4izQcBXmJCedA0A6Ct4AQkODweU5nYxW7f4kcYZAcoMF4TdDLcPeJc8OG1G1Q8dfCXZS8vjdWJmKElymBmqbaLKs1QVUbPFZheZefgl2REzTcqQIhaZX9aVy8kDwmWnkroAWDGv49gWadknkKUbHFq_gxyM8TKVEy8PGF2gmkDXkg2pvl598uZUXDL5svz9XDdQ90RRZVadMT8wlp2j5gO5Plftf5Zvzg-j4sT_3XIyuxKh8jwmeICxoaXvvkLO274UMcLCNZXEkrPQ-CmjUkACQ5M5rOcAI; session-token="CXpMUQVXX+bcPXMLqA7T9caleUA9JO5VWkX834DDQPUumoVZWL4vyjpKFMyjQVoVOlyAYTG0hT3E9QmhWG18kPxfPQq3vquApm1HzDUTuOwb8XSdG0Avkrp2I+lwgpjYMdOX1xiMMtgFLcxxKsIA9cPDPEinm1p4SVTHYdQ6S83TzcuK5Jr+C5oE4ZNoDeuY7p7aTitCEHxuHwMRqHzwEtKj7TB8N6S1x1KLjnd8X8u5ToZGudN5UYmKtp7tuIObvC4Z064GtK1I9OZvTF32KLW5XkY0v9FWUuZqEze5xkoukN+7o3KSnCYMfFteNPY1Nk+IislDOVbGwRuEaYbxPHYCuVj1RyamIA2LbLx1dRqe3ODi8B/b9oCP1VHuDFdqmqMYbxNy66Q="; sp-cdn="L5Z9:DE"Well, this is delightful; the links that this tool finds now 403, and looking at the network inspector, it seems that the URLs are now signed in some way.
Last time I tried to DeDRM my Kindle book collection, there were many books with "newer" DRM that wasn't possible to strip. Did that improve recently?
If you download them using the serial # of an older kindle it should get the older file type and work
My collection is mainly .azw3 and .azw, with a handful of .tpz and azw4.
The former were trivial to strip; the latter, I'm not so sure yet. However, I have no .kfx books, so perhaps I haven't been exposed to the newer DRM?
The former were trivial to strip; the latter, I'm not so sure yet. However, I have no .kfx books, so perhaps I haven't been exposed to the newer DRM?
Thank you! This was a great help in getting everything saved.
I’m not sure why anyone buys Kindles when there are so many better options available.
I bought a Kobo Clara years ago, and it supports regular MOBI and ePub files.
My book purchases are no longer liked with the reader and I’ve never had a problem in all these years. And this wasn’t even the best or best value for money device I could have bought.
Today there are so many other better alternatives in all price points and form factors.
I bought a Kobo Clara years ago, and it supports regular MOBI and ePub files.
My book purchases are no longer liked with the reader and I’ve never had a problem in all these years. And this wasn’t even the best or best value for money device I could have bought.
Today there are so many other better alternatives in all price points and form factors.
People don't buy Kindles for the hardware. They buy Kindles because they work with a store that has the books they want to buy (and the hardware is good enough and cheap enough).
Without data I believe that more than 99% of ereader users have no idea what a MOBI or ePub file is and have never attempted to manually move a file onto their device. Instead, they go to a digital book store, click "buy", and content appears on their device.
Amazon does that as well as (better than?) any competitor, and crucially their store has the books people want.
I don't want a subscription store filled exclusively with LLM-generated trash. I don't really want to have to find which of a thousand websites will sell a DRM-free copy of something so I can buy it, download it, transcode it in Calibre into a format my device reads, and transfer it to my device. I'd much rather pay a few dollars, click a button that sends some money to the author and sends a book to my device.
This whole comments section reeks of "I don't understand why anyone uses Windows when Linux is so easy to get to", managing to simultaneously assume every user has a degree in computer science and overlooking all the rough edges.
Without data I believe that more than 99% of ereader users have no idea what a MOBI or ePub file is and have never attempted to manually move a file onto their device. Instead, they go to a digital book store, click "buy", and content appears on their device.
Amazon does that as well as (better than?) any competitor, and crucially their store has the books people want.
I don't want a subscription store filled exclusively with LLM-generated trash. I don't really want to have to find which of a thousand websites will sell a DRM-free copy of something so I can buy it, download it, transcode it in Calibre into a format my device reads, and transfer it to my device. I'd much rather pay a few dollars, click a button that sends some money to the author and sends a book to my device.
This whole comments section reeks of "I don't understand why anyone uses Windows when Linux is so easy to get to", managing to simultaneously assume every user has a degree in computer science and overlooking all the rough edges.
The alternative I see mentioned here is kobo. I haven't used/owned a kindle so I don't know what amazon do better than the kobo store. I can say that I've bought over 50 books on the kobo store, can't recall a single instance of it not having a book I wanted.
Another reason people (e.g., my mother in law) buy kindles is that the price of ebooks is very often much less from Amazon than from the Kobo store. My mother in law wants to be like us and so she recently bought a kobo. But then she bought herself a new kindle as well simply so she can buy cheaper books and then transfer them (which she hasn’t figured out how to do, and which according to this thread will no longer be possible).
I don't think you can download ebooks from the Kindle store and transfer them to a Kobo unless they happen to be specifically DRM-free ebooks (which very few ebooks are, and basically none from the big publishing firms)? And even then a format conversion would be involved.
(If you mean transferring them to the Kindle reader, you can of course download the books directly on-device.)
(If you mean transferring them to the Kindle reader, you can of course download the books directly on-device.)
> Another reason people (e.g., my mother in law) buy kindles is that the price of ebooks is very often much less from Amazon than from the Kobo store.
Note that Kobo will price match plus credit 10% of the difference. It’s pretty quick and I’ve never had one of my requests denied.
Note that Kobo will price match plus credit 10% of the difference. It’s pretty quick and I’ve never had one of my requests denied.
It is (was) very convenient to buy ebooks on Amazon, download them to Calibre, and strip them of DRM so that you ended up owning them for real.
If that's no longer possible then there's no point in using Amazon for this, yes.
If that's no longer possible then there's no point in using Amazon for this, yes.
>I’m not sure why anyone buys Kindles when there are so many better options available.
For me, the Kobo lacks something like the Send to Kindle feature.
I can send books I've obtained from outside the Kindle Store (DRM free sellers, Humble Bundle, public domain etc.) and then store them in my Kindle library.
These are then synchronised across all of my Kindle devices and apps - completely for free
Kobo does have integration with cloud storage, but it's not the same feature.
Plus it has the Kindle Store, which has the biggest selection of books for sale.
For me, the Kobo lacks something like the Send to Kindle feature.
I can send books I've obtained from outside the Kindle Store (DRM free sellers, Humble Bundle, public domain etc.) and then store them in my Kindle library.
These are then synchronised across all of my Kindle devices and apps - completely for free
Kobo does have integration with cloud storage, but it's not the same feature.
Plus it has the Kindle Store, which has the biggest selection of books for sale.
> Plus it has the Kindle Store, which has the biggest selection of books for sale.
Because Amazon abuses its position to get there, right? I see how it makes it more convenient, but I also see how that is a reason for not buying a Kindle.
Because Amazon abuses its position to get there, right? I see how it makes it more convenient, but I also see how that is a reason for not buying a Kindle.
Correct.
Maybe more intensely, if a book is available on Kindle Unlimited, Amazon has exclusive rights to the book and it is not available on any other digital store.
Maybe more intensely, if a book is available on Kindle Unlimited, Amazon has exclusive rights to the book and it is not available on any other digital store.
A working solution for me was to deploy a little website to organize both my physical and ebooks in the same place. For physical books, it tells me where they should be. For ebooks, I can download the file, the website is light enough that it works fine with my ebook reader.
Surely there are bugs, but here it is, if you'd like to give it a spin: https://github.com/seanboyce/ubiblio
Interestingly enough, I had tried to find a way to add an 'email to my device' option, but it was too fiddly. I got it working with OAUTH + gmail, but setting it up was not exactly user-friendly. The simple download option worked much better.
Anyway just a weekend project I extended a little. Don't expect much polish :D
Surely there are bugs, but here it is, if you'd like to give it a spin: https://github.com/seanboyce/ubiblio
Interestingly enough, I had tried to find a way to add an 'email to my device' option, but it was too fiddly. I got it working with OAUTH + gmail, but setting it up was not exactly user-friendly. The simple download option worked much better.
Anyway just a weekend project I extended a little. Don't expect much polish :D
That looks good (not actually cloned and tried it yet).
However the screenshots in the README show (for me anyway) as broken links, even though they work when clicked on. I can see you're linking to the images in the blobs. If it helps, for my own stuff in the README I link relative to the README file in the actual source. So for one of yours for example I'd use: ./ubiblio_menu.png
This also has the advantages of both being self-contained and also working locally (eg in the VS Code preview) before you've pushed the images.
However the screenshots in the README show (for me anyway) as broken links, even though they work when clicked on. I can see you're linking to the images in the blobs. If it helps, for my own stuff in the README I link relative to the README file in the actual source. So for one of yours for example I'd use: ./ubiblio_menu.png
This also has the advantages of both being self-contained and also working locally (eg in the VS Code preview) before you've pushed the images.
Isn't that what Calibre is for?
Massive +1 to this, I'd recommend using Calibre to manage your library and any Kobo reader as the companion, I manage a massive 2000+ book library like like this, and never encountered issues with syncing, corrupt file systems, etc, which I did regularly with Kindle.
I’ve managed the kindle library for my wife and I on two devices for close to 10 years and I’ve never dealt with syncing or file systems full stop. I hit “buy” on amazon and about 15 seconds later the book is on the kindle and ready to read. There _is_ no management to do.
To clarify this is managing my own library rather than buying books off Amazon. I tend to buy books locally and pirate the ebook copy which I sync from my computer. I don't feel inclined to line Amazon's pockets any more than I already have...
I understood, sorry. The comment you replied to that you plus 1’ed said:
> I’m not sure why anyone buys Kindles when there are so many better options available.
My point is that the kindle _is_ an excellent experience and that’s why people buy them.
> I’m not sure why anyone buys Kindles when there are so many better options available.
My point is that the kindle _is_ an excellent experience and that’s why people buy them.
I couldn't agree more. I use a Boox e-reader, and I had no interest in using the Kindle app, so stripping the DRM (on books I'd purchased, for my own use only) was a selling point. Without that I'm just moving my business over to Kobo, Calibre + a plugin and there's no DRM issue.
I won't pretend to know if there are enough people like us to impact Amazon's calculus, but I hope there are.
I won't pretend to know if there are enough people like us to impact Amazon's calculus, but I hope there are.
I still have found nothing really comparable to the Kindle Oasis on any other platform. At least not with good enough user reviews to consider trying.
I actually picked up a refurb unit to have as a spare since Amazon discontinued it.
I would love a modern USB-C or wireless charging version of it. Roughly same size and form factor, physical buttons, backlit, and completely waterproof.
That said since they discontinued that model line I would have no real reason to stick with kindle when my two on-on hand finally kick the bucket aside from convenience.
The Kobo Libre Colour seems to be the current closest option, so we shall see how it stands the test of time for when I finally leave my last Oasis on a plane or whatnot.
I actually picked up a refurb unit to have as a spare since Amazon discontinued it.
I would love a modern USB-C or wireless charging version of it. Roughly same size and form factor, physical buttons, backlit, and completely waterproof.
That said since they discontinued that model line I would have no real reason to stick with kindle when my two on-on hand finally kick the bucket aside from convenience.
The Kobo Libre Colour seems to be the current closest option, so we shall see how it stands the test of time for when I finally leave my last Oasis on a plane or whatnot.
Well, Amazon does have a global presence, for worse rather than better in my opinion, but I live in Brazil and, as far as I am aware, there isn't really any other decent e-reader brand selling its devices here officially and conversion rates plus taxes would make it really expensive to import anything else, so that could be a reason.
I have an 2016 basic kindle that I use often, it is sideloaded with KOreader (official software didn't support epubs when I bought it) and I mainly use it for non-amazon books through Calibre or cable transfer.
I have an 2016 basic kindle that I use often, it is sideloaded with KOreader (official software didn't support epubs when I bought it) and I mainly use it for non-amazon books through Calibre or cable transfer.
Three reasons for me.
First, Kindle Oasis has a great form factor. I want a reader that is shaped conveniently to hold with one hand and flip pages without having to lift my thumb. Oasis does exactly that.
Second, I find that Amazon is the most likely to have books that I care about. Other catalogs aren't as extensive, and depending on your preferences, this can get really noticeable.
Lastly, I already have a very large Kindle library from way back, and switching to a different incompatible device means abandoning all of that.
First, Kindle Oasis has a great form factor. I want a reader that is shaped conveniently to hold with one hand and flip pages without having to lift my thumb. Oasis does exactly that.
Second, I find that Amazon is the most likely to have books that I care about. Other catalogs aren't as extensive, and depending on your preferences, this can get really noticeable.
Lastly, I already have a very large Kindle library from way back, and switching to a different incompatible device means abandoning all of that.
I've got an onyx boox and it has been amazing. No way on earth I'd buy a locked brick like the Kindle after my experience with the Boox.
Kobo ereader is way more expensive. You can get the basic Kindle for 80 eurodollars (because Amazon expects to make it back).
For me it’s purely the multi-device experience across e-reader and iphone app.
Access to my purchased books from either device anywhere, and flawless progress syncing.
I don’t take my kindle everywhere, sometimes I just have my phone but still want to read.
I don’t believe this is as easy with Kobo as with Kindle (or even possible). If it is I’ll switch.
Access to my purchased books from either device anywhere, and flawless progress syncing.
I don’t take my kindle everywhere, sometimes I just have my phone but still want to read.
I don’t believe this is as easy with Kobo as with Kindle (or even possible). If it is I’ll switch.
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I hear the complaints about Kindle but...
How are we supposed to do?
In three "taps" I buy a book and 10s later I start reading it. Legally. The device just works.
The alternatives? Libraries here (France) have a very limited offer of ebooks. Even for ebooks in English. I owned a Kobo circa 2013 and it was awful. I tried friend's devices more recently, and it's not the UX I expect from a "book".
A simple comparison; "Parable of the Sower", bought it for 3.49€ on amazon.fr, it's at 5.26€ on ebooks.com and it still got DRMs.
Even pirating is less convenient: some files are buggy, some files are weird OCR of physical books, you have to deal with the download and transfer...
And I just can't read physical books. I hate that.
So usually, if I really enjoy an ebook, I buy a physical copy in a local bookstore and give it to a friend/whoever I think is going to like it.
I would love an open ecosystem where I could rent ebooks from a library, and buy books that can be read wherever I want. But that's not going to happen because the big guns of the industry think they know better.
So that's where I'm at: buying & reading books in Amazon's walled garden, or doing neither at all.
How are we supposed to do?
In three "taps" I buy a book and 10s later I start reading it. Legally. The device just works.
The alternatives? Libraries here (France) have a very limited offer of ebooks. Even for ebooks in English. I owned a Kobo circa 2013 and it was awful. I tried friend's devices more recently, and it's not the UX I expect from a "book".
A simple comparison; "Parable of the Sower", bought it for 3.49€ on amazon.fr, it's at 5.26€ on ebooks.com and it still got DRMs.
Even pirating is less convenient: some files are buggy, some files are weird OCR of physical books, you have to deal with the download and transfer...
And I just can't read physical books. I hate that.
So usually, if I really enjoy an ebook, I buy a physical copy in a local bookstore and give it to a friend/whoever I think is going to like it.
I would love an open ecosystem where I could rent ebooks from a library, and buy books that can be read wherever I want. But that's not going to happen because the big guns of the industry think they know better.
So that's where I'm at: buying & reading books in Amazon's walled garden, or doing neither at all.
In Canada, I use my (now 8-year old Kobo) plus a public library app to borrow ebooks from our library system for free. Everything just works. It's terrific. I'm sorry to hear the same doesn't work where you are.
Here in Sweden there used to be like 3 libraries that used OverDrive and worked with Kobo, now its down to like 1 library! :(
What exactly is the UX you want from an eReader? I find Kindles and Kobos are pretty similar. So I'm curious what exactly was better about Amazon. I personally find Amazon has worse text options, font sizing, line spacing etc.
I have purchased eBooks that were just bad OCRs, some publishers just don't care.
Kobo will also price match with Amazon, you get credit back and an extra 10% too.
I have purchased eBooks that were just bad OCRs, some publishers just don't care.
Kobo will also price match with Amazon, you get credit back and an extra 10% too.
I'm intrigued that you think Kindle has worse text options than Kobo; in my experience it's the other way around. My Kobo doesn't have the ability to justify just body text while leaving headings alone; my Kindles have handled that just fine for over a decade.
What options does Kobo have for text that you think Kindle is missing?
I use my Kobo for comics and buy those through them (specifically got one with a large screen since Amazon didn't have a similar device), but I don't know if I'd switch to Kobo for novels. I'd rather buy from Kobo and sideload to my Kindle.
What options does Kobo have for text that you think Kindle is missing?
I use my Kobo for comics and buy those through them (specifically got one with a large screen since Amazon didn't have a similar device), but I don't know if I'd switch to Kobo for novels. I'd rather buy from Kobo and sideload to my Kindle.
With my Kobo Libra 2, if I set justification to "off", it follows the justification that's in the ebook -- which usually tend to do exactly what you're asking, e.g., justify body text while leaving headers alone.
When I switched over to Kobo a few years ago, it seemed much easier to manage custom fonts, too, although I think Kindle has improved in that regard. I don't think there's a tremendous amount of difference between the two in practice anymore, though. (In terms of text handling, that is.)
When I switched over to Kobo a few years ago, it seemed much easier to manage custom fonts, too, although I think Kindle has improved in that regard. I don't think there's a tremendous amount of difference between the two in practice anymore, though. (In terms of text handling, that is.)
Unfortunately many ebooks don't specify a default justification on their body text, so with "off", my Kobo Sage will left-align the text in those books.
Agree that I think Kobo better manages custom fonts from what I've seen. (I don't use a custom font so I'm not 100% up-to-date on the sordid details for either platform.)
Agree that I think Kobo better manages custom fonts from what I've seen. (I don't use a custom font so I'm not 100% up-to-date on the sordid details for either platform.)
Line, paragraph spacing, fonts and font sizing and margins. Amazon has like 6 options of each. One of which I consider almost tolerable (but not quite) and the rest are useless. Kobo has a LOT more play with these settings and much easier to get something I like.
I can't speak to the experience in France, but my experience with Kobo in the US has been that it's just as good as a Kindle in most respects, and better in some others, such as integration with Overdrive and Pocket. (My understanding is that Kindles have gotten better at Overdrive since I left that ecosystem.)
I mean, I can buy a book on a Kobo and read it legally in just as few taps, and I can also borrow a book on Kobo and read it legally.
Also, Kobo plays more nicely with Calibre, including a much nicer DRM-stripping management plugin, which seems relevant to the overall topic of this thread -- all the Kindle DRM removal plugin how-tos out there stopped working reliably for me years ago.
I mean, I can buy a book on a Kobo and read it legally in just as few taps, and I can also borrow a book on Kobo and read it legally.
Also, Kobo plays more nicely with Calibre, including a much nicer DRM-stripping management plugin, which seems relevant to the overall topic of this thread -- all the Kindle DRM removal plugin how-tos out there stopped working reliably for me years ago.
> I owned a Kobo circa 2013 and it was awful.
I got my Kindle around that time, even though I had actively looked for alternatives. Nothing seemed to compare then.
But I'm ready to believe that now in 2025, Kobo caught up? I read many comments here praising Kobo.
I got my Kindle around that time, even though I had actively looked for alternatives. Nothing seemed to compare then.
But I'm ready to believe that now in 2025, Kobo caught up? I read many comments here praising Kobo.
> some files are weird OCR of physical books
Kindle store has those too.
Kindle store has those too.
[deleted]
> Even pirating is less convenient
I stopped reading ebooks and actually moved to physical books, but from what I remember pirated books were super convenient. I had this giant library of tons and tons of scifi/fantasy books I once randomly copied from someone and it didn't even take that much storage space. It lasted me my childhood and I've only managed to read a small fraction of it.
I stopped reading ebooks and actually moved to physical books, but from what I remember pirated books were super convenient. I had this giant library of tons and tons of scifi/fantasy books I once randomly copied from someone and it didn't even take that much storage space. It lasted me my childhood and I've only managed to read a small fraction of it.
Sci Fi more than a decade old is the golden zone for piracy. Everything else is harder. Contemporary books, very hard.
Sci Fi tends more likely to be DRM free. Baen has been selling DRM free eBooks for forever direct and TOR also has a DRM free policy.
Ive never had trouble finding any sci-fi books on the high seas, even newer ones. I did try to grab some trash romance novels for my mother before though from her wish list and 9/10 of those simply weren't available and half of the time he one I could find was in some crazy ass format that stock kindle didn't want you to read.
If you know, you know, but pirating books is... very very easy. The answer is not torrents or Usenet.
i want to knowwwww
Ah yeah I mean there's always some big archive that is constantly dodging takedowns, I find it hard to keep up as these tend to go down every few months and you need to know the new one somehow
Uhh what? There’s like four tabs for the Kobo interface, one specifically for books. You literally just click the book you want to read…Not sure what more you want from an ereader or how much easier it can get.
By the way, all kindle models are currently jailbreakable: https://kindlemodding.org/jailbreaking/WinterBreak/
Oh finally! I have a Kindle Scribe, and it's really amazing hardware, but it's unusable for reading websites like Wikipedia and sending links to it using the Amazon bookmarklet is a pretty bad experience.
The biggest issue is the web browser doesn't have pagination, ie a next page button. *It only supports smooth scrolling using the touch screen*. Which on an e-ink display is a completely awful, insanely frustrating experience that I can't believe they ship it (and the Scribe is an 11th generation product).
Using a web browser to read pure text is a blurred mess that's takes several painful seconds to slowly scroll to the next page.
Since I bought the Kindle Scribe (big mistake due to the above issue), I've wanted to jailbreak it to install a non-terrible Wikipedia browser.
Eg the one available in the KOReader project -- the open-source alternative eink-optimized ebook app that is widely-supported across the eink ecosystem (including older Kindles).
Thanks for heads up that a jailbreak is finally available!
The biggest issue is the web browser doesn't have pagination, ie a next page button. *It only supports smooth scrolling using the touch screen*. Which on an e-ink display is a completely awful, insanely frustrating experience that I can't believe they ship it (and the Scribe is an 11th generation product).
Using a web browser to read pure text is a blurred mess that's takes several painful seconds to slowly scroll to the next page.
Since I bought the Kindle Scribe (big mistake due to the above issue), I've wanted to jailbreak it to install a non-terrible Wikipedia browser.
Eg the one available in the KOReader project -- the open-source alternative eink-optimized ebook app that is widely-supported across the eink ecosystem (including older Kindles).
Thanks for heads up that a jailbreak is finally available!
The Scribe should be so much better but all the issues you mentioned put me off buying one.
As far as I can tell, the main benefit of jailbreaking is to be able to install a reader that supports more ebook formats, since a stock Kindle can already browse the web and read ebooks from any source, but it only supports MOBI/AZW3, and the Send to Kindle EPUB converter is not very good. But it’s easy enough to use Calibre to do a lossless EPUB -> AZW3 conversion without the hassle of jailbreaking. Is there some other benefit that I’m missing?
It’s a bit more than just supporting additional formats. KOReader for example is a highly customizable (and mature) reader that’s hard to beat. Plenty of plugins exist also. In particular, one nice thing about the Calibre plugin is wireless sending of books and progress sync across device(s) and desktop.
This is especially obnoxious for books that are already DRM-free. For example, one can presently buy a Tor (the publisher, not the onion router) book from the Kindle store, download the azw3 file, use a tool like KindleUnpacker [0] to more or less losslessly convert it to ePub, and read it anywhere. There's no DRM to break!
[0] KindleUnpacker follows in the IMO utterly bizarre tradition in the epub tool writing scene of making it obvious how to run a really bad Tk UI wrapper and hiding the actual command-line tool in lib/. And of wanting an output directory instead of a filename. And of leaving a whole pile of unnecessary temporary files around. And of forcing you to look through the temporary crap to even find the output. Oh well; the actual output is excellent.
[0] KindleUnpacker follows in the IMO utterly bizarre tradition in the epub tool writing scene of making it obvious how to run a really bad Tk UI wrapper and hiding the actual command-line tool in lib/. And of wanting an output directory instead of a filename. And of leaving a whole pile of unnecessary temporary files around. And of forcing you to look through the temporary crap to even find the output. Oh well; the actual output is excellent.
I think if decent companies like Tor ("this book is sold without drm") could unlock "download this book" in your kindle library, it would be a great thing.
also, in california with AB2426, I wonder if this would qualify as a purchase not a license.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml...
also, in california with AB2426, I wonder if this would qualify as a purchase not a license.
https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/billNavClient.xhtml...
For people already locked into Kindle, I don't know what to tell you. (Unless you DRM-crack, and get into the gray areas of the piracy culture that's creating much of the DRM problems.)
But it would be healthy for everyone if people supported a DRM-free and non-surveillance ebook ecosystem.
One solution I found is to buy ebooks as DRM-free EPUBs and PDFs, and read them in open source desktop tools and on my relatively decent PocketBook InkPad Lite.
Some details at: https://www.neilvandyke.org/ebooks/
But it would be healthy for everyone if people supported a DRM-free and non-surveillance ebook ecosystem.
One solution I found is to buy ebooks as DRM-free EPUBs and PDFs, and read them in open source desktop tools and on my relatively decent PocketBook InkPad Lite.
Some details at: https://www.neilvandyke.org/ebooks/
> But it would be healthy for everyone if people supported a DRM-free and non-surveillance ebook ecosystem.
I dream of a day when that's possible, but all of the massive publishers with over 80% of book marketshare insist on DRM.
I dream of a day when that's possible, but all of the massive publishers with over 80% of book marketshare insist on DRM.
> and get into the gray areas of the piracy culture that's creating much of the DRM problems
This is an interesting framing, mainly because it can be flipped 180 degrees around. "Shinier and more impregnable DRM just creates problems that lock you into certain devices and usage patterns, which simply create much of the gray area of piracy culture"
I mean, you're literally starting out by not trusting the person who fucking purchased your product and then furthermore also artificially limiting them in how they can use that content and on what devices!
Imagine if every marriage began with an un-shut-offable location tracker in your wedding band. You'd be complaining about the "cheating culture that has contributed to the need to install uncircumventable perma-trackers on the newly-married... and also, everyone who tries to disable them OBVIOUSLY just wants to cheat" /eye-roll
This is an interesting framing, mainly because it can be flipped 180 degrees around. "Shinier and more impregnable DRM just creates problems that lock you into certain devices and usage patterns, which simply create much of the gray area of piracy culture"
I mean, you're literally starting out by not trusting the person who fucking purchased your product and then furthermore also artificially limiting them in how they can use that content and on what devices!
Imagine if every marriage began with an un-shut-offable location tracker in your wedding band. You'd be complaining about the "cheating culture that has contributed to the need to install uncircumventable perma-trackers on the newly-married... and also, everyone who tries to disable them OBVIOUSLY just wants to cheat" /eye-roll
> (Unless you DRM-crack, and get into the gray areas of the piracy culture that's creating much of the DRM problems.)
Meh. Even if there was no piracy there'd be DRM. It's not only used to limit privacy but also how you can legitimately use stuff you bought. Like how many devices you can access it on. Or how many times you can view video content.
In fact I think the presence of piracy helps keep prices low. I'm sure Netflix would raise prices even more if they weren't losing customers to piracy every time they raise prices or add crap like ads.. And really, DRM does absolutely nothing to prevent this. It's not as if the latest shows aren't on the pirate bay hours after they appear on Netflix.
> But it would be healthy for everyone if people supported a DRM-free and non-surveillance ebook ecosystem.
That would be very nice yes, if there were one. I don't think there's anything like GOG for books. But yes I do always buy my games on GOG if they are available there.
Meh. Even if there was no piracy there'd be DRM. It's not only used to limit privacy but also how you can legitimately use stuff you bought. Like how many devices you can access it on. Or how many times you can view video content.
In fact I think the presence of piracy helps keep prices low. I'm sure Netflix would raise prices even more if they weren't losing customers to piracy every time they raise prices or add crap like ads.. And really, DRM does absolutely nothing to prevent this. It's not as if the latest shows aren't on the pirate bay hours after they appear on Netflix.
> But it would be healthy for everyone if people supported a DRM-free and non-surveillance ebook ecosystem.
That would be very nice yes, if there were one. I don't think there's anything like GOG for books. But yes I do always buy my games on GOG if they are available there.
That is what DRM is for. Same as the region locking in DVDs. It is about segmenting markets, preventing competition and ensuring that the publishers can sell the same content over and over again.
ebooks.com does tell you if a title has DRM or not, which seems to be the best option currently. Outside of that I haven't found much.
Not that I've ever encountered it in the wild, but I feel like pointing out that publishers can opt-out of DRM on Amazon as well. You'd recognise them by this in the description:
> At the Publisher's request, this title is being sold without Digital Rights Management Software (DRM) applied.
I only know about it because of Cory Doctorow, never seen anyone else that does this. Heck, even re-packaged public domain books contain DRM for some inexplicable reason.
> At the Publisher's request, this title is being sold without Digital Rights Management Software (DRM) applied.
I only know about it because of Cory Doctorow, never seen anyone else that does this. Heck, even re-packaged public domain books contain DRM for some inexplicable reason.
Kobo also does it. They tell you in the eBook details. It's the publisher's request. Publishers like Tor, O'reily and Baen go DRM free. If the re-packaged public domain books don't request it then on goes the DRM.
The link lists a few places that have DRM-free ebooks, and some examples of good technical books I've bought that way.
Hmm yeah but I don't tend to read technical books on ereaders. Most of them require a bigger screen to be usable. I only read fiction on my kindle.
I haven't seen a good store that has the usual popular content without DRM. Well except on paper of course :)
But yeah I didn't know that existed for tech books. In fact the ones I bought online were from big publishers and quite expensive compared to fiction books. But perhaps that's just my niche.
I haven't seen a good store that has the usual popular content without DRM. Well except on paper of course :)
But yeah I didn't know that existed for tech books. In fact the ones I bought online were from big publishers and quite expensive compared to fiction books. But perhaps that's just my niche.
> But it would be healthy for everyone if people supported a DRM-free and non-surveillance ebook ecosystem.
I try nearly every time. The book I want (usually sci-fi recommended to me by friends) is never available from any DRM free shop I can find.
I end up buying from Amazon because their DRM is the most convenient to remive. And I go to the effort to remove it because I want to keep the content I buy, not have it disappear when the DRM key holder decides to take it away from me.
I try nearly every time. The book I want (usually sci-fi recommended to me by friends) is never available from any DRM free shop I can find.
I end up buying from Amazon because their DRM is the most convenient to remive. And I go to the effort to remove it because I want to keep the content I buy, not have it disappear when the DRM key holder decides to take it away from me.
> One solution I found is to buy ebooks as DRM-free EPUBs and PDFs
Unfortunately, for many, many books, this isn't possible, at least legally.
Unfortunately, for many, many books, this isn't possible, at least legally.
You can always load 3rd-party DRM-free books and I don't see Amazon removing that. Their hardware and ecosystem aren't that much better than everyone else's.
In fact, I want to hear from authors, who write books and profits from their work, what’s their thoughts about this policy change.
I don’t really get the Kindle hype. Kobo is a vastly better experience and the unlimited plans are more affordable. Kobo is $8 a month, $10 for books and audiobooks. Kindle is $12 flat. Kobo has g drive and Dropbox integration. Also the e-readers use the same screens (minus the “colorsoft” which is still a e-ink product).
Marketing, first mover advantage, brand recognition, entrenched userbase, ubiquitous company name.
People use Kindles because they’re the easiest to find, most well known, integrated with one of the most popular online shps on the planet that also encourages easy publishing, were one of the first, used to “just work”, don’t need to be changed, already have their books on there, and so on.
People use Kindles because they’re the easiest to find, most well known, integrated with one of the most popular online shps on the planet that also encourages easy publishing, were one of the first, used to “just work”, don’t need to be changed, already have their books on there, and so on.
Idk about Kobo plus, the content available on it all seems to basically be the written equivalent of shovelware (unknown authors, questionable quality). I've almost never searched for a modern book I want to read and found it available on the subscription service.
Agree everything else is better though, and Amazon's equivalent subscription library could be just as bad for all I know.
Agree everything else is better though, and Amazon's equivalent subscription library could be just as bad for all I know.
I suppose it depends on what you're into but kindle unlimited is the reason I prefer the kindle to kobo. Kobo seems to just be garbage but around 1 of every 3-4 books on my TBR written at least 6 months ago is on unlimited. Almost everything else I can find at the library. The few remaining outliers I wait until a sale (physical or digital).
Uh. My Kindle cost me $100 like 8-10 years ago and has literally zero running costs.
What are these figures you are mentioning?
If a Kobo means a monthly fee, I swear I’ll never even consider getting one.
What are these figures you are mentioning?
If a Kobo means a monthly fee, I swear I’ll never even consider getting one.
Kobos doesn't require a subscription. I switched from a Kindle to a Kobo Clara Colour recently and it's honestly one of the best tech choices I've ever made. Kobos are hackable by default, so you can literally plug them into Chrome and flash new software onto them via WebUSB (or just via the file system). The real kicker for me though is the support with Calibre, I have a massive collection of maybe 2000 books, and this perfectly syncs with my Kobo supporting filtering, collections, etc. attempting this with even 10 books with my Kindle would routinely break down, books not appearing even after waiting hours for it to index, corrupt file systems, etc, the entire device is designed to push you towards Amazon store, including the scammy "pay £20 more to remove adverts" and them disguising the actual price as "reduced".
The fee GP pointed to is a monthly subscription similar to Amazon's Kindle book club offering.
The fee GP pointed to is a monthly subscription similar to Amazon's Kindle book club offering.
They're referring to the subscription plans that give you unlimited access to their catalogue (or at least most of it), like Spotify versus buying an album. Both Kobo and Kindle offer individual purchases as well.
I meant the book and audiobook subscription. It’s equivalent to Kindle Unlimited.
Discussions
(120 points, 3 days ago, 93 comments) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43041726
(50 points, 2 days ago, 23 comments) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43046995
(120 points, 1 day ago, 101 comments) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43058889
(120 points, 3 days ago, 93 comments) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43041726
(50 points, 2 days ago, 23 comments) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43046995
(120 points, 1 day ago, 101 comments) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43058889
Kobo has a sideloading mode that disables all connected-services by default (no need for an account, no online store necessary). Highly recommended alternative.
https://blog.the-ebook-reader.com/2022/01/21/kobo-software-u...
https://blog.the-ebook-reader.com/2022/01/21/kobo-software-u...
I’ve tried leaving kindle but keep coming back because of how well it syncs side-loaded (via email) epub reading progress between the physical reader and the kindle app on my iPhone.
I recently got a Boox Palma, which I love, but the Android Kindle app can’t display time remaining in a chapter for emailed epubs. I find this very surprising, considering both the kindle hardware readers and iPhone kindle app have no problem doing this. Sharing this story in case someone else has run into this and identified a solution.
I recently got a Boox Palma, which I love, but the Android Kindle app can’t display time remaining in a chapter for emailed epubs. I find this very surprising, considering both the kindle hardware readers and iPhone kindle app have no problem doing this. Sharing this story in case someone else has run into this and identified a solution.
I recently got a Palma as well, but just had the display randomly break in my soft coat pocket (note screen and touch are totally fine, just the eink). I would recommend other people avoid them due to this random breakage.
I have a heap of graphic novels I bought for my kids that are basically unusable because Amazon moved everything into Kindle and I couldn't have them in a separate comixology app for my kids anymore and Kindle doesn't allow me to curate family books for kids as I wish. Lesson learned. No more Kindle/comixology/audible purchases in this household. I considered breaking the DRM but we never bought into their readers.
I think hard copies (not from Amazon) are the only reasonable non-infringing option for book lovers. Returning to real libraries to supplement individual purchases lets you access more content for your money and buying a physical copy that might be read once or twice is unsustainable.
If you have to do digital I think piracy is becoming the only reasonable answer. I always thought it was immoral to deprive authors of income if you could afford to do the right thing but with AI companies like Meta downloading terabytes of copyright content for their own commercial gain why should the rest of us feel guilty downloading for personal use?
I think hard copies (not from Amazon) are the only reasonable non-infringing option for book lovers. Returning to real libraries to supplement individual purchases lets you access more content for your money and buying a physical copy that might be read once or twice is unsustainable.
If you have to do digital I think piracy is becoming the only reasonable answer. I always thought it was immoral to deprive authors of income if you could afford to do the right thing but with AI companies like Meta downloading terabytes of copyright content for their own commercial gain why should the rest of us feel guilty downloading for personal use?
> If you have to do digital I think piracy is becoming the only reasonable answer.
What I do is purchase the ebook and remove the DRM, so I can read it on whatever device I want. It may be illegal but would you really consider that piracy?
What I do is purchase the ebook and remove the DRM, so I can read it on whatever device I want. It may be illegal but would you really consider that piracy?
My library has an incredible selection of ebooks I can send straight to my Kindle. The process is less hassle than pirating, too. I get 90% or more of what I read on my Kindle from my library. The only books I buy are from a couple series I adore and always go back to and reference books. Those are few and far between.
[dupe]
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43046995
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43039924
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43041726
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43039924
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43041726
This comment is itself a dupe of https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43070314
Except it flags it properly as dupe and doesn't include more dupes.
This is a problem that can only be fixed by legislation. Other things being equal DRM that's convenient for the vast majority increases book sales and consumers aren't willing to pay enough more for DRM free books to cover the difference -- much less understand the difference between 'owning' books and 'if we feel like it' licenses. And even if a general (i.e. not O'REILLY) ebook/ereader vender just wanted to do the right thing it's far from clear you could write a license that is flexible enough to allow pivoting with changing market conditions, get good deals with publishers but not so flexible as to be meaningless. And it's hard to sell a more expensive DRM free option alongside since, as the DRM free price goes up each sale is more likely to be sold to a 'pirate'.
Bad, but anyone sideloading would skip Kindles anyway for a long time now for much better products.
Also, what better products are there? Kobo? I have a kindle oasis and it's a great device. Not that I love giving money to Amazon, I avoid that when I can with library or at least heavily discounted/public domain or side-loaded books whenever possible.
Kobo Libra color. If I’m being very honest, the screen isn’t as good as the oasis but it’s a compromise I’ve accepted for vastly superior hackability. I telnet into my kobo and installed tailscale then pointed the api to my calibre web instance, I have a much better experience overall because the books are drm-free(d) and calibre web handles sync with kobo really well.
And it has physical buttons. I was clinging to my oasis for the buttons.
And it has physical buttons. I was clinging to my oasis for the buttons.
> the screen isn’t as good as the oasis
Genuinely interested: how good does the screen have to be for mimicking text on paper? I have a Kindle from around 2013, I don't think I would ever need a better quality?
> I telnet into my kobo and installed tailscale then pointed the api to my calibre web instance
Wow that sounds great! This would make me consider a Kobo now (though my old Kindle is still good enough) :-).
Genuinely interested: how good does the screen have to be for mimicking text on paper? I have a Kindle from around 2013, I don't think I would ever need a better quality?
> I telnet into my kobo and installed tailscale then pointed the api to my calibre web instance
Wow that sounds great! This would make me consider a Kobo now (though my old Kindle is still good enough) :-).
> Genuinely interested: how good does the screen have to be for mimicking text on paper? I have a Kindle from around 2013, I don't think I would ever need a better quality?
The 300 DPI screens are a nice step up, as are the variable colour-temp backlights.
The 300 DPI screens are a nice step up, as are the variable colour-temp backlights.
At least kobo still has physical buttons on most of their devices. The oasis has them yes but it hasn't been updated in many years. It lacks mod cons like light temperature and white on black mode.
The one thing that really bothers me about Kobo is that they no longer have a b/w reader in the Libra format. The Kobo colour has so much worse contrast. That degradation is not worth the slight benefit of mediocre colours for me. It really means always needing the blacklight.
The one thing that really bothers me about Kobo is that they no longer have a b/w reader in the Libra format. The Kobo colour has so much worse contrast. That degradation is not worth the slight benefit of mediocre colours for me. It really means always needing the blacklight.
I kept my oasis chugging for as long as I could stand it but there was no replacement with physical buttons, so I switched to a kobo colour. It's pretty great, if you install koreader on it you can even get to an on-screen linux shell, if you just have to bang out some awk on the bus.. :}
Kobo is definitely superior to Kindle in my book. The hardware is great and it's completely open to sideloading and even modding (it runs Linux under the hood).
I can't speak to their digital bookstore but they integrate with Overdrive for library borrowing.
I can't speak to their digital bookstore but they integrate with Overdrive for library borrowing.
besides books, which you can sideload very simply with kindle, what do you need to sideload to your e-reader
There are a few alternative e-reading applications. KOReader and Plato are both under active development. KOReader is great at reading PDF documents on e-ink screens, has nicer options for accessing Wikipedia articles, has useful options for tracking reading progress (e.g. you can see which pages you have read, which is useful while jumping around technical books), and generally goes overboard in giving you control over how a book is formatted. I have also seen random applications make their way to the Kobo, and some people use Kobo's for their own programming projects.
Another benefit is the ability to sideload software without jailbreaking it. I'm not going to say it is easy, since you need to know a bit about Unix to package your own software for sideloading (verses something that someone else packaged for you), but at least you can do it using trusted applications (rather than downloading something from a random third-party).
Another benefit is the ability to sideload software without jailbreaking it. I'm not going to say it is easy, since you need to know a bit about Unix to package your own software for sideloading (verses something that someone else packaged for you), but at least you can do it using trusted applications (rather than downloading something from a random third-party).
Adding on to what others said - I added a button that can download book files from my Google Drive, and it was as simple as copying over rclone and a one line bash script.
Better reading software. KOReader is fantastic (also on Kindle, if you jailbreak).
[deleted]
I use a Kindle and pretty much exclusively sideload. The display and form factor are fantastic. Battery life is very good. Last time I was in the market (late 2021), nothing else was as good.
you're right. it's an e-reader that you can email any epub file to and it'll read it. if you don't want to pirate, there's a functional store. what more do people need?
> you can email any ePub file
Except when you can't, like literally yesterday: subscribed to Asimov's, sent ePub, got a link, clicked a link, "that link is not valid". Repeat, same message. Why? Who knows?
My next ereader won't be a Kindle.
Except when you can't, like literally yesterday: subscribed to Asimov's, sent ePub, got a link, clicked a link, "that link is not valid". Repeat, same message. Why? Who knows?
My next ereader won't be a Kindle.
Can you clarify what you mean by "got a link"? If you're using Send to Email, there shouldn't be any links involved. You just, well, send an email to the designated address with the ePub attached, and it shows up in your library shortly after.
Amazon asks you to verify the upload was intended, by sending a link you need to click. It's been like that for years.
FWIW I have been using that feature for well over a decade, with several hundred third party books in my Kindle library, and I haven't seen what you described once. Is the sender on the pre-approved list in Send to Email settings?
I've been sending files to my Kindle for years, I've never seen that.
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The web app for sending to Kindle is a lot more reliable:
https://www.amazon.com/sendtokindle
https://www.amazon.com/sendtokindle
you probably just didn't send it from a verified send-to-kindle email address. either add the email or send the epub from your kindle account email
I think the value of Kindles lies in Amazon's ecosystem. Hardware-wise I think most competitors catched up. Kobos especially are great, and have a much more open software platform.
My kobo is easily as good as my kindle was. Only better, because it has zero ties to Amazon.
The Pocketbook Era Color is the best e-reader right now if you don't care about stores. Or at least it was the best device out there when I was in the market for a reader.
I only use eInk to read at the beach or pool. I am still happily using a Kindle 3G. That’s an old, old model, but it still works and it has physical page turn buttons. Too old to work with the Kindle store even over WiFi. But sideloading works just fine, and I always have a laptop on vacation. As long as I have 3-4 books ready each day I’ll never be caught short. Download, strip DRM if desired, sideload.
Now I suppose it will just be Anna and me doing the sideload.
Now I suppose it will just be Anna and me doing the sideload.
I sideload with my Kindle all the time and I don't expect to switch away. It still lets me grab any random non-DRM ePub and upload it over USB, or, better yet, add it directly to my cloud library with Send to Email (and then I also get position & bookmark sync across all devices etc).
I think you can still sideload? Seems like this applies more to getting stuff off of the kindle to the P.C.
No the books are downloaded from the Amazon site. This is what is being removed.
They are for the specific purpose of officially supported sideloading so that is also being removed. Sideloading books from other sources is still ok.
They are for the specific purpose of officially supported sideloading so that is also being removed. Sideloading books from other sources is still ok.
I have a medium sized collection of Kindle books. I stay in the ecosystem because I enjoy the convenience of being able to read on my phone and tablet, and I enjoy being able to write and sync notes and highlights.
I would have liked to have all the books on my hard drive, fully searchable. But it seems like it won’t be possible now? I guess I’ll have to make do with my notes.
I would have liked to have all the books on my hard drive, fully searchable. But it seems like it won’t be possible now? I guess I’ll have to make do with my notes.
It sounds like this applies to backing up to a hard drive etc, and for some people, then removing DRM from their kindle books.
I understand the worry, but for me I was more worried about losing the ability to side-load books, which I don't think is being removed.
I understand the worry, but for me I was more worried about losing the ability to side-load books, which I don't think is being removed.
I bought a Tolino vision color (a rebranded Kobo Libra Color with shittier software) a few months ago. If Amazon no longer allows me to download purchased books, I can no longer de-DRM them and read them offline on my phone, on my Tolino or on my computer. It seems that most stores outside Amazon have even shittier DRM than Amazon has. How am I going to be able to buy books in the future so I can actually read them?
I’m absolutely willing to pay for ebooks. I always did. For me, removal of the download feature will absolutely be a bookalypse.
I’m absolutely willing to pay for ebooks. I always did. For me, removal of the download feature will absolutely be a bookalypse.
Kobo, I never had problems downloading the books and getting rid of the DRM.
Good reminder to all of us to check the dependencies from time to time. Services don't last forever, which is not a problem at all, if people enter into contract consciously. What's painful is overly relying on a service, and then having the rug pulled from underneath the feet.
I don't think that this instance is particularly painful, but the lesson is still the same. If it's important, it's worth to back up at least the metadata.
I don't think that this instance is particularly painful, but the lesson is still the same. If it's important, it's worth to back up at least the metadata.
Thank goodness I made a habit of downloading and unlocking the books that I bought on Amazon. I would hate to rush and download >100 books one by one now.
As of this writing I can still connect my kindle and then read the kfx file with Calibre and then convert it to azw3 or epub (with the dedrm plugin).
Should I loose every way to backup my books, then probably I'd use tesseract, puppeteer and their cloud reader to re-ocr the books (it's better than nothing). Also note that the country I live in, libraries have no ebooks. Kobo drm is another nuisance.
Should I loose every way to backup my books, then probably I'd use tesseract, puppeteer and their cloud reader to re-ocr the books (it's better than nothing). Also note that the country I live in, libraries have no ebooks. Kobo drm is another nuisance.
When I try to do this, it flatly doesn't work -- I get a popup message saying "This book has DRM". I have what I believe to be the latest version of the DeDRM plugin installed in Calibre.
(I am currently attempting to follow a recipe off the internet that begins with "install an old version of the PC Kindle app, disconnect from the internet before running it so you can tell it not to auto-update itself, ...". Perhaps that will work.)
[EDITED to add:] Yup, looks like that has worked, though most of the titles and authors will need to be entered manually.
(I am currently attempting to follow a recipe off the internet that begins with "install an old version of the PC Kindle app, disconnect from the internet before running it so you can tell it not to auto-update itself, ...". Perhaps that will work.)
[EDITED to add:] Yup, looks like that has worked, though most of the titles and authors will need to be entered manually.
I keep a file with details for myself that change every year, thanks to Amazon being a dick and I a moron for giving them money. I still use an older calibre version and a dedrm plugin fork, not the original.
There was a post on HN a couple days ago about the launch of bookshop.org, which lets you buy e-books from your local bookseller. Good timing!
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43056526
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43056526
That's arguably got even more restrictive DRM than the Kindle Store.
And it's only available in the US.
And it's only available in the US.
I didn't know that feature existed until I saw this. Downloaded all my books last night and now I'm able to switch ecosystem - an option I didn't think I had and probably never would have tried if they hadn't removed it.
I'm surprised no one here has mentioned about how Winterbreak can now jailbreak any kindle regardless of its firmware, this is the way to go if you wanna get out of Amazon's ecosystem
i have owned kindles for the better part of a decade and purchased books from the store a total of 4 times - the library and friend’s epub collections were far more appealing
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Stallman calls it Swindle, for a reason. Actually, many reasons.
That quote really is true about present and future power moving society towards owning nothing.
Sounds awful and is awful for the user in practice.
Sounds awful and is awful for the user in practice.
Coincidentally, Libgen has been down for 4 days. Never saw that before.
Maybe the dark publishing forces are trying to corral their herd.
Maybe the dark publishing forces are trying to corral their herd.
I own Kindles and I have bought a lot of ebook content from the Amazon store over the years but they don't seem to realize that the more restrictions they put in place, the more they are incentivizing just someone going to the effort to decrypt/de-DRM everything to epub and shoving it into a Kobo (or apple's Books.app, or comic book reader, or anything else that reads the ebook or comic book formats)
...Which is exactly what I ended up doing. Decrypting 100% of my Kindle purchases so I can use them how I please, and using z-library when I was too lazy to even do so.
Apple understood this when the first iPod came out. Offer a better service, not shinier handcuffs.
...Which is exactly what I ended up doing. Decrypting 100% of my Kindle purchases so I can use them how I please, and using z-library when I was too lazy to even do so.
Apple understood this when the first iPod came out. Offer a better service, not shinier handcuffs.
>Apple understood this when the first iPod came out. Offer a better service, not shinier handcuffs.
It's a shame they haven't tried to pressure the publishers into dropping DRM for books.
The DRM used by Apple's bookstore is entirely limited to Apple's own apps on its own devices. You can't even read the books in a web browser.
It's a shame they haven't tried to pressure the publishers into dropping DRM for books.
The DRM used by Apple's bookstore is entirely limited to Apple's own apps on its own devices. You can't even read the books in a web browser.
Which is why I try to decrypt everything I purchase, or obtain a decrypted version after purchase. (The only grey-area exception is if I own the physical copy of the book, I consider it ethical to download the ebook, but this is of course debatable to a degree)
I'm not trying to screw over authors and publishers, I just want to use my purchased content how I please.
They could easily do what Apple did and leave things un-DRM'd but digitally-signed as having been purchased by someone.
I'm not trying to screw over authors and publishers, I just want to use my purchased content how I please.
They could easily do what Apple did and leave things un-DRM'd but digitally-signed as having been purchased by someone.
Buying hard copies of a book and the pirating the DRM-free digital version is completely acceptable imo - as long as you buy the hard copy in a bookshop and not online ilk like Amazon.
Most local bookshops also will offer shipping if you’re too lazy to walk there a couple of times/year.
The vast majority of Kindle users do not possess the technical expertise or inclination to decrypt/de-DRM their purchases. But, also, I doubt that the kind of workflow that is affected by this change is something that would even register for most.
The first iPod and iTunes stores were very full of DRM.
What do you use to decrypt your Kindle purchases? I haven't yet found anything that works with modern purchases.
Most forums frown on sharing such information, but seek and ye shall find. Also, it's good to leave speed bumps in place due to the ethical concerns.
The last time I did it I had to basically procure an old Kindle app and get the content via that, because it used a weaker version of DRM. That loophole may have been closed in the meantime, though.
The last time I did it I had to basically procure an old Kindle app and get the content via that, because it used a weaker version of DRM. That loophole may have been closed in the meantime, though.
I bought a Pocketbook after Amazon started nagging too much about connecting to the wifi. Would recommend.
Pocketbook is a solid choice. I've been very happy with my Pocketbok Inkpad Color 3 - their free cloud offering is great for transferring my ebooks around and their send-to feature is also great. I've never trusted the Kindle jail but in my various trials with eink devices, I've come to appreciate the clean experience that Pocketbook currently offers.
How do I jailbreak Kindle books so they aren’t later removed or restricted in weird ways?
this feels like living in an alternate universe where instead of the guide changing it's moto from
"dont panic" to "panic" we get a change of user agreement notification on e reader screens
Libby is the way to go. It's going to suck when they defund the library.
I love Libby. It's introduced me to so many titles by browsing what's currently available that I otherwise would've skipped over. The 21 day loan period gives me just enough of a gentle push to read that I wouldn't have if I owned the book outright.
For me, although this option is still there on Amazon's webpages, it doesn't actually work. I get a popup saying "You do not have any compatible devices registered for this content. Buy a Kindle or get the free Kindle reading app." (I already have the Kindle app on my phone.)
The files containing the book content appear to be on the phone (an Android device) and I can transfer them off it. Perhaps these are the same things that I would get on my computer if I were able to do "download and transfer"? So far as I can tell, however, there is no way to do anything with them. At least, if Calibre + the DeDRM plugin + the KFX input plugin are able to interpret them, then I have failed to find how to do so using Calibre's famously clear and intuitive user interface.
(This sort of thing is why I only "buy"[1] Kindle books when they are much, much cheaper than actual physical books.)
[1] To buy something is to give money to its owner, after which you become its owner. Whatever it is you do when you get access to a Kindle e-book, it isn't buying it; you own nothing more after handing over the money than you did before.
The files containing the book content appear to be on the phone (an Android device) and I can transfer them off it. Perhaps these are the same things that I would get on my computer if I were able to do "download and transfer"? So far as I can tell, however, there is no way to do anything with them. At least, if Calibre + the DeDRM plugin + the KFX input plugin are able to interpret them, then I have failed to find how to do so using Calibre's famously clear and intuitive user interface.
(This sort of thing is why I only "buy"[1] Kindle books when they are much, much cheaper than actual physical books.)
[1] To buy something is to give money to its owner, after which you become its owner. Whatever it is you do when you get access to a Kindle e-book, it isn't buying it; you own nothing more after handing over the money than you did before.
To use download and transfer you are required to have a kindle device that supports it registered on your account (11th gen or older), so that's why the option doesn't show up for you.
If the files are .azw3 then it's the same
If the files are .azw3 then it's the same
Is there a script to download all your Kindle books?
perhaps this will help you as well: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43071284 .
does anyone know if this affects the older versions of kindle for pc? You’re able to download your books from there still currently.
see also
All Kindles can now be jailbroken -
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43073969
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something something library genesis
(1) This is the "Download and Transfer" option where Amazon allowed users to select books they had purchased a license to and download them from the Amazon website.
(2) The ability to transfer books from your computer to your Kindle using a USB cable is not affected.
(3) The ability to send non-Amazon-licensed ePubs using the Send to Kindle email feature is not affected.