Giorgio Armani didn't accomplish anything until his forties(gq.com)
gq.com
Giorgio Armani didn't accomplish anything until his forties
http://www.gq.com/style/celebrities/201506/giorgio-armani-interview
49 comments
Aware of what?
I often find people in their 40s' to be deeply troubled, tired, and grappling for power or ego.
Anecdotally I have encountered more people in the 50s-90s range with a calmer, wiser, and altruistic awareness of self and others. I imagine it has something to do with the thought of mortality nullifying their materialistic or egoistic pursuits, and some sort of realization that we're all here together on a big rock hurdling through space so maybe baking a batch of cookies for friends is a good idea worth spending time on.
I often find people in their 40s' to be deeply troubled, tired, and grappling for power or ego.
Anecdotally I have encountered more people in the 50s-90s range with a calmer, wiser, and altruistic awareness of self and others. I imagine it has something to do with the thought of mortality nullifying their materialistic or egoistic pursuits, and some sort of realization that we're all here together on a big rock hurdling through space so maybe baking a batch of cookies for friends is a good idea worth spending time on.
Of course, there's plenty of people in their 40s experiencing the struggles you describe. But, as a matter of fact, I've met as many of them in the 20s and 30s range with the same problems (maybe not so tired, but troubled and egomaniac nonetheless).
In the context of entrepreneurship, however, I find that those traits are much less prominent, regardless of the age.
In my case, today I just sold my part of the company I founded 10 years ago to my cofounding partner. Not a big, glorious exit, BTW. Just the opportunity to try again, and get better results this time.
Being 46, I do feel much more aware now that I felt 10 years ago. Aware of my strengths and aware of my limits. And aware of my motivations.
However, I must confess that, ten years ago, I had the same image that you describe about fortysomethings. That's why I decided to start my own company then, to avoid becoming one of them.
In the context of entrepreneurship, however, I find that those traits are much less prominent, regardless of the age.
In my case, today I just sold my part of the company I founded 10 years ago to my cofounding partner. Not a big, glorious exit, BTW. Just the opportunity to try again, and get better results this time.
Being 46, I do feel much more aware now that I felt 10 years ago. Aware of my strengths and aware of my limits. And aware of my motivations.
However, I must confess that, ten years ago, I had the same image that you describe about fortysomethings. That's why I decided to start my own company then, to avoid becoming one of them.
(Disclaimer, or self-indictment, or something: I am in my early 40s.)
Of course we are making incredibly broad generalizations here. But what part of what you are saying is incompatible with the post to which you reply?
Self-awareness is frequently painful. Not everyone reacts the same way, or well. Personally, I do find that I'm reflecting differently than I used to on choices I've made, opportunities missed, times I've been less than the human I want to be, and it isn't all zen gardens and rainbows. People react to disappointment, shame, unfairness, etc. differently, and lashing out, trying to make up for lost time, and far more inexplicable reactions are all pretty common, I think.
Not there yet, but I certainly hope that by the time I hit my 50s, I will have gained some equanimity about the more painful things in my life.
And if not, I can always take up whacking the kids with my cane.
Of course we are making incredibly broad generalizations here. But what part of what you are saying is incompatible with the post to which you reply?
Self-awareness is frequently painful. Not everyone reacts the same way, or well. Personally, I do find that I'm reflecting differently than I used to on choices I've made, opportunities missed, times I've been less than the human I want to be, and it isn't all zen gardens and rainbows. People react to disappointment, shame, unfairness, etc. differently, and lashing out, trying to make up for lost time, and far more inexplicable reactions are all pretty common, I think.
Not there yet, but I certainly hope that by the time I hit my 50s, I will have gained some equanimity about the more painful things in my life.
And if not, I can always take up whacking the kids with my cane.
Meta question. I only see upvote icons for the top comment and its first child. I see both up and down vote icons for children lower than that. Can anyone explain the logic?
I understand there is some logic in the voting mechanism to prevent flame wars. But this thread is over a day old. Whatever algorithm was in place here annoyed me enough to write this "meta" post and likely get downvotes for doing so.
I understand there is some logic in the voting mechanism to prevent flame wars. But this thread is over a day old. Whatever algorithm was in place here annoyed me enough to write this "meta" post and likely get downvotes for doing so.
I think the key is the quote says "...start to become aware. It's just the beginning..." In your forties, many have teenagers or those on the cusp on college, so I think the shift is moving from provider to wanting a legacy, and what you described is the bit of turbulence that comes with that shift.
This gives me the hope that with 35 I still have a chance to break the chains, get out of employee role and start my own business, because I feel so ready for it... But then again, there are mouths to feed at home, so... shut up and back to reading this feature requirement...
You have plenty of time. I don't know anything about your setup but if you can try to start a business on the side rather than leaving your job do so.
It wasn't until my kids were adults that I was able to make the jump into my lifelong dream of self employment. But I spent a lot of time training myself and laying the groundwork before that day. Keep pushing for your dream. The fight isn't over until you quit fighting! Age isn't a big deal unless you allow it to. If you keep learning and keep striving and keep exercising that will keep you young in all the ways that matter.
You have plenty of time. Here are some articles if you're ever feeling "too old" from reading HN:
http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/235357
http://www.forbes.com/sites/krisztinaholly/2014/01/15/why-gr...
https://hbr.org/2013/06/entrepreneurs-get-better-with/
I just turned 40 this year. I have 7 failed businesses behind me and one that is still alive, doing well.
One thing I have noticed is that a better understanding of how the world ACTUALLY works has been a huge help in avoiding the many pitfalls that await the intrepid explorer. And since there is no manual that explains all of this, you can only really get it through hard experience. And to make matters worse, once it's internalized, it just becomes part of your background thought process, making it difficult to explain to others because you hardly even notice it's there until you see someone about to make a huge mistake.
One thing I have noticed is that a better understanding of how the world ACTUALLY works has been a huge help in avoiding the many pitfalls that await the intrepid explorer. And since there is no manual that explains all of this, you can only really get it through hard experience. And to make matters worse, once it's internalized, it just becomes part of your background thought process, making it difficult to explain to others because you hardly even notice it's there until you see someone about to make a huge mistake.
I've always wanted to write a quickie script that collected famous people pages (such as Nobel Prize winners) from Wikipedia and subtracted their birthdate from the year of their first major accomplishment...I suspect in something like Nobel Prize winners, the ages would skew middle-aged to older, but of course, such people would've been working hard in their field prior to the award.
"...the mean age of Nobel Prize winning achievements since 1980 is 48 y."
http://www.pnas.org/content/108/47/18910.full
http://www.pnas.org/content/108/47/18910.full
Well, the Nobel is usually awarded quite some time after the deed is done and the achievement has gained recognition. This is especially true for the prize in the "hard science" fields.
See also: 5 Famous People Who Succeeded Long After They Should've Quit
http://www.cracked.com/article_19655_5-famous-late-bloomers....
Lists: Alan Rickman, Peter Roget, Joseph Conrad, Kathryn Joosten and Harland “Colonel” Sanders.
http://www.cracked.com/article_19655_5-famous-late-bloomers....
Lists: Alan Rickman, Peter Roget, Joseph Conrad, Kathryn Joosten and Harland “Colonel” Sanders.
A lot of people don't accomplish anything until their forties. Easy to understand why too: you're wiser, have more money and built up a network of connections over the years.
The edge younger people have I think is a drive, higher energy=levels and an optimism that comes from not being jaded from years of full-time work.
The edge younger people have I think is a drive, higher energy=levels and an optimism that comes from not being jaded from years of full-time work.
Good summary of a 'hack' of human nature:
>A well-maintained physique is a great business card. Ideas and intelligence are what matters, but if you have a well-maintained physique, it's better. People are always more willing when it comes to beauty; there's not much to be done about it. It's a classic ideal: healthy mind, healthy body.
>A well-maintained physique is a great business card. Ideas and intelligence are what matters, but if you have a well-maintained physique, it's better. People are always more willing when it comes to beauty; there's not much to be done about it. It's a classic ideal: healthy mind, healthy body.
Related, Malcom Gladwell on "Late Bloomers":
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2008/10/20/late-bloomers-2 (2008)
http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2008/10/20/late-bloomers-2 (2008)
I like Gladwell from a pop-sci point of view. After he retroactively tried to medically diagnose Goliath using the King James Bible and a few anecdotes, I really tuned him out.
I totally feel this article. I decided to create a startup in my late 40s, 20 years into a steady, safe career of enterprise IT. I finally feel ready.
Somewhat related:
What's the average age of people you fund?
About 29. A lot of people think it's younger because
the press especially like to write about young founders.
I suspect people in their 40s will have far more potential sources of cash for funding a startup (personal savings, personal connections, wealthy friends), so probably wouldn't consider ycombinator a very good use of their time. So the ages of successful ycombinator applicants might not be the best metric to use in this case.
But wouldn't they also have more responsibilities?
There is a thin balance I suppose. There is a perfect age when you don't have the responsibilities of family and kids, and still have a decade's worth of industry experience to bank on.
If you are an engineer, you likely graduated at 22. By the time you hit 29, you've had 7 years of real world engineering experience.
Good enough to start your own company, in my opinion.
There is a thin balance I suppose. There is a perfect age when you don't have the responsibilities of family and kids, and still have a decade's worth of industry experience to bank on.
If you are an engineer, you likely graduated at 22. By the time you hit 29, you've had 7 years of real world engineering experience.
Good enough to start your own company, in my opinion.
> but wouldn't they also have more responsibilities?
Not necessarily. In my case I had far more financial independence at 40, no debt, and all the kids were out of the house for the first time in my life. Car fully paid off. In my 20s, I wasn't in the position to start a business because I had mouths to feed, at least not without external capital sources.
Not necessarily. In my case I had far more financial independence at 40, no debt, and all the kids were out of the house for the first time in my life. Car fully paid off. In my 20s, I wasn't in the position to start a business because I had mouths to feed, at least not without external capital sources.
> But wouldn't they also have more responsibilities?
From https://hbr.org/2013/06/entrepreneurs-get-better-with/:
“The average age of a successful entrepreneur in high-growth industries such as computers, health care, and aerospace is 40. Twice as many successful entrepreneurs are over 50 as under 25. The vast majority — 75 percent — have more than six years of industry experience and half have more than 10 years when they create their startup,” says Duke University scholar Vivek Wadhwa, who studied 549 successful technology ventures. Meanwhile, data from the Kauffman Foundation indicates the highest rate of entrepreneurship in America has shifted to the 55-64 age group, with people over 55 almost twice as likely to found successful companies than those between 20 and 34.
The narrative of "it's hard to start a company when you have a family and a mortgage" might seem intuitive, but the data around entrepreneurship and small business ownership in this country shows that most people don't start successful businesses when they're young, single and have limited responsibilities.
> If you are an engineer, you likely graduated at 22. By the time you hit 29, you've had 7 years of real world engineering experience.
> Good enough to start your own company, in my opinion.
I don't want to discount the value of engineering experience, but this is hardly all that's required for success. One should not mistake Silicon Valley investors tripping over themselves to provide seed funding to engineers with the creation of successful businesses. A lot of the startups today aren't going anywhere, and you just don't hear a lot about the failures because employees typically aren't out of work for long when the money runs out.
From https://hbr.org/2013/06/entrepreneurs-get-better-with/:
“The average age of a successful entrepreneur in high-growth industries such as computers, health care, and aerospace is 40. Twice as many successful entrepreneurs are over 50 as under 25. The vast majority — 75 percent — have more than six years of industry experience and half have more than 10 years when they create their startup,” says Duke University scholar Vivek Wadhwa, who studied 549 successful technology ventures. Meanwhile, data from the Kauffman Foundation indicates the highest rate of entrepreneurship in America has shifted to the 55-64 age group, with people over 55 almost twice as likely to found successful companies than those between 20 and 34.
The narrative of "it's hard to start a company when you have a family and a mortgage" might seem intuitive, but the data around entrepreneurship and small business ownership in this country shows that most people don't start successful businesses when they're young, single and have limited responsibilities.
> If you are an engineer, you likely graduated at 22. By the time you hit 29, you've had 7 years of real world engineering experience.
> Good enough to start your own company, in my opinion.
I don't want to discount the value of engineering experience, but this is hardly all that's required for success. One should not mistake Silicon Valley investors tripping over themselves to provide seed funding to engineers with the creation of successful businesses. A lot of the startups today aren't going anywhere, and you just don't hear a lot about the failures because employees typically aren't out of work for long when the money runs out.
Looking at some of the successful 40+ entrepreneurs, it strikes me that the 40 year old entrepreneur in a high growth industry has a very different profile than a 40 year old entrepreneur in a more "traditional" industry like food & beverages, retail, etc.
The former is usually composed of highly educated execs with business experience and a technical background. They jump in after identifying a core problem in their industry and usually have the technical chops + connections to solve it.
The former is usually composed of highly educated execs with business experience and a technical background. They jump in after identifying a core problem in their industry and usually have the technical chops + connections to solve it.
> But wouldn't they also have more responsibilities?
Yes, but they often have more support too. At 31, I've got a wife who can support the household, money in the bank to pay for capital expenditures, the ability to get a business line of credit, etc. If I quit my job to start a company, I wouldn't be staring down the end of a fixed runway. At 23, I would've been burning a fixed amount of cash needing to make things work before it ran out.
Yes, but they often have more support too. At 31, I've got a wife who can support the household, money in the bank to pay for capital expenditures, the ability to get a business line of credit, etc. If I quit my job to start a company, I wouldn't be staring down the end of a fixed runway. At 23, I would've been burning a fixed amount of cash needing to make things work before it ran out.
Not necessarily. It's entirely possible to be a great engineer and a terrible CEO/Founder/Mentor. It's obviously not always true, but I think there's a benefit to age and wisdom.
It's easy(ish) to find someone with entrepreneurial drive and technical skill. Far more important is the wisdom to know when to listen and when not to listen (and corollaries about hiring good people and managing). Those are critical for long term success and difficult to learn.
It's sad that there's a cult of youth in the valley because a lot of these skills develop over time.
It's easy(ish) to find someone with entrepreneurial drive and technical skill. Far more important is the wisdom to know when to listen and when not to listen (and corollaries about hiring good people and managing). Those are critical for long term success and difficult to learn.
It's sad that there's a cult of youth in the valley because a lot of these skills develop over time.
Yeah, but a normal distribution centered on 29, with a lower bound of ~18 doesn't actually imply all that many 40+ year olds.
(on mobile, someone else can reply with the math for an upvote)
(on mobile, someone else can reply with the math for an upvote)
Not that I am a mathematician, but I am pretty sure that you can't actually calculate how many 40+ people there are just from these values since you can't assume the distribution is normal.
Well, it's clearly not normal because it bound at the low end. But assuming a normal distribution shape for the high side is probably a reasonable first guess.
Put it like this: I'd say that the average being 29 means that around 80% of founders funded by YC are below 40.
Put it like this: I'd say that the average being 29 means that around 80% of founders funded by YC are below 40.
Assuming a normal distribution is always a reasonable first step, but when dealing with small numbers in your distribution you have to be really careful as you can go massively wrong with this assumption.
Well we can set hard upper and lower bounds on the ages of people they fund (let's call them 18 and 80). And if we further assume that 18-22 is more common than 65-80, that gives us fair bit of information to start building a likely distribution.
Yes we can build a model, but given we don't know how many people have been funded we can't really be very precise.
It's the distribution that is interesting.
(I'm actually pretty sure there is enough information about on how many companies YC is funded and the average team size to have a decent go at estimating the absolute numbers too, but that is less interesting for the purposes of this discussion)
Edit: (since you seem interested in the numbers) based on [1] and [2] we can guess lower bounds of (a) 550 companies funded, (b) 2 founders per company and taking my previous "(c)80% less than 40 estimate" (based on a normal distribution) that gives around 220 older than 40.
Given than we don't know (a),(b) or the standard deviation needed to accurately estimate (c) it is actually more useful to talk about the estimate (c) than to increase the inaccuracy by using the numbers (a) and (b).
Edit 2: [3] gives us more accurate numbers. 842 companies funded, max age of founder 66 (I guessed a max of 70). Using that to adjust the standard deviation, and sticking with the (b)=2 estimate above we get around 294 founders 40 or older. Call it 300 in round numbers.
To verify this, someone could run the numbers to check if this gives the average age (30.27) along with the median of 29 (although guessing the shape of the lower-side curve is probably challenging).
[1] http://yclist.com/
[2] http://www.quora.com/What-are-the-average-demographics-of-th...
[3] http://blog.ycombinator.com/yc-stats-winter-2015
(I'm actually pretty sure there is enough information about on how many companies YC is funded and the average team size to have a decent go at estimating the absolute numbers too, but that is less interesting for the purposes of this discussion)
Edit: (since you seem interested in the numbers) based on [1] and [2] we can guess lower bounds of (a) 550 companies funded, (b) 2 founders per company and taking my previous "(c)80% less than 40 estimate" (based on a normal distribution) that gives around 220 older than 40.
Given than we don't know (a),(b) or the standard deviation needed to accurately estimate (c) it is actually more useful to talk about the estimate (c) than to increase the inaccuracy by using the numbers (a) and (b).
Edit 2: [3] gives us more accurate numbers. 842 companies funded, max age of founder 66 (I guessed a max of 70). Using that to adjust the standard deviation, and sticking with the (b)=2 estimate above we get around 294 founders 40 or older. Call it 300 in round numbers.
To verify this, someone could run the numbers to check if this gives the average age (30.27) along with the median of 29 (although guessing the shape of the lower-side curve is probably challenging).
[1] http://yclist.com/
[2] http://www.quora.com/What-are-the-average-demographics-of-th...
[3] http://blog.ycombinator.com/yc-stats-winter-2015
Given that the actual value is known we don't really need to calculate anything, just get those that know to tell us.
I suspect that the distribution is approximately normal and that your calculations are close to the true value. From my perspective the really interesting thing to know is how close the true numbers are to expected. This will tell us something useful about the selection process.
I suspect that the distribution is approximately normal and that your calculations are close to the true value. From my perspective the really interesting thing to know is how close the true numbers are to expected. This will tell us something useful about the selection process.
The central limit theorem might have something to say about that...
I doubt they have funded a Sufficiently Large Number of people.
It's well over 1600 people funded.
I'd find it surprising if we didn't see a skewed normal distribution (skewed because of the lower bound).
I'd find it surprising if we didn't see a skewed normal distribution (skewed because of the lower bound).
Exactly.
Yeah, but I'm not sure about the "independent random variables" part. Specifically, the "independent" qualifier.
This is not a bunch of uncorrelated uranium decay random number generators.
This is not a bunch of uncorrelated uranium decay random number generators.
That's true, but you can ignore distributions, and assert that they must accept more people under 29 than over 40.
True, but this doesn't help you too much in calculating how many are over 40.
We don't know the distribution but I also think there are probably not many 40+ olds.
I posted it because the notion is similar. We are surprised that Giorgio Armani was in his forties. We are surprised that the average age of people funded by Y Combinator is almost 30.
Maybe there is another reason: At a young age every year is so important. Graduated at 17 or 18, big difference. As you get older that'll change. Founded startup with 30 or 40, not a big difference.
I posted it because the notion is similar. We are surprised that Giorgio Armani was in his forties. We are surprised that the average age of people funded by Y Combinator is almost 30.
Maybe there is another reason: At a young age every year is so important. Graduated at 17 or 18, big difference. As you get older that'll change. Founded startup with 30 or 40, not a big difference.
Headline is a bit misleading.
By 40 he had already significant experience in the industry, as a menswear buyer for a department store and through his 30s a menswear designer, both employed and freelance. Then he (the creative) and his partner (the business guy) created a startup leading to where he is today.
This isn't too unusual a story in the world of startups (not to minimize the achievement of his or any self-sacrificing startup), and doesn't reflect the title's premise at all.
By 40 he had already significant experience in the industry, as a menswear buyer for a department store and through his 30s a menswear designer, both employed and freelance. Then he (the creative) and his partner (the business guy) created a startup leading to where he is today.
This isn't too unusual a story in the world of startups (not to minimize the achievement of his or any self-sacrificing startup), and doesn't reflect the title's premise at all.
I don't know - I think it's more akin to spending 20 years as a dev in various companies, then one day saying "I'm finally going to take a chance on that start-up idea".
We'd probably be saying pretty much the same thing (regardless as to whether some of what she/he'd done had made a real difference to those companies) - "she/he spent 20 years writing code, but XXX was her/his first real accomplishment/success..."
As I've been told many, many times - overnight success is usually preceded by 10 years of hard work.
We'd probably be saying pretty much the same thing (regardless as to whether some of what she/he'd done had made a real difference to those companies) - "she/he spent 20 years writing code, but XXX was her/his first real accomplishment/success..."
As I've been told many, many times - overnight success is usually preceded by 10 years of hard work.
Agree, "didn't accomplish anything" = "didn't achieve extraordinary success". Typical media.
Yes: it reminded me of the old sour joke that musicians love about how it takes years of work to become an overnight sensation.
But the man himself provides reasons which I find much more profound (and that being in midforties myself, I'm glad to relate to:
> Your forties are the moment when you start to become aware. It's just the beginning. I've always believed that to confirm your way of thinking takes time. It takes experimenting. You have to confront different chapters of your life
Touched me deep enough to create an HN account just to comment.