Typography of Neon Genesis Evangelion(fontsinuse.com)
fontsinuse.com
Typography of Neon Genesis Evangelion
https://fontsinuse.com/uses/28760/neon-genesis-evangelion
113 comments
> I suspect it started out as limited technical aptitude and/or an "efficiency hack", but has since morphed into an actual stylistic decision that both makes thematic sense[1] and sets NGE apart.
I forget which famous modern composer said it, but there's the wonderful observation that "the artifacts of your medium will become its defining and desired characteristic".
See how we have systems trying to emulate CRT scanlines, or Synthwave style of music that not only reproduces the limitations of early synths but applies those limitations to newer sounds.
Edit: I think it was Brian Eno, though I can't immediately find the quote
I forget which famous modern composer said it, but there's the wonderful observation that "the artifacts of your medium will become its defining and desired characteristic".
See how we have systems trying to emulate CRT scanlines, or Synthwave style of music that not only reproduces the limitations of early synths but applies those limitations to newer sounds.
Edit: I think it was Brian Eno, though I can't immediately find the quote
It was Brian Eno, here's the quote:
“Whatever you now find weird, ugly, uncomfortable and nasty about a new medium will surely become its signature. CD distortion, the jitteriness of digital video, the crap sound of 8-bit - all of these will be cherished and emulated as soon as they can be avoided. It’s the sound of failure: so much modern art is the sound of things going out of control, of a medium pushing to its limits and breaking apart. The distorted guitar sound is the sound of something too loud for the medium supposed to carry it. The blues singer with the cracked voice is the sound of an emotional cry too powerful for the throat that releases it. The excitement of grainy film, of bleached-out black and white, is the excitement of witnessing events too momentous for the medium assigned to record them.”
https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/649039-whatever-you-now-fin...
“Whatever you now find weird, ugly, uncomfortable and nasty about a new medium will surely become its signature. CD distortion, the jitteriness of digital video, the crap sound of 8-bit - all of these will be cherished and emulated as soon as they can be avoided. It’s the sound of failure: so much modern art is the sound of things going out of control, of a medium pushing to its limits and breaking apart. The distorted guitar sound is the sound of something too loud for the medium supposed to carry it. The blues singer with the cracked voice is the sound of an emotional cry too powerful for the throat that releases it. The excitement of grainy film, of bleached-out black and white, is the excitement of witnessing events too momentous for the medium assigned to record them.”
https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/649039-whatever-you-now-fin...
I suppose that mechanical compression faithfully evokes what condensed fonts actively try to mitigate: the squeezing and stretching itself, which lends it a sense of emotional stress and tension.
Also, with digital fonts as new as they were when NGE was released, it's likely that compression seems more like a novel way to establish identity, rather than the now ubiquitous ignorant rescaling of fonts.
Also, with digital fonts as new as they were when NGE was released, it's likely that compression seems more like a novel way to establish identity, rather than the now ubiquitous ignorant rescaling of fonts.
I'm just excited to finally be able to read the fonts and Kanji/Kana.
When I first saw Evangelion - the text looked cool, foreign and amazing. I never thought there'd be one day when I would be able to read the kana phonetically and know what it means or actually recognize kanji.
When I first saw Evangelion - the text looked cool, foreign and amazing. I never thought there'd be one day when I would be able to read the kana phonetically and know what it means or actually recognize kanji.
What does "mechanically compressed" mean in this context?
To me, the fonts looks either squished or stretched horizontally throughout the series, especially the logo [0]
EDIT: If you've never watched it, it is on Netflix and it is really good.
[0] https://wiki.evageeks.org/File:Neon_Genesis_Evangelion_logo....
To me, the fonts looks either squished or stretched horizontally throughout the series, especially the logo [0]
EDIT: If you've never watched it, it is on Netflix and it is really good.
[0] https://wiki.evageeks.org/File:Neon_Genesis_Evangelion_logo....
It means squished as if it was a image, without regard for kerning, weight etc.
Usually a official condensed version of a typeface is adapted more subtly.
Usually a official condensed version of a typeface is adapted more subtly.
Regarding mechanical compression: it's probably not 100% so, but afaik in kanji/hanzi and likely many other SEA scripts, proportions of a character don't matter much―they're just strokes in a grid that you can squish without harm to legibility. That's why labels on cheap Chinese goods often had deformed quasi-monospace Latin type: the author just had no idea anything is wrong.
It's likely less true of sorta-calligraphic lettering of Matisse EB―but I still wonder if compression just wasn't seen as much of a deal.
It's likely less true of sorta-calligraphic lettering of Matisse EB―but I still wonder if compression just wasn't seen as much of a deal.
Here's a great article why so many Chinese goods are printed with those ugly latin characters: https://www.artlebedev.com/mandership/183/
One point that the article doesn't make very clear is, Chinese fonts have Western characters that occupy the same space as the hieroglyphs—seemingly so that mixed-language text follows the hanzi grid. (Afaik Unicode even has wide-proportioned versions of some punctuation—dot and comma—specifically for embedding in hanzi text. But dunno if it had widespace Latin or other Western letters.)
Not sure, though, if monospace Latin characters are really a requirement for mixed-language texts in the Chinese market. If it is, then new fonts will have to incorporate it. However, typesetting on exported Chinese goods should follow Western practices, and that will probably mean convincing the designers that Western letters work differently.
Not sure, though, if monospace Latin characters are really a requirement for mixed-language texts in the Chinese market. If it is, then new fonts will have to incorporate it. However, typesetting on exported Chinese goods should follow Western practices, and that will probably mean convincing the designers that Western letters work differently.
Unicode has two additional copies of whole ASCII, fullwidth and halfwidth with the expectation that the widths would match the Han character grid (strictly speaking the halfwidth variant is somewhat redundant, but it is there).
On the other hand I think that the ugly latin fonts on chinese goods (and also the amount of completely redundant and nonsensical labels like “Fan”, “LED”...) has completely different reason: nobody simply cares about that.
On the other hand I think that the ugly latin fonts on chinese goods (and also the amount of completely redundant and nonsensical labels like “Fan”, “LED”...) has completely different reason: nobody simply cares about that.
> But dunno if it had widespace Latin or other Western letters.
Yes, U+FF01–U+FF5E is a ‘full width’ copy of printable ASCII (U+0021–U+007E).
Ｙｅｓ， Ｕ＋ＦＦ０１－Ｕ＋ＦＦ５Ｅ ｉｓ ａ ｀ｆｕｌｌ ｗｉｄｔｈ＇ ｃｏｐｙ ｏｆ ｐｒｉｎｔａｂｌｅ ＡＳＣＩＩ （Ｕ＋００２１－Ｕ＋００７Ｅ）．
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halfwidth_and_Fullwidth_Forms_...
Yes, U+FF01–U+FF5E is a ‘full width’ copy of printable ASCII (U+0021–U+007E).
Ｙｅｓ， Ｕ＋ＦＦ０１－Ｕ＋ＦＦ５Ｅ ｉｓ ａ ｀ｆｕｌｌ ｗｉｄｔｈ＇ ｃｏｐｙ ｏｆ ｐｒｉｎｔａｂｌｅ ＡＳＣＩＩ （Ｕ＋００２１－Ｕ＋００７Ｅ）．
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halfwidth_and_Fullwidth_Forms_...
The answer seems to be that the only company that makes Chinese fonts just doesn't give a fuck about the latin characters.
In its proper use as setting a few words of foreign languages in a mostly Chinese text, the fonts succeed in their job.
> proportions of a character don't matter much―they're just strokes in a grid that you can squish without harm to legibility.
I'd say that's even less true than it is for latin letters.
I'd say that's even less true than it is for latin letters.
Specifically, apart from observation of hanzi and kanji being written with random proportions instead of square, I can't help noticing some patterns, like in the following cases:
日 月 明
女 子 好
金 不 鈈
虫 古 月 蝴
As far as I can see, all these keep the same proportions and occupy the same space.
日 月 明
女 子 好
金 不 鈈
虫 古 月 蝴
As far as I can see, all these keep the same proportions and occupy the same space.
I just finished Neon Genesis: Evangelion last month and was completely blown away by it! The intro alone is by far one of the most iconic in the genre.
Really neat to see this!
Really neat to see this!
If you are a fan of title card sequences check out cowboy bebop.
Hah, I just started that show last week and I an loving it so far! Any other recommendations?
Another anime series that asks big questions is Serial Experiments Lain.
It's about a young girl who gets into computers and learns about a parallel world of networked communication called the Wired. The Wired is like VR/AR/internet/chat rooms all in one.
It's only 13 episodes, so it's not a huge time investment, but really interesting. It covers computer hackers, Vannevar Bush's Memex, and more. It's also a bit like a David Lynch story, as it has its own dream logic that doesn't always correspond to what you expect.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_Experiments_Lain
It's about a young girl who gets into computers and learns about a parallel world of networked communication called the Wired. The Wired is like VR/AR/internet/chat rooms all in one.
It's only 13 episodes, so it's not a huge time investment, but really interesting. It covers computer hackers, Vannevar Bush's Memex, and more. It's also a bit like a David Lynch story, as it has its own dream logic that doesn't always correspond to what you expect.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_Experiments_Lain
I'll second this one. Most of the people in my office who watch anime have all said that SEL played a part in their path in life. It's fun to watch, it has some great artwork, and it's still surprisingly relevant. Just don't expect it to make sense for a long time.
Ghost in the Shell, 1995. Amazing film.
Ghost in the Shell Stand Alone Complex as well.
Gurren Lagann
Trigun
Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood (better remake of the 2003 series)
One Punch Man
Demon Slayer
Akira
Redline
FLCL
Trigun
Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood (better remake of the 2003 series)
One Punch Man
Demon Slayer
Akira
Redline
FLCL
Also, Kill La Kill.
It’s by the same director as Gurren Lagann, and is a strange mix of excessive fan service and reverse Bechdel Test failure.
It’s by the same director as Gurren Lagann, and is a strange mix of excessive fan service and reverse Bechdel Test failure.
These are all great suggestions but I think it would be helpful to give a small intro to some of them as they are not quite what they seem on the surface. For example, "Kill La Kill" is mostly about exposing the absurdity of fan service in Anime. "One Punch Man" shows that being the best at something is actually the worst thing ever. And "FLCL" is really weird - I truly don't know what it's trying to say.
I watched it at least 6 times and still notice new things. The characters are just really well written and the soundtrack is awesome.
One thing I love about anime is that when the authors really want to drive home a thematic concept they throw in these humble observations about the human condition and demonstrate it in the most absurd contexts.
Evangelion does this. I would highly recommend Mob Psycho 100 for this as well (by the one punch man guy, and similar but not sarcastic)
Evangelion does this. I would highly recommend Mob Psycho 100 for this as well (by the one punch man guy, and similar but not sarcastic)
The first season of Psycho Pass is really good in this regard as well (second season not so much). Some of the best sci-fi I’ve seen in a long time.
I really enjoyed one of the more subtle points the Psycho Pass movie made as well, reflected in the dynamic between two different shots involving two of the main characters in the film. It drives home the point about the difference between a technical victory and a lasting cultural victory.
Just rewatched the series now that it's out on Netflix, I really loved the aesthetic of NERV HQ digital screens. A nice mix of digital and older style fonts.
Had no idea this landed on Netflix. I've been in search of somewhere to rewatch for years now. This might be enough to get me to resubscribe for a month.
It's on Netflix with poor-quality subs and missing soundtrack pieces, though - you'd get a better experience from "other" sources.
What on earth possessed them to commission new subtitles? I can understand replacing "Fly Me to The Moon" in the ending - clearly licensing cost - but the new subtitles radically changed the meaning of some scenes, and not in a way that seems to match the original intent of the writers.
For me, NGE was both the best and the worst anime had to offer. On one hand, the music, art style and the fights were amazing. On the other hand, I found most characters downright disgusting (mostly Shinji and Asuka).
A detail I really like is how they made the user interfaces part of the story telling. The computer screens are displayed clearly and it allows the audience to interpret the information just like the characters.
Seeing the mecha switch from external to internal power and start a five minute countdown is pretty chilling. Jet Alone booting up version 2.2.1c and then reverting back to 2.1.1c without Misato's intervention confirms that it was sabotaged. When Shinji and Asuka's combined synchronization rate with EVA-02 peaks, we know they have won. Episode 13 visually depicts the angel taking over NERV's super computers: one triggers the self-destruct, the other two overrule it and the angel starts invading the other computers. End of Evangelion also revisits this: we know Ritsuko's plan has failed because one of the computers refused to comply.
2001: A Space Odyssey is the earliest example I know of this kind of story telling. The space ship's computer kills the sleeping crew: their vital signs slowly flatline one by one and in a specific order.
https://youtu.be/Z4n3dbPqk58
Seeing the mecha switch from external to internal power and start a five minute countdown is pretty chilling. Jet Alone booting up version 2.2.1c and then reverting back to 2.1.1c without Misato's intervention confirms that it was sabotaged. When Shinji and Asuka's combined synchronization rate with EVA-02 peaks, we know they have won. Episode 13 visually depicts the angel taking over NERV's super computers: one triggers the self-destruct, the other two overrule it and the angel starts invading the other computers. End of Evangelion also revisits this: we know Ritsuko's plan has failed because one of the computers refused to comply.
2001: A Space Odyssey is the earliest example I know of this kind of story telling. The space ship's computer kills the sleeping crew: their vital signs slowly flatline one by one and in a specific order.
https://youtu.be/Z4n3dbPqk58
For me, the broken and flawed characters/relationships were what made the show more than just another action anime.
>On the other hand, I found most characters downright disgusting (mostly Shinji and Asuka).
Good. That was the intent.
Good. That was the intent.
[deleted]
I think that’s kind of part of the story? It’s about kids handed a dying world, a world whose death their parents selfishly brought about, and devolving into madness and nihilism as a result. They’re conscripted into work that has no real purpose other than propping up the existing order and justifying its instrumental, destructive logic.
I watched it again recently and it struck me as incredibly relevant and a prescient warning about the trajectory of contemporary society, especially in the face of climate change. I mean, the entire setting is nearly flooded following a catastrophic event at one of the poles...
I watched it again recently and it struck me as incredibly relevant and a prescient warning about the trajectory of contemporary society, especially in the face of climate change. I mean, the entire setting is nearly flooded following a catastrophic event at one of the poles...
yeah i hear that a lot about Evangelion its like, just watch some Gundam or something dude.
The characters being so overwhelmingly flawed is a big part of what makes Evangelion what it is. You might as well say a museum is great except for all the exhibits.
The characters being so overwhelmingly flawed is a big part of what makes Evangelion what it is. You might as well say a museum is great except for all the exhibits.
The whole point of Evangelion is a lot of these people are mentally unwell. Watching Evangelion for the “fights” only works up to the 5th or so episode.. after that most of the violence is psychological (there are a couple of opponents which are ONLY psychological)
That’s why it’s considered good by the people who consider it good (I think it’s brilliant and one of the greatest pieces of motion art of the last century) - because although it can be classified as “mecha” anime it’s really about damaged people. There are plenty of great pieces of motion art that are not about damaged people. Evangelion is not one of them.
That’s why it’s considered good by the people who consider it good (I think it’s brilliant and one of the greatest pieces of motion art of the last century) - because although it can be classified as “mecha” anime it’s really about damaged people. There are plenty of great pieces of motion art that are not about damaged people. Evangelion is not one of them.
Not to mention the pace killing scenes where nothing happens for minutes at a time. They paid for those incredible fight scenes with interminable shots of the interior of elevators or close ups of Shinji's walkman.
Different strokes for different folks, but I found their willingness to let a scene breathe (even to the point of absurdity) a wonderful counterpoint to the fight scenes.
The show is not about mecha fighting monsters... it's about the spaces in between people, and how we fail and succeed to connect. The elevator scene, Misato and Kaji, Shinji's tape player, Shinji and Kaworu... those are some of my favorite scenes because they show the connection or disconnection between the characters.
Yes, it does save them money to not have to animate. Art always has to deal with the limitations of the medium, in this case budget.
The show is not about mecha fighting monsters... it's about the spaces in between people, and how we fail and succeed to connect. The elevator scene, Misato and Kaji, Shinji's tape player, Shinji and Kaworu... those are some of my favorite scenes because they show the connection or disconnection between the characters.
Yes, it does save them money to not have to animate. Art always has to deal with the limitations of the medium, in this case budget.
I liked the shots of power lines with cicadas chirping.
Best part of the series.
Best part of the series.
Well, I have some good news for you! You may also be interested in literally every anime that came out after Eva with a city setting.
May I recommend Serial Experiments Lain for more power lines and cicadas goodness? As every Anime sound director knows, those obnoxious bugs are the only available auditory shorthand for "it's summer".
May I recommend Serial Experiments Lain for more power lines and cicadas goodness? As every Anime sound director knows, those obnoxious bugs are the only available auditory shorthand for "it's summer".
Excellent recommendation. SEL always tops the lists of cicada connoisseur lists like https://thehardtimes.net/harddrive/we-ranked-animes-top-10-s...
I realise you jest slightly, due to the very overdone cicadas... but I had to jump in to add; Serial Experiments Lain is seriously a 10/10 anime. I'd strongly recommend it to anyone.
One scene that sticks out to me after all these years is a brief 2 minute scene from 'End of Evangelion' where Rei is talking to Shinji about the nature of dreams.
In the background you can hear Bach's Jesu Joy of Man's Desiring being played on a piano and it transitions from animation to filmed live action footage which I think was shot around Tokyo it shows things like train lines, buildings and an empty swing set in a playground and yes there is a power line shot. Then it cuts to an audience watching a film inside a cinema as handwritten letters flash up on the screen, which were death threats the studio had received from obsessive fans.
I was blown away by the aesthetics of this scene watching it as a 15 year old and it's stuck with me.
In the background you can hear Bach's Jesu Joy of Man's Desiring being played on a piano and it transitions from animation to filmed live action footage which I think was shot around Tokyo it shows things like train lines, buildings and an empty swing set in a playground and yes there is a power line shot. Then it cuts to an audience watching a film inside a cinema as handwritten letters flash up on the screen, which were death threats the studio had received from obsessive fans.
I was blown away by the aesthetics of this scene watching it as a 15 year old and it's stuck with me.
Just rewatched that scene (happens at around 1:16:00). The first time I watched that scene in particular I had to pause it because I was flabbergasted that they were so clearly breaking the fourth wall.
After the... unfortunate opening scene of the movie I hadn't rewatched it but every time I see even a small clip of anything from Eva (the movie or the show) I'm just enamored. Hideaki Anno is one of the greatest artists of our time just from NGE and Shin Godzilla. It felt like every frame of the original anime was perfect.
After the... unfortunate opening scene of the movie I hadn't rewatched it but every time I see even a small clip of anything from Eva (the movie or the show) I'm just enamored. Hideaki Anno is one of the greatest artists of our time just from NGE and Shin Godzilla. It felt like every frame of the original anime was perfect.
> They paid for those incredible fight scenes with interminable shots
Almost literally, since the still shots happened after the budget was cut.
Almost literally, since the still shots happened after the budget was cut.
Interestingly, the thick vertical strokes and skinny horizontal strokes you see in the Chinese characters in some of those fonts are the result of one individual's[0] personal style being adopted as the standard for non-cursive calligraphy;
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Zhenqing
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yan_Zhenqing
The famous calligraphers' styles were used in early woodblock printing, but the Song/Ming style you see nowadays are more rightly said to be influenced by the constraints of printing.
A way to think about this is that Western serif typefaces come from unical script, but their present standard forms are more rightly said to be influenced by the limitations of metal type.
file:///home/jhanschoo/Downloads/PJACNS-1(2015)-3-Lin.pdf
https://www.sljfaq.org/afaq/shotai-printed.html
A way to think about this is that Western serif typefaces come from unical script, but their present standard forms are more rightly said to be influenced by the limitations of metal type.
file:///home/jhanschoo/Downloads/PJACNS-1(2015)-3-Lin.pdf
https://www.sljfaq.org/afaq/shotai-printed.html
That makes sense, I guess I was focusing in on a particular font in the article that clearly has the mark of Yan Zhenqing's style. I'm talking about whatever font is used in the characters 使使 over the red background. Even the shape of the downward left pie strokes is distinctly Yan's style.
Maybe that's just a testament to the distinctiveness of his style that it is still clear even after being adapted to the constraints of printing, or it might also just be that particular font?
Maybe that's just a testament to the distinctiveness of his style that it is still clear even after being adapted to the constraints of printing, or it might also just be that particular font?
Or maybe, just like all the symbolism, it was chosen at random because it looked cool. More work went into this analyses than the original font selection process.
That's sort of how art works, though. You hone your sensibility as an artist, and then you 'know it when you see it'. Anno et al looked at the fonts, and they saw it was good. Explaining why it's good is quite another thing altogether. Artists are always being surprised by how things 'click' or how the viewer notices patterns the artists weren't even (consciously) aware of putting in. (And to a certain degree, if you could adequately explain and convey it in words, why would you bother with the art in the first place?)
I've been using NNs to generate poems and Irish music lately based on pairwise comparison of poems/music (based on https://openai.com/blog/fine-tuning-gpt-2/ ), and it's definitely striking how fast I can make the evaluation of which one is better, but then how long it would take to reread or relisten to them and verbalize what exactly made one better than the other.
I've been using NNs to generate poems and Irish music lately based on pairwise comparison of poems/music (based on https://openai.com/blog/fine-tuning-gpt-2/ ), and it's definitely striking how fast I can make the evaluation of which one is better, but then how long it would take to reread or relisten to them and verbalize what exactly made one better than the other.
Apparently Anno is particularly passionate about Matisse EB. He uses it so many other places outside of NGE that it's become not just a "NGE font" but also a "Hideaki Anno font".
It probably wasn’t chose at _random_ even if there wasn’t a lot of thought that went into it. It was still an artistic decision.
When I used to DJ a lot, I would go to the record store and listen to dozens of records over the course of an hour or two and buy a handful of them. If you asked me in the store why I bought them, I might just say, because I liked it. Sometimes I had only listened to 30 seconds of it and that was enough.
But ‘I liked it’ hides a lot of inputs. I might have liked it because it reminded me of another song I liked, or because it had a key change that felt emotional or it had a beat that fit in with another record I liked, and if you asked me to dig into my reasoning for any of them at length, I could have probably come up with a few aspects that fed into why I bought it. In most cases they’re just post hoc rationalizations because when you’re digging through all the new releases you don’t have time to think of that stuff, but that doesn’t mean they’re not legitimate explanations.
When I used to DJ a lot, I would go to the record store and listen to dozens of records over the course of an hour or two and buy a handful of them. If you asked me in the store why I bought them, I might just say, because I liked it. Sometimes I had only listened to 30 seconds of it and that was enough.
But ‘I liked it’ hides a lot of inputs. I might have liked it because it reminded me of another song I liked, or because it had a key change that felt emotional or it had a beat that fit in with another record I liked, and if you asked me to dig into my reasoning for any of them at length, I could have probably come up with a few aspects that fed into why I bought it. In most cases they’re just post hoc rationalizations because when you’re digging through all the new releases you don’t have time to think of that stuff, but that doesn’t mean they’re not legitimate explanations.
But why does it "look cool"?
Most difficult things work like this. The top performers in many complex tasks operate from pure intuition, and backtracking what their choices actually mean is a much more time intensive process.
Doing things quickly and just because the author feels like it's a good move does not necessarily mean the decision is not based on decades of experience and preliminary work.
Doing things quickly and just because the author feels like it's a good move does not necessarily mean the decision is not based on decades of experience and preliminary work.
I ('m apparently the last person in the world who) just watched this show for the first time recently. It had its cool moments and was an overall positive experience, but the reliance on outdated (even then) freudian ideas hurts it a bit. Not to mention the slideshows.
I think that if you read it symbolically it doesn't really matter whether the psychological model is inaccurate. This is why literary critics still use Freud in discussions. It's not about whether the model is accurate; the point is that these symbols provide a set of archetypes that we can then relate other things to. Freudian stuff in art criticism (when used well) is more of a shared vocabulary for discussing things than a reductive framework.
Not sure if that's your gripe. I used to dislike Freudian language/themes for a similar reason but realize now that I was taking it more literally than I now do.
Not sure if that's your gripe. I used to dislike Freudian language/themes for a similar reason but realize now that I was taking it more literally than I now do.
I would recommend anyone who have seen all the material to watch The Curse of Evangelion (39min) [1]
It meta analyzes the series and movies in chronological order. It explains the director's message to the fans about escapism from reality and the dangers of it.
The first EVA series had a massive impact on the anime industry in a bad way; It create more obsessed fans who escape from reality with it and make their lives miserable, even though the series talks about the dangers of it.
Rebuild (released 14 years later) criticizes the impact and how fans misinterpreted the earlier series. He sends a message that you (the obsessed fan) can rebuild your life for the better and stop escaping reality.
As a somewhat obsessed anime watcher it hit pretty close to home. I think the director is sad how early EVA and the impact it had, helped create more hikikomoris[2] instead of less.
I might remembered some stuff wrong above, it was a while ago I saw it.
[1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHIvs0Q-uKI [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hikikomori
It meta analyzes the series and movies in chronological order. It explains the director's message to the fans about escapism from reality and the dangers of it.
The first EVA series had a massive impact on the anime industry in a bad way; It create more obsessed fans who escape from reality with it and make their lives miserable, even though the series talks about the dangers of it.
Rebuild (released 14 years later) criticizes the impact and how fans misinterpreted the earlier series. He sends a message that you (the obsessed fan) can rebuild your life for the better and stop escaping reality.
As a somewhat obsessed anime watcher it hit pretty close to home. I think the director is sad how early EVA and the impact it had, helped create more hikikomoris[2] instead of less.
I might remembered some stuff wrong above, it was a while ago I saw it.
[1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHIvs0Q-uKI [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hikikomori
It was ahead of its time and was during the golden era of anime.
There is one more anime that comes to mind if we're talking about typography - Bakemonogatari. Throughout the series still images are shown containing vital information about the thoughts of characters, events' second meaning, puns, etc. Sometimes split second only, sometimes in a fast slides. Really novel and interesting take on animation.
Example: https://youtu.be/-jm-xrO2c_0 (first 30 seconds shows one of the still images and there's much more)
Example: https://youtu.be/-jm-xrO2c_0 (first 30 seconds shows one of the still images and there's much more)
> After starting out as a typical mechanical-robot (“mecha”) anime, Evangelion gradually evolved into an existentialist deconstruction of its own genre, immediately winning critical acclaim.
What does that mean?
What does that mean?
As someone said in the replies to this, Evangelion is, in a way, to giant-robot anime what Watchmen is to superhero comics.
Happiness ends after episode 13. The next couple episodes are somewhat depressing but everything starts truly falling apart in episode 16 and it only gets worse from there. The characters never recover.
It's a parody of Gundam and other mecha anime.
Slightly OT: The image "Key poster for Evangelion 2.0: You Can (Not) Advance." gives a nice 3d-ish effect on my OLED display. The white letters seem embossed into the red background.
What does "mechanical compression" mean, exactly? Googling "mechanical compression typography" turns up this article as the first result.
Fonts aren't just images. Characters have certain visual features we rely on to differentiate them from each other. When characters are scaled in size, the scaling is usually not done in a uniform manner - instead, the less significant features are scaled differently than the more visually significant features so as to minimize the loss of legibility.
In this context, "mechanical compression" means that the fonts were stretched and/or squashed as if they were mere images - without concern to whether the typographic features would be preserved.
In this context, "mechanical compression" means that the fonts were stretched and/or squashed as if they were mere images - without concern to whether the typographic features would be preserved.
Based on this part of the article:
The decision to use mechanical compression instead of commissioning a compressed-width variant...
it appears that "mechanical compression" refers to rendering the text in the standard font, and then reducing the horizontal width of the rendered text after-the-fact.
it appears that "mechanical compression" refers to rendering the text in the standard font, and then reducing the horizontal width of the rendered text after-the-fact.
[deleted]
In this case, changing the width but not the height of the text. Scaling in a way that doesn't maintain the aspect ratio.
I think it simply means the strokes are pretty densely packed. Kanji is very complex structure wise, bold typefaces such as this needs to utilize space carefully otherwise some strokes will become indistinguishable
The Internet is such a beautiful place: Would never thought about that on my own, but it's great to read this and know about it!
When you see the list of fonts used at the end it looks like nothing special. But the way they used it in context works really well.
This is a great, detailed article. Wish I could mega-upvote.
Nevangelion is such a good anime.
Typography is such an art
I watched End of Evangelion for the first time in 15 years
Still entertaining, great animation that stands the test of time, but wow I wish I can go tell my teenage self that it actually doesnt make sense, the symbolism has no point whatsoever but Judeo-Christian dogma is “foreign and cool“ and the writers eventually admit it and everyone had a good time making it
I watched End of Evangelion for the first time in 15 years
Still entertaining, great animation that stands the test of time, but wow I wish I can go tell my teenage self that it actually doesnt make sense, the symbolism has no point whatsoever but Judeo-Christian dogma is “foreign and cool“ and the writers eventually admit it and everyone had a good time making it
The use of Christian symbolism as nothing more than an aesthetic is somewhat common is Japanese fiction. I wouldn’t say it made no sense though.
The bad guys say humanity is fundamentally incapable of opening up to each other. Shinji proves that it can be done and is worth pursuing, although it is fundamentally difficult. He discovers acceptance of himself through his connections with his peers. He acknowledges that everyone must go through life at a pace they don’t get to choose, and that the inevitably of death doesn’t erase the meaning of existence.
The bad guys say humanity is fundamentally incapable of opening up to each other. Shinji proves that it can be done and is worth pursuing, although it is fundamentally difficult. He discovers acceptance of himself through his connections with his peers. He acknowledges that everyone must go through life at a pace they don’t get to choose, and that the inevitably of death doesn’t erase the meaning of existence.
Anno isn't an idiot.
This comment, while oft repeated, is simply not true. There is plenty of symbolism going on in the show. There is a lot of PoMo "mask on top of a mask" stuff going on with the biblical references, but some stuff is more on the nose. There are plenty of articles on this, including this one: https://reelrundown.com/animation/Symbolism-in-Neon-Genesis-...
This comment, while oft repeated, is simply not true. There is plenty of symbolism going on in the show. There is a lot of PoMo "mask on top of a mask" stuff going on with the biblical references, but some stuff is more on the nose. There are plenty of articles on this, including this one: https://reelrundown.com/animation/Symbolism-in-Neon-Genesis-...
There's plenty of symbolism but there's no deeper plot, no master plan.
Eva is a great anime series and a solid 'philosophy exists if you want to check it out' message for 12 year olds that worked for me back in the day, but let's not go overboard with assigning deep interpretations to it.
Eva is a great anime series and a solid 'philosophy exists if you want to check it out' message for 12 year olds that worked for me back in the day, but let's not go overboard with assigning deep interpretations to it.
I'm 99% sure that I read an interview in which Anno said that he included the Christian symbolism simply because he thought it looked cool. Of course, that doesn't exclude the possibilty of it still making sense somehow.
I can't quite get a read on Anno. Sometimes he'll answer a question like who's his favorite character almost flippantly with "Asuka, because she's cute" and sometimes he'll describe Eva as being almost autobiographical and diagnosing himself as stuck at the Fruedian oral stage and fundamentally disliking living things.
He's also described Eva as like a puzzle, and not wanting to give answers and instead let people come up with their own interpretations.
I guess what I'm trying to say is I both wouldn't be surprised if he did pull much of the visual symbolism out of a hat, or if he did come across it while exploring western philosophy and decided to incorporate it.
There's some great bits in Extra Curricular Lesson with Hideaki Anno, like him talking about disliking the parts of what he makes he sees himself in or sleeping through a fire in his apartment.
https://youtu.be/rGJ_Kq8qifQ?t=429
He's also described Eva as like a puzzle, and not wanting to give answers and instead let people come up with their own interpretations.
I guess what I'm trying to say is I both wouldn't be surprised if he did pull much of the visual symbolism out of a hat, or if he did come across it while exploring western philosophy and decided to incorporate it.
There's some great bits in Extra Curricular Lesson with Hideaki Anno, like him talking about disliking the parts of what he makes he sees himself in or sleeping through a fire in his apartment.
https://youtu.be/rGJ_Kq8qifQ?t=429
ah yes the classic "but which symbolism" rebuttal. predictable, there are great plot points, but ultimately there is no deeper meaning to a lot of it. There are crosses for the sake of crosses, and there are crucifixions for the sake of crucifixions, there are crosses popping out of forehead vagina eye sockets for the sake of crosses popping out of forehead vagina eye sockets
I mean, your comment doesn't really deserve a real rebuttal. You just state something as fact without any supporting evidence.
At least the person replying provided some evidence to their counter-claim.
I have no idea who is right, but you're not making anything close to an argument for your point here.
At least the person replying provided some evidence to their counter-claim.
I have no idea who is right, but you're not making anything close to an argument for your point here.
It was a Japanese show for a Japanese audience and Christian symbolism means something very different to them than it does to us. He might not have used the symbolism in the way that a western audience would have, but the connection between Christian symbolism and the West and in particular America would not have been lost on a country which had within living memory had a couple of atomic bombs dropped on them by a foreign army bringing Christian symbolism with them.
It’s almost impossible to understand any 80s or 90s anime without the context of Hiroshima and the occupation.
It’s almost impossible to understand any 80s or 90s anime without the context of Hiroshima and the occupation.
The creator of the series definitely thinks a lot about Hiroshima and the occupation. Its extremely evident in the live action movie Shin Godzilla that he also directed (its a great movie, check it out if you can, very unlike any Godzilla movie I've seen before). Not to spoil too much but the postwar relationship between the US and Japan is a major theme and the film includes a 10 second silent cutaway where photographs of the destruction of Hiroshima/Nagasaki are shown.
>but the connection between Christian symbolism and the West and in particular America would not have been lost on a country which had within living memory had a couple of atomic bombs dropped on them by a foreign army bringing Christian symbolism with them.
Japan was aware of Christianity and Christian symbolism long before the Americans dropped the atomic bombs, with missionary attempts going as far back as the 15th century, or thereabouts[0], so America really didn't "bring Christian symbolism with them" as a foreign army at that time.
Arguably, it was fear of the growing influence of Christians and their possible allegiance to the Pope threatening the Shogunate's power base (ironically, a similar fear that Americans would have of electing JFK, that he would be a puppet of the Vatican) which led to the Sakoku period and Japan committing genocide against its Christian population[1], forcing the religion underground.
I'm not disputing the analysis you're presenting - there is obviously a lot of symbolism in anime relating to the atomic bombings and occupation, but I wouldn't go so far as to imply that Japan sees Christian symbolism generally as being emblematic of that. Oftentimes it's just a visual metaphor for "the West" in general, or an attempt at "foreign" mystique[2] particularly when supernatural or magical elements are presented, where A lot of anime characters will recite spells or special moves in English because it sounds cool.
[0]https://www.tofugu.com/japan/history-of-christianity/
[1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakoku#Rationale
[2]https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AnimeCatholicism
Japan was aware of Christianity and Christian symbolism long before the Americans dropped the atomic bombs, with missionary attempts going as far back as the 15th century, or thereabouts[0], so America really didn't "bring Christian symbolism with them" as a foreign army at that time.
Arguably, it was fear of the growing influence of Christians and their possible allegiance to the Pope threatening the Shogunate's power base (ironically, a similar fear that Americans would have of electing JFK, that he would be a puppet of the Vatican) which led to the Sakoku period and Japan committing genocide against its Christian population[1], forcing the religion underground.
I'm not disputing the analysis you're presenting - there is obviously a lot of symbolism in anime relating to the atomic bombings and occupation, but I wouldn't go so far as to imply that Japan sees Christian symbolism generally as being emblematic of that. Oftentimes it's just a visual metaphor for "the West" in general, or an attempt at "foreign" mystique[2] particularly when supernatural or magical elements are presented, where A lot of anime characters will recite spells or special moves in English because it sounds cool.
[0]https://www.tofugu.com/japan/history-of-christianity/
[1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sakoku#Rationale
[2]https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AnimeCatholicism
Much of the Christian symbolism is just there for the sake of aesthetics, but this is less so true for the Jewish (and especially Kabbalistic) imagery - there's actually a lot of overlap between the plot of Evangelion and themes from Lurianic Kabbalah (especially the notion of the ein sof and the traditional interpretation of tikkun olam, which is reflected in the Human Instrumentality Project), so the visual/aesthetic nods to it are a nice touch.
NGE asked a lot of interesting questions about the nature of reality and humanity’s relationship to itself, but I think it intentionally left the answers up to the audience’s interpretation.
Not a bad way to go, but personally I felt was unsatisfying because I was a bit spoiled in having first seen Gurren Lagann, which I felt was far more concrete about the message it was trying to convey, and definitively answered one of the central questions asked by NGE: when a young person is forced into a desperate life-and-death situation, and comes to believe in the self that believes in them, what happens next?
Not a bad way to go, but personally I felt was unsatisfying because I was a bit spoiled in having first seen Gurren Lagann, which I felt was far more concrete about the message it was trying to convey, and definitively answered one of the central questions asked by NGE: when a young person is forced into a desperate life-and-death situation, and comes to believe in the self that believes in them, what happens next?
Gurren Lagann goes way off the rails in the last few episodes too. I enjoyed that as well. Never thought of it spoiling anyone from enjoying a trendsetting predecessor.
TTGL definitely gets whacky plotwise in the last few episodes but I don’t think it ever lost focus on its central themes at any point.
From all the buzz I’d heard from friends and on the internet about NGE, I was ready to be bawling by the end with a tsunami of emotion. Not that it’s without precedent: TTGL, Kill La Kill, and Darling in the FranXX, to give some examples, have had me (and my partner) in tears at several points. And yet at the end of NGE (both the series and EoE) I just sat there like “...ok, that was interesting. Lots to ponder over. Also...what?”
I read through the wiki and thought a lot about the plot and themes afterwards, but it didn’t really speak to me on an emotional level. Maybe it was just me.
From all the buzz I’d heard from friends and on the internet about NGE, I was ready to be bawling by the end with a tsunami of emotion. Not that it’s without precedent: TTGL, Kill La Kill, and Darling in the FranXX, to give some examples, have had me (and my partner) in tears at several points. And yet at the end of NGE (both the series and EoE) I just sat there like “...ok, that was interesting. Lots to ponder over. Also...what?”
I read through the wiki and thought a lot about the plot and themes afterwards, but it didn’t really speak to me on an emotional level. Maybe it was just me.
I see, I just enjoyed it and the mystery, the attention to detail, animation, direction choices
No tearjerkers from the twists or relationships, maybe just from the fun and perplexing outcomes rendered awesomely
Whiny angsty awkward teenagers are annoying, Gurren Lagaan doesnt have a main character like that which is refreshing but I never really considered comparing them - do a lot of people put them in the same category because mecha?
I would recommend NGE for the entertainment and mindfuckery
No tearjerkers from the twists or relationships, maybe just from the fun and perplexing outcomes rendered awesomely
Whiny angsty awkward teenagers are annoying, Gurren Lagaan doesnt have a main character like that which is refreshing but I never really considered comparing them - do a lot of people put them in the same category because mecha?
I would recommend NGE for the entertainment and mindfuckery
I think they fit in similar categories because many mecha animes deal with themes of exponential escalation, which I suspect was heavily influenced by the collective national experience of a total war that culminated in daily firebombings of cities, and ultimately (being on the receiving end of) the only wartime use of nuclear weapons in history.
However, both series deal with that escalation in different ways. While in TTGL, the escalation is purely physical - the villains get perpetually stronger and the heroes have to strengthen themselves to stand up to them - the escalation in NGE is more personal.
“Why do you pilot the Eva?”, Shinji asks Rei and Asuka, a question with an answer seemingly so obvious that nobody else in the entire series asks it. And yet it gets to the heart of Shinji’s development.
In the beginning, he’s a terrified teenager who is in way over his head. As time goes on, he becomes more confident in his ability to pilot the Eva, yet his experiences leave him a shattered husk of a human being.
I think (and this somewhat gets into spoiler territory for anyone that hasn’t seen NGE yet) that the answer to the question of what happens when someone is put through so much trauma that it destroys who they are is that there is nothing in a void. Community can help repair the damage but some things can’t simply be handled by the self, no matter how hard one tries, how dearly they want it, or how capable they are at other things. At least, that’s the impression I got from the ending.
However, both series deal with that escalation in different ways. While in TTGL, the escalation is purely physical - the villains get perpetually stronger and the heroes have to strengthen themselves to stand up to them - the escalation in NGE is more personal.
“Why do you pilot the Eva?”, Shinji asks Rei and Asuka, a question with an answer seemingly so obvious that nobody else in the entire series asks it. And yet it gets to the heart of Shinji’s development.
In the beginning, he’s a terrified teenager who is in way over his head. As time goes on, he becomes more confident in his ability to pilot the Eva, yet his experiences leave him a shattered husk of a human being.
I think (and this somewhat gets into spoiler territory for anyone that hasn’t seen NGE yet) that the answer to the question of what happens when someone is put through so much trauma that it destroys who they are is that there is nothing in a void. Community can help repair the damage but some things can’t simply be handled by the self, no matter how hard one tries, how dearly they want it, or how capable they are at other things. At least, that’s the impression I got from the ending.
>writers eventually admit
Excuse me sir, do you have a moment to talk about or lord and saviour, Death of the Author?
Excuse me sir, do you have a moment to talk about or lord and saviour, Death of the Author?
> Judeo-Christian dogma is “foreign and cool“ and the writers eventually admit it
Any reference?
Any reference?
I'm sure there's counter-references to be found but I imagine the parent is thinking of things like this, from an interview with assistant director Kazuya Tsurumaki:
> Can you explain the symbolism of the cross in Evangelion?
? KT: There are a lot of giant robot shows in Japan, and we did want our story to have a religious theme to help distinguish us. Because Christianity is an uncommon religion in Japan we thought it would be mysterious. None of the staff who worked on Eva are Christians. There is no actual Christian meaning to the show, we just thought the visual symbols of Christianity look cool. If we had known the show would get distributed in the US and Europe we might have rethought that choice.
http://web.archive.org/web/20020622231224/http://www.akadot....
> Can you explain the symbolism of the cross in Evangelion?
? KT: There are a lot of giant robot shows in Japan, and we did want our story to have a religious theme to help distinguish us. Because Christianity is an uncommon religion in Japan we thought it would be mysterious. None of the staff who worked on Eva are Christians. There is no actual Christian meaning to the show, we just thought the visual symbols of Christianity look cool. If we had known the show would get distributed in the US and Europe we might have rethought that choice.
http://web.archive.org/web/20020622231224/http://www.akadot....
not sure Westerners are in a place to criticize given that we love to thoughtlessly appropriate Hindu/Buddhist imagery all over the place in our culture
personally I love this aspect of Evangelion because it makes me examine my own orientalist biases
personally I love this aspect of Evangelion because it makes me examine my own orientalist biases
The anime "Haunted Junction" is fun in this regard.
The main characters are the son of Buddhist monk, a Shinto shrine priestess, and the son of a Christian minister; they protect their school from spiritual dangers.
If an eastern monk can be a D&D class, then why not Christian minister?
The main characters are the son of Buddhist monk, a Shinto shrine priestess, and the son of a Christian minister; they protect their school from spiritual dangers.
If an eastern monk can be a D&D class, then why not Christian minister?
> the symbolism has no point whatsoever but Judeo-Christian dogma is “foreign and cool“
All those wasted hours in Geocities pages during the late 90s looking for interpretations and explanations...
All those wasted hours in Geocities pages during the late 90s looking for interpretations and explanations...
I found the mechanical compression the most interesting part of this. I suspect it started out as limited technical aptitude and/or an "efficiency hack", but has since morphed into an actual stylistic decision that both makes thematic sense[1] and sets NGE apart. To the point now that it might be harder to do mechanical compression than just use a condensed font variant[2].
[1] "[the mechanical compression's] ubiquitous occurrence did evoke haste and, at times, despair—an emotional motif perfectly suited to a postapocalyptic story with existentialist themes"
[2] "... loads the normal Matisse Pro EB and then uses the CSS transform property to achieve the compression effect."