Ask HN: Those who left software development for a different technical field?
51 comments
You and I are in the same boat, except I've grown to hate not only the culture, but programming too. I've not heard of former devs breaking into other technical fields, but I have heard of them getting into stuff like farming, construction, or trades (electrical, plumbing, etc.). I wish I hadn't spent my 20s dwelling in anxiety. I wish I had moved around, become a trail guide, or got into scuba diving, or even joined the coast guard. Sadly the best I can hope for nowadays in my 30s is to program in a domain I don't totally despise.
My VP Engineering quit and opened a Falafel joint.
Sounds more fulfilling than a stand ups to be honest. Better stories too.
He's very happy. Best falafel in the Midwest (did a tour and charted every recipe, then created his own).
Keeps his crew for years - the normal term is months, especially in a college town. He's brought his management experience from Engineering teams to food prep and cooks and servers, some of who've never been treated like professionals and peers in their lives.
Does catering too, and supplies restaurants with 'snack packs' which are very popular around here.
Keeps his crew for years - the normal term is months, especially in a college town. He's brought his management experience from Engineering teams to food prep and cooks and servers, some of who've never been treated like professionals and peers in their lives.
Does catering too, and supplies restaurants with 'snack packs' which are very popular around here.
I enjoyed working in restaurants in my formative years but I don't think I'd be happy owning one. Honestly I think my dream job would be working on a cargo ship or something but sadly I'm well past the age cap for breaking into the field.
30s is so young, though! If you don’t have kids, the world is still wide open to you!
"If you don't have kids, the world is still wide open to you", this is the truth. I would also add 'not married' to that. I'm trapped at my job to support my family, and my wife won't consider moving to a cheaper area.
I left engineering at 36 and became a firefighter paramedic and I know quite a few people in their 40s who started. I just left the fire service after 14 years and now working as a programmer.
Age is just a number. Don't limit yourself.
Age is just a number. Don't limit yourself.
I badly want to quit and have a small farm.
The idea of being my own boss and not being subject to the whims of my bosses or corporate bureaucracy is very appealing (my company doesn't follow their own policies). I have also been tasked with learning obscure technology such as FileNet or Neoxam. This leaves me feeling like all my effort and expertise is thrown away when the project winds down or gets outsourced. This feeling of my company throwing me away or wasting me has completely sapped my motivation (why try when I'll just be thrown away again? ).
The idea of being my own boss and not being subject to the whims of my bosses or corporate bureaucracy is very appealing (my company doesn't follow their own policies). I have also been tasked with learning obscure technology such as FileNet or Neoxam. This leaves me feeling like all my effort and expertise is thrown away when the project winds down or gets outsourced. This feeling of my company throwing me away or wasting me has completely sapped my motivation (why try when I'll just be thrown away again? ).
I've gone in another path: applied programming. I chose a position that also involves programming rather than an actual developer role.
Personally the whole standup thing just drove me away
Personally the whole standup thing just drove me away
Can I ask what field you went into?
Random business enhancement work that usually involves the equivalent of a MBA - I got my MBA from reading a book. Mostly making businesses operate better by making sure the red tape is actually worthwhile. It boggles my mind to see how much gibberish is out there. I'll be in work until my talomeres give up or something otherwise falls off.
I often end up either writing some piece of code or project managing people who do.
I also volunteer for emergency services as well. Nothing realigns your priorities quite like cutting someone out of a car at 2am because they just had to send an important text and ignored a tree that was somehow inappropriately planted 100 feet away from the road. The hilarity of dealing with cats with their heads stuck in a pipe lightens other occasions.
I often end up either writing some piece of code or project managing people who do.
I also volunteer for emergency services as well. Nothing realigns your priorities quite like cutting someone out of a car at 2am because they just had to send an important text and ignored a tree that was somehow inappropriately planted 100 feet away from the road. The hilarity of dealing with cats with their heads stuck in a pipe lightens other occasions.
I just left cloud software development to be the jack-of-all-trades only computer person at a local shop. I love it. I spend all day helping people instead of fighting jira.
I have a related experience: a few years ago I built a website for a local music store, and I still do the occasional maintenance task for them. Their gratitude and happiness with the product has made it one of the most fulfilling technical projects I've ever done.
Advantages of being "the technical person" for a non-technical project/business/etc:
- You get out of the insular, one-upsmanship-steeped technical culture
- You can implement things exactly the way you want to
- You're probably much less abstracted away from the people you're actually helping
It's the third thing that I think is most important. In most tech jobs you're either gently swindling your customers through A/B tests and "conversion metrics", or you're doing "tech for tech's sake" which can be fun but ultimately feels empty. It feels really good to directly help real people.
Advantages of being "the technical person" for a non-technical project/business/etc:
- You get out of the insular, one-upsmanship-steeped technical culture
- You can implement things exactly the way you want to
- You're probably much less abstracted away from the people you're actually helping
It's the third thing that I think is most important. In most tech jobs you're either gently swindling your customers through A/B tests and "conversion metrics", or you're doing "tech for tech's sake" which can be fun but ultimately feels empty. It feels really good to directly help real people.
Not me personally. I have two friends that did.
One is a project manager for a small construction firm. Last time we had lunch together he told me the industry is ripe for some good software, but the owners don’t want to buy it. He started working on a free and open source tool.
The other ran so far away from software none of us are sure where he went. He’s vanished off of all social media and only occasionally answers texts.
One is a project manager for a small construction firm. Last time we had lunch together he told me the industry is ripe for some good software, but the owners don’t want to buy it. He started working on a free and open source tool.
The other ran so far away from software none of us are sure where he went. He’s vanished off of all social media and only occasionally answers texts.
I know of one programmer who went from writing software to building cars, rockets and a solar grid. I hear he's doing quite well.
When did Carmack get into solar???
/s
/s
Come on, Carmack isn’t interested in solar. Not when we can literally mine the energy straight from Hell, do you know how many btus we’re talking about here?
...I’m now being told trying to extract energy from Biblical Hell is a bad idea?
...I’m now being told trying to extract energy from Biblical Hell is a bad idea?
Is Hell based heat exchange a second law violation?
Ignoring the obvious angry, cold demons
Downvoters aint ever played Doom, hah.
I am a programmer but I prefer physical object business.
During Corona self isolation, I started creating and selling filament:
I documented the journey here: https://medium.com/endless-filament/make-your-filament-at-ho...
The price of filament is still going up.
Since selling filament I am working partime, mostly doing maintenance (updates/patches) existing application.
During Corona self isolation, I started creating and selling filament:
I documented the journey here: https://medium.com/endless-filament/make-your-filament-at-ho...
The price of filament is still going up.
Since selling filament I am working partime, mostly doing maintenance (updates/patches) existing application.
Is this viable in the long term? Why can’t the major plastic manufacturers push you out of business thanks economies of scale and lower prices?
I never think about what will happen in future, tomorrow I might as well fall under the bus and die. Planning way ahead doesn't help me, I just jump into whatever I find interesting then ride the tide till it's no more.
You can also check on YouTube there is a Canadian I think? Company called ProtoPasta which also makes filament in small shop.
Filament market I think, isn't big enough for the large companies to dominate.
And other thing is logistics, I make locally I can offer cheaper rates to local buyers shipping locally.
You can also check on YouTube there is a Canadian I think? Company called ProtoPasta which also makes filament in small shop.
Filament market I think, isn't big enough for the large companies to dominate.
And other thing is logistics, I make locally I can offer cheaper rates to local buyers shipping locally.
I went from Software Engineer to Solutions Architect a few years back, and can't be more happy.
a) You are still coding somewhat, but just prototypes. It is fun to use the APIs your company builds and help customers with it b) You learn a ton about business. I would call this position more professional consultant, since in the right company, you learn about deals, how much a company pays for what and what value they get out of you
You finally work with people and not nerds who never grow up. You can touch code, but also learn soft skills and make connections. Personally, the money was equal if not better. You finally work on the profit center of a company and not the cost center. After I switched to Solutions Architect, I come here every now and then and be so happy not to do this fulltime anymore. I don't care what you build at the weekend anymore.
I am also more free after work. There is no special new tool I need to learn after the job to get a job in 3 years from now. The people skills I build with my wife, kid and friends are so much more valuable now. So socializing replaced hacking on a new project. Which also did good for my mental health.
a) You are still coding somewhat, but just prototypes. It is fun to use the APIs your company builds and help customers with it b) You learn a ton about business. I would call this position more professional consultant, since in the right company, you learn about deals, how much a company pays for what and what value they get out of you
You finally work with people and not nerds who never grow up. You can touch code, but also learn soft skills and make connections. Personally, the money was equal if not better. You finally work on the profit center of a company and not the cost center. After I switched to Solutions Architect, I come here every now and then and be so happy not to do this fulltime anymore. I don't care what you build at the weekend anymore.
I am also more free after work. There is no special new tool I need to learn after the job to get a job in 3 years from now. The people skills I build with my wife, kid and friends are so much more valuable now. So socializing replaced hacking on a new project. Which also did good for my mental health.
Did you switch within the same company? I have made attempts to apply to Solutions Engineer and Developer Advocate roles to match how my personality has changed over time, but have found that no one responds to my resume / applications, even when I have spent several years teaching, consulting, and building content and demos on the side to supplement my engineering experience and prove I can do the job. I immediately get responses and enthusiasm when I apply as Senior Software Engineer, but it seems people are skeptical of why I would want to change to Solutions Engineer or Developer Advocate when the title is not already on my resume.
No, and I had the same responses. I applied at 12 Solutions Architect roles, and 1 company replied and offered the interview process.
I actually don't know how people choose Solutions Architects. One tipp would be to go on LinkedIn, look for the Solutions Architects at the company you apply for, and ask them how they got hired or just look at their CV.
Right now it can be that the market is dried up and this sales role is especially hard, since many fields don't have active customers any more (or won't get new ones in quite some time)
I actually don't know how people choose Solutions Architects. One tipp would be to go on LinkedIn, look for the Solutions Architects at the company you apply for, and ask them how they got hired or just look at their CV.
Right now it can be that the market is dried up and this sales role is especially hard, since many fields don't have active customers any more (or won't get new ones in quite some time)
Life is short, do what makes you happy is what they say, right?
I've begun the transition from sysadmin into nursing to hopefully a NP certification. Maybe I can blend my background of cloud security and Kubernetes with medicine somehow. Or not.
I've begun the transition from sysadmin into nursing to hopefully a NP certification. Maybe I can blend my background of cloud security and Kubernetes with medicine somehow. Or not.
Here is a cool suggestion:
I love doing manual labor for the physical challenge. In many such jobs the apps are crawling into the work flow. I'm sure they exist but what I've seen is lots of management and programming effort not producing the smoothness possible. I'm entirely convinced now that one cant get the design anywhere near perfection without experience doing the work. (where ofc substantial experience is better than some)
A manager together with an intelligent person with substantial development skills can design an UI where things that happen more frequently are easier to do. Then in the real world low frequency tasks may require 8 other people to wait 30 seconds while you tap buttons. It is not a big loss but it feels wrong. With some tasks it would be more convenient if you could operate the phone with one hand.
In my current job it may seem like time for a task is limited so we do a half-arse job. If it later turns out we do have time we want to get back to it but we cant. Checking a box means the job is done (we drink coffee in stead) no one would dare explain to the managers how the real world works. To them a job that takes 100-306 min always takes 203 min. Explaining a hundred tiny annoyances is waaaaaay to much work. Imagine a conversation about sessions that expire after 30 min while 5% of the tasks take slightly longer.
Also common is a complete lack of context with the current task. If the app knows I'm hammering floor boards with nail type 42 it can anticipate a need to order more nails. This feels empowering while navigating to the nail section of the supplies section then scrolling over a list feels as if it interrupted your actual work.
You can only do perfection if the entire feedback/testing loop takes place in the head of a single person. If one has a lot of experience one can sometimes encode the tricks of the trade.
I love doing manual labor for the physical challenge. In many such jobs the apps are crawling into the work flow. I'm sure they exist but what I've seen is lots of management and programming effort not producing the smoothness possible. I'm entirely convinced now that one cant get the design anywhere near perfection without experience doing the work. (where ofc substantial experience is better than some)
A manager together with an intelligent person with substantial development skills can design an UI where things that happen more frequently are easier to do. Then in the real world low frequency tasks may require 8 other people to wait 30 seconds while you tap buttons. It is not a big loss but it feels wrong. With some tasks it would be more convenient if you could operate the phone with one hand.
In my current job it may seem like time for a task is limited so we do a half-arse job. If it later turns out we do have time we want to get back to it but we cant. Checking a box means the job is done (we drink coffee in stead) no one would dare explain to the managers how the real world works. To them a job that takes 100-306 min always takes 203 min. Explaining a hundred tiny annoyances is waaaaaay to much work. Imagine a conversation about sessions that expire after 30 min while 5% of the tasks take slightly longer.
Also common is a complete lack of context with the current task. If the app knows I'm hammering floor boards with nail type 42 it can anticipate a need to order more nails. This feels empowering while navigating to the nail section of the supplies section then scrolling over a list feels as if it interrupted your actual work.
You can only do perfection if the entire feedback/testing loop takes place in the head of a single person. If one has a lot of experience one can sometimes encode the tricks of the trade.
From first-hand experience working in Silicon Valley, I've seen some people move into independently wealthy "landed gentry" lifestyles, and certainly some younger people who left tech jobs to attend law school, but few or no people who left software for a different, but still remunerative career.
How about becoming a primary or a secondary school Math teacher?
[deleted]
Or a high school computer science teacher, for that matter
I also want out of tech; I started 15 years ago as a help desk analyst, now I’m an Engineering Manager. The burn out is real, the golden handcuffs are real and I’m just tired of being in this kind of work, thoroughly sick at what I’m seeing in the tech industry from a career perspective, tired of standups, tired of sprint planning, tired of retros, scrum, “technical recruiters”, the resume skill rat race, interviews, interviewing...[trails off]...
As recently as this morning I was talking to a friend who teaches pre-calc at local high school and tutors part-time independently about potentially making this very career pivot, to the point where I’m legitimately looking at financial aid and scholarships to potentially just go back to school and get a BSc in Maths and Physics so I can go be a school teacher and geek off with kids about science like I do with my nephew whenever I’m babysitting him and we spend hours playing Kerbal Space Program
As recently as this morning I was talking to a friend who teaches pre-calc at local high school and tutors part-time independently about potentially making this very career pivot, to the point where I’m legitimately looking at financial aid and scholarships to potentially just go back to school and get a BSc in Maths and Physics so I can go be a school teacher and geek off with kids about science like I do with my nephew whenever I’m babysitting him and we spend hours playing Kerbal Space Program
Uhh my understanding is that, as a teacher, you're mostly policing a bunch of youngsters who are not happy to be in the classroom with you. If you get a couple of pupils who are into what you're teaching it's considered a blessing, otherwise it's squeezing water out of a stone.
Not to mention you can't just teach what you want, you have a program to follow. You will also be judged by various test results, so you can't focus on the few bright people in the class, you have to address the rather long tail of under-performers.
Not every teacher has a choice, but perhaps this one does. There are good schools.
Still preferable to what I’m doing now. Shall I reiterate once more how much I want out of this career path?
Get some hands on experience with cloud computing - either AWS or Azure - and leverage you’re combined skills of development and cloud to get a role in the cloud consulting department of either Microsoft or Amazon. No algorithms studying required. Pay is good, abc permanent remote work is possible.
Pre-Covid there were a lot of other consulting roles available, but they seem to have dried up.
Pre-Covid there were a lot of other consulting roles available, but they seem to have dried up.
I am a software engineer for 10 years, and have been dabbling in audio engineering / recording / mixing for the past couple of years. I haven't made the transition, but I wouldn't rule it out in the future.
I'd probably never stop coding though. It would just be a matter of switching from pro to hobby, and vice-versa.
I'd probably never stop coding though. It would just be a matter of switching from pro to hobby, and vice-versa.
Sonic Pi might interest you if you don’t know it already. It’s an alternative to DAWs where you use ruby code to make music
Here’s a demo https://youtu.be/KJPdbp1An2s
Here’s a demo https://youtu.be/KJPdbp1An2s
I write firmware for micro-controllers and deal mostly with engineers, techs, other sane code monkeys, and an occasional customer. My occasional dealings with actual mainstream software developers is generally unpleasant.
I would suggest firmware or some other job where software is part of the product not the product.
I would suggest firmware or some other job where software is part of the product not the product.
I agree 100%. Sometimes, it's not the type of work but the people you're working with. In the embedded space, you work with a lot more electrical and computer engineers, who, in my opinion, are "generally" a lot more tolerable. My worst experiences so far in both my career and in school were when I had to work with straight CS people. There's a certain personality that gets pulled in to it that can be toxic and hard to work with.
Looking at embedded job offers near me, plenty of them advertise using Scrum or some heavier waterfally processes. I suspect you'd be free of the bullshit only in a very small company, but that is true also for non-firmware development.
are you hiring?
"Maybe it's the money and prestige."
Do you have any examples of prestige?
I wish I had either one. I have never recieved any prestige in my career. The money is ok, but there are trades that pay more than what I make, especially if you factor in cost of living.
Do you have any examples of prestige?
I wish I had either one. I have never recieved any prestige in my career. The money is ok, but there are trades that pay more than what I make, especially if you factor in cost of living.
Not answer for the exact question, but I am trying to own a project and a software engineer and its much more bearable than a common job with the issues it comes.
Have you considered finance? Pay is good and the work is can be challenging.
Opportunity cost high: MBA.
That's not true, most people don't have MBAs in finance.
All that said, I still do enjoy programming and work on a number of cool projects for myself. I've started to wonder if I should do something else for a living and relegate programming a hobby I can still enjoy on the side.
There are plenty of stories of people going from programmer to some business position, whether that be management, sales, BA, etc., but I'm not really interested in any of that stuff. In fact, I think I would hate that more than programming. I've been interested in other fields since a kid, programming just won because of accessibility reasons. I've always enjoyed natural sciences (through school, I struggled in math, hated language arts classes, but always excelled in science). I also contemplated a couple going into a other engineering fields as a teen that I've retained an interest in. There are also some IT domains that look interesting (honestly I'd probably be a better network engineer that software engineer), but I don't think I could stomach starting at the bottom of that field. I expect a pay cut if I switch fields, but entry-level IT pays pennies.
I dont think I've ever heard of anyone doing anything like this. Googling only shows people doing the opposite going from X to software development. Everyone wants to be a programmer these days. Maybe it's the money and prestige.
Has anyone made a transition from software to some other technical field?