iFixit tools in Apple's lab(twitter.com)
twitter.com
iFixit tools in Apple's lab
https://twitter.com/iFixit/status/1326264991192764416
104 comments
Correction: Apple's studio. People are praising Apple's production value but I just see people awkwardly standing while talking because the director told them to make sure that their feet are exactly as apart as their shoulders. No one stands like in real life. The whole thing feels so extremely polished, scripted and manicured; I much prefer the candid style Steve Jobs did and may be they can take some questions from the crowd (although during the pandemic, its understandable). Genuine connection with people is what the high production studios do not understand. They create shiny pieces, not art. But shiny things sell, so all bets are off.
This. The whole thing is a lie.
As a former EE, I can categorically state that absolutely no bench I have ever seen is that tidy when debugging hardware. It's usually a complete snake pit of cables, mess and hell. And half the equipment that they would actually need to support what they have out on display is not actually there. Also no one is going to sit on those god awful chairs while working.
And on top of that I guarantee that there are PCs in their real laboratories that do the CAD and debugging work. Zukon, SolidWorks, Catia and Altium don't run on Macs.
PCs design Macs. Discuss :)
Edit: in retrospect I think it felt like a Scientologist recruitment video.
As a former EE, I can categorically state that absolutely no bench I have ever seen is that tidy when debugging hardware. It's usually a complete snake pit of cables, mess and hell. And half the equipment that they would actually need to support what they have out on display is not actually there. Also no one is going to sit on those god awful chairs while working.
And on top of that I guarantee that there are PCs in their real laboratories that do the CAD and debugging work. Zukon, SolidWorks, Catia and Altium don't run on Macs.
PCs design Macs. Discuss :)
Edit: in retrospect I think it felt like a Scientologist recruitment video.
This was my immediate reaction too. Seeing those chairs, I chuckled immediately. It's basically Apple marketing's idea of a HW lab. :) Just like computer hacking, Hollywood style.
At least I hope so.
At least I hope so.
And there are calipers on it on the scale of what you would use for woodworking. I can't fathom how you would use those in that lab but they look "sciency"
Yeah I imagine that pisses off woodworkers as much as it pisses me off seeing some 1980s LED multimeter featuring as a prop in the 2100's in The Expanse.
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The tables should also be covered in an appropriate amount of solder burns and flux residue.
Spot on! Also the floor is usually littered with things that fell off the benches.
No coffee mugs, no post-it's, not a single piece of paper with some notes, no personal stuff -> can't be a engineering office.
But the old Apple II on the shelf in the back got me to smile.
But the old Apple II on the shelf in the back got me to smile.
Which would require[0] a fume extractor, which they're lacking. Unless we're meant to believe they use lead free solder in their test labs.
[0] https://www.osha.gov/dts/osta/otm/otm_v/otm_v_3.html
[0] https://www.osha.gov/dts/osta/otm/otm_v/otm_v_3.html
Well, I grew up working only with lead free solder (learnt soldering in school in the EU, and RoHS applies for such purposes as well), and honestly, I can't see why they wouldn't. Lead free solder might be a bit easier to work with, but in the end not having a poison everywhere around you is gonna allow you to focus on the real issues instead.
Fume extractors are for the flux fumes, not the (nonexistent) lead fumes. You need them whatever type of solder you use.
There are ways of setting up solder fume extraction that is not intrusive, just like how casinos have HVAC systems that pull smoke upwards and out, generally avoiding the place smelling like smoke. I worked in a service center a long time ago that used such systems and if you shot video at ground level, you would never get any of that equipment in the shot.
"in retrospect I think it felt like a Scientologist recruitment video."
I made a very similar comment to my gf during the live stream. I think there is something insular, cult-like, and very broken in tech culture, and the live stream really seemed to emphasize the point.
Perhaps paradoxically, I thought this year's WWDC videos were much more natural and interesting, even though they clearly also were meticulously rehearsed and stage managed.
I made a very similar comment to my gf during the live stream. I think there is something insular, cult-like, and very broken in tech culture, and the live stream really seemed to emphasize the point.
Perhaps paradoxically, I thought this year's WWDC videos were much more natural and interesting, even though they clearly also were meticulously rehearsed and stage managed.
"Zukon, SolidWorks, Catia and Altium don't run on Macs." -- Windows does: https://support.apple.com/boot-camp.
If you do that, Zukon, SolidWorks, Catia and Altium vendors will tell you to piss off if you want support because the hardware isn't ISV certified.
No they do not. I have seen many CAD stations with Windows on Mac. They do make solid hardware.
Not sure for CATIA, but this is true for Zuken, Altium and SolidWorks at least; and Mentor Graphics and Cadence.
Not sure for CATIA, but this is true for Zuken, Altium and SolidWorks at least; and Mentor Graphics and Cadence.
CATIA only supports specific workstation configurations. It can be run on unsupported workstations just fine, but you may hit a brick wall with Dassault Systèmes support, which is like half of what your paying for with the maintenance fees.
Erm, maybe they were asked to tidy it before filming? This is clearly not a studio, it's just a lab that has been tidied and all the crap hidden away (and maybe a few nice looking circuit boards scattered around).
Yes, but you could run Windows on a Intel Mac.
Do we know if they have a staged set or is it all computer generated. Let alone I am curious how many takes it was for some of the presentations.
100% agree, not a human touch in sight (although the guy who did the processor design and the product managers for the mac pro / air were more human than the others). Tim Cook was probably the worst, considering he is supposed to be their enigmatic leader.
I would much prefer people bumbling over their words but speaking off-the-cuff than people who sound like they are reading something scripted by the PR department off a teleprompter.
I would much prefer people bumbling over their words but speaking off-the-cuff than people who sound like they are reading something scripted by the PR department off a teleprompter.
“There’s lots of ways to be as a person, and some people express their deep appreciation in different ways. But one of the ways that I believe people express their appreciation to the rest of humanity is to make something wonderful and put it out there."
“But somehow, in the act of making something with a great deal of care and love, something is transmitted there. And it’s a way of expressing to the rest of our species our deep appreciation.
"So, we need to be true to who we are and remember what’s really important to us. That’s what’s going to keep Apple, Apple, is if we keep us, us"
- Steve Jobs.
“But somehow, in the act of making something with a great deal of care and love, something is transmitted there. And it’s a way of expressing to the rest of our species our deep appreciation.
"So, we need to be true to who we are and remember what’s really important to us. That’s what’s going to keep Apple, Apple, is if we keep us, us"
- Steve Jobs.
That's not what most people like considering the flak Elon Musk gets for doing exactly that.
You are talking about a guy who shoots off stuff like the "pedo guy" tweet. Acting like a petulant child will catch flak.
I don't get how those two things are related. Besides people were hating on Musks public speaking skills before that whole debacle.
No one was hating on Musk's public speaking skills before that. People were saying he is hard to follow but that's different.
Besides that, yes not having planned speeches and speaking your mind unfiltered are traits that I would absolutely expect to see in the same person. They are different expressions of the same thinking process. I'm sure a lot of us have read that Thailand is were pedos go etc. But most people would have the restrain to not call someone attacking them a pedo.
Besides that, yes not having planned speeches and speaking your mind unfiltered are traits that I would absolutely expect to see in the same person. They are different expressions of the same thinking process. I'm sure a lot of us have read that Thailand is were pedos go etc. But most people would have the restrain to not call someone attacking them a pedo.
What? That is totally false. Musk has been criticized for his bad public speaking for years. Here is an example: https://smallbusiness.com/selling/elon-musk-in-an-awful-pres...
Musk tweeting some guy is a pedo has NOTHING to do with his public speaking skills. It wasn't in a public speaking setting.
Musk tweeting some guy is a pedo has NOTHING to do with his public speaking skills. It wasn't in a public speaking setting.
I agree with you, they're orthogonal. Looks like you were downvoted because people mixed up his character from the way he presents. I quite like his presentation style, it is genuine and unscripted.
Yeah, I am always curious to know if those meticulously designed workplace background was the real hardware lab or a TV studio. It makes more sense to be a studio for shooting videos.
No way it was a real lab. Too much risk to reveal something just from the tools or devices present. The viewers would analyze every pixel visible and it’s too much effort to clean up a real lab of what secrets it could reveal and a lot easier to build a real-looking lab out of things you can safely display.
Not sure if such a lab would be even open to all employees at Apple from what I hear.
Not sure if such a lab would be even open to all employees at Apple from what I hear.
It’s just instagram dysmorphia is making its way in to everything.
Soon engineers will be staging their workstations and benches so they look like the Kardashian I mean Apple selfies.
Soon engineers will be staging their workstations and benches so they look like the Kardashian I mean Apple selfies.
It would be a pain, literally, to work in such lab. No ergonomics. Just imagine doing a full working day with those stools, debugging circuits and all.
Are you talking about this picture? All I see is a person on a photo op trying really hard to look good. It is extremely hard to make posed pictures that look good and are in the moment at the same time.
On the sidenote it is kind of ironic that you label this a studio, which is generally an artist term, and then claim that apple creates shiny pieces and not art. That would make it precisely a lab...
On the sidenote it is kind of ironic that you label this a studio, which is generally an artist term, and then claim that apple creates shiny pieces and not art. That would make it precisely a lab...
I believe by studio they meant production studio, and not an actual place Apple works on their devices.
It starts to get really painful once they cut to Craig Federighi. Those are Zuckerberg levels of uncanny valley.
I like to think Craig enjoys that sort of thing and it makes him feel like an actor or someone doing show biz. What bothers me is rather Tim Cook and his super coordinated and carefully planned movements, camera angles, facial expressions, etc. It's not natural - although maybe he is in fact an android? I am not sure I would like to work with that guy. He seems extremely tense and probably would freak out at someone having a bad day or even making a bad joke in the same room.
> What bothers me is rather Tim Cook and his super coordinated and carefully planned movements
I'd also prefer a more casual approach.
> He seems extremely tense and probably would freak out at someone having a bad day or even making a bad joke in the same room
This statement seems unfair to me. Not everyone who looks tense would lash out at innocent people.
I'd also prefer a more casual approach.
> He seems extremely tense and probably would freak out at someone having a bad day or even making a bad joke in the same room
This statement seems unfair to me. Not everyone who looks tense would lash out at innocent people.
Yeah I guess you are right. I have heard that he pushes teams to work ungodly hours but I don't work for Apple and I don't know Cook, so yes it was unfair.
> What bothers me is rather Tim Cook and his super coordinated and carefully planned movements, camera angles, facial expressions, etc
I swear every presentation he spends a greater and greater portion of his speaking time doing prayer hands.
I swear every presentation he spends a greater and greater portion of his speaking time doing prayer hands.
Maybe he's just tense on camera. Lots of people lock up when reading from a script, for a video that's going to be seen by millions of people.
They're doing one of the single most important things for the company's performance in the next year or years; the Apple events alone can make Apple's market value jump or fall by hundreds of billions. If you had that influenced, you too would have a serious team behind these presentations, and you would spend weeks rehearsing and polishing your presentation.
I hear you. I guess they are making extra effort these days to try to gain market share. I mean in terms or revenue and profits they've already won, but it's always in the nature of a company to want more, keep expanding, keep growing.
> the Apple events alone can make Apple's market value jump or fall by hundreds of billions
The stock price is down since Monday, so I guess they screwed up?
The stock price is down since Monday, so I guess they screwed up?
Probably not even a studio. That looks a lot like CGI to me.
Check the transition at 13:10 "back to Johny"
Check the transition at 13:10 "back to Johny"
It may look like CGI but the amount of effort it takes to do good CGI vs just setting up some computers and tables is a few orders of magnitude off.
You can't just do CGI and call it a day at 90% close-enough levels. You gotta do it well or not do it at all.
You can't just do CGI and call it a day at 90% close-enough levels. You gotta do it well or not do it at all.
Agreed, but remember this is Apple releasing a product platform that is costing hundreds of millions or billions of dollars in technical investment and marketing - they'll have put the effort in.
The video is 10:47 long.
I was referring to the Apple Event:
https://www.apple.com/apple-events/november-2020/
https://www.apple.com/apple-events/november-2020/
In case someone else is wondering what this comment is referring to, it's apparently this staged video that was part of the Apple announcement: https://youtu.be/XRb_VAp_6B0?t=519
Completely agree. Everything you see in that video was carefully choreographed and purposefully put into view for a reason. With the marketing resources Apple has, I don't think it's too conspiratorial to think that they put the iFixit tools and old Apple II computers there for the sole purpose of them to be talked about on social media.
The sleek, clean, uncomfortable workspace is just convincing enough for the average user to seem like a real lab. It's perfectly on brand with how Apple wants to be perceived.
The sleek, clean, uncomfortable workspace is just convincing enough for the average user to seem like a real lab. It's perfectly on brand with how Apple wants to be perceived.
Well they couldn't have this because of the human malware that is going around.
I guess they could have a big facetime call and answer questions or something?
There were a number of other Easter eggs and in-jokes in that video. Bondi iMac, original Mac, a reference to a "snappier" Safari, the PC guy at the end.
Some smart person should enumerate all of the references. It was like an all-Apple version of Ready Player One.
Some smart person should enumerate all of the references. It was like an all-Apple version of Ready Player One.
Was the "wake from sleep instantly" thing an in-joke, or just a surreal joke?
The thing where he cracked the lid open a little and looked inside, all bathed in a red glow?
I'm not sure what that was about. To me it was just weird, and came off as slightly pedo.
I'm not sure what that was about. To me it was just weird, and came off as slightly pedo.
I am very curious about the other products that can be seen on the desks. Which brands / products are the various electronics equipment, table work mat, white and black table lamps visible? Is there anyone who can name one or more products? Thanks in advance!
Real pro use tools from brands most consumers have never heard of. Obviously this set is faker than Linus' "modern home" set.
Maybe it's not even a studio, it looks so clean and polished that it can all be CGI.
Most likely it's a bit of both, like all TV productions nowadays.
If (when) the camera track is static, they can overlay any CGI on top of the final image to enhance backgrounds or add/remove items.
If (when) the camera track is static, they can overlay any CGI on top of the final image to enhance backgrounds or add/remove items.
Funny, I bet the T3 and the T5 bits are trashed.
Amusingly, I've read that Apple (internally) frequently uses Anker cables.
Apple provides Belkin USB-C to Gigabit ethernet adapters because they don't make their own. Never saw an Anker cable, but perhaps they provide them somewhere.
I've seen that both be suggested _and_ denied on Hacker News, so I wouldn't be surprised if it happens, but I doubt it's routine practice.
I also read something along the lines of that they have do some EDA work either on windows or on special mac builds of the tools. Might be just gossip keep in mind, not that it matters (beyond ones religious devotion to mac)
I suspect they'll do what many large companies do, have a server farm that has all the tools on and have engineers remotely use them from a personal machine. The server farm will be running Linux and they can use Macs as the personal machines.
Ultimately you often need a setup something like this as EDA vendors can have various rules to follow about where the binaries are kept. For implementation engineers there may be onerous terms around access to the process library files which are easier to deal with if the libraries plus the tools that use them don't go near the engineer's personal machine.
Plus an engineer may want to spin up multiple instances of tool (very common for simulation for instance) so you want easy access to a cluster for this purpose.
Ultimately you often need a setup something like this as EDA vendors can have various rules to follow about where the binaries are kept. For implementation engineers there may be onerous terms around access to the process library files which are easier to deal with if the libraries plus the tools that use them don't go near the engineer's personal machine.
Plus an engineer may want to spin up multiple instances of tool (very common for simulation for instance) so you want easy access to a cluster for this purpose.
When I worked there 10 years ago all the EDA/VLSI/etc was running on rhel/centos. As you’d expect because that’s what all of the EDA vendors support, Source, me. My team built managed and ran the in house compute and storage for all of that work on the portable/xserve/desktop/monitor hardware.
https://betanews.com/2014/09/26/apple-tests-the-iphone-6s-du.... A lot of the EDA work is of course done on Windows and Linux.
That seems pretty likely. Most (non-software) engineering disciplines have a ton of Windows-only GUI software.
Understandable, because their own ones fall apart so often from normal use.
[deleted]
For those who don't get the joke, Apple's engineers are apparently using an iFixit toolkit in their lab, while continuing to make Apple devices harder for companies like iFixit to repair.
https://www.ifixit.com/Store/Tools/Manta-Driver-Kit--112-Bit...
Apple engineers don’t have specific mandate to make devices harder to repair, the are tasked to make devices cheaper to produce. It so happens that it also affects ease of repair.
For extreme example of this look at the Kindle - obviously it’s glued so it’s cheaper to make, but it makes it completely unrepairable.
For extreme example of this look at the Kindle - obviously it’s glued so it’s cheaper to make, but it makes it completely unrepairable.
Apple made it so that you need their blessing to swap out the battery, display, or camera on their phones[1]. And they can't replace the battery on my MBP but have to replace the whole top case, nor replace the little rubber feet without replacing the whole bottom case.
At this point ascribing any sort of "it's just the economics" reasoning to Apple is wishful thinking. They're doing this on purpose.
[1] https://www.ifixit.com/News/45921/is-this-the-end-of-the-rep...
At this point ascribing any sort of "it's just the economics" reasoning to Apple is wishful thinking. They're doing this on purpose.
[1] https://www.ifixit.com/News/45921/is-this-the-end-of-the-rep...
People always assume that every 3rd party repair shop has Louis Rossmann-levels of skill and integrity. Some do. Some don't.
Apple is trying to protect people (and their public image) from the scammy people who swap the cheapest shit on your phone and still charge a premium.
Then when the phone explodes and takes someones buttock with it, it's WAY too late for Apple to say "but it was a 3rd party battery, which was dodgy and installed carelessly" - the Court of Twitter has already decided that Apple is evil and their phones are crap and here come the class action suits.
So the only sane way is to make sure people can't get dodgy components installed on their devices.
Also, if every Apple Genius was Rossmann-good with similar tools, they could solder out single components and fix pretty much anything on site.
But they're not, so they are instructed on how to swap the smallest viable part when one section fails. That might mean swapping a whole case when one rubber foot falls of, but that's still easier and more cost-effective than training everyone to be a soldering and electrical engineering genius.
Apple is trying to protect people (and their public image) from the scammy people who swap the cheapest shit on your phone and still charge a premium.
Then when the phone explodes and takes someones buttock with it, it's WAY too late for Apple to say "but it was a 3rd party battery, which was dodgy and installed carelessly" - the Court of Twitter has already decided that Apple is evil and their phones are crap and here come the class action suits.
So the only sane way is to make sure people can't get dodgy components installed on their devices.
Also, if every Apple Genius was Rossmann-good with similar tools, they could solder out single components and fix pretty much anything on site.
But they're not, so they are instructed on how to swap the smallest viable part when one section fails. That might mean swapping a whole case when one rubber foot falls of, but that's still easier and more cost-effective than training everyone to be a soldering and electrical engineering genius.
If it were about dodgy parts, it would be enough to use genuine parts. It's not. If it were about dodgy parts they'd make it easy for third-party shops to get genuine parts. They don't. Why do parts through their independent repair program cost more (to the point of being uneconomical) if the shop is replacing a non-OEM part or (god forbid) they want to stock up so they can actually replace parts when their customer walks in and not have to wait for Apple's approval[1]? How does charging more for replacing a non-OEM part protect people?
I've done things Apple's way, and my reward was losing access to my work tools for two weeks. They can pay for prime real estate but they can't pay to train their Geniuses to actually fix things? To change a battery? They can't keep parts in stock? Doing things their way is miserable---they are capricious, they deny they ever make any design errors, it is inconvenient. This drives people to third-party providers where they can actually get better service for the products they paid a premium for. How does this protect people?
I'm not even talking about component-level repair. I'm not talking about changing a bad chip.
These are the feet[2]. They stick on. No soldering required. But apparently that's too hard for their Geniuses to do.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rCUF-V1esM
[2] https://www.ifixit.com/Store/Mac/MacBook-and-MacBook-Pro-Uni...
I've done things Apple's way, and my reward was losing access to my work tools for two weeks. They can pay for prime real estate but they can't pay to train their Geniuses to actually fix things? To change a battery? They can't keep parts in stock? Doing things their way is miserable---they are capricious, they deny they ever make any design errors, it is inconvenient. This drives people to third-party providers where they can actually get better service for the products they paid a premium for. How does this protect people?
I'm not even talking about component-level repair. I'm not talking about changing a bad chip.
These are the feet[2]. They stick on. No soldering required. But apparently that's too hard for their Geniuses to do.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rCUF-V1esM
[2] https://www.ifixit.com/Store/Mac/MacBook-and-MacBook-Pro-Uni...
That's simply what they want you to think.
1) Half the stuff won't work if you solder them properly anyway.
2) Apple should not be worrying about the shoddy job repair shops might do. It's not their business. What they could do is ask for every 3rd party repair shop to declare that they are not Apple certified clearly in their website/storefront.
1) Half the stuff won't work if you solder them properly anyway.
2) Apple should not be worrying about the shoddy job repair shops might do. It's not their business. What they could do is ask for every 3rd party repair shop to declare that they are not Apple certified clearly in their website/storefront.
Many third party repair shops are pretty bad and Apple goes out of their way to make sure those shops stay bad. It's very hard to get good when you cannot access parts or schematics. Apple does everything they can to sabotage the repair community so they can keep up this excuse.
Is that why they invent new and totally unnecessary driver bits? And make it so that you can't even replace a component from one iphone with a 100% apple made component from another identical iphone?
It's obvious that apple has spent a lot of money on intentionally making their devices harder to repair.
It's obvious that apple has spent a lot of money on intentionally making their devices harder to repair.
Most likely it was other way around - they wanted a machine which can reliably drive tiny screws. They invented the machine, but it required pentalobe screws, so they went with that.
[deleted]
The only reason ifixit sells its own tools is because Apple decided to invent a non standard screw over a decade ago. One that is functionally the same as every screw but required a screwdriver that could not be purchased off the shelf at the time.
And they absolutely knew and expected that professional repair shops would be able to get one of those screwdrivers... as has happened with every other security screw designed for just about forever.
The purpose is to deter people who have no business being inside of it to begin with.
The purpose is to deter people who have no business being inside of it to begin with.
How do you know that amazon or 'apple engineers don't have specific mandate to make devices harder to repair'? Do you mean NO Apple product development employee have said mandate?
> companies like iFixit to repair
iFixit itself doesn't perform the repairs. They simply make and sell tools to facilitate unofficial repairs, and they had a good reputation on doing that - which, as you said, is becoming increasingly difficult.
iFixit itself doesn't perform the repairs. They simply make and sell tools to facilitate unofficial repairs, and they had a good reputation on doing that - which, as you said, is becoming increasingly difficult.
It's an interesting business model I think.
They produce IP (researching and producing very clear instructions for fixes) and manage supply chain (trusted replacement parts & tools, worth more vs aliexpress equivalents because they endorse them).
The things they make money off are largely substitutable. Their value add (well deserved IMHO) is trust.
They produce IP (researching and producing very clear instructions for fixes) and manage supply chain (trusted replacement parts & tools, worth more vs aliexpress equivalents because they endorse them).
The things they make money off are largely substitutable. Their value add (well deserved IMHO) is trust.
The network effect is also at play here. It's a community-oriented operation, in a sense it's similar to GitHub or Wikipedia - their repair guides are actually on an open wiki that everyone can edit, and users have contributed a lot of guide as well, and nearly everything is licensed under CC BY-NC-SA 3.0.
Don't underestimate the value of consistency. If I buy an iFixit toolkit I can be fairly confident that there won't be wobbly bits, oddly creaking plastic, the grip will be the same across the board and that the steel will be of reasonable quality.
> It's an interesting business model I think.
Don't look for gold yourself: sell the camping supplies and pickaxes to the prospectors looking for gold.
* https://www.flexport.com/blog/trade-merchants-rich-californi...
Don't look for gold yourself: sell the camping supplies and pickaxes to the prospectors looking for gold.
* https://www.flexport.com/blog/trade-merchants-rich-californi...
Sounds analogous to youtube-dl...
<runs from room protecting head from shrapnel>
<runs from room protecting head from shrapnel>
this is most certainly just a studio and not a real lab.