Huawei Tops Intel as Top Linux Kernel Contributor for 5.10(news.itsfoss.com)
news.itsfoss.com
Huawei Tops Intel as Top Linux Kernel Contributor for 5.10
https://news.itsfoss.com/huawei-kernel-contribution/
138 comments
True.
Wouldn't more lines of code give someone more chance to slip in backdoors?
Wouldn't more lines of code give someone more chance to slip in backdoors?
I would love to find better metrics than changesets and lines of codes — I agree that both are awful ways of measuring actual software-development work. I have yet to find something better, though; suggestions welcome.
I think the best metric is to sort by number of comments on a particular changeset. More comments, more wide spread discussion, more people involved => more impact.
WireGuard for example is only a relatively small changeset, but has an huge impact for many uses, you can find many comments, posts, write ups, about it all over the internet. Many knew that this feature was going to be huge, well before merge into linux.
On the other hand, if almost no one is discussing a particular change (e.g. the removal of 20k lines of driver code), then the impact will either be very low and unimportant or it will unexpectedly become important, but there was no way you could have known it beforehand.
WireGuard for example is only a relatively small changeset, but has an huge impact for many uses, you can find many comments, posts, write ups, about it all over the internet. Many knew that this feature was going to be huge, well before merge into linux.
On the other hand, if almost no one is discussing a particular change (e.g. the removal of 20k lines of driver code), then the impact will either be very low and unimportant or it will unexpectedly become important, but there was no way you could have known it beforehand.
I wonder if folks should even look for it, because it will become an employment metric.
sorry you spent too much time on "learning", we need more "corbet-curve-units" from you.
sorry you spent too much time on "learning", we need more "corbet-curve-units" from you.
Goodhart's Law (Popular formulation): When a measure becomes a target, it ceases to be a good measure.
... via https://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup
... via https://github.com/globalcitizen/taoup
Thanks for replying!
In this case I think a lot of people are wondering what they changed. Would it be possible to extract that info from the paths modified, filtered with some handwritten rules to classify the changes? For example, did they commit driver code for their own hardware, or did they touch other areas of the kernel? How much of each?
In this case I think a lot of people are wondering what they changed. Would it be possible to extract that info from the paths modified, filtered with some handwritten rules to classify the changes? For example, did they commit driver code for their own hardware, or did they touch other areas of the kernel? How much of each?
Reminds me of this old story: https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?story=Negative_2000_Li...
Aren't there 2 million lines just for the AMD drivers?
Much of this is auto-generated header files e.g.
https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Linux-5....
https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Linux-5....
Not surprising after I saw how many R&D offices Huawei has in Europe.
They basically placed their offices right across their competitors like Ericsson, Nokia, Imagination, etc. to the point that in every European Tech hub you will find a Huawei office.
They basically placed their offices right across their competitors like Ericsson, Nokia, Imagination, etc. to the point that in every European Tech hub you will find a Huawei office.
I do not know why you are down voted... I have seen Huawei from the inside and the number of devs and first grade researchers is staggering.
The researchers get payed very well, but what (to those I met) was even more important: they get all the assistance they want, plus 1. As one of them told me "I hate doing things twice. I now do not have to. I think of something, try to get it to work and I am done. The grinding is done for me." A truly very nice environment to do research in, with a boatload of resources at their fingertips.
Just check the number of patents Huawei [0] holds.
[0] https://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1194023.shtml
The researchers get payed very well, but what (to those I met) was even more important: they get all the assistance they want, plus 1. As one of them told me "I hate doing things twice. I now do not have to. I think of something, try to get it to work and I am done. The grinding is done for me." A truly very nice environment to do research in, with a boatload of resources at their fingertips.
Just check the number of patents Huawei [0] holds.
[0] https://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1194023.shtml
Yeah, there were some interesting talks at FOSDEM by Huawei researchers, e.g.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PuFnRg8TH-k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PuFnRg8TH-k
Seems ironic for a Chinese tech organization to hold boatloads of patents...
It's well-known that China is very serious about IPs. At least to people actually paying attention to Chinese domestic policies.
A lot of Chinese firms knowingly violates IP laws in the past, because they understand there is not enough resources to enforce them. Additionally, Chinese government has been very open about the plan to enforce IP laws gradually to the same standard as the global market. A good balance has been played to allow rapid advancement without provoking the more advanced economies.
A lot of Chinese firms knowingly violates IP laws in the past, because they understand there is not enough resources to enforce them. Additionally, Chinese government has been very open about the plan to enforce IP laws gradually to the same standard as the global market. A good balance has been played to allow rapid advancement without provoking the more advanced economies.
What would you point to as a sign that they take foreigners' IP seriously?
> It's well-known that China is very serious about IPs.
> Chinese government has been very open about the plan to enforce IP laws gradually to the same standard as the global market.
IMHO, these two statements contradict themselves.
> Chinese government has been very open about the plan to enforce IP laws gradually to the same standard as the global market.
IMHO, these two statements contradict themselves.
IP is a means of commercializing intellectual achievements. It's not noble in that it protects people actually doing the work, most patent owners get them from coauthors of the patent, and has very low degree of moral assessment value. Indeed, most innovative corps today are the pioneers of only use patent as defensive measure (Google Tesla).
Being serious about IP is to respect a rule of game, and not actually enforce it is out of necessity (are you expecting a sweat shop to actually pay loyalty and produces actual profit?) and actual recognition that building up the mechanisms of innovation will take time.
Being serious about IP is to respect a rule of game, and not actually enforce it is out of necessity (are you expecting a sweat shop to actually pay loyalty and produces actual profit?) and actual recognition that building up the mechanisms of innovation will take time.
IIRC in terms of patent fees: China is massive net importer: $6 in patent fees for every $1 they receive, US is opposite, massive net exporter. Hence Chinese drive to build / buy domestic patent portfolio and slowly implementing IP standards until they can play the same crooked IP extraction game.
that doesn't mean it's not a good strategy - acquire IP for self, ignore IP of others until everything is in place.
It makes sense when you consider that patents nowadays are more like ammo to start/settle potential lawsuits with, rather than about actual protection of IP.
Axis Communications who are the leaders in the network camera industry has their HQ in the small Swedish city, Lund.
Huawei decided to place a new R&D team which focuses on network cameras in the same building were the Axis HQ are located, in Lund.
EDIT: Source (in Swedish): https://computersweden.idg.se/2.2683/1.712002/huawei-kamerav...
Huawei decided to place a new R&D team which focuses on network cameras in the same building were the Axis HQ are located, in Lund.
EDIT: Source (in Swedish): https://computersweden.idg.se/2.2683/1.712002/huawei-kamerav...
Yea Huawei has a location right outside NVIDIA in Santa Clara that was hit with a DOJ investigation after they gave out bonuses based on stealing IP and other nonsense.
Oh that's super interesting, I remember hearing rumors from about that building being the local hub for Chinese industrial espionage but never gave it much credence.
This is what happens when business strategy spans decades and not from one quarterly report to another.
Agreed, a Nortel for each decade is usually sufficient from a business strategy perspective.
You mean this is what happens when you have a gigantic state government bag holding for you with a given mission of wiping out all competition.
Yes, that's exactly what I mean. The entire country sat quietly whilst the western companies poured billions upon billions into it. Fast forward 30-40 years and everyone is super surprised that once humble and kowtowing country showing a middle finger to the rest of the world and nobody can do anything about it. Huawei has been operating like this since its inception.
You can blame that on the colonialist mentality that prevailed in the MBAs of the rich western nations where they saw China as this obedient servant that will just build our stuff and always do what we tell them to do since we have the money and the kow-how and they'll never wise up and become a threat.
I worked in the NL hardware business over a decade back and that was the exact mentality management there had in regards to China and Chinese workers.
I worked in the NL hardware business over a decade back and that was the exact mentality management there had in regards to China and Chinese workers.
Pretty much. Nortel Guangzhou had bamboo ceiling on (mainland) Chinese management roles in the late 90s even foreign nationals, i.e. (mainland) Chinese Canadians. Big surprise when entire engineering teams got poached by ZTE and Huawei. Pretty consistent complaints from other industries. Emphasis on mainland because it didn't apply to Taiwan / HK / SK / Singapore expats. I think institutional inertia and seniority played a big part, but didn't sit well with people being blocked.
People never learn from history. It's same when the Germans invited gastarbeiters to build the country, expecting them to just pack up and leave afterwards. As one of them later said: I spent 15 years building this country, it's my home,why would I leave?
Also, Huawei are building a 500 acre R&D facility next to the ARM headquarters in Cambridge, UK.
Not quite next door - 15 minutes drive away.
Might take 15mins to simply drive around such a huge campus.
There is a rumor here that Huawei approaches key personal of competitors and offers to match the salary + 12000usd/month (which alone is probably more than 90% make)
Money and strategy talks
If only Nokia hadn't got dragged down by the Symbian fools
If only Nokia hadn't got dragged down by the Symbian fools
You mean the Windows Phone fools?
I firmly believe that Nokia could have become a major player if they'd stayed the course with Meego-Harmatton. I owned a Nokia N9, the one phone that ran it, and it was great!.
The UI was very different from iOS, but it had all of the iPhone's polish and purposeful design. I greatly preferred it for several reasons: multi-tasking, for instance, was far more seamless than what iOS could do at the time.
Nokia's timing was right, too, and unlike Microsoft, Nokia had a deep history in the mobile space. They really could have made something.
I firmly believe that Nokia could have become a major player if they'd stayed the course with Meego-Harmatton. I owned a Nokia N9, the one phone that ran it, and it was great!.
The UI was very different from iOS, but it had all of the iPhone's polish and purposeful design. I greatly preferred it for several reasons: multi-tasking, for instance, was far more seamless than what iOS could do at the time.
Nokia's timing was right, too, and unlike Microsoft, Nokia had a deep history in the mobile space. They really could have made something.
Have you heard of the "Burning platform" memo?
Have you read "Paranoidi optimisti" by Risto Siilasmaa? All the big problems software wise were cause by Symbian.
"Unfortunately, this was only the tip of the iceberg. Siilasmaa later learned that the overall build time of Symbian was two weeks." https://www.flashover.blog/posts/technical-debt/
"Unfortunately, this was only the tip of the iceberg. Siilasmaa later learned that the overall build time of Symbian was two weeks." https://www.flashover.blog/posts/technical-debt/
Symbian definitely had to go. But that's why Nokia had Meego-Harmattan. It's as if Apple announced they were going to stop developing their own software, right after replacing classic Mac OS with OS X.
And, instead of adopting Windows for future Macs, Apple was going all-in on Solaris.
And, Steve Jobs had just stepped down as interim CEO, and his replacement just happened to be a former Sun Microsystems executive.
And, Apple's investors were apparently okay with this.
And, instead of adopting Windows for future Macs, Apple was going all-in on Solaris.
And, Steve Jobs had just stepped down as interim CEO, and his replacement just happened to be a former Sun Microsystems executive.
And, Apple's investors were apparently okay with this.
How the fuck can a piece of software reach a two day compilation time without raising alarm bells? Sounds like a disfunctional organization where the only goal is just to ship features continuously.
The software practices of hardware companies in the 90s/00s was precarious and tools like ClearCase createad a generation of idiots (or vice-versa and the ones that thought 2 days build times were ok were the last to leave their jobs - usually forced)
Holy shit, how did that happen?
Edit: it seems the compilation time was 2 days in that article, I wonder what the rest was.
Edit: it seems the compilation time was 2 days in that article, I wonder what the rest was.
It was largely BS to justify the pivot to Windows phone. Jolla demonstrated that the problems with Meego could be solved with far fewer resources than Nokia put into their pointless Windows phone migration.
I just said above that I loved Meego Manhattan, but I never liked Jolla's UI. One example of something I believe they just got completely wrong is that swiping away an app causes it to fade out, instead of actually move alongside your finger. This makes multi-tasking somewhat easier, since you can quickly peak at what's behind an app, but it isn't connected to the gesture.
The UX was, well, Marmite at best but they solved the real issues - porting the OS to Qualcomm SOC (instead of the discontinued TI OMAP) and adding 4g support.
Yep, and being in Espoo the week it was published, I can tell no one was that happy with it, specially after the push to modernize Symbian with Qt.
This doesn't surprise me. I've been working in the open source software space for a good while and many many many of my former colleagues now work at Huawei. All of them report to me that it's a great place to work where they're well compensated and put on teams of smart people with ample resources to get things done, including doing things in the open.
How is security taken care of when contributions are being done by Huawei (backdoors in 41k lines of sourcode?)? But I am guessing there is no real fight between open source software and state actors - perhaps someone who knows more about the security of the kernel can comment.
Normally the identity of contributors is not really checked when you want to contribute to an open source project. A valid email address and a name is sufficient to contribute to the Linux kernel.
All changes to The Linux kernel are getting publicly reviewed, so the hard thing is passing this technical review if you want to introduce a backdoor. If people know you, based on previous contributions, the review could be less hard, so it could make sense to build up a reputation before. In the Linux kernel not the company builds up the reputation, but the individual engineer who contributes. If this is a Huawei hardware it could be easier for an engineer with a Huawei mail address to get changes integrated, because people assume he known the driver and hardware well and people trust claims like, "this can not happen because the closed source firmware takes care of this".
If the Chinese intelligence agency wants to integrate a backdoor into mainline Linux it would be easier to just build up some own fake identities and use them. It probably would be easier to just analyze the Linux kernel and use bugs introduced by other people.
The NSA also contributed to the Linux kernel, look for contributes from a nsa.gov mail address.
All changes to The Linux kernel are getting publicly reviewed, so the hard thing is passing this technical review if you want to introduce a backdoor. If people know you, based on previous contributions, the review could be less hard, so it could make sense to build up a reputation before. In the Linux kernel not the company builds up the reputation, but the individual engineer who contributes. If this is a Huawei hardware it could be easier for an engineer with a Huawei mail address to get changes integrated, because people assume he known the driver and hardware well and people trust claims like, "this can not happen because the closed source firmware takes care of this".
If the Chinese intelligence agency wants to integrate a backdoor into mainline Linux it would be easier to just build up some own fake identities and use them. It probably would be easier to just analyze the Linux kernel and use bugs introduced by other people.
The NSA also contributed to the Linux kernel, look for contributes from a nsa.gov mail address.
I would expect that malicious code would itself not be a proper backdoor, but rather a framework or hook or API that makes it easier to bypass restrictions. Subtle behavioral changes in the kernel combined with user space code could empower a state actor to move unnoticed. I think of it like 20 parts of a munition. Each piece by itself may look mostly harmless. This is all theory of course, but that is how I would do something malicious in the kernel. A theoretical example would be a simple kernel API combined with something like systemd's binfmt mount and a benign looking PNG image file that when parsed by binfmt, instructs the kernel to do something interesting such as tickle an undocumented CPU instruction.
Not just contributed. SELinux is primarily authored by the NSA.
Now Huawei is fixing bugs in SELinux:
https://git.kernel.org/linus/68dae71b7cde628a082e982c0abbf6e...
Or reports them, so the NSA can fix them: https://git.kernel.org/linus/3a2f5a59a695a73e0cde9a61e0feae5...
Or reports them, so the NSA can fix them: https://git.kernel.org/linus/3a2f5a59a695a73e0cde9a61e0feae5...
Huawei has already made some 'careless mistakes':
https://www.zdnet.com/article/huawei-denies-involvement-in-b...
And they follow the "deny, deny, lie" aspect of their government as well. Wish they would have some honesty. You can't call a project named after your company not involved with your company.
If a state actor really wants to do it and someone could get it past reviews, I am sure they could bribe any contributor from any country (including US). Why single out China? We never raised concerns with Russian contributors.
Maybe not single out China, but many people think China is particularly untrustworthy:
they insist Chinese law is used outside China, and lecture people how they should refer to China in public;
they operate concentration camps;
the Chinese language has no word for *mutuality*, China benefits from free speech and access to institutions in the West but doesn't allow the same in China for journalists or businessmen;
China treats Chinese-speaking minority in Western countries as Chinese citizens, and even blackmails them by threating their family;
Winnie the Pooh is extremely thin-skinned and can have games like Devotion removed from Steam and GOG even after the reference is removed from the secret area in the game;
there are many instances where businesses with Chinese shareholders were pressured not to publish anything mildly critical of China.
BBC team visiting China investigating covid19 faced obstacles reminiscent of The Truman Show;
WHO scientists investigating covid19 recently not permitted into China;
China doesn't even formally frown at corruption;
Journalists disappear or regularly get sentences in China;
> China doesn't even formally frown at corruption;
That is such a ridiculous claim considering that Xi Jinping strengthened his power through anti-corruption efforts:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-corruption_campaign_und...
That is such a ridiculous claim considering that Xi Jinping strengthened his power through anti-corruption efforts:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-corruption_campaign_und...
as someone entirely in the dark on this particular campaign, it seems pretty easy to me to label people corrupt and remove them when they disagree with me. They don't have to actually be corrupt, just not align with my goals. What's to say this isn't the case?
> they insist Chinese law is used outside China
They're touchy about people recognizing what they view as separatist movements, but that's relatively minor compared to, say, the United States forcing its sanctions policy on the rest of the world. Everyone around the world is afraid of doing business with Cuba, Iran, Huawei, and other targets of US sanctions, because the US aggressively applies secondary sanctions. The US is even sanctioning Germany, its own ally, in order to try to force Germany to back out of a pipeline deal with Russia.
> the Chinese language has no word for mutuality
There are many ways to say "win-win" in Chinese, and if you ever listen to Chinese diplomats, they say that phrase incessantly.
> China doesn't even formally frown at corruption;
One of Xi Jinping's most highly publicized policies (inside China) is his anti-corruption campaign. This is practically his signature policy. You can argue the policy isn't in effective or isn't sincere, but to say that corruption isn't formally frowned upon us just wrong.
> WHO scientists investigating covid19 recently not permitted into China;
China hasn't processed their visas quickly. I'd wait a bit before passing judgment.
They're touchy about people recognizing what they view as separatist movements, but that's relatively minor compared to, say, the United States forcing its sanctions policy on the rest of the world. Everyone around the world is afraid of doing business with Cuba, Iran, Huawei, and other targets of US sanctions, because the US aggressively applies secondary sanctions. The US is even sanctioning Germany, its own ally, in order to try to force Germany to back out of a pipeline deal with Russia.
> the Chinese language has no word for mutuality
There are many ways to say "win-win" in Chinese, and if you ever listen to Chinese diplomats, they say that phrase incessantly.
> China doesn't even formally frown at corruption;
One of Xi Jinping's most highly publicized policies (inside China) is his anti-corruption campaign. This is practically his signature policy. You can argue the policy isn't in effective or isn't sincere, but to say that corruption isn't formally frowned upon us just wrong.
> WHO scientists investigating covid19 recently not permitted into China;
China hasn't processed their visas quickly. I'd wait a bit before passing judgment.
Ever heard that Taiwan is doing a stellar job holding off coronavirus? No, because China presses WHO into not mentioning Taiwan. We could learn a lot from Taiwan. China doesn't just boycott Taiwan, it makes others act as if the country doesn't exist.
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/taiwan
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/taiwan
There's a frozen civil war in China. The government is obviously touchy about other countries recognizing what it views as a breakaway province. China views such recognition as meddling in its internal affairs.
In Western news coverage, though, I see precisely the opposite of what you see. Taiwan is often listed as an example to follow, while China's combating of the epidemic is largely ignored. A lot of people even seem to think that the epidemic is still raging in China, but that it's all just being covered up.
In Western news coverage, though, I see precisely the opposite of what you see. Taiwan is often listed as an example to follow, while China's combating of the epidemic is largely ignored. A lot of people even seem to think that the epidemic is still raging in China, but that it's all just being covered up.
a) It's not Western news coverage but international.
b) No one believes anything China has to say because they have a history of coverups and suppression.
c) The lack of an independent press or judiciary means we don't have mechanisms to independently assess the truth.
b) No one believes anything China has to say because they have a history of coverups and suppression.
c) The lack of an independent press or judiciary means we don't have mechanisms to independently assess the truth.
It's not actually difficult to know what the basic situation is in China right now. Go on YouTube Twitter, or any other large social media platform and look at what people who are currently in China are saying. Even in this thread, I'm sure that some of the commenters are in China.
You can also look coverage by Western press in China. A German-French public broadcaster did a report from Wuhan not too long ago that shows how different the situation is there from Europe and the US: [1,2].
By the way, documents from Hubei province have leaked, and the number of people testing positive for SARS-CoV-2 in internal government records roughly matches the numbers that were published each day.
1. German: https://youtu.be/LmsI7lc2_Vg
2. French: https://youtu.be/OyHt7-KmK7Y
You can also look coverage by Western press in China. A German-French public broadcaster did a report from Wuhan not too long ago that shows how different the situation is there from Europe and the US: [1,2].
By the way, documents from Hubei province have leaked, and the number of people testing positive for SARS-CoV-2 in internal government records roughly matches the numbers that were published each day.
1. German: https://youtu.be/LmsI7lc2_Vg
2. French: https://youtu.be/OyHt7-KmK7Y
Since you mention YouTube, I quickly compile a list of Westerners who have lived some time in China, i.e. not tourists. To help people make decision if they are brainwashed. But usually "Brainwash" means brainwashed people can not find they are brainwashed.
List A: These 2 guys are thinkers then others. They should be working on different job. Expecially in Western intellegence to help westener better undrestading China)
1. Cyrus Janssen(American)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxEQsjgRRfGWiJJu_PDygxw
2. Daniel Dumbrill(Canadian)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6Bl8MTbW9M9MQoPhxbarpw
List B: (Positive)
3 Matt (American)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8Ykci4MKSSdTJYuYp53G7A
4 Gweilo 60 (Canadian. Mainly positive. He also talked about negative side)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChXOhG9bRDb3vSTg-qkPAZg
5 Jason(British)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCzDE2LGSmJnw53WrZ7mM_Aw
6 Nathan Rish(American. Seem a little opinionted)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaSlyjhR4WC7QhYuaivxb6g
List C: (Negative, but was positive)
7 serpentza (South African, the oldest vlogger about China)
https://www.youtube.com/user/serpentza
8 laowhy86 (American)
https://www.youtube.com/user/laowhy86
(edit) reformat
List A: These 2 guys are thinkers then others. They should be working on different job. Expecially in Western intellegence to help westener better undrestading China)
1. Cyrus Janssen(American)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxEQsjgRRfGWiJJu_PDygxw
2. Daniel Dumbrill(Canadian)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6Bl8MTbW9M9MQoPhxbarpw
List B: (Positive)
3 Matt (American)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC8Ykci4MKSSdTJYuYp53G7A
4 Gweilo 60 (Canadian. Mainly positive. He also talked about negative side)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChXOhG9bRDb3vSTg-qkPAZg
5 Jason(British)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCzDE2LGSmJnw53WrZ7mM_Aw
6 Nathan Rish(American. Seem a little opinionted)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCaSlyjhR4WC7QhYuaivxb6g
List C: (Negative, but was positive)
7 serpentza (South African, the oldest vlogger about China)
https://www.youtube.com/user/serpentza
8 laowhy86 (American)
https://www.youtube.com/user/laowhy86
(edit) reformat
Taiwan is not a country in China's eyes. Technically Taiwan is really not a country but works like one since 1949. If you follow Winnie the Poh closely enough, he has claimed "Taiwan problem will not be passed onto next generation". My personal estimate is that Taiwan will be taken by force within 20 years.
Do you feel it'd be an amphibious invasion would be a bit of a pyrrhic victory within 20 years? I feel like the PRC would be unpopular with the citizens of Taiwan and not look good internationally.
My impression is that the PRC was sabre-rattling to rally the public.
My impression is that the PRC was sabre-rattling to rally the public.
PRC appears to be unpopular with significant numbers of Hong Kong residents and it most definitely didn't look good internationally. That doesn't necessarily stop them from taking power.
If Taiwan is not a country but a Chinese province, why is China ashamed of it? A province famous for electronic industry and very successful against global pandemic.
My personal estimate is that Taiwan will become a forgotten remnant after Pooh Jinping goes into the void in 20 years.
I'm not the GP, but:
Yes, I heard about it plenty of times.
It's great that they're doing well, but that doesn't diminish the Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese, Newzealandese accomplishments in tackling covid19
Yes, I heard about it plenty of times.
It's great that they're doing well, but that doesn't diminish the Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese, Newzealandese accomplishments in tackling covid19
> The US is even sanctioning Germany
The US has not sanctioned Germany. E.g. a US company subject to the EU Global Human Rights sanctions regime does not mean the EU is sanctioning the US.
The US has not sanctioned Germany. E.g. a US company subject to the EU Global Human Rights sanctions regime does not mean the EU is sanctioning the US.
This is a major project that the German government is heavily involved in. Major German companies are under threat of sanctions. The US is using sanctions in order to try to force the German government to change its strategic and economic policy. This is a bit more than the US sanctioning some random German company.
> They're touchy about people recognizing what they view as separatist movements
I love how you refer to mass kidnapping of protestors from Hong Kong "touchy".
I love how you refer to mass kidnapping of protestors from Hong Kong "touchy".
I didn't say anything remotely like that.
[deleted]
Some of your points feel off to me:
"they insist Chinese law is used outside China, and lecture people how they should refer to China in public;"
"they operate concentration camps;"
"the Chinese language has no word for *mutuality*"
"China benefits from free speech"
"Winnie the Pooh is extremely thin-skinned and can have games like Devotion removed from Steam and GOG even after the reference is removed from the secret area in the game;"
"there are many instances where businesses with Chinese shareholders were pressured not to publish anything mildly critical of China."
"BBC team visiting China investigating covid19 faced obstacles reminiscent of The Truman Show;"
"WHO scientists investigating covid19 recently not permitted into China;"
"China doesn't even formally frown at corruption;"
Everything you wrote is pathetically false. Why not be honest because shitty propaganda harms your cause more than it helps.
Here's me being European and thinking, how many of these could be applied to USA as well. At least Xi Jinping is a properly ruthless politician, his thinner-skinned equivalent in the USA is just a fucking idiot running around screaming.
Yeah, yeah, "whataboutism". BTW, Chinese values, or Chinese government values? I'm sure the average Chinese would speak up if they knew they wouldn't end up in reeducation camp. Yeah I'll give you one thing, at least in the West it's still possible to speak up.
Meanwhile, in Washington DC at the moment, there are violence-ready Americans openly demanding democracy be ignored and to install their preferred fuckwit as ruler. Seems like they're just as brainwashed as a Chinese who's been fed CCP propaganda.
Yeah, yeah, "whataboutism". BTW, Chinese values, or Chinese government values? I'm sure the average Chinese would speak up if they knew they wouldn't end up in reeducation camp. Yeah I'll give you one thing, at least in the West it's still possible to speak up.
Meanwhile, in Washington DC at the moment, there are violence-ready Americans openly demanding democracy be ignored and to install their preferred fuckwit as ruler. Seems like they're just as brainwashed as a Chinese who's been fed CCP propaganda.
> I'm sure the average Chinese would speak up if they knew they wouldn't end up in reeducation camp
What is the average standard of living in China 50 years ago vs today? There has been remarkable growth for millions of people. If your standard of living was 10x your parents, you might not view life as that bad?
What is the average standard of living in China 50 years ago vs today? There has been remarkable growth for millions of people. If your standard of living was 10x your parents, you might not view life as that bad?
This is exactly the point a lot of people miss: as long as the quality of life keeps growing, nobody will do anything about it. However, once it starts slowing down or even going down, then the government will start having really hard time. This repeats throughout the history again and again.
I'll give you another example. A man was removed from a Polish reality TV show because he had been accused of rape outside Poland. The TV station was TVN, owned by US. The participant had received a sexual favor from a 16 year old. The age of consent in Poland is 15.
I'm not impressed by ruthless politicians. Ruthlessness is good for action movie thrills. It takes much more skill and leadership to forge compromises and unite people using respect. By the way Spartans sucked even at combat, they just had really good PR. No matter how you slice it, they were completely average, even if you exclude naval battles or battles which included their allies.
(extremely long reads for those interested in history)
https://acoup.blog/2019/08/16/collections-this-isnt-sparta-p...
https://acoup.blog/2020/01/17/collections-the-fremen-mirage-...
re: whataboutism. Whataboutism has no place here because it's not even on the same order of magnitude. You're comparing tons to kilograms. We don't even know the full extent of what China is doing because free press is not allowed to operate there, doctors and journalists get sentences.
I'm not impressed by ruthless politicians. Ruthlessness is good for action movie thrills. It takes much more skill and leadership to forge compromises and unite people using respect. By the way Spartans sucked even at combat, they just had really good PR. No matter how you slice it, they were completely average, even if you exclude naval battles or battles which included their allies.
(extremely long reads for those interested in history)
https://acoup.blog/2019/08/16/collections-this-isnt-sparta-p...
https://acoup.blog/2020/01/17/collections-the-fremen-mirage-...
re: whataboutism. Whataboutism has no place here because it's not even on the same order of magnitude. You're comparing tons to kilograms. We don't even know the full extent of what China is doing because free press is not allowed to operate there, doctors and journalists get sentences.
Reality check: if a state actor wants to add a backdoor it's easier at the parts closest to the consumer: the integrators, not the fundamental technology
Of course you could be playing the long game as well like with Dual-EC-DRBG
Of course you could be playing the long game as well like with Dual-EC-DRBG
It's not even necessary to mention China and Russia, the NSA is equally interested in placing a backdoor in the Linux kernel. People were paranoid about it already 20 years ago [0], but according to Linus' father, NSA actually tried to pull it off [1].
[0] https://freedom-to-tinker.com/2013/10/09/the-linux-backdoor-...
[1] https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/11/nsa-ask-linus-torvalds-i...
[0] https://freedom-to-tinker.com/2013/10/09/the-linux-backdoor-...
[1] https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/11/nsa-ask-linus-torvalds-i...
[deleted]
Eh you may want to read up about the NSA history of backdoors.
Honestly, people seem to forget that this happened. They lose their shit at the slightest mention of Huawei/China but don't even have an issue using software released by the NSA[0].
Unpopular opinion, but if I had to choose between China and the U.S. spying on me, I would pick the one who's less likely to have me extradited from whatever country I am in or ban me from flying.
0.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghidra
Unpopular opinion, but if I had to choose between China and the U.S. spying on me, I would pick the one who's less likely to have me extradited from whatever country I am in or ban me from flying.
0.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghidra
> I would pick the one who's less likely to have me extradited from whatever country I am in or ban me from flying.
Frankly, I despise what the American government did to Assange and Manning. However, you can't even remotely compare their fate to what is happening every day to hundreds and thousands of people in different parts of China like Tibet. You have no chance of escaping, no chance of trial not to mention any appeal, your life can be destroyed in an instant. Several people in Tibet each year prefer to self-immolate than live under the terrible conditions imposed by the Chinese government.
Frankly, I despise what the American government did to Assange and Manning. However, you can't even remotely compare their fate to what is happening every day to hundreds and thousands of people in different parts of China like Tibet. You have no chance of escaping, no chance of trial not to mention any appeal, your life can be destroyed in an instant. Several people in Tibet each year prefer to self-immolate than live under the terrible conditions imposed by the Chinese government.
For sure, China does awful things to many of its citizens.
But for an American, China doesn't have the ability to do any of that stuff. Nor are they likely to have any reason to care about my actions. While on the other hand, the USA has direct powers over me, and is likely to care more because I'm here.
So sure, China and the CCP are evil, probably much more evil than the US government. But even at that, the danger they pose to a typical US citizen is much less than that of their own government. So it's rational prefer, say, a Chinese-made phone to a US-made one.
But for an American, China doesn't have the ability to do any of that stuff. Nor are they likely to have any reason to care about my actions. While on the other hand, the USA has direct powers over me, and is likely to care more because I'm here.
So sure, China and the CCP are evil, probably much more evil than the US government. But even at that, the danger they pose to a typical US citizen is much less than that of their own government. So it's rational prefer, say, a Chinese-made phone to a US-made one.
About self-immolations for "Free Tibet": People in India, born in India, who have never visited Tibet are self immolating
https://qz.com/india/632077/quietly-a-tibetan-teenager-in-in...
To me, this does not speak about extreme suffering in Tibet, but rather:
1- A very strong sense of self-sacrifice and pride in their community
2- A very effective propaganda machine that persuades even people who haven't experienced suffering first-hand, to make the extreme sacrifice in support of the cause
https://qz.com/india/632077/quietly-a-tibetan-teenager-in-in...
To me, this does not speak about extreme suffering in Tibet, but rather:
1- A very strong sense of self-sacrifice and pride in their community
2- A very effective propaganda machine that persuades even people who haven't experienced suffering first-hand, to make the extreme sacrifice in support of the cause
Interesting opinion, given what Tibet looked like before Chinese invasion (tl;dr: it was a totalitarian hellhole, not comparable with the current situation).
If it's so improved, you have to explain why Tibetans regularly risk their lives escaping over the border to India, where - so long as they are not shot by border guards - they join the ruler of that former totalitarian hellhole, the Dalai Lama, in Dharamsala.
I'd like to read more, do you have any sources?
Speaking from personal experience (I met exiles in Northern India in the 90s). Here's a source, though I don't know how reliable it is: https://bylinetimes.com/2020/01/22/china-clamps-down-on-the-...
They might have been brainwashed - after all, religion plays a role here. Also, getting rid of slavery does hurt the situation of previous slave owners.
You can't just compare what US does to some individuals, and what China does to the entire minority populations of Uighurs (13M people) or Tibetans (7M), like harvesting their organs for example
https://www.businessinsider.com/china-harvesting-organs-of-u...
https://www.businessinsider.com/china-harvesting-organs-of-u...
Yeah, the US just kills civilians around the world at will, invading whatever country they think they own.
So you choose the US?
I understood china.
china has extradition laws just like the US. But the major difference (other than the list of countries they have treaties with) is if you insult the US government, nothing would happen, if you insulted the ccp, they would make up some false accusations to extradite you and throw you in jail, like whats happening already with Hong Kong.
So you're definitely safer with the US than you are with china.
So you're definitely safer with the US than you are with china.
Saving people the google search, I believe secfirstmd is referring to:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gRsgkdfYJ8
For anyone not good with faces the guy responding is Linus Torvalds who created and still manages Linux.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gRsgkdfYJ8
For anyone not good with faces the guy responding is Linus Torvalds who created and still manages Linux.
I didn't read the above comment as dismissing the NSA's history with backdoors. It generalizes by referring to 'state actors'. The NSA is not mentioned at all.
Perhaps it was edited?
Perhaps it was edited?
(Unknown) and (none) are pretty large contributors too...
Surprise that Apple is NOT on that list
This is concerning
Gonna be great when Congress gets word of this
You expect Congress to understand this in the first place?
Sure, the power balance just shifted substantially, but it still doesn't change the fact that a significant chunk of its leadership (majority party or otherwise) can't be bothered to understand how search rankings work, or how Facebook makes money.
And this extends at least as far back as the 90s, when Congress shuttered the Office of Technology Assessment, whose literal job was to educate them on these exact sorts of issues.
Sure, the power balance just shifted substantially, but it still doesn't change the fact that a significant chunk of its leadership (majority party or otherwise) can't be bothered to understand how search rankings work, or how Facebook makes money.
And this extends at least as far back as the 90s, when Congress shuttered the Office of Technology Assessment, whose literal job was to educate them on these exact sorts of issues.
What can congress do? They're already blacklisted.
The only thing left is to shoot your own foot. Maybe avoid that?
I've seen nothing logical that came out of Trumps silly blacklisting except cashing out on the reputation the US had for pennies on the dollar. China is destined to be Europe and the US combined in term of tech. Time will tell if their culture causes problem for them.
Smart high intelligence people + strong work ethic + competition and not rent seeking by incumbents. They're only second to Israel in terms of average human intelligence.
Every top math Olympiad participant representing the US is of Chinese ethnicity/descent, this should be noted.
I've seen nothing logical that came out of Trumps silly blacklisting except cashing out on the reputation the US had for pennies on the dollar. China is destined to be Europe and the US combined in term of tech. Time will tell if their culture causes problem for them.
Smart high intelligence people + strong work ethic + competition and not rent seeking by incumbents. They're only second to Israel in terms of average human intelligence.
Every top math Olympiad participant representing the US is of Chinese ethnicity/descent, this should be noted.
Suggesting that human intelligence varies by race is a very old, very debunked idea that no-one believes any more outside of some small racist cliques.
I haven't seen any good studies debunking it, but neither have I seen any studies which prove it. That IQ is heritable and has a large genetic component however is "settled science" [a], and the current trend in behavioural genetics seems to be that a large swathe of cognitive and social behaviours are very heritable indeed.
[a]: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4270739/
[a]: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4270739/
This comment should be voted down; it is inline with the current social attitudes in the US but it is scientifically not true. Nothing has been debunked. What we do know is IQ is heritable AND China has people with High IQ. Whether IQ is inherited for chinas case or whether IQ is a good quantitative measure for intelligence is not formally established but the parent-parent poster does not make an unrealistic proposition. I may get voted down on this but shame on people who voted this up for supporting a social ideal over the cold hard truth. Nothing has been debunked.
Genetics control how we look physically across all races, there is no black magic that suddenly makes every race equal in intelligence and behavior while only controlling for physical differences. Uphold your social ideals but don’t let your ideals blind you from the cold hard truth.
Genetics control how we look physically across all races, there is no black magic that suddenly makes every race equal in intelligence and behavior while only controlling for physical differences. Uphold your social ideals but don’t let your ideals blind you from the cold hard truth.
it's not "cold hard truth" it's a right-wing white-supremacist dog whistle.
No it’s not. The biases that infect the white supremacist are just one side of the extremist coin. You live on the other side of extremism. Unable to see the scientific truth past your idealism.
The white supremacist sees himself as superior even though reality says he clearly isn’t and you see everything as equal even though it clearly isn’t the case. The truth is far more complex. But that is irrelevant to you. You don’t care about the truth, you only care about defeating your enemy, the white supremacist.
Thats why your childish response tries to turn the whole topic into a war against your personal enemy. Almost no one here is a white supremacist so your statement serves no one other than yourself.
How can I say so much about your character without really knowing you? First off you made a huge logical error that reveals your biases.
IQ scores do not make white people look good. They make Asians look smart. If anything IQ scores will be utilized by Asian supremacists NOT white supremacists. It is totally illogical to think that IQ scores are used by white supremacists when Asians have Superior scores.
Yet here you are calling it a white supremacist dog whistle. Totally illogical. So why do you do it? Again the only reason here is because your statement serves your own personal biases. My advice to you is to to cast your biases aside and try to be more logical. You are a software engineer and logical thought is a required trait for all software engineers so it's good for you to train for this because clearly you lack training in this area.
The white supremacist sees himself as superior even though reality says he clearly isn’t and you see everything as equal even though it clearly isn’t the case. The truth is far more complex. But that is irrelevant to you. You don’t care about the truth, you only care about defeating your enemy, the white supremacist.
Thats why your childish response tries to turn the whole topic into a war against your personal enemy. Almost no one here is a white supremacist so your statement serves no one other than yourself.
How can I say so much about your character without really knowing you? First off you made a huge logical error that reveals your biases.
IQ scores do not make white people look good. They make Asians look smart. If anything IQ scores will be utilized by Asian supremacists NOT white supremacists. It is totally illogical to think that IQ scores are used by white supremacists when Asians have Superior scores.
Yet here you are calling it a white supremacist dog whistle. Totally illogical. So why do you do it? Again the only reason here is because your statement serves your own personal biases. My advice to you is to to cast your biases aside and try to be more logical. You are a software engineer and logical thought is a required trait for all software engineers so it's good for you to train for this because clearly you lack training in this area.
No, my response is based on the science.
The cold hard truth is that there isn't a single study identifying any kind of racial component to IQ (and please supply one if you know different).
The reason it's a white supremecist dog whistle is that any theory that suggests that character has anything to do with race allows racists to say that "they are like this, therefore we must treat them like this". Also, nazism - the Nazis were huge believers in racial differences.
If we can agree that individual differences in IQ massively outweigh all other factors (in that there are low-IQ asians, and high-IQ white folks) then any kind of racial profiling around this is just racism. You cannot conclude anything about an individual from their race.
And you're not controlling for cultural differences. I've spent time in Asia, and the cultural differences are enormous. Massively outweighing any genetic differences.
The cold hard truth is that there isn't a single study identifying any kind of racial component to IQ (and please supply one if you know different).
The reason it's a white supremecist dog whistle is that any theory that suggests that character has anything to do with race allows racists to say that "they are like this, therefore we must treat them like this". Also, nazism - the Nazis were huge believers in racial differences.
If we can agree that individual differences in IQ massively outweigh all other factors (in that there are low-IQ asians, and high-IQ white folks) then any kind of racial profiling around this is just racism. You cannot conclude anything about an individual from their race.
And you're not controlling for cultural differences. I've spent time in Asia, and the cultural differences are enormous. Massively outweighing any genetic differences.
> No, my response is based on the science.
Then cite your science. Don't give me some one sentence response with no evidence.
>The cold hard truth is that there isn't a single study identifying any kind of racial component to IQ (and please supply one if you know different).
I literally stated that the cold hard truth makes this controversial not definitive. There is no single study that race as a causative factor for IQ but there is also no single study that definitively separates IQ and race. This is something hard to measure, but it is highly highly unrealistic to assume that there is zero correlation with IQ and race when all genes control both physical attributes and mental attributes. What we do know is that IQ is correlated with race. This much is true. Correlation doesn't imply causation but it doesn't terminate any possibility of causation either. In fact correlation is a prerequisite to causation.
https://www.worlddata.info/iq-by-country.php
Note that for the above Asian countries have vastly different cultures between countries. Also note that despite vastly different cultures the top countries are mostly Asian. Correlation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence#Group_di...
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18656315/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S01602...
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20712152/
Actual studies are numerous and produces definitive differences between in IQ between countries AND race. What causes these differences is controversial but the difference and correlations exist (even when accounting for Asians and white people living in the same culture.) There are even studies where the authors conclude that IQ is indeed caused by race. However there are conflicting conclusions that say otherwise. The causation is controversial but the correlation is definitive.
>If we can agree that individual differences in IQ massively outweigh all other factors (in that there are low-IQ asians, and high-IQ white folks) then any kind of racial profiling around this is just racism. You cannot conclude anything about an individual from their race.
I am not arguing for racial profiling. Please do not imply this and turn this into a racist witch hunt. I am arguing for observable facts.
There are low IQ asians and high IQ white people this much is true. But statistics talks in terms of bell curves and generalities. The IQ bell curve for a population of Asians is higher then the IQ bell curve for a population of white people. This fact cannot be denied.
>And you're not controlling for cultural differences. I've spent time in Asia, and the cultural differences are enormous. Massively outweighing any genetic differences.
I am aware of the cultural differences. Show me some studies relating IQ to culture and you have an argument here. However it proves nothing. IQ differences can be influenced by either culture or race or both. There is nothing that definitively proves either factor yet here you are specifically stating that your view is based on science. It is not.
Then cite your science. Don't give me some one sentence response with no evidence.
>The cold hard truth is that there isn't a single study identifying any kind of racial component to IQ (and please supply one if you know different).
I literally stated that the cold hard truth makes this controversial not definitive. There is no single study that race as a causative factor for IQ but there is also no single study that definitively separates IQ and race. This is something hard to measure, but it is highly highly unrealistic to assume that there is zero correlation with IQ and race when all genes control both physical attributes and mental attributes. What we do know is that IQ is correlated with race. This much is true. Correlation doesn't imply causation but it doesn't terminate any possibility of causation either. In fact correlation is a prerequisite to causation.
https://www.worlddata.info/iq-by-country.php
Note that for the above Asian countries have vastly different cultures between countries. Also note that despite vastly different cultures the top countries are mostly Asian. Correlation.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence#Group_di...
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18656315/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S01602...
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20712152/
Actual studies are numerous and produces definitive differences between in IQ between countries AND race. What causes these differences is controversial but the difference and correlations exist (even when accounting for Asians and white people living in the same culture.) There are even studies where the authors conclude that IQ is indeed caused by race. However there are conflicting conclusions that say otherwise. The causation is controversial but the correlation is definitive.
>If we can agree that individual differences in IQ massively outweigh all other factors (in that there are low-IQ asians, and high-IQ white folks) then any kind of racial profiling around this is just racism. You cannot conclude anything about an individual from their race.
I am not arguing for racial profiling. Please do not imply this and turn this into a racist witch hunt. I am arguing for observable facts.
There are low IQ asians and high IQ white people this much is true. But statistics talks in terms of bell curves and generalities. The IQ bell curve for a population of Asians is higher then the IQ bell curve for a population of white people. This fact cannot be denied.
>And you're not controlling for cultural differences. I've spent time in Asia, and the cultural differences are enormous. Massively outweighing any genetic differences.
I am aware of the cultural differences. Show me some studies relating IQ to culture and you have an argument here. However it proves nothing. IQ differences can be influenced by either culture or race or both. There is nothing that definitively proves either factor yet here you are specifically stating that your view is based on science. It is not.
Nature vs nurture is an ancient argument. Science indicates both contribute, and IQ is a subjective measure of what's perceived as intelligent anyway.
IQ is not subjective. The word intelligence is subjective. You can't say something like Asians in general are more intelligent then white people but you can say Asians in general have higher IQ.
So a better way to talk about this topic is to ignore the word "intelligence" all together. Just talk about how and why Asians have higher IQ.
So a better way to talk about this topic is to ignore the word "intelligence" all together. Just talk about how and why Asians have higher IQ.
I said the idea that IQ measures intelligence is subjective.
That's only because the word "intelligence" is subjective and ill defined. The problem is our usage of the word intelligence as a primary entity. Instead iq should be the primary benchmark for mental performance and intelligence is just one subjective aspect of it.
I don't read the comment as suggesting that Chinese people are genetically smart - just that they are smart. That IQ varies by race or ethnicity is an established fact, not a debunked theory. The controversial question is why it varies - nature or the environment?
Nature vs nurture is an ancient argument. Science indicates both contribute, and IQ is a subjective measure of what's perceived as intelligent. It certainly isn't settled science that some ethnicities are more intelligent on average than others. That is some James Damore BS that can never be measured. And by the way, we are one human race, according to the scientific definition.
You are only right to the extent that IQ is indeed a "subjective measure". For example, there are IQ differences between black and white people in the US. See e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achievement_gaps_in_the_United.... Debates about this take the form (a) of arguing about what IQ measures, and whether it is valid; (b) of arguing about whether environmental or genetic factors contribute to the differences - for instance, if you have worse nutrition, experience more air pollution, or have a less stimulating home environment, all of these might cause your IQ to be lower than someone else. However, there is no serious debate that the gaps in IQ tests (and many other achievement measures) exist.
The debate about whether IQ is "subjective" is ongoing but some things are pretty clearly known. For instance, IQ is highly predictive of many life outcomes, and many different kinds of academic tests all load on a single factor (general intelligence).
This has all been debated up and down the hillsides, and although I don't think IQ is the single measure that defines everything (obviously?), you are premature to dismiss IQ as "subjective". That's far from obvious.
The debate about whether IQ is "subjective" is ongoing but some things are pretty clearly known. For instance, IQ is highly predictive of many life outcomes, and many different kinds of academic tests all load on a single factor (general intelligence).
This has all been debated up and down the hillsides, and although I don't think IQ is the single measure that defines everything (obviously?), you are premature to dismiss IQ as "subjective". That's far from obvious.
Your thesis and supportive arguments contradict your conclusion.
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If the math Olympiad is racist then so is fashion modelling and NFL.
And I called it ethnicity/descent already.
And I called it ethnicity/descent already.
That’s not sufficient evidence for the scale of the claim you’re making about basic human nature. Many other factors can explain China’s success much less the demographic composition of Math Olympiad participants.
Without mentioning how the intelligence is measured, how can you decide that it is racist? You're not assuming good faith.
China is destined by US and European politicians to take power, because those in power are totally corrupt. This has nothing to do with the instrinsic abilities of respective populations. Same goes for Israel. And you have a strange definition of ethics given the amount of IP piracy going on with the blessing of occidental politicians.
[deleted]
> And you have a strange definition of ethics given the amount of IP piracy going on with the blessing of occidental politicians.
What IP did Huawei steal? 5G?
What IP did Huawei steal? 5G?
> Every top math Olympiad participant representing the US is of Chinese ethnicity/descent, this should be noted.
But conversely, if you look at winners of the Fields Medal, Abel Prize, Wolf Prize, Chern Medal etc. There is surprisingly few Chinese recipients despite outnumbering everyone else in total population.
But conversely, if you look at winners of the Fields Medal, Abel Prize, Wolf Prize, Chern Medal etc. There is surprisingly few Chinese recipients despite outnumbering everyone else in total population.
> Chern Medal
Self-explanatory, I think.
Self-explanatory, I think.
[deleted]
Lines of code are not a good metric for the importance of the contributions. You can see that the top developer actually made a single 26k loc commit that just removed a driver.