High blood pressure cases double in 30 years(taipeitimes.com)
taipeitimes.com
High blood pressure cases double in 30 years
https://taipeitimes.com/News/world/archives/2021/08/26/2003763267
125 comments
To anybody dealing with higher than ideal blood pressure, try supplementing magnesium. Magnesium deficiency is not often diagnosed by medical professionals, yet it's very common.
Also anyone suffering from insomnia. Magnesium should be the first thing to try. But never magnesium oxide (the cheapest form) because that does not absorb at all.
Actually, magnesium oxide absorbs just fine.
https://www.algaecal.com/expert-insights/magnesium-oxide-del...
https://www.algaecal.com/expert-insights/magnesium-oxide-del...
Also B1, especially when one's life is plagued by fatigue.
deficiency of ions is almost never measured in any blood test afaik. Almost nobody seems to be looking for deficiencies.
The blood test rarely shows Mg deficiency since the body compensates electrolytes in the blood w/ intra-celular reserves, according to my doctor. The diagnosis is always indirect by other symptoms (decreased reflexes, cramps, insomnia).
Iron deficiency is incredibly obvious on even a simple blood test. It will result in a reduced hematocrit(among other things), which is always calculated.
Or try having a proper diet for your species! The only salt primates are consuming in nature are the minute amounts inside things like tomato and cucumber.
Gorillas specifically seek out salty foods.
https://datadryad.org/stash/dataset/doi:10.5061/dryad.369539...
https://datadryad.org/stash/dataset/doi:10.5061/dryad.369539...
My BP was a clockwork 120/80 all my life. Suddenly, during the last 2 years, without any change of lifestyle, nutrition, or other health status, it went up to a little less than 140/90. I rushed to take Micardis (telmisartan), which did nothing at all. While in Bulgaria, a doctor noticed my heart beat is pretty high (it's been above 90 all my life since youth) and told me I need a beta-blocker. After prescribing me Lodoz (Ziac in the States) (bisoprolol and hydrochlorothiazide), my pulse normalized and my BP dropped below 120/80 even.
Before that, I've tried EVERYTHING for 2 years! Every supplement, every herbal with no effect whatsoever. I've never had magnesium deficiency as for 10+ years I've been taking a mixture of different chelates and supplementing with 500mg a day religiously.
In situations like this, I really start disbelieving in alternative medicine and nutrition as, really, if something works, there'd be a patented drug monetizing the measurable effect.
Of course, with drugs, I don't really know all the negative effects. But! Not all supplements are benign, they can be contaminated, there are almost never recalls for them.
Before that, I've tried EVERYTHING for 2 years! Every supplement, every herbal with no effect whatsoever. I've never had magnesium deficiency as for 10+ years I've been taking a mixture of different chelates and supplementing with 500mg a day religiously.
In situations like this, I really start disbelieving in alternative medicine and nutrition as, really, if something works, there'd be a patented drug monetizing the measurable effect.
Of course, with drugs, I don't really know all the negative effects. But! Not all supplements are benign, they can be contaminated, there are almost never recalls for them.
I suspect social networks have a lot to do with it.
Or, as they say in the actual article, "...reflects concerning worldwide trends in unhealthy lifestyle choices such as high fat, sugar, salt and alcohol intake, sedentary lifestyles with avoidance of exercise and smoking”.
And, as they were so close to writing, "reflections concerning worldwide trends".
The quality of thought in many environments and contexts can show as severely declined. Exposure is with certainty a possible factor impacting on blood pressure, whether it is brought to topic or not (one can perceive it). It is still unhealthy lifestyle.
The quality of thought in many environments and contexts can show as severely declined. Exposure is with certainty a possible factor impacting on blood pressure, whether it is brought to topic or not (one can perceive it). It is still unhealthy lifestyle.
Much more likely it's obesity, highly processed foods, lack of physical activity due to sitting at the computer, etc.
Most people spend most of their time sitting at computers on various forms of social networks, so you're both right.
The factors you mention definitely don’t help but you’d be surprised how much of HBP is just genetics. I’m slim, run at least three times a week and ran a marathon two years ago, don’t eat much meat, rarely drink, non smoker and yet I have HBP and had to start taking pills recently. In my case it doesn’t help that both parents suffer from the condition.
But saying that you have HBP == you live an unhealthy lifestyle is just not true.
But saying that you have HBP == you live an unhealthy lifestyle is just not true.
This is actually a good observation, unreasonably downvoted. Obesity appears to be a viral disease, looking at its growth. Now the question to answer is, is the viral spread of obesity explained by social contagion or by bacteria.
I don't know if this analysis also included changes in what is considered hypertension. They've changed multiple times, every time decreasing the limit. Sure, it would be great to have 110/70 every time, but even for a healthy and young person I find myself borderline.
Take it yourself for 30 days. Don't count on that one visit to the doctor's office.
Also, some people have so-called White coat hypertension. Basically, a medical appointment stresses them enough that they present with HBP even though they are, in fact, healthy.
To mitigate this, frequent measurements at home or at work should be taken. Those give you much more information about your status.
To mitigate this, frequent measurements at home or at work should be taken. Those give you much more information about your status.
But isn’t it very common to account for the white coat syndrome?
I was recently diagnosed with HBP and the process went like this: - doctor took the measurement, was very high
- asked me to measure at home, call if it was still high (it was, but much lower)
- invited me over, I got a blood pressure monitor for 24h. That showed a borderline 130/85) higher BP. For comparison, he was reading 160/100 at his office..
This is just to illustrate that doctors should know about the white coat syndrome and shouldn’t diagnose you based on readings in their office only.
I was recently diagnosed with HBP and the process went like this: - doctor took the measurement, was very high
- asked me to measure at home, call if it was still high (it was, but much lower)
- invited me over, I got a blood pressure monitor for 24h. That showed a borderline 130/85) higher BP. For comparison, he was reading 160/100 at his office..
This is just to illustrate that doctors should know about the white coat syndrome and shouldn’t diagnose you based on readings in their office only.
Competent and caring doctors know about it and mind it, yes. Finding those that do have free patient slots is quite a quest, though. Especially outside large urban centers.
You will always find a great cardiologist or dentist in Prague. Ostrava is already much more challenging and Bruntál means playing it on hard mode :)
You will always find a great cardiologist or dentist in Prague. Ostrava is already much more challenging and Bruntál means playing it on hard mode :)
Yes, I confirm that. I was always found to be hypertensive when I had my blood pressure taken by a nurse, but when I took it myself it was usually only a bit elevated (between 120-135) or normal (between 110-120). As a result I was diagnosed with white coat hypertension.
Same, then after my systolic climbed to to 180-200 they got around to diagnosing me with kidney disease. I ended up with permanent vision and kidney damage because other than that, I was an apparently healthy young person.
Even mild hypertension can be a serious indicator of potentially life threatening, or at least altering, issues. If you measure high at the doctor, measure yourself at home and keep a log.
Even mild hypertension can be a serious indicator of potentially life threatening, or at least altering, issues. If you measure high at the doctor, measure yourself at home and keep a log.
Sorry to hear that. Yes, I'm keeping a log, and so far all is well. I went from 164/83 in late June, when I started taking measurements, to 114/59 last week, without making any dietary or lifestyle changes. I'm quite convinced it was all psychological.
What was the underlying issue?
A congenital autoimmune disorder that led to renal hypertension in my late teens. This is my first year in remission.
And many nurses don't know how to take it. Half the time they turn the automated machine up to 200. It takes so long to pump up and then vent down that my arm will get tingley and I can feel my blood pulse get stronger.
Well, I have an MD in the household. But I get anxious when measuring blood pressure because I'm scared it will be to high. My dad has it, and I'm always afraid I'll get it too. When she ambushes me and measures it when I don't have the time to panic, it is usually fine.
On the other hand, I had a regular blood test several weeks ago, and my blood sugar was borderline high for a fasting period. I just went out and bought a glucometer and tracked it for days later, it was much lower. It just happened on that one reading at the lab. The only explanation is that I was fasting for too long (close to 16 hours) and the lab was not the first thing I went in the morning, I had one more place to visit before. So my body was already fully woken up and/or my liver started doing its thing and produced glucose from fat or whatever.
On the other hand, I had a regular blood test several weeks ago, and my blood sugar was borderline high for a fasting period. I just went out and bought a glucometer and tracked it for days later, it was much lower. It just happened on that one reading at the lab. The only explanation is that I was fasting for too long (close to 16 hours) and the lab was not the first thing I went in the morning, I had one more place to visit before. So my body was already fully woken up and/or my liver started doing its thing and produced glucose from fat or whatever.
Just want to expand on how I feel this alone is most of the reason why accessing the right healthcare is such a pain. This quick fix culture of "let's get you assessed and we'll have you on some kind of pills in no time. Oh look, it's time for my lunch break!"
Similarly, I've noticed dogma in psychiatry discouraging of "self-diagnosis" and the consequence of that: individuals with stories of spending years experiencing their state of mind, many hours researching it yet still having to go through multiple professionals to arrive at the "right" diagnosis (despite often spoonfeeding the professional the answer on a silver platter yet meeting resistance)
Similarly, I've noticed dogma in psychiatry discouraging of "self-diagnosis" and the consequence of that: individuals with stories of spending years experiencing their state of mind, many hours researching it yet still having to go through multiple professionals to arrive at the "right" diagnosis (despite often spoonfeeding the professional the answer on a silver platter yet meeting resistance)
> This quick fix culture of "let's get you assessed and we'll have you on some kind of pills in no time. Oh look, it's time for my lunch break!"
That's what you get when wrong incentives are in place. Additionally, I believe it would be better to have a separate market for diagnosis (as in, technicians selling their services, not attached to any doctor or hospital) so that you can get tested whenever you want (at your expenses, or partially reimbursed by your insurer, whichever system works best) instead of having a gate-keeper for everything.
That's what you get when wrong incentives are in place. Additionally, I believe it would be better to have a separate market for diagnosis (as in, technicians selling their services, not attached to any doctor or hospital) so that you can get tested whenever you want (at your expenses, or partially reimbursed by your insurer, whichever system works best) instead of having a gate-keeper for everything.
My friend is a practicing doctor and we’ve talked a lot about medicine. The “quick fix” culture is one of his biggest complaints; from his perspective, it mostly comes from profit-seeking hospitals forcing larger and larger case loads. But also, if you’re treating the general public, you’ll encounter a lot of superstition, woo, and “Facebook M.D.s”, so as a patient be prepared to be persistent.
This is true. In 2017, the definition changed from 140 systolic to 130 systolic. Quite a huge win for the pharmaceutical companies that
That's true :( very sad.
> he number of people living with high blood pressure has more than doubled since 1990
> To find out how hypertension rates
So are they talking about raw numbers of cases or rates? That's confusing because the population has massively increased in the past 30 years so of course there should be more cases...
> To find out how hypertension rates
So are they talking about raw numbers of cases or rates? That's confusing because the population has massively increased in the past 30 years so of course there should be more cases...
Good point. World population increased 50% since 1990 and they are comparing raw numbers. So really it is a ~35% increase in the rate and a doubling in absolute numbers.
May be more people measure their blood pressure now? I never cared about it. This year when getting COVID vaccine doctor checked my pressure and it was higher than normal. If not for COVID, I wouldn’t even know about it. Might be an interesting correlation, if doctors check blood pressure before vaccination in other countries.
> May be more people measure their blood pressure now? I never cared about it
Definitely. Especially in non-western countries most people were never tested in the first place.
Definitely. Especially in non-western countries most people were never tested in the first place.
That's why it's called the silent killer. You can have it for years and have no idea until something really bad happens (heart attack, stroke).
Gave me a scare there. World population has only increased by 3 billion since 1990. We good. /s
> World population has only increased by 3 billion since 1990
And nobody is dying from Hunger anymore. What a miracle, if you think about it.
And nobody is dying from Hunger anymore. What a miracle, if you think about it.
More like 5 million per year: https://oi-files-d8-prod.s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/s3fs-pub...
Which is fewer than 1990, despite the population growing.
So?
Imo, 1 billion a decade is way too much. Experts say it will slow down, tbf.
It won't be a problem if we actually start colonizing space. Some safety will have to go out the window, though.
Imo, 1 billion a decade is way too much. Experts say it will slow down, tbf.
It won't be a problem if we actually start colonizing space. Some safety will have to go out the window, though.
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I got rid of my HBP that I had from 24 to 41 years of age through intermittent fasting and it never came back, even though I only fast sometimes these days. I am 43 now.
18/6 scheme works for me.
18/6 scheme works for me.
How long do you fast for before seeing changes?
In my case, the BP dropped after a few weeks. After a month and a half, I could no longer take pills that I took for almost two decades because they depressed my BP to unsafe levels (blacking out when standing up).
My fasting glucose also got lower, though it was never bad to start with. I experimented with a continuous glucose meter and I have seen about 5 per cent reduction (from 5.0 to 4.7 in Euro units).
My fasting glucose also got lower, though it was never bad to start with. I experimented with a continuous glucose meter and I have seen about 5 per cent reduction (from 5.0 to 4.7 in Euro units).
For America:
1. Sodium intake correlates with blood pressure
2. The sodium content of processed foods provide ≈80% of the sodium in the average American diet.
3. According to national food-recall surveys (which underestimate food intake and exclude salt added at the table), daily sodium consumption increased from 2262 mg in 1974 to 3375 mg in 2000.
Excerpted from
https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/81/4/941/4753811
1. Sodium intake correlates with blood pressure
2. The sodium content of processed foods provide ≈80% of the sodium in the average American diet.
3. According to national food-recall surveys (which underestimate food intake and exclude salt added at the table), daily sodium consumption increased from 2262 mg in 1974 to 3375 mg in 2000.
Excerpted from
https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/81/4/941/4753811
Salt has been demonized for high blood pressure maybe unnecessarily. Morton Salt even sued about it once. Unless you are salt sensitive (most people aren’t, you’d know if you were, you would have high blood pressure) eating high salt won’t raise blood pressure. Salt away and stop denying yourself! I think it’s a masochism thing for many people.
https://time.com/3313332/salt-and-blood-pressure/
America’s high blood pressure is probably caused by that 42% obesity rate I saw yesterday…
https://time.com/3313332/salt-and-blood-pressure/
America’s high blood pressure is probably caused by that 42% obesity rate I saw yesterday…
>> Unless you are salt sensitive (most people aren’t, you’d know if you were, you would have high blood pressure) eating high salt won’t raise blood pressure.
The question is how you would know if you have high blood pressure. Most people don't measure their blood pressure as a matter of fact and there are no symptoms of high blood pressure until it gets really, really bad.
The question is how you would know if you have high blood pressure. Most people don't measure their blood pressure as a matter of fact and there are no symptoms of high blood pressure until it gets really, really bad.
Probably assuming a yearly checkup.
Occasional checkups seem to have a tendency to produce inaccurate results. See white coat hypertension, discussed elswhere here. There is also white coat hypotension. In general, the most accurate measurement of blood pressure, as far as I can tell, is the measurement of so-called ambulatory pressure taken with a 24-hour meter.
Besides which a year with high blood pressure can have lasting effects.
Besides which a year with high blood pressure can have lasting effects.
I generally agree. However, sodium imbalance can potentially lead to higher blood pressure. Basically, if one's diet sucks and they aren't getting enough other electrolytes and water, then it could cause a temporary rise.
A lot of people would consider a diet high in salt to "suck", so what do you call a diet that doesn't suck ?
High in fats, sugars and salt?
High in fats, sugars and salt?
If you are eating an otherwise healthy diet, then higher salt intake doesn't mean much. If you are eating fruits and veggies, then your electrolyte intake should be balanced enough not to matter (with sufficient hydration and renal function). For example, if you aren't eating fruits and veggies, your magnesium and potassium levels could be out of whack and cause BP issues.
"A lot of people would consider a diet high in salt to "suck"..."
I don't anyone who thinks that, so I doubt it's "a lot of people".
"A lot of people would consider a diet high in salt to "suck"..."
I don't anyone who thinks that, so I doubt it's "a lot of people".
It sounds like you’re really saying, you can add _some_ salt to your diet, as long as it’s balanced?
Yeah working kidneys should remove salt efficiently the think is HBP often damages kidneys. So people with long term HBP may be less efficient at removing salt than others.
The time article you linked to says:
All of which is surprising given the fact that Americans are bombarded with warnings that we eat far too much: just yesterday, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) issued a report finding that 90% of U.S. children eat more sodium than guidelines recommend. Almost half of that comes from 10 processed foods that kids tend to eat a lot of: pizza, bread, processed meats, savory snacks, sandwiches, cheese, processed chicken, pasta dishes, Mexican dishes, and soup.
The CDC firmly believes that salt directly influences blood pressure. “We consider the totality of the evidence,” said Janelle Gunn of the CDC’s Division of Heart Disease and Stroke Prevention at a press conference. “A vast majority of scientific research confirms that as sodium is reduced, so is blood pressure.”
All of which is surprising given the fact that Americans are bombarded with warnings that we eat far too much: just yesterday, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) issued a report finding that 90% of U.S. children eat more sodium than guidelines recommend. Almost half of that comes from 10 processed foods that kids tend to eat a lot of: pizza, bread, processed meats, savory snacks, sandwiches, cheese, processed chicken, pasta dishes, Mexican dishes, and soup.
The CDC firmly believes that salt directly influences blood pressure. “We consider the totality of the evidence,” said Janelle Gunn of the CDC’s Division of Heart Disease and Stroke Prevention at a press conference. “A vast majority of scientific research confirms that as sodium is reduced, so is blood pressure.”
> "A vast majority of scientific research confirms that as sodium is reduced, so is blood pressure."
Considering that sodium intake was linked to a bad diet ("Almost half of that comes from 10 processed foods that kids tend to eat a lot of: pizza, bread, processed meats, savory snacks, sandwiches, cheese, processed chicken, pasta dishes, Mexican dishes, and soup."), could this be a case of correlation not meaning causation?
Considering that sodium intake was linked to a bad diet ("Almost half of that comes from 10 processed foods that kids tend to eat a lot of: pizza, bread, processed meats, savory snacks, sandwiches, cheese, processed chicken, pasta dishes, Mexican dishes, and soup."), could this be a case of correlation not meaning causation?
“A vast majority of scientific research confirms that as sodium is reduced, so is blood pressure.”
Is that for people who already have hypertension? There's a big difference between causing hypertension and people with hypertension being sensitive to it.
Is that for people who already have hypertension? There's a big difference between causing hypertension and people with hypertension being sensitive to it.
The mechanism by which salt causes high blood pressure is basic. Salt causes fluid retention.
It shouldn't if you have proper fluid intake, balanced electrolyte consumption, and renal function.
By "balanced electrolyte consumption" you mean chemicals such as sodium, right? I'll give you a moment to think about that...
I think the point they were making is that salt when paired with adequate hydration (and offsetting losses from sweating etc.) isn't as obvious an issue.
As always, balance is key. Mediterranean diets aren't skimping on salt but the populations are (relatively) sweating often and taking hydration seriously due to the climate.
If you have an active lifestyle, it sounds reasonable that your salt tolerance could be higher (I'm not a medical professional).
As always, balance is key. Mediterranean diets aren't skimping on salt but the populations are (relatively) sweating often and taking hydration seriously due to the climate.
If you have an active lifestyle, it sounds reasonable that your salt tolerance could be higher (I'm not a medical professional).
Not just sweating, but eating generally healthy foods that contain potassium, magnesium, calcium, etc.
Sodium is just one.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolyte#Physiological_impo...
The average intake for people in the US for magnesium, potassium, and calcium is well below DRI.
https://www.nature.com/articles/1001955
More support/info:
https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Potassium-HealthProfession...
Track your food (myfitnesspal/cronometer/etc) with a cheap gram scale and ensure you are meeting the daily recommended requirements for vitamins and minerals. Plain potatoes are a great source of magnesium and potassium, and are pretty low calorie/healthy if you don't put junk on them, but there are plenty of other foods as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolyte#Physiological_impo...
The average intake for people in the US for magnesium, potassium, and calcium is well below DRI.
https://www.nature.com/articles/1001955
More support/info:
https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Potassium-HealthProfession...
Track your food (myfitnesspal/cronometer/etc) with a cheap gram scale and ensure you are meeting the daily recommended requirements for vitamins and minerals. Plain potatoes are a great source of magnesium and potassium, and are pretty low calorie/healthy if you don't put junk on them, but there are plenty of other foods as well.
Balance is within a range, nobody is saying it’s ok to drink sea water to stay hydrated. But, otherwise healthy adults can safely consume a lot more salt than people with kidney issues.
It’s largely self regulating as people naturally avoid extreme amounts of salt. Even just gargling salt water is unpleasant.
It’s largely self regulating as people naturally avoid extreme amounts of salt. Even just gargling salt water is unpleasant.
For some people it's a great way to get Kidney stones, so maybe there's no need to constantly reach for the shaker, just get used to less salty food and you will be ok.
Right. Yes it's diet related but that's because most American's diets are awful in general.
As an n=1 bit of anecdote, I had hypertension for years, capping out somewhere around 180/120. I was put on low sodium diets with no change at all. I was put on blood pressure medication, with modest benefits.
Then one year I arrived at my annual physical with a dramatic drop. What changed? I lost 30 pounds. The next year I arrived with another notable drop, now square in the normal BP range. What changed? I lost another 10 pounds and had picked up a fair amount of cardiovascular exercise. During this time period and to this day I never bother limiting my sodium intake, and I both have a heavy hand in the kitchen as well as eat out a lot, both leading to high levels.
As an n=1 bit of anecdote, I had hypertension for years, capping out somewhere around 180/120. I was put on low sodium diets with no change at all. I was put on blood pressure medication, with modest benefits.
Then one year I arrived at my annual physical with a dramatic drop. What changed? I lost 30 pounds. The next year I arrived with another notable drop, now square in the normal BP range. What changed? I lost another 10 pounds and had picked up a fair amount of cardiovascular exercise. During this time period and to this day I never bother limiting my sodium intake, and I both have a heavy hand in the kitchen as well as eat out a lot, both leading to high levels.
I watched a great Nature of Things episode called "Pass the Salt" [0] recently which disproved the myth that salt causes high blood pressure.
(It's highly correlated to alcohol intake, smoking, and poor diet in general.)
The data that inferred that salt was the culprit (there was none) almost makes it look like the tobacco/alcohol industries might have cherry picked it to inject doubt on what they probably knew to be true about their products.
Highly recommended watch!
[0] https://www.cbc.ca/natureofthings/episodes/pass-the-salt
(It's highly correlated to alcohol intake, smoking, and poor diet in general.)
The data that inferred that salt was the culprit (there was none) almost makes it look like the tobacco/alcohol industries might have cherry picked it to inject doubt on what they probably knew to be true about their products.
Highly recommended watch!
[0] https://www.cbc.ca/natureofthings/episodes/pass-the-salt
I eat tons of salt, but with a ketogenic diet, and my BP is perfect now (it was always high prior to going keto).
Perhaps your post is an oversimplification.
Perhaps your post is an oversimplification.
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No. The only time sodium impact blood pressure is if you have sodium sensitive hypertension.
Normally functioning kidneys can easily excrete excess sodium with no impact on blood pressure.
Normally functioning kidneys can easily excrete excess sodium with no impact on blood pressure.
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High blood pressure, hypertension, obesity, and insulin resistance often come together. This hallmark combination is caused by the underlying metabolic dysfunction when the body is unable to consume the glucose in full despite it's more than adequate presence in the blood stream.
Keyword: acquired mitochondrial disease. Moderate fasting, moderate physical activities, minerals (magnesium), and vitamins (especially B1, B3) help. The exception is a genetic form of mitochondrial disease which is generally incurable.
Keyword: acquired mitochondrial disease. Moderate fasting, moderate physical activities, minerals (magnesium), and vitamins (especially B1, B3) help. The exception is a genetic form of mitochondrial disease which is generally incurable.
Mitochondrial disease can also be caused by some antibiotics. People tend to think of antibiotics as safe, but some of them can have drastic side effects. Mitochondria are basically bacteria that were incorporated into our cells through endosymbiosis so it's not surprising that treatments to kill off bacteria can also impact them.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3760005/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3760005/
> This hallmark combination is caused by the underlying metabolic dysfunction when the body is unable to consume the glucose in full despite it's more than adequate presence in the blood stream.
Can you perhaps provide some sources to back your claim?
Can you perhaps provide some sources to back your claim?
"Mitochondrial dysfunction leads to decreased β-oxidation and ATP production and increased ROS production, resulting in insulin resistance, diabetes, and cardiovascular disease." [2]
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glycolysis
[2] https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCRESAHA.107.16547...
[3] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC380258/
[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cellular_respiration
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glycolysis
[2] https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCRESAHA.107.16547...
[3] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC380258/
[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cellular_respiration
https://www.amazon.com/Metabolical-Processed-Nutrition-Moder...
p. 39-42
"the kidney is very adept at excreting excess sodium. But there’s one thing that inhibits sodium excretion by the kidney—insulin resistance. High insulin levels increase blood pressure, even with relatively low sodium intake. And many people are insulin resistant—and those people do need to lower their salt as a treatment of the disease."
"the kidney is very adept at excreting excess sodium. But there’s one thing that inhibits sodium excretion by the kidney—insulin resistance. High insulin levels increase blood pressure, even with relatively low sodium intake. And many people are insulin resistant—and those people do need to lower their salt as a treatment of the disease."
Or they could lower carbohydrates, and reverse their insulin resistance.
Correct, for most people. The book I quoted is by Dr Robert Lustig who is a leading voice on that point of view. He would more or less say insulin resistance is the root problem. Chronic conditions like hypertension are symptoms. The whole book is an argument in favor of curing the underlying metabolic disease with diet adjustment.
Yes Virta Health has shown good clinical results with that approach.
https://diabetes.diabetesjournals.org/content/67/Supplement_...
https://diabetes.diabetesjournals.org/content/67/Supplement_...
Cutting out sugar and carbohydrates is key. Recommending lowering salt intake is a low priority when the root cause is usually insulin resistance/obesity.
If potassium levels are low, then potassium chloride can be used (at least partially) as sodium alternative. Potassium works well for lowering blood pressure, according to studies:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41371-020-00396-1
> We believe current guidelines recommending increasing K+ intake for the prevention and treatment of hypertension are justified
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21403995/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32500831/
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article%3Fid%3D10.1371/jou...
https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Potassium-HealthProfession...
Updated to add a caveat in the first sentence.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41371-020-00396-1
> We believe current guidelines recommending increasing K+ intake for the prevention and treatment of hypertension are justified
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21403995/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32500831/
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article%3Fid%3D10.1371/jou...
https://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/Potassium-HealthProfession...
Updated to add a caveat in the first sentence.
Do not mess with K in diet. Its levels are asymptomatic and in a bad day (eg dehydration) a fatal cardiac arrhythmia is possible
What levels are you talking about? The article published in Nature mentions that the general population does not consume enough of it:
> Potassium (K+) is an extremely important mineral, as supported by National Academy of Science, Engineering, and Medicine Dietary Reference Intakes (DRI), and has been designated as a “nutrient of public health concern” due to its general under consumption [3]. In 2004, the Food and Nutrition Board of the Institute of Medicine established recommended intake levels of 4700 mg/day of K+ [4]. Despite these recommendations, data from National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (NHANES) 2007–2008 estimated mean intakes in the United States to be 2290 mg/day for women and 3026 mg/day for men, substantially lower than the suggested values [5]. This relative “deficiency” is even more noteworthy when one considers the K+ intake of prehistoric man was estimated to be 15,000 mg/day, which actually exceeds the NHANES recommendations by a factor greater than 4 [6]. Despite studies demonstrating blood pressure lowering effects of increasing K+ intake, the 2019 DRI concluded more evidence is required to support a DRI for K+ [7].
> Potassium (K+) is an extremely important mineral, as supported by National Academy of Science, Engineering, and Medicine Dietary Reference Intakes (DRI), and has been designated as a “nutrient of public health concern” due to its general under consumption [3]. In 2004, the Food and Nutrition Board of the Institute of Medicine established recommended intake levels of 4700 mg/day of K+ [4]. Despite these recommendations, data from National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey (NHANES) 2007–2008 estimated mean intakes in the United States to be 2290 mg/day for women and 3026 mg/day for men, substantially lower than the suggested values [5]. This relative “deficiency” is even more noteworthy when one considers the K+ intake of prehistoric man was estimated to be 15,000 mg/day, which actually exceeds the NHANES recommendations by a factor greater than 4 [6]. Despite studies demonstrating blood pressure lowering effects of increasing K+ intake, the 2019 DRI concluded more evidence is required to support a DRI for K+ [7].
For potassium there is normally no need for supplements. It is enough to eat more vegetables. The general population, especially in USA, is likely to eat not enough vegetables, so they may have low potassium because of that.
Nevertheless there are old people who may eliminate too easy the potassium from the body. Those at risk to have this are typically old women who have taken during many years medication for high blood pressure. For old men taking medication for high blood pressure, the risks also exist, but they are much lower than for women.
Those belonging to this risk group would better have a few times per year a blood test for electrolytes, especially for the sodium and the potassium concentrations in blood.
Only when the potassium concentration in blood is found to be low even with a healthy diet rich in vegetables, then potassium supplements are needed.
If potassium supplements are taken, chloride is not a good choice, because it provides excess chloride that is not useful. The salt eaten provides enough chloride. Better supplements are based on organic salts of potassium, e.g. lactate or citrate, which provide only potassium without anything else that might have unintended effects.
Source: my mother belonged to this risk group. She developed hyponatremia & hypokalemia and it was a very tough job to determine appropriate doses per day of salt and potassium supplements while maintaining the blood pressure at acceptable levels with only small doses of blood pressure medication, as that increased the rate of elimination for sodium & potassium.
Nevertheless there are old people who may eliminate too easy the potassium from the body. Those at risk to have this are typically old women who have taken during many years medication for high blood pressure. For old men taking medication for high blood pressure, the risks also exist, but they are much lower than for women.
Those belonging to this risk group would better have a few times per year a blood test for electrolytes, especially for the sodium and the potassium concentrations in blood.
Only when the potassium concentration in blood is found to be low even with a healthy diet rich in vegetables, then potassium supplements are needed.
If potassium supplements are taken, chloride is not a good choice, because it provides excess chloride that is not useful. The salt eaten provides enough chloride. Better supplements are based on organic salts of potassium, e.g. lactate or citrate, which provide only potassium without anything else that might have unintended effects.
Source: my mother belonged to this risk group. She developed hyponatremia & hypokalemia and it was a very tough job to determine appropriate doses per day of salt and potassium supplements while maintaining the blood pressure at acceptable levels with only small doses of blood pressure medication, as that increased the rate of elimination for sodium & potassium.
I think your points are valid, I see them as orthogonal to my comments. Just one remark: If part of the sodium intake is replaced with potassium, then chloride should be fine.
While what you say is correct, it is still better to use potassium supplements without chloride, because that gives you the freedom to adjust the sodium and potassium doses independently, without worrying about chloride.
The daily requirements for sodium and chloride are strongly correlated, because their main use is to ensure correct concentrations of ions in the extracellular liquids, where sodium and chloride are the most abundant ions and they are used in proportional quantities.
The main purpose of potassium is as as a positive ion in the intracellular liquids, needed to compensate the charge of the organic acids and phosphoric acid.
Because of that, the quantity of potassium needed by the body is not correlated with the quantity of chloride needed, except weakly and indirectly, due to the normal range of ratios between the quantities of extracellular and intracellular liquids and the similar rates of renal losses.
The daily requirements for sodium and chloride are strongly correlated, because their main use is to ensure correct concentrations of ions in the extracellular liquids, where sodium and chloride are the most abundant ions and they are used in proportional quantities.
The main purpose of potassium is as as a positive ion in the intracellular liquids, needed to compensate the charge of the organic acids and phosphoric acid.
Because of that, the quantity of potassium needed by the body is not correlated with the quantity of chloride needed, except weakly and indirectly, due to the normal range of ratios between the quantities of extracellular and intracellular liquids and the similar rates of renal losses.
thats interesting, online there are lots of articles (including webmd etc) about eating foods with potassium such as black beans, bananas, sweet potatoes etc + lowering sodium intake for hypertension... are you saying thats actually dangerous?
(sorry if the question seems weird, but im genuinely curious)
(sorry if the question seems weird, but im genuinely curious)
K/Na metabolism is tricky. Both are fundamental but in a very different way (Na levels are higher and with more tolerance in fluctuations, hypo/hyper-K can easily stop the heart).
The pressumed effect of K in BP is mainly that K pushes Na outside of renal tubules in an 1:1 analogy, which could be better achieved by not consuming Na in the first place.
In practice for a healthy adult below a certain age K intake is healthy (as it is contained in healthy foods) but otherwise risks arise. Certainly blind suggestion to the public is not warranted and K substitutes are used ONLY on demand (hypo-K, diarrhea etc)
> K pushes Na outside of renal tubules in an 1:1 analogy, which could be better achieved by not consuming Na in the first place.
Eating enough vegetables has many good effects, including providing an adequate quantity of potassium.
Eating too little salt is as dangerous as eating too much salt. The usual recommendation is to eat about 4 to 5 grams of salt per day.
The salt consumption can be a problem when instead of cooking your food with known quantities of salt you buy already processed food, which almost always contains excessive quantities of salt and sugar, because these are very cheap ingredients, which not only reduce the production cost, but they also improve the taste.
So for those buying already prepared food, the normal risk is to eat too much salt. Those who make their own food, must also take care to not eat too little salt.
Eating too little salt is as dangerous as eating too much salt. The usual recommendation is to eat about 4 to 5 grams of salt per day.
The salt consumption can be a problem when instead of cooking your food with known quantities of salt you buy already processed food, which almost always contains excessive quantities of salt and sugar, because these are very cheap ingredients, which not only reduce the production cost, but they also improve the taste.
So for those buying already prepared food, the normal risk is to eat too much salt. Those who make their own food, must also take care to not eat too little salt.
> Eating too little salt is as dangerous as eating too much salt. The usual recommendation is to eat about 4 to 5 grams of salt per day.
Who recommends 4g of salt as a minimum?
Who recommends 4g of salt as a minimum?
E.g. the USA Recommended Dietary Allowances.
Due to the much more frequent cases of excessive salt consumption, the minimum recommended daily quantities are not emphasized, but I have direct experience with the effects of too low salt consumption.
After having a stroke many years earlier, my mother was very concerned about HBP and she consumed low quantities of salt.
That eventually caused serious neurological problems and many months were wasted because she was not diagnosed correctly in the beginning, the various symptoms being attributed to completely different causes.
When the real cause was identified in the end, she very narrowly escaped death.
4 to 5 g/day is expected to be centered in the optimal range of daily salt consumption.
The minimum daily salt consumption under which health problems may appear is obviously much lower, probably under 1 g/day.
However, nobody has done any tests to determine the minimum requirements for humans, so the minimum threshold is not known, like also for all the other required nutrients for humans, because such tests would be dangerous for the test subjects.
Due to the much more frequent cases of excessive salt consumption, the minimum recommended daily quantities are not emphasized, but I have direct experience with the effects of too low salt consumption.
After having a stroke many years earlier, my mother was very concerned about HBP and she consumed low quantities of salt.
That eventually caused serious neurological problems and many months were wasted because she was not diagnosed correctly in the beginning, the various symptoms being attributed to completely different causes.
When the real cause was identified in the end, she very narrowly escaped death.
4 to 5 g/day is expected to be centered in the optimal range of daily salt consumption.
The minimum daily salt consumption under which health problems may appear is obviously much lower, probably under 1 g/day.
However, nobody has done any tests to determine the minimum requirements for humans, so the minimum threshold is not known, like also for all the other required nutrients for humans, because such tests would be dangerous for the test subjects.
Potassium is certainly not good if you are not in the best cardiac health, moreover if you are older
Do you mean in the cases where potassium levels in serum are already too high? That would make sense. Other than that, it seems to be not as simple (just a mouse model, mind you):
> The findings [...] demonstrate the benefit of adequate potassium supplementation on prevention of vascular calcification in atherosclerosis-prone mice, and the adverse effect of low potassium intake
https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/how-too...
> The findings [...] demonstrate the benefit of adequate potassium supplementation on prevention of vascular calcification in atherosclerosis-prone mice, and the adverse effect of low potassium intake
https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/how-too...
any articles about that i can check?
(not old, or have cardiac troubles, but curious)
(not old, or have cardiac troubles, but curious)
I have high blood pressure, I watch my salt intake and I'm certain it is genetic since I eat well and im not overweight.
My father and all my brothers have high blood pressure as well. Each take different meds with varying results.
I'm taking a food supplement, primary herb is motherwart and I've gotten my numbers back to normal.
I've been having my blood pressure steadily rise since being a teenager but now I have a food pill that keeps my numbers proper!
It sounds too good to be true and yet it's not. I've had the levels in normal range for the last 6 months!
This is the specific product I've been using:
https://www.restorativeformulations.com/products/rf-cardiova...
The other suggested food pill is magnesium, which puts me to sleep similar to Benedryl. I take 30 minutes before bed when I remember.
I work with a Natropathic Dr and have brought this up with my general practitioner who is too busy and over worked to follow up much on this.
I have a machine to take my reading so, same machine, same body position, same location, same times. I take my reading randomly lately expecting to get a bad reading and yet it's still normal.
I understand how this makes me look to share my story,like I'm peddling a pill, I'm willing to risk my reputation if it means helping anothers, and just sharing what has worked for me.
I'm 36 years of age.
I grow food but the ingredients in this pill are grown all over the world (there are 5 active ingredients):
Motherwort herb 290mg | Hawthorn leaf & flower 300mg | Passion flower herb 200mg | European Mistletoe leaf 100mg | African Snake Root 24mg
I plan to try to grow some of these plants and potentially try to narrow down if one herb is most responsible than others for my stabilization. It would be cheaper to grow my own herbs if possible.
It took about 3 weeks to see a downward trend.
I quit coffee two years before starting this pill.
My father and all my brothers have high blood pressure as well. Each take different meds with varying results.
I'm taking a food supplement, primary herb is motherwart and I've gotten my numbers back to normal.
I've been having my blood pressure steadily rise since being a teenager but now I have a food pill that keeps my numbers proper!
It sounds too good to be true and yet it's not. I've had the levels in normal range for the last 6 months!
This is the specific product I've been using:
https://www.restorativeformulations.com/products/rf-cardiova...
The other suggested food pill is magnesium, which puts me to sleep similar to Benedryl. I take 30 minutes before bed when I remember.
I work with a Natropathic Dr and have brought this up with my general practitioner who is too busy and over worked to follow up much on this.
I have a machine to take my reading so, same machine, same body position, same location, same times. I take my reading randomly lately expecting to get a bad reading and yet it's still normal.
I understand how this makes me look to share my story,like I'm peddling a pill, I'm willing to risk my reputation if it means helping anothers, and just sharing what has worked for me.
I'm 36 years of age.
I grow food but the ingredients in this pill are grown all over the world (there are 5 active ingredients):
Motherwort herb 290mg | Hawthorn leaf & flower 300mg | Passion flower herb 200mg | European Mistletoe leaf 100mg | African Snake Root 24mg
I plan to try to grow some of these plants and potentially try to narrow down if one herb is most responsible than others for my stabilization. It would be cheaper to grow my own herbs if possible.
It took about 3 weeks to see a downward trend.
I quit coffee two years before starting this pill.
No offense, but this sounds like a bad advert for quackery. Any research or studies you've looked at to back up the claims?
Could be a psychosomatic effect instead of quackery. As blood pressure and psychological stress are often correlated.
While a know that stress can alter readings (white coat syndrome) I can assure you im not under stress at this point in my life. The pill really works for me otherwise I would have not shared. It's the only change I've made.
Well-executed studies usually do control for placebo effect. If you find such studies, then that's a clue there might be something to it.
I was arguing more in the sense that sometimes the placebo effect is all you need. Especially if there is no underlying physical condition but a case of psychological stress. If it's alleviated well by a placebo (or meditation, or other technique), then using something that has a biologically active ingredient might be counterproductive, because of the possibility of adverse side effects. As the side effects are then again medicated, the person is caught in a medication loop.
I'm all for studies and finding the right active molecule for treating the illnesses. But from my anecdotal experience, many cases of the common ailments like back pain[1], stomach problems, blood pressure are either psychogenic or stem from conditions of one's life. If a placebo brings enough amelioration, it should not be considered 'quackery'.
[1] see Dr. Sarno's 'Healing back pain': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTXjsexiDKE
I'm all for studies and finding the right active molecule for treating the illnesses. But from my anecdotal experience, many cases of the common ailments like back pain[1], stomach problems, blood pressure are either psychogenic or stem from conditions of one's life. If a placebo brings enough amelioration, it should not be considered 'quackery'.
[1] see Dr. Sarno's 'Healing back pain': https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTXjsexiDKE
In this case it isn't placebo, I take two pills once per day in the morning. If I back it off to 1 pill my pressure readings increase accordingly after a few days.
Something or a combination of things in this pill is helping my levels stay in acceptable bounds.
Something or a combination of things in this pill is helping my levels stay in acceptable bounds.
Entering "{NAME OF COMPOUND} blood pressure pubmed" or "{NAME OF COMPOUND} blood pressure hindawi" into your favorite search engine usually yields some quick results. I did that for some of the herbs in that formula, and found some interesting papers for each one.
I hear you, other than the fact that I have nothing to gain from sharing, I'm not sure how else to prove it, I mean I have a google spreadsheet I could maybe share.
Grab the ingredient list and search each up in relation to blood pressure reduction and kidney/adrenal healing.
Grab the ingredient list and search each up in relation to blood pressure reduction and kidney/adrenal healing.
All good! I've got diet induced hypertension that I've slowly widled down to almost respectable numbers (125/73) though diet but the last few pips are hard. Always looking for something to help
Try olive leaf extract. Toniq with 50% Oleuropein is the way to go. It’s as effective as pharmaceuticals for me without the side effects. One pill in the morning is enough for me. Half a pill in the morning and another half at night would likely be better. Your results may vary, but most people clock a 10-20 point drop.
Your respectable numbers are my "good" numbers. If you consistently get that for readings I wouldn't worry too much. That's a great reading in my book.
For what it's worth I decided these pills where my last ditch effort before going on a beta blocker. My readings where touching 158/104 at 11am daily. Now I'm in your range on every reading regardless of time or day.
Congrats on your progress mate!
For what it's worth I decided these pills where my last ditch effort before going on a beta blocker. My readings where touching 158/104 at 11am daily. Now I'm in your range on every reading regardless of time or day.
Congrats on your progress mate!
Appreciate it! Sounds like you've made some massive progress yourself.
I've got a family history of shitty hearts. My father basically did everything right (vegan, cardiovascular numbers like an Olympic athlete) and still suffered a minor stroke. Kicked my ass into gear, but had the negative affect of making me hyper-paranoid about all things heart.
All the best on your journey to health
I've got a family history of shitty hearts. My father basically did everything right (vegan, cardiovascular numbers like an Olympic athlete) and still suffered a minor stroke. Kicked my ass into gear, but had the negative affect of making me hyper-paranoid about all things heart.
All the best on your journey to health
You're seriously overlooking the magnesium here. Could be that's what's working.
But I can't comment on the other stuff, it could be effective, I never heard of it.
But I can't comment on the other stuff, it could be effective, I never heard of it.
My BP on my days off is normal. Usually I have my biometrics done during the work day. Going from work to that it is usually elevated. It sounds like work stress is my main cause.
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Wonder if its tied more to our food or drink consumption? Lots of soda has tons of sodium. As well as alcoholic beverages.
The main reason for all three high blood pressure , diabetes and obesity seems to be excess glucose intake in our food. Millets seem to work wonders in solving this problem for society at large. High fiber rich vegetables diet plan is helping in controlling blood pressure and diabetes diseases.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/327501651_A_whole_f...
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/327501651_A_whole_f...
I suspect that lower average nitric oxide levels are one of several factors behind the increase in hypertension rates. Nitric oxide is a vasodilator. Production is stimulated by sunlight exposure and exercise. Generally people are spending less time being active outdoors.