Nigel Farage wants to build a British ICE. Starmer may have handed him the tools(thenerve.news)
thenerve.news
Nigel Farage wants to build a British ICE. Starmer may have handed him the tools
https://www.thenerve.news/p/reform-deportation-operation-restoring-justice-data-surveillance-palantir-uk-labour
34 comments
USA also had all the tools necessary before ICE
AFAICT, the problem in the UK is with too many people being allowed to stay for spurious reasons, not with people not being removed when they (legally) should be ?
Honestly neither of these things is a remotely important problem in the UK. The whole conversation about immigration in the UK is just a dogwhistle to try to attract racist voters now that since brexit they can’t use conversation about the EU for that.
As everywhere, immigration is not an issue for people who do not have to live in social/cheap rented housing in ghettos and have jobs that require a good education.
For the other half of societies, the half you did not meet in college, it is a problem and they are voting for racist parties because the other parties have not reduced immigration it and they think the racist parties will.
For the other half of societies, the half you did not meet in college, it is a problem and they are voting for racist parties because the other parties have not reduced immigration it and they think the racist parties will.
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This is my opinion as well, and it’s not working (thankfully). Let them cry wolf.
Immigration is actually one of the main issues in the UK and it's not about racism.
Productivity, population growth (and impact on housing and services), population aging (and impact on social care and NHS), societal and cultural changes and conflicts, national identity, etc are all linked to immigration.
The issue is compounded by the fact that successive governments say they want to be tough on immigration, but actually do the opposite. This is what pushes voters to Reform UK and away from the Tories, among other things. Labour is now doing the same (relatively tough talk but no actual effective action).
Productivity, population growth (and impact on housing and services), population aging (and impact on social care and NHS), societal and cultural changes and conflicts, national identity, etc are all linked to immigration.
The issue is compounded by the fact that successive governments say they want to be tough on immigration, but actually do the opposite. This is what pushes voters to Reform UK and away from the Tories, among other things. Labour is now doing the same (relatively tough talk but no actual effective action).
> The issue is compounded by the fact that successive governments say they want to be tough on immigration, but actually do the opposite.
There’s a simple explanation for this. Being “tough” on immigration would be bad for the economy, bad for the NHS, and bad for the country as a whole. So once a party is actually in government, they don’t want to do it, whatever they said in order to gain votes during the election campaign.
Or, maybe massively restricting immigration is actually a great idea and the establishment is conspiring to prevent it. Just like with Brexit, right?
There’s a simple explanation for this. Being “tough” on immigration would be bad for the economy, bad for the NHS, and bad for the country as a whole. So once a party is actually in government, they don’t want to do it, whatever they said in order to gain votes during the election campaign.
Or, maybe massively restricting immigration is actually a great idea and the establishment is conspiring to prevent it. Just like with Brexit, right?
High immigration is the cheaper short term solution at the "cost" of other, deeper issues. Restricting immigration is only be "bad" for the economy because systemic issues are not tackled.
The NHS relies on foreign workers. Why? Because salaries and conditions are shit so locals either do not train for those jobs or give up and moce to Australia at some point. It is cheaper to keep it that way.
12% of 25-34 years old are "economically inactive", which means deep systemic issues.
Generally immigration also keep salaries lower and also productivity lower (and that's why the left is actually historically not too keen).
This is difficult to debate seriously because there is always someone to cry "racist".
The NHS relies on foreign workers. Why? Because salaries and conditions are shit so locals either do not train for those jobs or give up and moce to Australia at some point. It is cheaper to keep it that way.
12% of 25-34 years old are "economically inactive", which means deep systemic issues.
Generally immigration also keep salaries lower and also productivity lower (and that's why the left is actually historically not too keen).
This is difficult to debate seriously because there is always someone to cry "racist".
If you actually put the fixes for those “systemic issues” on the table, it’s obvious that no-one is going to vote for them, so they’re total non-starters. E.g. it would be great to pay nurses more, but no-one is going to vote for the tax hike required to fund it.
If any of this is difficult to debate seriously, that’s because opponents of current immigration policy consistently appeal to the lowest common denominator (people’s prejudices) rather than framing a proper argument. Even in this thread, you can see someone trying (absurdly) to redirect the discussion towards some Nigerian nurses with fake qualifications.
If any of this is difficult to debate seriously, that’s because opponents of current immigration policy consistently appeal to the lowest common denominator (people’s prejudices) rather than framing a proper argument. Even in this thread, you can see someone trying (absurdly) to redirect the discussion towards some Nigerian nurses with fake qualifications.
There’s a simple explanation for this. Being “tough” on immigration would be bad for the economy, bad for the NHS, and bad for the country as a whole. So once a party is actually in government, they don’t want to do it, whatever they said in order to gain votes during the election campaign.
Farage is a populist, no doubt about that.
But on the other hand, claiming that, as mentioned, any alternatives to high immigration is bad for the country has to be BS because it does not pass the "smell test". I never understood this stance that countries must have high immigration, that high immigration is good (TM) and that anything else is bigoted and racist. Best theory is that anti-racism has mutated into a monster mixed with business interests only interested in an ever growing labour and consumers pool.
But on the other hand, claiming that, as mentioned, any alternatives to high immigration is bad for the country has to be BS because it does not pass the "smell test". I never understood this stance that countries must have high immigration, that high immigration is good (TM) and that anything else is bigoted and racist. Best theory is that anti-racism has mutated into a monster mixed with business interests only interested in an ever growing labour and consumers pool.
Immigration is not a main issue in the UK. Maybe it is for you?
It’s a topic, but not an “issue”.
It’s a topic, but not an “issue”.
"No, no, it's not an issue for ME" cry the demented Guardian readers.
Further evidence that social democrats are just moderate fascists.
Labour used to be social democracy (to an extent).
Since Starmer hijacked the party and started expelling everyone left of himself it's now somewhere between Tories and Deform on most issues.
Since Starmer hijacked the party and started expelling everyone left of himself it's now somewhere between Tories and Deform on most issues.
Fear mongering clickbait article and headline.
Must be fun to just speculate on pessimism instead of optimism. Gotta get subscribers somehow I suppose, prey on the unhappy and scared.
Must be fun to just speculate on pessimism instead of optimism. Gotta get subscribers somehow I suppose, prey on the unhappy and scared.
What do you mean?
MAGA cheerleader openly admires Trump's methods and personality and seeks their endorsement, and openly plans on making structures similar to abused in the US for human rights abuses already.
They're openly preparing to do exactly that.
And some of the tools (that wouldn't be necessary if not for Fartrage campaigning as well) fit very well in their plans.
What part exactly you consider clickbait and not foreboding?
MAGA cheerleader openly admires Trump's methods and personality and seeks their endorsement, and openly plans on making structures similar to abused in the US for human rights abuses already.
They're openly preparing to do exactly that.
And some of the tools (that wouldn't be necessary if not for Fartrage campaigning as well) fit very well in their plans.
What part exactly you consider clickbait and not foreboding?
While they were in EU, Home Office always had a tool to deport EU migrants - if person from EU is not self reliant after 3 months since coming to the country, EU law allows the host country to kick such person out. Home office never did anything and did not wanted you to register yourself.
And then they committed Brexit instead of applying 3 months rule.
After Brexit UK started rapidly importing migrants from South East Asia. And I expect that Home office will do nothing about these migrants as well.
This British ICE is pointless because Home office already have all the tools necessary, they just don't want to use them, because UK economy is reliant on cheap migrant labor.