Managing engineering teams(defmacro.org)
defmacro.org
Managing engineering teams
http://www.defmacro.org/2014/10/03/engman.html
22 comments
How does an individual contributor (specifically in a startup) get promoted to engineering management?
My company is specifically looking to hire a PMP certified manager (externally) to oversee the five person dev team, and there's no way I could get that certification because it requires five years of management experience. Is it worth having a conversation to see if this requirement can be overcome?
My company is specifically looking to hire a PMP certified manager (externally) to oversee the five person dev team, and there's no way I could get that certification because it requires five years of management experience. Is it worth having a conversation to see if this requirement can be overcome?
Sounds like you're not working in a technology company, where technology is in the DNA of the company.
PMP certified dev managers without any dev experience (I'll emphasise the last bit), in my experience, have been universally poor. There's too big a gap to fill between project management language (which is what pmp or prince gives you) and building something through modern development practices. If you have some very strong engineering leads who can fill the gap and translate then that might work but it's a dynamic I've never seen balanced correctly. Most successful technology/software companies that I know don't work this way which is why I made my original comment above.
Addressing your desire to move in to management, the first thing you need to do is express a desire to move in to management and then you need to figure out (communicate with your current boss) how to get from here to there. The simplest way I've seen this achieved is by being part of a growing organisation as there's always lots of opportunities. It's much easier to get an internal promotion than moving to management externally, but you could set those expectations through the interview process... "I'm really interested in a senior engineer position but my ambition is to move in to management. Do you see me being able to fulfil that ambition with your company?"
PMP certified dev managers without any dev experience (I'll emphasise the last bit), in my experience, have been universally poor. There's too big a gap to fill between project management language (which is what pmp or prince gives you) and building something through modern development practices. If you have some very strong engineering leads who can fill the gap and translate then that might work but it's a dynamic I've never seen balanced correctly. Most successful technology/software companies that I know don't work this way which is why I made my original comment above.
Addressing your desire to move in to management, the first thing you need to do is express a desire to move in to management and then you need to figure out (communicate with your current boss) how to get from here to there. The simplest way I've seen this achieved is by being part of a growing organisation as there's always lots of opportunities. It's much easier to get an internal promotion than moving to management externally, but you could set those expectations through the interview process... "I'm really interested in a senior engineer position but my ambition is to move in to management. Do you see me being able to fulfil that ambition with your company?"
Thanks for the feedback. We are a software company (web and mobile), but we work in the broadcast industry where things can be a little more old-fashioned.
Ultimately I want to run my own company eventually, and I feel like management experience would be a beneficial and necessary thing to have in that case. I worry that remaining a developer (even with an inflated title) will make it look like I'm standing still in my career.
I think I just need to bite the bullet and have the conversation, at least once this project is finished.
Ultimately I want to run my own company eventually, and I feel like management experience would be a beneficial and necessary thing to have in that case. I worry that remaining a developer (even with an inflated title) will make it look like I'm standing still in my career.
I think I just need to bite the bullet and have the conversation, at least once this project is finished.
specifically looking to hire a PMP certified manager (externally) to oversee the five person dev team
I read that and felt very, very sad.
I read that and felt very, very sad.
You and me both.
The conversation could be valuable to you even if it does not lead anywhere immediately.
All I want from my manager is actually #6: Fire bullies and underperformers.
Once we have a team of friendly and skilled people, we can sort everything else out.
Once we have a team of friendly and skilled people, we can sort everything else out.
These are helpful points. I would like to have some more detail regarding having a "rough edge" when necessary. The articles states “I’m not ok with that” is usually enough. What about when it's not?
Some engineers are not as socially smart as they are technically, so they might not understand they just hit a boundary. I think they are still workable though. You just have to be willing to explain things to some.
Still, very helpful points, I just want more.
Some engineers are not as socially smart as they are technically, so they might not understand they just hit a boundary. I think they are still workable though. You just have to be willing to explain things to some.
Still, very helpful points, I just want more.
Normally in a group setting you probably don't want to go much further than that so if that comment with the right intonation (assertive not aggressive) doesn't work then you've got a bigger issue.
At this point I'd look to move on in a group setting and talk to the individual one on one. The non violent communication link on that page also addresses good ways of having that conversation with your employee. It's not an easy conversation but it should either bring you and your employee closer or, hopefully in the minority of conversations, let you know you have an issue on your hand.
Part of this is building trust with your employees through regular, meaningful one on one's. Maybe your employee really feels like you were not the right person to make that decision and so maybe they were right to push back. Be open to the fact you might be wrong. But, if you've got someone constantly swimming against the tide in a _disruptive_ fashion you've got a problem.
I've been told I'm wrong and corrected by my colleagues and team literally hundreds of times. So it's not about a respect-my-authority! situation. Make sure you don't setup an environment where people can't question, you're not trying to create a Dickensian factory. Typically, once all parties enter in to the conversation with mutual respect then everything will be fine. Occasionally someone (including you) step over the line and you should acknowledge that but then swiftly move on if it's not commonplace.
Its often not the contents but the packaging, frequency and intent of the comments that are the issue in my experience. If you decide you've got a problem then it's time for those difficult conversations.
At this point I'd look to move on in a group setting and talk to the individual one on one. The non violent communication link on that page also addresses good ways of having that conversation with your employee. It's not an easy conversation but it should either bring you and your employee closer or, hopefully in the minority of conversations, let you know you have an issue on your hand.
Part of this is building trust with your employees through regular, meaningful one on one's. Maybe your employee really feels like you were not the right person to make that decision and so maybe they were right to push back. Be open to the fact you might be wrong. But, if you've got someone constantly swimming against the tide in a _disruptive_ fashion you've got a problem.
I've been told I'm wrong and corrected by my colleagues and team literally hundreds of times. So it's not about a respect-my-authority! situation. Make sure you don't setup an environment where people can't question, you're not trying to create a Dickensian factory. Typically, once all parties enter in to the conversation with mutual respect then everything will be fine. Occasionally someone (including you) step over the line and you should acknowledge that but then swiftly move on if it's not commonplace.
Its often not the contents but the packaging, frequency and intent of the comments that are the issue in my experience. If you decide you've got a problem then it's time for those difficult conversations.
How do I tactfully express a few key points of advice from this article to my manager? He's generally a good manager, just very bad at:
> 14. Don’t shoot down ideas until it’s necessary.
> 25. Don’t judge too quickly; you’re right less often than you think. Even if you’re sure you’re right in any given case, wait until everyone’s opinion is heard.
> 30. Most conflict happens because people don’t feel heard. Sit down with each person and ask them how they feel. Listen carefully. Then ask again. And again. Then summarize what they said back to them. Most of the time that will solve the problem.
> 34. Use non-violent communication — it’s the best method I know of to critique people’s behavior without offending them. It smells like a management fad, but it really works (I promise).
Number #34 includes a link to an article on non-violent communication which pretty much sums up why I feel stressed and pressured at work all the time. It's not so much the deadlines, although they are stressful sometimes, it's more my managers communication style.
> Say you’re an early employee at a startup. You’re probably working 12 to 14 hours a day doing the work of three people. So which question would you prefer to hear from a teammate?
A. Will you get your work done this week? B. What do you need to hit your deadline this week?
The first is an example of a closed question. It requires a “yes” or “no” response and does nothing to acknowledge your dedication or address your feelings about it. You know there’s a right answer and a wrong answer, and just knowing that is likely to make you tense, agitated and defensive.
http://firstround.com/review/power-up-your-team-with-nonviol...
My manager is constantly asking type A questions. It took my a long time to understand why I felt so pressured and this is exactly why. He just wants to hear yes and if he hears no, it feels like I've done something wrong. He is willing to help if that's the case, but every meeting feels like a hostile negotiation.
> 14. Don’t shoot down ideas until it’s necessary.
> 25. Don’t judge too quickly; you’re right less often than you think. Even if you’re sure you’re right in any given case, wait until everyone’s opinion is heard.
> 30. Most conflict happens because people don’t feel heard. Sit down with each person and ask them how they feel. Listen carefully. Then ask again. And again. Then summarize what they said back to them. Most of the time that will solve the problem.
> 34. Use non-violent communication — it’s the best method I know of to critique people’s behavior without offending them. It smells like a management fad, but it really works (I promise).
Number #34 includes a link to an article on non-violent communication which pretty much sums up why I feel stressed and pressured at work all the time. It's not so much the deadlines, although they are stressful sometimes, it's more my managers communication style.
> Say you’re an early employee at a startup. You’re probably working 12 to 14 hours a day doing the work of three people. So which question would you prefer to hear from a teammate?
A. Will you get your work done this week? B. What do you need to hit your deadline this week?
The first is an example of a closed question. It requires a “yes” or “no” response and does nothing to acknowledge your dedication or address your feelings about it. You know there’s a right answer and a wrong answer, and just knowing that is likely to make you tense, agitated and defensive.
http://firstround.com/review/power-up-your-team-with-nonviol...
My manager is constantly asking type A questions. It took my a long time to understand why I felt so pressured and this is exactly why. He just wants to hear yes and if he hears no, it feels like I've done something wrong. He is willing to help if that's the case, but every meeting feels like a hostile negotiation.
Maybe you need to provide the B side.
"Will you get your work done this week?" "To do that I'll need X and Y"
If you feel pressured to lie to your boss, that's a serious problem. Is it possible you're misreading him? Do others on the team feel the same way?
"Will you get your work done this week?" "To do that I'll need X and Y"
If you feel pressured to lie to your boss, that's a serious problem. Is it possible you're misreading him? Do others on the team feel the same way?
Have a frank and honest conversation. Any good manager doesn't want his employees to be stressed. Mention the S word and you'll get his attention.
Have you brought this up with him previously?
Have you brought this up with him previously?
I've certainly mentioned stress, but the target has always been deadlines, shifting priorities, etc. I've never been able to articulate his particular faults.
Remember it's his communication style so first thing is try not to get stressed in the first place. If your child starts crying, you may get stressed the first couple of times, but with experience you understand it's just the nature of the child and there are a set of steps you can take to diffuse the situation. Treat your situation with your boss the same way.
At a tactical level start translating his requirements down to less aggressive language in your head.
Your long term plan though should be to tackle his communication style head on in a relaxed way. If you have regular one on one's start addressing this there. If you don't talk to him about organising them or organise them yourself as a way to stay on point priority wise.
You may end up figuring out you have a shitty boss, but any half way decent boss wants to improve so if you give him the opportunity they often will.
At a tactical level start translating his requirements down to less aggressive language in your head.
Your long term plan though should be to tackle his communication style head on in a relaxed way. If you have regular one on one's start addressing this there. If you don't talk to him about organising them or organise them yourself as a way to stay on point priority wise.
You may end up figuring out you have a shitty boss, but any half way decent boss wants to improve so if you give him the opportunity they often will.
Thanks, this advice will definitely help. I know he's open to feedback so I'll make sure to be proactive.
Feel free to reach out for any advice. Email is in profile
http://www.rethinkdb.com/jobs gives a 404
Maybe because they don't actually have a jobs page? http://rethinkdb.com/about/
edit: https://www.google.de/search?q=jobs+site%3Arethinkdb.com
edit: https://www.google.de/search?q=jobs+site%3Arethinkdb.com
Might be a subtle job offer for nginx engineers.
A manager could be new and he could be managing an Engineer that is has already completed successful projects at the company. In this scenario the manager is actually the one that would be at risk getting fired for being too pushy with the engineer.
This. I've worked with many software organizations who jump to conclusions about their engineers and their reaction about poor performance is usually "we need to fire him/her" or "I don't think I have the right dev team". I always have to ask "When was the last time you asked that person what they really want to do?" The answer is almost universally "not since we hired them". It's a healthy conversation and something that needs to happen more often than it does in engineering teams.