lunixbochs

vorige maanddiscuss

Thank you.

vorige maanddiscuss

I don't think any of your points reflect what I was trying to communicate.

> You're not interested in addressing customers' needs

I would love to support Wayland, but it is my position that it is impossible to "support Wayland" for Talon. I can only support a subset of the features and only on specific compositors, and it would be a lot of work.

> or giving them ways to address their needs themselves

As I said at the top of the message you are replying to, I believe today users already have the tools to address their needs themselves with about the same level of jank I'd be able to provide on Wayland. If this is a veiled hard line on open source being the only way for users to address their needs themselves, we have a philosophical difference that won't be sorted out in this thread.

> If slack interactions are so unpleasant, why do you direct all support through it?

That's a whole new sentence. I was specifically referring to the support requests for Wayland, which in the long tail have been more hostile toward me than is likely warranted.

> "yes this is a hack, but we'll live with it for now until an actually good solution is available"

The hack is switching to X11, which is fully supported, or working around it in your user scripts, which has already been done by some users for their specific environment.

lunixbochs

vorige maanddiscuss

Hi, I'm the developer of Talon.

It's possible to do the simple compositor specific hacks from Talon's scripting system to give yourself partial Wayland support at roughly the quality I'd be able to provide myself, and I know of a couple efforts to do this.

The tentative plan for "dropping support for X11" is just to do one more public Linux X11 release, stop there, leave it available to download, and make it very clear what to expect when you download for Linux or run on Wayland. I plan to continue supporting X11 on the paid version indefinitely.

Most requests relating to Wayland on the Slack have not been offers to help, and way too many have ended up being unpleasant conversations.

I have a standing offer to reconsider my stance if someone can show the vast majority of the necessary APIs are available and well supported without compositor specific hacks.

For some of the other points above, consider me disappointed but not surprised.

lunixbochs

6 maanden geledendiscuss

naive c is just a memcpy. non-temporal uses the streaming instructions.

lunixbochs

6 maanden geledendiscuss

your single core numbers seem way too low for peak throughput on one core, unless you stipulate that all cores are active and contending with each other for bandwidth

e.g. dual channel zen 1 showing 25GB/s on a single core https://stackoverflow.com/a/44948720

I wrote some microbenchmarks for single-threaded memcpy

    zen 2 (8-channel DDR4)
    naive c:
      17GB/s
    non-temporal avx:
      35GB/s

    Xeon-D 1541 (2-channel DDR4, my weakest system, ten years old)
    naive c:
      9GB/s
    non-temporal avx:
      13.5GB/s

    apple silicon tests
    (warm = generate new source buffer, memset(0) output buffer, add memory fence, then run the same copy again)

    m3
    naive c:
      17GB/s cold, 41GB/s warm
    non-temporal neon:
      78GB/s cold+warm

    m3 max 
    naive c:
      25GB/s cold, 65GB/s warm
    non-temporal neon:
      49GB/s cold, 125GB/s warm

    m4 pro
    naive c:
      13.8GB/s cold, 65GB/s warm
    non-temporal neon:
      49GB/s cold, 125GB/s warm

    (I'm not actually sure offhand why asi warm is so much faster than cold - the source buffer is filled with new random data each iteration, I'm using memory fences, and I still see the speedup with 16GB src/dst buffers much larger than cache. x86/linux didn't have any kind of cold/warm test difference. my guess would be that it's something about kernel page accounting and not related to the cpu)

I really don't see how you can claim either a 6GB/s single core limit on x86 or a 20GB/s limit on apple silicon

lunixbochs

6 maanden geledendiscuss

I'm confused why they repeatedly call a slots class larger than a regular dict class, but don't count the size of the dict

lunixbochs

7 maanden geledendiscuss

I'm not familiar with C# compile at runtime. Are you saying your change was to do an AOT compile locally?

lunixbochs

5 jaar geledendiscuss

> The participant was able to communicate at about 90 characters, or 18 words, per minute.

> By comparison, able-bodied people close in age to the study participant can type on a smartphone at about 23 words per minute, the authors say. Adults can type on a full keyboard at an average of about 40 words per minute.

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