I think we can agree that c and c++ are essentially table stakes at this point and that anything new needs to offer strong incentives.
I like rust (I actually liked it from the start years ago). However, I believe that there are tradeoffs and the companies you named use other languages in addition to rust because they also believe there are tradeoffs.
Rust won't be the last language. I don't want to get too comfortable with what I know and miss out on what I don't. I am excited by new languages that may also have something to offer. However, I can't master them all so a good discussion is valuable and can offer shortcuts through the noise. I think my assumption in my first reply to your original post was that you were interested in the same thing. However, if you are happy with rust then I don't want to spoil your enjoyment.
I am surprised that you don't encounter a productivity cost in rust vs languages with a gc (like python and go). If that were typical then I assume everyone would be using it. What do you consider to be the tradeoffs between rust and other languages? What are its drawbacks in your experience? How much rust experience do you have compared to other languages?
"some time" is the entry barrier I was referring to and increases the cost of onboarding and adoption. However, rust also incurs a non-negligible ongoing productivity cost for its complexity.
Rust can provide some guarantees but it still won't protect you from logic errors or a "clever" coworker. In comparison, zig is simple and at the end of the day readability is my best defense against bugs/errors.
I find myself agreeing with pron and others in that discussion when they say no one really wants to use a safe language. What they want are correct programs.
What remains to be seen is how easy it is to write correct programs in each and the values people place on the deltas between the two languages.
If zig catches on then the question may change from "why zig" to "do I really need rust?". Rust has a higher entry barrier and is harder to use daily. Is the safety guarantee worth it? In my experience, it is easier to fix a bug than to prove to the rust compiler that there is no bug. I just need a language that finds and reports the bugs (before production). Zig's error handling is interesting in this regard and it may be "good enough". Beyond that, I would prefer to spend my time on the real problem rather than appeasing the compiler.
I am happy with the build quality so far. It feels sturdy and lightweight. The laptop is noticeably lighter and thinner than my old ThinkPad. With the lid open it is about the same height as my 14 inch but there is more vertical screen real estate because there is less black around the display area. I have read about issues with the hinges but I think this has been fixed now. I have not had hinge issues. I opened up the laptop to take a look inside when I first got it and everything came apart and went back together nicely (my only surprise was one screw does not come out all the way by design which I had to Google about). The expansion slots are maybe a little too sturdy and require a good amount of force to remove.
For battery life I think an average user can expect 5 to 6 hours. I use mine for about 5 hours with Firefox (around 10-20 tabs) and a few terminal processes and will still have about 20% remaining.
Oh, good point. Yes, my resolution is 2256x1504 and found the 1x too small so I have to scale it up. I haven't had any issues but I also typically do lower level and back end type work (occasional front end when needed). I also haven't done any gaming with the laptop (except some minor experimentation with Godot). If you are a designer or serious artist I recommend at least trying out your os with fractional scaling first.
Is there a way to middle click with this method? I use that often for new tabs and ThinkPads have the physical button at the top and tap to click is just three fingers.
Yep, the trackpoint (and buttons on top of the touchpad) are huge. I am a heavy vim user so those were extremely convenient but I have been trying to get comfortable with tap to click because that seems to be the way laptop manufacturers have headed (and I don't want my efficiency to suddenly collapse when I am put behind any other brand of computer). I am also still holding out some small hope that someone will come up with a way to swap it in to a framework laptop but I'm not holding my breath.
Yes, I owned a t430 (and also a yoga 14) so the keys on the framework are a little wider. I can still feel the keypresses and they are a little "softer" and quieter. I use vim frequently so I do still miss the trackpoint and buttons at the top of the touchpad but it hasn't been as big of a problem as I anticipated. I am also still adjusting to the cntrl/fn placement but I think a lot of people swapped that in the bios anyways so it might be normal for others.
I recently received my first framework laptop after being a loyal Thinkpad user for years. I am loving it so far. I run Ubuntu 22.04 daily and have not had any issues with battery life or the lid (but I do typically leave it plugged in during lunch and overnight). The expansion cards are brilliant and the keyboard is comparable to my old t-series. The aspect ratio is great for coding and I'm happy to see upgradeability is being taken seriously as promised. If I can get 5-10 years out of it like my old ThinkPads (all while upgrading piecewise along the way) I will be a fan for life.
I like rust (I actually liked it from the start years ago). However, I believe that there are tradeoffs and the companies you named use other languages in addition to rust because they also believe there are tradeoffs.
Rust won't be the last language. I don't want to get too comfortable with what I know and miss out on what I don't. I am excited by new languages that may also have something to offer. However, I can't master them all so a good discussion is valuable and can offer shortcuts through the noise. I think my assumption in my first reply to your original post was that you were interested in the same thing. However, if you are happy with rust then I don't want to spoil your enjoyment.