The Death of Infosec Twitter(cyentia.com)
cyentia.com
The Death of Infosec Twitter
https://www.cyentia.com/the-death-of-infosec-twitter/
88 comments
This same exact thing happened to the blind community, of which I'm a member of. Blind Twitter was pretty vibrant before Elon took over, but that changed almost completely around November/December of last year. The killer change for us was the death of third-party clients, on which blind people relied almost exclusively. The whole community is on Mastodon now, mostly concentrated around two instances, though there are plenty of people elsewhere.
Glad to hear a new home was found. My child and I began to analyze random public braille the other day out of random interest and found it was surprisingly easy to pick up a few letters, apparently being both alphabetic and potentially conceived as some kind of semi-derived state from regular roman shapes which provides a handy memory reference for we sighted people. I'd be very interested to hear what the best braille interfaces are. How long does it take to learn to use it for input? How do totally blind people handle the presumed need to switch between typing (on a regular keyboard, I would assume) and "input" (fingers on a braille generating device) modes at once? I suppose the staccato nature of this type of interaction harks back heavily to the old days of Unix, limited baud terminals and early micros.
Braille screens are prohibitively expensive. Most blind people on the internet either have enough sight to navigate a heavily vision-optimized interface (high-contrast, large text) or use a screen reader, or both.
As far as input goes, braille keyboards are more affordable, but many users can touch-type (and have their screen reader read back). Dictation is also a mature option at this point.
Blind people need 3rd-party apps because these apps can be more compatible with screen readers, or can be themed in an easier way allowing for blind-friendly presets. In general, official apps tend to be heavily obfuscated to prevent automated scraping and puppeting. Since blind users often need to basically puppet their devices by not using common interfaces, this puts them at odds with corporations who do not care about them and would ban them if allowed. The alternative is of course not to use big tech products but just because you have a disability shouldn't mean you are abandoning at least half the current web.
As far as input goes, braille keyboards are more affordable, but many users can touch-type (and have their screen reader read back). Dictation is also a mature option at this point.
Blind people need 3rd-party apps because these apps can be more compatible with screen readers, or can be themed in an easier way allowing for blind-friendly presets. In general, official apps tend to be heavily obfuscated to prevent automated scraping and puppeting. Since blind users often need to basically puppet their devices by not using common interfaces, this puts them at odds with corporations who do not care about them and would ban them if allowed. The alternative is of course not to use big tech products but just because you have a disability shouldn't mean you are abandoning at least half the current web.
Understood. What do you feel the tipping point would be on price and features for an open source braille display? In particular, what is the required number of rows / columns for English to make it very useful?
Is anyone suing them for ADA violations, or does the site work 'well enough' with accessiblity tools to avoid it?
All of the infosec people I follow have moved to Mastodon. As someone with primarily tech related interests, I'm currently finding Mastodon as good or better than Twitter at it's prime.
What I dislike about Mastodon is how people talk about "moving to Mastodon".
Unlike Twitter, FB etc. you don't just "move to Mastodon"... you move to some ActivityPub server. Which one? They don't want you to know I guess?
Edit: thanks for the pointers!
Unlike Twitter, FB etc. you don't just "move to Mastodon"... you move to some ActivityPub server. Which one? They don't want you to know I guess?
Edit: thanks for the pointers!
But they're specifically moving to Mastodon (infosec.exchange and defcon.social), which is not the same as moving to Lemmy, KBin, or PixelFed. For example, Lemmy federates with KBin, but not with Mastodon. Kbin federates both with Lemmy and Mastodon. Also, Mastodon has a Twitter-like UX, while Lemmy/Kbin have a Reddit-like UX. PixelFed has a Flickr-like UX.
It makes a difference, and insisting on calling them ActivityPub or Fediverse servers has strong GNU/Linux vibes, which we should probably avoid too.
It makes a difference, and insisting on calling them ActivityPub or Fediverse servers has strong GNU/Linux vibes, which we should probably avoid too.
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You are making the same mistake. There is no Mastodon as a place or protocol. There's ActivityPub and a bunch of server/client software. Mastodon is one of those
> Lemmy federates with KBin, but not with Mastodon
I follow several Lemmy users on Mastodon.
I follow several Lemmy users on Mastodon.
Lemmy federates with Mastodon. You can @ a community to post in it.
I mean... strictly speaking yes, but for most practical purposes it hardly matters, surely?
> They don't want you to know.
This sounds overly dramatic and conspiratorial.
This sounds overly dramatic and conspiratorial.
Why conspiratorial?
People are allowed to be private and not want others to follow them by not saying exactly where they moved. I am allowed to voice my frustration about that.
Segregating communities is the trend now (post web 2.0 social platforms), I don't think that is over dramatizing things.
People are allowed to be private and not want others to follow them by not saying exactly where they moved. I am allowed to voice my frustration about that.
Segregating communities is the trend now (post web 2.0 social platforms), I don't think that is over dramatizing things.
Don't forget that Twitter was actively censoring Mastodon links and preventing users from putting them in their Twitter profiles:
https://mastodon.social/@danluu/109521316258129814
https://mastodon.social/@danluu/109521316258129814
I'm more about tech people casually dropping they moved to Mastodon, us techies kinda get Mastodon is not a single place like Twitter so the only explanation for not saying "I moved from Twitter to such or such community" is not wanting people to know.
> us techies kinda get Mastodon is not a single place like Twitter so the only explanation for not saying "I moved from Twitter to such or such community" is not wanting people to know.
Eh? There are _some_ Mastodon instances which are to some a community distinct from Mastodon writ large, but that's not most of them. I moved from Twitter initially to mastodon.online (one of the giant ones, not really a community at all), then to mastodon.ie (the generic Ireland one; marginally a community, but only very marginally), and reserve the right to move further if appropriate. But I don't see why anyone would care about the distinction between them, really.
Generally, I would assume it's less not wanting people to know, and more that it's irrelevant detail. I think this is maybe a common point of confusion over Mastodon; for most people, for most purposes, the instance _simply does not matter_. There are some generally very small instances which are highly focused on specific communities (and may even require that user content revolves largely around those communities) but those are rare; I'd expect under 1% of the user ship. For most people Mastodon is the community, not their instance.
If someone says "I used to do business mostly by post and fax, but now do it mostly by email" you wouldn't go "ah, but are you using gmail or hotmail? It must be a conspiracy because you don't want to tell us!" They don't name the email provider because it is _irrelevant_.
Eh? There are _some_ Mastodon instances which are to some a community distinct from Mastodon writ large, but that's not most of them. I moved from Twitter initially to mastodon.online (one of the giant ones, not really a community at all), then to mastodon.ie (the generic Ireland one; marginally a community, but only very marginally), and reserve the right to move further if appropriate. But I don't see why anyone would care about the distinction between them, really.
Generally, I would assume it's less not wanting people to know, and more that it's irrelevant detail. I think this is maybe a common point of confusion over Mastodon; for most people, for most purposes, the instance _simply does not matter_. There are some generally very small instances which are highly focused on specific communities (and may even require that user content revolves largely around those communities) but those are rare; I'd expect under 1% of the user ship. For most people Mastodon is the community, not their instance.
If someone says "I used to do business mostly by post and fax, but now do it mostly by email" you wouldn't go "ah, but are you using gmail or hotmail? It must be a conspiracy because you don't want to tell us!" They don't name the email provider because it is _irrelevant_.
> the only explanation for not saying "I moved from Twitter to such or such community" is not wanting people to know.
The only explanation for something that people are, in your own words, "casually dropping"? Your comment practically contradicts itself.
The only explanation for something that people are, in your own words, "casually dropping"? Your comment practically contradicts itself.
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Defcon.social works great for this particular subject.
Infosec twitter may be gone, but the infosec spam bots are still there. Just try searching for "Linux kernel" and try to find content by a real human. Before you manage to find one, you'll have to scan through hundreds if not thousands of low-quality bot posts about the latest linux kernel commit, linux kernel CVEs, or linux kernel mailing list posts.
> And with that, we say “so long” to infosec twitter.
... and thanks for all the phish!
... and thanks for all the phish!
Has any of the OSINT/INFOSEC crowd moved to mastodon or somewhere other then twitter?
There's an entire Mastodon instance of infosec people here: https://infosec.exchange/about
A whole list of infosec folks on there for importing, if anyone wants: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1t13k5_cNhP9_TgoUmqDZ...
Holy carp, that's handy! The only downside to moving to a new social media platform is curating a new set of people to follow and unfollow, which is more overhead than I'm willing to endure. But starting with a list like this means just having to unfollow people who take a "build a brand" approach via quantity rather than quality. So, thank you.
You might want to add a column for Bluesky/AT Protocol people too.
If you change the CSV format, you break the ability to import it directly to mastodon.
I really doubt if this can be imported into Mastodon as-is.
Wait, why? Do you doubt that Mastadon has that feature, or doubt the validity of the CSV?
Yeah I doubt the validity of this as-is.
Not mine. :)
This is the best mastodon instance, Jerry is cool
What about Threads? Isn't that supposed to be the Twitter-killer?
The people leaving Twitter want:
1. Both high quality and high quantity posts instantly available
2. Reasonable API access, maybe not directly but they want their niche workflows to be supported
3. Clear and consistent moderation. Eliminate disruptive content while giving reasonable people a clear understanding of whether something will be removed before they post it.
Threads has made vague promises to these three but not yet delivered.
1. Both high quality and high quantity posts instantly available
2. Reasonable API access, maybe not directly but they want their niche workflows to be supported
3. Clear and consistent moderation. Eliminate disruptive content while giving reasonable people a clear understanding of whether something will be removed before they post it.
Threads has made vague promises to these three but not yet delivered.
4. no loginwall for post and profile
Infosec and similar communities migrated off twitter starting months ago.
Threads was not an option then, and isn't of much interest to these communities (as a platform to socialise upon) now.
Threads was not an option then, and isn't of much interest to these communities (as a platform to socialise upon) now.
Threads lasted for like a week
Not available officially in Europe, for one
not available in EU.
Threads is too new for large communities to coalesce there yet.
I for one welcome the decentralized internet that Elon is ushering in. Things were better when we had small disparate forums where people could develop their perspectives in community. As long as people are members of multiple communities we should have enough cross-pollination and course corrections to keep things mostly on track.
Mods and groupthink are always a threat but it turned out they were a bigger threat still when everyone was trying to be on one social network to rule them all.
Mods and groupthink are always a threat but it turned out they were a bigger threat still when everyone was trying to be on one social network to rule them all.
Awesome, it's great to see a successful move to the Fediverse.
This is sad indeed, but it was already infested with low quality trolls before the Elon Musk purchase. The entire Jonathon Scott clown-fiesta was utterly embarrassing.
water9(6)
this is so sad rip
rip? its not dead, it just moved. the community just shifted to a platform that is _much_ more suited to the community’s needs.
- it’s open, in more ways than just the obvious. while twitter is narrowing in just about every direction you can think of.
- significantly higher signal that isn’t lost amongst a bunch of noise.
- relates to above, but kinda different: waay better quality of discourse. just much more pleasant.
- much more responsive and predictable admin. so so so many props to jerry.
definitely not a bad thing, it’s absolutely a step up and out.
- it’s open, in more ways than just the obvious. while twitter is narrowing in just about every direction you can think of.
- significantly higher signal that isn’t lost amongst a bunch of noise.
- relates to above, but kinda different: waay better quality of discourse. just much more pleasant.
- much more responsive and predictable admin. so so so many props to jerry.
definitely not a bad thing, it’s absolutely a step up and out.
They probably meant RIP Twitter, RIP what it once was and used to be capable of.
I'm really happy they moved to masto, their content just became much more accessible
Why? People leave an enshitified platform for less shitty pastures, and the audience can follow them.
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