Boeing Whistleblower: "If Anything Happens to Me, It's Not Suicide"(twitter.com)
twitter.com
Boeing Whistleblower: "If Anything Happens to Me, It's Not Suicide"
https://twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1768517997285482626
75 comments
Duplicate: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39712618 (300 comments)
Probably a dupe because I can't find this submission or the one you linked on any page of HN now.
edit: just found this one on page 6 now.
edit2: both are completely gone now off any page.
edit3: now it's claimed as a [dupe] and the active discussion is dead.
Wow.
edit: just found this one on page 6 now.
edit2: both are completely gone now off any page.
edit3: now it's claimed as a [dupe] and the active discussion is dead.
Wow.
Well, enough people found it to get >330 comments, which is a lot.
IIRC, the algorithm on HN deliberately punishes submissions which have more comments than upvotes. It uses this as a flamebait-detector.
It's strange neither are on the first 20 pages of HN.
Many older Boeing articles with less points and less comments are on the first 10 pages.
It dropped to page 8 within seconds, I haven't seen that before.
Many older Boeing articles with less points and less comments are on the first 10 pages.
It dropped to page 8 within seconds, I haven't seen that before.
I find it hard to believe that there many people in this world worth the kind of professional assassination that could avoid all of the widespread surveillance apparatus (consumer surveillance cameras, leaving behind no genetic data) and the advances in post-mortem medical examination, but maybe I'm just naïve.
Well, the cameras could go off for an hour and both guards could be asleep for the same hour.
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edit: on a meta note, why did this submission flash on the homepage, and now I can't find it?
edit2: I can't find the dupe submission either: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39712618
edit3: I found this submission now on page 6, it was just on the first page and gaining comments and votes fast until just now.
edit4: both submissions are completely gone now off any page.
@dang?
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edit: on a meta note, why did this submission flash on the homepage, and now I can't find it?
edit2: I can't find the dupe submission either: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39712618
edit3: I found this submission now on page 6, it was just on the first page and gaining comments and votes fast until just now.
edit4: both submissions are completely gone now off any page.
@dang?
That only happens at the Metropolitan detention center, in the Jeffrey Epstein memorial wing.
Well yeah, if you want to make up outlandish hypotheticals with no basis in reality /s
I think we fall into a false sense of "How could this happen and no one get caught doing it". I know I've had that thought for decades now but murders keep happening and people keep getting away with it. I find myself thinking "Wow, I guess that was easier than I thought it'd be (thinking back 1-4 years), but _now_ it would be harder", the issue is I've had that same thought almost every year so clearly my guess of how hard it would be is way off.
I think we fall into a false sense of "How could this happen and no one get caught doing it". I know I've had that thought for decades now but murders keep happening and people keep getting away with it. I find myself thinking "Wow, I guess that was easier than I thought it'd be (thinking back 1-4 years), but _now_ it would be harder", the issue is I've had that same thought almost every year so clearly my guess of how hard it would be is way off.
That wasn't a hypothetical. I was referencing a current event.
edit: missed the /s, stupid brain
edit: missed the /s, stupid brain
they were being sarcastic, hence the /s :P
I know, that's why I had the "/s" I know you're referencing Epstein
My brain completely skipped over that, woops.
No problem, easy mistake. Joking is the only way I can deal with this stuff.
I feel ya.
Side note, for my sanity, did this article disappear off the first page for you as well?
It's on page 6 for me now.
edit: it's completely gone now off any page.
Side note, for my sanity, did this article disappear off the first page for you as well?
It's on page 6 for me now.
edit: it's completely gone now off any page.
Yeah, it did. This type of stuff gets flagged pretty hard so I’m not surprised.
I never saw a [flagged] pop up but that's possible I suppose.
The other submission also wasn't flagged, even as of now, but it's gone on the pages.
There's much older and deader Boeing articles that are still on pages 3-10.
The other submission also wasn't flagged, even as of now, but it's gone on the pages.
There's much older and deader Boeing articles that are still on pages 3-10.
I've obviously never bought a hitman off of the dark web. However, it seems like these services aren't going anywhere. I'm not sure if they're all a scam or what.
The interesting case with Boeing is, its not only that the company would want this person gone, but rather the entire US government too. Boeing is "too big to fail."
The interesting case with Boeing is, its not only that the company would want this person gone, but rather the entire US government too. Boeing is "too big to fail."
> edit4: both submissions are completely gone now off any page.
Front page isn't what we vote for, it's manually curated by dang and other moderators.
For actual popular stuff go to /active.
Front page isn't what we vote for, it's manually curated by dang and other moderators.
For actual popular stuff go to /active.
It seems we hear fairly often about mercenary - as opposed to ideological - killings that are revealed to be such only long after the fact. It would seem gratuitous to assume that all such killings are eventually revealed.
For example, the U.S. and German governments have taken the position that the Russian federation conspired to have a Chechen leader killed in Berlin, Germany[1]. He was ultimately caught, and surveillance footage seems to have played a role, but if you look into the details of the case, it seems likely he was an experienced contract killer who could have gotten away with many other lower-profile killings.
1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zelimkhan_Khangoshvili
For example, the U.S. and German governments have taken the position that the Russian federation conspired to have a Chechen leader killed in Berlin, Germany[1]. He was ultimately caught, and surveillance footage seems to have played a role, but if you look into the details of the case, it seems likely he was an experienced contract killer who could have gotten away with many other lower-profile killings.
1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zelimkhan_Khangoshvili
What kind of "security" are we talking about? Hotel exterior cameras that are cloud controlled by (probably) a large commercial provider? Considering what is possible with hacking that, and that this is an enormously powerful company, I think it's entirely possible that a hit man could have been involved.
That said, I think suicide is the most likely cause, but we should avoid failures of imagination and consider the possibility.[0]
0. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Failure_of_imagination
That said, I think suicide is the most likely cause, but we should avoid failures of imagination and consider the possibility.[0]
0. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Failure_of_imagination
Conversely, there's also these relevant wikipedia articles:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motive_(law)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naivety
You can't just take things as face value when people can lie, deceive, plot, and other more horrific things.
Especially when there's motive and a wall of coincidences.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motive_(law)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naivety
You can't just take things as face value when people can lie, deceive, plot, and other more horrific things.
Especially when there's motive and a wall of coincidences.
How many murders are actually solved?
Would YOU want to pursue and present evidence that Boeing just offed a guy for pursuing and presenting evidence?
Would you want to be the policing agency that did not, only to be later found that it was the case? Authority should investigate and go where the investigation takes them. Have someone look at the camera systems, determine if it has been hacked, look at the footage and compare it - due diligence is not a bad thing.
You may not want to be the policing agency or agent that did look into it.
But yes, authorities should investigate and should go where the investigation takes them.
Boeing and friends are too big to actually look into, similar to the island being an event that was too big to actually look into.
But yes, authorities should investigate and should go where the investigation takes them.
Boeing and friends are too big to actually look into, similar to the island being an event that was too big to actually look into.
That's not what I asked. Of course I want them to look into it, but I am not the one who has to weigh my own life against the possibility of holding a big company accountable. Would you choose to risk it?
A chance to be famous for bringing justice? Absolutely!
LOL, you are indeed, most murders go unsolved and a hit can cost as little as $10k. 99% it is a cartel member and if they do get caught worst case they get sent back to mexico.
A professional hit can cost as little as a few thousand dollars. The persons who do it for that kind of fee aren't the sharpest tools in the shed.
Well, he was definitely one of them.
I don’t understand the motivation behind Boeing ordering the hit. The guy already let out all the dirty laundry and nothing he said can further damage Boeings reputation. So why do it?
I’d think it’s one of Boeings stockholders who had a judge against him speaking out.
I’d think it’s one of Boeings stockholders who had a judge against him speaking out.
Let's break it down. He was about to under-go day 3 of whistleblower testimony. He had already given 2 days worth and they have found instances worth following up with criminal investigations. Guy's in a hotel (probably under his name) and is found in his car - shot to death in what appears to be a suicide. Then this, saying he stated that "If anything happens to me...", then Boeing "conveniently" overwriting the door bolt safety footage, etc has all the hallmarks of it being a hit. To protect Boeing from criminal investigation and costing the company potentially billions in fines and lost sales.
I'm in the camp that they did, in fact, hire someone or someone within their organization did to protect their interests in this case. Whether it's from corporate or from just the group of folks that might/would/will be indicted from the whistleblowers testimony. You don't land on 21-black 3 times in a row and say it's luck.
I'm in the camp that they did, in fact, hire someone or someone within their organization did to protect their interests in this case. Whether it's from corporate or from just the group of folks that might/would/will be indicted from the whistleblowers testimony. You don't land on 21-black 3 times in a row and say it's luck.
He was not going into “whistleblower” testimony.
He was suing Boeing for defamation And his claims were that Boeing retaliated against him for being a whistleblower. It might seem like the same thing, but it’s not.
And the instances promoting criminal investigation are related to the 737 probes, not the 787 that he was a whistleblower about. There no evidence his civil case was the impetus for those criminal probes.
He was suing Boeing for defamation And his claims were that Boeing retaliated against him for being a whistleblower. It might seem like the same thing, but it’s not.
And the instances promoting criminal investigation are related to the 737 probes, not the 787 that he was a whistleblower about. There no evidence his civil case was the impetus for those criminal probes.
Ok, “private testimony against his company”…
Also to say that Foo in Green is in no way connected to Foo in Blue is a farce. 737,777,787, they all share a safety process and protocol. To say he was talking about oranges when the probes are about apples when it’s all about the Grocery Store is absurd. It’s connected. May not be directly connected, but it’s connected. It’s bad management, bad practice, sus circumstances, a coverup on the left and a dead body on the right.
Also to say that Foo in Green is in no way connected to Foo in Blue is a farce. 737,777,787, they all share a safety process and protocol. To say he was talking about oranges when the probes are about apples when it’s all about the Grocery Store is absurd. It’s connected. May not be directly connected, but it’s connected. It’s bad management, bad practice, sus circumstances, a coverup on the left and a dead body on the right.
We don't know that all the laundry has been let out. It's also possible that there could be criminal charges against some of Boeing's leadership if this guy were to testify against them or if he had more info.
I'm not a lawyer, but if he was dead before the deposition, it doesn't really count. In order to have any weight, he would've had to been under oath, in a deposition, some type of very official interview and documentation. It's like when a mob witness goes missing. If they can't testify, they can't testify.
There would be revolution in the streets tomorrow if the average person understood where money comes from and how it works. Once a group of people is wired into the free money pipeline they will do ANYTHING to make sure their supply is not cut off.
The USA has been printing and giving away free money for 30+ years now. The recipients of those funds have proven again and again, they will and do commit heinous crimes to maintain their position.
1) The legislature - Law makers have been captured through campaign contributions. In MOST cases a law maker has no say in how they vote, they are told by their campaign managers.
2) The judicial - Similarly judges tend to run for their seat every 4 years. In family court any divorce attorney worth their salt is donating the maximum amount to every judge every time they run. Then when they are in front of the judge in court just a thumbs up and a nod is enough to remind the judge who REALLY got them elected.
3) Corporations are DONE paying taxes and have been for a long time. Successful corporations have figured out how to siphon money from not only their customers but their employees and the federal government as well.
4) The money supply and system in general is fucked beyond repair and anyone willing or able to point that out is going to be on the "kill list".
1) The legislature - Law makers have been captured through campaign contributions. In MOST cases a law maker has no say in how they vote, they are told by their campaign managers.
2) The judicial - Similarly judges tend to run for their seat every 4 years. In family court any divorce attorney worth their salt is donating the maximum amount to every judge every time they run. Then when they are in front of the judge in court just a thumbs up and a nod is enough to remind the judge who REALLY got them elected.
3) Corporations are DONE paying taxes and have been for a long time. Successful corporations have figured out how to siphon money from not only their customers but their employees and the federal government as well.
4) The money supply and system in general is fucked beyond repair and anyone willing or able to point that out is going to be on the "kill list".
Why would someone under criminal investigation kill a key witness after they had talked but before they could testify?
Not only are the reasons fairly obvious, but the history of that being exactly what happens is pretty compelling evidence that, independently of arguments over its rationality, that is very much a thing people in that situation do.
Not only are the reasons fairly obvious, but the history of that being exactly what happens is pretty compelling evidence that, independently of arguments over its rationality, that is very much a thing people in that situation do.
Maybe they threatened him at first not to talk, he did, then they killed him.
They were scheduled for an additional day of deposition. Apparently there was more "dirty laundry" to talk about.
And not to mention a potential criminal trail from the DOJ. He would be a key witness against individuals for a criminal case that bubbles up to the top brass.
Sure he may have already aired out what Boeing was doing, but he was only talking about general actions. But given that DOJ is looking into a criminal investigation that means he can name names, and testify against individuals which would bubble up the chain since lower level management just follows upper management’s direction. Also there could have been key information unsurfaced that he may not even know the importance of that the legal team would have spotted.
I mean why would someone who has given up everything to blow the whistle and devoted the past 7 years trying to get something done about it all a sudden kill himself in the middle of a trail and before a potential DOJ criminal investigation?
The man had a mission, why would he do Boeing a favor and kill himself so that he could not testify at a criminal hearing?
Imagine this in a criminal trail he would testify against his direct managers who would then just say “hey, I was told by my boss to tell him to do x” and then it bubbles up the chain to the executives.
I mean why would someone who has given up everything to blow the whistle and devoted the past 7 years trying to get something done about it all a sudden kill himself in the middle of a trail and before a potential DOJ criminal investigation?
The man had a mission, why would he do Boeing a favor and kill himself so that he could not testify at a criminal hearing?
Imagine this in a criminal trail he would testify against his direct managers who would then just say “hey, I was told by my boss to tell him to do x” and then it bubbles up the chain to the executives.
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Maybe there was more (unaired dirty laundry)
A late message to potential future whistleblowers.
You think crazy Jennifer made this up for her 5 minutes of fame?
You think crazy Jennifer made this up for her 5 minutes of fame?
Sends a pretty clear message to anyone else thinking of speaking up.
Boeing is presently in the middle of a coverup; they don't want anybody coming forward with information that Boeing management knew about the "opening a plug door" process shortcut.
As much as this was meant to silence him, this was meant as a message to anyone else considering whistleblowing.
Whistleblowing rapidly loses attractively if you know that you will get putined.
Why pay someone off? Why be scared? Just kill anyone you don't like. They do it because they can. They are companies with country-sized budgets.
This is corporation sponsored terrorism against the population.
Will there be consequences? I doubt it.
Whistleblowing rapidly loses attractively if you know that you will get putined.
Why pay someone off? Why be scared? Just kill anyone you don't like. They do it because they can. They are companies with country-sized budgets.
This is corporation sponsored terrorism against the population.
Will there be consequences? I doubt it.
I don't think we have that many informations to label c-suite in Boeing as killers with such ease.
Those are serious allegations.
I would rather wait for an inquiry/coroner/etc to shed more light on what's happened.
Those are serious allegations.
I would rather wait for an inquiry/coroner/etc to shed more light on what's happened.
It is never so direct.
Management gets a contact who is a fixer, hired though an attorney, hiring a contractor who does investigations who happen to have contacts who will do field work research.
Field researcher gets name, hotel, car, follows from deposition and when the schedule becomes predictable an interaction or two occurs. Maybe an offer to stay silent followed up with a threat or action that will further persuade a favorable outcome for the hiring agency.
Upper management has zero exposure and everyone down the line was vague enough to be removed from direct action with the trigger being unaffiliated party.
Want to punish a neighbor? Pay a homeless guy to hire a homeless guy to throw a rock through a window. Who gets arrested? Not the home owner. Homeless guys can't be trusted for their witness. No records. Window is still broken.
Management gets a contact who is a fixer, hired though an attorney, hiring a contractor who does investigations who happen to have contacts who will do field work research.
Field researcher gets name, hotel, car, follows from deposition and when the schedule becomes predictable an interaction or two occurs. Maybe an offer to stay silent followed up with a threat or action that will further persuade a favorable outcome for the hiring agency.
Upper management has zero exposure and everyone down the line was vague enough to be removed from direct action with the trigger being unaffiliated party.
Want to punish a neighbor? Pay a homeless guy to hire a homeless guy to throw a rock through a window. Who gets arrested? Not the home owner. Homeless guys can't be trusted for their witness. No records. Window is still broken.
I’d more readily believe it’s a shareholder than anyone directly at Boeing. But who knows
What would be the incentive? Seeing his portfolio shrink and the company go through even more problems than it has?
Modest 401ks invested in index funds yielding a tiny amount of supplemental income that mostly gets reinvested for retirement are not a universal truth. Some people invest for a living. If you have the net worth for it, it's a nice way to live. Other people strive for the same using concentration and leverage. So yeah, there are investors out there who care a lot.
But no investor here benefits from throwing shades on Boeing killing whistleblowers.
What? Why on Earth would you think that? "We are all pretty sure Boeing did it" doesn't meet any actionable legal standard. Deposing this guy and the followups is a critical part of the accountability process that will no longer happen or, in the case of followups, be significantly impeded by the presence of a credible threat looming over their heads. Shareholders (and management) absolutely benefit.
Because getting the company you have shares in dragged in even more mud at such a time with a whistleblower dying mysteriously does really your shares no good.
Once you start to look at hedge funds with very large option positions, the losses can be many thousands of times larger than just “stock lost 5%, means I lost 5%”
It’s usually something like “if stock drops 2.5% at this number, we’re forced to buy the inverse option to hedge our bets and we loose X amount” (over simplification)
Just look at the GME stuff and how much money was lost due to retail trading meme behavior
It’s usually something like “if stock drops 2.5% at this number, we’re forced to buy the inverse option to hedge our bets and we loose X amount” (over simplification)
Just look at the GME stuff and how much money was lost due to retail trading meme behavior
Im surprised they didn't murder Roaring Kitty (Keith Gill) probably wh he has gone into hiding. He probably got the same offer he couldn't refuse, "shut the fuck up or else."
We already know that they are killers. Just ask the people who died on their planes, for which they did their best to cover up Boeing's responsibility.
We already know they're killers, the second MAX crash showed that if the first didn't. Now it's just a question of how direct they're willing to get.
Some non-twitverse links to this story:
https://www.newsweek.com/john-barnett-boeing-whistleblower-p...
https://abcnews4.com/news/local/if-anything-happens-its-not-...
https://www.newsweek.com/john-barnett-boeing-whistleblower-p...
https://abcnews4.com/news/local/if-anything-happens-its-not-...
I wonder if the police are afraid to investigate it thoroughly.
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I don't really have an opinion on this either way, but I would just like to point out that it is in fact possible to say publicly (or privately for that matter) that you will not kill yourself and then kill yourself. There is no fundamental law of nature that says if you say something that are cosmically stuck to that statement.
With all due respect, "no shit?"
There however is less reason to believe this was suicide given the circumstances.
There however is less reason to believe this was suicide given the circumstances.
then maybe consider using real evidence instead of something that isn't evidence of anything.
This isn't a court and the bar for real evidence isn't going to be met here.
Assassinations, by definition, are done to keep the actual person behind them hidden.
What we do have is a series of problematic behavior Boeing is doing, that fit an MO.
Also, it's clear that *you do* have an opinion on this.
Assassinations, by definition, are done to keep the actual person behind them hidden.
What we do have is a series of problematic behavior Boeing is doing, that fit an MO.
Also, it's clear that *you do* have an opinion on this.
i literally know absolutely nothing about boeing or this guy. i have 0 opinion on this case at all. what i have an opinion about is people using someone claiming they won't commit suicide as evidence that they were murdered when they die. see john mcafee. it was a major headline when he died that he said he wouldn't commit suicide and then he died therefore conspiracy. except in reality he is the exact sort of unhinged maniac that would commit suicide. i wouldn't be surprised if there was ACTUAL evidence of a conspiracy, but him saying him saying he won't kill himself aint it.
This seems like a screen capture from Fox? Anyone has the link to the original video on Fox?
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