France starts collecting tax on tech giants(techcrunch.com)
techcrunch.com
France starts collecting tax on tech giants
https://techcrunch.com/2020/11/25/france-starts-collecting-tax-on-tech-giants/
25 comments
So in short France is supposed to abolished everything that actually makes the country.. French?
It's simply a stupid idea to try to emulate the US. The world doesn't need more gigantic global conglomerates which are largely built on homogogenous large domestic markets with unified languages to scale up (hence the dominance of China and the US).
Countries like France, instead of dumping taxes or eroding worker rights, should focus on small business and human scale technology. Privacy, encryption, protocols rather than platforms, open standards, open source, healthy and diverse ecosystems rather than growth. Switzerland is the example to follow, not the US or China.
It's simply a stupid idea to try to emulate the US. The world doesn't need more gigantic global conglomerates which are largely built on homogogenous large domestic markets with unified languages to scale up (hence the dominance of China and the US).
Countries like France, instead of dumping taxes or eroding worker rights, should focus on small business and human scale technology. Privacy, encryption, protocols rather than platforms, open standards, open source, healthy and diverse ecosystems rather than growth. Switzerland is the example to follow, not the US or China.
It has never been easier to operate in multiple languages, and technology will make this even cheaper in the long run.
The real barrier to having a wide unified market for Europe to grow it's ecosystem is having N jurisdictions with laws that are incompatible with each other.
The real barrier to having a wide unified market for Europe to grow it's ecosystem is having N jurisdictions with laws that are incompatible with each other.
This is something the EU is working on, which will hopefully get better in the future. (Hopefully including EU-wide worker protection, consumer protection and tax laws)
The Zurich google office is pretty cool. Had a fun slide.
France has a tech industry, containing companies like ST and Ubisoft.
Heck, China has "global market leaders" following exactly none of that advice.
Heck, China has "global market leaders" following exactly none of that advice.
They built a moat around their market and forced "partnerships" for companies that wished to enter it.
But sure.
But sure.
These are not fines and have absolutely nothing to do with France ability or inability to grow an "ecosystem".
This is entirely about large foreign companies using clever schemes to offload their sale taxes to semi-parasitic members of the EU.
A new way of calculating taxes is a lot less messy than bombing Irland and Luxembourg.
This is entirely about large foreign companies using clever schemes to offload their sale taxes to semi-parasitic members of the EU.
A new way of calculating taxes is a lot less messy than bombing Irland and Luxembourg.
They are writing special rules to specifically rent-seek a list of companies. It's a short term political gain.
What they should do instead is if they don't like the existing legal framework that enables companies to pay taxes in an other European jurisdiction, simply re-write that.
Write bad laws, get bad results.
What they should do instead is if they don't like the existing legal framework that enables companies to pay taxes in an other European jurisdiction, simply re-write that.
Write bad laws, get bad results.
Rent seeking is an interesting point, since every tech giant is basically a rentier in some form. The path to billions in revenue is to control eyeballs, marketplaces, platforms, without ever strictly selling it away.
Rentierism is fundamentally unproductive. If you're a keynesian, a rent is literally the excess that can be extracted due to some market inefficiency, and the flood gates should release a million competitors into the market.
Clearly this isn't what is happening. I'm okay with taxing rentiers for the regulatory protection they rely on to protect their monopolies.
I completely agree with your other points.
Rentierism is fundamentally unproductive. If you're a keynesian, a rent is literally the excess that can be extracted due to some market inefficiency, and the flood gates should release a million competitors into the market.
Clearly this isn't what is happening. I'm okay with taxing rentiers for the regulatory protection they rely on to protect their monopolies.
I completely agree with your other points.
> The last one in particular is critical. In some EU countries, you can already justify your 5th employee's complete salary having a dedicated "accountant" whose only job is to apply for government grants.
Your argument is that government grants are bad because they cause some moderate buerocratic hassle?
Your argument is that government grants are bad because they cause some moderate buerocratic hassle?
> Your argument is that government grants are bad because they cause some moderate bureaucratic hassle?
There's nothing moderate about it. Think about the amount of paperwork required so that someone is spending 35h/week working on it. And we're talking about a 5 people org. All that to claim tax credits the company will maybe get next quarter. As opposed to a US startup that pays way less tax and can just hire the engineer they need as their 5th employee. Which one is getting a head start?
And on the other hand, all these programs are administered by an army of bureaucrats, all paid with a cushy pension fund.
It's a great job program for bureaucrats, not so much for startups!
There's nothing moderate about it. Think about the amount of paperwork required so that someone is spending 35h/week working on it. And we're talking about a 5 people org. All that to claim tax credits the company will maybe get next quarter. As opposed to a US startup that pays way less tax and can just hire the engineer they need as their 5th employee. Which one is getting a head start?
And on the other hand, all these programs are administered by an army of bureaucrats, all paid with a cushy pension fund.
It's a great job program for bureaucrats, not so much for startups!
In other news, France also banned the sharing of videos of police brutality.
How is this relevant?
It’s context for the general philosophy of the French government.
My guess is that people who know nothing about French politics would be surprised by this, imagining that most countries in Europe have strong civil liberties protections, or at least respect for them.
If you don’t know about this, the French approach to taxation can seem progressive, With context though, it seems much more like an authoritarian move.
My guess is that people who know nothing about French politics would be surprised by this, imagining that most countries in Europe have strong civil liberties protections, or at least respect for them.
If you don’t know about this, the French approach to taxation can seem progressive, With context though, it seems much more like an authoritarian move.
The tech giants should have a giant leak...all French people to get all their cloud files and communications made public.
Ah, the American approach: unlimited collateral damage to bully other countries into economic surrender.
The DGSE has carried out extra territorial murder before..
The DGSE has carried out extra territorial murder before..
I hate to break it to you, but you're not a temporarily embarrassed tech giant, so there is no need to think up retaliation plans for them.
Germany has the right idea. All countries should ensure data and operational sovereignty of critical tech companies.
Then when one of them misbehaves a leaf can be taken from the American play book, and said company will simply be seized by the government and handed over to a trusted sovereign entity for operation going forward.
Then when one of them misbehaves a leaf can be taken from the American play book, and said company will simply be seized by the government and handed over to a trusted sovereign entity for operation going forward.
followed by mysterious explosions killing whole boards of directors of said US tech giants no doubt https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinking_of_the_Rainbow_Warrior
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Bootstrapping an ecosystem capable of spawning and growing global market leaders is hard. And it would require some very unpopular measures.
- Weak/Non-Existent non-compete
- Make it easier to hire and fire employees
- Competitive approach to retaining talent
- Lower tax rate for tech companies instead of endless government grants/subsidies
The last one in particular is critical. In some EU countries, you can already justify your 5th employee's complete salary having a dedicated "accountant" whose only job is to apply for government grants.