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john-mark

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Neo4j is unprofitable after 17 years, is this common for VC funded companies? [pdf]

storage.courtlistener.com
2 points·by john-mark·2 года назад·3 comments

China's Generative Video Race Heats Up

techcrunch.com
4 points·by john-mark·2 года назад·0 comments

Free Software Foundation Addresses Neo4j's Commons Clause

fsf.org
5 points·by john-mark·3 года назад·0 comments

[untitled]

1 points·by john-mark·3 года назад·0 comments

Why would Neo4j Investors be taking control of Neo4j Inc?

glassdoor.com
3 points·by john-mark·3 года назад·1 comments

SFC's Policy Fellow Files Expert Report in Neo4j vs. PureThink

sfconservancy.org
1 points·by john-mark·3 года назад·2 comments

comments

john-mark
·10 месяцев назад·discuss
Neo4j Hype Translator:

Input Hype: “Neo4j Launches Breakthrough Infinigraph Architecture to Unify Transactional and Operational Workloads”

Output Hype Translation: After over a decade of “clustering”, Neo4j finally figured out sharding, basically fixing the thing their clustering should’ve done from the start.
john-mark
·в прошлом году·discuss
If you’re doing GraphRAG in the style of Microsoft’s original model , where the graph is inferred dynamically by the LLM and used primarily for retrieval or reasoning , then Neo4j is often overkill in my opinion. Not to mention its performance issues and toxic attitude to open source.

Lightweight, in-memory alternatives like NetworkX or even plain Python dictionaries are typically faster to set up, easier to integrate, and better suited to ephemeral, prompt driven graph reasoning.

Here are some other options : NetworkX

LlamaIndex’s KnowledgeGraphIndex

LangChain with in-memory Python structures, Lets you model entities and relationships as dictionaries or lists, making it easy to traverse or query on demand.

https://docs.llamaindex.ai/en/stable/examples/index_structs/...

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/blog/moving-to-grap...

https://github.com/microsoft/graphrag
john-mark
·в прошлом году·discuss
Neo4j has bet the farm on GraphRag. Unfortunately - I don’t think the return on investment is there even if using Neo4j community edition - and even then - I think there are better options.

Good article though.
john-mark
·2 года назад·discuss
Thanks - this one is new to me. Checking it out.
john-mark
·2 года назад·discuss
DozerDB: extends Neo4j Community with features such as multi-db. https://dozerdb.org

Memgraph: https://memgraph.com/memgraph-for-neo4j-developers

Apache AGE https://age.apache.org/

And much more….
john-mark
·2 года назад·discuss
If you are using community edition - check out the DozerDB plugin which adds enterprise features to Neo4j community such as multi database. Its still in its infancy but has already implemented multi db and enterprise constraints. https://dozerdb.org
john-mark
·2 года назад·discuss
Will more information that could touch on what you mentioned be in their S-1 registration if they attempt an IPO? I need to search through all the court documents to see if there are any more details about prior years. Good thing I have LLMs to help with this now.

https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/16272543/neo4j-inc-v-pu... https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/16276158/neo4j-inc-v-gr...
john-mark
·2 года назад·discuss
Trial testimony shows that Neo4j is not currently profitable after 17 years.

Is this normal for VC funded software companies nowadays?

---

Q. DO YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR NET PROFITS ARE?

A. WE ARE IN A LOSS POSITION RIGHT NOW.

https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.cand.33...
john-mark
·2 года назад·discuss
Seems mostly like hype.

The analysis below seems to show that GraphRag with @Neo4j offers minimal improvement in context retrieval and only slight gains in answer relevancy and faithfulness.

https://aiencoder.substack.com/p/graphrag-analysis-part-1-ho...
john-mark
·3 года назад·discuss
Why would the investors of Neo4j take control of Neo4j Inc?

I believe the COO was removed as COO around the time I first heard this.

I hope Neo4j Inc does not get desperate and add terms to their Neo4j Community Edition making it proprietary or non-free like they did with their enterprise edition!
john-mark
·3 года назад·discuss
It seems from their repo (need to verify) that they did the right thing and changed the License to their own license name called Dgraph Community License (DCL)

Compare this to Neo4j, who added the commons clause to the AGPL License complete with FSF copyright and preamble. Neo4j kept the License as AGPL and reaped the benefits from open source community.

Neo4j’s approach made people think it was still open source under the AGPL, while dgraph’s approach was proper and clear.

Neo4j’s approach was deceitful in my opinion, and I believe it’s finally coming back to haunt them after some toxic rulings put the GPL structure at risk unless an upcoming appeal overturns it.

Good for dgraph for doing it right in the end and not making people think they were Apache licensed with commons.
john-mark
·3 года назад·discuss
I never saw this.

If Dgraph has the commons clause then it is no longer open source or free software (as in libre free).

If they are still calling it open source, they should be warned the courts have ruled that the commons clause means ‘not open source’.
john-mark
·3 года назад·discuss
https://github.com/docker/genai-stack/graphs/contributors
john-mark
·3 года назад·discuss
All hype in my opinion, and apparently the #2 committer of the project may agree.

He agrees that @neo4j is slower than a “normal vector db”.

“if you are not dealing with many documents, it works quite well”

“Neo4j might not be optimized for vector search, but that doesn't mean it can't do it.”

https://x.com/tb_tomaz/status/1646626362243919873?s=20
john-mark
·3 года назад·discuss
Direct link to the report.

https://sfconservancy.org/docs/kuhn_expert-report-in-neo4j_5...
john-mark
·3 года назад·discuss
Case about the “further restrictions” removal provision of the AGPLv3 continues after counterclaim filing
john-mark
·4 года назад·discuss
This post is several years old, but it shows what their prices were back when neo4j enterprise was available commercial or AGPL.

As soon as end users learned they were getting the same software either way, guess what they picked?

(This is my blog post - iGov Inc is just me)

https://blog.igovsol.com/2018/01/10/Neo4j-Commercial-Prices....
john-mark
·4 года назад·discuss
Yes they closed the enterprise source code.

They first tried adding the commons clause, then when that did not accomplish what they wanted, they closed the enterprise source code.

The kicker is that this was not because of behemoth like Amazon or Oracle, it was because of a single individual… (guess who?)

Good read to get a better picture:

https://sfconservancy.org/blog/2022/mar/30/neo4j-v-purethink...
john-mark
·4 года назад·discuss
I touched on the negative Glassdoor reviews in this thread. Do you see a common pattern/theme? https://twitter.com/jmsuhy/status/1600093327130431488?s=61&t...