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trott

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Tiny Model, Big Logic: Large-Model Reasoning Ability in VibeThinker-1.5B

arxiv.org
4 points·by trott·8 месяцев назад·0 comments

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trott
·в прошлом году·discuss
> According to Stack Overflow developer survey [0] Rust is at 12.5%, ... So definitely not niche.

The annual survey is very popular in the Rust community. Its results are often used for advocacy. Participation by Rust developers is very high. So what you have is a classic case of a selection bias.
trott
·2 года назад·discuss
> The big-O here is irrelevant for the architectures since it's all in the configuration & implementation of the model; i.e. there is no relevant asymptote to compare.

?!

NNs are like any other algorithm in this regard. Heck, look at the bottom of page 2 of the Were RNNs All We Needed paper. It has big-O notation there and elsewhere.

> I was responding to

>> a Transformer layer can look back see O(X^2) numbers, while an RNN can only see O(X) numbers

In the BASED paper, in Eq. 10, sizeof(s) = 2dN. But I defined d = N = X above. Ergo, sizeof(s) = 2X^2 = O(X^2).

For minGRU, sizeof(s) = d. Ergo, sizeof(s) = X = O(X).
trott
·2 года назад·discuss
> Transformers actually have an quantifiable state size

Are you griping about my writing O(X^2) above instead of precisely 2X^2, like this paper? The latter implies the former.

> So a sufficiently sized RNN could have the same state capacity as a transformer.

Does this contradict anything I've said? If you increase the size of the RNN, while keeping the Transformer fixed, you can match their recurrent state sizes (if you don't run out of RAM or funding)
trott
·2 года назад·discuss
> Simplistic thinking. An RNN hidden parameter space of high dimension provides plenty of room for linear projections of token histories. I think people just do not realize just how huge R^N can be.

16N bits as hard limit, but more realistically, about 2N bits or less of useful information probably.

You'd need to grow the network dimension in proportion to the maximum sequence length just to avoid the information theoretical limit.
trott
·2 года назад·discuss
> This is no different than a transformer, which, after all, is bound by a finite state, just organized in a different manner.

It's not just a matter of organizing things differently. Suppose your network dimension and sequence length are both X.

Then your memory usage (per layer) will be O(X^2), while your training update cost will be O(X^3). That's for both Transformers and RNNs.

However, at the end of the sequence, a Transformer layer can look back see O(X^2) numbers, while an RNN can only see O(X) numbers.
trott
·2 года назад·discuss
People did something similar to what you are describing 10 years ago: https://arxiv.org/abs/1409.0473

But it's trained on translations, rather than the whole Internet.
trott
·2 года назад·discuss
My feeling is that the answer is "no", in the sense that these RNNs wouldn't be able to universally replace Transformers in LLMs, even though they might be good enough in some cases and beat them in others.

Here's why.

A user of an LLM might give the model some long text and then say "Translate this into German please". A Transformer can look back at its whole history. But what is an RNN to do? While the length of its context is unlimited, the amount of information the model retains about it is bounded by whatever is in its hidden state at any given time.

Relevant: https://arxiv.org/abs/2402.01032