Ask HN: Why is it hard to find a wife now-a-days?
21 comments
As a married male software engineer in his 20s: the problem here is you. Your expectations are ridiculous and if you continue to seek a woman who meets them you will likely die alone.
You want an Indian woman living in the PNW, roughly your age (I assume) yet without any relationship experience, limited alcohol consumption and didn't party in her 20s?
I'm sure many people here would like a rich supermodel scientist who can cook a beautiful meal too. Would you say their inability to marry one is because of some change in society?
Drop your insane criteria entirely. You need to be meeting as many people as you can and _really_ getting to know them. For all you know, your perfect wife is a fun-loving African-American who's been in a few relationships and loves partying but right now, if you ran into her at a conference or something, you'd dismiss her instantly because she doesn't meet your silly criteria.
Also, don't be laser focused on marriage. If you go into all your relationships looking only for a wife, you're near certain to fail. Finding a wife (for me at least) is about getting to know someone first and deciding you want to spend your life with them second. It normally takes years for people to decide they're willing to make a commitment like marriage.
You want an Indian woman living in the PNW, roughly your age (I assume) yet without any relationship experience, limited alcohol consumption and didn't party in her 20s?
I'm sure many people here would like a rich supermodel scientist who can cook a beautiful meal too. Would you say their inability to marry one is because of some change in society?
Drop your insane criteria entirely. You need to be meeting as many people as you can and _really_ getting to know them. For all you know, your perfect wife is a fun-loving African-American who's been in a few relationships and loves partying but right now, if you ran into her at a conference or something, you'd dismiss her instantly because she doesn't meet your silly criteria.
Also, don't be laser focused on marriage. If you go into all your relationships looking only for a wife, you're near certain to fail. Finding a wife (for me at least) is about getting to know someone first and deciding you want to spend your life with them second. It normally takes years for people to decide they're willing to make a commitment like marriage.
You said it yourself. You expect a woman in her 30s with no relationship experience who hardly ever drinks alcohol. Without saying anything about those preferences, it's only a small number of women who fit that requirement.
Do you have the same requirements for male friends? If not, why does a relationship like marriage need to be different? I understand that you want someone who shares your experience in not having had a relationship, but consider that you are in an increasingly small group as you get older and the type of people in that group probably tend to be reclusive and not meet each other anyway. I would encourage you to consider if sharing that experience is really so important in the bigger picture.
Do you have the same requirements for male friends? If not, why does a relationship like marriage need to be different? I understand that you want someone who shares your experience in not having had a relationship, but consider that you are in an increasingly small group as you get older and the type of people in that group probably tend to be reclusive and not meet each other anyway. I would encourage you to consider if sharing that experience is really so important in the bigger picture.
You want to find a girl who is:
1. ready for marriage 2. has had NO previous boyfriends 3. doesn't drink more than twice a month 4. said girl should not value money at all 5. this girl should be ok a guy who has poor social skills 6. should not have an arbitrary set of rules that excludes nearly 100% of the dating pool
If you find this girl, I guarantee you she is messed up in the head.
Bonus question: How come you said a women "on my side" rather than "by my side"? (is she a gun or a partner?)
1. ready for marriage 2. has had NO previous boyfriends 3. doesn't drink more than twice a month 4. said girl should not value money at all 5. this girl should be ok a guy who has poor social skills 6. should not have an arbitrary set of rules that excludes nearly 100% of the dating pool
If you find this girl, I guarantee you she is messed up in the head.
Bonus question: How come you said a women "on my side" rather than "by my side"? (is she a gun or a partner?)
> How come you said a women "on my side" rather than "by my side"? (is she a gun or a partner?)
I think this is just an honest mistake as a result of bad English rather than a reflection of his attitude towards women.
I think this is just an honest mistake as a result of bad English rather than a reflection of his attitude towards women.
I could totally see that. However, too many "misspeaks" like this could come across as telegraphing your true feelings.
Sometimes how people say things is even more important than WHAT they say. (other case in point: "Decent" is a highly charged, loaded VALUE JUDGEMENT. I wonder if the Op is "decent"?)
Sometimes how people say things is even more important than WHAT they say. (other case in point: "Decent" is a highly charged, loaded VALUE JUDGEMENT. I wonder if the Op is "decent"?)
I can understand not wanting someone who drinks regularly.
I can understand wanting to find an Indian girl -especially if you're Indian.
I can understand not wanting to date someone who has slept with too many men, especially because it sounds like you haven't?
You clearly wrote this looking for feedback, so let me speak about what sticks out to me about your comments. I think it's a bit odd that you want them to have "no relationship experience". So they need to be 18, socially awkward, or career driven. If they're 18 or Career driven, they may not be interested in you. That just leaves "socially awkward".
I think you should reconsider that qualification and should be open to having a relationship with a woman who has had a few (not hundreds) of relationships before. It's my opinion - and experience - that women need a few relationships to really find themselves.
I hope that helps.
I can understand wanting to find an Indian girl -especially if you're Indian.
I can understand not wanting to date someone who has slept with too many men, especially because it sounds like you haven't?
You clearly wrote this looking for feedback, so let me speak about what sticks out to me about your comments. I think it's a bit odd that you want them to have "no relationship experience". So they need to be 18, socially awkward, or career driven. If they're 18 or Career driven, they may not be interested in you. That just leaves "socially awkward".
I think you should reconsider that qualification and should be open to having a relationship with a woman who has had a few (not hundreds) of relationships before. It's my opinion - and experience - that women need a few relationships to really find themselves.
I hope that helps.
Just a few idle observations...
Women are sexually attracted to confidence and charisma the way men are sexually attracted to youth and beauty. Attraction is not negotiable, so if you have neither confidence nor charisma, you need to learn them. I hear toastmasters is good for this.
If you're looking to attract a traditional woman, then you need to be a traditional man. Dress well, have a good job and make enough money to support a household and kids.
Where do you meet women? Most of the US dating scene is focused around alcohol (bars, clubs, etc). If you want to meet someone who doesn't drink, then stay away from places where alcohol is consumed. Church (or a hindu temple) is still a good place to meet traditional women, as are book groups, hiking groups, soccer groups, stand-up paddle board classes, etc. Also, any group that meets at the crack of dawn for some sort of physical activity. Anybody who shows up to that sort of event will more than likely be in shape and not drink a lot.
Expecting somebody to have no relationship experience isn't realistic. If you want any hope of finding a wife, you need to let go of that one.
Women are sexually attracted to confidence and charisma the way men are sexually attracted to youth and beauty. Attraction is not negotiable, so if you have neither confidence nor charisma, you need to learn them. I hear toastmasters is good for this.
If you're looking to attract a traditional woman, then you need to be a traditional man. Dress well, have a good job and make enough money to support a household and kids.
Where do you meet women? Most of the US dating scene is focused around alcohol (bars, clubs, etc). If you want to meet someone who doesn't drink, then stay away from places where alcohol is consumed. Church (or a hindu temple) is still a good place to meet traditional women, as are book groups, hiking groups, soccer groups, stand-up paddle board classes, etc. Also, any group that meets at the crack of dawn for some sort of physical activity. Anybody who shows up to that sort of event will more than likely be in shape and not drink a lot.
Expecting somebody to have no relationship experience isn't realistic. If you want any hope of finding a wife, you need to let go of that one.
What about an Indian dating site or app? I met my now wife through okcupid a few years ago and we couldn't be a better match. My dating life before okcupid was non existent. I also had a hard time online and took a lot of work but I don't think I would have went on as many dates with people that matched the attributes I was looking for without using a website that filtered out a lot of that. You can easily exclude the drinkers, smokers, etc. There will be disappointments but it's a numbers game and you'll find someone if you keep at it. There's a lid for every pot as they say.
If that doesn't work maybe ask your parents to do a traditional Indian wedding where they do match you with someone. But I'd go the online route first if your family isn't traditional.
Good luck!
https://www.quora.com/Which-are-the-best-online-dating-sites...
If that doesn't work maybe ask your parents to do a traditional Indian wedding where they do match you with someone. But I'd go the online route first if your family isn't traditional.
Good luck!
https://www.quora.com/Which-are-the-best-online-dating-sites...
The problem is that you are expecting too many things from women and why this word "marry" comes many times?
My advice now is not looking for a wife but for a girlfriend, make sure this is the right person before thinking about getting married.
From my own experience, I work in an IT company in China and most of my Chinese colleagues look socially awkward. They don't take care of themselves (wear the same t-shirt for 1 week or 2), they can't look at a girl in the eyes without blushing and so on. I am small compared to my friends and colleagues, I don't have the 6 pack either but I have learned to feel comfortable with women.
Don't blame on the society, only blame on yourself. I think your requirements are quite outdated and if you can't accept it, just go back to India.
My advice now is not looking for a wife but for a girlfriend, make sure this is the right person before thinking about getting married.
From my own experience, I work in an IT company in China and most of my Chinese colleagues look socially awkward. They don't take care of themselves (wear the same t-shirt for 1 week or 2), they can't look at a girl in the eyes without blushing and so on. I am small compared to my friends and colleagues, I don't have the 6 pack either but I have learned to feel comfortable with women.
Don't blame on the society, only blame on yourself. I think your requirements are quite outdated and if you can't accept it, just go back to India.
What sticks out like a sore thumb in this post is that you're approaching this like a candidate selection process. The most horrifying thing of all is that you're enumerating a list of criteria you want and nowhere do you even remotely mention human emotion. It's about finding somebody you love and not about satisficing bullet points.
Any woman who by sheer chance satisfied all those criteria and wasn't fucked in the head would probably be utterly uninterested in the idea of spending the rest of her life in a loveless marriage.
Any woman who by sheer chance satisfied all those criteria and wasn't fucked in the head would probably be utterly uninterested in the idea of spending the rest of her life in a loveless marriage.
Sounds like you like traditional women. If a girl like that didn't drink in her twenties and focused on her studies or career like you, why shouldn't she expect a guy with resources? She's a good catch. Traditional girls want to focus on family life and their kids so money ensures they could be free to do that.
Since you want good catches don't accept being bald. You can get hair transplants if needed. You should take a realistic look at yourself and think if being bald makes you look like the Indian Jason Stathom or if it makes you look less appealing. My guess is the latter because most under 40 yr old guys can't pull it off. After fixing the bald issue look for other ways to improve yourself.
Finally start meeting the right women. Go to traditional Indian supermarkets. Find meetups for Indian professionals. If dating sites aren't working you might need to try harder to meet the traditional types you like. If you can't find that in America take some trips to India. Don't care what other people say... go somewhere that you can meet the women you want.
Since you want good catches don't accept being bald. You can get hair transplants if needed. You should take a realistic look at yourself and think if being bald makes you look like the Indian Jason Stathom or if it makes you look less appealing. My guess is the latter because most under 40 yr old guys can't pull it off. After fixing the bald issue look for other ways to improve yourself.
Finally start meeting the right women. Go to traditional Indian supermarkets. Find meetups for Indian professionals. If dating sites aren't working you might need to try harder to meet the traditional types you like. If you can't find that in America take some trips to India. Don't care what other people say... go somewhere that you can meet the women you want.
The real cures for bald are "funny" or "confident". Those are attributes women REALLY want. And if your sense of humor is only ok, try "being a caring, active listener" (amazingly almost no one does this).
The asker didn't want to be wanted for their money, but to be wanted for your hair? Think about it. That's even MORE shallow.
The asker didn't want to be wanted for their money, but to be wanted for your hair? Think about it. That's even MORE shallow.
Besides some of the other good observations nearby, I wanted to add that you should admit you are deficient in relationship experience. You should change your attitude, and be thankful that you might meet someone who has had more experience, and perhaps her superiority in this regard could complement your ignorance.
In other words, you might learn something.
In other words, you might learn something.
The crux of your question revolves around loneliness and your desire for companionship, but I think you're focusing instead on a list of inflexible requirements that you're imposing upon a person you have yet to meet. Are all of these expectations really what you need from another person in your life, or do they stem from fear of women, relationships, and trust? If it's the latter, insecurity is getting in the way of your happiness, and that's not healthy.
Also, I'm bothered by a lot of your wording. Some things to consider, that only you can really answer:
Why are you afraid that women are hunting you down for your "resources?" What is this presumed power/resource imbalance and what does that say about your opinion of women in general?
Why do you expect someone to have no relationship experience? You stated that you feel like you've missed out on building your own experiences. Why do you wish this mistake on someone else? Do you also expect your male friends to never have been in a relationship? What does that say about your respect for the experiences and agency of half the world's people?
What are the social norms around alcohol consumption in your city. If it's normal for people to drink socially once or more a week, how might your alcohol rules affect a person's other social relationships. It's this really about alcohol or is it about control or fear of the other relationships in a woman's life? Are you hoping to change someone? What's does this say about your own insecurities and ability to trust?
Finally, what do you imagine is a "decent woman?" Does she need to be Indian? Can she be more successful than you? Make more money? Hack better code? Have more friends? Is a woman with relationship experience not decent? Can a decent woman impress you? Can you work under a decent woman? What age is a decent woman? Are most women you meet decent? Does your definition of a "decent man" differ?
Also, I'm bothered by a lot of your wording. Some things to consider, that only you can really answer:
Why are you afraid that women are hunting you down for your "resources?" What is this presumed power/resource imbalance and what does that say about your opinion of women in general?
Why do you expect someone to have no relationship experience? You stated that you feel like you've missed out on building your own experiences. Why do you wish this mistake on someone else? Do you also expect your male friends to never have been in a relationship? What does that say about your respect for the experiences and agency of half the world's people?
What are the social norms around alcohol consumption in your city. If it's normal for people to drink socially once or more a week, how might your alcohol rules affect a person's other social relationships. It's this really about alcohol or is it about control or fear of the other relationships in a woman's life? Are you hoping to change someone? What's does this say about your own insecurities and ability to trust?
Finally, what do you imagine is a "decent woman?" Does she need to be Indian? Can she be more successful than you? Make more money? Hack better code? Have more friends? Is a woman with relationship experience not decent? Can a decent woman impress you? Can you work under a decent woman? What age is a decent woman? Are most women you meet decent? Does your definition of a "decent man" differ?
5 isn't very many at all. Try harder. It may take 10 or 100 more. Social activities, sports, churches, universities or interest groups are the best places.
I wouldn't rush into marriage, because it's the best way to rush into divorce.
https://video.vice.com/en_us/video/inside-america39s-billion...
I wouldn't rush into marriage, because it's the best way to rush into divorce.
https://video.vice.com/en_us/video/inside-america39s-billion...
> What can I do? I don't think I will be ever able to accept a girl who is just marrying me for the resources.
Well then, what are you contributing to the relationship?
Well then, what are you contributing to the relationship?
Why does she have to be Indian?
I've been hearing a lot of this from people in tech and I think I know the reason why this happens to guys like you.
Here are some of my observations:
- You are in tech, so you are possibly an introverted nerd. Which means, you feel drained with social interaction. Unfortunately, women won't come without interaction
- You are in tech, so your profession requires constant studying and updating skills, which means less time outside, meeting and interacting with women
- You are in tech, you allowed companies to make your life miserable with stupid interview processes, perf reviews, PIPs etc. Ever occurred to you how much you are compromising in your life to "win" at these stupid artificial processes?
- You are an Indian in the US. I'm guessing on H1b. Which means you are basically a modern day slave unfortunately. Do you realize how much freer people are back in India? If real life is more important to you than substandard life in US, go back to India. Seriously, life in India is FREEDOM. Live in some nice cities, meet people, meet neighbors, celebrate festivals
- You are in tech, so you are more comfortable with computers than with people. Women are not computers
- Your go-to place to ask such an issue is HN? Perhaps cut down time in front of the screen and meet real people. This action of yours gives a clue as to how unhealthy your relationship with computers is
- You are seriously behind socially. There's no other way to put this. Women are humans, they have social and emotional needs. A healthy woman will have had some relationships. You haven't had a relationship before? Guess what, most healthy people in their 20s do. You are the odd man out, nothing changed with women
Now you know why so many people choose not to do STEM?
Here are some of my observations:
- You are in tech, so you are possibly an introverted nerd. Which means, you feel drained with social interaction. Unfortunately, women won't come without interaction
- You are in tech, so your profession requires constant studying and updating skills, which means less time outside, meeting and interacting with women
- You are in tech, you allowed companies to make your life miserable with stupid interview processes, perf reviews, PIPs etc. Ever occurred to you how much you are compromising in your life to "win" at these stupid artificial processes?
- You are an Indian in the US. I'm guessing on H1b. Which means you are basically a modern day slave unfortunately. Do you realize how much freer people are back in India? If real life is more important to you than substandard life in US, go back to India. Seriously, life in India is FREEDOM. Live in some nice cities, meet people, meet neighbors, celebrate festivals
- You are in tech, so you are more comfortable with computers than with people. Women are not computers
- Your go-to place to ask such an issue is HN? Perhaps cut down time in front of the screen and meet real people. This action of yours gives a clue as to how unhealthy your relationship with computers is
- You are seriously behind socially. There's no other way to put this. Women are humans, they have social and emotional needs. A healthy woman will have had some relationships. You haven't had a relationship before? Guess what, most healthy people in their 20s do. You are the odd man out, nothing changed with women
Now you know why so many people choose not to do STEM?
Agree with you on "tech persons are more comfortable with computers than woman"
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I am trying to find Indian woman I can marry. Recently, I met 5 Indian women. Despite what is being said in the media, I felt that cards are stacked against men. I don't believe in caste or religion and my parents are cool with any girl I marry to. When I met these women, all of them have had at least 1 or 2 boyfriends. I dont expect my wife to be a virgin, but I am expecting someone with no relationship experience. That's because I never had girlfriend or I never was in a relationship. All these women said they drink alcohol quite often. I would be okay with drinking alcohol once in a while but daily/weekly is definitely no.
I have had same experience with dating women in US. I went on quite a few dates but never turned into anything serious.
Throughout my 20s I focused on studies, building career and now I am finding that I missed in dating/relationships area. Working hard was the only choice I had. I grew up in lower middle class family so study and work were only things known to me.
I maintain good hygiene and can converse well. I dont have specific hobby as such but I like reading, soccer and hiking.
I feel my life is incomplete without a woman on my side. I see so many couples and honestly I feel jealous.
I am a bit concerned if I can ever find a decent woman to marry who doesn't drink and haven't gone partying throughout her 20s.
Is this a midlife crisis? What can I do? I don't think I will be ever able to accept a girl who is just marrying me for the resources.