Hangry in the field: On the impact of hunger on anger, irritability, and affect(journals.plos.org)
journals.plos.org
Hangry in the field: On the impact of hunger on anger, irritability, and affect
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0269629
53 comments
One of the nice perks of eating low carb and regularly doing ~48hr fasts is it's completely removed any hangry phase of being from my existence. I just choose to stop eating whenever and without even thinking about food 24hrs have gone by. The next best perk is not having to waste any time on meal-prep/eating/pooping those days either.
Based on my experience, I agree.
The only thing I would like to add is that going low carb does not necessarily have to be extreme (20gms per day or similar). It could be just cutting out high GI foods, or having such food in small quantities after your main meal. Tolerance for carbs varies in individuals and all you need to do is find your limit. Also, 48 hours fast is great but you can do as little as skip a meal every day (say 16:8 intermittent fast) to start seeing benefits: improved mood and energy.
I wanted to chime in just to make sure that people do not read your comment and say "oh, that's beyond me." A small step in the general direction of reducing carb intake and fasting for a few hours a day will go a long way for most people.
The only thing I would like to add is that going low carb does not necessarily have to be extreme (20gms per day or similar). It could be just cutting out high GI foods, or having such food in small quantities after your main meal. Tolerance for carbs varies in individuals and all you need to do is find your limit. Also, 48 hours fast is great but you can do as little as skip a meal every day (say 16:8 intermittent fast) to start seeing benefits: improved mood and energy.
I wanted to chime in just to make sure that people do not read your comment and say "oh, that's beyond me." A small step in the general direction of reducing carb intake and fasting for a few hours a day will go a long way for most people.
Whenever I skip a meal, I always feel "Hangry" without fail. So I am sceptical about this. How long do you have to do any kind of intermittent fasting to actually start feeling the benefit? (What are the actual benefits?).
From what I have read, our body is healthier with "regular" cycles / habits - sleeping and waking up at the same time, eating regularly at the same time, exercising at the same time etc. so that all the "body clocks" (apparently we have many, like for sleep, releasing hormones etc.) get in sync. So things like intermittent fasting kind of goes against that logic because it creates stress in the body. (Though I have read that intermittent fasting can be helpful to reset some of the body clocks, but I am still not sure how to best use it in our daily life. Islam, for example, prescribes monthly (full day) fasting every year, but because of the lunar calendar that is followed, this happens at different period every year. That's one established / tried and tested way of doing it "intermittently". Some sects of Christianity and Hinduism prescribe some particular days every year for fasting. That's another way old way of doing it. But is there a scientifically studied way or regimen in our modern times to do this safely and effectively?)
From what I have read, our body is healthier with "regular" cycles / habits - sleeping and waking up at the same time, eating regularly at the same time, exercising at the same time etc. so that all the "body clocks" (apparently we have many, like for sleep, releasing hormones etc.) get in sync. So things like intermittent fasting kind of goes against that logic because it creates stress in the body. (Though I have read that intermittent fasting can be helpful to reset some of the body clocks, but I am still not sure how to best use it in our daily life. Islam, for example, prescribes monthly (full day) fasting every year, but because of the lunar calendar that is followed, this happens at different period every year. That's one established / tried and tested way of doing it "intermittently". Some sects of Christianity and Hinduism prescribe some particular days every year for fasting. That's another way old way of doing it. But is there a scientifically studied way or regimen in our modern times to do this safely and effectively?)
> Whenever I skip a meal, I always feel "Hangry" without fail.
In my experience, this is a kind of carb withdrawal. If your body is accustomed to not having a lot of carbs available constantly, you won't suffer from this. If you're eating lots of carbs, and especially sugary foods, the day(s) before IF, you'll get hangry.
As with any form of withdrawal, coming out of it doesn't happen overnight though. You need to soldier through a few days and then it subsides. The first time I did this it took me around 1 1/2 to 2 weeks of IF. After that, I could go 20-22 hours without feeling hungry or hangry.
These days, when I fall off the bandwagon, it takes me a couple days only as I'm more used to the feelings and sensations, and I guess my body knows it needs to adapt.
This is highly anecdotal and empyrical though, so take it with a grain of salt.
In my experience, this is a kind of carb withdrawal. If your body is accustomed to not having a lot of carbs available constantly, you won't suffer from this. If you're eating lots of carbs, and especially sugary foods, the day(s) before IF, you'll get hangry.
As with any form of withdrawal, coming out of it doesn't happen overnight though. You need to soldier through a few days and then it subsides. The first time I did this it took me around 1 1/2 to 2 weeks of IF. After that, I could go 20-22 hours without feeling hungry or hangry.
These days, when I fall off the bandwagon, it takes me a couple days only as I'm more used to the feelings and sensations, and I guess my body knows it needs to adapt.
This is highly anecdotal and empyrical though, so take it with a grain of salt.
While reading I was just going to ask if there are more non-anectotal evidence for doing this? And also, are there information sites where one could start to try it on oneself? :)
> In my experience, this is a kind of carb withdrawal.
I generally avoid high GI foods, and consume carbs with high fibre content only so that the sugar is released more slowly into the body ( https://www.health.harvard.edu/healthbeat/a-good-guide-to-go... ). I am loathe to completely avoid all kinds of carbs as it is essential for our health.
I generally avoid high GI foods, and consume carbs with high fibre content only so that the sugar is released more slowly into the body ( https://www.health.harvard.edu/healthbeat/a-good-guide-to-go... ). I am loathe to completely avoid all kinds of carbs as it is essential for our health.
Yep, choosing your carbs wisely is the better approach. I didn't mean to say you should avoid them completely but I can understand why you might have thought that from my post.
> Whenever I skip a meal, I always feel "Hangry" without fail.
How often do you skip meals? You have to make your body get used to your stomach being empty and burning fat. It is like walking, if you don't do it regularly then all the systems in your body that are there to burn fat aren't ready so they wont work properly. But if you practice it regularly then after a while it wont phase you at all, humans are made to function well without constantly eating meals.
It has nothing to do with low carb btw, I can do it just fine with high carb. Just have to get used to your stomach being empty from time to time.
> it creates stress in the body
Yeah, and training makes your muscles hurt and damages them when you haven't trained in a long time. Still training regularly is the healthy thing to do, and then your muscles will be just fine. Similarly skipping a meal doesn't damage you if you are used to it, your body just starts burning fat instead and everything continues like normal.
Also, try to predict what happens when your body isn't used to burn fat, and instead you just eat more every time your body starts to try to burn fat? Do you think that is healthy?
How often do you skip meals? You have to make your body get used to your stomach being empty and burning fat. It is like walking, if you don't do it regularly then all the systems in your body that are there to burn fat aren't ready so they wont work properly. But if you practice it regularly then after a while it wont phase you at all, humans are made to function well without constantly eating meals.
It has nothing to do with low carb btw, I can do it just fine with high carb. Just have to get used to your stomach being empty from time to time.
> it creates stress in the body
Yeah, and training makes your muscles hurt and damages them when you haven't trained in a long time. Still training regularly is the healthy thing to do, and then your muscles will be just fine. Similarly skipping a meal doesn't damage you if you are used to it, your body just starts burning fat instead and everything continues like normal.
Also, try to predict what happens when your body isn't used to burn fat, and instead you just eat more every time your body starts to try to burn fat? Do you think that is healthy?
> Yeah, and training makes your muscles hurt and damages them when you haven't trained in a long time. Still training regularly is the healthy thing to do, and then your muscles will be just fine.
With training, it matters greatly how much and how often you train. It is easy to over-train and even easier to cause yourself an injury.
With training, it matters greatly how much and how often you train. It is easy to over-train and even easier to cause yourself an injury.
This. 10 years ago I started a weight loss journey of some 50kgs or so. Biggest takeaway ever was the tremendous benefit of becoming metabolically flexible.
The freedom in daily planning and mental stability (never hangry) I can recommend anyone.
Low carb, skip a meal every now and then. Gets you 90% of the way there.
The freedom in daily planning and mental stability (never hangry) I can recommend anyone.
Low carb, skip a meal every now and then. Gets you 90% of the way there.
Can folks recommend any articles/books that shed a light on time-restricted feeding done safely while incorporating vigorous exercise? I'm someone who historically gets "hangry" (according to my wife) and starting 2 weeks, I accidentally skipped breakfast two days in a row and
1. felt amazing
2. surprised my hangry stopped kicking in
It’s hard to get good data - everybody seems to have something to sell.
That said, I’m enjoying this person’s YouTube channel: https://youtu.be/XCvUf9WU4qI
He at least refers to physiology and his videos avoid taking about toxins, acidity and other woo too much.
I accidentally did a nearly 60 hour fast for the first time ever last week as a result of watching that channel and doing some reading. Ate dinner on Monday, I was aiming for 36, felt fine on Wednesday morning so extended to 48 then decided to push on and skip dinner. Woke up at 3am on Thursday feeling such a genuine hunger that made me realise I’ve never been more than ‘peckish’ for most of my life. I caved and ate a small spoonful of ghee (pure fat) which lit my brain up like fireworks. Hunger immediately abated, the physical relief was incredible.
The main advice I followed was to drink more water, probably about double my usual consumption and take electrolyte salts.
https://reddit.com/r/fasting is also a pretty good resource
That said, I’m enjoying this person’s YouTube channel: https://youtu.be/XCvUf9WU4qI
He at least refers to physiology and his videos avoid taking about toxins, acidity and other woo too much.
I accidentally did a nearly 60 hour fast for the first time ever last week as a result of watching that channel and doing some reading. Ate dinner on Monday, I was aiming for 36, felt fine on Wednesday morning so extended to 48 then decided to push on and skip dinner. Woke up at 3am on Thursday feeling such a genuine hunger that made me realise I’ve never been more than ‘peckish’ for most of my life. I caved and ate a small spoonful of ghee (pure fat) which lit my brain up like fireworks. Hunger immediately abated, the physical relief was incredible.
The main advice I followed was to drink more water, probably about double my usual consumption and take electrolyte salts.
https://reddit.com/r/fasting is also a pretty good resource
Thank you so much for the resources and will be watching the video on autophagy that you had linked.
I definitely don't do low carb diet, don't do any kind of fasting and I don't get any of this.
I can skip breakfast altogether, if I don't do any sport I can skip lunch too and don't feel much difference. My wife (and her side of family generally) is opposite - feeling weak and irritated when hungry.
Genes play a big role, as in everything body-related.
I can skip breakfast altogether, if I don't do any sport I can skip lunch too and don't feel much difference. My wife (and her side of family generally) is opposite - feeling weak and irritated when hungry.
Genes play a big role, as in everything body-related.
For sure, but it does seem riding a glucose roller-coaster affects the probability one will experience things like cravings and irritability on the dips. Just modulo that with genetics.
How would this work with a high intensity exercise/lifting regimen? Or rather, would it work?
It's not fun.
I'm currently in the middle of a hardcore body recomposition routine that involves eating 200g of protein a day on a 1400-1600 calorie budget (so ~60% protein, but not keto)
Workouts are mentally draining, and obviously muscle gain is slow (some people think you can't gain muscle and lose weight... unless you're a competition prepped body builder with 6% body fat you don't need to worry about that).
-
Before toning things down a bit I had a few episodes where I'd enter ketosis, not necessarily from avoiding carbs, but from completely depleting my body's glycogen stores during a workout (cyclists and runners know it as bonking).
It can be a horrible feeling because a truly deep part of your mind is convinced it's trying to preserve you, and it deeply affects your emotional state. Each time it happened I'd spend the next day feeling like crap despite upping my carbs again
I'm currently in the middle of a hardcore body recomposition routine that involves eating 200g of protein a day on a 1400-1600 calorie budget (so ~60% protein, but not keto)
Workouts are mentally draining, and obviously muscle gain is slow (some people think you can't gain muscle and lose weight... unless you're a competition prepped body builder with 6% body fat you don't need to worry about that).
-
Before toning things down a bit I had a few episodes where I'd enter ketosis, not necessarily from avoiding carbs, but from completely depleting my body's glycogen stores during a workout (cyclists and runners know it as bonking).
It can be a horrible feeling because a truly deep part of your mind is convinced it's trying to preserve you, and it deeply affects your emotional state. Each time it happened I'd spend the next day feeling like crap despite upping my carbs again
I am a 60 year old lifelong cyclist, ectomorphic build. I have fasted for 24 hours (dinner time to next day's dinnertime) once weekly for about 5 years now. When fasting, I incorporate moderate exercise throughout the day, usually periodic sets of pushups and pullups, sometimes a 30 or 45 minute ride.
I can report I have no problem maintaining muscle or body mass with this regimen.
Further I can recall a few minor hangry episodes while fasting, early on. But like fasting itself, it became progressively easier for me to fast over time.
You would have a difficult time maintaining and gaining muscle mass with frequent, long fasts. Your muscles need protein to repair/recover/grow. If you don't provide it from food, your body will cannibalize it from wherever it can. This is one of the reasons it is recommended to increase protein intake, distributed throughout the day, when in a caloric deficit.
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Perhaps with GOMAD (Gallon of milk a day)
but such a hard change of diet or be planned, perhaps ask your doc / trainer first
but such a hard change of diet or be planned, perhaps ask your doc / trainer first
Low carb and lifting can work, you just schedule most carbs immediately pre/post workout.
Honestly I was more wondering about the 48 hour fasts. At first glance, I'm assuming it might impair recovery over the long term if the regimen is high enough intensity. I would assume if you're in more of a maintenance mode it could work better or even in a deficit
I don't train particularly hard and mostly just do cardio stuff, like lots of pushups daily.
Based on what I have experienced I think it's fine provided you're still maintaining an overall balance in the long-term. As in, on the non-fasting days you're eating enough of (if not more than) everything your body needs for your training regimen.
Based on what I have experienced I think it's fine provided you're still maintaining an overall balance in the long-term. As in, on the non-fasting days you're eating enough of (if not more than) everything your body needs for your training regimen.
I just drink some mineral water whenever I'm hungry.. It completely rids me off the hungry feeling.. not permanently, but when I feel hungry again I just drink some more mineral water and I'm not hungry again.
Eating is often a drag. You have to set aside time, you might get heartburn, you have to suppress burps, you might get a buildup of muckus in your throat that you have to lightly cough away. If I feel lethargic I often feel better just drinking some lemon water.
I’m often irritable anyway. Eating doesn’t help unless I have low blood sugar to the point of being fatigued. It often makes it worse.
I’m often irritable anyway. Eating doesn’t help unless I have low blood sugar to the point of being fatigued. It often makes it worse.
> you might get heartburn, you have to suppress burps, you might get a buildup of muckus in your throat that you have to lightly cough away.
What on earth are you eating?
What on earth are you eating?
I think parent has reached another level of enlightenment.
They are right! Eating maybe cause all of these things and for some people eating is just a chore.
I wish I was like that. I love eating though and I also enjoy a few more bodily functions!
I wish I was like that. I love eating though and I also enjoy a few more bodily functions!
Imagine experiencing such sour grapes over someone expressing a different opinion (on a subjective topic) that you sarcastically call them enlightened. Maybe this “hangry” concept isn’t just some dumb zoomer slang, indeed.
I wasn't being sarcastic at all
If there are no other illness, heartburn / reflux, burps, stomach rumbling, stomach pain etc. is all quite common if you regularly eat outside. Taste sells, so food in restaurant use copious amounts of oil / butter, sugar, salt, refined flour, MSG, etc. all of which are unhealthy when consumed in quantity and regularly. Eating home-cooked food really makes a difference to your gut health.
Also, parent could research into their intolerance. E.g milk, gluten etc could easily cause these, and cutting them (mostly) out might be an easy fix.
A lunch for me could either be a salad from the grocery store or raw broccoli, tomatoes, carrots, almonds, and maybe one of hard-boiled eggs/canned ham/cheese.
That sounds healthy except perhaps for the canned ham, if it is processed; diary products like cheese can cause bloating, pain, flatulence etc. if you are lactose intolerance (according to this article - https://www.everydayhealth.com/digestive-health/foods-that-c... - Broccoli and carrot can also gas, but not a real cause for concern with healthy foods like these). Apart from that you still face the common issue of hygiene and when the food was prepared. When eating out, we don't know what goes in the kitchen where the food is prepared and can only make a best guess that the food is handled hygienically in a clean environment. So that's out of our hand. But in grocery stores, we can certainly keep an eye out for the date / time the food was prepared and try to buy it "fresh". Foods that are kept out for long or not stored properly in the right temperature do undergo change (fermentation for e.g.) and that can also affect our tummy.
None of the foods you mentioned causes that. Nor does eating outside. Not to a healthy person.
I said they are unhealthy when eaten regularly in the quantity that restaurants use. That, and the fact that restaurants (even the good ones) sometimes serve leftovers often cause these issues. (And a healthy person won't remain healthy for long if they eat regularly eat unhealthy food from restaurants).
Crushed apple seeds.
This is certainly not the norm. Although having to cook/buy/think about food is annoying, the overwhelming majority of people I know love eating. The rest are mainly apathetic (target market for Soylent and similar products), I don't think anyone I know actively hates eating, with the caveat that several have to exclude certain foods for various reasons.
I said it’s sometimes a drag and you said actively hates -- well done.
Change hates -> drags and it'd still be the same meaning just less strong. I know many people who hate meal prep but that's totally separate from the actual act of eating which is absolutely not seen as a 'drag' by most people.
Change lovees -> like and it’d still be the same meaning just less strong.
> by most people.
Uhuh. Who cares. This is my subjective opinion only. Yet more invention of stuff that was never said.
> by most people.
Uhuh. Who cares. This is my subjective opinion only. Yet more invention of stuff that was never said.
It's a basic human drive so if you've grown up with a negative experience that you've generalised unknowingly to something that should be pleasurable, you should know that, since recognising it will hopefully lead to a fix. The reason to care is because you have to eat, so it's preferable to enjoy it rather than not.
You’ve misunderstood the degree to which I find eating to be inconvenient. It is merely that: at times inconvenient. I have a good appetite and am more likely to gain excess weight as opposed to losing weight due to not being motivated to eat.
It sounds like you're over-eating. Eat smaller meals and those symptoms will almost certainly go away.
I have had heart-burn since my teens and I have never considered -- nor ever just done by happenstance -- eating smaller meals. Thanks for the tip.
The closest thing I've had to hangry in 18mos on a one-meal-a-day diet was when I didn't have coffee one day, and it resulted in something close to a narcoleptic episode mid afternoon. I'd speculate (albeit tendentiously) whether hangriness was mostly refined sugar withdrawal.
> To assess trait anger, we used the German translation [44] of the Anger subscale from the Buss and Perry Aggression Questionnaire (BPAQ) [45], which consists of 6 items (sample item: “I have trouble controlling my temper”) rated on a 5-point scale from 1 (do not agree at all) to 5 (totally agree). Cronbach α for scores on this subscale was .81 (for more details, see S1 Table)
They focused on an "anger" measure at face value without much insight into what anger was.
The useful part of managing "hangry," on OMAD is that you can convert the extra aggression into focus and creativity. The paper calls it "ego depletion," and notably, what they did not find (or state) was increased neuroticism or agreeableness or any of the other big-5 personality traits, and particularly whether people suffering from an excess of these traits experienced relief as a result. While not a cure, managed hangriness via fasting could be an interesting hack for someone with a percieved anxiety disorder. Ironically, when you look at the anecdotal history of cultiness around fasting, it's primarily high neuroticism high agreeableness people who claim to benefit from it, and the increased aggression from fasting gets channeled into offsetting the suffering of an imbalanced personality.
Ater 24+ hours without eating, I'm not hangry, I'm an existential hero on an epic quest for food. It's just a question of attitude. ;)
> To assess trait anger, we used the German translation [44] of the Anger subscale from the Buss and Perry Aggression Questionnaire (BPAQ) [45], which consists of 6 items (sample item: “I have trouble controlling my temper”) rated on a 5-point scale from 1 (do not agree at all) to 5 (totally agree). Cronbach α for scores on this subscale was .81 (for more details, see S1 Table)
They focused on an "anger" measure at face value without much insight into what anger was.
The useful part of managing "hangry," on OMAD is that you can convert the extra aggression into focus and creativity. The paper calls it "ego depletion," and notably, what they did not find (or state) was increased neuroticism or agreeableness or any of the other big-5 personality traits, and particularly whether people suffering from an excess of these traits experienced relief as a result. While not a cure, managed hangriness via fasting could be an interesting hack for someone with a percieved anxiety disorder. Ironically, when you look at the anecdotal history of cultiness around fasting, it's primarily high neuroticism high agreeableness people who claim to benefit from it, and the increased aggression from fasting gets channeled into offsetting the suffering of an imbalanced personality.
Ater 24+ hours without eating, I'm not hangry, I'm an existential hero on an epic quest for food. It's just a question of attitude. ;)
Anger as a manifestation of a nutritional deficiency.
Get a healthy daily dose of chelated magnesium and most of these non-life-threatening outbursts simply disappear.
Get a healthy daily dose of chelated magnesium and most of these non-life-threatening outbursts simply disappear.
hunger is real and it’s a real issue. Not the type of hunger where you want to eat tasty food, physical “body doesn’t get enough calories” hunger.
Listen to accounts of people who actually starved for months, like those lost in the wilderness, bodybuilders in extreme cutting sessions, or from the Minnesota Starvation experiment. They describe how they stopped caring about anything but food to an extreme degree, even sex drive. That’s what serious hunger can do to you. It can make you depressed and uninhibited and directly lower your QOL and intelligence. At that just accepting fat might seem like the sensible option.
Fortunately you don’t have to get this type of hungry even when losing weight, unless you have a hormonal issue. You can be 15% body fat and not physically “hungry”, even 10% if you have good genetics or take pills. This is why CICO, while absolutely true, is generally bad advice, and eating whole foods and weightlifting, while not guaranteed to cause weight loss unless CICO, is strongly recommended.
Listen to accounts of people who actually starved for months, like those lost in the wilderness, bodybuilders in extreme cutting sessions, or from the Minnesota Starvation experiment. They describe how they stopped caring about anything but food to an extreme degree, even sex drive. That’s what serious hunger can do to you. It can make you depressed and uninhibited and directly lower your QOL and intelligence. At that just accepting fat might seem like the sensible option.
Fortunately you don’t have to get this type of hungry even when losing weight, unless you have a hormonal issue. You can be 15% body fat and not physically “hungry”, even 10% if you have good genetics or take pills. This is why CICO, while absolutely true, is generally bad advice, and eating whole foods and weightlifting, while not guaranteed to cause weight loss unless CICO, is strongly recommended.
The comedian, Dom Irerra used to tell a joke, where he would ask "Ever get so hungry you feel like punching someone in the head?". I don't know why, but it always struck me in an incredibly funny way. It still cracks me up just thinking about it. It's a strange association, but it also makes perfect sense.
I don't feel this way even though I rarely have breakfast or lunch. Pretty sure I am not the norm.
People who tend to get "hangry" kind of make me feel uneasy because such behaviour suggests that if it comes down to that, they will surely try to kill me for food or just to eliminate competition.
People who tend to get "hangry" kind of make me feel uneasy because such behaviour suggests that if it comes down to that, they will surely try to kill me for food or just to eliminate competition.
"hangry" is real - the word, that is. I had a French girlfriend who, when she said (in English) either hungry or angry - they both sounded pretty much the same. So whoever coined the word hangry probably heard it from someone French first !
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haha I am not sure this is a very high yield paper, but at least someone has defined what I feel on a regular basis