The Honorable Parts(scopeofwork.net)
scopeofwork.net
The Honorable Parts
https://www.scopeofwork.net/the-honorable-parts/
40 comments
Thank you for this. I had no idea there was such a thing as an "industrial photographer" let alone several.
I work in the manufacturing sector and there are times, despite the grime, frustrations with management/bureaucracy or general environmental concerns that I find what we do quite beautiful, in a way. When you see the choreographed dance of a production line, be it the size of a building or a small automation cell, it's really quite something that we were able to put that all in motion without catastrophic failure. The photo of the Global Foundry is really something, illustrating the intricate complexities I have encountered in so many factories that just look like monolithic beige boxes from the outside, housing virtual cities of activity within.
I work in the manufacturing sector and there are times, despite the grime, frustrations with management/bureaucracy or general environmental concerns that I find what we do quite beautiful, in a way. When you see the choreographed dance of a production line, be it the size of a building or a small automation cell, it's really quite something that we were able to put that all in motion without catastrophic failure. The photo of the Global Foundry is really something, illustrating the intricate complexities I have encountered in so many factories that just look like monolithic beige boxes from the outside, housing virtual cities of activity within.
I saw the Maurice Broomfield exhibition and have the book of the same name (Industrial Sublime), which is still widely available and recommended for anyone interested in this area.
On the same visit to the V&A I also saw some of Bernd and Hilla Becher's work (water towers etc) which has since sent me on a journey of discovery of The Dusseldorf School of Photography. The style of some photographers from this genre (especially the Bechers, Andreas Gursky, Candida Höfer) may well appeal to anyone interested in industrial photography, while perhaps not strictly of the same genre. I am headed to a small Candida Höfer exhibition in London this weekend. Definitely have been enjoying this particular rabbit hole immensely!
On the same visit to the V&A I also saw some of Bernd and Hilla Becher's work (water towers etc) which has since sent me on a journey of discovery of The Dusseldorf School of Photography. The style of some photographers from this genre (especially the Bechers, Andreas Gursky, Candida Höfer) may well appeal to anyone interested in industrial photography, while perhaps not strictly of the same genre. I am headed to a small Candida Höfer exhibition in London this weekend. Definitely have been enjoying this particular rabbit hole immensely!
It may be one of these who do post industrial, smelter towers, decaying mine shafts.
There's another one who photographs electricity pylons. Stunning shots, b&w.
There's another one who photographs electricity pylons. Stunning shots, b&w.
It’s slightly funny that your last link is to the website of a museum at SFO airport. I like SFO a lot for having such installations and an overall calm vibe.
Great links, thank you for this.
I had an opportunity to do some industrial work while putting myself through university. I do wish there were more opportunities to do industrial work on a part time, temporary, or casual basis. There is something particularly rewarding about working with your hands as a part of a team and in combination with a large machine to produce something tangible.
My first job was as technician, then, as an EE (well, I lie, my first job was as a dishwasher, at a nursing home, but that was when I was 16).
The nice thing about that job, was that I got to do both the hardware and the software. In my case, I designed the electronics, and things like the chassis, so I was working with the metalshop, and whatnot.
I linked to my first project, in a previous post: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42637454
The nice thing about that job, was that I got to do both the hardware and the software. In my case, I designed the electronics, and things like the chassis, so I was working with the metalshop, and whatnot.
I linked to my first project, in a previous post: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42637454
I fell into industrial work right out of undergrad as a EE, not intending to work in the rust belt or manufacturing or anything of the like. I erroneously assumed it was not important, not sexy, not interesting. How wrong that was.
How things are made is so important, not only for our society but also as learning experiences for engineers, planners, logicticians, and more. As a career roboticist, the time I spent in the manufacturing industry seems invaluable to me now.
How things are made is so important, not only for our society but also as learning experiences for engineers, planners, logicticians, and more. As a career roboticist, the time I spent in the manufacturing industry seems invaluable to me now.
The problem is not that it's 'not important' or 'not sexy', and the attitude that this stuff is somehow underappreciated is so tiresome. It's endlessly fetishized in mainstream media, by politicians, and so on, in a reverse-snobbism anti-intellectual bend, designed to appeal to the insecurities of the "lower" class American.
The problem is that industrial manufacturing employers treat their workers are poorly as they possibly can, and these days, companies actually seek to treat workers so poorly they don't stay - to keep them from qualifying for expensive benefits.
We have one of the highest productivity per person-hour rates in the industrialized world and you'd never think it if you spent even two days working in a warehouse or manufacturing plant. No amount of productivity is ever enough - if you do your job well, you're just shoved more work instead of being rewarded for your effort.
The problem is that industrial manufacturing employers treat their workers are poorly as they possibly can, and these days, companies actually seek to treat workers so poorly they don't stay - to keep them from qualifying for expensive benefits.
We have one of the highest productivity per person-hour rates in the industrialized world and you'd never think it if you spent even two days working in a warehouse or manufacturing plant. No amount of productivity is ever enough - if you do your job well, you're just shoved more work instead of being rewarded for your effort.
Any advice or resources on how to scale a manufacturing business other than outsource it all to China? I have some ideas of things I can make myself, but then when it comes to shipping them off to a factory in Shenzen, I lose interest.
(note: i wrote the link in the OP)
as it happens, i spent about a decade working on an electronic product that, for complex reasons, wasn't suitable for outsourcing overseas. i wrote a reasonably long and detailed post about this process recently, which you can find here: https://scopeofwork.net/proof/ i also wrote about it a bunch on my personal blog; you can find the relevant posts here: https://pencerw.com/feed?tag=thepublicradio
as it happens, i spent about a decade working on an electronic product that, for complex reasons, wasn't suitable for outsourcing overseas. i wrote a reasonably long and detailed post about this process recently, which you can find here: https://scopeofwork.net/proof/ i also wrote about it a bunch on my personal blog; you can find the relevant posts here: https://pencerw.com/feed?tag=thepublicradio
Thank you for writing and sharing this! I very emphatically agree that we need more people showing us the honorable parts of messy things, and wish I could say so as beautifully as your piece does.
Are you trying to have a product made? Or are you really just interested in the manufacturing process itself?
It depends on the product, obviously. For many things you have domestic manufacturing options, but people either overlook them or immediately seek out the cheapest alternative (often China). There are small contract manufacturers all over the United States.
Doing your own manufacturing of electronic goods is a common trap for people with just enough experience to know that it’s possible. Nearly everyone who has done it will recommend against it. You have to choose if you want to be in the business of making and selling a product, or in the business of setting up and operating a lot of difficult manufacturing machines and processes. People who try to do both at the same time usually get overwhelmed, delayed, and burned out.
It depends on the product, obviously. For many things you have domestic manufacturing options, but people either overlook them or immediately seek out the cheapest alternative (often China). There are small contract manufacturers all over the United States.
Doing your own manufacturing of electronic goods is a common trap for people with just enough experience to know that it’s possible. Nearly everyone who has done it will recommend against it. You have to choose if you want to be in the business of making and selling a product, or in the business of setting up and operating a lot of difficult manufacturing machines and processes. People who try to do both at the same time usually get overwhelmed, delayed, and burned out.
Interested in the manufacturing process itself
There are a lot of categories of products where it still makes sense to do the manufacturing close to the customer. Take a look at the window industry for example.
There is still a lot of manufacturing in North America, both small and large. Zoom into the industrial area of any major center and start looking at names to get some ideas.
There are also some folks that are trying to break the mold entirely. Check out https://www.srtxlabs.com/
There is still a lot of manufacturing in North America, both small and large. Zoom into the industrial area of any major center and start looking at names to get some ideas.
There are also some folks that are trying to break the mold entirely. Check out https://www.srtxlabs.com/
This is a really good idea. This spatial exploration seems to be a normal thing, here for my location in Hamburg, Germany: https://hamburg-business.com/en/commercial-real-estate/comme...
One option is contract manufacturing - which avoids the need for you to set up your own factory and hire your own employees.
At least in the electronics sector, there are contract manufacturers in the west that are happy to deal with small-to-medium-volume production runs.
Their websites will sometimes make them sound a bit aloof, making out they're big and high tech and expensive, but that's just marketing. If an electronics contract manufacturer says they work in aerospace, defence and security, medical, oil and gas and their website has photos of jet fighters and operating theatres? What they really mean is they're set up for production runs as small as a few hundred items, they're happy to deal with a bit of bureaucracy on your end, and they'll guarantee they won't cut corners (like substituting components with cheaper or more easily available ones) unless you tell them to.
A catch, of course, is the minimum orders involved. Automated assembly machines may have the same running costs regardless of the wages of the country they're in - but those machines need to be set up and reconfigured when changing between orders. I don't know what wizardry lets PCBWay offer surface mount PCB assembly for $30 for 20 boards, but you can't match it while paying western skilled worker wages. So if you ask a western contract manufacturer for <300 boards, the price will be substantially more expensive than Chinese manufacturing.
At least in the electronics sector, there are contract manufacturers in the west that are happy to deal with small-to-medium-volume production runs.
Their websites will sometimes make them sound a bit aloof, making out they're big and high tech and expensive, but that's just marketing. If an electronics contract manufacturer says they work in aerospace, defence and security, medical, oil and gas and their website has photos of jet fighters and operating theatres? What they really mean is they're set up for production runs as small as a few hundred items, they're happy to deal with a bit of bureaucracy on your end, and they'll guarantee they won't cut corners (like substituting components with cheaper or more easily available ones) unless you tell them to.
A catch, of course, is the minimum orders involved. Automated assembly machines may have the same running costs regardless of the wages of the country they're in - but those machines need to be set up and reconfigured when changing between orders. I don't know what wizardry lets PCBWay offer surface mount PCB assembly for $30 for 20 boards, but you can't match it while paying western skilled worker wages. So if you ask a western contract manufacturer for <300 boards, the price will be substantially more expensive than Chinese manufacturing.
I imagine the wizardry is an industrial robot and some custom software
It is probably not the full answer. I think they are just willing to go the extra mile for what we here in the west would consider "not much money".
Just few weeks ago I ordered my first design from pcbway. (Both first order from them, and the first PCB I ever designed.)
Turns out I was a muppet and made multiple mistakes with my component footprints/selection. One of the connectors just simply didn't fit, the other connector was colliding with a resistor and an IC next to it. Complete shambles and absolutely my mistake.
They were super nice about it. Sent a detailed excel sheet with photos and arrows on the photos illustrating the problems. The sheet had detailed english description of what is wrong and they even had suggestion how they could "bodge" things to still get it working as well as they can given my design mistakes.
We exchanged emails about options and eventually figured out the best way to do it. They did as good a job as they could with my faulty design and now I'm a happy owner of the assembled PCBs.
The whole thing cost $85 for my five boards, components, and assembly. (I think shipping was not included in that price.) Which is "not a lot of money" where I am , and I would certainly not go to this much trouble for that much.
What I'm saying with this story is that "industrial robot and some custom software" doesn't get you this part of the service. Where someone messages you back and forth to figure out how to salvage the poxy design sent by someone incompetent like me.
Just few weeks ago I ordered my first design from pcbway. (Both first order from them, and the first PCB I ever designed.)
Turns out I was a muppet and made multiple mistakes with my component footprints/selection. One of the connectors just simply didn't fit, the other connector was colliding with a resistor and an IC next to it. Complete shambles and absolutely my mistake.
They were super nice about it. Sent a detailed excel sheet with photos and arrows on the photos illustrating the problems. The sheet had detailed english description of what is wrong and they even had suggestion how they could "bodge" things to still get it working as well as they can given my design mistakes.
We exchanged emails about options and eventually figured out the best way to do it. They did as good a job as they could with my faulty design and now I'm a happy owner of the assembled PCBs.
The whole thing cost $85 for my five boards, components, and assembly. (I think shipping was not included in that price.) Which is "not a lot of money" where I am , and I would certainly not go to this much trouble for that much.
What I'm saying with this story is that "industrial robot and some custom software" doesn't get you this part of the service. Where someone messages you back and forth to figure out how to salvage the poxy design sent by someone incompetent like me.
Sounds like the classic strategy of good-customer-service.
85$ is not a lot of money in China either. Double so for English speaking help. Triple so when you get assembled PCBs at the end.
The theory I've heard is that where American business culture prioritizes profit, Chinese businesses are chasing market share. Thus you get combinations like Rumba and Kin Yat. Roomba subcontracts all manufacturing to China, earns incredible gross margins, while the Chinese manufacturer is free to make competitors. In time the competitors tech reaches and exceeds the original. Now Roomba is left with low/mid tier product lines and Chinese companies control the majority market share.
Great while it lasted. Lots of profits for over a decade. The profit maxing strategy just lacks a future.
85$ is not a lot of money in China either. Double so for English speaking help. Triple so when you get assembled PCBs at the end.
The theory I've heard is that where American business culture prioritizes profit, Chinese businesses are chasing market share. Thus you get combinations like Rumba and Kin Yat. Roomba subcontracts all manufacturing to China, earns incredible gross margins, while the Chinese manufacturer is free to make competitors. In time the competitors tech reaches and exceeds the original. Now Roomba is left with low/mid tier product lines and Chinese companies control the majority market share.
Great while it lasted. Lots of profits for over a decade. The profit maxing strategy just lacks a future.
> The profit maxing strategy just lacks a future.
That's pretty much it. The best way to make a strict "profit" in many cases is to buy large messy bundles of assets/debts (companies), destroy the integration, and sell off the individual assets; that is, the private equity playbook.
But destroying is easy, building is hard.
That's pretty much it. The best way to make a strict "profit" in many cases is to buy large messy bundles of assets/debts (companies), destroy the integration, and sell off the individual assets; that is, the private equity playbook.
But destroying is easy, building is hard.
Completely different kind of business but I have a friend who runs a small business doing industrial print work (stickers, metal plates with serial numbers/qr codes, etc.). Pretty niche but very interesting. He uses premium materials and machines and rapid response times to customers is one of his key selling points. Next day deliveries and those kinds of things via premium delivery services. Business is going well for him and I've talked a lot to him about how he runs things.
His machines are expensive (hundreds of thousands of euros) and his key challenge is keeping those busy and having redundant capacity when they break down or need servicing. Meaning that he has a lot of idling machines. He's mostly floorspace constrained and he just doubled his floor space so he can get more machines and improve utilization.
So, I asked him if he was going to get more people as well. And to my surprise his answer was, not really. The machines do most of the work. Setting them up is not his biggest challenge. Availability of the machines is. That's why he's doubling floor space. He was estimating that he would be able to operate the new machines with the same staff. Most of what they do is preparing print jobs, supplying materials, packaging up finished stuff, etc. Having more space simply means he can respond faster.
He also went through the process to become iso certified. Meaning he has quality control and processes. Basically any machine downtime costs him money. So, he has at least two of each. And he's good at small batch sizes. He has a lot of repeat customers that order small batches regularly. For example, cutting out metal plates means he has to put in a big metal sheet. Regardless of whether it's 3 or 300 metal plates that are being ordered. He's going to sacrifice at least one of those sheets. But he can do some clever things with combining orders from different customers in one print job (he's a software guy) which works around this. And he has supplies of pre-cut plates for his repeat customers that are ready for printing when they order 2 more plates. They pay for quality and speed. A lot of his competitors are slower.
There's a fixed overhead per job (set up time, packaging, customer support, etc.). But he's good at that stuff and gives a lot of quality support to his customers. Big batches mean he utilizes the machines for longer and that they generate more revenue. His staff can use the time to prepare the next job and take care of customers. A lot of the small stuff ends up being bundled up.
I imagine electronics manufacturing contracting is a bit similar to this.
His machines are expensive (hundreds of thousands of euros) and his key challenge is keeping those busy and having redundant capacity when they break down or need servicing. Meaning that he has a lot of idling machines. He's mostly floorspace constrained and he just doubled his floor space so he can get more machines and improve utilization.
So, I asked him if he was going to get more people as well. And to my surprise his answer was, not really. The machines do most of the work. Setting them up is not his biggest challenge. Availability of the machines is. That's why he's doubling floor space. He was estimating that he would be able to operate the new machines with the same staff. Most of what they do is preparing print jobs, supplying materials, packaging up finished stuff, etc. Having more space simply means he can respond faster.
He also went through the process to become iso certified. Meaning he has quality control and processes. Basically any machine downtime costs him money. So, he has at least two of each. And he's good at small batch sizes. He has a lot of repeat customers that order small batches regularly. For example, cutting out metal plates means he has to put in a big metal sheet. Regardless of whether it's 3 or 300 metal plates that are being ordered. He's going to sacrifice at least one of those sheets. But he can do some clever things with combining orders from different customers in one print job (he's a software guy) which works around this. And he has supplies of pre-cut plates for his repeat customers that are ready for printing when they order 2 more plates. They pay for quality and speed. A lot of his competitors are slower.
There's a fixed overhead per job (set up time, packaging, customer support, etc.). But he's good at that stuff and gives a lot of quality support to his customers. Big batches mean he utilizes the machines for longer and that they generate more revenue. His staff can use the time to prepare the next job and take care of customers. A lot of the small stuff ends up being bundled up.
I imagine electronics manufacturing contracting is a bit similar to this.
> surface mount PCB assembly for $30 for 20 boards
Often uneconomical to set up pick and place for just 20 boards. Quite often the wizardry is a little middle-aged Chinese lady who wields a vacuum tweezer like a chopstick, from 9am to 9pm six days a week.
Often uneconomical to set up pick and place for just 20 boards. Quite often the wizardry is a little middle-aged Chinese lady who wields a vacuum tweezer like a chopstick, from 9am to 9pm six days a week.
Manual assembly is indeed a common practice.
But it's skilled work, so it'll be paying skilled wages. And you need an inspection step - especially if you're working with BGAs and other difficult components. Presumably for $30 they're shipping out boards without doing a power-on test - which makes visual/x-ray inspection even more important.
And even when the assembly is manual, you've still got to get the right parts to the right assembly station at the right time. Can't be putting in a 5% 10k 0805 resistor if the design calls for 1%.
Even with manual assembly, if they're making a profit at the prices they're charging they must be running a very efficient operation indeed.
But it's skilled work, so it'll be paying skilled wages. And you need an inspection step - especially if you're working with BGAs and other difficult components. Presumably for $30 they're shipping out boards without doing a power-on test - which makes visual/x-ray inspection even more important.
And even when the assembly is manual, you've still got to get the right parts to the right assembly station at the right time. Can't be putting in a 5% 10k 0805 resistor if the design calls for 1%.
Even with manual assembly, if they're making a profit at the prices they're charging they must be running a very efficient operation indeed.
Thats where the custom software comes in - you can program a robot to move in a pattern through setting it or through sending coordinates to it (I have done that as part of a job).
You could have software that converts the instructions for the PCB into instructions for the robot to do pick and place.
You could have software that converts the instructions for the PCB into instructions for the robot to do pick and place.
Look for any and all of the sponsors/people who work with the Battlebots groups.
While some of them are big names (Solidworks) you will also find lots of little guys flagged in there who are doing the contract manufacturing.
But, it won't be $100 like China. Expect minimum NRE of about $5K to make it worthwhile to them.
And, please understand that, even so, you are still an unprofitable nuisance--so be SUPER polite when dealing with them. Also please understand that the manufacturer talking to you is at the top of a pyramid of problems being caused by your choices, part manufacturers, material suppliers, etc.--their bad day is generally due to everybody else (including you!) However, since you are dealing with real people face to face and being really nice, you will find that they often will go an extra mile for you that you would never get otherwise.
(One shop I worked with had yield problems on assembling a board. It turned out the big manufacturer created a really brain damaged part whose footprint just sucked terribly--it was so bad that they quickly EOLd the part and changed the footprint. We had ordered 100 boards expecting that we needed 50 with lots of lead. Of course, that wasn't happening. One worker there sat down, hand tinned an almost microscopic chip 100+ times and resoldered those chips repeatedly until we had fifty. Needless to say, I funnelled any and all business I could through them from that point forward.)
Any company willing to deal with you at low volumes should be treated like you have found gold nuggets--because you have.
While some of them are big names (Solidworks) you will also find lots of little guys flagged in there who are doing the contract manufacturing.
But, it won't be $100 like China. Expect minimum NRE of about $5K to make it worthwhile to them.
And, please understand that, even so, you are still an unprofitable nuisance--so be SUPER polite when dealing with them. Also please understand that the manufacturer talking to you is at the top of a pyramid of problems being caused by your choices, part manufacturers, material suppliers, etc.--their bad day is generally due to everybody else (including you!) However, since you are dealing with real people face to face and being really nice, you will find that they often will go an extra mile for you that you would never get otherwise.
(One shop I worked with had yield problems on assembling a board. It turned out the big manufacturer created a really brain damaged part whose footprint just sucked terribly--it was so bad that they quickly EOLd the part and changed the footprint. We had ordered 100 boards expecting that we needed 50 with lots of lead. Of course, that wasn't happening. One worker there sat down, hand tinned an almost microscopic chip 100+ times and resoldered those chips repeatedly until we had fifty. Needless to say, I funnelled any and all business I could through them from that point forward.)
Any company willing to deal with you at low volumes should be treated like you have found gold nuggets--because you have.
I rarely hear about stuff being done in the US, especially electronics.
But I did like reading they did it reading the book "Schiit Happened":
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1514355027
But I did like reading they did it reading the book "Schiit Happened":
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1514355027
Nearly without joking: Karl Marx..
As you seem to want to acquire or manage the means of production: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Means_of_production
As you seem to want to acquire or manage the means of production: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Means_of_production
Well yeah, I'm a capitalist. A good capitalist wants centralized control of the means of production, like the communists.
They're just honest in their intentions
They're just honest in their intentions
Sure :)
Hard to not give a somewhat generic answer without the kind of ideas of things that need to be manufactured (and in which area).
Maybe try to find companies like Rtone (I'm not money related with them): https://rtone.fr/en/
Or go to fairs/shows for equivalent ideas of things, there is always those behind-the-scene workers around.
Honest intentions but hidden (private) knowledge.
Wishing you the best !
Hard to not give a somewhat generic answer without the kind of ideas of things that need to be manufactured (and in which area).
Maybe try to find companies like Rtone (I'm not money related with them): https://rtone.fr/en/
Or go to fairs/shows for equivalent ideas of things, there is always those behind-the-scene workers around.
Honest intentions but hidden (private) knowledge.
Wishing you the best !
It has become so easy to live life abstracted from all the manufacturing, farming, and logistics that makes it possible. As technology increases leverage, and allows things to become more complex, it feels like we're constantly getting farther away from understanding how the world works.
Photography like this is necessary to remind us of everything we take for granted. I talked to Chris Payne once. He's a genius. To me he is today's Margaret Bourke-White. It takes more than a good eye to get those photographs. There are so many talents coming together.
Photography like this is necessary to remind us of everything we take for granted. I talked to Chris Payne once. He's a genius. To me he is today's Margaret Bourke-White. It takes more than a good eye to get those photographs. There are so many talents coming together.
Also worth looking at: Bernd and Hilla Becher https://www.artsy.net/article/artsy-editorial-photographer-c...
What a lovely community, right up my alley. Thank you!
Is it just me or does anyone else read the headline as damning, with faint praise, the state of labor in America? Think Amazon warehouse workers, Wal*Mart retail employees, UPS delivery drivers, and the entire gig economy.
The title on HN is the subtitle of the article. The main title is "The Honorable Parts".
Even this seems to imply that there are also dishonorable parts that we are assumed to be aware of. Seems like a disrespectful way to talk about people who agreed to be your photography subjects.
Oh I hadn't thought of it in terms of the laborers themselves. I was thinking about the conditions under which the subjects labor in places like Amazon warehouses and the gig economy. But yes, the sort of anti-labor zeitgeist that permeates the US is definitely one of "labor dishonorable".
Maurice Broomfield: https://www.vam.ac.uk/exhibitions/maurice-broomfield-industr...
Wolfgang Sievers: https://www.google.com/search?q=WOLFGANG+SIEVERS&sourceid=ch...
And the one mentioned in the article (Alfred Palmer)
https://www.sfomuseum.org/exhibitions/women-work-world-war-i...