Amazon leads $575M investment in Deliveroo(techcrunch.com)
techcrunch.com
Amazon leads $575M investment in Deliveroo
https://techcrunch.com/2019/05/16/amazon-takes-a-bite-into-deliveroo/
48 comments
> Deliveroo actively masks restaurants' locations
This is what allows you to order from a restaurant that is otherwise too far away from you. It's arguably of great benefit to those who do not live in that delivery area.
> it comes from a metal shipping container, under a bridge, next to a train track
The metal shipping container has been outfitted to modern standards precisely for this purpose, as opposed to down some stairs in a windowless Victorian cellar, under a bridge, next to a traintrack, which many 'real' restaurant kitchens are like.
> These, are made by Deliveroo
No they are not, the chefs are employed by the restaurant, and are making the same dishes to the same standards.
This is what allows you to order from a restaurant that is otherwise too far away from you. It's arguably of great benefit to those who do not live in that delivery area.
> it comes from a metal shipping container, under a bridge, next to a train track
The metal shipping container has been outfitted to modern standards precisely for this purpose, as opposed to down some stairs in a windowless Victorian cellar, under a bridge, next to a traintrack, which many 'real' restaurant kitchens are like.
> These, are made by Deliveroo
No they are not, the chefs are employed by the restaurant, and are making the same dishes to the same standards.
> This is what allows you to order from a restaurant that is otherwise too far away from you. It's arguably of great benefit to those who do not live in that delivery area.
So? They still do it, this is shady business practices which is what the whole point of my post was about. They've started adding a badge "5 star restaurant affiliate" or something similar. They only did this after they were called out on it by the mainstream news.
> The metal shipping container has been outfitted to modern standards precisely for this purpose, as opposed to down some stairs in a windowless Victorian cellar, under a bridge, next to a traintrack, which many 'real' restaurant kitchens are like.
It still comes from somewhere which is not where i ordered it from. Agree with me or not, the food still comes from (literally) a metal shipping container which has not been certified to the British food health/safety regulations, and is rented out to different restaurants/people from one day to the next. Also that "windowless Victorian cellar" WOULD have been given a food hygiene rating, otherwise it wouldn't be able to operate. Whether or not that rating is good is not the point, the point is that a government official has gone in and rigorously tested it, it is subject to surprise visits, etc. You should be able to easily view this information as you already can online at https://ratings.food.gov.uk. Can you say the same about the shipping containers which don't have a postcode (so you can't check)?
> No they are not, the chefs are employed by the restaurant, and are making the same dishes to the same standards.
I didn't mean the food, i meant the containers. But if we are talking about the food, you can almost guarantee that "5 star restaurant" isn't going to be sending their best chefs away from the proper kitchen into a metal box. Again, this is shady as hell and deceptive.
So? They still do it, this is shady business practices which is what the whole point of my post was about. They've started adding a badge "5 star restaurant affiliate" or something similar. They only did this after they were called out on it by the mainstream news.
> The metal shipping container has been outfitted to modern standards precisely for this purpose, as opposed to down some stairs in a windowless Victorian cellar, under a bridge, next to a traintrack, which many 'real' restaurant kitchens are like.
It still comes from somewhere which is not where i ordered it from. Agree with me or not, the food still comes from (literally) a metal shipping container which has not been certified to the British food health/safety regulations, and is rented out to different restaurants/people from one day to the next. Also that "windowless Victorian cellar" WOULD have been given a food hygiene rating, otherwise it wouldn't be able to operate. Whether or not that rating is good is not the point, the point is that a government official has gone in and rigorously tested it, it is subject to surprise visits, etc. You should be able to easily view this information as you already can online at https://ratings.food.gov.uk. Can you say the same about the shipping containers which don't have a postcode (so you can't check)?
> No they are not, the chefs are employed by the restaurant, and are making the same dishes to the same standards.
I didn't mean the food, i meant the containers. But if we are talking about the food, you can almost guarantee that "5 star restaurant" isn't going to be sending their best chefs away from the proper kitchen into a metal box. Again, this is shady as hell and deceptive.
> the food still comes from (literally) a metal shipping container
1. This is only true in some cases, there are all variety of hire kitchens used in this program. 2. Much food you consume comes from a metal shipping container at some point, because they are suitable for many different purposes. Is one use okay but the other not?
> this is shady business practices which is what the whole point of my post was about
As a customer, I truly believe this to be a innovative business practice that benefits me. The restaurants are marked as 'Editions' partners.
> a metal shipping container which has not been certified to the British food health/safety regulations
The only partners allowed to use Editions kitchens have a 4 or 5 star hygiene rating for their main kitchen.
You do realise that the ratings are based on the practices used in that kitchen and not the building itself don't you?
Essentially the exact same kitchen could be a zero or a five star rating based on what the chefs do with the food and the environment.
So the idea of the 'metal box' being somehow inherently unsuitable - when the interiors are fitted out to the highest modern standards and used by teams who have already proven they meet high hygiene ratings - is simply not true or useful.
> It still comes from somewhere which is not where i ordered it from.
If you have worked in a restaurant kitchen you will have observed that this is true of much of the food that goes on the plate. This includes: 1. additional unseen kitchens where the bulk of cooking takes place 2. entirely separate kitchen where prep takes place, often days beforehand 3. part-made dishes and ingredients ordered in and made in locations unknown to you 4. pre-made sauces, breads, entire dishes ordered in and made in locations unknown to you
Show me the hygiene rating of the kitchen where your fries or ketchup are actually produced.
> you can almost guarantee that "5 star restaurant" isn't going to be sending their best chefs away from the proper kitchen into a metal box
Most kitchens will use their best chefs at new locations precisely to ensure their success, the trainees will take over at the main location due to its ease and familiarity.
1. This is only true in some cases, there are all variety of hire kitchens used in this program. 2. Much food you consume comes from a metal shipping container at some point, because they are suitable for many different purposes. Is one use okay but the other not?
> this is shady business practices which is what the whole point of my post was about
As a customer, I truly believe this to be a innovative business practice that benefits me. The restaurants are marked as 'Editions' partners.
> a metal shipping container which has not been certified to the British food health/safety regulations
The only partners allowed to use Editions kitchens have a 4 or 5 star hygiene rating for their main kitchen.
You do realise that the ratings are based on the practices used in that kitchen and not the building itself don't you?
Essentially the exact same kitchen could be a zero or a five star rating based on what the chefs do with the food and the environment.
So the idea of the 'metal box' being somehow inherently unsuitable - when the interiors are fitted out to the highest modern standards and used by teams who have already proven they meet high hygiene ratings - is simply not true or useful.
> It still comes from somewhere which is not where i ordered it from.
If you have worked in a restaurant kitchen you will have observed that this is true of much of the food that goes on the plate. This includes: 1. additional unseen kitchens where the bulk of cooking takes place 2. entirely separate kitchen where prep takes place, often days beforehand 3. part-made dishes and ingredients ordered in and made in locations unknown to you 4. pre-made sauces, breads, entire dishes ordered in and made in locations unknown to you
Show me the hygiene rating of the kitchen where your fries or ketchup are actually produced.
> you can almost guarantee that "5 star restaurant" isn't going to be sending their best chefs away from the proper kitchen into a metal box
Most kitchens will use their best chefs at new locations precisely to ensure their success, the trainees will take over at the main location due to its ease and familiarity.
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> which has not been certified to the British food health/safety regulations
That's factually wrong. Of course, the same regulations apply to those facilities as any other.
> Can you say the same about the shipping containers which don't have a postcode (so you can't check)?
yes.
That's factually wrong. Of course, the same regulations apply to those facilities as any other.
> Can you say the same about the shipping containers which don't have a postcode (so you can't check)?
yes.
The regulations may be the same but the FSA rating you can look up for the restaurant probably doesn't include an inspection of the shipping container, if it is inspected at all.
> I hope to god Deliveroo takes some of Amazon's customer service tips/experience.
My experience of Amazon and Deliveroo's customer service has been pretty similar. I don't get to talk to a human, but if I do raise an issue (late delivery from Amazon, missing items from a Deliveroo order) I fairly quickly get a response apologising for it and giving me some free credit.
Interesting points about the way they handle restaurants though. I've noticed a few of the ones that you describe, that are not actually real restaurants. Since Deliveroo is useless at showing reviews and ratings, I'll usually search for places online before I order from there, if I haven't heard of them. A bunch of the takeaways on Deliveroo in my area all have the same address, an industrial estate - as you say, by a train track, probably in a metal shipping container.
I've not had bad expeirences with those "restaurants" to be fair, but it does highlight that Deliveroo is cheating the system and hiding how they actually do things. I hadn't considered the hygiene aspect, that is worrying that they can get away with selling food without the usually required safety/hygiene levels.
It's interesting that Deliveroo has beaten Amazon at their own game in the UK. Amazon Restaurants was a thing for a while as their answer to Deliveroo, but it didn't take off. I think it still exists, but last time I checked there were about 5 restaurants available in my area, compared to 50+ on Deliveroo and Uber Eats. Deliveroo's tactics really don't feel that far removed from Amazon's though.
My experience of Amazon and Deliveroo's customer service has been pretty similar. I don't get to talk to a human, but if I do raise an issue (late delivery from Amazon, missing items from a Deliveroo order) I fairly quickly get a response apologising for it and giving me some free credit.
Interesting points about the way they handle restaurants though. I've noticed a few of the ones that you describe, that are not actually real restaurants. Since Deliveroo is useless at showing reviews and ratings, I'll usually search for places online before I order from there, if I haven't heard of them. A bunch of the takeaways on Deliveroo in my area all have the same address, an industrial estate - as you say, by a train track, probably in a metal shipping container.
I've not had bad expeirences with those "restaurants" to be fair, but it does highlight that Deliveroo is cheating the system and hiding how they actually do things. I hadn't considered the hygiene aspect, that is worrying that they can get away with selling food without the usually required safety/hygiene levels.
It's interesting that Deliveroo has beaten Amazon at their own game in the UK. Amazon Restaurants was a thing for a while as their answer to Deliveroo, but it didn't take off. I think it still exists, but last time I checked there were about 5 restaurants available in my area, compared to 50+ on Deliveroo and Uber Eats. Deliveroo's tactics really don't feel that far removed from Amazon's though.
They're not _quite_ as bad as you used to be. They still do not show an address or registered business name. So many will still find it next to impossible to see a rating unless they do some sleuthing. As without this basic information you cannot search for the rating.
The thing I thought was most cheeky was that they put a link to the now useless FSA rating search page. Not to the kitchen rating page. That still seems pretty shady to me.
The thing I thought was most cheeky was that they put a link to the now useless FSA rating search page. Not to the kitchen rating page. That still seems pretty shady to me.
Yes and in London it's still significantly more expensive than grabbing food from a brick and mortar restaurant IME. It's crazy that they do not produce the food on restaurant premises, do not have to pay normal London rents and are still more expensive than normal restaurants, even when including delivery by restaurants which offer their own delivery. Is that extra money all going to their drivers?
This hasn’t been my experience. Any problems with an order, they refund immediately no questions asked and add an extra £5 as an apology. Over the years, this has been consistent.
Uber Eats customer service is like pulling teeth. Never had a refund after several incidents and we try not to use them any more.
Uber Eats customer service is like pulling teeth. Never had a refund after several incidents and we try not to use them any more.
Not my experience with Eats at all. Refunds always, no questions except during a brief stint I was asking for a lot of refunds in a short time. YMMV.
Until they ban you for “abusing” it despite providing evidence every time. They shut down my account with over 4k£ spent in a year because of that. Haven’t regularly used them since then.
has there ever been a delivery service that is food focused rather than food-vendor focused? i just want to order a good burrito, i don't care who makes it. or i'm having a party and we want to order a few burritos, couple pizzas and some sushi - we don't want to make separate orders for all of that. which vendor executed the order can be than rated and future vendors selected by rating and personal preferences.
is this even viable?
is this even viable?
Deliveroo has basically doing this kind of thing in the UK for a while. They operate "dark kitchens" (https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/oct/28/deliveroo-d...) which are industrial-zone food prep facilities combining a variety of different vendors on one site. There's still a brand associated with it and everything, which I would guess is actually quite important for customer comprehension.
As long as you can convince different restaurants to produce the same thing exactly sure it can work but thats rather a tall task.
Most people I know would select the place they want to get food from first since there is a huge variance in quality and personal tastes.
Most people I know would select the place they want to get food from first since there is a huge variance in quality and personal tastes.
I don't think you need to convince them to produce the same thing. The delivery company would just have single preferred suppliers for each different kind of meal.
Curiously another post on the frontpage is about the success of Aldi, which has a similar model as a grocery store (very limited selection of good quality products). I could see the Aldi of meal delivery working.
Curiously another post on the frontpage is about the success of Aldi, which has a similar model as a grocery store (very limited selection of good quality products). I could see the Aldi of meal delivery working.
Aldi isn’t a high quality grocery store it’s a discount supermarket it’s in house brands are god awful when compared to the likes of M&S and Waitrose.
Comparisons are irrelevant; Aldi products are of quality enough that a very large swathe of the population shop there, not just poor people.
Is that true though? I have seen Lidl/Aldi winning awards for the quality of their own brands over M&S and Waitrose before
Interestingly, I was only yesterday thinking about Deliverance[1]. They were a food delivery company in London that did just that — they cooked all of the meals and then delivered them, but they closed down a few years ago.
[1] https://twitter.com/deliverancefood
[1] https://twitter.com/deliverancefood
I remember these guys. It was one of the best ways to order food to the office that pleased everyone. It was comparatively good food vs its competitors back in the day.
i wonder why it's a billion dollar business now and not then. Is it mobile penetration allow low paid citizen to deliver ? But scooters have always existed..
As long as there is a sufficient quantity of people who have limited means of other income, and they can drive, it should be viable.
This reminds of a service named Sprig we had in SF. It closed down a couple years ago, however, after a short run.
Does this increase the reputation of Uber? In the past people contrasted amazon reinvestment of profits to uber’s expenses. Now Amazon is following uber eats...
Deliveroo have the ambition to own food, so it's no surprise this appeals to Amazon. Delivery is just their first tactic in a far larger strategy.
With the speed that delivery services are growing, I am under the impression that I soon won't need to leave my chair to have everything I need at my doorstep in less than a few hours.
I have recently had to use a grocery delivery service so I can't complain. The time saved does add up if you're busy.
I have recently had to use a grocery delivery service so I can't complain. The time saved does add up if you're busy.
Here in Singapore. If I could work from home I would never need to leave home. I can get everything delivered already. A lot of same day delivery too.
That’s been the case in NYC for decades. A friend ordered a cup of coffe from the local diner and they delivered it without question.
Coffee...
I ordered bottled water a few times in London.
I ordered bottled water a few times in London.
Do you not have a tap?
To be fair, I had a picky friend who would make fun of me for being wasteful with money.
So I would order bottled water from the takeaway and keep telling him how much I like Evian to keep him whining.
I do admit that I find buying bottled water from a takeaway quite amusing.
So I would order bottled water from the takeaway and keep telling him how much I like Evian to keep him whining.
I do admit that I find buying bottled water from a takeaway quite amusing.
Water in London is very "hard". It crusts up your kettle, and some people don't like the taste.
This been the case for London for a while now.
That said I’m not sure it’s a good thing.
That said I’m not sure it’s a good thing.
I'm in a wheelchair, being able to get groceries delivered has been hugely beneficial.
why? because something forces you to move?
The resources needed to transport stuff are not free, and they usually involve petrol instead of legs.
It is not that easy. One delivery truck delivering to multiple people can be more efficient over them driving individually.
A warehouse can be more efficiently cooled and enlighted than a shop for individuals.
A big kitchen preparing menu after menu can be more efficient than heating up the oven for a single use. A restaurant using larger supply packs can be more efficient than household sizes in packaging and transport.
It's a case by case thing, but average for a few domains might not be that bad.
A warehouse can be more efficiently cooled and enlighted than a shop for individuals.
A big kitchen preparing menu after menu can be more efficient than heating up the oven for a single use. A restaurant using larger supply packs can be more efficient than household sizes in packaging and transport.
It's a case by case thing, but average for a few domains might not be that bad.
Cooking meals at home probably takes fewer resources and creates less waste overall.
However, assuming that there's driving involved in either case, I wouldn't think having an order delivered from a big facility is much different from you going to a restaurant and picking up takeout.
However, assuming that there's driving involved in either case, I wouldn't think having an order delivered from a big facility is much different from you going to a restaurant and picking up takeout.
Because I can literally never leave my house for anything at this point even late night booze and there is something eerie about that.
There is a certain "The Machine Stops" [1] sense to it. I have mixed feelings. I can get very little rapid delivery where I live. Sometimes, I wish I could just order some takeout, but it's not necessarily a bad thing that I get forced to either go out myself or make a meal at home.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Machine_Stops
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Machine_Stops
I work for a competitor of Deliveroo and in asia you already have these all encompassing delivery apps that started with food and now deliver almost anything. Some also started as Uber competitors branching out into delivery like Uber does with UberEats. Grab, Go-Jek in Asia or Rappi in South America are moving fast into this direction.
In Germany there was a consolidation this year. Lieferando bought some competitors. Didn't even know Deliveroo was a big thing, thought this was some Berlin only thing.
Yeah, Lieferando (takeaway.com) bought the german business of Delivery Hero (Lieferheld, pizza.de, Foodora) for close to a billion. They had a long fight in Europe but DH is now focusing on Asia, but they still have a considerable share in takeaway.
It's big in the UK (where it started) and apparently operates in 200 cities now.
Deliveroo, Uber Eats, Just Eat also (again, speaking for the UK) do not list restaurants' food safety/hygienic ratings, which is a requirement to run a restaurant in the UK[2]. This has lead to people like a comedian here (Joe Lycett) making a restaurant in a skip (a big industrial waste disposal unit) and getting food delivered to himself to see if it would work[3]...and it did.
If that wasn't bad enough, in London, Deliveroo actively masks restaurants' locations. For example, you order from "my 5 star restaurant" but the food might not actually come from the restaurant, instead it comes from a metal shipping container, under a bridge, next to a train track. These, are made by Deliveroo and, again, have no safety ratings/hygienic information.[4]
[1] (example) https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/deliveroo-food-o...
[2] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45888709
[3] https://twitter.com/joelycett/status/1085924299339452420?lan...
[4] https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/oct/28/deliveroo-d...
This has been my experience, several times, it really isn't a unique experience. Their policy seems to be to cut corners and hold on to money as much as physically possible. Don't get me wrong, i love the idea, and convenience of it all and use all 3 apps pretty regularly. Given the amount of money they make they should all seriously step up their game in terms of just not being shady bastards.