'Extremely rare' Rameses II-era burial cave found in Israel(phys.org)

125 pointsby rntnvor 4 Jahren49 comments

'Extremely rare' Rameses II-era burial cave found in Israel

https://phys.org/news/2022-09-extremely-rare-rameses-ii-era-burial.html

51 comments

I'm confused.

    "It noted that "a few items" had been looted from it in the short period of time between its discovery and closure."

and

    "The cave was uncovered on a beach Tuesday, when a mechanical digger working at the Palmahim national park hit its roof..."

So since Tuesday it's already been looted? That's unfortunate.

Louzsuovor 4 Jahren

I somewhere read that there was a news ban but the news was spread via social networks and if you reach enough people, some looters will pop up.

Sadly, obviously the side had not been guarded well. So some idiots destroyed potentially invaluable insights into the past for a couple of bucks on the black market.

Although I'm not a fan of penalties I'm thinking about whether fines for breaking the news coverage ban would be any effective. I mean, tracing the social networks shouldn't be difficult.

topynatevor 4 Jahren

Israel has quite a serious problem with looting of antiquities. I was talking to an archaeologist a few months ago and suggested adopting something like the UK's Treasure Act so that people who find artefacts have a way of legally being paid for them and was met with blank incomprehension.

shahar2kvor 4 Jahren

Israelis also have a serious problem with following rules (source: am an israeli) finding workarounds and doing what you want is almost a national pastime

Nomentatusvor 4 Jahren

In fairness, there are so many sites in this whole area that it is in fact very hard to comprehend how such schemes could be implemented.

twblalockvor 4 Jahren

I'm not surprised. There is a strong black market for stolen antiquities.

kurupt213vor 4 Jahren

It was probably ransacked by the people who found it

noworldvor 4 Jahren

The date on the article is September 19, so maybe a previous Tuesday?

j-kentvor 4 Jahren

"In a video released by the Israel Antiquities Authority, gobsmacked archaeologists shine flashlights on dozens of pottery vessels in a variety of forms and sizes, dating back to the reign of the ancient Egyptian king who died in 1213 BC."

Here's some of the videos I was able to find:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wQYrfjv0fw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLTBzxA1QaE

TedDoesntTalkvor 4 Jahren

The items are neatly arranged in some places but scattered in others. If no one has entered this cave since it was sealed, how did the items get scattered? Earthquakes?

tablespoonvor 4 Jahren

> The items are neatly arranged in some places but scattered in others. If no one has entered this cave since it was sealed, how did the items get scattered? Earthquakes?

The article said there was some looting that happened after it was discovered. Maybe the looters messed things up?

drummondvor 4 Jahren

It’s a cave and on the beach. Likely flooding of the cave moved items and scattered them.

helge9210vor 4 Jahren

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TedDoesntTalkvor 4 Jahren

> a few items had been looted from it in the short period of time between its discovery and closure.

I mean, wth? It’s 2022 and people are still looting this stuff? There wasn’t any gold found in the cave, so the value of what is taken is lost when it is removed from its context.

BurningFrogvor 4 Jahren

Theft is alive and well all across the planet.

I forecast this trend will continue well into 2023.

aqwsdevor 4 Jahren

Bold claim!

sharikousvor 4 Jahren

What do you mean "still"? Stealing is not something that depends on the year we are in.

This kind of looting goes either to collectors (money) or to personal trophies in private houses. All things that human beings like to have from millenia.

mjburgessvor 4 Jahren

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whig_history

cromkavor 4 Jahren

> There wasn’t any gold found in the cave

Well, maybe not anymore it wasn't?

schnablevor 4 Jahren

People like to collect antiquities.

hutzlibuvor 4 Jahren

"so the value of what is taken is lost when it is removed from its context."

You can still sell it to collectors. They know the context.

And about the why people still do this in 2022? Probably because not everyone is wealthy or interested in accurate history.

ch4s3vor 4 Jahren

They mean the context of where it was in the burial chamber. What was it collocated with.

hutzlibuvor 4 Jahren

I meant the context of the burial chamber. For a private collector that might be enough.

(and regarding the downvotes above: I am interested in history)

ch4s3vor 4 Jahren

Sure, but it destroys all historical and archeological value.

hutzlibuvor 4 Jahren

Sure, but where did I say that I approve that? I just explained the motivation of people who do not care about that. And for some rich collectors it is enough, to have old objects of historic value.

aqwsdevor 4 Jahren

Apparently some things got stolen already the first night since apparently they did not guard the side properly. :/

dylan604vor 4 Jahren

That's okay, they probably didn't have time to remove the curse(s) protecting them.

kurupt213vor 4 Jahren

Please curse me with Bronze Age gold

Kukumbervor 4 Jahren

I sincerely hope it's a team of international and independent archeologists, we should not trust countries with a strong religious leadership, they'll either silence, hide or destroy anything that goes against their religious narrative

invalidnamevor 4 Jahren

Israel is the 3rd or 4th most atheistic country in the world. It is NOT a religious country!

jscipionevor 4 Jahren

This is an interesting find because it is contemporaneous with The Merneptah Stele [0] that declared “Israel is wasted, its seed is not” in 1208 BC. This find confirms that ancient Egyptians were present in the Holy Land at that time. Although Merneptah’s claim may not have been entirely accurate with regards to the success of his mission in Canaan.

[0] https://biblearchaeologyreport.com/2019/03/08/three-egyptian...

epberryvor 4 Jahren

This finding could shed more light on the timing of the so-called 'bronze age collapse' which Jared Diamond and Eric Cline (author of 1177 BC) have popularized. Cline's conclusion is that the collapse began around 1230 and continued on for 50-100 years throughout the mediterranean.

voz_vor 4 Jahren

Be careful citing Jared Diamond on anything, the guy is a bit of a disreputable quack and a trap for intelligent folks without experience in the field.

fortran77vor 4 Jahren

There's a better source here:

https://www.gov.il/en/departments/general/burial-cave-from-t...

Eisensteinvor 4 Jahren

Are there 'somewhat-rare' Rameses II-era burial caves?

dgfitzvor 4 Jahren

I imagine there was until there wasn’t. Why do you ask?

kurupt213vor 4 Jahren

Ramesses II

webwielder2vor 4 Jahren

The past is shrouded in mystery, but the evidence is overwhelming for ancient people having had pots.

sillyquietvor 4 Jahren

I know this is a joke, but pottery is kind of the road sign of archaeology. Pottery can tell all kinds of stories about technology levels, trade routes, cultural patterns, foods eaten and agriculture (from seed impressions and residues), the list goes on. Pottery is pretty important.

Louzsuovor 4 Jahren

You could also simply rob it, put it on a side table and accidentally destroy it while vacuuming your house.

Kukumbervor 4 Jahren

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