Telegram surpassed 500M active users. 25 mil new users in the last 3days(twitter.com)
twitter.com
Telegram surpassed 500M active users. 25 mil new users in the last 3days
https://twitter.com/telegram/status/1349014065931284480
64 comments
Telegram advantages over Signal:
- The ability to message someone with just your username / without revealing your phone number
- Easy to use from multiple devices (with full history the minute you install it on a new device)
- Great bot api
- Channels (like an rss feed, people may join to get info, but only the admins can post)
- Much larger groups
- Much larger per-file size limit when sending files
- Message scheduling
- Multiple accounts in the official client
- Polls / quizes
- Hashtags / stickers / animated stickers / etc
- Uses an encryption protocol (now in it's 2nd revision as of 3 years ago) that's been independently audited. (For comparison: Signal's encryption protocol was sponsored / paid for by the US Govt and is used by Facebook's WhatsApp. Telegram has been banned in multiple countries for refusing to turn over data to the govt as well)
Signal advantages over Telegram:
- E2E chats are the only type of chats offered.
TLDR - If you use mostly 1:1 chats and E2E is important to you, use Signal. If you use mostly group chats or want ease of use to get your friends / family on board, use Telegram. Both are open source and have had independent security audits, which is better than WhatsApp!
- The ability to message someone with just your username / without revealing your phone number
- Easy to use from multiple devices (with full history the minute you install it on a new device)
- Great bot api
- Channels (like an rss feed, people may join to get info, but only the admins can post)
- Much larger groups
- Much larger per-file size limit when sending files
- Message scheduling
- Multiple accounts in the official client
- Polls / quizes
- Hashtags / stickers / animated stickers / etc
- Uses an encryption protocol (now in it's 2nd revision as of 3 years ago) that's been independently audited. (For comparison: Signal's encryption protocol was sponsored / paid for by the US Govt and is used by Facebook's WhatsApp. Telegram has been banned in multiple countries for refusing to turn over data to the govt as well)
Signal advantages over Telegram:
- E2E chats are the only type of chats offered.
TLDR - If you use mostly 1:1 chats and E2E is important to you, use Signal. If you use mostly group chats or want ease of use to get your friends / family on board, use Telegram. Both are open source and have had independent security audits, which is better than WhatsApp!
And all of it is free no matter how large the herd of cattle grows right?
That narrative time and again has proved to be bullshit as things scale.
The larger the scale the larger the problems. No free lunch. Just a matter of time.
The only people who cling to the free scale narrative are people who personally benefit from it at the expense of everyone else.
That narrative time and again has proved to be bullshit as things scale.
The larger the scale the larger the problems. No free lunch. Just a matter of time.
The only people who cling to the free scale narrative are people who personally benefit from it at the expense of everyone else.
https://t.me/durov/142 - Telegram is going to be monetized. Not on the current features though. For example, new paid stickers.
- instant search. I use tg for notes. It blazing fast. Just try to search in Skype for something to compare
but full text search of Telegram is still buggy, especially on CJK character:
https://superuser.com/questions/1374761/telegram-message-sea...
https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/issues/7096
https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/issues/7022
https://superuser.com/questions/1374761/telegram-message-sea...
https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/issues/7096
https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/issues/7022
You'll need to build a bot to leverage elastic search to index text and provide search via a bot (I didn't built the whole thing but providing supporting infrastructure - a host for the guy who wrote the integration to do docker-compose style deployment), it works pretty well, only problem is that running elastic search requires at least 2GB of RAM -_-z
Well summed up. Telegram in general provides more features and best of breed UX (among messaging apps) for the majority.
I've been using Wire (also using Signal protocol) but does not require mobile number to register (email and a @username), so 1 to 1 and group chats are end-to-end encrypted, but the UI really sucks, only using it to transfer files and messaging with a specific group. Telegram is a balance between security/control and eas of use (adoption).
I've been using Wire (also using Signal protocol) but does not require mobile number to register (email and a @username), so 1 to 1 and group chats are end-to-end encrypted, but the UI really sucks, only using it to transfer files and messaging with a specific group. Telegram is a balance between security/control and eas of use (adoption).
Signal is open source, Telegram isn't.
Signal is closed source, considering their server code hasn't been updated in 9 months yet changes have been made on production since then. [1] This is a really dishonest argument.
[1] https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Server
[1] https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Server
Why hasn't this blown up everywhere? This is an egregious abuse of trust.
related from telegram author: https://t.me/durovschat/515221
(most his stuff is posted in telegram)
He is saying telegram clients are open-source AND verifiable so you can prove the app store is giving the pushed source.
And there is no point of open-sourcing the server because it doesn't allow you to prove more about the encryption and you can't prove the published source matches reality.
Obviously there are business/brand reasons as well, but I think Telegram is being honest here.
He is saying telegram clients are open-source AND verifiable so you can prove the app store is giving the pushed source.
And there is no point of open-sourcing the server because it doesn't allow you to prove more about the encryption and you can't prove the published source matches reality.
Obviously there are business/brand reasons as well, but I think Telegram is being honest here.
I would love to hear more about the bot api. What did you use for reference documentation? Is your code available online?
These are the official bot api docs:
https://core.telegram.org/bots/api#authorizing-your-bot
There also lots of libraries for most languages.
There also lots of libraries for most languages.
Big pros of telegram compared to wa:
1. So easy to migrate. Wa restore can take up to an hour from gdrive, telegram is ready as soon as it is installed
2. It's always on everywhere, i.e. when i open web.telegram.org or desktop qpp it just connects instantly, web.whatsapp otoh requires my phone to be connected, takes forever to start and fails half the time.
3. I can restore year old file on tg while wa fails unless i have it in a backup.
4. The api. So easy to implement and such amazing bots. Just search skeddy for an example.
5. Huge groups. Our housing group has 1100 members, don't think its possible on wa
Biggest con compared to wa:
1. An amazingly bonehead feature that fills up my inbox: it has tell me x or y has joined telegram with a red badge. Seriously and i would care why? I add hundreds of people to my contact list. I can't even turn off this feature.
1. So easy to migrate. Wa restore can take up to an hour from gdrive, telegram is ready as soon as it is installed
2. It's always on everywhere, i.e. when i open web.telegram.org or desktop qpp it just connects instantly, web.whatsapp otoh requires my phone to be connected, takes forever to start and fails half the time.
3. I can restore year old file on tg while wa fails unless i have it in a backup.
4. The api. So easy to implement and such amazing bots. Just search skeddy for an example.
5. Huge groups. Our housing group has 1100 members, don't think its possible on wa
Biggest con compared to wa:
1. An amazingly bonehead feature that fills up my inbox: it has tell me x or y has joined telegram with a red badge. Seriously and i would care why? I add hundreds of people to my contact list. I can't even turn off this feature.
You can turn off notifications for your contacts joining Telegram in settings, but what’s annoying is that it will still create a new empty chat for the both of you and that cannot be disabled. It’s annoying to have to delete that chat manually for contacts I’d never even chat with (but are there for non-Telegram purposes).
The other solution for this is more of a nuclear approach where you disable contact sync and manage contacts in Telegram manually.
The other solution for this is more of a nuclear approach where you disable contact sync and manage contacts in Telegram manually.
Maybe I can write a bot that crawls web.telegram.org ever 5 minutes and delete all such chats.
On thing I love about Telegram is how easy the bot API is. Anytime I need a quick personal CLI to a service that works on mobile, I can get it running in no time. For example, I wrote a script to check flight prices and send me a telegram message when it hit a certain threshold.
Do you know Signal-cli? I'm using it for all my Signal bots. https://github.com/AsamK/signal-cli
I do not, thanks for sending this my way!
Telegram does not have end-to-end encryption by default and group chats cannot be end-to-end encrypted at all.
You cannot really do this when telegram is available on many devices at the same time. I can use it on 5 devices or even more at the same time. A feature that WhatsApp does not offer. The data is on my phone and maybe (if the backup works for once) in google drive or iCloud.
iMessage pulls this off though, afaik iMessage does this by having the sender encrypt for each recipient device.
Then there is still the issue of storage. With the amount of channels and groups i am in none of my devices would be able to hold everything. While i can just redownload everything from telegram.
First off: Correct. Off all the people trying to say this you are the first I've seen who has nailed it!
That said: Neither is mail.
Mail is still useful for a lot of things.
See also tptaceks take:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22371316
That said: Neither is mail.
Mail is still useful for a lot of things.
See also tptaceks take:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22371316
I am not comparing it to mail, I am comparing it to whatsapp.
No, you are not comparing to anything, which is totally fine :-)
I'm comparing it to mail.
And if you want a more secure alternative, please go with Signal.
WhatsApp leaks metadata east and west, and if you or any of the people you talk to enable backups all your chats end up in the cloud with a different company.
So much for bulletproof encryption in that case.
I'm comparing it to mail.
And if you want a more secure alternative, please go with Signal.
WhatsApp leaks metadata east and west, and if you or any of the people you talk to enable backups all your chats end up in the cloud with a different company.
So much for bulletproof encryption in that case.
Which is why, as crazy as it may sound, telegram is genuinely less secure than WhatsApp for most people
Telegram has not given any private data to any government. They have been banned (that didn't stop them tho) for this.
Whatsapp backsups are strongly encouraged by the app on a frequent basis. You cannot control the backup settings for your contacts. Therefore almost every group is backed up to google drive. Google has allegedly given this data to the authorities because these chats have leaked in a popular case here in India.
https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/how-ncb-retrieved-what...
https://www.indiatoday.in/technology/news/story/bollywood-wh...
Whatsapp backsups are strongly encouraged by the app on a frequent basis. You cannot control the backup settings for your contacts. Therefore almost every group is backed up to google drive. Google has allegedly given this data to the authorities because these chats have leaked in a popular case here in India.
https://www.thenewsminute.com/article/how-ncb-retrieved-what...
https://www.indiatoday.in/technology/news/story/bollywood-wh...
The unfortunate reality is that moving to Telegram is moving to a new Facebook. Yes, they offer a bunch of fancy features, unfortunately it's at the price of true privacy. All your data, for all perpetuity, will be stored on telegram servers where you hope that at no point in the future will they be compromised or forced to rat you out.
This is not a problem that Signal faces as they do not keep any of your data.
This is not a problem that Signal faces as they do not keep any of your data.
They comply with the GDPR. You have the right and ability to both export and delete your data at short notice.
I switched to Telegram long time ago when Putin presented an ultimatum to hand over the private keys to its founder, exiling the founder as a result. He never had any problems or ultimatums with WhatsApp.
I imagine Signal is seeing a bump as well.
Unsure if you’re a signal user and/or joking but I’ve had a steady stream of “X is on signal” messages the last week
The number of my contacts on signal has increased from 3 to 35 in 2 days.
Yeah me too, +15 or so contacts
for you and sibling - from the FT today:
> Signal was downloaded 8.8m times worldwide in the week after the WhatsApp changes were first announced on January 4, versus 246,000 times the week before
> Signal was downloaded 8.8m times worldwide in the week after the WhatsApp changes were first announced on January 4, versus 246,000 times the week before
Yes, Signal has also seen a large influx, so much so that the registration OTPs failed to deliver and Signal was working on that (with carriers) to sort it out. This was in the news a few days ago.
Telegram develops and launches new features the fastest among the popular messaging apps. It’s kinda unbelievable how fast it moves the needle and leaves the rest far behind. Look at the newly launched Telegram Tips channel to see all the features it has, explained with animations and text.
a FAQ from telegram's author from a couple days ago:
https://t.me/durov/146
Can someone comment on the Russian angle/ownership of Telegram.
Please, not trying to start a flame war but as a US person I’m trying to gauge if I should consider using it or not.
I don’t care about features, mostly care about security and privacy.
I don’t care about features, mostly care about security and privacy.
You can find it on Wikipedia as a start and read the founder’s (Pavel Durov’s) posts. The founder is in exile and is a citizen of St. Kitts & Nevis. The Telegram team is currently in Dubai, but has been in other locations before. Telegram was attempted to be banned in Russia a few years ago, but that failed terribly.
As a U.S. person, you have a lot more to worry about the three letter agencies there than about Telegram. And theoretically, you’d also have to worry about Signal being based out of the U.S.
As a U.S. person, you have a lot more to worry about the three letter agencies there than about Telegram. And theoretically, you’d also have to worry about Signal being based out of the U.S.
Still don't trust them at all.
And you would be smart not to. It's like people haven't learned from history and what happened to Facebook and WhatsApp. Moving to Telegram is simply moving to a new Facebook and hoping that they don't sell out or get compromised. All your data is stored by default on their servers and out of your control. Switching to Signal is the only real viable option going into 2021.
While it is not truly private, it is absurd to compare it to a company that lives from tracking people and selling their data..
Wow. Now all the need is to add a feed
Are those Trumps Twitter followers?
Or are they coming from Parlor?
Serious questions. Not trying to troll.
Serious questions. Not trying to troll.
No, the second half of the headline is "38% came from Asia, 27% from Europe, 21% from Latin America and 8% from MENA."
tons of people in LA/SA are moving to telegram from whatsapp due to the whole facebook debacle.
That's what I'm also observing. I'm having to actively raise awareness of Signal to my LA friends, because they are largely going to Telegram by default.
So what's going on in the world that's driving the surge in signups? Hopefully not US political nonsense.
I also really hope it's not intelligence agencies rushing to make new accounts to move their disinformation campaigns to new platforms.
I also really hope it's not intelligence agencies rushing to make new accounts to move their disinformation campaigns to new platforms.
Facebook ruining whatsapp:
https://www.macrumors.com/2021/01/06/whatsapp-privacy-policy...
https://www.macrumors.com/2021/01/06/whatsapp-privacy-policy...
Looks like you missed the massive discussion regarding Whatsapp’s ultimatum to everyone if they want to continue using their service for free:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25662215
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25662215
Yep that will do it. If I used Whatsapp that would make me want to switch too.
Jan 6 was not a good day to announce such a policy shift. It got drowned out by world (well, US) events.
Jan 6 was not a good day to announce such a policy shift. It got drowned out by world (well, US) events.
I guess this is a wave of WhatsUp-privacy-gate
Some for sure, there have been rumors of Telegram groups starting up in the aftermath of Parler.
Almost none of my conservative friends used Parler. It really was a ghost town until Twitter banned President Trump and many signed up, hoping they could read posts from him there, but he was never on Parler.
As for the surge in encrypted messaging, yes, a lot of this is conservatives no longer willing to use Facebook and Twitter out of anger or fear. Of my conservative friends, I would say that at least half have moved to platforms like Wickr and Signal in the last week. They are using it to replace private Facebook Messenger chats.
As for the surge in encrypted messaging, yes, a lot of this is conservatives no longer willing to use Facebook and Twitter out of anger or fear. Of my conservative friends, I would say that at least half have moved to platforms like Wickr and Signal in the last week. They are using it to replace private Facebook Messenger chats.
> It really was a ghost town until Twitter banned President Trump and many signed up, hoping they could read posts from him there, but he was never on Parler.
All of my family and most of my in-laws as well as most of my friends here in Norway from outside work uses it since long time ago, but just the last few days two more Norwegians and one Pakistani friend of mine joined.
All of my family and most of my in-laws as well as most of my friends here in Norway from outside work uses it since long time ago, but just the last few days two more Norwegians and one Pakistani friend of mine joined.
Parler's user base really started growing in mid-late 2020 as FB, Twitter etc. became stricter about political content, and started censoring the President and other conservatives much more frequently.
The don't censor conservatives, they censor hate speech.
Just turns our the right does a lot more of that. Reality is hard, sometimes.
Just turns our the right does a lot more of that. Reality is hard, sometimes.
Can without doubt say that Telegram nails it when it comes to user interface, features and userfriendliness. Girlfriend loves their animated stickers.
Their bot-api is easy to use as well, created a echo-bot in no time. Only thing that annoys me is the lack of encrypted groups, but no one is really concerned about it.