GIMP's 2022 Annual Report(gimp.org)
gimp.org
GIMP's 2022 Annual Report
https://www.gimp.org/news/2023/01/29/2022-annual-report/
94 comments
Gimp is in a tough spot, and it's easy to understand - it's an open source project that has bounced around for decades without strong leadership or corporate investment to pull it forward (cf. Blender).
In that time they haven't built non-destructive layers, they haven't improved the UI, and they've kept that stupid kink/ableist name.
Image editors in the near future will be 100% AI-first. Gimp is not going to make it.
In that time they haven't built non-destructive layers, they haven't improved the UI, and they've kept that stupid kink/ableist name.
Image editors in the near future will be 100% AI-first. Gimp is not going to make it.
GIMP can be used for what it is, as op is getting at. There's no need to "make it" to anything.
(BTW I used to teach Photoshop at the college level...AI editors and illustrators are Clip Art 2.0, and already have the same smell to them)
(BTW I used to teach Photoshop at the college level...AI editors and illustrators are Clip Art 2.0, and already have the same smell to them)
> Image editors in the near future will be 100% AI-first. Gimp is not going to make it.
30 years ago AI was also a big hype. As you can see, after 30 years AI is again the big hype. I presume that in 30 years (if we live that long) we will see again such statements that AI will solve everything.
30 years ago AI was also a big hype. As you can see, after 30 years AI is again the big hype. I presume that in 30 years (if we live that long) we will see again such statements that AI will solve everything.
Yes, as stated here: https://linkedrecords.com/which-jobs-are-being-replaced-by-a...
3D TVs will be making a comeback first! Or maybe VR?
I don't get why HN feels this way about AI. We're clearly onto something. Scratching the surface. The present day research hasn't even been productized - there's so much the current level of AI can and will improve. And yet research marches forward at blinding pace.
Because the same cycle is happening.
https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobile/how-chatgpt-could-take-micr...
We are going to end up with Clippy 2.0. Microsoft is going to want it to always nudge towards Microsoft services.
> Hey, it looks like you are trying to build a webservice. Would you like to switch to C# or Typescript?
I have seen this story 100 times before. We have barely scraped VR, but Facebook is bought up the leader and now we have a terrible experience with attempts to lock in all the time. We had barely scraped 3D, but Hollywood decided that it would be best if it were presented as Minions with yo-yos rather than subtle ways of increasing immersion.
We could have had really awesome phones that brought about social changes. Or we could have Apple trying to lock everyone into a chat silo and Google trying to produce an iPhone and Microsoft destroying the only innovative phone manufacturer.
I'm cynical because the folks investing in these things don't have our interests, they want to make a quick buck so they can fuck off to Mars.
https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobile/how-chatgpt-could-take-micr...
We are going to end up with Clippy 2.0. Microsoft is going to want it to always nudge towards Microsoft services.
> Hey, it looks like you are trying to build a webservice. Would you like to switch to C# or Typescript?
I have seen this story 100 times before. We have barely scraped VR, but Facebook is bought up the leader and now we have a terrible experience with attempts to lock in all the time. We had barely scraped 3D, but Hollywood decided that it would be best if it were presented as Minions with yo-yos rather than subtle ways of increasing immersion.
We could have had really awesome phones that brought about social changes. Or we could have Apple trying to lock everyone into a chat silo and Google trying to produce an iPhone and Microsoft destroying the only innovative phone manufacturer.
I'm cynical because the folks investing in these things don't have our interests, they want to make a quick buck so they can fuck off to Mars.
I think it's disappointment fatigue.
Pareto's principle is alive and well, the first 20% of developing a technology is the easiest and most productive, but the actual goal is deep in the weeds of the non-trivial 80% of the work that must be done.
Thanks to capitalism, the work will stall alongside the profits. We'll get 30-50% of the way there, and hit the wall, that being that if we want general purpose AI we will have to pay researchers and developers more and more money for more and more diminishing returns.
Eventually we will hit the point where even though we are 80% of the way there, the bean counters won't justify the expense. "It's good enough, just stop here" they'll say, and then all of the research will be shelved for 5-7 years, then open sourced, and then muddled with for 10 years or so and then the cycle will repeat itself all over again until the right genius with the right background in the right time and right location finally codes the right bit of code or uncovers a new branch that we've overlooked and this all blows up again.
Pareto's principle is alive and well, the first 20% of developing a technology is the easiest and most productive, but the actual goal is deep in the weeds of the non-trivial 80% of the work that must be done.
Thanks to capitalism, the work will stall alongside the profits. We'll get 30-50% of the way there, and hit the wall, that being that if we want general purpose AI we will have to pay researchers and developers more and more money for more and more diminishing returns.
Eventually we will hit the point where even though we are 80% of the way there, the bean counters won't justify the expense. "It's good enough, just stop here" they'll say, and then all of the research will be shelved for 5-7 years, then open sourced, and then muddled with for 10 years or so and then the cycle will repeat itself all over again until the right genius with the right background in the right time and right location finally codes the right bit of code or uncovers a new branch that we've overlooked and this all blows up again.
This is a decades-old comment, but many would like for its name to be changed.
I didn’t even know that Gimp had a slang definition until this thread.
Do you genuinely think this change would help the project? I don’t see how it does anything other than confuse potential users and cause a lot of discussion about something that doesn’t actually improve the functionality itself.
Do you genuinely think this change would help the project? I don’t see how it does anything other than confuse potential users and cause a lot of discussion about something that doesn’t actually improve the functionality itself.
I’m certain renaming GIMP would make a tremendous difference. The name is perceived as offensive & that makes it impossible for people to take seriously, especially in a corporate setting. Edit: As someone who has tried to get people using it because it’s such great software.
I used it in my high-school multimedia class instead of Photoshop and my (female) teacher never bat an eyelid. I can't imagine many workplaces that would be more prudish than a Catholic school? The biggest obstacle I find is that people are used to Photoshop, and some tools are quite tricky to use (the alignment tool).
Someone could easily fork it and change nothing but the branding if the name was such a problem.
I'm pretty sure that the biggest threat to the adoption of GIMP isn't the name GIMP, it's Adobe doing regular Adobe things.
I'm pretty sure that the biggest threat to the adoption of GIMP isn't the name GIMP, it's Adobe doing regular Adobe things.
Maybe in America. I can assure elsewhere nobody has any idea of the offensive meaning.
We know what a gimp is, the film Pulp Fiction and the internet exist here :-)
They should rename it for americans. For the rest of the world it can stay the same.
Yep, same experience here. The name is a big problem.
I’m also unlikely to recommend it to kids, for example, because googling its name can be risky.
ROTFL. Never heard about this in 20 years.
Doing an extended search shows that "gimp" is a kind of latex costume. There are worse things for kids than a latex costume. For example violence.
gimp is not a latex costume
google: define gimp
> / (ɡɪmp) / noun. US and Canadian offensive, slang a physically disabled person, esp one who is lame. slang a sexual fetishist who likes to be dominated and who dresses in a leather or rubber body suit with mask, zips, and chains.
(probably from urban dictionary)
see also a real dictionary
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/gimp
google: define gimp
> / (ɡɪmp) / noun. US and Canadian offensive, slang a physically disabled person, esp one who is lame. slang a sexual fetishist who likes to be dominated and who dresses in a leather or rubber body suit with mask, zips, and chains.
(probably from urban dictionary)
see also a real dictionary
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/gimp
When I was a kid and trying to learn LaTeX this happened to me all the time on the library computers.
I do not think I have a point, you just made me remember some fun and dreadful moments.
I do not think I have a point, you just made me remember some fun and dreadful moments.
I remember I worked in a content creation related company and the director saying “there’s a reason they call it GIMP”
I’m not sure a name change would do that much. The tool itself is behind photoshop from 2010 and the gap is growing.
I’m not sure a name change would do that much. The tool itself is behind photoshop from 2010 and the gap is growing.
There was a fork called Glimpse - it failed hard. Just name is not enough for a project to prosper - surprisingly, you need also actual developers to code.
I could see it's name as an impedance toward adoption in a corporate environment. The name "GIMP" certainly doesn't inspire confidence in someone who's never heard of it before. GLIMPSE, a fork of GIMP, certainly has a better name.
I don't think funny names hinder tool adoption. Photoshop is the standard because it's a better tool than Gimp, although it's non-free.
Companies adopted Git. They'll adopt Gimp if it's better than Photoshop.
Companies adopted Git. They'll adopt Gimp if it's better than Photoshop.
FWIW, "git" doesn't have an insulting meaning to most people in the US. "Git" can mean "go" in some US dialects. I would guess that the average person here has no idea that "git" has any kind of negative connotation.
On the other hand, in the US, "gimp" is always either an insult, a derogatory verb, or the open source project.
On the other hand, in the US, "gimp" is always either an insult, a derogatory verb, or the open source project.
Git is pretty universally known as referring to an ignorant and unpleasant person.
No, it's really not. Inside the UK, your statement is true, but inside the US, most people have never heard of this.
Hmm, I'm Australian and it's very well known
Again, Australia and the UK are not like the US, and have different slang.
Where universe fits in the borders of USA.
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There is a fork with a rename. Cinepaint. But I don't see it being more popular. Looks like people don't care about the name that much after all.
Cinepaint was never general fork of Gimp and was never meant as a competitor or alternative. It was a fork focusing on solving some very domain specific problems that Gimp wasn't focusing on. Most of those features have since been folded back into Gimp.
Just call it GNU IMP.
Or by its full name.
Or by its full name.
I see a bunch of mentions of non-destructive layer effects. Non-destructive editing is a killer feature of Photoshop which GIMP has desperately needed for years. I hope they’re finally able to pull it off because it makes editing so much easier.
I'm really happy to see that there will be improvements related to colour space and more specifically to CMYK.
What’s the best graphics editing tool that’s more than MS Paint but much less than GIMP or Photoshop? Ideally for Linux.
I like GIMP but so often I just want to doodle on a screenshot. I find GIMP is a bit much for real quick “let me show you what I mean” moments.
I like GIMP but so often I just want to doodle on a screenshot. I find GIMP is a bit much for real quick “let me show you what I mean” moments.
If you're veering in the direction of arty doodles and more ..
Krita comes in a Linux 64-bit AppImage: https://krita.org/en/
When it comes to simple image manipulation and transforms (scaling, colour reduction, cropping) I usually use the Image Magick CLI suite as there'll be more than one picture to process.
Krita comes in a Linux 64-bit AppImage: https://krita.org/en/
When it comes to simple image manipulation and transforms (scaling, colour reduction, cropping) I usually use the Image Magick CLI suite as there'll be more than one picture to process.
Krita can also be installed straight from the debian repos, if you run debian. (I imagine other distros have it too!)
I like it a lot, it has a pretty easy to use interface. Only grumble is there's no print dialogue, you have to save/export your image and then print from somewhere else, which is a pretty minor inconvenience.
I like it a lot, it has a pretty easy to use interface. Only grumble is there's no print dialogue, you have to save/export your image and then print from somewhere else, which is a pretty minor inconvenience.
Windows has Paint.net, Linux has Pinta that basically strives to be its clone.
(For me what makes it more than MS Paint is especially the layer support.)
(For me what makes it more than MS Paint is especially the layer support.)
If you just want to mess around with simple graphics art, I really like Kolourpaint in the KDE library of applications.
For editing photos, Krita (also from KDE) is pretty popular.
For editing photos, Krita (also from KDE) is pretty popular.
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maybe Krita?
Do they have another report where they talk about how all the money that is donated gets distributed?
It sounds like GIMP 3.0.0 should come out in late 2023 (or 2024), which would be cool
Anything in particular you're excited for?
Switching from GTK2 to GTK3 and online extensions management (npm for Gimp plugins) are what's most exciting to me (even though we've already moved onto GTK4...)
> Switching from GTK2 to GTK3 and online extensions management (npm for Gimp plugins)
This is very exciting but in the negative sense. I guess i have to improve my firewall.
This is very exciting but in the negative sense. I guess i have to improve my firewall.
Sounds like non-destructive editing should come out in late 2050 (or 2060), which would be cool
With a nod to Jeff Atwood, I have a problem to report in the data's very first bullet point
> ‧ 1 stable releases (GIMP 2.10.32)
Anyway, note that there is prose below the bullet point statistics. I almost missed that there was more to this post than a git summary (should have paid more attention to the table of contents). Particularly the future plans, near the bottom, I felt like finally gave some insight into what is actually going on for me, an out-of-the-loop GIMP user: https://www.gimp.org/news/2023/01/29/2022-annual-report/#pla...
Seems like they have a lot going on, lots of loose threads, but not enough manpower to guide and manage incoming contributions while also working on more necessary improvements first for earlier releases.
> ‧ 1 stable releases (GIMP 2.10.32)
Anyway, note that there is prose below the bullet point statistics. I almost missed that there was more to this post than a git summary (should have paid more attention to the table of contents). Particularly the future plans, near the bottom, I felt like finally gave some insight into what is actually going on for me, an out-of-the-loop GIMP user: https://www.gimp.org/news/2023/01/29/2022-annual-report/#pla...
Seems like they have a lot going on, lots of loose threads, but not enough manpower to guide and manage incoming contributions while also working on more necessary improvements first for earlier releases.
I wonder who will have non-destructive layers first?
Gimp or StableDiffusion?
Gimp or StableDiffusion?
https://developer.gimp.org/core/roadmap/#animation-and-multi...
> New XCF format [Discussed] An archive-based format should allow us more easily to load data on-use, therefore allowing much bigger project files (ex.: page and animation)
Would this be the first time this has happened?
> New XCF format [Discussed] An archive-based format should allow us more easily to load data on-use, therefore allowing much bigger project files (ex.: page and animation)
Would this be the first time this has happened?
They should use Sqlite
I'll offer a positive instead of a negative. I think GIMP is great editor. It's my goto editor for simple photo/image edits that go into presentations. I am glad it exists. Some of us don't need Photoshop.
I remember GIMP used to be the poster boy for the open-source alternative to Photoshop.
But these days, I'm hearing more and more Krita, which is another popular open-source and free photo editor. Curious how GIMP holds up these days against Krita (and possible other alternatives?)
But these days, I'm hearing more and more Krita, which is another popular open-source and free photo editor. Curious how GIMP holds up these days against Krita (and possible other alternatives?)
I wouldn't call Krita a photo editor, much like I wouldn't really consider GIMP and Krita to be real competitors.
Krita is aimed at artists above all else, mostly working as a canvas for brushes. GIMP is much more oriented at editing photos.
Both have features for both purposes, but I just wouldn't use Krita for any photo editing nor would I pick GIMP for drawing art.
The real Photoshop competitor these days is probably Photopea.com, with its Photoshop-like UI and tooling. It's not open source, though.
Krita is aimed at artists above all else, mostly working as a canvas for brushes. GIMP is much more oriented at editing photos.
Both have features for both purposes, but I just wouldn't use Krita for any photo editing nor would I pick GIMP for drawing art.
The real Photoshop competitor these days is probably Photopea.com, with its Photoshop-like UI and tooling. It's not open source, though.
Darktable is what one wants to use for photos.
Krita is a much better paint tool. Gimp is a much better photo editor.
Really: Although Gimp is far behind Photoshop, everything else is far behind Gimp if you're a serious photo editor.
Really: Although Gimp is far behind Photoshop, everything else is far behind Gimp if you're a serious photo editor.
Even Photopea? That seems to be the program I hear more often as a recommended alternative to Photoshop.
I think GIMP has far more (and more powerful) features than Photopea.
But when it comes to features you'll actually be able/willing to use, Photopea will likely win over GIMP because the UX of the latter is so terrible.
But when it comes to features you'll actually be able/willing to use, Photopea will likely win over GIMP because the UX of the latter is so terrible.
> Photopea will likely win over GIMP because the UX of the latter is so terrible.
Photopea is online. Already lost.
Photopea is online. Already lost.
99% of users care more about usability than about things like this.
Photopea is not open source, I don't think it's a real competitor to GIMP or Krita if it can be killed by one person without any hope of outsiders maintaining it.
Hard to see a full feature list for Photopea, but does it support automation and plugins? Examples of things I do in Gimp:
- Smart object removal (select an object, remove it, but autofill it with the surrounding pattern - unlike heal which you have to tweak).
- Automatic creation of luminosity masks (https://www.capturelandscapes.com/introduction-to-luminosity...)
- Equivalent of Liquid Rescale: http://liquidrescale.wikidot.com/ GIMP had this before Photoshop :-)
- Smart object removal (select an object, remove it, but autofill it with the surrounding pattern - unlike heal which you have to tweak).
- Automatic creation of luminosity masks (https://www.capturelandscapes.com/introduction-to-luminosity...)
- Equivalent of Liquid Rescale: http://liquidrescale.wikidot.com/ GIMP had this before Photoshop :-)
Darktable for photos.
No. And I say this as a heavy user of darktable. Darktable/Lightroom is in a separate category altogether - focusing on workflow - as well as RAW capabilities.
I do most of my processing in Darktable, but when I need to do serious editing for a given picture, I have to drop into GIMP.
I do most of my processing in Darktable, but when I need to do serious editing for a given picture, I have to drop into GIMP.
Krita is better in any concievable way.
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jrm4(2)
bitwize(3)
I gave up on comparing it to Photoshop over a decade ago, and by simply accepting it as its own thing (learning how it works and not grumbling about how this/that isn’t how Photoshop does it), it’s really not that difficult to learn. Just like vi (or photoshop) it’s a powerful tool and you need to spend some time to gain competence with it.