Tesla exaggerated EV range so much that drivers thought cars were broken(arstechnica.com)
arstechnica.com
Tesla exaggerated EV range so much that drivers thought cars were broken
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/07/tesla-exaggerated-ev-range-so-much-that-drivers-thought-cars-were-broken/
22 comments
The optimistic mode is alleged to ignore outside temperature. This is mentioned on the second page of the article:
>Other data cited by Reuters found that Tesla cars "almost always calculated that they could travel more than 90 percent of their advertised EPA range estimates regardless of external temperatures."
All EVs encounter cold weather, but most of them pretty much hit their range ratings regardless. Why should Tesla be different?
>Other data cited by Reuters found that Tesla cars "almost always calculated that they could travel more than 90 percent of their advertised EPA range estimates regardless of external temperatures."
All EVs encounter cold weather, but most of them pretty much hit their range ratings regardless. Why should Tesla be different?
My Model Y gives two mileage estimates simultaneously - a ballooned EPA estimate and an accurate (typically within 1%!) estimate once I put in a destination. The latter is usually ~75% of the former.
At first this felt like typical marketing BS. But I also find my inner engineer defending it a bit - the range depends significantly on top speed and head/tail wind. If I slow down to 60 mph on the interstate I have exceeded the stated EPA mileage.
I get the confusion and frustration, but at the same time the claimed range is under ideal conditions, just like every other manufacturer. But because the Tesla is so much more energy efficient, deviations feel magnified.
At first this felt like typical marketing BS. But I also find my inner engineer defending it a bit - the range depends significantly on top speed and head/tail wind. If I slow down to 60 mph on the interstate I have exceeded the stated EPA mileage.
I get the confusion and frustration, but at the same time the claimed range is under ideal conditions, just like every other manufacturer. But because the Tesla is so much more energy efficient, deviations feel magnified.
It's why I switched my Model 3 to just report battery percentage instead of estimated range. Their charge usage algorithm in their route planner is very impressive. Even across 300+ km trips, I've never seen it out by more than a few percent. From what I can see, it's most affected by wind. I guess they don't input weather into the estimation model.
My experience is that real world usage gets me about 85% of the advertised range for most of the year. I average around 160 Wh/km for the driving I do, so with a pack capacity of 75 kWh, that's about 470 km. Advertised range here in the EU was 530 km.
My experience is that real world usage gets me about 85% of the advertised range for most of the year. I average around 160 Wh/km for the driving I do, so with a pack capacity of 75 kWh, that's about 470 km. Advertised range here in the EU was 530 km.
> but at the same time the claimed range is under ideal conditions, just like every other manufacturer
No, not like every other manufacturer:
https://insideevs.com/reviews/443791/ev-range-test-results/
No, not like every other manufacturer:
https://insideevs.com/reviews/443791/ev-range-test-results/
Super interesting! I stand corrected - upvote for you. Thanks for that link!
Stories like this make me wonder how much software is out there straight up lying to everyone and we just don’t know it.
I’ve been asked to build tools that round up or down wherever possible, to just add a little polish to how the data is presented. But nothing like this. It definitely makes me weary about future where everything runs on software.
I’ve been asked to build tools that round up or down wherever possible, to just add a little polish to how the data is presented. But nothing like this. It definitely makes me weary about future where everything runs on software.
If there’s profit to be made from lying, assume the worst. In Tesla’s case, the rosy picture was to convince people who had range anxiety over EVs as well as look better against the competition.
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Uber greyball, VW emissions test profilers, Tesla range shenanigans.
Seems we should default to assuming it lies until otherwise proven.
Seems we should default to assuming it lies until otherwise proven.
Look into closed source breathalyzers
Have you ever tried to reach advertised mpg (or l/100km) on gasoline car?
It’s not the software. Everyone is lying.
It’s not the software. Everyone is lying.
My car generally exceeds its efficiency rating by around 15%.
The sort of alleged malfeasance is not normal. Edmund's claims most EVs meet or exceed their range estimates, while Tesla systematically inflates range estimates by a third.
The sort of alleged malfeasance is not normal. Edmund's claims most EVs meet or exceed their range estimates, while Tesla systematically inflates range estimates by a third.
Most of my ICEs and EVs reached advertised efficiency without much effort.
Let’s not normalize amount of deception Tesla does in their marketing and user hostile behaviors.
Let’s not normalize amount of deception Tesla does in their marketing and user hostile behaviors.
For many years, I got better-than-advertised mpg with a Honda Civic. My more recent vehicles, though, don't quite reach their claimed mpg. Is this "everyone lying" a new phenomenon, or is Honda an exception from "everyone"?
There is a difference between the range that a standardized test reports which allows for comparing apples to apples and a range that my car shows me based on my driving style.
When the missus drives the car and then fills up the tank I see range X. When I drive the car and fill up I see range Y. Different driving styles.
When the missus drives the car and then fills up the tank I see range X. When I drive the car and fill up I see range Y. Different driving styles.
I frequently exceed it on mine as well as on rental cars. It really depends on one's driving style.
Coasting to upcoming red lights/stop signs and accelerating at a gentler pace make a big difference, as well as driving the speed limit on the highway.
Coasting to upcoming red lights/stop signs and accelerating at a gentler pace make a big difference, as well as driving the speed limit on the highway.
I have. Perhaps not everyone?
I usually do a lot better than the advertised MPG on my Mazda
Lol gotta love the Musk stans flagging the article...
Big discussion of original source: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36891642
What does the Tesla firmware look like? Is the car tamper proof — is it a Trusted Platform? Any good links on picking apart the car software would be gratefully received.
Cold climates also prevent any sort of absolute positioning awareness based autonomous driving since in winter the road lane positions are emergent and more of a function of human flocking than the underlying obscured road markings or edges.