The midwit home(dynomight.substack.com)
dynomight.substack.com
The midwit home
https://dynomight.substack.com/p/midwit-home
286 comments
I have a smart lock from Schlage that has all the features you just described, but also ZWave and so can be controlled over HomeAssisstant. We can both tell our friend a code to get in, but I can revoke a code remotely if I ever need to.
I also never get locked out. Usually I key myself in with the keypad, and there's a normal key slot too. It's also powered by a 9V -- but will also indicate to HomeAssistant what the battery level is
The key isn't that connectivity is bad, the key is that it should degrade gracefully when the more advanced features fail. Wireless is down? Can't unlock with my phone, but I can still use the keypad. Battery is dead? I can still use my physical key.
I also never get locked out. Usually I key myself in with the keypad, and there's a normal key slot too. It's also powered by a 9V -- but will also indicate to HomeAssistant what the battery level is
The key isn't that connectivity is bad, the key is that it should degrade gracefully when the more advanced features fail. Wireless is down? Can't unlock with my phone, but I can still use the keypad. Battery is dead? I can still use my physical key.
I have the same lock, with basically the same underlying rules: any automation should fail towards the old, "dumb", way. I automate light switches more than outlets, and most other things send control commands to those switches. The thermostat is added as well but works just as well as a walk-up-and-change-it touchscreen.
The other rule is that no cloud service ever be necessary. I want heat & lights, even if the internet is out.
The other rule is that no cloud service ever be necessary. I want heat & lights, even if the internet is out.
I have the same lock, but I've never figured out how to get Home Assistant to change codes. Do you know of a good guide for that?
I’m interested in this. Does this require a hardware zwave controller or does the lock talk directly to home assistant?
You’ll need a ZWave stick plugged into the machine running Home Assistant.
A related option to allow entry based on a code, if you don't want to replace your lock, is to put a combination key lock box (sometimes called a "realtor box") somewhere near the door. We have one of these and have been very happy with it. And no batteries that can die!
One threat model with that kind of approach is that once a visitor possesses your key -- even if they return it -- you can't tell how many copies they may have made.
I got one WITHOUT an app, bluetooth or wifi.
Geeksmart "smart dumb" fingerprint door lock:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08TMBL7FW
works great
Geeksmart "smart dumb" fingerprint door lock:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08TMBL7FW
works great
I'm going to guess you don't live in a place where gloves are necessary for a good portion of the year. I would see this option as more of a pain than a solution. Glad it works well for your use case through.
I wonder if the fingerprint reader would get cold enough my skin would freeze and stick to it.
I hate that feeling.
I hate that feeling.
Lockly's base model fingerprint lock is fingerprint + keycode, and Bluetooth is actually optional, you can set it all up on the device w/o a phone. IMHO they don't advertise this enough, and they really try to upsell you to the Wi-Fi models.
They don't advertise this, super cool.
Oh and it uses a standard Schlage cylinder so you can get all your doors keyed the same, or swap it out with a high security cylinder if you so desire. (Lockpicking Lawyer even said not bad things about it!)
Fingerprint is a seriously cool. Except it doesn't work if your finger is wet, at which point you are back to just using a code.
Now, all that said, there are times I really wish I had the Wi-Fi model, knowing on my phone that, for example, the animal sitter has stopped by and fed the pets, is super useful.
But not having the Wi-Fi model is a trade off I have made in return for the security of not having another wireless entry point into my home network.
They don't advertise this, super cool.
Oh and it uses a standard Schlage cylinder so you can get all your doors keyed the same, or swap it out with a high security cylinder if you so desire. (Lockpicking Lawyer even said not bad things about it!)
Fingerprint is a seriously cool. Except it doesn't work if your finger is wet, at which point you are back to just using a code.
Now, all that said, there are times I really wish I had the Wi-Fi model, knowing on my phone that, for example, the animal sitter has stopped by and fed the pets, is super useful.
But not having the Wi-Fi model is a trade off I have made in return for the security of not having another wireless entry point into my home network.
This thread got me researching locks and I think the Lockly is promising. With the current models you can buy the WiFi module for $80. The Pro model costs $50 more than the base one and includes the module but you should be able to add just the WiFi since the locks themselves are the same.
This may not be true for older models that may exist, so I would verify.
This may not be true for older models that may exist, so I would verify.
I have somethint similar but it’s purely mechanical, no electronics or batteries to worry about at all. Even my kids can use it fine and it only takes a second to enter the combo.
only a second? easier than a key?
Much easier, for many of the kids I know, than keeping track of a key!
To all of you extolling the virtues of combo locks, I guess you live in pretty secluded houses in safe neighborhoods with zero visibility of the keypad from across the street.
If I had a combo lock, I'd be more worried about someone with binoculars or an ultra-zoom camera watching me key my lock without covering my hand than my physical key getting lost or stolen.
If I had a combo lock, I'd be more worried about someone with binoculars or an ultra-zoom camera watching me key my lock without covering my hand than my physical key getting lost or stolen.
If someone cared that much about getting into my house, they could easily get into any key-based lock as well, or through any other way, like a window.
I live right outside downtown Seattle but I have a fence, so my door is not visible from the street. I don’t know why more people don’t try it.
Aren't the keys you press visibly different from the others after a while? This is a failure mode I've noticed on several code pads. Even though you don't know the exact code, it gives the numbers so you now only have to guess the order.
Just change the code?
> And if you're intent on breaking in, well, the windows are made of glass. Please don't do that.
Does your insurance cover it? Mine requires a keyed lock specifically.
Does your insurance cover it? Mine requires a keyed lock specifically.
You can use a 'sticky film' for the glass that allegedly really fucks w/ any burglar.
Burglar here. Actually we prefer the sticky film, because then the glass comes out as a one piece. Makes entry much safer, and workplace safety is important!
I thought it doesn't break cleanly and then can cut them up trying to break it more?
> If we are on vacation, we can call up a friend and tell them a code so they can get in.
I love that I can give my family/friends a code and make it valid for a specific time period. Or remotely let them in. That’s the value I see in networked locks.
I love that I can give my family/friends a code and make it valid for a specific time period. Or remotely let them in. That’s the value I see in networked locks.
Mind sharing which device that is so I can have one for my house?
I've had https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NJJ1MQ for 10 years now with zero issues and not even a battery change needed yet.
Not sure if this is the one OP has but:
[https://www.homedepot.com/p/Schlage-Camelot-Satin-Nickel-Ele...]
I had one on my house growing up from like 2007-2012, rock solid. Bought a house this year and the first thing I did was install these on the front and back doors. Seems like it's exactly the same model that was being sold in 2007 (which is still on my childhood home and going strong btw).
[https://www.homedepot.com/p/Schlage-Camelot-Satin-Nickel-Ele...]
I had one on my house growing up from like 2007-2012, rock solid. Bought a house this year and the first thing I did was install these on the front and back doors. Seems like it's exactly the same model that was being sold in 2007 (which is still on my childhood home and going strong btw).
We have a similar Schlage, yup.
But did you look at the program code of it? Did you figure out that 8675309 opens it even if you didn't program it? That's what I have worried about on these kinds of devices.
While there is always a chance a backdoor like that exists, and thieves start memorizing default and backdoor codes and also learn how to recognize the corresponding models by sight from a non-suspicious distance... there's an orders-of-magnitde greater chance they use a low skill rock-through-window style attack.
Mandatory related xkcd: https://xkcd.com/538/
While I believe that HA is very cool and many vendors provide valuable solutions, we must consider what happens when we die.
This is just one anecdote, but I believe the problem is more pervasive.
I was called to an elderly lady's home to "un-haunt" the building. See, her husband had recently passed away; he done "all of the cool things" to make the home smart. Unfortunately too smart. The wife could not operate the devices in her own home.
She had the tenacity to handle living in a dark house. All the time; she just gave up on the lights -- she couldn't figure it out and lived like this for an entire year.
She finally called for help when lights started randomly turning on and off. She believed it was the spirit of her late husband, but after some diagnostics, we found some cross-channel noise from a home further down the block. Whenever this neighbor would come home, he would turn on his lights via his home automation. About 75% of the time, it would turn on our lady's lights too. In her bedroom. And the neighbor worked 3rd shift.
I spend the next two days removing all home automation devices and, as she put it, putting in "turn the light on and off again" switches.
When choosing technology -- any technology, it's important to consider the life of that device and the people impacted far in the future.
This is just one anecdote, but I believe the problem is more pervasive.
I was called to an elderly lady's home to "un-haunt" the building. See, her husband had recently passed away; he done "all of the cool things" to make the home smart. Unfortunately too smart. The wife could not operate the devices in her own home.
She had the tenacity to handle living in a dark house. All the time; she just gave up on the lights -- she couldn't figure it out and lived like this for an entire year.
She finally called for help when lights started randomly turning on and off. She believed it was the spirit of her late husband, but after some diagnostics, we found some cross-channel noise from a home further down the block. Whenever this neighbor would come home, he would turn on his lights via his home automation. About 75% of the time, it would turn on our lady's lights too. In her bedroom. And the neighbor worked 3rd shift.
I spend the next two days removing all home automation devices and, as she put it, putting in "turn the light on and off again" switches.
When choosing technology -- any technology, it's important to consider the life of that device and the people impacted far in the future.
Of course you can have your cake and eat it too. If you were to throw away the Raspberry Pi in my house that runs home assistant, all of the switches on the wall would continue to work. This is possible by switching in smart switches instead of smart bulbs. For RGB bulb controls, Zigbee pairing can make the operation of the remote controls independent of the hub to some degree, though I'm not 100% confident that those will function properly without the hub since then there's no coordinator (right?)
Thank you. I am not sure why so many people have this impression that if you install smart home stuff you can't have switches that Just Work. My garage door has a smart opener and also a physical switch inside the garage and a key fob remote in the kitchen drawer, they all work just fine. If the Wifi is down you can just use an old fashioned analog solution. Progressive enhancement is not that hard, you just need to do five minutes of research and pay ten extra dollars to be sure you are getting products that have physical fallback.
This was a basic principle I decided on when thinking about smart switches etc. Basically they must be dumb switches first and only if HA is working are they smart. The most promising ones I find were from Shelly. They fit into normal light switches (or in the UK you probably have to put them at ceiling roses).
Then I decided I didn't really want to put electronics in my wall at all and did something more useful with my time instead.
Then I decided I didn't really want to put electronics in my wall at all and did something more useful with my time instead.
Yeah I've done meross homekit switches for all of our light switches. There's one that needed a reset (via the button on the outside, easy as cake). I didn't notice for weeks because it works like a switch when you tap it. Switches are the best place to add smarts and they gracefully degrade just fine. This midwit fix involving remote controls to turn on lights STINKS. Hell, our bedroom fan has that just because it's a 2 wire fan and I hate it.
That's my plan for the house. The internet can go down and every extra controller can fry and the basic switches should still work exactly as designed. I'm going for zwave, but the same idea - smart switches with normal bulbs. Nothing talks to wifi.
We started with smart bulbs, but once we bought a house, we've been replacing them with Lutron Casita switches and adapters.
Oof! Thank you for sharing that.
This is one of the reasons that smart bulbs and the like are generally bad - you never want a situation where the switch doesn't just act like a switch.
Smart houses should be designed from the perspective of remaining identical to use when the smarts go away. And if there's weird behavior it should all stop if you unplug the hub or controller.
I generally like in-wall smart switches but even there they tend to die faster than dumb switches, so you may be leaving your survivors a bunch of calls to an electrician.
This is one of the reasons that smart bulbs and the like are generally bad - you never want a situation where the switch doesn't just act like a switch.
Smart houses should be designed from the perspective of remaining identical to use when the smarts go away. And if there's weird behavior it should all stop if you unplug the hub or controller.
I generally like in-wall smart switches but even there they tend to die faster than dumb switches, so you may be leaving your survivors a bunch of calls to an electrician.
I feel like "if your internet-connected X doesn't do regular internet-less X-things without the internet, its not an X" should be the core axiom of IoT design.
Yep, my goals are largely two-fold:
- "Everything 'smart' must continue to function if the internet is disconnected"
- "Everything 'smart' must fall-back to normal 'dumb' operation if the automation server is not available"
- "Everything 'smart' must continue to function if the internet is disconnected"
- "Everything 'smart' must fall-back to normal 'dumb' operation if the automation server is not available"
>- "Everything 'smart' must fall-back to normal 'dumb' operation
...immediately, every single time the occupant wants it to do that. Regardless of the state of any other component.
...immediately, every single time the occupant wants it to do that. Regardless of the state of any other component.
> This is one of the reasons that smart bulbs and the like are generally bad - you never want a situation where the switch doesn't just act like a switch.
Depends on your devices, but I have (Philips?) smart bulbs that can be turned on/off "regularly", but keep it on and you can control it via google home.
Depends on your devices, but I have (Philips?) smart bulbs that can be turned on/off "regularly", but keep it on and you can control it via google home.
80% of my lights are smart bulbs rather than switches, and I agree with your take here. In my house I have the smarts in the switch itself wherever possible, but so much of my lighting is from floor and table lamps (that aren't plugged into switched outlets). In those cases, the bulb is the only thing I can "smarten", and it still will work via the stem on the lamp itself if the HA box goes away.
The main drawback is that this means I have to have the bulbs set to light up after power is restored. A middle-of-the-night power outage is fun when the entire house lights up at 3am :)
I've done a few new installs of lighting in my garage, driveway, and patio. Because that was "greenfield" work, I got to put smart switches in. If I ever rewire this house, I'll use that opportunity to do some more.
The main drawback is that this means I have to have the bulbs set to light up after power is restored. A middle-of-the-night power outage is fun when the entire house lights up at 3am :)
I've done a few new installs of lighting in my garage, driveway, and patio. Because that was "greenfield" work, I got to put smart switches in. If I ever rewire this house, I'll use that opportunity to do some more.
Have you looked at smart plugs? I have a few lamps in my home plugged into them and the automation works fine. I have a couple spares I store with the Xmas stuff so that the lights can be automated once the decorations are up.
I use Kasa (TP-Link) plugs but there are a bunch of different brands.
I use Kasa (TP-Link) plugs but there are a bunch of different brands.
I have, yeah. A couple years ago I got a bunch of Tasmota-flashable ones, and I use them for the coffeemaker, a couple stereos, and one table lamp. Oh yeah, and the christmas lights. :)
My issue with those is that they fail the "normal person" test. A normal person will try to turn on a lamp and it will never work because the smart plug is off. But with a smart bulb, it'll come on after they twist the stem a couple times. (And it never gets noticed! People are used to 3-way style lamp sockets needing a couple clicks to turn regular bulbs on and off, so they don't really notice that they had to double twist the stem to get the light to turn on)
My issue with those is that they fail the "normal person" test. A normal person will try to turn on a lamp and it will never work because the smart plug is off. But with a smart bulb, it'll come on after they twist the stem a couple times. (And it never gets noticed! People are used to 3-way style lamp sockets needing a couple clicks to turn regular bulbs on and off, so they don't really notice that they had to double twist the stem to get the light to turn on)
Of course, now you have the opposite problem: someone turns the bulb off with the lamp knob (unaware of/irritated with its smart features), and now it's unresponsive with all smart controls.
The best compromise are smart switches. Switch still manually controls the light, and smart features are always available. The downsides are that the lamp's outlet must have switch wiring, and smart switches aren't like normal toggles: they're more like push buttons so the switch isn't in a strange physical state.
The best compromise are smart switches. Switch still manually controls the light, and smart features are always available. The downsides are that the lamp's outlet must have switch wiring, and smart switches aren't like normal toggles: they're more like push buttons so the switch isn't in a strange physical state.
Haha, yup. No matter what method I choose, I give something up. I agree switches are usually the best, but it gets more complicated when I want to have configurable color temp and dimmability in the same fixture. Can't use a dimmer switch, because the smart bulb wants full power. Or I can use a dimmer that's operating as basically a remote for the bulb rather than a true current-interrupting switch. But now it needs to be able to fall back to real switch mode if the hub is offline.
(By the way, Philips Warm Glow bulbs are awesome for this. I use them in my dining room lamp connected to an Inovelli Z-wave dimmer. They get warmer the dimmer they go, mimicking how tungsten filaments work)
My current setup is a mix-n-match of all three types, using each one where it beats the other two for simplicity and predictability.
(By the way, Philips Warm Glow bulbs are awesome for this. I use them in my dining room lamp connected to an Inovelli Z-wave dimmer. They get warmer the dimmer they go, mimicking how tungsten filaments work)
My current setup is a mix-n-match of all three types, using each one where it beats the other two for simplicity and predictability.
The default on Hue bulbs is to reset to mid-bright white when first turned on. This means whenever you flip the switch on the light turns on, and obviously if you turn the switch off the light turns off. So, they essentially do let the switch be a switch by default.
That's why I love HomeAssistant!
I programmed a dead man's switch tied to the presence feature so if my phone or smartwatch don't show up in the house for six months, it turns on the "HAUNT FAMILY" program. There's no way I'm leaving my afterlife up to crosstalk from a distant neighbor.
That reminds me: I have to hook up the smart speaker so that it says "WHAT ARE YOU DOING, DA- HONEY?" any time my partner walks up to the RaspberryPi.
I programmed a dead man's switch tied to the presence feature so if my phone or smartwatch don't show up in the house for six months, it turns on the "HAUNT FAMILY" program. There's no way I'm leaving my afterlife up to crosstalk from a distant neighbor.
That reminds me: I have to hook up the smart speaker so that it says "WHAT ARE YOU DOING, DA- HONEY?" any time my partner walks up to the RaspberryPi.
Just wanna share that the sentence “There's no way I'm leaving my afterlife up to crosstalk from a distant neighbor” totally made my day.
Actually the nice thing about all the recent advancements in machine learning and generative AI is that you can set it up to record everything you say in the house, and train itself to learn your speech patterns and voice. Then it can behave realistically when spirit mediums attempt to contact it. No more of this canned prerecorded nonsense that falls apart after a week of investigation.
Of course there's a similar premier in a black mirror episode. Only a bit more fleshed out.
Along that same line - My Home-automation setup is fairly simple using Samsung's hub and requires very little maintenance. But I do have a fairly complicated homelab and network setup. I'm in my early 50s and have considered what would my wife/children do if one day the 'internet' connection wasn't working and I'm no longer around to fix it? No way they're going to know how to log into OPNSense or Unifi controller to troubleshoot. So I bought a off the shelf router, configured with basic setup with same SSID and IP scheme. Typed up some simple instructions on a single page and attached it to the router box. The idea being that they can simply unplug the OPNSense box, plug the router into it and then power everything up. I've done a fire-drill test and had my teenage son try it. So far he seems to know exactly what to do. The rest I'm hoping he can figure it out on his own.
I might have to do this for my roommate. My homelab died while I was out of town, and they didn't have internet for a day or two
It doesn't even have to involve death. I had a NAS that I set up and relied on, and then when it stopped working, I was so busy for the next month that I got used to living without it. (It wasn't a difficult fix, but I didn't know that, and I didn't want to even get started on it unless I had several hours at my disposal.) I eventually got it working because I absolutely needed a couple of files off of it, but after that I could never bring myself to put anything new on it, because I just don't enjoy fixing stuff like that anymore, and I often don't have the time.
Reminds me of an old scifi short story I read years ago and can no longer find.
It outlined a future where everyone started automating elements of their messaging to each other. Simple things like automated "Happy Birthday" messages. Eventually, people started setting up auto "Thank you" replies to these messages. It only got more complex from there with increasingly elaborate conversations being automated between people.
Eventually, some calamity hits civilization and humans go extinct. But their technology is resilient and keeps running without them. The ghosts of a dead people continue talking to each other in perpetuity, long dead people cheerfully wishing each other "Happy Birthday" until the lights finally ran out.
Haunting story that I still think about from time to time. Would love it if anyone else recognizes the story and could credit it.
It outlined a future where everyone started automating elements of their messaging to each other. Simple things like automated "Happy Birthday" messages. Eventually, people started setting up auto "Thank you" replies to these messages. It only got more complex from there with increasingly elaborate conversations being automated between people.
Eventually, some calamity hits civilization and humans go extinct. But their technology is resilient and keeps running without them. The ghosts of a dead people continue talking to each other in perpetuity, long dead people cheerfully wishing each other "Happy Birthday" until the lights finally ran out.
Haunting story that I still think about from time to time. Would love it if anyone else recognizes the story and could credit it.
I don't know that story, but it's a similar premise to "There Will Come Soft Rains"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2552i2Z8sNM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2552i2Z8sNM
The owner of a custom rotating house in California cited a similar reason for moving. The video is worth watching but here is the relevant section:
"I've had 18 heart procedures. My wife is in perfect health. The odds of me outliving her are zero...We're moving back to Coronado. This is a complex house, even though I think it's simple! For her to try and teach somebody else how to run everything and do everything would be difficult if something happened to me. So we're just kind of jumping ahead."
https://youtu.be/gisdyTBMNyQ?t=383
"I've had 18 heart procedures. My wife is in perfect health. The odds of me outliving her are zero...We're moving back to Coronado. This is a complex house, even though I think it's simple! For her to try and teach somebody else how to run everything and do everything would be difficult if something happened to me. So we're just kind of jumping ahead."
https://youtu.be/gisdyTBMNyQ?t=383
I love how he solved for rotating plumbing
I run HA at home, and my home is an apartment. I was able to buy some zigbee switches [1] that just 'snap' over the top of traditional light switches, after adding some castellated plastic washers under the screws that hold the switch cover in place
This means that instead of a light switch, there is a button. And when I relocate, I can just remove these devices from the switches and take them with me
[1] https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08TVZK8D6
This means that instead of a light switch, there is a button. And when I relocate, I can just remove these devices from the switches and take them with me
[1] https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08TVZK8D6
3D-printable replacement for the plastic clips, https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:6014514
Yeah HN is generally young people and early adopters. Most HA stuff is part of a "generation" of tech. What people don't realize is that in about 15-20 years, all buzzwords/acronyms/techstacks will likely be completely different.
Home stuff needs to generally work for 20 years, and lot of things (light switches, etc) will be even longer. Tech has no conception or demonstrated discipline for functioning that long.
HA/IOT is an interop disaster currently, and the current cacaphony of standards/acronymns guarantees it will be cycled/replaced in a decade's time.
The INTER-NET of Things doesn't have a functional INTER, nor a NET.
Inter is software, which should be mathematically doable but historically improbable.
The ubiquitous NET part basically means you buy the device, and it will work with zero-config networking that means you can find it.
And the final issue is the interface. Interfaces do NOT age gracefully either. Perhaps voice interfaces are what is needed.
Consumer IOT is yet another 10 years away.
Home stuff needs to generally work for 20 years, and lot of things (light switches, etc) will be even longer. Tech has no conception or demonstrated discipline for functioning that long.
HA/IOT is an interop disaster currently, and the current cacaphony of standards/acronymns guarantees it will be cycled/replaced in a decade's time.
The INTER-NET of Things doesn't have a functional INTER, nor a NET.
Inter is software, which should be mathematically doable but historically improbable.
The ubiquitous NET part basically means you buy the device, and it will work with zero-config networking that means you can find it.
And the final issue is the interface. Interfaces do NOT age gracefully either. Perhaps voice interfaces are what is needed.
Consumer IOT is yet another 10 years away.
You are absolutely correct. It is a horrible mess.
Which is why Homeassistant is a godsend - you can add the mess and present it in a sensible way. As long as you stay the fuck away from anything cloud you are pretty much golden no matter what the parent company decides to do.
E.g. Telldus had a huge range of 433mhz things that still work IF you avoided their TelldusNet or whatever.
Which is why Homeassistant is a godsend - you can add the mess and present it in a sensible way. As long as you stay the fuck away from anything cloud you are pretty much golden no matter what the parent company decides to do.
E.g. Telldus had a huge range of 433mhz things that still work IF you avoided their TelldusNet or whatever.
That sounds like an old school X10 system problem, I remember issues like that.
> The wife could not operate the devices in her own home.
Hopefully this isn't a common situation. I know that for me, not being able to control basic things like lights/heating/cooling without calling on and waiting around for somebody else would drive me nuts and one way or another the situation would have been resolved before the only person who knew how to handle the tech had a chance to sleep let alone die.
I've known a lot of people who couldn't figure out to how to use their own TV remove for anything more advanced than getting to the point where they can watch their usual shows and change the volume, but not being able to turn off a light at night is like not knowing how to turn a TV on at all!
Hopefully this isn't a common situation. I know that for me, not being able to control basic things like lights/heating/cooling without calling on and waiting around for somebody else would drive me nuts and one way or another the situation would have been resolved before the only person who knew how to handle the tech had a chance to sleep let alone die.
I've known a lot of people who couldn't figure out to how to use their own TV remove for anything more advanced than getting to the point where they can watch their usual shows and change the volume, but not being able to turn off a light at night is like not knowing how to turn a TV on at all!
I visited a friend not too long ago, who had a smart speaker in the guest room mainly to control the lights. It went through a smart plug. Naturally, their internet connection went down. We had to move the bed (in the dark) in order to remove the smart plug and re-activate the regular lightswitch.
Fortunately, we're both reasonably fit people, but I know people who would've just had to give up and use a flashlight.
Fortunately, we're both reasonably fit people, but I know people who would've just had to give up and use a flashlight.
Also consider what happens when you sell your home. Or be careful buying a house with a system.
A friend of mine bought a house with an expensive system, but it wasn't very useful and later had a fault. To remove it would require replacing all the switch plates - I would guess $1000 to get rid of it. He was technical so he fixed it instead.
A friend of mine bought a house with an expensive system, but it wasn't very useful and later had a fault. To remove it would require replacing all the switch plates - I would guess $1000 to get rid of it. He was technical so he fixed it instead.
This is a consideration for me, since I'm in the middle of a pretty big upgrade to smart switches throughout my basement and main floor. I think this will be very appealing for the right potential buyer. I'm just curious what I'll need to do to make this a feature. Maybe de-sync it from my system and provide a Smart Things hub and get them all set up with it there so it's easy.
I'm not getting rid of the existing switches and plate covers, so at least I can more easily remediate it if the future buyers don't want the system.
I'm not getting rid of the existing switches and plate covers, so at least I can more easily remediate it if the future buyers don't want the system.
I recommend making it a zero-effort handoff. My experience with selling houses is that I want precisely zero to do with the buyer, and them with me.
This btw is the source of the word "turnkey". You turn the key, and it works.
This btw is the source of the word "turnkey". You turn the key, and it works.
Made a comment in the root of the article thread that is related to yours, in terms of overcoming your elderly client’s problem with something far more robust and reliable:
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37861604
My mother called me freezing cold. Her nest thermostat had a "wifi connectivity lost" message on the screen and she couldn't (or didn't know how) to bypass it and turn up the heat.
Yeah these smart switches should
All have backup physical buttons which I believe they all do but also a kill all automation hard switch but that would not be so simple
There's a lot of potential for posthumous practical jokes currently going unused! You want part of my estate, you better be ready for jump scares
I 100%, absolutely sympathize with the opening there. The situation really sucks to a surprisingly great extent. At the same time though, it has to be stated that going for a 'dumb, simple' Smart Lights really, really misses an enormous amount of the potential value. Nearly 100% of my smart home is about lights for now using just Philips Hue/HomeKit, though HA remains on my list, but only a tiny percentage is about simply having switches wherever. The true value for me has been in more intelligent color lighting based on layered actions. I change the amount of blue and brightness during the course of the day, so that there's lots in the morning and it's dimmer and ever redder in the evening. Particularly in the winter this has been incredibly helpful for my sleep cycles. It can all be extremely transparent as well since the switches and motion sensors can have time-of-day as well as which-button and number-of-clicks categorization. So hitting the on button always turns the lights on, but the color and brightness mix of a room will be different over the course of the day. Same with outdoors, motion sensors anywhere that can have different colors and activation periods at different times has been great for massively cutting down extraneous blue light at night, which is good not just for humans but for animals and insects as well. I can wake up in the heart of winter when the sun doesn't rise until 8 or later in the morning to a 20 minute long "sunrise" I created myself simulated nicely with a bunch of lights. And more complex logic like "lights all come on when smoke alarm goes off or a basement flood is detected" are also handy.
Again I'm very sympathetic to the shitty state of the ecosystems right now, frequently miserable UI/UX, and massive heaping doses of bullshit companies are constantly trying to pull to extract more ongoing revenue from people for what should be buy-once-and-done products. But it really sucks precisely because yes: smart home features genuinely can be pretty great.
Again I'm very sympathetic to the shitty state of the ecosystems right now, frequently miserable UI/UX, and massive heaping doses of bullshit companies are constantly trying to pull to extract more ongoing revenue from people for what should be buy-once-and-done products. But it really sucks precisely because yes: smart home features genuinely can be pretty great.
The one word there sums it up: ecosystems. Every manufacturer seems to be insisting on themselves being "the ecosystem" and the end result is we ended up with dozens of ecosystems, none of whom have a full soup-to-nuts-yet-easy solution, and they don't invest enough effort into getting them compatible with each other.
Every few years I get tempted to go down this rabbit hole, hoping that in the last few years the industry has finally gotten its shit together, and every time I look, it's the same clown show, just with more clowns.
Every few years I get tempted to go down this rabbit hole, hoping that in the last few years the industry has finally gotten its shit together, and every time I look, it's the same clown show, just with more clowns.
Yeah, big companies (tech or otherwise) now have their ears up to prevent anything from becoming a success without them, and so nothing becomes a success because there’s no room for the users and startups around them to evolve to what the products really should be.
We need more things that are complete in themselves but causally work with other things. (Y’know, like the web.) Things that can perform tasks without an installation page, but readily extensible using MQTT or HTTP. That’s the kind of thing my company tries to build. That’s a very useful thing about Shelly, or any of the polished devices that expose an open protocol.
We need more things that are complete in themselves but causally work with other things. (Y’know, like the web.) Things that can perform tasks without an installation page, but readily extensible using MQTT or HTTP. That’s the kind of thing my company tries to build. That’s a very useful thing about Shelly, or any of the polished devices that expose an open protocol.
There are so many ecosystems that should die and get opened up. Televisions, car entertainment systems, closed app stores.
They hold society down.
They hold society down.
It's a https://xkcd.com/927/ situation because (1) there's so much money at stake and (2) many involved are incompetent/have bad taste.
Eh, it's not exactly that... its more of
"Lets design a spec that anyone can use"
Premium brand that uses spec is $30 dollars a light, but works...
UNGADONG brand made in China is $10 dollars and has a 30% chance of catching on fire.
Premium brand goes out of business and market is taken over by crap.
---
Also, vendor lock in by the premium brand allows them to jack up prices even more.
"Lets design a spec that anyone can use"
Premium brand that uses spec is $30 dollars a light, but works...
UNGADONG brand made in China is $10 dollars and has a 30% chance of catching on fire.
Premium brand goes out of business and market is taken over by crap.
---
Also, vendor lock in by the premium brand allows them to jack up prices even more.
This is probably because a lot of smart home enthusiasts are less enthused about actually turning the lights on and off. They have fun tinkering and building wireless systems.
I believe you based on my experience with the salve, but I’m the opposite.
Very much, “I just want it to work.”
Here’s what I’ve found useful from a smart home:
* I can leave for a week or weekend, let the house get quite hot or cold (obviously within some safety parameters) and then turn in the heat or AC a couple hours before I get home.
* I get alerts when a package or other delivery shows up at the front door.
* I can set a timer to turn off any lights my kids left on during the day, late at night every night.
* I can set a timer to turn off the heat or AC in an outbuilding no-one sleeps in late at night, in case my kids were out there and forgot to turn it off.
* I can set my outdoor lights to go on at sunset, and turn off around “it’s unlikely anyone will be going out here and need a lit pathway” time.
* I can set my espresso maker to turn on and warm up before I’m ready for coffee, and turn off when we’re a bit past “you should stop drinking coffee or it’s gonna mess with your sleep” time.
* When we leave town with an arrangement for a dog sitter to come by and take care of our dog a few hours after we leave, I can check to make sure they actually did and poor Rover isn’t lonely and unfed.
But I do 100% agree with the author’s frustration, and wish things “just worked” and just worked together.
Very much, “I just want it to work.”
Here’s what I’ve found useful from a smart home:
* I can leave for a week or weekend, let the house get quite hot or cold (obviously within some safety parameters) and then turn in the heat or AC a couple hours before I get home.
* I get alerts when a package or other delivery shows up at the front door.
* I can set a timer to turn off any lights my kids left on during the day, late at night every night.
* I can set a timer to turn off the heat or AC in an outbuilding no-one sleeps in late at night, in case my kids were out there and forgot to turn it off.
* I can set my outdoor lights to go on at sunset, and turn off around “it’s unlikely anyone will be going out here and need a lit pathway” time.
* I can set my espresso maker to turn on and warm up before I’m ready for coffee, and turn off when we’re a bit past “you should stop drinking coffee or it’s gonna mess with your sleep” time.
* When we leave town with an arrangement for a dog sitter to come by and take care of our dog a few hours after we leave, I can check to make sure they actually did and poor Rover isn’t lonely and unfed.
But I do 100% agree with the author’s frustration, and wish things “just worked” and just worked together.
I totally don't understand what I gain with colored lights. My friend had a similar setup and I just don't get the attraction. I have a Google home and setting timers has a clear value, I forget less. Playing music has clear value, I relax. Colored lights??? I don't get it.
>I totally don't understand what I gain with colored lights. My friend had a similar setup and I just don't get the attraction. I have a Google home and setting timers has a clear value, I forget less. Playing music has clear value, I relax. Colored lights??? I don't get it.
While the effect no doubt varies with individual, there has been a significant amount of studies suggesting that there is some link between bright light in shorter wavelengths (so blue end of spectrum) and melatonin suppression, and in turn circadian rhythms [ex: 0, 1, 2]. If you live near the equator with consistent sunrise/sunset year round artificial light management may be less of a concern to you, but the further you are and the more seasonal variation you experience the more helpful it may be (and is for me) to have lighting throughout home/work that can help maintain circadian rhythm as desired. "Sunrise" into bright white/blue in the morning and day, then slowly changing into dimmer, redder light as one approaches the desired time to go to sleep. YMMV of course but as someone in tech who had decades of difficulty in maintaining a normal 24h cycle in the northern latitudes, heavy light brightness and temperature control has been a very significant improvement in my QOL and I never want to go back.
Of course, some people just enjoy having fun with lighting as well, for parties and mood and such. "Painting with light" can be interesting by itself. But for me the practical advantages have been significant value for the cost, and without any need for any kind of drugs or other mechanisms.
----
0: https://www.webmd.com/sleep-disorders/sleep-blue-light
1: https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/blue-light-ha...
2: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9424753/
While the effect no doubt varies with individual, there has been a significant amount of studies suggesting that there is some link between bright light in shorter wavelengths (so blue end of spectrum) and melatonin suppression, and in turn circadian rhythms [ex: 0, 1, 2]. If you live near the equator with consistent sunrise/sunset year round artificial light management may be less of a concern to you, but the further you are and the more seasonal variation you experience the more helpful it may be (and is for me) to have lighting throughout home/work that can help maintain circadian rhythm as desired. "Sunrise" into bright white/blue in the morning and day, then slowly changing into dimmer, redder light as one approaches the desired time to go to sleep. YMMV of course but as someone in tech who had decades of difficulty in maintaining a normal 24h cycle in the northern latitudes, heavy light brightness and temperature control has been a very significant improvement in my QOL and I never want to go back.
Of course, some people just enjoy having fun with lighting as well, for parties and mood and such. "Painting with light" can be interesting by itself. But for me the practical advantages have been significant value for the cost, and without any need for any kind of drugs or other mechanisms.
----
0: https://www.webmd.com/sleep-disorders/sleep-blue-light
1: https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/blue-light-ha...
2: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9424753/
High color temperature in the morning to wake you up versus low temperature in the night to let you get to sleep quickly is the main benefit.
they're fun! they help set the mood, so the living room changes from an office space vibe to a campfire vibe to a cool outer space feel. it's goes beyond strictly utilitarian uses but you have to have emotions to get use out of that feature.
Other than fun, being able to shift lights in the kids bedrooms to a more yellow hue for storytime then a dark red for a nightlight has been good.
When my teen would be up in his room with headphones on, I would flash the bedroom lights remotely from downstairs. That was his cue to come downstairs for dinner or so we could figure out our weekly schedule or whatever.
I have a bladerunner/Tokyo nights mode I can put my apartment in, I love it.
The 1 Hue light I have resets itself on occasion and I've given up on reprogramming it to do the 1 thing I want it to do, which is color tracking by time of day.
I imagine if I bought a compatible "smart switch" that issue would go away (power never completely dropped to the bulb), but seriously...
I imagine if I bought a compatible "smart switch" that issue would go away (power never completely dropped to the bulb), but seriously...
I searched the page for “Lutron” but was disappointed…
There is a line of lutron switches that are dead simple, no smarts, no hub … and a cute little remote that everyone in my family uses to “all off” the interior lights.
We have a no smart devices policy in the house and these make the cut …
EDIT: From my notes ... the specific product line is "maestro wireless" and I have MRF2-6CL switches paired with "pico" remotes. This is as opposed to the caseta line from Lutron which is quite a bit "smarter".
There is a line of lutron switches that are dead simple, no smarts, no hub … and a cute little remote that everyone in my family uses to “all off” the interior lights.
We have a no smart devices policy in the house and these make the cut …
EDIT: From my notes ... the specific product line is "maestro wireless" and I have MRF2-6CL switches paired with "pico" remotes. This is as opposed to the caseta line from Lutron which is quite a bit "smarter".
For what it's worth I do have the Caseta line and it is by far and away the most reliable part of my smart home setup. If it were possible I'd be powering everything with it but sadly the only way to get e.g. fans integrated is to buy one of a very small set of fans with Caseta functionality built in. So instead I have pico remotes talking to Home Assistant talking to the fans which... mostly works. But the Caseta part itself has been flawless.
Are you talking about ceiling fans? If so, I've found that their fan switches work flawlessly - no need to buy any kind of fan with smarts built-in: https://www.casetawireless.com/us/en/products/dimmers-switch...
(Search the page for "Original Smart Fan Speed Control Switch", there's seemingly no way to link directly to the requisite page section... which is a thing I could rant about but will not).
(Search the page for "Original Smart Fan Speed Control Switch", there's seemingly no way to link directly to the requisite page section... which is a thing I could rant about but will not).
Sorry, I should have been clearer. Those switches work great with fans that are already hardwired for a switch in the wall but a lot of modern fans (in my experience, maybe because I was buying cheap!) don't bother with that and have their own wireless system of some variety to control fan speed, lights etc.
My solution to that was to buy a Zigbee controller to go inside the fan. I wish Lutron sold some kind of standalone fan controller you could shove in there but alas.
My solution to that was to buy a Zigbee controller to go inside the fan. I wish Lutron sold some kind of standalone fan controller you could shove in there but alas.
Ah I see, that makes sense.
The commercial versions of Lutron controls are an (expensive) option as well, if you are of the sort that really wants whole-home automation.
These things are installed in big fancy commercial buildings where there is an expectation that they last longer than the warranty, which is reassuring.
These things actually do pretty well at power conservation at these scales, but it's a little fuzzy if it will do the same for a home. Just swapping out LED for incandescent gets you pretty much all of the bang for your buck, but if you have people in your house who are allergic to turning off lights, the occupancy sensors will help a bit.
Lutron is a real company as well, an not an Amazon company, which is not nothing.
These things are installed in big fancy commercial buildings where there is an expectation that they last longer than the warranty, which is reassuring.
These things actually do pretty well at power conservation at these scales, but it's a little fuzzy if it will do the same for a home. Just swapping out LED for incandescent gets you pretty much all of the bang for your buck, but if you have people in your house who are allergic to turning off lights, the occupancy sensors will help a bit.
Lutron is a real company as well, an not an Amazon company, which is not nothing.
Exact same thought here but with their Caseta lineup. It is one of the most easy to configure and reliable smart home things I have in the house.
I still use HA on a RPi4 for other things, typically via Zigbee, but the Casetas always work like you'd expect from a light switch while also enabling smart stuff like voice control or automations.
I still use HA on a RPi4 for other things, typically via Zigbee, but the Casetas always work like you'd expect from a light switch while also enabling smart stuff like voice control or automations.
More votes for Caseta.
Also a happy Lutron fan, but I went with RadioRA2. It's a bit "smarter" but it's very reliable, not connected to the internet, and some basics can even be programmed without the management software.
One thing that stands out with Lutron products is their use of a unique spectrum[0], unlike almost all other smarthome products that share the same noisy bands.
[0]: https://assets.lutron.com/a/documents/clear_connect_technolo...
One thing that stands out with Lutron products is their use of a unique spectrum[0], unlike almost all other smarthome products that share the same noisy bands.
[0]: https://assets.lutron.com/a/documents/clear_connect_technolo...
> Hauling your body across the room just to flip a switch is absurd.
Maybe this is a sign of getting old, but I never got why this is such a hassle. Light switches are within reach when you enter a room. Once you're inside, you rarely have to touch them again until you exit. On the rare ocasion that I do, maybe it's also a good time to stretch my legs, take a bathroom break, or get a snack.
Is that such a major inconvenience that we have to overengineer solutions using expensive and complicated ecosystems of gadgets and software?
Maybe I'm in the minority with this line of thinking on this forum, but I never got the smart home appeal. I want devices that I can control directly, not those that will interpret or anticipate what I want to do and, more than likely, cause frustration rather than satisfaction. The switch is the ubiquitous and perfect mechanism of control, especially if it's directly wired to a simple state machine, and not layers of indirection and "protocols". I wish more devices used dumb switches, not less.
Don't get me started on the motion sensing lights TFA mentions. I curse the times I've entered a public bathroom that has these, only for the light to go off at the most inopportune moment. Don't want to use a physical switch because of sanitation? That's fine, but cheap and low-power LED lights exist for them to be always on during your service hours. You won't save much having the light turn off, and potentially annoy your customers.
Maybe this is a sign of getting old, but I never got why this is such a hassle. Light switches are within reach when you enter a room. Once you're inside, you rarely have to touch them again until you exit. On the rare ocasion that I do, maybe it's also a good time to stretch my legs, take a bathroom break, or get a snack.
Is that such a major inconvenience that we have to overengineer solutions using expensive and complicated ecosystems of gadgets and software?
Maybe I'm in the minority with this line of thinking on this forum, but I never got the smart home appeal. I want devices that I can control directly, not those that will interpret or anticipate what I want to do and, more than likely, cause frustration rather than satisfaction. The switch is the ubiquitous and perfect mechanism of control, especially if it's directly wired to a simple state machine, and not layers of indirection and "protocols". I wish more devices used dumb switches, not less.
Don't get me started on the motion sensing lights TFA mentions. I curse the times I've entered a public bathroom that has these, only for the light to go off at the most inopportune moment. Don't want to use a physical switch because of sanitation? That's fine, but cheap and low-power LED lights exist for them to be always on during your service hours. You won't save much having the light turn off, and potentially annoy your customers.
The light switch in our primary bedroom is, as you describe, within reach when you enter the room. It controls a switched outlet near the bed that has a lamp plugged into it. When it comes time to turn out the light to go to sleep, you have two non-ideal choices: get up from bed to turn the lamp off using the switch near the door, or stay in bed and turn the lamp off manually, meaning the next time you operate the wall switch the lamp won't turn on (unless you remembered to turn the lamp back on in the morning).
I have a lamp right next to my bed that I also turn on as part of my going to bed routine, so that I turn off the room light, get in bed, and still have light.
This is a lot cheaper than a home automation system.
This is a lot cheaper than a home automation system.
1. Enter bedroom
2. Turn on primary light
3. Walk to bedside lamp and turn it on
4. Walk back to primary light and turn it off
5. Walk back to bed and climb in
6. Turn off beside lamp.
It's not _the worst_, but it is toil.
2. Turn on primary light
3. Walk to bedside lamp and turn it on
4. Walk back to primary light and turn it off
5. Walk back to bed and climb in
6. Turn off beside lamp.
It's not _the worst_, but it is toil.
3-way switches are the best solution here. Switch the bedside lamp on from the main switch by the door, and then off again from a second switch at the bedside. Many stairways are like this: you can control the lights from the switches at the bottom or the top of the stairs.
This was solved in the 90s. The actual lightswitch can be mounted in a wireless remote that sockets into the switch plate by the door. You just take the switch with you to the bedside table. In the morning when you leave the room you socket it back into the switch plate.
This was solved probably around 1880: 3-way switches
My stairway/upstairs lights are on a 4-way switch. I’ve never researched it but presumably one could build out a 5-way or 6-way switch by adding more switches wired the “middle” way. I’m sure there’s a term for the two wire switch in the middle but I’m no electrician.
The same cost to get an electrician out to wire in one 3-way switch paid for an apartment of smart (plug-in) outlets for me.
And since it’s a rental, I would not have been allowed to actually add the 3-way switch.
Have you seen a room wired with a second lightswitch specifically for the bedside? I'd be interested to know if anyone's done this.
It is possible to work these steps into your routine.
1. Enter bedroom 2. Turn on primary light 3. Do getting ready for bed activities. 4. Turn on lamp when convenient 5. Use bathroom 6. Turn off main lights 7. Get in bed and turn off the lamp.
1. Enter bedroom 2. Turn on primary light 3. Do getting ready for bed activities. 4. Turn on lamp when convenient 5. Use bathroom 6. Turn off main lights 7. Get in bed and turn off the lamp.
On the bright side, it's a few more steps on your pedometer.
Ah, it sounds like you need smart switches then. :)
In my case I just have two lights. The ceiling one is controlled by a switch near the door, and the lamp is controlled by a switch on its cord. I use either depending on what I'm doing.
In my case I just have two lights. The ceiling one is controlled by a switch near the door, and the lamp is controlled by a switch on its cord. I use either depending on what I'm doing.
43 years old and it's never been a problem I've wanted a new solution to. Don't think I ever will. I remember deriding those clap-on, clap-off devices when I was a kid. Same deal here.
For me, "remote control" is by far the least useful part of my home assistant setup - I have smart switches and use the physical switches most of the time to control the lights if I just want to switch them on/off eg as I enter/exit a room. The useful things (to me) come from integrating several different devices together - for example:
- If I've been out (defined by my phone's wifi connection or alarm arming state) and then come home and turn on the light nearest my front door, all the lights in my house will turn on (at a predefined brightness level according to time of day)
- When I start a TV show/movie/etc on the TV (but only in the evening), the lights in the room where the TV is will dim. If I pause, they get a bit brighter. Switch the TV off and they get fully bright.
- If I'm watching TV or listening to music and get a phone call, the TV/music automatically pauses
- When I leave the house, all the house lights get switched off automatically in case I forgot to switch any off (again based on phone wifi connection and/or alarm arming state - my alarm state is one-way so HA can't control the alarm, only the other way around)
- If someone leaves the bathroom light on for too long, it will automatically switch off
- In the morning, the lights in my bedroom dim up very gradually to help me wake up (with timing and whether it happens linked to my calendar so it happens later at weekends or during school holidays when I don't need to help with the school run)
- I get a notification on my phone when my washing machine/tumble drier are done which means I don't forget to unload/reload them
I also use HA to unify energy sensors (which are then sent into a Victoria Metrics instance) to monitor the energy usage of various things in my house - this has been pretty helpful to identify where I should prioritise trying to save energy.
All of this is done locally/without cloud services and I think I've probably just scratched the surface of what's possible so far - eg I don't have my heating/AC/blinds/curtains integrated into HA so far and I also plan to investigate whether I could usefully adjust the "wake-up time" in my HA setup depending on traffic/public transport status.
All of these things are of course possible manually and my guiding principle has always been that if the HA instance isn't running then nothing should stop working - but the automations do make life a lot more pleasant.
- If I've been out (defined by my phone's wifi connection or alarm arming state) and then come home and turn on the light nearest my front door, all the lights in my house will turn on (at a predefined brightness level according to time of day)
- When I start a TV show/movie/etc on the TV (but only in the evening), the lights in the room where the TV is will dim. If I pause, they get a bit brighter. Switch the TV off and they get fully bright.
- If I'm watching TV or listening to music and get a phone call, the TV/music automatically pauses
- When I leave the house, all the house lights get switched off automatically in case I forgot to switch any off (again based on phone wifi connection and/or alarm arming state - my alarm state is one-way so HA can't control the alarm, only the other way around)
- If someone leaves the bathroom light on for too long, it will automatically switch off
- In the morning, the lights in my bedroom dim up very gradually to help me wake up (with timing and whether it happens linked to my calendar so it happens later at weekends or during school holidays when I don't need to help with the school run)
- I get a notification on my phone when my washing machine/tumble drier are done which means I don't forget to unload/reload them
I also use HA to unify energy sensors (which are then sent into a Victoria Metrics instance) to monitor the energy usage of various things in my house - this has been pretty helpful to identify where I should prioritise trying to save energy.
All of this is done locally/without cloud services and I think I've probably just scratched the surface of what's possible so far - eg I don't have my heating/AC/blinds/curtains integrated into HA so far and I also plan to investigate whether I could usefully adjust the "wake-up time" in my HA setup depending on traffic/public transport status.
All of these things are of course possible manually and my guiding principle has always been that if the HA instance isn't running then nothing should stop working - but the automations do make life a lot more pleasant.
For feature readers: there is a project [1] for Home Assistant that use VictoriaMetrics as long term storage of your Home Assistant monitoring data.
1. https://github.com/fuslwusl/homeassistant-addon-victoriametr...
1. https://github.com/fuslwusl/homeassistant-addon-victoriametr...
got a write-up of it someplace?
The music quiet when phone call thing is particularly attractive. I think I have most of the pieces of it here. HomeAssistant, Owntone, airplay (shairport-sync) speakers, a phone running the HA client.
The music quiet when phone call thing is particularly attractive. I think I have most of the pieces of it here. HomeAssistant, Owntone, airplay (shairport-sync) speakers, a phone running the HA client.
Unfortunately no write-up. But to get music to pause when the phone rings I use the Spotify integration and HA companion app. It's a pretty simple automation - it has one trigger when "Phone state" changes to "ringing", one condition that Spotify is playing, and one action which sets Spotify to paused.
I think the "ringing" state provided by the companion app only works on Android, not iOS though.
OwnTone has an HA integration so I would expect you can do something similar with that.
I think the "ringing" state provided by the companion app only works on Android, not iOS though.
OwnTone has an HA integration so I would expect you can do something similar with that.
Presently loathing an iphone rather than hating an android so i guess I’m out of luck.
HA Owntone integration works very well as does shairport-sync & its mqtt interface. Owntone also does Spotify.
Thanks for your thoughts btw.
HA Owntone integration works very well as does shairport-sync & its mqtt interface. Owntone also does Spotify.
Thanks for your thoughts btw.
To be fair, remote controlled lights can be genuinely useful. The reason the Clapper got popular with the elderly is because people with mobility problems have a hard time reaching switches. In those cases it solves an important problem. I wouldn't mind using it myself, except I think the clapping would be annoying, especially if it misinterprets and doesn't work. So I'm not opposed to eventually using one of the remote controlled lights or plugs the article mentions, but I thankfully have no need for it yet.
Keep in mind, this thread is in reference to a story relayed by the GP whereby an elderly woman lost control of her own lights and wanted to go back to manual switches...
Hey, different strokes for different folks. You do you!
We may be in the minority, you're certainly not alone. I prefer physical, tactile controls, especially for my home and appliances.
And automobile!
> Light switches are within reach when you enter a room.
For multi-entry rooms (many rooms that aren't bedrooms or bathrooms, and even occasionally bedrooms and bathrooms) this is often true of less than all the entrances to the room.
> Once you're inside, you rarely have to touch them again until you exit.
Not all that true if you are in a room with substantial natural light across the day/night transition.
> Don't get me started on the motion sensing lights TFA mentions. I curse the times I've entered a public bathroom that has these, only for the light to go off at the most inopportune moment. Don't want to use a physical switch because of sanitation? That's fine, but cheap and low-power LED lights exist for them to be always on during your service hours. You won't save much having the light turn off, and potentially annoy your customers.
Motion sensing lights with sensors designed to track motion outside of the stalls and a short timer exist specifically to "annoy your customers". Or. more specifically, they exist to discourage activities that involve spending an extended time in the stalls, whether it is various uncouth activities or merely employee malingering. Obviously, that also has adverse impacts on people doing normal bathroom activities that happen to take longer than average times, but that's a tradeoff the people employing these systems have decided is worthwhile.
It is not about energy savings, so arguing against it as unnecessary for energy savings misses the point.
For multi-entry rooms (many rooms that aren't bedrooms or bathrooms, and even occasionally bedrooms and bathrooms) this is often true of less than all the entrances to the room.
> Once you're inside, you rarely have to touch them again until you exit.
Not all that true if you are in a room with substantial natural light across the day/night transition.
> Don't get me started on the motion sensing lights TFA mentions. I curse the times I've entered a public bathroom that has these, only for the light to go off at the most inopportune moment. Don't want to use a physical switch because of sanitation? That's fine, but cheap and low-power LED lights exist for them to be always on during your service hours. You won't save much having the light turn off, and potentially annoy your customers.
Motion sensing lights with sensors designed to track motion outside of the stalls and a short timer exist specifically to "annoy your customers". Or. more specifically, they exist to discourage activities that involve spending an extended time in the stalls, whether it is various uncouth activities or merely employee malingering. Obviously, that also has adverse impacts on people doing normal bathroom activities that happen to take longer than average times, but that's a tradeoff the people employing these systems have decided is worthwhile.
It is not about energy savings, so arguing against it as unnecessary for energy savings misses the point.
I think smart lights may be the equivalent of an Arduino blink-the-LED sketch. Humans like a little bit of control (over your environment/technology) for its own sake.
Speaking of getting old, I've set up a lot of home automation stuff for elderly folks who have to deal with limited mobility. Sometimes getting up and down a few extra times really is a big deal, if possible at all.
One of my clients carries an echo dot with a battery pack with her when she's in her back yard, gardening. She mostly uses it for music, but the ability to drop in/phone call if she falls an can't get up has been a real benefit to her peace of mind.
FYI for the interested, and I admit a data point of one, but tp-link's Kasa stuff have been the most reliable of the smart switches, plugs, and bulbs that I've tried. Never once had an unexpected desync with any of it.
One of my clients carries an echo dot with a battery pack with her when she's in her back yard, gardening. She mostly uses it for music, but the ability to drop in/phone call if she falls an can't get up has been a real benefit to her peace of mind.
FYI for the interested, and I admit a data point of one, but tp-link's Kasa stuff have been the most reliable of the smart switches, plugs, and bulbs that I've tried. Never once had an unexpected desync with any of it.
I thought this until my parents bought an expensive and fancy house. There are dozens of light switches spread all over the walls of the large living areas plus individual lamps and it's a chore to walk around and switch them all off every night or when you leave the house. I can see why automation is attractive for that, and I can see why home automation companies would target owners of fancy houses since they have the most money.
I blame the designers though. The fine grained control is completely unnecessary. If each room had only one circuit for all the lights in the room, controlled by switches at each doorway, that would also fix the problem.
I blame the designers though. The fine grained control is completely unnecessary. If each room had only one circuit for all the lights in the room, controlled by switches at each doorway, that would also fix the problem.
Sure, I can see how automation would be useful in that case. If it ever becomes a problem I need to solve, I'll consider fancy gadgets to help me, but jumping into a complex solution to a nonexistent problem doesn't make sense to me.
I reckon that most of these deployments are done because the owner is a tech geek and enjoys tinkering, and not because of necessity. Which is fine as well, whatever floats your boat.
I reckon that most of these deployments are done because the owner is a tech geek and enjoys tinkering, and not because of necessity. Which is fine as well, whatever floats your boat.
The only reason I have smartbulbs in my house (and not all of my bulbs are smartbulbs) is because I like adjusting them to be orange/red in the evening to signal to my body that it's almost bedtime, and white/blue in the morning to signal to my body that it's time to get up. It really makes a big difference for my quality of sleep, especially in the winter.
And have it simulate sunrise in the morning. Starts at low power red at 6am and over 1 hour gradually increases to max power white. It does wonders to my family's morning routine in winter.
If you get even older you may reach the point where getting out of bed is something you'd only like to do once a day. Hopefully these doodads will be more reliable by then.
>The hell? But people seem to think that Home Assistant is good. (Something about subscription fees and invasive apps and forced obsolescence?) So you search for “how to get a Home Assistant”. This reveals a recursive landscape of terror:
Google "how to install home assistant" which leads to:
>https://www.home-assistant.io/installation/
>If you are unsure of what to choose, follow the Raspberry Pi guide to install Home Assistant Operating System.
This leads to:
>https://www.home-assistant.io/installation/raspberrypi
This has a nice visual guide that requires you to know how to buy a raspberry pi, how to plug in a raspberry p, how to plug in an sd card (twice), and how to navigate to a url.
Google "how to install home assistant" which leads to:
>https://www.home-assistant.io/installation/
>If you are unsure of what to choose, follow the Raspberry Pi guide to install Home Assistant Operating System.
This leads to:
>https://www.home-assistant.io/installation/raspberrypi
This has a nice visual guide that requires you to know how to buy a raspberry pi, how to plug in a raspberry p, how to plug in an sd card (twice), and how to navigate to a url.
>This has a nice visual guide that requires you to know how to buy a raspberry pi, how to plug in a raspberry p, how to plug in an sd card (twice), and how to navigate to a url.
What about upkeep? Sure, installing PopOS is pretty easy if you follow the tutorial, but what happens if you try to install Steam one day and it breaks your desktop environment? Or maybe your sd card accumulates too much writes and corrupts your OS, and you have to diagnose the root cause?
What about upkeep? Sure, installing PopOS is pretty easy if you follow the tutorial, but what happens if you try to install Steam one day and it breaks your desktop environment? Or maybe your sd card accumulates too much writes and corrupts your OS, and you have to diagnose the root cause?
>What about upkeep? Sure, installing PopOS is pretty easy if you follow the tutorial, but what happens if you try to install Steam one day and it breaks your desktop environment?
Huh? I have no idea what you're talking about here.
>Or maybe your sd card accumulates too much writes and corrupts your OS, and you have to diagnose the root cause?
Get a new sd card and reload from the last backup.
Huh? I have no idea what you're talking about here.
>Or maybe your sd card accumulates too much writes and corrupts your OS, and you have to diagnose the root cause?
Get a new sd card and reload from the last backup.
I'm not sure if you realize it, but you're demonstrating exactly the thing described in the blog post.
Why the hell do I need a backup for my light switch?
The first time I installed HomeAssistant (on a Raspberry Pi), it worked great for a couple of months, then it bricked itself because it ran out of log space. I re-installed it. A couple of months later, it auto-updated itself and decided to lock me out because apparently it now required that you log in where it previously didn't. At around the same time, Apple locked out their HomeKit HA integration so I could no longer tell Siri to flip the lights. At that point I just gave up.
Recently I tried reinstalling it again, and let's just say I don't recommend it if you value your sanity.
Every time I look into HA, I face this kind of cognitive dissonance between my experience and people condescendingly telling me that I'm obviously doing something wrong.
I just want a zwave hub for my light switches. I don't want any of this crap.
Why the hell do I need a backup for my light switch?
The first time I installed HomeAssistant (on a Raspberry Pi), it worked great for a couple of months, then it bricked itself because it ran out of log space. I re-installed it. A couple of months later, it auto-updated itself and decided to lock me out because apparently it now required that you log in where it previously didn't. At around the same time, Apple locked out their HomeKit HA integration so I could no longer tell Siri to flip the lights. At that point I just gave up.
Recently I tried reinstalling it again, and let's just say I don't recommend it if you value your sanity.
Every time I look into HA, I face this kind of cognitive dissonance between my experience and people condescendingly telling me that I'm obviously doing something wrong.
I just want a zwave hub for my light switches. I don't want any of this crap.
> you're demonstrating exactly the thing described in the blog post.
exactly. Who wants to backup anything in their house just to be able to do things that work perfectly well with 50's technology?
exactly. Who wants to backup anything in their house just to be able to do things that work perfectly well with 50's technology?
>Huh? I have no idea what you're talking about here.
https://youtu.be/0506yDSgU7M?t=632
>Get a new sd card and reload from the last backup.
1. How do you do backups? Is it built into home assistant? Do you think the average person knows or will remember to make backups?
2. "restore from backups" works if the sdcard just dies. If it's silently corrupting your install and causing weird behavior you won't even know it's sd card's fault unless you go through troubleshooting.
https://youtu.be/0506yDSgU7M?t=632
>Get a new sd card and reload from the last backup.
1. How do you do backups? Is it built into home assistant? Do you think the average person knows or will remember to make backups?
2. "restore from backups" works if the sdcard just dies. If it's silently corrupting your install and causing weird behavior you won't even know it's sd card's fault unless you go through troubleshooting.
I mean, HomeAssistantOS has a GUI in the browser with an upgrade button that appears when there's a new release (which is frequent -- actually my biggest complaint about HA is how fast they move and that I can't configure HA to just install the updates as they arrive, and I have to actually click the button. Horror.)
It performs a backup whenever you perform a release, so if the SD card gets corrupted.. just follow the install instructions a second time and upload the last backup?
That's it for the upkeep, other than dealing with 3rd party APIs that change and make things break, but that's not HomeAssistant's fault.
It performs a backup whenever you perform a release, so if the SD card gets corrupted.. just follow the install instructions a second time and upload the last backup?
That's it for the upkeep, other than dealing with 3rd party APIs that change and make things break, but that's not HomeAssistant's fault.
What are you doing with your Pi where you’re running both HAOS and Steam? Definitely seems like an edge case. Put Debian on the thing stick it on a bookshelf and forget it exists
edit: Actually put HAOS on, no reason to run Debian
edit: Actually put HAOS on, no reason to run Debian
> What are you doing with your Pi where you’re running both HAOS and Steam? Definitely seems like an edge case. Put Debian on the thing stick it on a bookshelf and forget it exists
I'm not saying that's a specific issue you'll run into with home assistant. I'm just pointing out that's an example of something that's simple in theory to set up, but causes headaches if you venture off the happy path.
I'm not saying that's a specific issue you'll run into with home assistant. I'm just pointing out that's an example of something that's simple in theory to set up, but causes headaches if you venture off the happy path.
Got it, makes sense and I definitely agree: with Linux systems the more you deviate from the popular applications and use cases the more elbow grease is required. FWIW I’ve never had difficulty with my DE resulting from running Steam but presumably other people have experienced it. Certainly keeping Proton updated is a massive hassle
> Sure, installing PopOS is pretty easy if you follow the tutorial, but what happens if you try to install Steam one day and it breaks your desktop environment?
I think you're replying to the wrong comment. This was a comment about installing Home Assistant OS, which shouldn't ever be a base for running Steam!
I think you're replying to the wrong comment. This was a comment about installing Home Assistant OS, which shouldn't ever be a base for running Steam!
I don’t touch my Home Assistant. It just works.
I felt like that was a big strawman. HA in particular makes it very easy to chose how to install, they even a product you can buy that's ready to use (HA Yellow).
This is probably for an audience less enamoured with the Pi than the HN crowd. Someone that's more interested in getting to a working result than having to yak shave for a couple days or more to do the same.
For someone who doesn't have a Linux background, "just put it on a Raspberry Pi" is kind of like saying "You write a distributed map reduce function in Erlang". Ie: it's easy if they know it, but if they don't then that "just" is doing a lot of work there.
Pre-installed is almost certainly the way to go for such a person.
For someone who doesn't have a Linux background, "just put it on a Raspberry Pi" is kind of like saying "You write a distributed map reduce function in Erlang". Ie: it's easy if they know it, but if they don't then that "just" is doing a lot of work there.
Pre-installed is almost certainly the way to go for such a person.
When it comes to Home Assistant, the Pi is actually a much more pragmatic option.
It works out of the box, is very easy to source (hell some brick & mortar stores sell them), has very good Linux support due to its popularity, and makes up a large part of the install base meaning HA support for it is unlikely to get deprecated.
It works out of the box, is very easy to source (hell some brick & mortar stores sell them), has very good Linux support due to its popularity, and makes up a large part of the install base meaning HA support for it is unlikely to get deprecated.
Right, but the fact that running it on a Pi with Linux is the "much more pragmatic solution" is already ruling out about 90% of the US.
Keep in mind that Home Assistant provides ready-made images that behave like an appliance and can auto-update. In fact, it doesn't even give you a shell/SSH by default and such access is discouraged.
Thus the Linux/RaspberryPi underlying complexity is irrelevant to the user - the "complexity" is to dd/BalenaEtcher/etc a downloaded file to an SD card, put the card in the Pi and connect it to power. From there it's available over the network and can be configured through a web browser.
Thus the Linux/RaspberryPi underlying complexity is irrelevant to the user - the "complexity" is to dd/BalenaEtcher/etc a downloaded file to an SD card, put the card in the Pi and connect it to power. From there it's available over the network and can be configured through a web browser.
> is very easy to source
I was with you until this point. A Pi hasn't been easy to source for almost 4 years now.
I was with you until this point. A Pi hasn't been easy to source for almost 4 years now.
As reasonable as that is, the starting point for this is a person that wants to install smart switches and other home automations.
This is already a job that requires fairly decent electrical knowledge, especially if there are 3-way switches involved.
Turn-key solutions exist for people that don't want to deal with the complexity.
This is already a job that requires fairly decent electrical knowledge, especially if there are 3-way switches involved.
Turn-key solutions exist for people that don't want to deal with the complexity.
I purchased a home assistant yellow and my experience was anything but “ready to use”.
You have to build the damn thing, which isn’t hard per se since it’s ultimately only 3 actual components, but it still took me some time and felt complicated since it involves attaching a heat sink with thermal compound on a CPU.
And then the software install process isn’t totally amazing either since it involves flashing a USB stick, but also needing to choose a few very non-obvious options.
Should I install HA on the EMMC and later move my data-disk to the nVME drive or install the OS on the nVME drive directly? Google random forums to find out what people think of this decision first I guess.
I mean I think it’s still a good product, don’t get me wrong, but it is still very much a power user thing.
Which is probably fine because setting up HA itself when you have an install isn’t exactly a picnic either.
You have to build the damn thing, which isn’t hard per se since it’s ultimately only 3 actual components, but it still took me some time and felt complicated since it involves attaching a heat sink with thermal compound on a CPU.
And then the software install process isn’t totally amazing either since it involves flashing a USB stick, but also needing to choose a few very non-obvious options.
Should I install HA on the EMMC and later move my data-disk to the nVME drive or install the OS on the nVME drive directly? Google random forums to find out what people think of this decision first I guess.
I mean I think it’s still a good product, don’t get me wrong, but it is still very much a power user thing.
Which is probably fine because setting up HA itself when you have an install isn’t exactly a picnic either.
I don't know if it's changed but I felt like a super genius a few years ago when I finally got my HA up and running on a pi, and I'm a linux person and former system admin. There's Home Assistant and Home Assistant Core, Docker or not Docker, install HACS or don't. Some things don't seem to work unless you're on a Docker container but then it's a pain to ssh in and find folders to install stuff. I really hope it's better now as my HA install has mysteriously died and I haven't had the heart to dig in and see what the issue is so I'm guessing I'm going to have to start from scratch.
> HA in particular makes it very easy to chose how to install
This is the problem with lots of stuff similar to HA when it tries to break into a non-enthusiast audience: people don't WANT to choose how to install it. Most of the time they have no clue why they would choose one thing over another and giving them those choices is confusing and overwhelming.
It's like starting a an intro to Nix tutorial with by asking if the user wants to enable flakes.
I say this as a very active user of HA & Nix for 5+ years.
This is the problem with lots of stuff similar to HA when it tries to break into a non-enthusiast audience: people don't WANT to choose how to install it. Most of the time they have no clue why they would choose one thing over another and giving them those choices is confusing and overwhelming.
It's like starting a an intro to Nix tutorial with by asking if the user wants to enable flakes.
I say this as a very active user of HA & Nix for 5+ years.
With HA it doesn't help that their installation docs are a mess with solutions that don't provide the same features.
I've had HA for +4-5 years too.
I've had HA for +4-5 years too.
HA is similar to self-managed Kubernetes: easy to install, a bitch to maintain. Updates seem to constantly break services and configurations.
I googled "how to install home assistant", and the links you point to above don't appear to be anywhere on the first page of results.
The second link is this one: https://community.home-assistant.io/t/guide-how-to-install-h...
But the linked page is pretty complex.
The second link is this one: https://community.home-assistant.io/t/guide-how-to-install-h...
But the linked page is pretty complex.
That result does not show up for me when I google it and the other one is the top result for me.
If someone can come up with a reason why top results aren't even present on others' page 1, I would be very interested.
If someone can come up with a reason why top results aren't even present on others' page 1, I would be very interested.
Google "personalizes" search results.
This is not an explanation. I am aware the search results can be different to different people and based on demographic information.
My specific question is why would a top result not even end up on the first page. This requires a more significant explanation than "its possible".
My specific question is why would a top result not even end up on the first page. This requires a more significant explanation than "its possible".
> I am aware the search results can be different to different people and based on demographic information.
You answered yourself. If you are are searching zoos and cute animals more often than programming stuff, "python egg" will return dramatically different results. This is not a theoretic possibility, it is the way google works (which I think is unfortunate).
You answered yourself. If you are are searching zoos and cute animals more often than programming stuff, "python egg" will return dramatically different results. This is not a theoretic possibility, it is the way google works (which I think is unfortunate).
What a time to be alive
The scare quotes are disingenuous. However we may dislike or disapprove of Google's algorithms, it is absolutely accurate to describe the results as personalized.
They individualize search results: they give different results to different people.
They don't personalize search results: they don't give people results which are optimal for the searcher, but rather those which attempt to be optimal for the advertisers without discouraging the searcher enough to swap search engines.
They don't personalize search results: they don't give people results which are optimal for the searcher, but rather those which attempt to be optimal for the advertisers without discouraging the searcher enough to swap search engines.
Incorrectly titled. The "smart" devices from the first part of the article ARE the midwit solution. The better devices in the rest of the article are the actual right-end-of-the-bell-curve solutions.
Indeed. Wanting things to be dead simple and not need to be fiddled with constantly and take months to learn how to set up is the big brained move. Same reason I switched to an iPhone. I don't have time to nerd out and customize Android till it's usable.
Same reason I picked Android. I can just plug in my headphones and they're already working without any pairing or configuration or charging.
> MongoChopper only works in reticulated mode, which newer Qetzl hubs don’t support.
False! Just use skubenjoyer64's modded wetware, which supports most reticulated mode variants. Just set LD_SIDELOAD to your device's beacon adapter address at decompile time, assuming you have Qetzl Hub 3.9 rev 5 or later.
False! Just use skubenjoyer64's modded wetware, which supports most reticulated mode variants. Just set LD_SIDELOAD to your device's beacon adapter address at decompile time, assuming you have Qetzl Hub 3.9 rev 5 or later.
Honestly I stopped reading the article when he had the audacity to skip over modded Qetzl hub solutions
This thread is peak satire. This thread is satire right?
These are the big brains right here, folks.
My own experience , half the time Nest tells me it can't find the lights to turn them on or off.
I have somehow automated some lights to come on too early in the morning but the specific task/automation I set to do this is nowhere to be found.. I can create and remove new tasks but I'm being haunted by this old task.
My father has most of his home setup. Worked great until Christmas eve, when lightning hit the local exchange..
I have somehow automated some lights to come on too early in the morning but the specific task/automation I set to do this is nowhere to be found.. I can create and remove new tasks but I'm being haunted by this old task.
My father has most of his home setup. Worked great until Christmas eve, when lightning hit the local exchange..
>some lights to come on too early in the morning but the specific task/automation I set to do this is nowhere to be found..
What a novel form of nightmare
What a novel form of nightmare
"Wakey, wakey, little matey!"
Hook it up to an speech recognition-challenged "smart" speaker that will dutifully play death metal when you order it to turn off the damn lights for teh win.
Hook it up to an speech recognition-challenged "smart" speaker that will dutifully play death metal when you order it to turn off the damn lights for teh win.
I set one up to play "Christmas everyday" when I say "Hey google, it's Christmas"
The only problem is it still announcing "playing Christmas everyday on YouTube music by..." I wanted it to just start playing.
The only problem is it still announcing "playing Christmas everyday on YouTube music by..." I wanted it to just start playing.
At least it recognized the command instead of replying "No, it is in fact October 12, 2023. Please check your settings in your Google Home app. Would you like me to send a link to your phone?"
I swear it behaves more like Clippy every day.
I swear it behaves more like Clippy every day.
Some light-switches have the "smarts" to turn on and off at certain times, built right into them. Therefore, you might lose access to the external tool you used to program them, and they'll happily continue on repeating the behaviors. You might try a hard reset, often using a paperclip to depress a microswitch though a small hole on the light switch itself.
I'll try that later :)
I recently picked up this rabbit hole of a hobby. It's only when you want to get fancy, and have lots of mismatched stuff, that it gets that complicated. (Which, as nerds, we are wont to do.) If you just buy into one brands stuff, and use just that, you don't get lost in the home assistant quagmire. There are quirks, eg Phillips Hue has a 50 device limit per hub resulting in needing multiple hubs for a complex scene, but it works for people who aren't programmers.
Meanwhile, as a hardware hacker and software engineer, yeah, I'll admit, I had to do things that look a lot like my job I'm paid very well to do in order to get my light switches to work right. No idea how people who don't program for a living are supposed to get Home Assistant to work quite right!
Meanwhile, as a hardware hacker and software engineer, yeah, I'll admit, I had to do things that look a lot like my job I'm paid very well to do in order to get my light switches to work right. No idea how people who don't program for a living are supposed to get Home Assistant to work quite right!
The author seems unfamiliar with Radio Shack's Plug 'n Power, which was first introduced in 1979.
>The modules were designed to respond to commands sent over the electrical wires inside the house. They could turn on or off, or in the case of a lamp, change brightness. The advantage of using a power-line communication system was that it didn’t require any additional (and costly) signal wiring.
http://www.trs-80.org/plug-n-power/
>The modules were designed to respond to commands sent over the electrical wires inside the house. They could turn on or off, or in the case of a lamp, change brightness. The advantage of using a power-line communication system was that it didn’t require any additional (and costly) signal wiring.
http://www.trs-80.org/plug-n-power/
The "recursive landscape of terror" doesn't stop once you install Home Assistant, it continues during maintenance. And at that point you're dependent on it to run the systems in your house. Thus I recently decided to get rid of my whole setup and go back to normal.
Further, the tinkering aspect isn't enjoyable to me because I don't feel like I'm learning anything useful, I'm just trying to duct tape together other people's hobby projects that adds support for this or that bulb or radio.
Further, the tinkering aspect isn't enjoyable to me because I don't feel like I'm learning anything useful, I'm just trying to duct tape together other people's hobby projects that adds support for this or that bulb or radio.
I dream of setting up my home automation as if it was a starship. It doesn't have to look like one, but it should operate like one.
First, it'd be self-contained, so devices don't need to dial back up to a cloud server in order to change settings. Who's ever heard of a starship that dials back to Starfleet headquarters to open a door?
HVAC, water heater, and water softener would be "life support". The garage would be the shuttle bay. External cameras tracking people, cars, and planes that fly overhead would be the Sensor Array. Since houses don't move, you could say there's no engineering. But if I had a power generation system like a solar panel, we'll just make that engineering. I'd be able to "redirect power" when we have a heat wave. Each system would have an API that reports stats that you can culminate into a daily dashboard displayed on your bathroom mirror. Of course, the Alexas would be "computer", and a lounge dedicated to AR/VR would be the "Holodeck".
I imagine that's what most people have in their heads, but we get lost in the weeds. In reality, I haven't done much home automation myself. Just a few lights, ecobee thermostat, and alexa that I don't use.
Having to pull out my phone just to control these things is often too much friction. Asking Alexa to do it is rather nice, but I'm not thrilled about the prospect of a company listening in (rumored to anyway). If you set it to turn off by geolocation or by time, there are edge cases that you often run into where you don't want to turn them off.
I had set the lights to turn off when I left my apartment. My roommates were all sitting the living room, and I left to go grab some milk, and the lights all turned off on them when I left, and they were perplexed.
I even mystified myself. Sometimes, in the mornings, I would wake up and the lights would be blue, and I wouldn't know why. But in fact, I had just forgotten I'd set up an IFTTT automation to turn the lights blue if it was going to be rainy day. I had just completely forgotten this and never could make out the pattern and association.
One of the problems with home automation is that the settings are hidden and not readily observable. All the problems that we have in our programming lives with observability of our production systems, we want to bring to home.
First, it'd be self-contained, so devices don't need to dial back up to a cloud server in order to change settings. Who's ever heard of a starship that dials back to Starfleet headquarters to open a door?
HVAC, water heater, and water softener would be "life support". The garage would be the shuttle bay. External cameras tracking people, cars, and planes that fly overhead would be the Sensor Array. Since houses don't move, you could say there's no engineering. But if I had a power generation system like a solar panel, we'll just make that engineering. I'd be able to "redirect power" when we have a heat wave. Each system would have an API that reports stats that you can culminate into a daily dashboard displayed on your bathroom mirror. Of course, the Alexas would be "computer", and a lounge dedicated to AR/VR would be the "Holodeck".
I imagine that's what most people have in their heads, but we get lost in the weeds. In reality, I haven't done much home automation myself. Just a few lights, ecobee thermostat, and alexa that I don't use.
Having to pull out my phone just to control these things is often too much friction. Asking Alexa to do it is rather nice, but I'm not thrilled about the prospect of a company listening in (rumored to anyway). If you set it to turn off by geolocation or by time, there are edge cases that you often run into where you don't want to turn them off.
I had set the lights to turn off when I left my apartment. My roommates were all sitting the living room, and I left to go grab some milk, and the lights all turned off on them when I left, and they were perplexed.
I even mystified myself. Sometimes, in the mornings, I would wake up and the lights would be blue, and I wouldn't know why. But in fact, I had just forgotten I'd set up an IFTTT automation to turn the lights blue if it was going to be rainy day. I had just completely forgotten this and never could make out the pattern and association.
One of the problems with home automation is that the settings are hidden and not readily observable. All the problems that we have in our programming lives with observability of our production systems, we want to bring to home.
> Remote-controlled light bulbs. Personally, I’d never buy these, because I’m fanatical about color quality. (It’s futile to start with low-quality photons and then try to arrange matter to make them look good.)
I am about to buy several Philips Hue lights. Does this statement apply to all LED-based lights or just the cheap ones?
I am about to buy several Philips Hue lights. Does this statement apply to all LED-based lights or just the cheap ones?
I recommend getting 1600 lumens if you can find it. 800 isn't bright enough in my experience, at least for room lighting. Maybe desk/ambient lighting
The Hue lights are wildly overpriced. I have the WiZ A67 Wi-Fi for my office (so I only use the warm white and cool white) and it's much brighter than Hue's offering, which is so valuable in an office. I can also switch its setting using a normal light switch so I never need to open the app.
If you're playing with colours, then Hue usually does do better in the blues, greens and purples but it probably isn't going to make much of a difference to your life.
If you're playing with colours, then Hue usually does do better in the blues, greens and purples but it probably isn't going to make much of a difference to your life.
Will check them out, although Philips Hue also offers an E27 bulb with 1,600 lumen, same as the WiZ, but a bit pricier.
Philips LED lights, Hue or otherwise, are wonderful. Be aware though that they seem to be enshitifying the Hue ecosystem https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37667266
Hue bulbs should work with any ZigBee LightLink controller. Or if they don't, I'll be very upset about the times I flew out to the LightLink gatherings to make sure all our products worked together.
If you want the numbers, there's always https://lamptest.ru/
Definitely saved this article as a guide.
But in terms of light switches, specifically - is there not a simpler way to turn lights on and off while keeping the physical wall switches as the fundamental source of truth?
I’m thinking of a traditional physical switch that has been enhanced with an electromagnetic component that can actually physically flip that switch. A separate control line from each switch in the house goes to a separate controlling computer in the basement. This computer can then interface with Bluetooth remotes or apps on smartphones or anything else that is needed, including having its own internal scheduler for turning lights on or off, or connected to ambient light sensors near windows that could trigger threshold settings to do the same.
That way, no matter how you set up your basement controller, you can always go over to the wall and turn the lights on or off if you need so. And if you are going to bed, bringing up the app can tell you if you’ve left the garage lights on, so you can remotely turn them off.
And when you remotely turn these switches on or off, the in-wall light switch will actually be physically moved to its desired position via the electromagnet being triggered.
Granted, this is something that is really only doable during a new build or a frame-off rebuild of a home (I’m doing the latter and would love to implement this idea), but the point being: this would be a largely obsolescence-proof, dummy-proof and robust/reliable way of automating a home while leaving the physical switches themselves as the ultimate source of truth: flipping the physical switch will _always_ do what is expected it will do, and the switch will always be in the position expected for the light’s current state.
But in terms of light switches, specifically - is there not a simpler way to turn lights on and off while keeping the physical wall switches as the fundamental source of truth?
I’m thinking of a traditional physical switch that has been enhanced with an electromagnetic component that can actually physically flip that switch. A separate control line from each switch in the house goes to a separate controlling computer in the basement. This computer can then interface with Bluetooth remotes or apps on smartphones or anything else that is needed, including having its own internal scheduler for turning lights on or off, or connected to ambient light sensors near windows that could trigger threshold settings to do the same.
That way, no matter how you set up your basement controller, you can always go over to the wall and turn the lights on or off if you need so. And if you are going to bed, bringing up the app can tell you if you’ve left the garage lights on, so you can remotely turn them off.
And when you remotely turn these switches on or off, the in-wall light switch will actually be physically moved to its desired position via the electromagnet being triggered.
Granted, this is something that is really only doable during a new build or a frame-off rebuild of a home (I’m doing the latter and would love to implement this idea), but the point being: this would be a largely obsolescence-proof, dummy-proof and robust/reliable way of automating a home while leaving the physical switches themselves as the ultimate source of truth: flipping the physical switch will _always_ do what is expected it will do, and the switch will always be in the position expected for the light’s current state.
Shelly devices can do this. You install it in parallel to the light switch.
That way both can turn on the power to the light independently without interfering with each other.
They don't physically move the switches though, but that's pretty rarely needed.
That way both can turn on the power to the light independently without interfering with each other.
They don't physically move the switches though, but that's pretty rarely needed.
Zigbee light switch that fits over existing physical light switch, https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37861815
1. Wear biometrics to help track and improve health and fitness.
2. Buy smart home products so you don't have to get up off the couch, walk 10 feet, and flip a switch.
Does anyone else enjoy the irony? Disclosure: I am guilty of both of the above.
2. Buy smart home products so you don't have to get up off the couch, walk 10 feet, and flip a switch.
Does anyone else enjoy the irony? Disclosure: I am guilty of both of the above.
Definitely enjoying that irony, although the smart home products came first for me.
Re. #2, I like the peace of mind that I haven't left lights on when I head out of town and also the security benefit of programming them to periodically turn on.
Also, if you only have a single switch to flip, then I envy you.
Re. #2, I like the peace of mind that I haven't left lights on when I head out of town and also the security benefit of programming them to periodically turn on.
Also, if you only have a single switch to flip, then I envy you.
I don't have either, but my fat butt needs to move more, so smart home things aren't interesting to me.
I put a bunch of smart light switches in my house about 5 years ago. Two of them have failed in the past year and I reverted them back to dumb switches. I'll probably do the same as they continue to fail over time. I found I rarely use the smart features to their full potential. It helps that my house is built to all the modern codes, so I have switches at convenient places and really only use the "smarts" for table lamps and outdoor lighting.
I think it's worth taking a look back at X10 [0], the OG home automation.
Yes, it was primitive by today's standards with a very limited command set, but that command set was good enough for 90% of purposes and its simplicity meant that it was trivial to implement correctly and everything interoperated.
It didn't need an internet connection to function. It didn't even need a local server. Though you could have a programmable controller, the minimum viable setup consisted of having some X10-enabled device (such as a light socket), an X10 switch, and setting some DIP switches as configuration.
[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X10_(industry_standard)
Yes, it was primitive by today's standards with a very limited command set, but that command set was good enough for 90% of purposes and its simplicity meant that it was trivial to implement correctly and everything interoperated.
It didn't need an internet connection to function. It didn't even need a local server. Though you could have a programmable controller, the minimum viable setup consisted of having some X10-enabled device (such as a light socket), an X10 switch, and setting some DIP switches as configuration.
[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X10_(industry_standard)
Amen to that. 70s tech that just worked. I've got boxes of X10 switches, motion sensors, and modules that I don't use anymore because Home Assistant doesn't support it well. I miss it.
It was simple, with some small issues.
If you wanted to kick it up a notch you could run a Mister House server connecting to the powerline through a $15 Radio Shack module.
It was simple, with some small issues.
If you wanted to kick it up a notch you could run a Mister House server connecting to the powerline through a $15 Radio Shack module.
IoT was always a bad vision for the future. 20 years from now I don't want a million devices in my home running software. Either they'll all constantly be pestering me with updates that break functionality I rely on, or they'll be out of date with bugs and security holes that last forever.
My vision of a good future is one where I have exactly one smart device: a robot butler which will operate all my other devices. I don't need smart switches if my butler turns off all the lights for me. I don't need a smart lock if the butler unlocks the door for me. I don't need a security webcam if the butler monitors the house while I'm away. I don't need a smart thermostat if the butler sets it for me. Etc.
My vision of a good future is one where I have exactly one smart device: a robot butler which will operate all my other devices. I don't need smart switches if my butler turns off all the lights for me. I don't need a smart lock if the butler unlocks the door for me. I don't need a security webcam if the butler monitors the house while I'm away. I don't need a smart thermostat if the butler sets it for me. Etc.
I am a fan of Ikea lights.
I can use normal light switches to turn the light on/off.
But I also have a remote and I can dim the lights or change the temperature.
No hub needed. The price is low enough.
And Ikea will probably stay in business a long time.
Buying their hub enables you to use an app on your phone to control the lights, if you so desire.
You can do the same with Philips Hue.
And just like the Ikea one, it's just a bit better with the hub.
And just like the Ikea one, it's just a bit better with the hub.
And the best thing is that they speak zigbee and you can ditch their hubs and use homeassistant if you want to avoid any lock-in!
I've actually had two Ikea Trådfri switches break though - they are cheap enough to replace but bit bothersome.
I've actually had two Ikea Trådfri switches break though - they are cheap enough to replace but bit bothersome.
And in the future they'll all speak Thread and be mostly hub agnostic
Home Assistant is awesome, but not ready for the mass-market. It's a fun tech project to setup and one that will require your attention regularly forever-- but on the bright side, it isn't constantly annoying, it works consistently, and it can all work locally so when some Chinese vendor shuts down their servers you aren't left sitting in a dark room.
It's improving at a rapid pace and I can see it being ready for your aunt to use in a couple of years. Not this year, not next.
I set all my relatives up with Apple HomePod Minis and HomeKit, which has expensive hardware (matter is supposed to fix that...) but is largely local and relatively private.
It's improving at a rapid pace and I can see it being ready for your aunt to use in a couple of years. Not this year, not next.
I set all my relatives up with Apple HomePod Minis and HomeKit, which has expensive hardware (matter is supposed to fix that...) but is largely local and relatively private.
> I want a variant that works like this: If the power is quickly turned off and on again, the outlet switches from powered to unpowered (or vice-versa).
> It’s funny because incandescent three-way bulbs and switches used to be very common. Now that everything is LED you need a complicated timer system to achieve the same result.
Or just a dimmable LED bulb in an existing 3-way fixture.
Or just a dimmable LED bulb in an existing 3-way fixture.
Dimmable bulbs and 3-way lamps are not compatible: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/3-way_lamp. The electrical principles are not the same —- a three way bulb has a different socket contact configuration to accept different wattages at each of the three levels. Supposedly LED 3 way bulbs exist but I’ve never seen one in the wild.
....and a little label next to the switch so you know it's got a sceneswitch bulb.
I first learned about these from the author of 'calm technology' https://calmtech.com/
I first learned about these from the author of 'calm technology' https://calmtech.com/
I was already running home server, so for me, setting up smart home was relatively simple:
- Buy Zigbee USB dongle - Install Home Assistant and Zigbee2MQTT in Docker on server - Initial configuration
It requires basic technical knowledge, but after initial configuration it just works.
There were three major pains:
- Configuring camera (ONVIF is pure pain) - it works initially, but I physically plug-in cameras only when I'm going on holiday - Configuring voice assistant - Finding good ZigBee remotes - Price of Hue Wall Switch (DIY approach is possible by gutting cheap button)
Cameras and voice assistant troubles were arguably result of my "keep as much as possible within local network" approach.
Minor pains:
- Binding remotes to light bulbs, so they work even if server is down - Finding instructions how to bind certain ZigBee accessories (they have "just open our proprietary app and it will explain what to do" manual)
- Buy Zigbee USB dongle - Install Home Assistant and Zigbee2MQTT in Docker on server - Initial configuration
It requires basic technical knowledge, but after initial configuration it just works.
There were three major pains:
- Configuring camera (ONVIF is pure pain) - it works initially, but I physically plug-in cameras only when I'm going on holiday - Configuring voice assistant - Finding good ZigBee remotes - Price of Hue Wall Switch (DIY approach is possible by gutting cheap button)
Cameras and voice assistant troubles were arguably result of my "keep as much as possible within local network" approach.
Minor pains:
- Binding remotes to light bulbs, so they work even if server is down - Finding instructions how to bind certain ZigBee accessories (they have "just open our proprietary app and it will explain what to do" manual)
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That's why I like Shelly. The stuff connects via WiFi. The protocol is MQTT or REST. Stuff I know and can understand.
I installed yale smart locks which work with Nest.
After going through a bunch of pain getting it to initially work, I would go away from anything smart device at all, except for maybe an electric code lock that isn't networked.
It's convenient to not have to always have my keys on me, and I got used to the tech after my previous apartment installed a similar device, but it randomly fails. Or randomly makes me log in to google again (and I have basically only minimal google usage now, no email by them). Or randomly fails when I'm 300 feet away from the house and trying to unlock.
But, at one point I was considering installing a compatible device for the thermostat. It has lost the appeal to me, and the nearly intractable software interface to deal with problems was a big part of it. Getting a second lock up and running took a bunch of arcane knowledge.
After going through a bunch of pain getting it to initially work, I would go away from anything smart device at all, except for maybe an electric code lock that isn't networked.
It's convenient to not have to always have my keys on me, and I got used to the tech after my previous apartment installed a similar device, but it randomly fails. Or randomly makes me log in to google again (and I have basically only minimal google usage now, no email by them). Or randomly fails when I'm 300 feet away from the house and trying to unlock.
But, at one point I was considering installing a compatible device for the thermostat. It has lost the appeal to me, and the nearly intractable software interface to deal with problems was a big part of it. Getting a second lock up and running took a bunch of arcane knowledge.
There's a bias where most of the content is produced by the most hardcore group of people. This is, of course, no different with home automation. You can do Home Assistant without making it your hobby, it's just that most of the posts you see are from people who are way too deep into it.
Exactly. I have my lights tied into Home Assistant to turn on/off when a room is occupied for couple of rooms and a wakeup routine for the bedroom tied to the alarm on my phone (lights mimic a sunrise 30 mins before the alarm).
I also have a couple of convenience automations like turning off the TV if it's been idle for X minutes (I've probably fallen asleep).
I've found they are mostly set and forget. Haven't touched it for about a year and don't plan to touch them any time soon.
I also have a couple of convenience automations like turning off the TV if it's been idle for X minutes (I've probably fallen asleep).
I've found they are mostly set and forget. Haven't touched it for about a year and don't plan to touch them any time soon.
The most important mid-wit home automation tool is the programmable thermostat, which curiously isn't mentioned. That will have more impact on energy use and quality of life than anything else. No remote control, no wifi needed. Just turns heat on in the morning and turns it off when things warm up, and turns the temperature setpoints lower overnight. In comparison with heat, LED light automation doesn't matter so much. For example, this one:
https://www.honeywellhome.com/us/en/products/air/thermostats...
https://www.honeywellhome.com/us/en/products/air/thermostats...
My house came with the doorbell wires buried behind the frame somewhere, so I installed a self-powered wireless doorbell. The transmitter harvests power from the user physically pressing the button, so it doesn't need batteries. I just caulked it straight onto the brick.
Do you have a link to that doorbell product?
My house came with the same problem.
https://tecknet.com/collections/wireless-doorbell/products/s...
I removed the TECKNET logo with isopropyl alcohol.
The receiver has dozens of tunes, but the only one worth using is the Westminster Chime Melody. There's also a "ding-dong ding-dong", but it's annoying that it plays twice. The rest are just too long; it's a doorbell, not a jukebox.
The receiver remembers the tune and volume if power is interrupted, so that extra cruft doesn't matter after initial setup.
I removed the TECKNET logo with isopropyl alcohol.
The receiver has dozens of tunes, but the only one worth using is the Westminster Chime Melody. There's also a "ding-dong ding-dong", but it's annoying that it plays twice. The rest are just too long; it's a doorbell, not a jukebox.
The receiver remembers the tune and volume if power is interrupted, so that extra cruft doesn't matter after initial setup.
I love this! Sometimes I daydream about a device that works kind of like an old printing press. You can arrange letter tiles to create a message. Then, you power the thing by pumping a lever or something, and it constructs a digital signal from the letters and sends it over something like LoRaWAN.
I need to choose outlets and switches for a new building, and I hope to "smart home" it. I had started to do some reading, and while my experience wasn't _quite_ as gruesome as the author of this article portrays it to be, I generally agree with their sentiments.
Still, I'm not quite ready to give up on computer-controlled automation.
Does anyone know of a reasonably complete guide (web site, book, whatever) that explains this well? What I'm looking for: help choosing components that will work together; not "for dummies"; I'm technically competent and willing to learn some stuff but don't want to make a hobby/profession out of this; doesn't require buying into Google Home, Alexa, or another privacy-hostile system.
Thanks in advance.
Still, I'm not quite ready to give up on computer-controlled automation.
Does anyone know of a reasonably complete guide (web site, book, whatever) that explains this well? What I'm looking for: help choosing components that will work together; not "for dummies"; I'm technically competent and willing to learn some stuff but don't want to make a hobby/profession out of this; doesn't require buying into Google Home, Alexa, or another privacy-hostile system.
Thanks in advance.
Just go with Philips Hue, you can't go wrong.
Then, when you're ready, setup home assistant but setup everything so basic functionality still works even if your server or internet went down.
My hue bulbs are at the center of this strategy with each bulb controlled by either a remote control or a hue movement detector. Hint: remote controls in rooms where you stay, sensors where you pass by or if you stay only a little while.
I can also control everything via Alexa and can't wait for the day there is a viable privacy-friendly / low-maintenance alternative (Home assistant are working on this). Again, if internet goes down, I still have the remotes/detectors so my lights always work.
Also, for any other equipment you would buy, make sure it's compatible with Matter.
Then, when you're ready, setup home assistant but setup everything so basic functionality still works even if your server or internet went down.
My hue bulbs are at the center of this strategy with each bulb controlled by either a remote control or a hue movement detector. Hint: remote controls in rooms where you stay, sensors where you pass by or if you stay only a little while.
I can also control everything via Alexa and can't wait for the day there is a viable privacy-friendly / low-maintenance alternative (Home assistant are working on this). Again, if internet goes down, I still have the remotes/detectors so my lights always work.
Also, for any other equipment you would buy, make sure it's compatible with Matter.
Smart bulbs are the gateway drug to home automation, but they soon reveal themselves as a bad idea, at least if not coupled with a smart switch.
Think about this: if you have a smart bulb, but your light switch is off, there's no way to turn on that light. At the same time, if your bulb "state" is off, your light switch won't be able to turn it on.
You could JUST pair a smart bulb with a smart switch, and align their states. Or skip smart bulbs altogether and make the switches smart - using Lutron Caseta or an equivalent solution.
Think about this: if you have a smart bulb, but your light switch is off, there's no way to turn on that light. At the same time, if your bulb "state" is off, your light switch won't be able to turn it on.
You could JUST pair a smart bulb with a smart switch, and align their states. Or skip smart bulbs altogether and make the switches smart - using Lutron Caseta or an equivalent solution.
Hue smart bulbs, by default (you can change this), will always turn back on after power loss/restoration. If it's off and you have a switch, you just toggle it twice and the light comes on.
I've found Hue bulbs to be one of the best purchases I've made. Being able to adjust color temperature and brightness arbitrarily does wonders for my circadian rhythm.
IKEA bulbs (Zigbee compatible) always turn on when you turn the dumb light switch on, no matter how you turn them off.
I wired together all the cables behind the switches in my home and covered them with smart switches
Hue just decided to start requiring an online account even for local control; I used to think they were the best option, but now I'd recommend avoiding them (even if you don't care about a needless account, consider that this most likely is step 1 to adding fees)
I honestly never understood why people even bothered using the official Hue bridge when Zigbee light link is an open standard with tons of both open and proprietary alternatives available.
Just take your existing hue bulbs elsewhere
Just take your existing hue bulbs elsewhere
Oh, sure, the bulbs are still good, I just don't recommend buying into the whole system
If you have access to it in your area, consider looking into KNX for home automation and DALI for lighting. Both are BUS systems that you wire throughout your house, and they are very reliable. They are commonly used in hotels, schools, etc. It might be a bit more expensive and require pre-planning, but these systems have been around for decades in Europe. Plus, you'll be adhering to a standard, not bound to a specific company
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Smart home is not about just turn on/off lights remotely. It's about do it automatically/reponding to other interactions.
i.e, when sunlight is out (in HA, you can get sunset triggers), and when there are people present in living room, turn on living room lights.
i.e, when sunlight is out (in HA, you can get sunset triggers), and when there are people present in living room, turn on living room lights.
Or "when the only occupant opens the front door and drops off the network, turn off all lights, arm the alarm, turn off the stereo, and yell at me if the cooktop is drawing power".
> and yell at me if the cooktop is drawing power
For standard power outlets I have "smart plugs" that measure the power draw, are there ones that support 40A/240V appliances?
For standard power outlets I have "smart plugs" that measure the power draw, are there ones that support 40A/240V appliances?
I'm a zigbee fan, mostly because there's such a wide variety of devices.
I almost exlusively use zigbee2mqtt [0] reference to find devices that suit me. Searching for `meter` gives a lot of options, you'd have to do more investigation to find something that supported 40A, but my guess would be that a clamp meter is likely your best option.
It's also possible that you could use one of the DIN rail options in your fusebox, but I haven't looked at the current ratings.
[0] https://www.zigbee2mqtt.io/supported-devices/#s=meter
I almost exlusively use zigbee2mqtt [0] reference to find devices that suit me. Searching for `meter` gives a lot of options, you'd have to do more investigation to find something that supported 40A, but my guess would be that a clamp meter is likely your best option.
It's also possible that you could use one of the DIN rail options in your fusebox, but I haven't looked at the current ratings.
[0] https://www.zigbee2mqtt.io/supported-devices/#s=meter
You're gonna need power meters for that.
E.g. check out the Shelly *EM series.
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I wrote a little script for my homebrew ESPHome-controlled CW/WW LED strip to automatically control color temperature based on if and where the sun is in the sky. Warm-only when the sun is down, mix of warm and cool when the sun is up with peak coolness at solar noon.
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This is a cool approach to an article about home automation. But for me, not only do I refuse to automate things via networking computers together, I won't buy a product that requires me to have a new remote control either. I'm open to things like lights with motion sensors that turn on when I enter the room, but whatever marginal convenience I get from automation would be outweighed by the absurdity of having 25 different, dedicated remote controls to keep track of.
Another peeve is that every G-D home device now feels like it needs an LED light that is on all the time. My view is that it should be dark when the lights turn off, but that's hard to these days.
Another peeve is that every G-D home device now feels like it needs an LED light that is on all the time. My view is that it should be dark when the lights turn off, but that's hard to these days.
I love this category of product and use them extensively around my small NYC apartment. Moving fairly often and valuing privacy, it is delightful to not muck around with extra networking and internet of shit. I always wonder why the category doesn't get more love, like a nod from the wirecutter, or a big brand trying to make a slightly uscale line with a consistent deisgn language.
One thing I'd love to buy is a purely offline outlet control that can listen for a programmable wakeword -- a clapper that can do "turn on the lights." Not sure if this much computation violates the spirit, but there's no reason it can't be a tidy self-contained thing.
One thing I'd love to buy is a purely offline outlet control that can listen for a programmable wakeword -- a clapper that can do "turn on the lights." Not sure if this much computation violates the spirit, but there's no reason it can't be a tidy self-contained thing.
You could just get a clapper, and say that to yourself as you clap your hands.
The author’s mistake is thinking about the ”smart” lights in terms of systems, and the “midwit” lights in terms of products. If you look at smart lights starting with products, ignoring the connectivity and asking questions like will this pair well with my light fixtures and is it capable of the color changing or other tricks I want, then look into the best system to control those products, you won’t get caught in analysis paralysis so easily.
This advice probably doesn’t apply as much to people who want smart-everything since that can get very complicated, but if it’s mainly about lights then you’ll find compatible options for any of the major protocols.
This advice probably doesn’t apply as much to people who want smart-everything since that can get very complicated, but if it’s mainly about lights then you’ll find compatible options for any of the major protocols.
Adding to this list the Philips sceneswitch bulbs: color changing bulbs that can be rapidly power-cycled to change color. https://www.usa.lighting.philips.com/consumer/choose-a-bulb/...
If one could trigger scheduled actions by connecting a remote control to a daily or weekly plug-in timer, that would meet virtually every use case I have for app-controlled appliances, bulbs, and locks.
If one could trigger scheduled actions by connecting a remote control to a daily or weekly plug-in timer, that would meet virtually every use case I have for app-controlled appliances, bulbs, and locks.
This is where I landed. A couple of years ago I sold all of my Apple Surveillance Device Minis, boxed up all of my Hugh lights, and got a remote control outlet for my bedroom light and a remote control light strip for my TV's bias lights. I still have a August lock but I don't let it on WiFi, bluetooth only. Life is easier and I'm not feeding the megacorps with data about my comings and goings and what I do while I'm inside.
> That’s basically an AND gate. But what about OR gates? [...]
How about a Turing-complete clap processing unit? Effectively, a language for specifying, identifying, connecting, activating, and signaling various logic gates with hand claps alone.
Also, come on. Is it really too much to ask for a person to know how to open a Sonoff switch, connect gator clips to its programming ports, flash it with Tasmota, and connect it to Home Assistant via MQTT? This is basic stuff..
How about a Turing-complete clap processing unit? Effectively, a language for specifying, identifying, connecting, activating, and signaling various logic gates with hand claps alone.
Also, come on. Is it really too much to ask for a person to know how to open a Sonoff switch, connect gator clips to its programming ports, flash it with Tasmota, and connect it to Home Assistant via MQTT? This is basic stuff..
> My usual process for making tea is to walk to the kitchen and start the kettle. Then, because it takes an eternity for water to boil, I go back to my desk to wait.
Instead of remote controlling the kettle, get a hot water dispenser.
In Europe: https://yum-asia.com/eu/product-category/instant-hot-water-h...
Instead of remote controlling the kettle, get a hot water dispenser.
In Europe: https://yum-asia.com/eu/product-category/instant-hot-water-h...
Or get one that goes under the counter: https://www.quooker.co.uk/?___store=en
"We are currently active in The Netherlands, Belgium, United Kingdom, Ireland, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, Italy, United Arabic Emirates, Hong Kong, Israel and Portugal. Due to company regulations, service and warranty we do not ship Quooker-systems to countries where we do not have a local office."
Sigh...
Do you know anything available EU-wide?
Sigh...
Do you know anything available EU-wide?
"Power-controlled remote pressers. This is utterly cursed, but hear me out: I want a gadget that I physically attach to a remote. When the gadget gets power, it presses the “on” button on the remote. When it loses power, it presses the “off” button."
Except that too many remotes have one button, and one signal, for both on and off. TV and cable box remotes out of sync is the most common result.
Except that too many remotes have one button, and one signal, for both on and off. TV and cable box remotes out of sync is the most common result.
Every light switch runs an LLM which is able to submit JSON payloads of the format { "on": true } to an internal HTTP server controlling the switch. The LLM is connected to a microphone and is prompted with a unique name. You can use it just by yelling "turn on the lights!", or if you only want to turn on one of the lights "Gary, turn on!"
The LLM is also allowed to respond to arbitrary events of is own, such as time stamps and motion detectors, and it just comes up with what it thinks you want. It would probably work at least as well as these other systems, until it decided that one of your light names was too naughty.
Actually, I created a toy system of a virtual robot that could consume events like FORWARD, LEFT, LOOK UP, SAY [x], etc. ChatGPT was able to control it really well.
Actually, I created a toy system of a virtual robot that could consume events like FORWARD, LEFT, LOOK UP, SAY [x], etc. ChatGPT was able to control it really well.
KNX seems like a solid solution: a single shared bus that smart devices communicate with each other over, without any need for any kind of centralized server (either on prem or not). But unfortunately AFAICT there aren't any installers in the Bay Area, and it would cost a pretty penny to wire the house anyway.
Any suggestions for how to get something similar set up in the US?
Any suggestions for how to get something similar set up in the US?
I really like clappers, but if you want to read a book at night, what about just using a bedside lamp? No need for smart anything.
Regarding remote control switch pressers, I have a couple switchbots, and most of the information online talks about using things like Home Assistant, but they also respond to anything that sends them a simple bluetooth command. You can easily do a point to point thing with a bluetooth device on the other end.
I control mine with a little ESP32 board.
I control mine with a little ESP32 board.
Ah. The Clapper.
I've tried to find a Clapper functionality for Alexa or Google Assistant or something, but haven't come across it. So often I just want to turn on or off the nearest light that's on, not try to have a conversation with some device or pull up my phone with my dry eyes in the middle of the night.
I've tried to find a Clapper functionality for Alexa or Google Assistant or something, but haven't come across it. So often I just want to turn on or off the nearest light that's on, not try to have a conversation with some device or pull up my phone with my dry eyes in the middle of the night.
Just FYI that the link to the page about the case against ultrasonic humidifiers is broken; it's missing the / after the domain. I tried leaving a comment on the page, but even after creating a dummy profile it wouldn't accept it, so hopefully you'll see it here.
Those motion sensor light bulbs are perfect. My basement lights are all chain-pull so I got them in, and now everything is illuminated by the time I reach the bottom of the stairs.
I also like the IKEA tradfri stuff, since you can just pair the remote directly. No apps or internet needed.
I also like the IKEA tradfri stuff, since you can just pair the remote directly. No apps or internet needed.
> (BTW, manufacturers, if you want to use touch sensors and you don’t want to lose the massive midwit market, make things that automatically turn on when first connected to power, without waiting for a touch.)
...and if you ever lose power to the house, suddenly all devices turn on.
...and if you ever lose power to the house, suddenly all devices turn on.
What a great way to be sure the power has been restored. I suppose the power being restored at 3am would suck but in most cases I would want the lights to all come back on after an outage.
One immediately useful thing I got from the post is the genius idea of putting the printer (that frequently needs to be restarted for some reason) on a smart outlet. It's working around broken technology by using more technology, but I'll take it!
I feel this sentiment deeply. I wonder how much of it is due to lack of good options, and how much is due to a hostile information space - that is, there are bandits out there who want your money and attention, and they are willing to say anything to get it.
The lack of good options is due to hostiles IMO, everything wants to force you to install their app.
To add to this: F&(*&ing manufacturers that change the internals of the IoTs silently. That worked fine, let me just hop onto Amazon click "buy again" to get more.
That said mine generally works fine. The ESPHome integration in particular is grand
That said mine generally works fine. The ESPHome integration in particular is grand
Not sure what author is building with this list of keywords, smart home nuclear bomb? Because otherwise HA setup works with small subset of that. Then it's up to you how complex you want things to get, as with any software
Simple, remote control outlets are great. We have them in most rooms in our home.
Another great use for them is to get the ones that look just like light switches, and hang them low enough for small children to use.
Another great use for them is to get the ones that look just like light switches, and hang them low enough for small children to use.
HA sounds cool to me but other than being a fun thing to work on, what's so good about it? Can anyone "sell" me on it? Is it just being able to turn stuff on and off from your phone?
Not all of these ideas I have implemented, but here are some things you can do.
- remote control to turn on/off lights in bed
- Bed sensor to turn on/off lights when heading to the bathroom at night
- define a scene (lights dimmed, shades down, mood lights on) to trigger in an event (Netflix turned on TV at 8pm)
- Remote control of wall AC unit out of the house (shut off while away but turn on before driving home)
- Alerts for when my brother turns on the coffee maker
- Control system to avoid coffee maker and microwave running together long enough and tripping the circuit breaker in your old apartment (haven't done this one)
- Alert to tell you when washing machine is done (or use to estimate how much time is left)
- use color lights as reminders or to signify events
- check to make sure doors are closed and locked at night
- check that door for room (or window in room) with AC is closed when AC is running, otherwise shut AC off
- alerts when someone gets home even if you are out of the house (know kid gets home from school, for example)
Ultimately it is a hobby. I had a raspberry pi 4 I bought and had just sitting around. It feels good to see it in the corner doing something cool.
- remote control to turn on/off lights in bed
- Bed sensor to turn on/off lights when heading to the bathroom at night
- define a scene (lights dimmed, shades down, mood lights on) to trigger in an event (Netflix turned on TV at 8pm)
- Remote control of wall AC unit out of the house (shut off while away but turn on before driving home)
- Alerts for when my brother turns on the coffee maker
- Control system to avoid coffee maker and microwave running together long enough and tripping the circuit breaker in your old apartment (haven't done this one)
- Alert to tell you when washing machine is done (or use to estimate how much time is left)
- use color lights as reminders or to signify events
- check to make sure doors are closed and locked at night
- check that door for room (or window in room) with AC is closed when AC is running, otherwise shut AC off
- alerts when someone gets home even if you are out of the house (know kid gets home from school, for example)
Ultimately it is a hobby. I had a raspberry pi 4 I bought and had just sitting around. It feels good to see it in the corner doing something cool.
HA has built-in or community provided integrations to pretty much everything imaginable.
You can for example:
- Start the robo vacuum every time there's nobody in the house and tell it to stop when people are coming back - Add a voice command for said vacuum to just vacuum the kitchen or hallway - Open the curtains when it's light enough outside and put them back down when it's darker outside than inside. - Adjust light temperature and brightness based on the time of day so you won't get 1000 lumens of 6000K light blinding you when you go to the bathroom at night - Turn down the AC/heating when people aren't home and start preheating/cooling when they are nearing the house again
When everything is integrated to HA your imagination is pretty much the only limit when combining different sensors to devices.
You can for example:
- Start the robo vacuum every time there's nobody in the house and tell it to stop when people are coming back - Add a voice command for said vacuum to just vacuum the kitchen or hallway - Open the curtains when it's light enough outside and put them back down when it's darker outside than inside. - Adjust light temperature and brightness based on the time of day so you won't get 1000 lumens of 6000K light blinding you when you go to the bathroom at night - Turn down the AC/heating when people aren't home and start preheating/cooling when they are nearing the house again
When everything is integrated to HA your imagination is pretty much the only limit when combining different sensors to devices.
I think this is just a problem for tech-y nerds. Almost anyone can just buy into a specific smart home ecosystem (like Hue) and use that for everything. Never had a problem.
What if complex IT stacks didn't exist primarily to solve problems, but to create niche domains in which Average Redditors can lord their knowledge over everyone else?
Then they would be replaced, because Average Redditors have very little power when it comes down to it. The real problem with bad but popular tech stacks is that they do exist to solve problems - just not ours. I want everything to be compatible with everything else; hardware manufacturers want oligopoly rents. I like languages that let me be as productive as possible; employers like languages that let as much of their candidate pool as possible be productive enough. So it goes.
s/Average Redditors/tech companies/
Lutron Caseta for lights. ZWave for sensors and shades. HomeKit for cameras. (I run a whole home assistant setup but I could have done everything with HomeKit natively)
This is grug tier. He's criticizing midwit tier. Genius tier is some guy who effortlessly coded his own elegant and simple solution.
The Legrand smart lights that came with our house are pretty painless. No idea what setup is like, though, since they were preinstalled.
> Mechanical outlet timers: You plug this into an outlet, it slowly spins once per day, and the pins determine is the outlet is active for each 30 minute period.
[...]
> Many use these with light for plants. Or, it can be nice to wake up with light rather than sound. Instead of buying a light alarm clock, you can just plug a lamp into one of these.
Beware.
I bought one of these for the bedroom for precisely that purpose.
I accidentally got a brand that clicked audibly as it rotated.
I'm sure the reader can easily imagine how useful that wasn't.
Beware.
I bought one of these for the bedroom for precisely that purpose.
I accidentally got a brand that clicked audibly as it rotated.
I'm sure the reader can easily imagine how useful that wasn't.
Definitely midwit tier. Getting some benefits from home automation is trivial. Now if only Alexa’s response time wasn’t trash …
A fantastic lesson on why to keep it simple, stupid!
Enjoyed the opening quite a bit. Very funny and relatable.
We are never locked out. There is no key under a rock. The phone cannot get unpaired, the remote cannot be intercepted and replayed. If we are on vacation, we can call up a friend and tell them a code so they can get in.
A 9V battery lasts about three years, then it starts flashing and beeping every time you open the door for a month before dying. If you already have the right hole in the door, it takes about 20 minutes to install.
And if you're intent on breaking in, well, the windows are made of glass. Please don't do that.