Kirin demos "electric salt spoon" at CES(techcrunch.com)
techcrunch.com
Kirin demos "electric salt spoon" at CES
https://techcrunch.com/2025/01/05/kirin-offers-a-taste-of-its-electric-salt-spoon-at-ces-2025/
87 comments
FFS, can humans not just keep creating plastic crap that'll ruin the planet. Make your own wooden spoon and you have a beautiful object created with your own hands.
But how would that wooden spoon simulate salt?
I don't even get how we came to this point. Anyone uttering this question should reconsider their entire life choices...
Is the end game of humanity shitty chat bots, half assed autonomous cars and salt simulating spoons? Is this what people dream about these days? We're pathetic
Is the end game of humanity shitty chat bots, half assed autonomous cars and salt simulating spoons? Is this what people dream about these days? We're pathetic
I assume you're aware of the following and are being willfully ignorant:
- landed on the Moon
- industrialized agriculture to support a population orders of magnitude larger than otherwise possible
- eliminated smallpox, polio
- invented penicillin which has saved hundreds of millions
These are just the ones off the top of my head
- landed on the Moon
- industrialized agriculture to support a population orders of magnitude larger than otherwise possible
- eliminated smallpox, polio
- invented penicillin which has saved hundreds of millions
These are just the ones off the top of my head
> industrialized agriculture to support a population orders of magnitude larger than otherwise possible
Which destroyed our soils and allowed us to grow so out of proportion that in 200 years of industrial revolution we're slowly coming to the conclusion that we might have destroyed our home planet...
Which destroyed our soils and allowed us to grow so out of proportion that in 200 years of industrial revolution we're slowly coming to the conclusion that we might have destroyed our home planet...
All the examples you used are from about a human lifespan before our time. Not really anything people alive now have any connection or conscious appreciation of.
A huge percent of the population can't take food with salt because of medical conditions. This would be a quality of life improvement for them.
You can still eat as much salt as you like, not need to feel pathetic.
You can still eat as much salt as you like, not need to feel pathetic.
Huge percent you say? Feel free to post a source
How much of this huge percent are people with bad eating habits and who over used salt for decades in the first place?
We should stop half assing solutions for symptoms when all we have to do is eat properly in the first place, diet coke doesn't solve diabetes, magic salt simulating spoons don't solve decades of bad choices.
How much of this huge percent are people with bad eating habits and who over used salt for decades in the first place?
We should stop half assing solutions for symptoms when all we have to do is eat properly in the first place, diet coke doesn't solve diabetes, magic salt simulating spoons don't solve decades of bad choices.
Being fat is uncomfortable, lowers your life-expectancy and is something many people feel embarrased about. In movies and popular culture fat people are overwhelmingly shown in a negative light (stupid, greedy, impulsive).
All of which is to say: there are many many negative incentives for people to "eat properly" and obesity is still very common. Telling people to just get more disciplined is obviously not working. (Also, obesity and addiction more generally has a large genetic component, so try to have some empathy)
All of which is to say: there are many many negative incentives for people to "eat properly" and obesity is still very common. Telling people to just get more disciplined is obviously not working. (Also, obesity and addiction more generally has a large genetic component, so try to have some empathy)
> Telling people to just get more disciplined is obviously not working.
Ok so the solution is to give them a plastic spoon that simulates salt, which solves nothing, gotcha...
> there are many many negative incentives for people to "eat properly" and obesity is still very common.
And there are infinitely more incentives for food companies to make you fat and addicted at all cost, and many incentives for the pharmaceutical industry to have fat and unhealthy people they can sell "cures" to.
Ok so the solution is to give them a plastic spoon that simulates salt, which solves nothing, gotcha...
> there are many many negative incentives for people to "eat properly" and obesity is still very common.
And there are infinitely more incentives for food companies to make you fat and addicted at all cost, and many incentives for the pharmaceutical industry to have fat and unhealthy people they can sell "cures" to.
Pretty sure yours is the more common take, rather than the opposite. Or at least a view that is very well represented by just about any news outlet. There's also a popular comedy movie about it.
So, you're not exactly going against the grain here.
So, you're not exactly going against the grain here.
I just can’t imagine getting so angry about someone who needs to keep their salt consumption down having access to a tool that helps them.
Apparently an unpopular comment but I commend it for having the ability to step back and think "wtf are we doing", which far too many people seem to lack.
You've gotta admit that a spoon which adds salt flavour is an oddly superficial use of technology... is it really a good solution to a real problem?
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> especially relevant in Japan, where the country’s adult population eats more than double the World Health Organization’s recommended intake
Japan is also the country with the second highest life expectancy in the world. Is salt really that bad? How long would they live if they followed WHO's recommendations?
Japan is also the country with the second highest life expectancy in the world. Is salt really that bad? How long would they live if they followed WHO's recommendations?
No it isn't unless you are salt sensitive. You would know if you are salt sensitive, you would have high blood pressure.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/its-time-to-end-t...
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/its-time-to-end-t...
I'd take some years off my life if it meant I could continue to enjoy salt.
Iirc only the northern parts of Japan have high salt diets, the south side has lesser intake, but I could be wrong.
I don't think this is true at all, everyone here eats a lot of salt.
Soy sauce is in basically everything, it's full of salt.
Soy sauce is in basically everything, it's full of salt.
> Is salt really that bad?
I was wondering, does exercise purge "extra" salt?
also, since this is japan, would they have a chopsticks model? Maybe this is for soup. Or an export version. Japanese ramen spoons have a different shape.
I was wondering, does exercise purge "extra" salt?
also, since this is japan, would they have a chopsticks model? Maybe this is for soup. Or an export version. Japanese ramen spoons have a different shape.
Not really. Of course you tend to drink and sweat more, which contributes.
> does exercise purge "extra" salt?
No. Your kidneys do this, assuming they work correctly.
No. Your kidneys do this, assuming they work correctly.
Is salt consumption and life span uniformly distributed across Japan?
Everyone in Japan eats a lot of salt, there is no region specific salt intake.
> Is salt really that bad?
No, salt is good because it helps you to eat unpalatable, nutritious food.
No, salt is good because it helps you to eat unpalatable, nutritious food.
And Na is absolutely vital, and depending on your diet, if you cut 100% of table salt you will get deprived of Na and Iodine
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It's not just one thing. Their diet very low calorie.. Low on fat.
If we eat oil like Mediterranean fat like Intuit's, carb like Raramurii, protein like Americans will have worst health of all.
If we eat oil like Mediterranean fat like Intuit's, carb like Raramurii, protein like Americans will have worst health of all.
Source for the low calorie bit? Seems unlikely, given the amount of rice consumed.
You seem to be assuming "the amount of rice consumed" is high, but are you taking into consideration that the average portion may be small?
Dietary fat isn't actually bad for you in reasonable amounts. It's the overindulgence of carbs, which turns into body fat.
Also the Japanese diet is interesting. It's actually not low-calorie pound-per-pound, but the portion sizes are much smaller. The Japanese just eat less than Americans.
It has also a surprisingly small amount of greens. There is usually a pickled vegetable dish on the side, but that's it.
Also the Japanese diet is interesting. It's actually not low-calorie pound-per-pound, but the portion sizes are much smaller. The Japanese just eat less than Americans.
It has also a surprisingly small amount of greens. There is usually a pickled vegetable dish on the side, but that's it.
Actually a healthy person can regulate Na levels very good. There is a lot of debate if it is as bad as portrayed.
Im very tempted to think the japanese have higher life expectancy because they are on average much shorter than western europeans with similar quality of life.
You can check this by comparing Japanese who lived in different countries. I vaguely remember it doesn't hold up, but should be simple to search.
> Is salt really that bad?
Here's a brief video that makes the claim that you probably need more salt in your diet. He has 3 more salt videos, if you're intrigued.
You probably need more salt (short): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02rgtB0Bxi0
Salt: Are you getting Enough?: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amJ-ev8Ial8
WHY Low Salt Stresses the Body: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bNdhM4vt4I
Low Sodium's link to Fat Gain & Insulin Resistance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ygExIZm7Wo
Here's a brief video that makes the claim that you probably need more salt in your diet. He has 3 more salt videos, if you're intrigued.
You probably need more salt (short): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02rgtB0Bxi0
Salt: Are you getting Enough?: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amJ-ev8Ial8
WHY Low Salt Stresses the Body: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bNdhM4vt4I
Low Sodium's link to Fat Gain & Insulin Resistance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ygExIZm7Wo
This guy is not a healthcare professional and makes intentionally contrarian videos for views. He is cherry picking information and ignoring decades of science on nutritional sodium. Please listen to your doctor, not some random YouTuber trying to monetize your attention.
> This guy is not a healthcare professional
As aren't you (and i). And why should i listen to a random Hacker dude? Or a smoking doctor? Dou you think every GP is a nutritionist? And even then...
As aren't you (and i). And why should i listen to a random Hacker dude? Or a smoking doctor? Dou you think every GP is a nutritionist? And even then...
I watch this guy a lot. I noticed a few things.
He does two things that increase believability: he cites papers and studies, and he runs experiments on himself. This is good.
He does one thing that decreases believability: he only cites papers and studies that reinforces his contrarian points, and benignly ignores the rest. This is called being a YouTube influencer.
In ML terms, his content has high precision and low recall -- he optimizes for true positives but not false negatives. It's a form of confirmation bias. You can still use his data (which I assume to be correctly sourced), but you might want to be skeptical of his conclusions by seeking your own disconfirming evidence.
He does two things that increase believability: he cites papers and studies, and he runs experiments on himself. This is good.
He does one thing that decreases believability: he only cites papers and studies that reinforces his contrarian points, and benignly ignores the rest. This is called being a YouTube influencer.
In ML terms, his content has high precision and low recall -- he optimizes for true positives but not false negatives. It's a form of confirmation bias. You can still use his data (which I assume to be correctly sourced), but you might want to be skeptical of his conclusions by seeking your own disconfirming evidence.
> He is cherry picking information and ignoring decades of science on nutritional sodium
Show us, then. He cites his sources. The least you can do is do the same.
Show us, then. He cites his sources. The least you can do is do the same.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33351135/
tl;dr: Higher (yes, higher) sodium intake correlated with longer life expectancy and lower mortality but the study was observational and not a basis for dietary recommendations.
tl;dr: Higher (yes, higher) sodium intake correlated with longer life expectancy and lower mortality but the study was observational and not a basis for dietary recommendations.
Meanwhile the garbage science that got us "salt = blood pressure" has made it into dietary recommendations just fine, ruining food all over the world.
A gentle reminder those longevity claims may be suspect https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41738434
Salt is not bad for you. The small hypertension decreases people experience on low sodium diets are capped at roughly 10% and salt is almost never the actual cause. It is another victim of choosing a boogie man to hide the fact that sugar is by far the most destructive thing to consume by a huge margin
This idea has been around for a long time:
https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg22429935-000-food-bla...
When I heard about this, I couldn't help but think of the taste of a 9-volt battery on the tongue, but from what I understood/guessed from TFA, this does something more like pulling dissolved sodium ions to the outer surface of the food to make them more readily encountered by taste buds? So, the food would need to have a decent salt content to begin with and not be too dry probably?
Lasers. If ain't got no lasers it ain't no good.
I read about this the other day. The main thing I remember was the weird grip required...a fist grip? I'd be curious to hear more about that aspect...
It's going to be because it needs a complete circuit. (and firm contact with the handle where there will be another 'electrode'
This sounds exactly like (for example) electric shock gag pens and other things that attempt to emit a charge - A lot of electrical devices need a complete circuit- and so the circuit needs to be complete. For what this device is doing with moving ions, it probably needs the circuit- I don't know that the few devices out there that emit power without that sort of circuit could accomplish the same.
This sounds exactly like (for example) electric shock gag pens and other things that attempt to emit a charge - A lot of electrical devices need a complete circuit- and so the circuit needs to be complete. For what this device is doing with moving ions, it probably needs the circuit- I don't know that the few devices out there that emit power without that sort of circuit could accomplish the same.
I think we are witnessing ascent of the new Dyson of kitchen utensils.
My taste buds have become extremely muted after covid bouts and other sinus issues. Wonder if this would be helpful.
Say what you will about salt consumption, but my wife suffered thyroid issues until we added a shaker of iodized salt back into our kitchen/eating area.
There are plenty of other sources for iodine.
Which?
Primarily seafood.
You can get it from a lot of other places, but they are unreliable. Plants grown in iodine rich soil will have iodine, but good luck identifying that.
I use iodized salt because I don't love the alternatives.
You can get it from a lot of other places, but they are unreliable. Plants grown in iodine rich soil will have iodine, but good luck identifying that.
I use iodized salt because I don't love the alternatives.
Seaweed has plenty of iodine
Not really, at least not everywhere. If you live away of sea, you will bot be inclined to eat seafood, also will be expensive. There are many cultures in which the diet does not have enough iodine.
Sure, if you live in a country with submodern infrastructure, doesn't produce enriched wheat, or cannot afford to buy an iodine supplement, you are probably right.
However 1 cup of milk has more iodine than 1/4 teaspoon of iodized salt, 1 egg has half as much, and two slices of enriched wheat bread has three times as much.
Also, a typical kelp supplement has way more than the RDV, in a single pill.
However 1 cup of milk has more iodine than 1/4 teaspoon of iodized salt, 1 egg has half as much, and two slices of enriched wheat bread has three times as much.
Also, a typical kelp supplement has way more than the RDV, in a single pill.
> Sure, if you live in a country with submodern infrastructure
That describes a whole lot of world population.
That describes a whole lot of world population.
Yet, not a whole lot of the hacker news user population.
This is a very important point. Also other point is that in some hospitals people are going into ER with hiponatremia. Granted extreme cases. But many people are getting obsessive with low Na. And while a little bit too much will not affect you at all, a little bit too little will affect you immediately.
FoodTV and other influencers also drove a lot of people to kosher salt, which isn’t iodized.
I mean, what do spend your time with, once you have solved all of the World's problems?
How much salt do I need to buy for the spoon to be cheaper?
Well also glutamate can be replaced.
We have sugar-free sweets, alcohol-free beer, tobacco-free cigarettes (vapes), THC-free weed, oil-free fryers and now salt-free saltiness.
What a time to be alive! Honestly though none of these products appeal to me at all. It’s like the thing without the thing that makes it enjoyable. Except air fryers since the foods do still have some fat naturally
Lactose and gluten free also…
All foods which say “X free” take care of not saying what DOES is inside…
All foods which say “X free” take care of not saying what DOES is inside…
speaking as a health conscious foodie ,with gagetaholism, this will press all of my "got to have the shiny thing" buttons, in an upscale retail enviroment
a version built right into a bowl would be the way to intruduce it into resturaunts and build retail demand in places big on soup, Vietnam....china
That’s actually a pretty solid idea, I wonder if it would work in a bowl format…
But does it work?
This is the third report I’ve seen in recent days and none of them mention if the spoon delivers on its promise. Reporters may be reluctant to share a spoon with dozens of other attendees, but might they practice some journalism by surveying folks who did try it?
This is the third report I’ve seen in recent days and none of them mention if the spoon delivers on its promise. Reporters may be reluctant to share a spoon with dozens of other attendees, but might they practice some journalism by surveying folks who did try it?
At that price point placebos become pretty powerful. I’d like to see some actual data of salt distribution with a regular spoon vs theirs.
EDIT: Seems that it works by stimulating the tongue with current not by changing salt distribution
EDIT: Seems that it works by stimulating the tongue with current not by changing salt distribution
My thoughts:)
We can replace this boring chair with an ~electric chair~!
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How about a fork, actually made of salt [0]?
[0] https://youtu.be/4FPwNkkMPrE?si=IqgSHPIHyFVfeXu7
[0] https://youtu.be/4FPwNkkMPrE?si=IqgSHPIHyFVfeXu7