Fermented Chili “Open Sauce” – My most starred repo has no code in it(github.com)
github.com
Fermented Chili “Open Sauce” – My most starred repo has no code in it
https://github.com/aweijnitz/recipe-el_fuego_viviente
123 comments
Similar story with me. I was at my grandma's house for the holidays and wanted to can a bunch of jalapenos. I'd slice them in half, rub the seeds/guts out with my thumb then slice them into rings and throw them in a jar to boil. Did several pounds... Night came and I couldn't sleep my hands were burning so bad. Touching the sheets or anything would shoot pain. I went and dug through her medicine cabinet and found some tylenol with codeine pills. Took a couple and managed to go to sleep but woke up in the morning and they were still burning. Was like that for 3 days or so.
Ha me too! I couldn’t believe that burn and how long it lasted. I soaked my hands in milk as placebo one day.
We had a kid just after making it and therefore loads of visitors for meals - everyone commented on how good it was and wanted some. I’m gonna make it again.
We had a kid just after making it and therefore loads of visitors for meals - everyone commented on how good it was and wanted some. I’m gonna make it again.
I made some and loved it too, a few different various things added but one I think was important was some fruit. An apple or some mango or something adds something quite beautiful.
I really recommend trying some other lacto-ferments. Green beans are great, as are tomatoes (those on toast are fantastic). I make them with my 3yo as it's just "kinda chop & add ~2% salt".
I really recommend trying some other lacto-ferments. Green beans are great, as are tomatoes (those on toast are fantastic). I make them with my 3yo as it's just "kinda chop & add ~2% salt".
“Wash” your hands in oil (capsaicinoids are most soluble in oil), then wash off the oil with strong detergent like dish soap.
It doesn’t eliminate the heat, but it reduces it by (to my perception) about 80%. Using gloves annoys me, and this method allows me to skip them.
It doesn’t eliminate the heat, but it reduces it by (to my perception) about 80%. Using gloves annoys me, and this method allows me to skip them.
I got used to gloves, I use them for handling ground meat as well, especially when making sausages.
Another thing to watch out for is opening the lid to a pot of stewing chiles. I had a friend that made sauce like this often and when she’d open the lid, it was like chemical warfare.
Worse with a blender. You aerosolize them and then stick your face in it. Just like being hit with mace or bear spray
Use gloves if you’re ever handling a lot of tamarind as well. It’s more acidic than you might think and it will burn your skin.
Same thing with lemons, especially if you're in sunlight.
Any citrus, and a few other plants as well: https://health.clevelandclinic.org/lime-juice-and-sunshine-c...
Yeah I had to juice a bunch of lemons a few days ago (1/4 lemon just speared with a fork and juiced into a strainer to catch the seeds, which is quick but also covers basically your entire hand in juice) and I was surprised how almost raw my hands felt after for basically the rest of the day.
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I feel dumb, I just now rubbed my eye after eating hot sauce. Senor Lechuga Hot Sauce .003 - very good but very hot and my eye is on fire.
Avoid touching sensitive areas if you handle chili peppers or hot sauce, eyes, nose, groin...
Avoid touching sensitive areas if you handle chili peppers or hot sauce, eyes, nose, groin...
That’s the expected burn. What surprised me, was that the non-sensitive area "hand" would burn, and that it would seep below the top layer of the skin so you can’t even clean it off.
The nerves are below the skin surface so...
Rubbing your eye after handling peppers is a definitely a problem - I’ve had that issue when peeling roasted green chile. Going to the bathroom can be risky, too. I had a vivid experience with that after chopping up a couple jalapeños at Taco Cabana one time…
Contact lenses. No matter how much I cleaned my hands, put oil on, butter...next morning putting my contact lenses in were 10 second of bleakness.
I've also had a similar experience peeling and crushing a massive amount of garlic by hand with no gloves. Not as bas as with chilis, but still caught me by surprise.
Author of the open sauce here. Coolt to see this on HN for the second time(!)
Still making fermented sauces and pickles. Set Moroccan Salted Lemons this week actually.
Happy to answer any questions. :-)
Hey,
Thanks for the recipe! I am also into fermented recipes.
Quick question, where do you buy Habanero Chilis in Germany? I somehow never saw them in supermarkets or "wochenmarkt"s.
Thanks for the recipe! I am also into fermented recipes.
Quick question, where do you buy Habanero Chilis in Germany? I somehow never saw them in supermarkets or "wochenmarkt"s.
Habeneros aren't common there, but in general for cheap chilis, try the Turkish grocery stores (EuroGida or similar). Basically for any Mexican / Latin-American stuff, they're great for sourcing ingredients: chilis, dry beans, corn meal, flour tortillas (durum) and will be a lot cheaper than specialty shops. Chilis are also easy to grow (I'm growing 4 kinds on my balcony in Berlin), and one habanero plant goes a long way.
Not in DE myself but scotch bonnet chillies are more easily found in the UK due to the Carribbean/West African connection. You may have a better chance of finding them instead and I'm told they are quite similar.
I'm buying them regularly from the Asian shop in my town. They have fresh Habaneros, Jalapenos, and Thai peppers
I'm from Germany and while I grow some chilis, if I need more I order from Westlandpeppers.
I can second westlandpeppers.
Usually you can find them at super markets (Rewe, Edeka) sometimes Discounter have it as promotional item (Aldi).
I recommend growing yourself just use seeds from the bought fruits. They are rather easy to grow.
I can also send you seeds, if you like.
I am growing them myself! Last year I grew some Reapers and Scorpions for fun :-).
I am from Austria though.
Do you always do a 5% brine? I usually do slightly over 4%. My brother in law does them at about 3%.
I grow all my own peppers in a community garden. My favorite to use for ferments are Buena Mulata. If you like to order seeds check out rareseeds.com.
I grow all my own peppers in a community garden. My favorite to use for ferments are Buena Mulata. If you like to order seeds check out rareseeds.com.
I love this recipe, I'm so happy you made it available. I have made it multiple times. I might suggest you let potential chefs know of possible increased gastric activity with fermented foods, especially ones that like to give you painful reminders on the way out. But I'm sure as hell not submitting a pull request for that :)
Hi, thanks for putting this online! Can you put the moroccan salted lemons on github as well?
Why chlorine free water?
This is really, really important for any kind of fermentation (including things like sourdough starter). I believe it's possible to get rid of some kinds of chlorination from municipal water sources by boiling the water first, but it is not possible to get rid of "chloramines," which are widely used (at least in the US). The web page for your local water supplier should be able to tell you whether they use chloramines or not, but I pretty much always just use bottled water that I know has nothing in it that would inhibit the fermentation.
It may be what's used in dechlorinator products, but vitamin C (ascorbic acid, or Sodium Ascorbate) does a good job of converting chloramines (or just chlorine) to salt, NaCl. I used an ascorbic acid shower filter for years when living in a city that used chloramine in their water. It worked well and I could tell every five months or so that it needed to be refilled because my skin started itching from the chlorine.
You can also buy dechlorinator for use with aquariums - super important to not accidentally kill the bacteria maintaining your nitrogen cycle. A bottle goes a very long way (ratio is drops per gallon of tap water).
My sourdough starter is absolutely fine with chloraminated water. I do use bottled water for pickles though because each batch is starting from scratch.
Chlorine kills bugs = reduces scope for fermentation.
I loved the issue about the "sauce code", and "compiling the sauce".
There's so many puns here waiting to happen:
- Finding 'bugs' in the 'sauce'
- Continuous testing and integration
- "Forking"
... what else? Contribute your puns below :p
There's so many puns here waiting to happen:
- Finding 'bugs' in the 'sauce'
- Continuous testing and integration
- "Forking"
... what else? Contribute your puns below :p
The language of coding is almost all metaphorical, some food & food-adjacent terms offhand:
- bit, byte
- server
- curry
- salted hash
- spaghetti code
- code smell
- syntactic sugar
- java
> - curry
Fun fact, this was named after Haskell Curry. Haskell is also named after him.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haskell_Curry
Fun fact, this was named after Haskell Curry. Haskell is also named after him.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haskell_Curry
Named after Haskell Brooks Curry. The Brook programming language is also named after him!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BrookGPU
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BrookGPU
It also works better as a verb than Schönfinkel or Frege: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moses_Sch%C3%B6nfinkel#Work
Although now I'm tempted to use more fregging in my functional code.
Although now I'm tempted to use more fregging in my functional code.
DRY the chilli, Beautiful Soup
- 0XDEADBEEF
- 0xCAFEBABE
:-)
- 0xCAFEBABE
:-)
Continuous tasting and integration
If you're growing your own pepper you'll want to 'pull' them.
'Merge' the ingredients in a pot.
And I guess, once fermented, the last stage is to 'solution-ise' it in a blender.
Don't forget the Brew and Bottle steps.
I had to laugh at the "don't let it get hot" in the readme.
Someone with Microsoft's copilot: Does that mean if you write "fermented chilli sauce recipe" in your IDE, it's now able to generate you a boilerplate recipe?
I'm getting this:
# fermented chilli sauce recipe
# https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/friedchilli_83671Recipe not found
Unfortunately, we can’t find the recipe you’re looking for. This may be because it has been taken down from the BBC Food website, which happens when our rights to publish a recipe expire. To find an alternative recipe from our collection you can search for the key ingredients in the search box or try one of the recommended recipes below.
I know UK has stricter copyright regime, but seriously?
Unfortunately, we can’t find the recipe you’re looking for. This may be because it has been taken down from the BBC Food website, which happens when our rights to publish a recipe expire. To find an alternative recipe from our collection you can search for the key ingredients in the search box or try one of the recommended recipes below.
I know UK has stricter copyright regime, but seriously?
Give it a bit more recipe in the prompt. You can force its hand.
My most starred repo has no code in it too!
A few years ago I bought an AnyTone AT-D868UV ham radio. As with any software-managed device, there were a few issues. I wanted a place to keep track of these problems for my own purposes. So I thought "GitHub Issues!"
https://github.com/geary/AnyTone-D868UV
I added a couple dozen of the problems I'd run into. And then it took a life of its own. Some people thought it was an official AnyTone support channel (despite my disclaimer). That's bound to happen.
The fun part was when people started an issue on how to upgrade a D868UV to a D878UV and get all the new features.
https://github.com/geary/AnyTone-D868UV/issues/59
Of course this was kind of an insane project unless you look at it from the point of a ham operator: radio hacking is fun!
Now about the gloves and chili.
Around 1974 I decided to stir fry a very hot dish of chiles and eggplant.
I didn't use gloves or a fume hood or any of those smart precautions.
Midway through the stir fry I noticed my forehead was burning.
But I ate the dish and it was delicious.
The next morning I woke up and my fingers were numb!
I went into survival mode and quickly realized that what I needed to do was eat a lot of yogurt, right then and there.
And it worked. I still have my fingers!
A few years ago I bought an AnyTone AT-D868UV ham radio. As with any software-managed device, there were a few issues. I wanted a place to keep track of these problems for my own purposes. So I thought "GitHub Issues!"
https://github.com/geary/AnyTone-D868UV
I added a couple dozen of the problems I'd run into. And then it took a life of its own. Some people thought it was an official AnyTone support channel (despite my disclaimer). That's bound to happen.
The fun part was when people started an issue on how to upgrade a D868UV to a D878UV and get all the new features.
https://github.com/geary/AnyTone-D868UV/issues/59
Of course this was kind of an insane project unless you look at it from the point of a ham operator: radio hacking is fun!
Now about the gloves and chili.
Around 1974 I decided to stir fry a very hot dish of chiles and eggplant.
I didn't use gloves or a fume hood or any of those smart precautions.
Midway through the stir fry I noticed my forehead was burning.
But I ate the dish and it was delicious.
The next morning I woke up and my fingers were numb!
I went into survival mode and quickly realized that what I needed to do was eat a lot of yogurt, right then and there.
And it worked. I still have my fingers!
What would have happened if you didn’t eat the yogurt?
To give you a serious answer in case you were really wondering: nothing. Capsaicin stimulates the sensory receptors used for evaluating temperature and makes them react to temperatures under your body temperature. It tricks your nervous system into thinking the part is burning. It lasts as long as the intermediary protein used to transfer this information is available. When it’s depleted you just feel numb which what happened here. It all goes back to normal once capsaicin has been naturally eliminated by the body and the intermediary protein stocks are restored.
At the time, I felt that my fingers might be paralyzed and they would fall off.
Luckily, I ate the yogurt and they were saved.
It is a testimony to the power of fermented foods.
Luckily, I ate the yogurt and they were saved.
It is a testimony to the power of fermented foods.
I find no fault in this logic, it's watertight!
Strictly speaking, it's yoghurttight.
There is an argument to be made that a recipe is code, it just runs on a different platform
Works well when explaining open source too. Proprietary is when the restaurants don't disclose the recipe, you just hope that they'll do a good job like last time, or that your allergies don't trigger. Government is forcing food products to disclose at least parts of their recipe, making it partially open. GPL needs you to include the recipe along with the food you serve to people, but not when you cook at home. And so on
Yes, that's how I usually explain programming to someone unexperienced with it. A computer programming language is usually more strictly defined, but depending on compiler and architecture results can differ in computer progamming as well.
Speaking of which, a spec for recipes that was a previous Show HN[1], Cooklang[2]
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28997309
[2] https://github.com/cooklang/spec
[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28997309
[2] https://github.com/cooklang/spec
This is especially true with the programming language Chef: https://esolangs.org/wiki/chef
I wish emacs would implement kitchen-sink support already.
You will not be surprised to learn of the existence of org-chef, a package to help writing recipes in org-mode.
I've been using Emacs for over 20 years, and even I thought you were joking before I web-searched org-chef!
Oh ye of little faith!
So why is code copyrightable and software patentable, while recipes are neither?
Because corporations get to make money from software.
Or at least pseudocode - it fulfills the same purpose but is less formal/consistent than for example the esoteric programming language Chef.
Indeed, and just like code you hate the way it looks a few days later.
Glad to see this already pointed out!
I'm in the process of making Polish pickles in brine, and normally share my recipes through google docs... or a blog on which I had spent way too much time yak shaving, because there are only 2-3 recipes in it (it was fun to code though(?)).
In other words, I might steal this format!
In other words, I might steal this format!
As the author of the linked repo - You should! :-)
Github is a very good blogging platform- easy access to all the files, issues are the comments section, stars are likes, people can fork and make PRs, mentions the date on top and uses markdown. what more could you ask for?
I'd say that it's about as much wiki as it is blog, because the timeline feature that separates a blog from a pre-blog "homepage" is hidden to the point of being missing.
Makes me wonder how an "alternate history wikipedia" would be like, where pages had explicit maintainers and the cotton fork model. The process for selecting the current leading fork would obviously be a huge source of endless drama, but I'd expect that this would end up a much better "reader experience" than the current model of edit wars where the uninitiated can't really tell an edit history with the occasional trolling/untrolling loop from an outright battleground.
Makes me wonder how an "alternate history wikipedia" would be like, where pages had explicit maintainers and the cotton fork model. The process for selecting the current leading fork would obviously be a huge source of endless drama, but I'd expect that this would end up a much better "reader experience" than the current model of edit wars where the uninitiated can't really tell an edit history with the occasional trolling/untrolling loop from an outright battleground.
I don't buy this, cuz like you mentioned itd be a source of endless drama alright but it'll also be harder to keep track of everything on Wikipedia if it were all a giant repo.. tho having different repos about each page sounds more sensible
Fork/pr would have to be per page, obviously, not per wikipedia.
would probably be a hellscape, filled with opposing "facts", conspiracy theories and vandalism.. imo wikipedia is still better as it atleast tries to be factual and neutral (ofc it isn't perfect, but do you really want anti vaxers to show you what they think is a credible source right next to an actual credible source? why don't we let the baseless conspiracy theories stay on facebook)
The beauty in the fork/pr model would be that people who claim that they would be better stewards of a given topic could simply try to convince by example (in their fork), even in the hottest edit war. The current wikipedia model, as far as I understand it (which isn't far at all I admit), is that if a battle gets too hot it ends with a competition in pulling rank: escalating lockdown until only one group remains (a group that may or may not be considered neutral by others - certainly considers itself neutral, but who doesn't...). Fork/pr could never have a problem editors that are respected/neutral in one field but turn out to be zealous in some other niche.
okay, you've changed my opinion
> atleast tries to be factual and neutral
This isn't the Wikipedia I know, and hasn't been since long before the pandemic. If you want credibility, go to a real encyclopaedia like Britannica. Otherwise, let people fork and edit and use stars to signal their opinion instead of letting cliques control information based on their far too obvious biases.
This isn't the Wikipedia I know, and hasn't been since long before the pandemic. If you want credibility, go to a real encyclopaedia like Britannica. Otherwise, let people fork and edit and use stars to signal their opinion instead of letting cliques control information based on their far too obvious biases.
Now all I need is a way to import this into my local Mealie instance! :)
Self-hosted, FOSS recipe database: https://hay-kot.github.io/mealie/ (Discussed four months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30623852 - mind that Tandoor looks like a good option as well)
Self-hosted, FOSS recipe database: https://hay-kot.github.io/mealie/ (Discussed four months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30623852 - mind that Tandoor looks like a good option as well)
Looks like a great project.
I was about to install another recipe web application in my nas but i will add yours.
I just did a batch of fermented hot sauce using home grown chillis. It's only my 3rd batch. The first batches I left for 4 weeks, but I let this last batch ferment for 10 weeks.
The wait was worth it, it's a beautiful batch.
Love the idea of using carrots though. Going to try that next batch.
Thanks for sharing
The wait was worth it, it's a beautiful batch.
Love the idea of using carrots though. Going to try that next batch.
Thanks for sharing
Repo owner here - Can recommend adding carrots and maybe a little more parsnip depending on taste. It gives the sauce another "body" and I really enjoy it.
Someone also made the "open source cookbook"
https://github.com/logicguy1/The-Cookbook
Seems like the ideal way to share and learn new recipes to me
https://github.com/logicguy1/The-Cookbook
Seems like the ideal way to share and learn new recipes to me
I’ve got a private repo where I maintain all my recipes, and only invite close friends/family as contributors. It’s a great place to store recipes in general.
Is it at all feasible to export your repo to a cookbook? I've been looking for software that makes it easy to input individual recipes (locally is fine, on the web would be better) and export them for desktop publishing. It looks like git is perfect for the input part :)
They’re all stored in markdown, so you could probably write a Pandoc script quite easily to put them into a PDF.
Is this kind of like sourdough? Since there's no starter culture, seems like it will ferment with whatever random yeast or bacteria happens to land in it while you're preparing it.
I tried making sourdough without a starter culture several times and it worked every time (1), so I suspect that having the correct conditions may be sufficient depending on what you want to ferment.
(1) to be precise, it looked and tasted the same every time, and it was somewhat sour and not disgusting, so I just assumed that it worked ;)
(1) to be precise, it looked and tasted the same every time, and it was somewhat sour and not disgusting, so I just assumed that it worked ;)
Sourdough does use yeast from the air and feeds on the flour (often with help from a sugary friend like an apple), but fermentation of vegetables is usually from bacteria on the skin of the veg, for instance in sauerkraut the bacteria that kicks off fermentation is Leuconostoc mesenteroides which is found on the skin of cabbage (and many other veg).
With both you can use a starter, often from the previous batch but buying them works too. My first attempts at sourdough weren't very successful at all and I wish I'd chosen a famous starter to get that good taste, even once I got it going okay it wasn't a great taste, the yeast strains in my kitchen can't have been that good!
[1] https://olykraut.com/blogs/knowledge/the-stages-of-sauerkrau...
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leuconostoc_mesenteroides#Envi...
With both you can use a starter, often from the previous batch but buying them works too. My first attempts at sourdough weren't very successful at all and I wish I'd chosen a famous starter to get that good taste, even once I got it going okay it wasn't a great taste, the yeast strains in my kitchen can't have been that good!
[1] https://olykraut.com/blogs/knowledge/the-stages-of-sauerkrau...
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leuconostoc_mesenteroides#Envi...
Similar yeah. It'll be mostly lactobaccilus that's already present on the vegetables. Probably will pick up some other stuff from the environment and your skin but the dominant strains will be from the product itself.
Similarly with sourdough, the main yeast and bacteria strains are already present in the flour when you start and grow from there. Some surely get introduced from the air as well but they aren't that significant compared to the ones that "come with."
Similarly with sourdough, the main yeast and bacteria strains are already present in the flour when you start and grow from there. Some surely get introduced from the air as well but they aren't that significant compared to the ones that "come with."
The salt and then the acid metabolites narrows the kinds of things which can grow considerably. Lacto-fermenting bacteria are everywhere
Love the idea of using github!
I have one recipe that involves mango, pineapple, cinnamon, ginger, garlic, etc. It comes out really sweet and cinnamon, ginger and chilli combo plays nicely on the tongue.
My first home made sauce was done with tomatoes. Didn't really like that as it was just hot ketchup.
I have one recipe that involves mango, pineapple, cinnamon, ginger, garlic, etc. It comes out really sweet and cinnamon, ginger and chilli combo plays nicely on the tongue.
My first home made sauce was done with tomatoes. Didn't really like that as it was just hot ketchup.
Not code, but perhaps an algorithm.
"The author has in fact barely resisted the temptation to name the present volume 'The Programmer's Cookbook.' Perhaps someday he will attempt a book called 'Algorithms for the Kitchen.'" -- Knuth, TAOCP
"The author has in fact barely resisted the temptation to name the present volume 'The Programmer's Cookbook.' Perhaps someday he will attempt a book called 'Algorithms for the Kitchen.'" -- Knuth, TAOCP
This raises an interesting question. Why is code copyrightable and a recipe is not?
Someone should port it to the Recipe JSON Schema
https://schema.org/Recipe
I can second the fact that Marie Sharp's is the tastiest sauce of the tens I've tried. May not be the hottest, but I optimize for taste.
This is the same for me: my most starred repo has 220 stars and a dozen forks--and no code. It's links about writing (prose) with Emacs: https://github.com/thinkhuman/writingwithemacs
I think the idea that 'repos are just for code' hasn't been valid for several years now.
I think the idea that 'repos are just for code' hasn't been valid for several years now.
Everything we observe and interact (procedurally or otherwise) with is code, especially recipes. This looks like a great one to try. I realize Github features also provide a 1:1 perfect match for recipes now you’ve drawn my attention to it.
There are many "Awesome {something}" list-style repos with many stars
Holy crap - Marie Sharp's is my favorite hot sauce. I have to try this!
Almost any beginner programming course states that algorithms are like recipes for a computer. Conversely a recipe is an algorithm meant for imperfect humans.
If a recipe isn’t code then what is ?
this reminds me of the compsoc cookbook(https://github.com/compsoc-edinburgh/cook-book), a git based cookbook made by members of the university of edinburghs computing society, it tends to get some new activity when a new term starts
Aahah this thread is so entertaining! Definitely a good reminder to wear gloves when handling hot peppers.
What size jar is the ferment done in? I'm guessing a 1Qt/1L, but the directions dont say.
its kinda interresting the kind of "github culture" that has developed, as I recall, people did not do this kind of thing with cvs or svn. I wonder if there is some kind of more specific software/service/system missing for this kinda stuff
Github put the Readme and some code that makes up the repo up front, and there's an outsized focus on making fancy landing pages.
The downside of this is that because Github's methodology has been so dominant, many don't understand that there could be any other way to host code - tools that are primarily code review focused like Gerrit require require a bit of "hey, imagine that an aggregated PR page was the homepage" training for new hires, for example.
The downside of this is that because Github's methodology has been so dominant, many don't understand that there could be any other way to host code - tools that are primarily code review focused like Gerrit require require a bit of "hey, imagine that an aggregated PR page was the homepage" training for new hires, for example.
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I’m getting more interested in fermented foods. Any good resources on making them at home?
if you guys enjoy recipe repos, Hendricius maintains an entire tome of knowledge on sourdough and bread baking!
https://github.com/hendricius
https://github.com/hendricius
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Shit coder? /s
I made this back then! It’s what taught me to use gloves with chili. The capsaicin managed to permeate my skin, and for around 3 days my hands would start burning if they only got slightly warm. I had to sleep with my hands slightly raised, so they wouldn’t touch either the mattress or the covers (or my own skin). Nowadays, I always have nitrile gloves for any kind of hot chili recipes ;)
I think it was great, I guess I’ll make it again this year.