Buying a retro game console(medium.com)
medium.com
Buying a retro game console
https://medium.com/@razorbeamz/you-probably-dont-want-to-buy-a-retro-console-a-guide-for-people-who-aren-t-freaks-90031659bd21
35 comments
> the available emulators may just not be good enough, such as for example the CDi and 3DO.
funnily enough, the first public version of 3DO is now available on the MiSTer (se: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyew7oHGyNE) - its doesn't seem perfect, but its not nothing!
funnily enough, the first public version of 3DO is now available on the MiSTer (se: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyew7oHGyNE) - its doesn't seem perfect, but its not nothing!
Emulating the 3DO is a complete pain in the ass, several reasons:
1. There’s not that much interest in general, most anything interesting got ports to other systems.
2. There’s no such thing as a 3DO. There were several, and all of them function slightly differently, usually an irrelevant difference in functionality, but if you’re making an accurate emulator it means you need to make a dozen emulators, actually.
3. Apparently the hardware is just weird in general. See also the N64 for an example of a system that suffers from this.
1. There’s not that much interest in general, most anything interesting got ports to other systems.
2. There’s no such thing as a 3DO. There were several, and all of them function slightly differently, usually an irrelevant difference in functionality, but if you’re making an accurate emulator it means you need to make a dozen emulators, actually.
3. Apparently the hardware is just weird in general. See also the N64 for an example of a system that suffers from this.
> I highly recommend not bothering at all with legitimate hardware. As I’ll dive deeper into in this guide, original hardware is expensive, hard to use with a modern TV, and prone to breaking. Retro game cartridges and discs are often more expensive than modern games. Retro consoles can often be very expensive too.
It really depends. My father found my old consoles in the loft and I decided to get them working.
- PlayStation 1,2 and Dreamcast are easy to get, easily to repair. Normally the biggest problem will be CD/DVD-ROM drive that is bad. These consoles are extremely reliable other than the DVD/CD drive. Repairing such as this are simple and can be done in literally minutes, with a screw driver.
- Games are relatively inexpensive for PS1, PS2 and Dreamcast. Yes Marvel vs Capcom 2 and Castlevania Symphony of the night will £500 for a copy, but the vast majority of games can be found in Good Condition for £5-20. Absolute mint condition games will be about £30-50. I buy a couple of games a month for each console and have a nice small collection of classic games (not anything too crazy, but decent).
- I was missing cables for the consoles (long since lost). I got official controllers, and cables for reasonable amount of money. Memory cards were cheap. I did have to take apart the old controllers and service them, but again nothing major.
- If you have a slightly older (late-2000s/early-2010s) LCD TV, the upscaler will actually work properly and the games look pretty reasonable. You can get HDMI upscalers for a reasonable price for these consoles. Cheap upscalers can be bought online for PS1/PS2 and Dreamcast and the results are "OK".
Emulation is obviously easier, with a few caveats. You must find a BIOS for the PS1 and PS2. These can be easily found with some googling. Also DuckStation has licensing doesn't allow it to be repackaged for your <linux distro>, so you have to use their app image or download & compile yourself. Which is a bit annoying, as I don't really know what to do with AppImages.
It really depends. My father found my old consoles in the loft and I decided to get them working.
- PlayStation 1,2 and Dreamcast are easy to get, easily to repair. Normally the biggest problem will be CD/DVD-ROM drive that is bad. These consoles are extremely reliable other than the DVD/CD drive. Repairing such as this are simple and can be done in literally minutes, with a screw driver.
- Games are relatively inexpensive for PS1, PS2 and Dreamcast. Yes Marvel vs Capcom 2 and Castlevania Symphony of the night will £500 for a copy, but the vast majority of games can be found in Good Condition for £5-20. Absolute mint condition games will be about £30-50. I buy a couple of games a month for each console and have a nice small collection of classic games (not anything too crazy, but decent).
- I was missing cables for the consoles (long since lost). I got official controllers, and cables for reasonable amount of money. Memory cards were cheap. I did have to take apart the old controllers and service them, but again nothing major.
- If you have a slightly older (late-2000s/early-2010s) LCD TV, the upscaler will actually work properly and the games look pretty reasonable. You can get HDMI upscalers for a reasonable price for these consoles. Cheap upscalers can be bought online for PS1/PS2 and Dreamcast and the results are "OK".
Emulation is obviously easier, with a few caveats. You must find a BIOS for the PS1 and PS2. These can be easily found with some googling. Also DuckStation has licensing doesn't allow it to be repackaged for your <linux distro>, so you have to use their app image or download & compile yourself. Which is a bit annoying, as I don't really know what to do with AppImages.
Cheap generic upscalers add significant latency and worse non-consistent latency. It might be OK for a turn based RPG like Persona 3, but it will drive you mad for games like DDR, Guitar Hero or heavily action based games.
As I said the results were "ok". Obviously you would need to buy a retrotink or something similar to have the best results but all but the most expensive models are often out of stock.
The biggest issue is that some stretch picture IMO. The latency is greatly exaggerated IME. I just used an older TV with a built in good upscaler (newer TV have worse upscalers).
The biggest issue is that some stretch picture IMO. The latency is greatly exaggerated IME. I just used an older TV with a built in good upscaler (newer TV have worse upscalers).
IDK, when I tried one DKC was completely unplayable. For some games it's very important. This has been a well documented problem with the cheap scalers.
They have other issues too and RetroRGB has a good video going over the problems:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUrqWN4AcJc
Not all TVs support 240p over component either, especially from the late 2000s/early 2010s which means you can run into problems with some PS1 games on a PS2 or earlier consoles.
https://www.hdretrovision.com/240p
These days there are clones of the RetroTink 2s and options like the ODV GBS-C that are decently priced and good options.
They have other issues too and RetroRGB has a good video going over the problems:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUrqWN4AcJc
Not all TVs support 240p over component either, especially from the late 2000s/early 2010s which means you can run into problems with some PS1 games on a PS2 or earlier consoles.
https://www.hdretrovision.com/240p
These days there are clones of the RetroTink 2s and options like the ODV GBS-C that are decently priced and good options.
I am aware of all this. This is why I said that depending on the box it can be either total garbage or "ok". At this point any emulation is always going to be easier.
We've been playing PS2 again recently. I think the optical drive still works but with Free McBoot on a memory card it's unnecessary - our games run directly from a network share (the slim PS2 has ethernet built-in)
Get a component video cable for it if at all possible.
Get a component video cable for it if at all possible.
> Which is a bit annoying, as I don't really know what to do with AppImages.
They're self-contained. You make them executable and run them. Store them in /use/local/bin or wherever you want.
They're self-contained. You make them executable and run them. Store them in /use/local/bin or wherever you want.
I'd rather they just distribute a tarball. If I am going to be pissing around copying files around just have tarball download. I ended up downloading from source and compiling. I've had to do this unfortunately with a lot of quasi open source projects.
You don't have to move them, and appimages can self-extract
> "For Wii it’s better to use a Wii U, because they support HDMI."
If you are going to buy a Wii U for wii games, make sure you buy one that actually has a gamepad, since they are useless without one (efforts are currently underway to make a working replacement, but currently you need a whole computer to pretend to be one)
If you are going to buy a Wii U for wii games, make sure you buy one that actually has a gamepad, since they are useless without one (efforts are currently underway to make a working replacement, but currently you need a whole computer to pretend to be one)
Eh, while they do need a Wii U Game Pad, once you're past setup you don't really need it except for a handful of games. Maybe to do the occasional settings change. If you're just using it as a Wii you can also press B on the Wii Remote while booting to boot straight into Wii Mode too.
I wouldn't recommend it for non-technical people, but people here would probably be fine.
I wouldn't recommend it for non-technical people, but people here would probably be fine.
Not really, you can now use a Steam Deck or similar to replace the original pad, yet, you'll need to have the Steam Deck though
https://github.com/vanilla-wiiu/vanilla
I read Retro console, see in comments people talking about PS2. There's even someone mentioning they bought a PS3, implying it is a retro console.
Man, I have a PS3 here. Not really as part of a retro collection, it was just the PS3 I bought close to the end of PS3 days. I never thought of that thing as retro. I now feel extremely old.
Either way, yeah, owning original hardware is something for hobbyists. To play ancient consoles as they were meant to be played you will be looking for CRT TVs, sometimes you will need to repair shit.
If you just want to experience old games, emulation is the way to go. Retroarch is an amazing tool for that, especially if you take the time to adjust settings (such as shaders for example) to make the pixel art look better on modern monitors.
Man, I have a PS3 here. Not really as part of a retro collection, it was just the PS3 I bought close to the end of PS3 days. I never thought of that thing as retro. I now feel extremely old.
Either way, yeah, owning original hardware is something for hobbyists. To play ancient consoles as they were meant to be played you will be looking for CRT TVs, sometimes you will need to repair shit.
If you just want to experience old games, emulation is the way to go. Retroarch is an amazing tool for that, especially if you take the time to adjust settings (such as shaders for example) to make the pixel art look better on modern monitors.
When I wrote this article I defined "retro" as "pre-HDMI".
no, you wrote:
"For the purpose of this guide, any game console newer than the Wii is not a “retro console” because you can easily use HDMI to connect them to your TV."
PS3 was released in NA on November 17th 2006 BEFORE Wii was released on November 19th 2006, which makes PS3 retro console according your definition since PS3 is older than Wii, so maybe next time don't name specific console and just say you consider everything without HDMI a retro console.
"For the purpose of this guide, any game console newer than the Wii is not a “retro console” because you can easily use HDMI to connect them to your TV."
PS3 was released in NA on November 17th 2006 BEFORE Wii was released on November 19th 2006, which makes PS3 retro console according your definition since PS3 is older than Wii, so maybe next time don't name specific console and just say you consider everything without HDMI a retro console.
I went down this rabbit hole, and am now the proud owner of a PS2 (Slim), a PS2 (Fat), a PS3 (Fat), a PS4 Pro and a PS5. I also own a Nintendo Switch and a Gaming PC.
After installing a custom firmware on the PS3, I am now able to play my PS2 games, and also have the benefit of using HDMI without an expensive upscaler.
Turns out, the PS3 satisfied my needs to relive childhood memories, although I never had one as a kid growing up.
Also, I started reading books again. A pretty hassle-free childhood memory, to say the least.
After installing a custom firmware on the PS3, I am now able to play my PS2 games, and also have the benefit of using HDMI without an expensive upscaler.
Turns out, the PS3 satisfied my needs to relive childhood memories, although I never had one as a kid growing up.
Also, I started reading books again. A pretty hassle-free childhood memory, to say the least.
For N64 and back, a MiSTer is a good option these days. Because of the Mister Pi and QM-Tech clones and clones of the clones prices have dropped a fair bit.
What I can highly recommend is the (free) RetroArch app for AppleTV. You upload your legally owned ROM files via a simple web interface and you can just pair your bluetooth gamepad with the AppleTV.
Side node: The same thing works on phones, too. While most of the games are not very fun on a touch screen, I've found that turn based games like RPGs hold up remarkably well.
edit: I'm referring to AppleTV the box, not the service
Side node: The same thing works on phones, too. While most of the games are not very fun on a touch screen, I've found that turn based games like RPGs hold up remarkably well.
edit: I'm referring to AppleTV the box, not the service
What happens if you upload illegally owned ROMs, does Retroarch has some verification on Apple TV? Never noticed it when playing on Android TV or PS3, so the words "your legally owned" seem redundant.
Not true, at least not in this all encompassing clickbait sense. $25 buys you a hackable R36S with 4 core cpu, 1gb ram, runs Debian off dual microsd with dual usb-c for any peripherials, swappable battery, emulation perf up to PSX. There are many more cheap, capable options.
I'd say "retro console" in the linux handheld sense is the best value hobby gadget to buy for the HN crowd.
I'd say "retro console" in the linux handheld sense is the best value hobby gadget to buy for the HN crowd.
I'm surprised the author finds emulation not worth covering, that's obviously the best way to play old games in the vast majority of cases. I guess maybe they wanted to keep up the kayfabe that everyone is getting roms from the original media.
Recommending RetroArch seems needlessly complex too, I'd figure it'd be simpler to learn how to operate a given emulator for a given system since the scope is narrower. DuckStation's UI for example is pretty friendly.
RetroArch seemed pretty easy to set up? Unless you're doing custom key bindings, it was relatively easy to navigate through the emulators.
Owning multiple Nintendo Switch consoles and have multiple people in the household using the Nintendo Switch Online subscription (the family pack) to play couch split screen type games magical.
Far better experience than traditional emulation.
Far better experience than traditional emulation.
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Mister FPGA is something definitely worth checking out if you're into this stuff.
It is hard to take seriously someone who claims this:
"Some rare PS3 models are compatible with PS2 games."
All PS3 models can play PS2 games (just not from disc, who borthers with discs in 2026 anyway?).
"For the purpose of this guide, any game console newer than the Wii is not a “retro console” because you can easily use HDMI to connect them to your TV."
PS3 was released in NA November 17th 2006 BEFORE NEWER Wii was released November 19th 2006, which makes PS3 retro console according his definition.
Thanks to Hen PS3 is amazing console where you can play natively PS1, PS2 and PS3 games (just search "game name ROM" in Google) + you can use RetroArch to play NES, SNES and other console older games. I find it funny even PS3 is nowadays considered retro console considering it has pretty amazing graphics, not that bad from newest games.
I bought mine used PS3 Slim for 40EUR including original dualshock controller and HDMI cable (local classifieds in EU) + we had already two other ipega gamepads we used before to play NES/SNES/N64 and Android games with kids on Android TV (though mostly SNES). This is first console in my life, when I was kid we played games on ZX Spectrum, C64 and later on desktop PCs, consoles were just too expensive/limited compared to versatile PC.
It was the best 40EUR spent on gaming, all it took was to install firmware with HEN and then I can download and play whatever I want with kids, just getting the game in is PITA, since I can't make it to recognize NTFS drive, FAT32 limit kills most of the ISOs, so usually I just copy them through FTP which takes looong time (think 1MB/s).
According author you should not want to buy PS3, I fail to see the reason, it use standard HDMI cable and can emulate lot of consoles and play thousands of games.
My kids also like playing games on their cheap Data Frog SF2000 handhels retro console with tons of games from various consoles on memory card, you can add other games.
All PS3 models can play PS2 games (just not from disc, who borthers with discs in 2026 anyway?).
"For the purpose of this guide, any game console newer than the Wii is not a “retro console” because you can easily use HDMI to connect them to your TV."
PS3 was released in NA November 17th 2006 BEFORE NEWER Wii was released November 19th 2006, which makes PS3 retro console according his definition.
Thanks to Hen PS3 is amazing console where you can play natively PS1, PS2 and PS3 games (just search "game name ROM" in Google) + you can use RetroArch to play NES, SNES and other console older games. I find it funny even PS3 is nowadays considered retro console considering it has pretty amazing graphics, not that bad from newest games.
I bought mine used PS3 Slim for 40EUR including original dualshock controller and HDMI cable (local classifieds in EU) + we had already two other ipega gamepads we used before to play NES/SNES/N64 and Android games with kids on Android TV (though mostly SNES). This is first console in my life, when I was kid we played games on ZX Spectrum, C64 and later on desktop PCs, consoles were just too expensive/limited compared to versatile PC.
It was the best 40EUR spent on gaming, all it took was to install firmware with HEN and then I can download and play whatever I want with kids, just getting the game in is PITA, since I can't make it to recognize NTFS drive, FAT32 limit kills most of the ISOs, so usually I just copy them through FTP which takes looong time (think 1MB/s).
According author you should not want to buy PS3, I fail to see the reason, it use standard HDMI cable and can emulate lot of consoles and play thousands of games.
My kids also like playing games on their cheap Data Frog SF2000 handhels retro console with tons of games from various consoles on memory card, you can add other games.
> For Nintendo games specifically, the way to play them is to buy a Nintendo Switch or Nintendo Switch 2 and subscribe to the Nintendo Switch Online service for $20
Unless you absolutely need to play these games away from home and a phone isn't good enough, please just emulate on a computer instead of paying a subscription for some mediocre emulators that you can't even own permanently.
Also, the article really should mention why cheap generic HDMI converters are bad instead of just saying they're not recommended (the lower video quality is obvious, but what's less obvious is that they usually have significant latency that may make certain types of games much less pleasant to play)
Unless you absolutely need to play these games away from home and a phone isn't good enough, please just emulate on a computer instead of paying a subscription for some mediocre emulators that you can't even own permanently.
Also, the article really should mention why cheap generic HDMI converters are bad instead of just saying they're not recommended (the lower video quality is obvious, but what's less obvious is that they usually have significant latency that may make certain types of games much less pleasant to play)
Nintendo Switch Online has insanely easy-to-use netplay for retrogames between consoles that were formerly locked to a single console.
Even with the latency/frame stuttering inherent in this sort of thing, it's been pretty amazing to re-play games with childhood friends who are now dispersed across the planet.
Switch 2 is not emulable currently, and likely won't be in a very good while.
I think you misunderstood; they were talking about your switch running an emulator for legacy games via subscription vs running that for no subscription on your phone and/or computer
Using an LCD adds unacceptable delays, even if you get a very expensive upscaler (though they do reduce it a lot, but not entirely) at which point you lose all of the advantage of using original hardware or an expensive hardware emulator.
If you're going to play on an LCD, just use a PC with the Duckstation, Mesen, Dolphin, MAME, Final Burn Neo, and PCSX2 emulators, which will get you all of the popular retro systems emulated more than good enough. Retroarch can be added if you need some of the other systems.
Note also that if you play on a sufficiently high-res and high-refresh monitor, there are some really convincing CRT simulation shaders, including realistic phosphor delay.
There's two exceptions to the above: N64 emulation is still not perfect, and if you want to play something more obscure, the available emulators may just not be good enough, such as for example the CDi and 3DO. In those cases, real hardware is better even if you don't have a CRT.
Edit: Oh and of course handhelds are honestly best played in handheld form factor. Either get original hardware, or one of the million small handheld emulation devices, all these systems are emulated near perfectly.