Complete Guide to Buying Lumber (2015)(artofmanliness.com)
artofmanliness.com
Complete Guide to Buying Lumber (2015)
https://www.artofmanliness.com/articles/primer-on-lumber/
69 comments
Having just rebuilt a deck and installed 200sqft of wood flooring, I'd like to add that if you are just dabbling in around the house projects, you can get much further than you might expect with a hand saw. I have a circular saw, but it both scares the piss out of me and is hard to keep on the line.
A hand saw theoretically takes longer, but I also don't have to worry about my kids getting hold of it and killing themselves. If I was cutting plywood to size, I'd probably still get out the circular saw, but for basically everything else the handsaw is my tool of choice.
A hand saw theoretically takes longer, but I also don't have to worry about my kids getting hold of it and killing themselves. If I was cutting plywood to size, I'd probably still get out the circular saw, but for basically everything else the handsaw is my tool of choice.
>I have a circular saw, but it both scares the piss out of me and is hard to keep on the line.
Nothing to be scared of, respected yes. to aid with straight cuts, you can clamp down a straight edge (2x4, level, etc) to let the base of the saw glide against. make sure what ever you are cutting has proper support so that the weight doesn't cause the material to sag at the cut (pinching the blade is big factor in kick backs and stalls)
i also find it similar to driving a car. if you look at the road directly in front of you, you'll swerve more than if you look further ahead. don't watch where the blade is cutting, but the notch in the frame of the base. you'll get the hang of it to the point you'll be able to cut a 4'x8' sheet of plywood length wise without issues
Nothing to be scared of, respected yes. to aid with straight cuts, you can clamp down a straight edge (2x4, level, etc) to let the base of the saw glide against. make sure what ever you are cutting has proper support so that the weight doesn't cause the material to sag at the cut (pinching the blade is big factor in kick backs and stalls)
i also find it similar to driving a car. if you look at the road directly in front of you, you'll swerve more than if you look further ahead. don't watch where the blade is cutting, but the notch in the frame of the base. you'll get the hang of it to the point you'll be able to cut a 4'x8' sheet of plywood length wise without issues
The other tip that helps with cutting straight with a circular saw is to set the cut depth just shallow enough to go through the material. If the blade is deep, it is harder to turn.
> Nothing to be scared of, respected yes.
That's more accurate. I was probably overselling my fear of the saw. Mostly I find it to be more of a bother than it's worth for what I've been doing.
Really, a miter saw would be the power tool that would have been useful for me given the project's I've been working on recently. But also cutting a board to length isn't hard and it's kind of nice to see yourself get better making square cuts.
Edit:
Also thanks for the tips. Appreciate it.
That's more accurate. I was probably overselling my fear of the saw. Mostly I find it to be more of a bother than it's worth for what I've been doing.
Really, a miter saw would be the power tool that would have been useful for me given the project's I've been working on recently. But also cutting a board to length isn't hard and it's kind of nice to see yourself get better making square cuts.
Edit:
Also thanks for the tips. Appreciate it.
You're next project you'll find yourself buying the chop/mitre saw. Then you'll find the cut it can't do for the next project, and you'll see yourself getting a router, and then a routing table, and then... Next thing you know, you can't park your car in the garage anymore because it's no longer a garage. it's now a woodshop!
A boy can dream, but we're low on space as it is. It's part of the reason I've been sticking to hand tools.
Also just being enamored with the stuff I see on The Woodwrights Shop. Quick plug that PBS has the most recent ten season of The Woodwrights Shop available on their website [1]. I always changed the channel when I was younger and it came on. Not sure if it's just an appreciation that comes with age or if I just didn't give it a fair shake before, but it's really a great show.
[1] https://www.pbs.org/show/woodwrights-shop/
Also just being enamored with the stuff I see on The Woodwrights Shop. Quick plug that PBS has the most recent ten season of The Woodwrights Shop available on their website [1]. I always changed the channel when I was younger and it came on. Not sure if it's just an appreciation that comes with age or if I just didn't give it a fair shake before, but it's really a great show.
[1] https://www.pbs.org/show/woodwrights-shop/
> a miter saw would be the power tool that would have been useful for me given the project's I've been working on recently.
Most of the projects I've done and did with my father when I was younger we done with a miter. If you're just making straight cuts on 2x4's, a miter is safe and easy to use. They are more expensive, but great tools, though they aren't as versatile as circular saws. Remember that every tool has a different job. If you have the money, it is always worth buying the tool than just winging it with what you have. I'll admit, and anyone that has used power tools will, that the close calls and dangerous stuff I've done is generally from a winging it situation. You shouldn't be scared, but you should always be paying attention and try to always use the right tool. Especially when the wrong tool doesn't work the first time. It is better to trade a few beers with your neighbor for a few hours with their tool than to get injured.
Most of the projects I've done and did with my father when I was younger we done with a miter. If you're just making straight cuts on 2x4's, a miter is safe and easy to use. They are more expensive, but great tools, though they aren't as versatile as circular saws. Remember that every tool has a different job. If you have the money, it is always worth buying the tool than just winging it with what you have. I'll admit, and anyone that has used power tools will, that the close calls and dangerous stuff I've done is generally from a winging it situation. You shouldn't be scared, but you should always be paying attention and try to always use the right tool. Especially when the wrong tool doesn't work the first time. It is better to trade a few beers with your neighbor for a few hours with their tool than to get injured.
One of my favorite You-tubers Andrew Camarata told the story of how he got a chainsaw at 10 years old. He hid it from his dad for months and used it. Then when his dad saw it he allowed him to use it on the provisio that he "be careful".
The trouble with the world today is that we're no longer allowing our kids to do anything useful for fear that they "injure" themselves.
So everyone grow up not really knowing even how to hammer a nail. I sympathize with your feeling having a kid myself, but without exposing them to even some slight danger, they will not grow up learning how to navigate the dangers in the world.
The trouble with the world today is that we're no longer allowing our kids to do anything useful for fear that they "injure" themselves.
So everyone grow up not really knowing even how to hammer a nail. I sympathize with your feeling having a kid myself, but without exposing them to even some slight danger, they will not grow up learning how to navigate the dangers in the world.
My friends have a kid. Every time she stands on top of something adults don’t normally stand on, they tell her to get off because she could hurt herself. Like standing on a chair, standing on a concrete thing outside, etc. Whenever she’s doing something slightly dangerous, they demand that she stops. They don’t even say “be careful, you could fall”. They just sternly say “get down from there that’s not safe.” Hard to watch.
Sawstop saws are pretty cool [0]. I’ve been in the woodshop of a nearby high school that has two of their table saws installed. On the wall are attached three wrecked blades from a student setting off the safety mechanism. Each one could have been some kid’s finger or hand.
I’m sympathetic to your argument - but power tools aren’t ‘slight’ danger.
[0]https://www.sawstop.com/
I’m sympathetic to your argument - but power tools aren’t ‘slight’ danger.
[0]https://www.sawstop.com/
They are not a problem if a parent teaches young kids how to use them properly. I'm not for just throwing power tools at kids.
The point i'm making is that in high school we had wood and metal shop. Welding. Electrical. NONE of those classes exist anymore. And with helicopter parenting kids aren't learning them either.
The point i'm making is that in high school we had wood and metal shop. Welding. Electrical. NONE of those classes exist anymore. And with helicopter parenting kids aren't learning them either.
The problem with power tools is that even if you know how to use them, a momentary lapse can lead to permanent disability. My father has been using them for decades. He got stupid with a table saw once recently and severed the tendons to half his fingers. A few tens of thousands in reconstructive surgery later, we're still not sure if he'll ever be 100% in that hand. Statistically, some kids are going to do the same. I can totally understand why people don't think the marginal utility of being able to use power tools outweighs the risk without safety measures like the sawstop.
> They are not a problem if a parent teaches young kids how to use them properly.
The statistics don’t bear out that training or experience eliminates risk of serious injury. It’s even trivially disprovable with anecdotes - tons of experienced woodworkers have had blade touches and/or kickback-induced blade touches. Here’s 3:
https://www.woodworkingfunhour.com/blog/2020/1/16/015-matts-...
https://twitter.com/JimmyDiResta/status/318214766818635776
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fifjjacjLBE
If anyone is learning advanced shop safety, a few years ago I made the advanced survey that I wished existed: http://sawsafely.org/ . http://sawsafely.org/#injury-research-&-statistics has table saw injury stats. In an era of flesh-detecting table saws, using a table saw without it (other than weird special-purpose saws) means underestimating either the probability or the consequences.
The statistics don’t bear out that training or experience eliminates risk of serious injury. It’s even trivially disprovable with anecdotes - tons of experienced woodworkers have had blade touches and/or kickback-induced blade touches. Here’s 3:
https://www.woodworkingfunhour.com/blog/2020/1/16/015-matts-...
https://twitter.com/JimmyDiResta/status/318214766818635776
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fifjjacjLBE
If anyone is learning advanced shop safety, a few years ago I made the advanced survey that I wished existed: http://sawsafely.org/ . http://sawsafely.org/#injury-research-&-statistics has table saw injury stats. In an era of flesh-detecting table saws, using a table saw without it (other than weird special-purpose saws) means underestimating either the probability or the consequences.
My father's trade was journeyman carpenter. His hands are so mangled and scarred from saws and air nailers. He has been doing it so long that he doesn't pay attention.
For myself, every time I pick up a saw, I imagine cutting my finger off and it makes me take care.
When I aim the air nailer, I make sure my hands are further away than the nail length. I've had nails deflect on unseen defects inside the wood and poke out the other side where I didn't expect.
For myself, every time I pick up a saw, I imagine cutting my finger off and it makes me take care.
When I aim the air nailer, I make sure my hands are further away than the nail length. I've had nails deflect on unseen defects inside the wood and poke out the other side where I didn't expect.
I think the point (certainly one I would make) is not that risk doesn't exist, but that overavoidance of risk is a problem. Yes, given the prevalence of power tools, there are statistically going to be some accidents (especially with the cavalier culture many shops have regarding tools). And yes, it sucks to be the statistic. I'm still glad I grew up around tools (and people who knew how to use them). As a result, I'm pretty handy with them, unlike many adults I know who are just super-awkward around them.
Regarding flesh-detecting table saws (which I fully support), there's a third possibility - lack of funds. Those things are seriously expensive. When the choice is not between sawstop and traditional saws, but instead traditional table saw or none, the traditional table saw can still be a worthy investment. It's all situational.
Regarding flesh-detecting table saws (which I fully support), there's a third possibility - lack of funds. Those things are seriously expensive. When the choice is not between sawstop and traditional saws, but instead traditional table saw or none, the traditional table saw can still be a worthy investment. It's all situational.
> The point i'm making is that in high school we had wood and metal shop. Welding. Electrical. NONE of those classes exist anymore. And with helicopter parenting kids aren't learning them either.
I had woodworking in high school, but no metal shop, no welding, no electrical. And most of the woodworking class was spent hand-sanding with worn out sandpaper from a drawer full - because the school didn't have enough funding to buy new paper each semester.
That said, I am better prepared for doing welding or electrical than my older relatives at my age, because I have access to youtube. It might be less reliable than learning it in school would have been, but I don't remember much from high school shop class anyway.
I had woodworking in high school, but no metal shop, no welding, no electrical. And most of the woodworking class was spent hand-sanding with worn out sandpaper from a drawer full - because the school didn't have enough funding to buy new paper each semester.
That said, I am better prepared for doing welding or electrical than my older relatives at my age, because I have access to youtube. It might be less reliable than learning it in school would have been, but I don't remember much from high school shop class anyway.
Sawstops are great and likely the reason I still count in base ten (I set one off in my university's woodshop years ago). The saw I was using at the time cost upwards of $10k (I was told) and the cartridges that stop the blade were ~$100 each at the time.
Even though I was using a tool with a very high tolerance for error, it was thoroughly impressed upon me that each cut I make requires consideration of the danger I am exposing myself to.
I use a $150 table saw today, and for every cut I make I run through a mental checklist to determine whether what I am going to be doing is within my own personal acceptable margin of safety, because that thing will not care one bit if my finger is in the way.
I'm all for safe tools, but my fear is that it grants a false sense of security for the user (in particular new ones), particularly when translating those skills to a new tool (another table saw in this case).
Even though I was using a tool with a very high tolerance for error, it was thoroughly impressed upon me that each cut I make requires consideration of the danger I am exposing myself to.
I use a $150 table saw today, and for every cut I make I run through a mental checklist to determine whether what I am going to be doing is within my own personal acceptable margin of safety, because that thing will not care one bit if my finger is in the way.
I'm all for safe tools, but my fear is that it grants a false sense of security for the user (in particular new ones), particularly when translating those skills to a new tool (another table saw in this case).
This.
There's that promotional video with the hotdog where the saw doesn't even open a gash in it. Just pops right down.
That's nice and all for marketing, but the reality is that even Sawstops can mess up fingers pretty good. Sure, there's a far better chance of you keeping it, but still.
It's a last line of defense. A person really ought to act as though it isn't even there.
There's that promotional video with the hotdog where the saw doesn't even open a gash in it. Just pops right down.
That's nice and all for marketing, but the reality is that even Sawstops can mess up fingers pretty good. Sure, there's a far better chance of you keeping it, but still.
It's a last line of defense. A person really ought to act as though it isn't even there.
Table saws are probably the most dangerous power tool in the wood shop. Kick back is more likely than inadvertently sticking a finger in the blade. In fact most amputations are from kick back pulling fingers into the blade. Saw stop is amazing tech. Just be sure to use a splitter or riving knife
Well, they're 4, 2, and 2. Maybe in a couple years we'll get more adventurous with power tools. They're still working on "don't run out in front of cars"
Fewer kids probably after missing fingers these days
"I have a circular saw, but it both scares the piss out of me and is hard to keep on the line."
You should buy a large size "speed square":
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_square
They are thick and have a lip so you square the lip against the edge of your board and that gives you a straight edge to run your circular saw against.
No clamping, nothing complicated - your non-sawing hand holds the square against the board instead of just holding the board itself and then the saw can just run along the straight edge.
I never pick up a circular saw without picking up the large speed square. Here is a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJ95G0hRyFo
You should buy a large size "speed square":
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_square
They are thick and have a lip so you square the lip against the edge of your board and that gives you a straight edge to run your circular saw against.
No clamping, nothing complicated - your non-sawing hand holds the square against the board instead of just holding the board itself and then the saw can just run along the straight edge.
I never pick up a circular saw without picking up the large speed square. Here is a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJ95G0hRyFo
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One more: The stores won't cut pressure-treated for you -- "It's toxic". So you'll need a circular saw, and a good respirator, which may be hard to buy just now ...
For what it’s worth, PT lumber has been arsenic-free, in the US at least, for almost 20 years now
Does anyone happen to know how toxic the new copper compounds are? Obviously they are toxic enough to microbes to make the wood rot resistant.
Also a fun fact I learned since our deck was originally built 15-20 years ago shortly after the switch-over to the new treated wood:
They needed to re-formulate the coatings they put on fasteners to hold up decent in the new treated wood. It took them a couple years to figure that out or at least for the knowledge to be widely known.
All the screws in our deck that I took out were corroded to the point that many of them looked more like toothpicks than screws when I removed them.
Also a fun fact I learned since our deck was originally built 15-20 years ago shortly after the switch-over to the new treated wood:
They needed to re-formulate the coatings they put on fasteners to hold up decent in the new treated wood. It took them a couple years to figure that out or at least for the knowledge to be widely known.
All the screws in our deck that I took out were corroded to the point that many of them looked more like toothpicks than screws when I removed them.
They still won't cut it.
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Buy some ratchet straps and be bold — you can drag home plywood on the roof of your car. Just batten it down well. (Unless you’re very precious about the finish of your car)
buy a few swimming pool noodles and put them underneath the load, very cheap and effective. Put a twist in the lengths of ratchet straps too and it will prevent them whistling at speed
if you're at a big box store like home depot/lowes, and you find yourself without the swimming noodles you can substitute the outdoor pipe insulation that comes in long foam tubes. or look in the moving supplies area for furniture pads.
A few of those bullet points sound like a reason to have a friend with a truck.
Many home improvement stores also let you rent a truck for something in the neighborhood of $20.
Also, you could check with your local lumber yard. Their products are often slightly more expensive, but also significantly higher quality. Plus, the one I go to will deliver for free within city limits.
Also, you could check with your local lumber yard. Their products are often slightly more expensive, but also significantly higher quality. Plus, the one I go to will deliver for free within city limits.
Having a sunroof has saved me more often than I care to admit.
With an inexpensive battery powered sawzaw you can rough cut the lumber in the parking lot. That resolves pretty much all your bullet points.
The explanation of dimensional sizing isn't quite correct. The lumber is indeed cut at the mill to its nominal size (like 2x4), but it's rough from the saw. (They use big, fast saws that tear up the wood.) Rough-sawn used to be sold, and you'll sometimes see nominal-size lumber in old houses. You may even be able to find it at some lumber yards, but it's rare.
To neaten up the board, the mill usually then surfaces it on all four sides, shaving off the rough cut to leave a nice smooth surface. This takes off around a quarter inch per side. Thus a 2x4 ends up as 1.5" x 3.5".
It's a little strange, but makes sense historically and per manufacturing practice. Kinda like a "quarter pounder". But what's really inexcusable is that plywood is no longer sticking to its nominal size. A 3/4" thick ply is actually 23/32” thick. For a full table see: https://www.inchcalculator.com/actual-plywood-thickness-size...
To neaten up the board, the mill usually then surfaces it on all four sides, shaving off the rough cut to leave a nice smooth surface. This takes off around a quarter inch per side. Thus a 2x4 ends up as 1.5" x 3.5".
It's a little strange, but makes sense historically and per manufacturing practice. Kinda like a "quarter pounder". But what's really inexcusable is that plywood is no longer sticking to its nominal size. A 3/4" thick ply is actually 23/32” thick. For a full table see: https://www.inchcalculator.com/actual-plywood-thickness-size...
"The lumber is indeed cut at the mill to its nominal size (like 2x4)"
That is still true today?
That is still true today?
I do industrial IT for a Candian wood products manufacturer (dimension lumber, studs, veneer, plywood, OSB and previously Kraft paper) and I can say for certain that it is still sawed to a 2" by 4" shape in the sawmill and (after being kiln-dried) planed down in, well, the planermill. The 2x4 is "nominal" and doesn't represent the final dimensions of the finished product. And yes, rough 2x4 lumber is still sold, and it is in fact 2" x 4".
Wood products manufacturing is fascinating, and I could go on about various minutiae all day. AMA I guess?
Wood products manufacturing is fascinating, and I could go on about various minutiae all day. AMA I guess?
Is the metric system on the horizon?
There is a mix of metric and non-metric products, with panel products having more than lumber. Occasionally you even run into other weird measuring systems such as in traditional Japanese beams.
North America seems very stuck in imperial measures when it comes to lumber specifically, likely due to entrenched skills and thinking in carpentry. Even PET (precision end trimmed) products designed for cookie-cutter construction are in inches (eg 140 and 5/8").
There is even resistance by old guys against metric threading on machines since all the old tooling and warehouse stock is imperial!
Well any interesting facts would be useful.
Yeah I’m not sure about that still being the case. I’ve always read that these numbers are just a historical artifact.
If mills can cut closer to actual vs nominal sizes and finish equally, then they will choose that, because every cut turns $(wood) into trash(sawdust).
Big box stores (Home Depot, Lowes, and Menards if you're in the midwest) are not generally great places to buy lumber. They're convenient if you're in a pinch and need a couple boards, but they're expensive, their framing lumber quality is really poor, and their hardwood selection is really limited.
For framing (softwood) lumber, you want to find a local lumberyard. Their prices will be more competitive than you expect (my local supplier is about 5% cheaper than Home Depot!), but what you're really going there for is the night and day difference in quality - boards that are supposed to be straight will actually be straight! Their hours are usually not convenient for a DIY-er (8-5 M-F, _maybe_ 8-noon on Saturday), but they'll usually deliver for free or a reasonable fee, and these days most of them will do business over email.
For hardwoods, you want to find a hardwood lumber supplier. These are pretty narrowly targeted at woodworkers, furniture makers, and cabinet makers, and don't sell much besides hardwoods and cabinet-grade plywood - you wouldn't even buy a 2x4 at these places. But they'll carry species and sizes of wood that neither a big box store or a normal lumberyard carry - you want some 4/4 wormy maple to build a tabletop out of? They'll be the only ones that have it.
As for finding these places, the best thing to do is just do some googling and ask your friends/family/coworkers. These places don't advertise much so it's not particularly obvious to a beginner how to find them or that they even exist.
For framing (softwood) lumber, you want to find a local lumberyard. Their prices will be more competitive than you expect (my local supplier is about 5% cheaper than Home Depot!), but what you're really going there for is the night and day difference in quality - boards that are supposed to be straight will actually be straight! Their hours are usually not convenient for a DIY-er (8-5 M-F, _maybe_ 8-noon on Saturday), but they'll usually deliver for free or a reasonable fee, and these days most of them will do business over email.
For hardwoods, you want to find a hardwood lumber supplier. These are pretty narrowly targeted at woodworkers, furniture makers, and cabinet makers, and don't sell much besides hardwoods and cabinet-grade plywood - you wouldn't even buy a 2x4 at these places. But they'll carry species and sizes of wood that neither a big box store or a normal lumberyard carry - you want some 4/4 wormy maple to build a tabletop out of? They'll be the only ones that have it.
As for finding these places, the best thing to do is just do some googling and ask your friends/family/coworkers. These places don't advertise much so it's not particularly obvious to a beginner how to find them or that they even exist.
> these days most of them will do business over email.
This has been super convenient for me. I email the guy at the lumber yard, "Hey, I'm thinking about doing X. I think I'll need these supplies. Can you get me a quote?"
He responds with a price list, maybe some substitution suggestions, and we barter back and forth a bit until I say "Yes, please order that for me." Then if it's a special order, he'll say, "Great, I'll let you know when it arrives."
It's a very satisfying process. Plus I always send pictures after I complete the project, which I think both of us enjoy.
This has been super convenient for me. I email the guy at the lumber yard, "Hey, I'm thinking about doing X. I think I'll need these supplies. Can you get me a quote?"
He responds with a price list, maybe some substitution suggestions, and we barter back and forth a bit until I say "Yes, please order that for me." Then if it's a special order, he'll say, "Great, I'll let you know when it arrives."
It's a very satisfying process. Plus I always send pictures after I complete the project, which I think both of us enjoy.
> their framing lumber quality is really poor
For 1x and 2x softwood at big box stores, assume that the 10% of pieces that are the most accessible have been picked over and rejected by previous customers. If you just need strength, take almost anything, but if you want nicer-looking boards, be as picky as those who shopped before you.
For 1x and 2x softwood at big box stores, assume that the 10% of pieces that are the most accessible have been picked over and rejected by previous customers. If you just need strength, take almost anything, but if you want nicer-looking boards, be as picky as those who shopped before you.
> they're expensive
Not here in California. All big-box lumber is always less expensive than any lumber yard. I've never seen it otherwise.
Not here in California. All big-box lumber is always less expensive than any lumber yard. I've never seen it otherwise.
Not relevant to the article, but I just want to say that woodworking is fun. Yes, there's a lot of things to learn, everything from the wood/material itself, to the tooling, to finishing. Just starting with small stuff is great, and doesn't need to be expensive.
We learned woodworking in school, and had a really great teacher throughout the years. I later started playing guitar, and use a ton of what we learned when building or fixing my instruments. Currently working on a mahogany body, and it's very soothing work.
We learned woodworking in school, and had a really great teacher throughout the years. I later started playing guitar, and use a ton of what we learned when building or fixing my instruments. Currently working on a mahogany body, and it's very soothing work.
i'll throw out a mention of the youtube channel Sampson Boat Company: https://www.youtube.com/c/SampsonBoatCo
it's one guy and various volunteers working to restore a >100 year old wooden sailing yacht. while he isn't even trying to teach wood working, i've learned quite a bit, and he's certainly caused me to reevaluate what can be accomplished with wood.
it's one guy and various volunteers working to restore a >100 year old wooden sailing yacht. while he isn't even trying to teach wood working, i've learned quite a bit, and he's certainly caused me to reevaluate what can be accomplished with wood.
One piece of advice that I would like to offer is to not order wood for delivery - whether from your local hardware store or a lumber yard, etc.
You will receive the crummiest batch of warped, twisted, banana shaped boards. You're getting all of the rejected pieces that the smart people rejected.
While I typically bemoan the time I spend hand picking lumber at the lumber yard, it is always time well spent - even the high quality material (kiln dried, clear, etc.) has a very wide range of quality and defects.
You will receive the crummiest batch of warped, twisted, banana shaped boards. You're getting all of the rejected pieces that the smart people rejected.
While I typically bemoan the time I spend hand picking lumber at the lumber yard, it is always time well spent - even the high quality material (kiln dried, clear, etc.) has a very wide range of quality and defects.
> not order wood for delivery - whether from your local hardware store or a lumber yard
I just had 45 1x8s delivered from the local lumberyard. After they dropped it off, they said, "We have some more in stock still, so if you find any that are bad, let us know and we'll swap them out. They all looked good to us though"
Having now gone through all of the wood, they were spot on. It's great wood.
I just had 45 1x8s delivered from the local lumberyard. After they dropped it off, they said, "We have some more in stock still, so if you find any that are bad, let us know and we'll swap them out. They all looked good to us though"
Having now gone through all of the wood, they were spot on. It's great wood.
Sorry - I should have qualified my comment as relating to framing lumber - 2x4 and 2x6, etc.
1x8 and so on is usually of decent quality and relatively uniform.
1x8 and so on is usually of decent quality and relatively uniform.
I think it depends on the store. Big box lumber racks are often rummaged by buyers who want the better stuff and an employee who loads it for shipping is left with junk. But a lot of pro lumberyards either don't let people rummage or all their lumber is better quality. I ordered 40 4x4x8 pressure treated boards from a pro yard last year and only one of them came with any problem (a split).
PT boards (for some reason) tend to be relatively straight and true - at least that has been my experience in California.
"the complete guide to buying lumber at home depot for simple diy projects"
There is so much more about lumber to know than this. It's a mistake to (only) consider big box stores for lumber.
If you like to learn more about wood, wood grades, milling, drying and working wood, I can wholeheartedly recommend the "wood talk" podcast with Marc Spagnuolo, Matt Cremona and Shannon Rogers, as well as the "lumber industry update" podcast by Shannon Rogers. They all have great YouTube channels too.
There is so much more about lumber to know than this. It's a mistake to (only) consider big box stores for lumber.
If you like to learn more about wood, wood grades, milling, drying and working wood, I can wholeheartedly recommend the "wood talk" podcast with Marc Spagnuolo, Matt Cremona and Shannon Rogers, as well as the "lumber industry update" podcast by Shannon Rogers. They all have great YouTube channels too.
Plywood has become significantly more complicated. See https://www.columbiaforestproducts.com/library/reference-gui... for example.
Agreed on going to a lumberyard or specialty wood store for hardwoods. It's great fun to check out coco bolo, ebony, zebra wood if you've never seen them before.
Agreed on going to a lumberyard or specialty wood store for hardwoods. It's great fun to check out coco bolo, ebony, zebra wood if you've never seen them before.
> ... as a piece of softwood lumber dries, it shrinks. That can change plans for how it’s used on the job site.
This was quite a revelation when I first tried to build something with 2x4's. They weren't 2"x4"!
This was quite a revelation when I first tried to build something with 2x4's. They weren't 2"x4"!
If you're referring to the fact that they were 1.5" by 3.5", that wasn't shrinkage. That's nominal vs. Actual size.
The lumber is indeed 2x4 at rough cut, but when you buy S4S (surfaced four sides) lumber, it's been surfaced down smooth. That process takes some material off, leaving you with the half-inch discrepancy.
The lumber is indeed 2x4 at rough cut, but when you buy S4S (surfaced four sides) lumber, it's been surfaced down smooth. That process takes some material off, leaving you with the half-inch discrepancy.
Well I think it's even more important to consider that if anything you make is exposed to moisture (including simply being in a high humidity environment) then it will expand across the grain. That can cause problems. Favorite story is how my beachfront dad hired a handyman to install a door and the next day it was stuck.
Surprised to not see any mention of avoiding heart-center containing boards.
In my experience those are much more prone to warping, twisting, and splitting as they continue drying and acclimating to the destination environment.
In my experience those are much more prone to warping, twisting, and splitting as they continue drying and acclimating to the destination environment.
Yeah it’s generally a bad idea to leave the center pith in your project.
However, I often buy a nice clear 2x10 (or 2x8 or whatever) that has pith down the middle, and then just rip it into 2x4s that avoid the pith. The overall quality of the wider boards tends to be much better than the garbage that gets made into 2x4s at the mill.
However, I often buy a nice clear 2x10 (or 2x8 or whatever) that has pith down the middle, and then just rip it into 2x4s that avoid the pith. The overall quality of the wider boards tends to be much better than the garbage that gets made into 2x4s at the mill.
This reminds me of something I heard on a Woodwrights Shop episode I was watching. He mentioned that since 2x12s require such a big cross-section of a tree, you can usually rip them down and end up with really nice quarter sawn lumber from the two ends of the board. He was making a desk with the wood I think.
For anyone wondering about quarter-sawn wood, this article has a pretty good rundown of what it is, compared with other lumber cutting techniques and their properties. https://www.grandior.net/what-is-the-difference-between-plai...
God that article is so confusing because it says quarter sawn is one thing, then says it's another thing and has multiple diagrams directly in conflict with each other.
That’s a great point. I was just thinking about knots, but the grain direction is a big plus too.
I am told a really cute windmill driven saw yard in the Netherlands is one of the last refuges for restoration of period homes: everywhere else nearby is doing metric dimensional timber cutting.
* knowing the maximum dimensions you can fit into your vehicle. Are you sure it'll fit in through the door or hatch and you'll be able to close it?
* knowing what cuts you can make at home, and which ones you need to have done at the lumber yard / big box retailer.
* if you need cuts done at the store, does that store offer that service? For example the Menards I shop at has an amazing selection of wood, but they won't cut any of it for me. The Lowe's has a smaller selection, but they do cuts for free.
* if you're having cuts at the store, make sure the saw is working before doing the hard work of choosing your lumber. Too many times to count I've spent 30 minutes getting all the pieces loaded on the cart and then noticed the "Out of Order" sign and had to leave empty handed.
* are you strong enough to lift the piece? Plywood comes in 4 foot by 8 foot sheets, and they can be heavy and awkward to move. A store employee can help you, but at some point you're on your own and will need to do it yourself, have some help, or fashion some tools to assist you.
* For cuts at the store, do you know what dimensions to tell the employee to cut at? Store cuts should be considered rough cuts than you true up later on. Make sure you account for this when dictating the cuts.
* Lastly, just assume you'll make mistakes early on. Luckily construction lumber in the US is pretty cheap, so you can afford a few lessons.