Nintendo 3DS discontinued after almost a decade(bbc.co.uk)
bbc.co.uk
Nintendo 3DS discontinued after almost a decade
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-54191058
234 comments
seriously?! I just bought one now after putting it off for years
Personally I wouldn't be mad, the homebrew and hacking community will probably stay strong for years. I'd be surprised if you bought it think you'd be playing brand new games?
Right? There is a tremendous game library on the 3Ds, with several well known titles being exclusive to the console. Thousands of hours of gameplay on native games, let alone the emulated ones.
You must have had a reason to get it though, i.e. specific titles.
As long as you can get them all for decent prices, I don't think there's much to regret, because if they're using any of the 3DS exclusive capabilities, you're not going to be able to reproduce the experience on any other console anyways.
As long as you can get them all for decent prices, I don't think there's much to regret, because if they're using any of the 3DS exclusive capabilities, you're not going to be able to reproduce the experience on any other console anyways.
There are cartridges which allow you to load games onto a micro SD card. They can be used to load homebrew games or roms obtained from less than legal means.
I had one for the original DS and obtained ROMs for the cartridges that I owned. It was convenient to have them all in one place when traveling without having to bring a bunch of cartridges with me.
I had one for the original DS and obtained ROMs for the cartridges that I owned. It was convenient to have them all in one place when traveling without having to bring a bunch of cartridges with me.
Even better, if you load custom firmware[1] on it, you don't need the special cartridge at all, and you can dump your game cartridges right to the system's SD card (this only works for GameBoy Advance and 3DS games, but not original DS games). If you buy digital games from the eShop, this also gives you an effective way to back them up, including save files.
[1]: https://3ds.hacks.guide/
[1]: https://3ds.hacks.guide/
It works for DS games also. I had a few on mine.
That's true, but it requires TwilightMenu++[1] and is not as straightforward as the usual method for 3DS and GBA games. Also, I don't think DS games will show up on the home screen like 3DS and GBA games do.
[1]: https://www.cfwaifu.com/twilight-menu-3ds/
[1]: https://www.cfwaifu.com/twilight-menu-3ds/
I have one from the release year and still use it so you might get ten years out of it, too. The game selection/portability/travelworthiness is hard to top.
I still use my DS Lite along with my 3DS XL: Nintendo really builds things to last, ime. Looking forward to the release of the retro Game And Watch Mario Bros in November.
Did you really buy it with an expectation of a steady stream of new titles?
I've been meaning to get one forever too and now I go looking and they're quite difficult to find (new, retail). I guess Nintendo hasn't shipped any new stock in some time.
I can’t believe it’s been a decade! I bought one on launch day - $250 and barely a 3 hour battery life. I later bought a New 3DS XL (or whatever the crazy naming scheme was) and it was wild how much better the newer hardware was than launch day.
I sort of wonder if there's going to be a barrage of exploits held until end-of-life that's going to be released now.
EDIT: I'm already aware that the system has been exploited to death and back, so I'm mostly curious if people haven't already dumped everything.
EDIT: I'm already aware that the system has been exploited to death and back, so I'm mostly curious if people haven't already dumped everything.
There's actually quite a large community of 3DS hackers: https://old.reddit.com/r/3dshacks/
I was able to hack mine(though I don't use it much anyway) fairly easily. My brother did it to his so he could dump DS carts onto the SD card for better portability.
I was able to hack mine(though I don't use it much anyway) fairly easily. My brother did it to his so he could dump DS carts onto the SD card for better portability.
There are some cool homebrews still made: https://gbatemp.net/threads/wip-wumiibo-amiibo-emulation-for...
I suspect 3DS hacking community will stay active for long time as it's the only cheap (second hand 2DS), wide spreaded, hacked portable console available.
I suspect 3DS hacking community will stay active for long time as it's the only cheap (second hand 2DS), wide spreaded, hacked portable console available.
Indeed, I know some hacks were being held back until end-of-life. For example the author of SoundHax (one of the most important tools in 3DS hacking) said he was holding something off: https://twitter.com/nedwilliamson/status/874594459744423936
However this all assumes that updates will stop, and I'm not so sure that Nintendo would even announce such a thing.
However this all assumes that updates will stop, and I'm not so sure that Nintendo would even announce such a thing.
you know they'll sneak updates forever worded like: General system stability improvements to enhance the user’s experience.
to patch exploits.
to patch exploits.
The small New 3DS is the last portable console I can actually fit in my pocket, and for that I still take it out with me instead of the Switch on some days. So much easier to whip out of my pocket.
My wife was angry at me that I could fit a Switch into my pocket the other day. Although it's pretty cumbersome to carry it around like that.
I could fit my New 3DS XL with “clip armor” https://gameidealist.com/news/a-look-at-the-pdp-new-nintendo... in some pockets. I also had a sweater that I could fit the 3DS inside between the pockets and the innner lining.
The games were the last and only software I paid for with actual money, until I joined the FSF.
The games were the last and only software I paid for with actual money, until I joined the FSF.
I do still play on my PS Vita, and I'm still sad that Sony abandoned it quite quickly after it was released, for me it's a perfect portable "Risk of Rain" machine (although I've played other games on it too!), it's also cool that they've ported some PS1 games to it like Metal Gear Solid, I wrote about my experience here: http://kaspergrubbe.com/i-bought-a-ps-vita-in-2016-first-imp...
The PS1 games on Vita are quite odd from a technical perspective because they run in a PS1 emulator running inside of a PSP emulator.
The PS Vita really deserved better. It really did so many things right.
The OLED screen is still unmatched by portable consoles IMO. Sure, somewhat higher resolution or higher refresh rates would be nice, but those infinitely deep black levels? Just amazing.
There are a few multiplatform games like Undertale for which I consider the PS Vita the best version.
The OLED screen is still unmatched by portable consoles IMO. Sure, somewhat higher resolution or higher refresh rates would be nice, but those infinitely deep black levels? Just amazing.
There are a few multiplatform games like Undertale for which I consider the PS Vita the best version.
The PS Vita is an awesome console for homebrew and game development. I've been working on a small cross-platform game, and used my Vita to both implement cross-compiling in my build system (to port to other systems later), and develop the game for both a touch screen and physical controller. Why bother carrying around a controller, android/ios device, and cables to develop a game when a single Vita will do!
If Sony and Nintendo would release their official SDKs for these dead consoles, maybe people would have less reasons throw them away. I don't understand why they're so defensive about it anyways.
If Sony and Nintendo would release their official SDKs for these dead consoles, maybe people would have less reasons throw them away. I don't understand why they're so defensive about it anyways.
God, if I can ever get some free time, I really want to get into that. Thank you for sharing that!
I was never able to comfortably fit a PS Vita in my pocket. :(
Looks like it's finally time to grab all those games I held off on grabbing because my backlog was already extraordinary, lest I have to find them in a couple years on eBay at wildly inflated prices.
You can pick them up for free if you pirate them.
Most in-demand 3DS games have not been cheap in years. They've been pretty expensive due to low printing (Bravely Default, DQ remakes, most Atlus RPGs) for years now. I'm guessing Nintendo games are OK due to so many people owning them though.
3DS eShop might be a safe bet but aside from the usual downsides of digital, the games are tied to the system, not your eShop account.
3DS eShop might be a safe bet but aside from the usual downsides of digital, the games are tied to the system, not your eShop account.
I got a lot of popular 3DS games from the used games market and likewise also sold off some of them when I was done with them. I never bought any at more than half the retail price of the game at that time. Of course, for this reason (and also to really own my games) I always preferred cartridges.
The 3DS homebrew scene seems pretty robust. The hardware is cheap enough now that you can have a modded system for preservation purposes, while keeping another for digital downloads.
I sold my 3ds games for a hefty profit so I agree
There are some that remained in print, however, and so I held off on taking the plunge because I didn't feel like dropping $40 for Fire Emblem Echoes (for example), knowing it would probably be a year before I played it.
But knowing that the console and likely all first-party games will soon be OOP certainly lights a fire under me, as I'd much rather pay $40 for a new, sealed copy of the game than $70 for a cart-only copy of the game off eBay in a year's time.
Radiant Historia: Perfect Chronology evidently went OOP while I wasn't looking, and the Ebay price has already skyrocketed. Argh!
EDIT: And yes, I've got a couple from the eShop (Devil Survivor's 1 & 2 and Soul Hackers), but I prefer carts since they're not locked to my system/account. And who knows when Nintendo will decide to shut down the eShop, just like they did for the Wii shop?
But knowing that the console and likely all first-party games will soon be OOP certainly lights a fire under me, as I'd much rather pay $40 for a new, sealed copy of the game than $70 for a cart-only copy of the game off eBay in a year's time.
Radiant Historia: Perfect Chronology evidently went OOP while I wasn't looking, and the Ebay price has already skyrocketed. Argh!
EDIT: And yes, I've got a couple from the eShop (Devil Survivor's 1 & 2 and Soul Hackers), but I prefer carts since they're not locked to my system/account. And who knows when Nintendo will decide to shut down the eShop, just like they did for the Wii shop?
You can dump your own carts or eshop titles to ROM files with custom firmware, which you can then install on another system. Technically piracy, but it's not something I personally have moral qualms about, especially when the clock is ticking on the store's own existence.
If you were to go a step further, the eShop actually trusts the client and you can download the entire 3ds library direct from Nintendo with the right hack. Google "freeshop" and read their FAQ if you're curious. I won't link it here in case it offends anyone.
Nintendo fixed that loophole back in August 2018, didn't they?
Oops, you are correct. I didn't think they'd be able to fix it. Thanks for the update, it's been a while :)
Funny story, this loophole existed for both the Wii U and 3DS eShops. While 3DS got it patched, the Wii U is still vulnerable.
Do you happen to know how they patched it? I thought the idea was that it was bad encryption and once the license generation was broken, eShop couldn't tell if it was a real license or a fake one.
I mean, I've been completing my GameBoy and GameBoy Color collection recently, and even the big titles that everyone wants(Zelda, Pokemon, Metroid) are not crazy, the most I've paid was £20 each for pokemon games. Not sure why 3DS games would go sky high in prices with time.
There were a _lot_ of copies of Pokemon Red, Blue, Gold, Silver etc. sold.
There were not quite so many copies of SMT IV or Professor Layton vs Phoenix Wright.
There were not quite so many copies of SMT IV or Professor Layton vs Phoenix Wright.
Facebook Market, Craigslist, and Amazon are severely overpriced for even DS games.
For example, Pokemon Platinum, is selling used for about 120-150.
For example, Pokemon Platinum, is selling used for about 120-150.
"Even" DS Games is not really applicable anymore really.
Games for consoles tend to follow the same cycle every time. They get cheaper as the current console gets older, then once the new Gen starts, they get really cheap and once you're about one to two generations removed, they get more expensive again.
It has been the DS's time to get more expensive for a while. PSP has also started to get more expensive, though not remotely as much as DS games, since the DS was more popular.
Games for consoles tend to follow the same cycle every time. They get cheaper as the current console gets older, then once the new Gen starts, they get really cheap and once you're about one to two generations removed, they get more expensive again.
It has been the DS's time to get more expensive for a while. PSP has also started to get more expensive, though not remotely as much as DS games, since the DS was more popular.
Hopefully Nintendo releases the SDK? It's been a decently active platform for indie titles and homebrew games. I'm not 100% sure, but I don't think the 3DS is covered by the same NDA as the Switch in terms of toolchain/docs/etc. I believe you can find those after signing up for a developer account at https://developer.nintendo.com/
I can promise you Nintendo won’t do this.
The way things are going lately they’re probably already leaked.
The kernel source code was leaked too
The 3ds has so much homebrew stuff right now. At this point Nintendo stopping to release updates is a relief.
ctrulib was pretty good when i used it in 2017
Yes. Only thing it's missing is a high-level shader compiler, you have to write shader code in assembly (which honestly isn't too onerous for the graphical fidelity possible on the 3DS)
At long last it can rest, one of the best consoles ever and kept the legacy of the DS going im glad i was able to experience it first hand!
Nintendo insisted that the 3DS was not being replaced by the switch, in the same way that they told me that the game boy line would keep going after the DS began.
Something tells me this is Nintendo hedging bets
Something tells me this is Nintendo hedging bets
Nintendo has never really wanted to discontinue a platform. Their vision was always that developers could support old and new platforms together through funky cross-compact measures.
• Did you know that the SNES’s CPU starts up in a “NES 6502 compatibility” mode, sort of like x86-64 processors starting up in 16-bit real mode? It’s fully possible to design and build a game entirely for the NES as a 6502-assembler codebase; and then to “port” the game to the SNES, by taking that very same 6502-assembler codebase, and just adding a few minor SNES-level “enhancements” that temporarily switch to 65c816 mode, do something, then switch back to 6502 mode. Since the market penetration of the NES was so high, many games in the early 90s were “dual-released” this way.
• Did you know it was possible to create a GBC cart that would act as a fully-fledged SNES game (i.e. mapping a separate SNES game ROM) when plugged into a SNES through a Super Gameboy? Or to have “progressive enhancement” logic in the GBC ROM itself that draws full-color sprites (OBJs) when played on a Super Gameboy? AFAIK, literally nobody has ever fully exploited this, not even demoscene devs.
But, well, third-party devs just seemingly have no interest in releasing for old platforms. They want to “be where the action is.” And Nintendo can’t carry the momentum of a platform all by itself. (Plus, Nintendo’s software dev-teams are too busy acting as stewards and shepherds for how to make use of the newest-gen hardware capabilities — by making games for them, and by interfacing with third-parties — to have any labor left over for making games for older consoles.)
That being said, Nintendo did try to keep the gameboy line going after the DS. They released the GB Micro. It was its whole own thing, with its own product code (OXY) that signalled that they had likely built up separate factories just to build it. But basically nobody bought it.
(But really, I think Nintendo was speaking to developers there, not to gamers. They meant that there’d still be a point, as a game studio, in producing GBA games, because the DS would also play them.)
• Did you know that the SNES’s CPU starts up in a “NES 6502 compatibility” mode, sort of like x86-64 processors starting up in 16-bit real mode? It’s fully possible to design and build a game entirely for the NES as a 6502-assembler codebase; and then to “port” the game to the SNES, by taking that very same 6502-assembler codebase, and just adding a few minor SNES-level “enhancements” that temporarily switch to 65c816 mode, do something, then switch back to 6502 mode. Since the market penetration of the NES was so high, many games in the early 90s were “dual-released” this way.
• Did you know it was possible to create a GBC cart that would act as a fully-fledged SNES game (i.e. mapping a separate SNES game ROM) when plugged into a SNES through a Super Gameboy? Or to have “progressive enhancement” logic in the GBC ROM itself that draws full-color sprites (OBJs) when played on a Super Gameboy? AFAIK, literally nobody has ever fully exploited this, not even demoscene devs.
But, well, third-party devs just seemingly have no interest in releasing for old platforms. They want to “be where the action is.” And Nintendo can’t carry the momentum of a platform all by itself. (Plus, Nintendo’s software dev-teams are too busy acting as stewards and shepherds for how to make use of the newest-gen hardware capabilities — by making games for them, and by interfacing with third-parties — to have any labor left over for making games for older consoles.)
That being said, Nintendo did try to keep the gameboy line going after the DS. They released the GB Micro. It was its whole own thing, with its own product code (OXY) that signalled that they had likely built up separate factories just to build it. But basically nobody bought it.
(But really, I think Nintendo was speaking to developers there, not to gamers. They meant that there’d still be a point, as a game studio, in producing GBA games, because the DS would also play them.)
That said, it was a very cool form factor.
>>Did you know it was possible to create a GBC cart that would act as a fully-fledged SNES game (i.e. mapping a separate SNES game ROM) when plugged into a SNES through a Super Gameboy? Or to have “progressive enhancement” logic in the GBC ROM itself that draws full-color sprites (OBJs) when played on a Super Gameboy? AFAIK, literally nobody has ever fully exploited this, not even demoscene devs.
https://loveconquersallgam.es/post/2350461718/fuck-the-super... are the definitive posts on this madness
https://loveconquersallgam.es/post/2350461718/fuck-the-super... are the definitive posts on this madness
> Did you know it was possible to create a GBC cart that would act as a fully-fledged SNES game (i.e. mapping a separate SNES game ROM) when plugged into a SNES through a Super Gameboy? Or to have “progressive enhancement” logic in the GBC ROM itself that draws full-color sprites (OBJs) when played on a Super Gameboy? AFAIK, literally nobody has ever fully exploited this, not even demoscene devs.
One game did! Space Invaders, of all things. Jeremy Parish did a video about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAyt8NI9u9c
One game did! Space Invaders, of all things. Jeremy Parish did a video about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAyt8NI9u9c
Fully exploited. Space Invaders was a partial exploitation at best. It was just a tiny stateless SNES ROM-image, that got loaded from the GB cart's ROM into the SNES's tiny work RAM, and then executed from there (leaving approximately zero WRAM for actual gameplay state. Good thing it was Space Invaders!)
A full exploitation, IMHO, would look more like the thing Pokemon Stadium did with Pokemon RBY — but done purely in-cart in the GBC game. A SNES game that "interacts with" a GBC game through the SRAM, such that you're playing the same game, two different ways, when you put it in your SNES vs. when you put it in your Gameboy. (Pretty much like Dragon Quest XI Definitive Edition's ability to reboot the game between 3D and 16-bit mode.)
Of course, to do that, you'd need actual separate ROM chips in the GBC cart for the SNES game, so that the SNES ROM-image could be larger than WRAM yet still fast. All that ROM would be untenable to fit into a GBC-cart sized cartridge even in 2003, the last year of the GBC's lifetime. It'd be perfectly doable now, though!)
A full exploitation, IMHO, would look more like the thing Pokemon Stadium did with Pokemon RBY — but done purely in-cart in the GBC game. A SNES game that "interacts with" a GBC game through the SRAM, such that you're playing the same game, two different ways, when you put it in your SNES vs. when you put it in your Gameboy. (Pretty much like Dragon Quest XI Definitive Edition's ability to reboot the game between 3D and 16-bit mode.)
Of course, to do that, you'd need actual separate ROM chips in the GBC cart for the SNES game, so that the SNES ROM-image could be larger than WRAM yet still fast. All that ROM would be untenable to fit into a GBC-cart sized cartridge even in 2003, the last year of the GBC's lifetime. It'd be perfectly doable now, though!)
> Since the market penetration of the NES was so high, many games in the early 90s were “dual-released” this way.
I don't remember games that were released on both systems, do you have any example ?
I don't remember games that were released on both systems, do you have any example ?
It's a good question. I don't think anyone's ever put together a definitive list. I don't even remember any specific examples off-hand, just that some games would be mentioned as being dual releases in Nintendo Power coverage. (This happened a lot more with NES + GB or SNES + GB dual-releases, but these are obviously not "source ports" but rather ground-up rewrites, so not interesting here.)
But that doesn't mean that we can't figure it out! Grabbing the No-Intro databases (https://no-intro.org), and then intersecting the romset names between the NES and SNES lists, gives me this list: https://gist.github.com/tsutsu/0a9d7dbaa3cb7bb1929b31d7bc878.... About 82 games!
Of course, some of those are sequels that just happen to share a name; some are ground-up-rewrite-style dual releases; and some are just unofficial ports — people trying to recreate a SNES game on the NES or vice-versa, without access to the original code. But there are likely a good few in there that were SNES-enhanced-NES-code dual-releases.
If someone here is a gaming content-creator, there's a very unique deep-dive essay waiting to be written here, about how these games work. (Retro Game Mechanics Explained, I'm looking at you.)
But that doesn't mean that we can't figure it out! Grabbing the No-Intro databases (https://no-intro.org), and then intersecting the romset names between the NES and SNES lists, gives me this list: https://gist.github.com/tsutsu/0a9d7dbaa3cb7bb1929b31d7bc878.... About 82 games!
Of course, some of those are sequels that just happen to share a name; some are ground-up-rewrite-style dual releases; and some are just unofficial ports — people trying to recreate a SNES game on the NES or vice-versa, without access to the original code. But there are likely a good few in there that were SNES-enhanced-NES-code dual-releases.
If someone here is a gaming content-creator, there's a very unique deep-dive essay waiting to be written here, about how these games work. (Retro Game Mechanics Explained, I'm looking at you.)
>AFAIK, literally nobody has ever fully exploited this, not even demoscene devs.
Not demoscene but I remember Pokemon and SML2 having custom frames and sprites.
Not demoscene but I remember Pokemon and SML2 having custom frames and sprites.
IIRC neither of those games are examples of uses of the SGB OBJ layer. They're just uses of the SGB CHR layer (custom borders) and of setting sprite palettes distinct from the tile palette (seemingly-custom sprites.) Correct me if I'm wrong, though!
According to https://tcrf.net/Super_Game_Boy#OBJ_TRN_.28Object_Transfer.2..., the SGB OBJ_TRN command wasn't even intended to be used by games! And it was removed in all revisions of the SGB after the first. It's no wonder it went unused. I wonder what Nintendo were thinking, including it in the first place!
But also, to be clear, when I said "fully exploited", the "fully" part is important. :) I didn't mean that nobody has ever used these features in some trivial way in a GB game. (IIRC, the definitive example of a trivial use of the SGB OBJ layer, is in Donkey Kong '94.) I meant that nobody has ever really pushed these features to their limits. There's a lot that can be done with the SGB (https://gbdev.gg8.se/wiki/articles/SGB_Functions) that I've literally never seen a game doing, let alone doing something interesting with.
Using all the SGB features together, you could likely cook up a SNES-looking or GBA-looking game, running purely on the GB's Z80 CPU! Surely not something a time-constrained game studio would care to do; but a hobbyist, as a passion project? Sure, why not?
According to https://tcrf.net/Super_Game_Boy#OBJ_TRN_.28Object_Transfer.2..., the SGB OBJ_TRN command wasn't even intended to be used by games! And it was removed in all revisions of the SGB after the first. It's no wonder it went unused. I wonder what Nintendo were thinking, including it in the first place!
But also, to be clear, when I said "fully exploited", the "fully" part is important. :) I didn't mean that nobody has ever used these features in some trivial way in a GB game. (IIRC, the definitive example of a trivial use of the SGB OBJ layer, is in Donkey Kong '94.) I meant that nobody has ever really pushed these features to their limits. There's a lot that can be done with the SGB (https://gbdev.gg8.se/wiki/articles/SGB_Functions) that I've literally never seen a game doing, let alone doing something interesting with.
Using all the SGB features together, you could likely cook up a SNES-looking or GBA-looking game, running purely on the GB's Z80 CPU! Surely not something a time-constrained game studio would care to do; but a hobbyist, as a passion project? Sure, why not?
> many games in the early 90s were “dual-released” this way.
No commercial SNES games used the 6502 compatibility mode afaik.
No commercial SNES games used the 6502 compatibility mode afaik.
The 3DS was released in February 2011, that makes it one of the longer lasting consoles of recent generations.
It's been a decade running and 3 years since the switch has been released.
Obviously. But it should be understood that "is not being replaced by" is always a time-windowed statement. In the grand scheme of things, everything new replaces everything old eventually.
> Nintendo insisted that the 3DS was not being replaced by the switch, in the same way that they told me that the game boy line would keep going after the DS began.
If the Switch had been a market failure (or had the DS been, back in its day), Nintendo probably would have kept the older system alive. But once it became clear that the Switch & DS were runaway successes, they could wind down the older hardware without losing their major source of revenue.
If the Switch had been a market failure (or had the DS been, back in its day), Nintendo probably would have kept the older system alive. But once it became clear that the Switch & DS were runaway successes, they could wind down the older hardware without losing their major source of revenue.
This is like when someone like Gerald Ford dies and I say, "Wow. I could have sworn Gerald Ford died 8 years ago."
I'm glad you linked this, so I didn't have to dig it up :-) An excellent sketch.
I'm nearly blind in one eye.
The 3DS XL was the first time I ever saw 3D.
In my life.
I don't just mean "the first time I saw a stereoscopic 3D effect in movies or a game console."
It was the first time I ever saw in three dimensions ever. As a human being.
It's a little bit hard to describe my typical experience with you, since I've never had "normal" version and I don't know what it's like. I would compare my life to playing a video game with a first-person perspective. You know how when you play one of those games, you're thinking in three dimensions, even though you're seeing the game on a flat two-dimensional television?
Well, that's my life. I see the world in two dimensions, even though I'm thinking about it in three dimensions.
But playing Zelda on a 3DS XL? Wow. I mean, it took my breath away. THAT'S HOW NORMAL PEOPLE SEE THE WORLD? You can just look at things and immediately know how far away they are? You don't have to move your head around to see a parallax effect to help your brain compute the distance? WOW. AMAZING.
I'm not a brainologist, so I'm not sure why the 3D system on the 3DS worked for me when nothing else had ever worked for me before, such as 1950s-style red/blue glasses. I'm still nearly blind in one eye, and the 3DS relies upon a lenticular stereoscopic effect that requires two eyes. It seems to me that it shouldn't work. But it did.
(Maybe modern VR headsets with stereo displays would work for me as well; I don't know -- I tried an early one in the 1990s and it didn't work for me, but obviously that was ancient tech)
Regardless, I had never ever experienced three-dimensional vision until the 3DS XL showed it to me. Thanks, little dude.
The 3DS XL was the first time I ever saw 3D.
In my life.
I don't just mean "the first time I saw a stereoscopic 3D effect in movies or a game console."
It was the first time I ever saw in three dimensions ever. As a human being.
It's a little bit hard to describe my typical experience with you, since I've never had "normal" version and I don't know what it's like. I would compare my life to playing a video game with a first-person perspective. You know how when you play one of those games, you're thinking in three dimensions, even though you're seeing the game on a flat two-dimensional television?
Well, that's my life. I see the world in two dimensions, even though I'm thinking about it in three dimensions.
But playing Zelda on a 3DS XL? Wow. I mean, it took my breath away. THAT'S HOW NORMAL PEOPLE SEE THE WORLD? You can just look at things and immediately know how far away they are? You don't have to move your head around to see a parallax effect to help your brain compute the distance? WOW. AMAZING.
I'm not a brainologist, so I'm not sure why the 3D system on the 3DS worked for me when nothing else had ever worked for me before, such as 1950s-style red/blue glasses. I'm still nearly blind in one eye, and the 3DS relies upon a lenticular stereoscopic effect that requires two eyes. It seems to me that it shouldn't work. But it did.
(Maybe modern VR headsets with stereo displays would work for me as well; I don't know -- I tried an early one in the 1990s and it didn't work for me, but obviously that was ancient tech)
Regardless, I had never ever experienced three-dimensional vision until the 3DS XL showed it to me. Thanks, little dude.
> I'm not a brainologist, so I'm not sure why the 3D system on the 3DS works for me when nothing else does. I'm still nearly blind in one eye, and the 3DS relies upon a lenticular stereoscopic effect that requires two eyes. Maybe the newer VR headsets would work for me as well; I don't know.
Not a brainologist either, just a guy with a maths/physics degree who works in IT. My first thought is that the 3DS was close enough to your face that the parallax might have been apparent just from your one good eye looking at different places on the screen.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax
Not a brainologist either, just a guy with a maths/physics degree who works in IT. My first thought is that the 3DS was close enough to your face that the parallax might have been apparent just from your one good eye looking at different places on the screen.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallax
For folks missing an eye, "manual" parallax is one of the primary ways we do depth perception in real life - you get it for free by having two eyes; we have to move our heads around sometimes. =)
That's an interesting theory but I think that's not what's happening.
For those unfamiliar, the 3DS uses a lenticular screen. It renders two separate images: the "right" and "left" image. The one you see depends on your viewing angle. If my good eye was seeing both images, I believe I'd experience a sort of double vision or as least discontinuities.
Perhaps more to the point, the 3D effect disappears if I close my "bad" eye! So my "bad" eye is contributing... somehow.
That's an interesting theory but I think that's not what's happening.
For those unfamiliar, the 3DS uses a lenticular screen. It renders two separate images: the "right" and "left" image. The one you see depends on your viewing angle. If my good eye was seeing both images, I believe I'd experience a sort of double vision or as least discontinuities.
Perhaps more to the point, the 3D effect disappears if I close my "bad" eye! So my "bad" eye is contributing... somehow.
My mom had the same reaction upon seeing a 3D movie with polarized lenses for the first time. For years she was like "I don't see 3D, I only see 2D." Then she actually tried it and... wow! My guess is your situation is similar to hers: you have a "lazy eye" and the artificial 3D stimulus somehow provides enough feedback to allow your brain to focus your lazy eye in a way the natural world does not.
The eye and brain are fascinating things. One time I broke my eyeglasses and did without for a year. Then I got a new prescription and was a bit disoriented at how flat the world seemed, to my mind it was "like a PlayStation game". What had happened was, my brain had trained itself to use blurriness as a proxy for distance (I'm myopic), and the eyeglasses removed that.
The eye and brain are fascinating things. One time I broke my eyeglasses and did without for a year. Then I got a new prescription and was a bit disoriented at how flat the world seemed, to my mind it was "like a PlayStation game". What had happened was, my brain had trained itself to use blurriness as a proxy for distance (I'm myopic), and the eyeglasses removed that.
It's something like a lazy eye. It actually tracks along with my other eye, it's just that the vision in there is quite bad. There's no lens in there; I had a catarct removed in the early 1980s before lens transplants.
Then I got a new prescription and was a bit disoriented
at how flat the world seemed, to my mind it was "like
a PlayStation game". What had happened was, my brain
had trained itself to use blurriness as a proxy for
distance (I'm myopic), and the eyeglasses removed that.
Yes, it's a bit like those people in an experiment who went around for weeks in glasses which inverted the image to their eyes. Eventually they adapted, and began to see things upright, but when the glasses came off, their vision was inverted!
>(Maybe modern VR headsets with stereo displays would work for me as well; I don't know -- I tried an early one in the 1990s and it didn't work for me, but obviously that was ancient tech)
I have a similar condition, and in fact only VR headsets and IMAX screens work for me. 3DS doesn't :<
I have a similar condition, and in fact only VR headsets and IMAX screens work for me. 3DS doesn't :<
That sure makes a lot more sense than my experience. The 3DS' lenticular system is kind of flawed -- though I wonder if that's perhaps part of why it works for me, somehow. I've never heard anybody else say, "only the 3DS worked for me"
I saw an IMAX 3D movie once but I forget how that system worked. Was it a shutter system, or was it like an updated version of the old red/blue system that relied on polarization somehow?
I haven't tried a modern VR headset. Honestly, I'd always kind of assumed that they wouldn't work because ViewMasters never worked for me back in the day. As primitive as ViewMasters were, they actually did provide fully stereoscopic images with a separate photo for the right and left eye, no lenticular or polarized or shutter system trickery involved.
May I ask what your eye condition is?
In my case, I was born with a cataract on my lens and my lens was removed circa 1980, before transplants were common. So that eye has just been chillin' without a lens ever since. I can see light and shapes, but I can't read the big "E" on the eye chart at the optomotrist's office.
I saw an IMAX 3D movie once but I forget how that system worked. Was it a shutter system, or was it like an updated version of the old red/blue system that relied on polarization somehow?
I haven't tried a modern VR headset. Honestly, I'd always kind of assumed that they wouldn't work because ViewMasters never worked for me back in the day. As primitive as ViewMasters were, they actually did provide fully stereoscopic images with a separate photo for the right and left eye, no lenticular or polarized or shutter system trickery involved.
May I ask what your eye condition is?
In my case, I was born with a cataract on my lens and my lens was removed circa 1980, before transplants were common. So that eye has just been chillin' without a lens ever since. I can see light and shapes, but I can't read the big "E" on the eye chart at the optomotrist's office.
The IMAX system, at least in my Cinema City venue, uses polarization. I've also tried Real 3D cinemas but that didn't work.
>May I ask what your eye condition is?
I don't know if it's neurological but I just don't register depth w/o forcing it. I have astigmatism and short-sightedness.
>May I ask what your eye condition is?
I don't know if it's neurological but I just don't register depth w/o forcing it. I have astigmatism and short-sightedness.
Interesting. (And more importantly, sorry to hear that)
So, your brain gets a stereo signal, but because of the "fuzziness" of far-away objects, it doesn't "compute" the depth information?
That makes sense to me, but - corrective lenses don't improve the issue? That's fascinating. Is that common with astigmatism? I don't know too much about depth perception issues outside of my own experience. (One might say I'm short-sighted in that regard... har har har)
So, your brain gets a stereo signal, but because of the "fuzziness" of far-away objects, it doesn't "compute" the depth information?
That makes sense to me, but - corrective lenses don't improve the issue? That's fascinating. Is that common with astigmatism? I don't know too much about depth perception issues outside of my own experience. (One might say I'm short-sighted in that regard... har har har)
>So, your brain gets a stereo signal, but because of the "fuzziness" of far-away objects, it doesn't "compute" the depth information?
No, I doubt that's the issue, corrective glasses don't help here at all.
>Is that common with astigmatism?
I don't know, lol.
I've got used to live with it, doesn't bother me during day to day life.
No, I doubt that's the issue, corrective glasses don't help here at all.
>Is that common with astigmatism?
I don't know, lol.
I've got used to live with it, doesn't bother me during day to day life.
Hahaha yeah, same here. I'm not typically bothered by my lack of depth perception at all -- it's just what I'm used to.
Still, it was super cool to catch a glimpse of that elusive third dimension thanks to Nintendo's little wonder!
Still, it was super cool to catch a glimpse of that elusive third dimension thanks to Nintendo's little wonder!
I've read many online claims from people who have said this about their first time in VR. Some even say the effect even carried over with them into the real world after leaving VR. You should give it a whirl!
I think perhaps I will check it out!
It's absolutely fascinating that you say some folks reported the effect carrying over into real life - do you perhaps remember where you read/saw that? It's not easily Googlable!
It's absolutely fascinating that you say some folks reported the effect carrying over into real life - do you perhaps remember where you read/saw that? It's not easily Googlable!
I always try to imagine what the final production run looks like at a factory for one of these. Is there usually some sort of ceremony for the very last unit rolling off the line? Or does it just run towards the end of the shift as normal, everything gets boxed up and shipped to retailers as normal, there just....isn't another shift after that? What happens with all the manufacturing hardrware?
It's not the same, but ‘Farewell, Etaoin Shrdlu’ (you can find it easily online) is a documentary about the last day that the New York Times used linotypes and hot metal typesetting before they switched to electronic/optical typesetting.
I think it's a wonderful, heartfelt, and technologically fascinating documentary. I recommend it when you have a half hour to spare.
I think it's a wonderful, heartfelt, and technologically fascinating documentary. I recommend it when you have a half hour to spare.
here it is
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MGjFKs9bnU
great video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MGjFKs9bnU
great video
Voice over sounds like George Carlin, but the accent is slightly heavier. He did a lot of voice over work though (e.g. thomas the tank engine).
It's hard to tell, but that room seem really loud
Edit: I'm always more amazed at old mechanical technology than modern technology. Thanks for sharing
Last edit: "Sign language is used, among the many deaf printers". HA!
It's hard to tell, but that room seem really loud
Edit: I'm always more amazed at old mechanical technology than modern technology. Thanks for sharing
Last edit: "Sign language is used, among the many deaf printers". HA!
> Last edit: "Sign language is used, among the many deaf printers". HA!
People with disabilities historically had very few job opportunities. Printing was latched onto in the late 20th century as the major trade career for the deaf--essentially every deaf trade school was teaching it. The noise of the printing machinery making spoken conversation difficult was probably a motivating factor, but it also appears that there was generally little issue with printers not being able to listen ([1] lists that most deaf printers in 1923 used written communication for tasks and their employees generally found deafness no handicap).
[1] https://www.jstor.org/stable/44462325?seq=4#metadata_info_ta...
People with disabilities historically had very few job opportunities. Printing was latched onto in the late 20th century as the major trade career for the deaf--essentially every deaf trade school was teaching it. The noise of the printing machinery making spoken conversation difficult was probably a motivating factor, but it also appears that there was generally little issue with printers not being able to listen ([1] lists that most deaf printers in 1923 used written communication for tasks and their employees generally found deafness no handicap).
[1] https://www.jstor.org/stable/44462325?seq=4#metadata_info_ta...
Thank you for this recommendation, I heartily enjoyed it.
There’s something beautiful about the pride the printers had in their work. Even if the output is somewhat ephemeral - a daily newspaper.
There’s something beautiful about the pride the printers had in their work. Even if the output is somewhat ephemeral - a daily newspaper.
Ephemeral perhaps, but for almost every issue, there was likely someone -- somewhere -- that would frame and keep it, because someone in their family got a mention, an interview, or an article published in the New York Times.
It surprised me that the "new" in this documentary was not much different to my modern eye than the "old". Paper blocks were now moved around instead of lead blocks, but fully computerized layout was still relatively far away.
For things like this, they're generally produced in (large) batches on a line, then once the run is finished the line is retooled for whatever is next on the schedule.
If nintendo use a third party manufacturer then I can't imagine there was much ceremony. If they own their production facilities then maybe they had a little mini-party? Most likely it'd depend on the particular teams working in the factory and what the culture is like.
Having said that, they may not even have known when the run was finished that it was going to be the last (management still pondering whether to do another run, or stock from the previous run lasted longer than expected so no new product produced) so it may well have been a total non-event.
If nintendo use a third party manufacturer then I can't imagine there was much ceremony. If they own their production facilities then maybe they had a little mini-party? Most likely it'd depend on the particular teams working in the factory and what the culture is like.
Having said that, they may not even have known when the run was finished that it was going to be the last (management still pondering whether to do another run, or stock from the previous run lasted longer than expected so no new product produced) so it may well have been a total non-event.
I'd assume there's probably only one line producing (at a single factory) as all the other ones have retooled to something else.
I don't think there's much room for sentiment on a factory floor where most things are automated. It's nice to imagine there's some nostalgic engineer who grew up with Nintendo consoles and personally put the finishing touches on the last 3DS or something like that... but it's more likely that the last one got pushed out and they went on making all the other consoles instead. Manufacturing hardware can most likely be repurposed and, if not, simply gets sold off for parts.
Factory has a retooling shutdown and then commences making something else if economy is good. If not, factory still has shutdown but the only thing commencing is an awkward all-hands meeting and a lot of paperwork.
As other comments mention, most Nintendo hardware is now made in China and I doubt they care, but there is also a factory in Uji staffed by Nintendo employees who definitely care.
I’m not sure what all they do these days, but at least they do a decent amount of serious testing and QA. They might have had a send off when authorizing the final models.
I’m not sure what all they do these days, but at least they do a decent amount of serious testing and QA. They might have had a send off when authorizing the final models.
The nice thing about the 3DS is that the emulator (Citra) is pretty good. I've used it to play "undubs" of games I own, where fans have taken the audio from the Japanese version of a game and put it into the US or EU version.
It's not perfect, but tons of games are fully playable and development is still very active.
It's not perfect, but tons of games are fully playable and development is still very active.
I wonder what the game plan is for offering these games in the future. The dual-screen setup obviously doesn’t map to the Switch, so it’s not just a simple eShop port like you’d have for an old SNES game.
I am mostly thinking about Pokémon. They’ve got this rich new Pokémon Home system to transfer between generations, but that’s reliant on having functioning older hardware. Now, there’s a massive pool of functional 3DS systems out there, so it’s not a pressing issue, but eventually, some poor Ash Greninja will be trapped on a 3DS cartridge. (I suppose the answer is: port all the Pokémon games, profit, swim in giant Scrooge McDuck moneybin of coins.)
I am mostly thinking about Pokémon. They’ve got this rich new Pokémon Home system to transfer between generations, but that’s reliant on having functioning older hardware. Now, there’s a massive pool of functional 3DS systems out there, so it’s not a pressing issue, but eventually, some poor Ash Greninja will be trapped on a 3DS cartridge. (I suppose the answer is: port all the Pokémon games, profit, swim in giant Scrooge McDuck moneybin of coins.)
There were only a handful of games that really required it. Most people I knew only used the 3D effect as a novelty every now and then.
I wonder maybe a VR 3DS emulator could emulate it the best?
I wonder maybe a VR 3DS emulator could emulate it the best?
Pokémon Home doesn't support any of the 3DS games; Pokémon Bank does. You can transfer from Bank to Home, but not the other way around.
OK, yes, the Pokémon Home dance is…a tad complex.
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/pokemon-home-guide-transf...
But still, they finally have what appears to be a canonical place to store Pokémon, and it’ll be a little annoying when 3DS units start dying off and you can’t dance that particular jig.
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/pokemon-home-guide-transf...
But still, they finally have what appears to be a canonical place to store Pokémon, and it’ll be a little annoying when 3DS units start dying off and you can’t dance that particular jig.
I'm honestly surprised Pokemon is still around. The first one came out in like 1996, and it was initially addictive because there were a fixed number of pokemon to try to collect (150). But each iteration was basically a carbon copy of the previous gen with some map and monster changes. 7(?) gens later and now there are what 500? 600? More? I just don't understand the motivation to collect something now that you can no longer "catch em all". Is it like Hearthstone or Magic where you just collect what you can knowing certain cards will forever be beyond your reach?
> I'm honestly surprised Pokemon is still around.
I'm honestly surprised baseball is still around. The first game came out in like 1839, and it was initially addictive because it was easy to play. But each season is basically a carbon copy of the previous season with player changes.
I'm honestly surprised baseball is still around. The first game came out in like 1839, and it was initially addictive because it was easy to play. But each season is basically a carbon copy of the previous season with player changes.
> I'm honestly surprised Pokemon is still around.
I'm honestly surprised chess is still around. It's basically the same game with the same rules from centuries ago.
I'm honestly surprised chess is still around. It's basically the same game with the same rules from centuries ago.
Chess is not a game based around collecting a fixed number of items.
Pokemon isn't based around collecting a fixed number of items.
There's strategy to pick an ideal team. To ev/iv farm if you're really into it.
There's a story, you can battle friends, you can make trades.
Pokemon isn't pog collecting.
There's strategy to pick an ideal team. To ev/iv farm if you're really into it.
There's a story, you can battle friends, you can make trades.
Pokemon isn't pog collecting.
[deleted]
Some people (I know one of them) carry their pokemon from the first generation, so they can still catch'em all. My friend's case is a mix of nostalgia and just knowing what they will get from the experience.
But Pokemon is not just about collecting pokemon, there's the competitive scene for one, where people will welcome new pokemons to shake the meta and not always care about a mon being available or not.
But Pokemon is not just about collecting pokemon, there's the competitive scene for one, where people will welcome new pokemons to shake the meta and not always care about a mon being available or not.
IIRC, it was actually possible to collect every Pokémon across all the games released on 3DS. A service facilitated transferring them between games. Several of the rare Pokémon were related to limited time events, but the opportunity was there. I’m sure it’ll be possible to get pretty close to a complete collection by the end of the Switch lifespan as well.
this holds true for new pokemon games, i'd never buy that shit. however sometimes i want to have a good afternoon. no wife, no kids, smokin weed killin time playing and old school pokemon game. sounds delightful haha.
Maybe they could something like what Drastic/Citrus does and have the two 3DS screens share the Switch/TV screen? I would say the main problem is that it has an effective resolution of 400x240 pixels on the top screen and 320x240 pixels on the bottom screen and the games were designed to look good on the really small displays, not blown up to a TV or even a Switch size display.
The Wii U eShop sold DS games with a variety of different display options: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCV8Y3lEPr0
The Wii U had a pretty natural default though, with the touchscreen on your lap as the lower screen, and TV as upper screen. That whole model was (rightly) tossed for the Switch, so now any games which really depended on it are a bit of a dead end.
Yup, that's what I'm getting at. It's not an easy 1:1 translation.
It was nice for games like Pokémon; easy access to the inventory, little mini-games on the touch screen, stuff like that. It obviously blew right up in their faces with the Wii U, but it worked for a certain class of game.
It was nice for games like Pokémon; easy access to the inventory, little mini-games on the touch screen, stuff like that. It obviously blew right up in their faces with the Wii U, but it worked for a certain class of game.
Yes, but the Wii U DS eShop emulator supported showing both screens on your TV. They could do the same on Switch. See about 0:40 in the video I linked.
I think perardi is referring to how the touchscreen gimmick of the Wii U wasn't as successful as it was on the DS and 3DS, not to any problems with the emulation.
Sorry about this, as it's an old argument that everyone here knows, but I wish Nintendo would stop making systems and just focus on their games on competing platforms. They do it for the money. So if I want to have the next Zelda, Mario/MK, DK I have to pay the 300 cost for the system first, then the price of the game ($60 on release day?) I mean, I get it from their perspective. Every Nintendo I purchase the number of games I buy for it seem to drip closer and closer to Nintendo only titles, essentially making it so my favorites really cost about $135 each. (Z/M/MK/DK + 299). I suppose that price is still worth it - not really - but what's killing me is this new thing they're doing where they just kinda stretch a title out for 9 years between the AAA releases. I don't consider a bunch of ports from DS style Zelda games as one of the titles I would buy.
Nintendo has a long history of taking hardware risks that are targeted at actually making interesting new types of gameplay possible.
The richness of games available would not be possible if Nintendo was not in the picture as a hardware manufacturer and had to target all their games at MS/Sony hardware.
Sony & MS have almost never tried any novel hardware and been able to tie it to unique gameplay that was actually successful. They've only tried to copy Nintendo's ideas, mostly failed, and then cancelled the hardware. See Kinect, Playstation Move controllers for PS3, etc.. it was all just copying the Wii.
A lot of the games on DS and 3DS would never have seen the light of day with their unique gameplay elements without Nintendo doing the experimental hardware required.
The richness of games available would not be possible if Nintendo was not in the picture as a hardware manufacturer and had to target all their games at MS/Sony hardware.
Sony & MS have almost never tried any novel hardware and been able to tie it to unique gameplay that was actually successful. They've only tried to copy Nintendo's ideas, mostly failed, and then cancelled the hardware. See Kinect, Playstation Move controllers for PS3, etc.. it was all just copying the Wii.
A lot of the games on DS and 3DS would never have seen the light of day with their unique gameplay elements without Nintendo doing the experimental hardware required.
I want to defend Kinect. I suspect that it's made by tech driven rather than copying idea from Nintendo.
> I suppose that price is still worth it - not really
Either it is, or it isn't. From there you can determine whether you should spend your money there or not.
Nintendo isn't stupid, if people stop buying their consoles and manifest wanting just the game for another platform they will eventually do just that; but their large customer base is saying that the price of the console is worth it and Nintendo deems it better that way so it will remain like that.
Either it is, or it isn't. From there you can determine whether you should spend your money there or not.
Nintendo isn't stupid, if people stop buying their consoles and manifest wanting just the game for another platform they will eventually do just that; but their large customer base is saying that the price of the console is worth it and Nintendo deems it better that way so it will remain like that.
But if I'm already teetering on whether $135 is worth it, AND you have the long delay between games, then the reality is I'm saying f--- no to a $360 Zelda right now. (for example)
If I already have a PS5 (not out yet, but which is already purchase worthy) then I would say f--- yes to even a $100 Zelda (were it available).
If I already have a PS5 (not out yet, but which is already purchase worthy) then I would say f--- yes to even a $100 Zelda (were it available).
Evidently not enough people have reached the point you are at yet.
I heard this a lot in the WiiU era, but having this opinion during the Switch? It's the most unique and successful console. If Nintendo drops their hardware we will only have phone to play with on the go, and it's obvious why people prefer and are willing to spend much more on quality handheld gaming hardware.
Damn capitalism is a bitch
The 3DS, in particular the "New" models, I think are really recommended to pick up cheap. They are well built devices that are supremely hackable with access to lots of fun games.
The 3DS library is good despite somewhat lacking in diversity. But the 3DS also has native compatibility with the entire excellent DS library, and after hacking it can also run the entire great GBA library without emulation (like Matroshka dolls, the 3DS hardware includes the complete DSi hardware which in turn includes GBA hardware, and it has firmware support to access them both).
The old models emulate a lot of 8 and 16 bit consoles well, whereas the New models have nearly complete compatibility for 8 and 16 bit consoles and additionally can emulate some Playstation 1. Moreover, hacking the 3DS has become even more accessible due to recent newly found exploits. Still getting a lot of fun out of mine.
The 3DS library is good despite somewhat lacking in diversity. But the 3DS also has native compatibility with the entire excellent DS library, and after hacking it can also run the entire great GBA library without emulation (like Matroshka dolls, the 3DS hardware includes the complete DSi hardware which in turn includes GBA hardware, and it has firmware support to access them both).
The old models emulate a lot of 8 and 16 bit consoles well, whereas the New models have nearly complete compatibility for 8 and 16 bit consoles and additionally can emulate some Playstation 1. Moreover, hacking the 3DS has become even more accessible due to recent newly found exploits. Still getting a lot of fun out of mine.
If picking up a 3DS, I highly recommend a "New" model. They include cameras that track your eyes, making the 3D effect much better.
It's true the 3D effect is just a gimmick, but it's a very neat one. Games like Metroid Samus Returns are much better in 3D IMO. The game feels like an actual mini diorama is in front of you.
It's true the 3D effect is just a gimmick, but it's a very neat one. Games like Metroid Samus Returns are much better in 3D IMO. The game feels like an actual mini diorama is in front of you.
The New 3DS/2DS enhancements don't stop at the camera & eye tracking - very few people, I think, ever understood the massive leap in specs. It's like the jump from the Game Boy to the Game Boy Color, except perhaps even bigger.
- CPU got double the ARM11 cores (now 4, was 2) at triple the clock speed (exactly)
- RAM doubled from 128 MB to 256 MB.
- VRAM upped by 2/3 to 10 MB, was 6 MB (which sounds like not a lot, which is true, but the top screen is 800x240 with an effective resolution of 400x240 and the viewport rendered twice from slightly different perspectives when 3D is enabled. Lower screen is 320x240, so it's not a lot of VRAM but it doesn't really need that much)
- Added an H.264 hardware decoder (yes, the original lacked one)
- NFC added, not big but an external reader/writer puck was required for the old 3DS models and amiibo is huge among a subset of fans
- ...Wi-Fi still maxes out at 802.11g (come on now)
The hardware gap is great enough that the New 3DS got a Switch port (Fire Emblem Warriors) and a Wii port with the 3D enabled (Xenoblade 3D). It can also be used for Twitch/YouTube streaming, as it has enough horsepower (and apparently extra hardware, but I'm not sure which is required; maybe someone else can enlighten us in this respect) to just dump the display buffer over Wi-Fi to a PC. Even with the 802.11g deficiency.
It's a great console with a huge library of games, especially with DS backwards compatibility, and with mods (all are vulnerable) it's also a capable and very portable emulation machine. Cheaper as well (although not necessarily significantly) than even the Switch Lite, and more moddable (unless you want to shell out for a Switch modchip).
Nintendo could have sold many more but botched the name and the marketing, like the Wii U. But it's worth a look.
- CPU got double the ARM11 cores (now 4, was 2) at triple the clock speed (exactly)
- RAM doubled from 128 MB to 256 MB.
- VRAM upped by 2/3 to 10 MB, was 6 MB (which sounds like not a lot, which is true, but the top screen is 800x240 with an effective resolution of 400x240 and the viewport rendered twice from slightly different perspectives when 3D is enabled. Lower screen is 320x240, so it's not a lot of VRAM but it doesn't really need that much)
- Added an H.264 hardware decoder (yes, the original lacked one)
- NFC added, not big but an external reader/writer puck was required for the old 3DS models and amiibo is huge among a subset of fans
- ...Wi-Fi still maxes out at 802.11g (come on now)
The hardware gap is great enough that the New 3DS got a Switch port (Fire Emblem Warriors) and a Wii port with the 3D enabled (Xenoblade 3D). It can also be used for Twitch/YouTube streaming, as it has enough horsepower (and apparently extra hardware, but I'm not sure which is required; maybe someone else can enlighten us in this respect) to just dump the display buffer over Wi-Fi to a PC. Even with the 802.11g deficiency.
It's a great console with a huge library of games, especially with DS backwards compatibility, and with mods (all are vulnerable) it's also a capable and very portable emulation machine. Cheaper as well (although not necessarily significantly) than even the Switch Lite, and more moddable (unless you want to shell out for a Switch modchip).
Nintendo could have sold many more but botched the name and the marketing, like the Wii U. But it's worth a look.
> very few people, I think, ever understood the massive leap in specs.
Because it was only ever used by a handful of games!
When the New 3DS launched, I expected it to be something of a stealth new console generation. The trajectory would been like the Gameboy Color; at launch, games could still be played in Black & White on the original gameboy, but it didn’t take long for games to drop that support so they could truly make use of the GBC’s superior internals.
But of course, this did not happen.
Because it was only ever used by a handful of games!
When the New 3DS launched, I expected it to be something of a stealth new console generation. The trajectory would been like the Gameboy Color; at launch, games could still be played in Black & White on the original gameboy, but it didn’t take long for games to drop that support so they could truly make use of the GBC’s superior internals.
But of course, this did not happen.
Admittedly I only played one game for a while on a borrowed 3DS (Super Mario 3D Land), but I quickly thought the best thing about the 3D effect is that you can turn it off.
If that was on an old 3DS, that was probably true. On the "New" 3DS, though, with the additional eye tracking to make sure the 3D effect is stable, it's superb.
I played through the entirety of the Metroid 2 remake with 3D on on my New 3DS, and it was dazzling. No discomfort or headaches, just a constant sensation of disbelief that this can even work without some kind of glasses on.
Does the eye tracking work with older games, or is the 3D baked into the game engines?
Yes, the eye tracking works with old games just as well as with new ones; it seems to require no software support; it just does its thing, dynamically adjusting the parallax barrier so that the left and right frames provided by the game will be seen by the correct eyes, even if those eyes are off-center, moving, or etc.
Just the way you worded this, leading me right up to the end of the comment, made me laugh pretty loud.
For what it's worth, it isn't a gimmick to me. I have really terrible eyes, and it's actually the first time I've seen in 3D up close... ever. VR headsets don't work on me, and my eyes can only see 3D at a distance.
Yeah some titles use the 3D much better than others. Some early launch windows titles kind of do it weirdly and poorly. Pilotwings for example feels too strong.
Some of the best would be yeah Metroid and Luigi's Mansion 2. The 3D gives a real "diorama" feel.
Some of the best would be yeah Metroid and Luigi's Mansion 2. The 3D gives a real "diorama" feel.
Pilotwings looks great in 3D if you actually make use of the 3D slider to adjust to your comfort level, instead of just pushing it all the way up.
I think later games realized people weren’t actually going to do that, and effectively optimized their visuals for the highest setting.
I think later games realized people weren’t actually going to do that, and effectively optimized their visuals for the highest setting.
Absolutely agree. I just got into 3DS development last year and it's been such an exciting development experience. The open-source tools are excellent (even supporting remote debugging!), and the system hits that sweet spot between being powerful enough to build interesting things and taking real work to make those things fast.
Over the last year or so I've been squeezing individual fps's of performance out of the PSX emulator and it's been some of the most fun hobby programming I've done in a long time.
Plus you can write for a platform with a 3D screen! How cool is that?
Over the last year or so I've been squeezing individual fps's of performance out of the PSX emulator and it's been some of the most fun hobby programming I've done in a long time.
Plus you can write for a platform with a 3D screen! How cool is that?
> I just got into 3DS development last year and it's been such an exciting development experience
That sounds really cool. Do you have any pointers for getting started?
That sounds really cool. Do you have any pointers for getting started?
devkitpro (https://devkitpro.org/) is the toolchain and base libraries, and sets up a package manager for downloading others.
For the basic stuff you can use the usual C libraries. I picked up a lot by reading and tweaking the examples, which are installed along with the toolchain: https://github.com/devkitPro/3ds-examples
libctru, installed with devkitpro (https://libctru.devkitpro.org/) is where a lot of the platform-specific APIs live. There are also some higher-level libraries built on top of it
A good understanding of ARM will take you a long way. A lot of what documentation there is (especially on 3dbrew.org) assumes you understand the terms and general architecture of an older ARM platform. This book https://www.brucesmith.info/arm-a32-assembly-language/ was great for building enough understanding that I could understand most of the official reference manuals. From those, I found the ARMv7 reference manual and the ARM11 MPCore Technical Reference Manual to be the most useful, and I refer back to the ARM instruction set reference card a lot.
Besides that, it's reading and modifying the source of other projects, and trying things out. If you look at homebrew apps like ctrQuake (https://github.com/masterfeizz/ctrQuake), you'll notice there's usually not a lot of platform-specific code -- most is just standard C / C++.
Hope that helps. Just like anything, it's knowing enough to get started (a toolchain, some C, and some examples) and using your questions and ideas to draw you into the next thing to learn.
For the basic stuff you can use the usual C libraries. I picked up a lot by reading and tweaking the examples, which are installed along with the toolchain: https://github.com/devkitPro/3ds-examples
libctru, installed with devkitpro (https://libctru.devkitpro.org/) is where a lot of the platform-specific APIs live. There are also some higher-level libraries built on top of it
A good understanding of ARM will take you a long way. A lot of what documentation there is (especially on 3dbrew.org) assumes you understand the terms and general architecture of an older ARM platform. This book https://www.brucesmith.info/arm-a32-assembly-language/ was great for building enough understanding that I could understand most of the official reference manuals. From those, I found the ARMv7 reference manual and the ARM11 MPCore Technical Reference Manual to be the most useful, and I refer back to the ARM instruction set reference card a lot.
Besides that, it's reading and modifying the source of other projects, and trying things out. If you look at homebrew apps like ctrQuake (https://github.com/masterfeizz/ctrQuake), you'll notice there's usually not a lot of platform-specific code -- most is just standard C / C++.
Hope that helps. Just like anything, it's knowing enough to get started (a toolchain, some C, and some examples) and using your questions and ideas to draw you into the next thing to learn.
Thanks! Lots of good stuff, I really appreciate it.
It also still supports the entirety of the original DS homebrew scene, including my favorite flashcard: the SuperCard DSTWO [0], which includes an onboard CPU and RAM for running software that's more powerful than the host DS! You could feel the chip bulging out underneath the label, and the cartridges went into the slot with an odd "squish" because of that. A ridiculous yet beautiful piece of engineering.
[0] http://eng.supercard.sc/
[0] http://eng.supercard.sc/
Yes! Don't forget you also get GameBoy Color and GameBoy games. IMO this massive library (N3DS, 3DS, DSi, DS, GBA, GBC, GB, SNES, NES) has at least 10 "must play before death" games in them (for people that care a lot about videogames, anyway).
Of course all of this can also be achieved on a PC with a simple 10$ amazon controller and free emulators, if you're comfortable pirating games.
Of course all of this can also be achieved on a PC with a simple 10$ amazon controller and free emulators, if you're comfortable pirating games.
Edit: You're right, that was rude of me lmao. This is an UNORDERED LIST:
1. Super Mario Bros 3
2. The Legend of Zelda (1986)
3. Super Metroid (1994)
4. The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past
5. Super Castlevania
6. Pokemon: Silver/Gold
7. Advance Wars: Dual Strike
8. Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (tecccchnically an n64 game though) (Majora's Mask would make this list if the DS version wasn't a butchered shadow of the original)
9. Metroid: Fusion
10. Like... ANY of the billion Final Fantasies available between NES and N3DS
edit: 11. Mario 64 baybbeeeeeeeee
1. Super Mario Bros 3
2. The Legend of Zelda (1986)
3. Super Metroid (1994)
4. The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past
5. Super Castlevania
6. Pokemon: Silver/Gold
7. Advance Wars: Dual Strike
8. Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time (tecccchnically an n64 game though) (Majora's Mask would make this list if the DS version wasn't a butchered shadow of the original)
9. Metroid: Fusion
10. Like... ANY of the billion Final Fantasies available between NES and N3DS
edit: 11. Mario 64 baybbeeeeeeeee
Oh shit I forgot donkey kong country!!!
I'm very curious as to why you didn't like MM3D.
They messed with the acceleration algorithm to where it was almost impossible for me to solve the lily pad jump puzzle.
They tweaked that fight where you chase the big monster around an endless forest hallway to be ABSURDLY easy.
On that note, same for the originally TERRIFYING jungle warrior fight.
Oh and the changed swimming mechanic was fucked, although I just read that they fixed it maybe?
Here's a video I think captured it well https://youtu.be/653wuaP0wzs
They tweaked that fight where you chase the big monster around an endless forest hallway to be ABSURDLY easy.
On that note, same for the originally TERRIFYING jungle warrior fight.
Oh and the changed swimming mechanic was fucked, although I just read that they fixed it maybe?
Here's a video I think captured it well https://youtu.be/653wuaP0wzs
So many questions. Like, do you really need pokemon to live?
And why specifically Super Castlevania, which is regarded as kind of a garbage castlevania (the player sprite is bigger so you get less of a heads up on whats ahead, and it's not part of the "metrovania" pantheon).
Why Fusion and Super Metroid?
Does the original LoZ hold up as well as say Link's Awakening?
Why are there only 3 companies represented on this list? Did Capcom run over your pet dog?
And why specifically Super Castlevania, which is regarded as kind of a garbage castlevania (the player sprite is bigger so you get less of a heads up on whats ahead, and it's not part of the "metrovania" pantheon).
Why Fusion and Super Metroid?
Does the original LoZ hold up as well as say Link's Awakening?
Why are there only 3 companies represented on this list? Did Capcom run over your pet dog?
> Does the original LoZ hold up as well as say Link's Awakening?
If you're only going to play one LoZ, play A Link to the Past. (I think "play the 3rd game" is pretty good advice for a lot of Nintendo series.) ALttP is when they figured out the formula; I played it after I played most of the others, and after playing it every other LoZ (at least the 2D ones) all kinda felt like a copy of ALttP, like they're each just remaking a different aspect of it (and adding in their own little gimmick).
The original LoZ holds up, but is a very different game than the later games. The world is empty for you, there are no towns, just wilderness; it's being a kid exploring the woods behind your house, pretending you're alone in the world. The loss of sword beams when you take damage made me feel that taking damage is getting hurt, rather than just some meter in the corner of the screen that I need to keep up; more so than any other game.
If you're only going to play one LoZ, play A Link to the Past. (I think "play the 3rd game" is pretty good advice for a lot of Nintendo series.) ALttP is when they figured out the formula; I played it after I played most of the others, and after playing it every other LoZ (at least the 2D ones) all kinda felt like a copy of ALttP, like they're each just remaking a different aspect of it (and adding in their own little gimmick).
The original LoZ holds up, but is a very different game than the later games. The world is empty for you, there are no towns, just wilderness; it's being a kid exploring the woods behind your house, pretending you're alone in the world. The loss of sword beams when you take damage made me feel that taking damage is getting hurt, rather than just some meter in the corner of the screen that I need to keep up; more so than any other game.
It could be nostalgia or me remembering incorrectly, but Super Metroid felt like a shift to more story telling and environmental setting. When I first played it as a kid, in a dark room it was a bit scary. I felt as the character more than any other game I had played prior.
Super Castlevania is quite highly regarded by the Castlevania community. It's not the best Castlevania (Rondo of Blood is), but it's up there.
Really? It didn't even make polygon's top 10.
https://www.polygon.com/features/2018/10/26/18011828/best-ca...
I do respect Jeremy Parish. But as a huge Castlevania fan myself I find that list pretty surprising. Obviously there is a lot of subjectivity in something like this. But I would argue Super Castlevania is better than many of the games he put above it.
And to be totally fair, it's true SC is clunky and dated in several regards (it was a very early SNES title and it shows...) So maybe Jeremy dings it on those aspects more than others do. But I would argue it makes up for a lot of that in atmosphere, style and uniqueness.
And to be totally fair, it's true SC is clunky and dated in several regards (it was a very early SNES title and it shows...) So maybe Jeremy dings it on those aspects more than others do. But I would argue it makes up for a lot of that in atmosphere, style and uniqueness.
Mostly cause I had to have a short list. I think you should play links awakening too lol.
Fusion is lit but you super metroid is like... The OG metroidvania.
Fusion is lit but you super metroid is like... The OG metroidvania.
Metroid Fusion in my opinion was the king of Metroidvanias for a really long time. It achieved perfection.
I think there's a number of people upset it doesn't have any sequence breaks, is super linear, and much of the exploration is of the "guess and check" variety. https://youtu.be/FsZ9Bb4IW5s?t=1315
> doesn't have any sequence breaks
I would never hate on a game for this.
> super linear
point taken, but speedrunners would say otherwise.
> much of the exploration is of the "guess and check" variety.
I finished the game as a 10 year old so I think it wasn't too easy or too hard.
To each his own !
I would never hate on a game for this.
> super linear
point taken, but speedrunners would say otherwise.
> much of the exploration is of the "guess and check" variety.
I finished the game as a 10 year old so I think it wasn't too easy or too hard.
To each his own !
>I would never hate on a game for this.
I think "achieved perfection" was the bar you set =) And Super Metroid set the bar quite high.
I think "achieved perfection" was the bar you set =) And Super Metroid set the bar quite high.
Don't forget Fire Emblem. I bought my 3DS entirely for Fire Emblem.
> has at least 10 "must play before death" games
Could you make some recommendations? I'd be very interested in your list.
Could you make some recommendations? I'd be very interested in your list.
Here's my rough list of games that you can play on a 3DS that are not necessarily 3DS games that I think are "must play" type games. Does not include all games that should be on the list.
1. LoZ: Ocarina of Time 2. Super Mario 64 (ds version) 3. Donkey Kong Country Returns 4. LoZ: A Link To The Past 5. Shin Megami Tensei: IV (maybe not "must", but you should give it a shot) 6. Earthbound 7. Super Mario World
1. LoZ: Ocarina of Time 2. Super Mario 64 (ds version) 3. Donkey Kong Country Returns 4. LoZ: A Link To The Past 5. Shin Megami Tensei: IV (maybe not "must", but you should give it a shot) 6. Earthbound 7. Super Mario World
> Donkey Kong Country Returns
Pretty please, play the Wii version of this! You can use Dolphin if you want.
The 3DS port halved the framerate from 60 fps to 30 fps, and it makes a big difference! At 30 fps, the game is much too difficult—unless you play on the "adjusted" difficulty they added, and I'm pretty sure I know why they adjusted it.
Also, while I'm here I'm going to add on Kid Icarus: Uprising. I know the controls were divisive, but if you can adapt, it's a really unique and well-done action adventure. From the creator of Smash Brothers!
Pretty please, play the Wii version of this! You can use Dolphin if you want.
The 3DS port halved the framerate from 60 fps to 30 fps, and it makes a big difference! At 30 fps, the game is much too difficult—unless you play on the "adjusted" difficulty they added, and I'm pretty sure I know why they adjusted it.
Also, while I'm here I'm going to add on Kid Icarus: Uprising. I know the controls were divisive, but if you can adapt, it's a really unique and well-done action adventure. From the creator of Smash Brothers!
And a few Pokemon ones too with Emerald at the top of that list.
Oooh yes i remember playing emerald and it being my favorite, among sapphire
For GBA:
1/2. Metroid Fusion & Zero Mission
3/4. Advanced Wars 1 & 2
5/6. Golden Sun 1 & 2
7. Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced
8. Kirby and the Amazing Mirror
9. The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap
10. Mario & Luigi Superstar Saga
There were also 3 great Castlevania's, 3 great Sonic Advanced, 2 or 3 Fire Emblems, I enjoyed the 3 Dragon Ball Z RPGs, I enjoyed the newer Pokemon Emerald and throwback FireRed (QoL improvements). Final Fantasy 6 is available.
Really, a flash cart was very much a worthwhile investment (and a larger capacity battery) for my gameboy micro. Would recommend EZ-Flash IV.
1/2. Metroid Fusion & Zero Mission
3/4. Advanced Wars 1 & 2
5/6. Golden Sun 1 & 2
7. Final Fantasy Tactics Advanced
8. Kirby and the Amazing Mirror
9. The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap
10. Mario & Luigi Superstar Saga
There were also 3 great Castlevania's, 3 great Sonic Advanced, 2 or 3 Fire Emblems, I enjoyed the 3 Dragon Ball Z RPGs, I enjoyed the newer Pokemon Emerald and throwback FireRed (QoL improvements). Final Fantasy 6 is available.
Really, a flash cart was very much a worthwhile investment (and a larger capacity battery) for my gameboy micro. Would recommend EZ-Flash IV.
Sorry, you're right https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24508604
I’ve played a GBA and a DS game on emulator and this is far from the real experience, especially for the DS one. The new 3DS, DS lite and GBA SP are such nice hardware it’s part of the experience.
Oh come now! You can't say 10 games you must play before you die and leave us hanging!
I'll be disappointed if Super Metroid doesn't make this list of yours.
Super Metroid is available on Switch Online. Super Mario RPG would be my pick from here that is almost impossible to find legally.
I wasn't big into RPGs growing up, and I didn't even have a Super Nintendo, but I bought a Mini SNES last year and gave it a shot...I was floored at how enjoyable the game is. I got pretty deep into it but life and work and everything got in the way, and now it's been so long that I want to go back to it but would be completely lost...but I'm looking forward to starting over again when I've got some free time to dig into it again.
Super Mario RPG is on the SNES Classic.
I was confused by this article because the 3DS has been unavailable for months now (except for random editions from Amazon sellers for above MSRP).
The main change seems to be them removing the 3DS page from the Nintendo website? My impression was that they stopped making them long ago and were only making new versions of the 2DS (which kind of defeats the entire purpose of the device).
They also don't make enough Switch consoles to meet demand, and they don't update basic things with their software (friend codes really?)
I'm not sure what the culture is like at Nintendo, but there's a lot of low hanging fruit that would make things a lot better (and make them a lot more money at the same time).
The main change seems to be them removing the 3DS page from the Nintendo website? My impression was that they stopped making them long ago and were only making new versions of the 2DS (which kind of defeats the entire purpose of the device).
They also don't make enough Switch consoles to meet demand, and they don't update basic things with their software (friend codes really?)
I'm not sure what the culture is like at Nintendo, but there's a lot of low hanging fruit that would make things a lot better (and make them a lot more money at the same time).
I don't think the 2DS defeats the purpose of the device. The 3D aspect was by design only used in optional ways by nearly all developers and the 2DS as a great, cheaper, lighter alternative to the original. If anything it makes the handheld more focused and useful by stripping away something that was never really effective to begin with.
In my case I was trying to get a gift for a friend who plays a lot of monster hunter world and the 3D apparently helps with gameplay since being able to sense the depth makes it easier to fight the monsters.
By “defeat the purpose” I just meant that a version of the 3DS without the 3D part isn’t really the same thing.
I generally find Nintendo the company frustrating to interact with when trying to buy things from them.
By “defeat the purpose” I just meant that a version of the 3DS without the 3D part isn’t really the same thing.
I generally find Nintendo the company frustrating to interact with when trying to buy things from them.
if 2DS was foldable I would buy it instead of 3DS. Didn't really care about the 3D.
The New 2DS is the foldable version.
Friend codes and generally Nintendo's online service being poor is a conscious decision. They really don't want players chatting with each other, as they want it to be a safe place for children.
This is just an excuse for bad design.
You can make good online services that are still safe for children (and they wouldn't have friend codes).
You can make good online services that are still safe for children (and they wouldn't have friend codes).
Personally I think the PS Vita is just as good, if not an even better value. You can get lightly used ones for around 80-100€ and they have a very nice OLED and a fast CPU. They can emulate pretty much anything up to PS1/N64.
PS Vita game library is nowhere near as strong though. It is another cool cheap device for homebrew.
Vita runs PSP games and PS1 games, so it's a strong library if you don't have a PSP already.
[deleted]
I would say a DSi XL is the best choice for original DS games though, you get a larger screen with the exact same resolution as DS games play in and you get possibly the nicest and most durable of Nintendo's portable designs.
The DSi as of last year is pretty hackable in itself too.
I got one basically as a bonus in an ebay auction a few months back along with a 3DS I was getting for a friend and I've found myself playing original DS games on it more than I ever did on my own New 3DS XL so I was almost certainly picking up on the iffiness of the upscaling to fill the screen.
I got one basically as a bonus in an ebay auction a few months back along with a 3DS I was getting for a friend and I've found myself playing original DS games on it more than I ever did on my own New 3DS XL so I was almost certainly picking up on the iffiness of the upscaling to fill the screen.
The DSi is great too of course, but if the scaling of DS games is a problem for you on a 3DS you can display the games unscaled/letterboxed by launching the game (or TwilightMenu) while holding Select or Start. I too much prefer displaying them without the bar scaling. The same trick works for Virtual Console games including GBA titles.
Seconding this, the platform can be blown wide open and has an amazing library of both homebrew and official games.
I've recently been eyeing the 3DS, do you have a specific model that you would recommend over others?
I’m not OP but my favourite is the regular sized New 3DS. However this model initially only came out in Europe and Japan, and came to the US later, so depending on your location you may find it more difficult to find than the XL model.
But it’s the ideal size IMO, and it has swappable faceplates and Super Famicom coloured buttons, if you’re into that kind of thing.
But it’s the ideal size IMO, and it has swappable faceplates and Super Famicom coloured buttons, if you’re into that kind of thing.
Just a heads-up, you can get a great-condition 3DS (or 2DS) cheaply from Nintendo directly: https://store.nintendo.com/nintendo-3ds-2ds/refurbished.html
Beyond playing games, can you use them for anything else? How hard is it to program them?
While the majority of existing homebrew are either games or emulators, the systems are not limited to just playing games and there are a few options for programming them. devkitPro[0] provides a cross-compiling toolchain for 3ds homebrew development, if you are comfortable with C/C++ it is not all that difficult to program on the platform. There are several "portlibs" including SDL (SDL1 not SDL2 unfortunately) provided by devkitPro, which come in handy if you don't want to learn low level 3ds-specific APIs. There are also some homebrew game engines[1] that allow running Lua-based programs, though I haven't tried these myself.
[0] https://devkitpro.org/wiki/Getting_Started [1] https://www.3dbrew.org/wiki/Homebrew_Applications#Game_Engin...
[0] https://devkitpro.org/wiki/Getting_Started [1] https://www.3dbrew.org/wiki/Homebrew_Applications#Game_Engin...
A 3D graphing calculator would be quite cool, I think.
I have the HP Prime that is basically this. The programming language is pretty terrible but you can get pretty impressive 3D plots (with touchscreen as well!) if you install a plugin
What's a good website for this scene?
https://gbatemp.net/categories/nintendo-3ds-discussions.198/ and https://www.reddit.com/r/3dshacks/ for discussion. The best resource for jailbreaking your 3DS would be here: https://3ds.hacks.guide
I've been playing games all my life on many different platforms, but some of the best fun I've ever had has been on handhelds.
Even when I also have the PC or console version, some games just feel more at home on a handheld, and more appealing when you don't have to commit to a whole session of playing them.
On one hand, handhelds take less focus than sitting in one place staring in one direction, so you can play on them in bite-sized breaks, putting them away at any time and instantly resuming where you left off.
But on the other hand, something so close to your face, that you can snuggle with in any position anywhere, also has a level of intimacy not found in bigger screens and bulkier controls.
Nothing can compare to dozing off in bed while engrossed in a game with a captivating story, mechanics, and music..
Laptops are too bulky, and phones or tablets don't have built-in physical controls.
Which is why I'm a bit concerned about there being only one handheld left. The Vita was amazing and I still love it but Sony did everything they could to kill it off, and the Switch's success hasn't inspired them to try again.
If anyone feels like making a new handheld that anyone can develop for, my money is yours. :)
Even when I also have the PC or console version, some games just feel more at home on a handheld, and more appealing when you don't have to commit to a whole session of playing them.
On one hand, handhelds take less focus than sitting in one place staring in one direction, so you can play on them in bite-sized breaks, putting them away at any time and instantly resuming where you left off.
But on the other hand, something so close to your face, that you can snuggle with in any position anywhere, also has a level of intimacy not found in bigger screens and bulkier controls.
Nothing can compare to dozing off in bed while engrossed in a game with a captivating story, mechanics, and music..
Laptops are too bulky, and phones or tablets don't have built-in physical controls.
Which is why I'm a bit concerned about there being only one handheld left. The Vita was amazing and I still love it but Sony did everything they could to kill it off, and the Switch's success hasn't inspired them to try again.
If anyone feels like making a new handheld that anyone can develop for, my money is yours. :)
There are a whole bunch of those OGA-derived handhelds (see https://obscurehandhelds.com/). I have an RGB10 on its way to me right now. Unfortunately, the library of native titles is very, very small, basically just Tux Kart and whatever open source engine recreations have been packaged for the particular distro you're running on it. So it's mostly about emulation, which means that what you're seeing is a pretty far cry from the "real" capabilities of what that processor could do on a 480x320 display. For my part, I'm hoping to get the toolchain set up enough to try compiling OpenJazz for it.
On the other side of things are deliberately wacky low-powered, lo-fi devices with novel distribution mechanisms, like Playdate: https://play.date/
On the other side of things are deliberately wacky low-powered, lo-fi devices with novel distribution mechanisms, like Playdate: https://play.date/
Ah thanks, some of these look pretty cool, like the Retroid 2 and the RG350, and I love Panic so of course I know about the Playdate. :)
The problem as you say is the lack of native titles, and an uncertainty about how long the devices will be supported for. In this day and age an official distribution channel like the App Store/eShop is important too, even if it's just a website you can download from onto an SD card.
But I'll try one of these out!
The problem as you say is the lack of native titles, and an uncertainty about how long the devices will be supported for. In this day and age an official distribution channel like the App Store/eShop is important too, even if it's just a website you can download from onto an SD card.
But I'll try one of these out!
The whole value proposition of emulation handhelds pretty much assumes rampant piracy of old titles, which gets especially murky when you have, say, a SNES game which is abandonware, clearly unavailable except at collector prices, whatever, but then it got remastered for the GBA or DS, and is definitely still available for purchase in the 3DS online store (alarm bells).
Besides that the population of these devices is relatively small, it seems there are a lot of subtle incompatibilities between them too, in terms of button quantity and layout, number of analog sticks (ranges from zero to two), etc.
So yeah, I'm sure someone will try it at some point, but it's not hard to see that this isn't a super appealing target for trying to stand up a paid app store. The best-case scenario I could imagine would be an all-you-can-eat Netflix-style affair where you pay $10/mo for access to a rotating catalogue of titles that are a mix of native ports, emulation under legal license, etc. On the other hand, if legal emulation was part of the pitch, it's hard to imagine it going anywhere without classic NES and SNES titles, and Nintendo would have basically zero incentive to legitimize such an effort by playing ball with it, when they're actively selling those titles under emulation on their own storefronts for their own hardware.
Besides that the population of these devices is relatively small, it seems there are a lot of subtle incompatibilities between them too, in terms of button quantity and layout, number of analog sticks (ranges from zero to two), etc.
So yeah, I'm sure someone will try it at some point, but it's not hard to see that this isn't a super appealing target for trying to stand up a paid app store. The best-case scenario I could imagine would be an all-you-can-eat Netflix-style affair where you pay $10/mo for access to a rotating catalogue of titles that are a mix of native ports, emulation under legal license, etc. On the other hand, if legal emulation was part of the pitch, it's hard to imagine it going anywhere without classic NES and SNES titles, and Nintendo would have basically zero incentive to legitimize such an effort by playing ball with it, when they're actively selling those titles under emulation on their own storefronts for their own hardware.
Phones don't need built-in physical controls. Attachable controls like the Nintendo Switch Joy-cons have been becoming more popular as phones have replaced handheld gaming system for the majority of people. The new Razer Kishi looks good though my phone is too big to fit it. ASUS ROG and Xiaomi Black Shark gaming phones also have their own official controllers.
A new handheld will probably not be able to succeed without software. That's what killed Windows Phone.
A new handheld will probably not be able to succeed without software. That's what killed Windows Phone.
[deleted]
Doing some Marie-Kondo style cleaning, found a 12 year old Nintendo DS with Advance Wars 2 cartridge.
Hadn't been plugged in for years (I don't have a charger). Turned on and played a game. Amazing.
Hadn't been plugged in for years (I don't have a charger). Turned on and played a game. Amazing.
It's a shame how many people didn't get to experience the Advance Wars series since they were only released on the GBA/DS. I think a Switch version would do really well.
There's a PC game similar to Advance Wars called War Groove. I haven't played it yet, but I've heard it's decent.
My first job coming out of college was working on a multi-platform game engine, and my first task was assembling a 3DS prototype board[1] and porting the engine over.
It was horrible and fantastic at the same time. The debugging tools were poor, most of the documentation hadn't been translated to english yet, and testing the dual-camera rendering pipeline required hunching over the desk to be in the sweet spot for the parallax to work.
I still love that kind of low-level development, but these days python and shell scripts pay the bills. RIP 3DS, and thanks for the memories.
1: https://www.engadget.com/2010-05-17-is-this-a-prototype-of-t...
It was horrible and fantastic at the same time. The debugging tools were poor, most of the documentation hadn't been translated to english yet, and testing the dual-camera rendering pipeline required hunching over the desk to be in the sweet spot for the parallax to work.
I still love that kind of low-level development, but these days python and shell scripts pay the bills. RIP 3DS, and thanks for the memories.
1: https://www.engadget.com/2010-05-17-is-this-a-prototype-of-t...
The docs were probably better than they were for the NES. Nintendo's were poor translations from the already sparse Japanese version (think of an entire book full of the Engrish found in early NES games). Australian developer Beam Software did good business writing their own NES docs that were much more user-friendly.
Dominic Arsenault goes into why this was something of a deliberate strategy for Nintendo in his book on the SNES, Super Power, Spoony Bards, and Silverware.
Dominic Arsenault goes into why this was something of a deliberate strategy for Nintendo in his book on the SNES, Super Power, Spoony Bards, and Silverware.
So it's a great time to run homebrews and emulators on it, as it's unlikely to be patched or updated.
3DS is an excellent platform to learn Japanese games. I fully recommend it.
I think it's an amazing time, and the games will stand the test of time just like the original mario series because the content is rich and great vs having to fall back on pushing systems & I/O to the max.
Nothing recently has given me as much joy as to replay N64 classics on the 3DS with better graphics, added gameplay and 100% solely in Japanese after originally growing up with them as they were released in the USA/English.
The context and general idea helped alot to drive me to replay the games and relearn vocabulary in a different language. And how the games are targeted at a young audience makes full kana or furigana available, with settings to use just Kanji if you want is fantastic.
It's something that every other learning app doesn't have for Japanese - but then again when you learn more languages you don't really go for the cultural angle, you do it to communicate and use culture as a reference point.
I think it's an amazing time, and the games will stand the test of time just like the original mario series because the content is rich and great vs having to fall back on pushing systems & I/O to the max.
Nothing recently has given me as much joy as to replay N64 classics on the 3DS with better graphics, added gameplay and 100% solely in Japanese after originally growing up with them as they were released in the USA/English.
The context and general idea helped alot to drive me to replay the games and relearn vocabulary in a different language. And how the games are targeted at a young audience makes full kana or furigana available, with settings to use just Kanji if you want is fantastic.
It's something that every other learning app doesn't have for Japanese - but then again when you learn more languages you don't really go for the cultural angle, you do it to communicate and use culture as a reference point.
The 3DS is also region-locked. If you're on a non-Japanese system, you likely won't legally be playing most games in Japanese.
Can you make some recommendations? I‘ve tried my luck with the Japanese DS Zelda games because they have furigana (either above characters or when tapping), but I couldn’t get far since there has been too much dialect. In Pokemon B/W there overall has been too much text. I didn’t try playing something I knew by heart yet tho. Are you referring to something like the N64 Zelda 3DS remakes (which are excellent)?
As with learning any language, immersion is key.
This is very late intermediate stage - to put yourself into having to read "Japanese."
I would only do it after knowing and writing/speaking Hiragana and Katakana outloud, several times, written it over and over and listening to songs (or any text, but songs have lyrics and it's easy) over and over and doing the lyrics over and over to kick in the muscle memory.
My secret, really, was learning the kana via Kyary Paymu Paymu songs. I enjoyed them, but, after doing that, over and over, the alure was lost and it took me about 3 years before I could listen to Pon Pon Pon again. But - the repetition in the song drilled down the kana for me.
If you already know Kana, then basic vocabulary/grammar. There's a great app on the Android App Store called "Kanji Study"
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.mindtwiste...
It's been further tweaked and is more refined then what it used to be, but the memory games are super useful for both kana and N5/N4 Kanji - the basic of the basics.
As for playing with a game/any game, it all falls together after a while - you see the pattern, you "get" the idea, but I would use a dictionary such as Akebi on Android or Jisho.org (Jisho literally means dictionary.) or even translate.google.com and each word you don't know, add it to a unique list and study/drill those over and over.
Soon it will come together. It's very slow at first, and painful, even though I could read Kana and had N5, I suffered reading the "warning" screens on the 3ds even though they're for kids, some of the words did not make sense, but the context was implied.
That's it, as for the games:
Pokemon is great, Zelda is also great, but if you really want to excel -
Karaoke.
You can go to youtube, and find karaoke songs to listen too - the 3dS joysound app stopped/died, but it's still on the WiiU and on the Switch and it is excellent, it offers near 100% furigana (except for very very simple kanji) and being forced to sing along makes you vocal quick.
You can also youtube "karaoke battle" or general karaoke after songs.
"カラオケバテル”
”カラオケ”
I personally enjoy lots of J-pop (which made learning the language much more easily/motivated) so I used songs I knew such as Tatsuhiro Yamashita
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rzBvkcHUz4
山下達郎 RIDE ON TIME （カラオケ）
And then just drilled on that as if it was memory cards or study drilling.
Pokemon games are good, zelda is great. Mario isn't per se as there isn't much "text" The inkling for a bit of puzzle makes it more that you need to "understand" what the meaning is, as it's different in English.
Context is much more inferred then stated in Japanese.
Phoenix Wright Professor Layton Animal Crossing
Then you can go onto some normal plain jane ds games, final fantasy and Square Enix titles are great once you're nearing the end of intermediate understanding.
This is very late intermediate stage - to put yourself into having to read "Japanese."
I would only do it after knowing and writing/speaking Hiragana and Katakana outloud, several times, written it over and over and listening to songs (or any text, but songs have lyrics and it's easy) over and over and doing the lyrics over and over to kick in the muscle memory.
My secret, really, was learning the kana via Kyary Paymu Paymu songs. I enjoyed them, but, after doing that, over and over, the alure was lost and it took me about 3 years before I could listen to Pon Pon Pon again. But - the repetition in the song drilled down the kana for me.
If you already know Kana, then basic vocabulary/grammar. There's a great app on the Android App Store called "Kanji Study"
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.mindtwiste...
It's been further tweaked and is more refined then what it used to be, but the memory games are super useful for both kana and N5/N4 Kanji - the basic of the basics.
As for playing with a game/any game, it all falls together after a while - you see the pattern, you "get" the idea, but I would use a dictionary such as Akebi on Android or Jisho.org (Jisho literally means dictionary.) or even translate.google.com and each word you don't know, add it to a unique list and study/drill those over and over.
Soon it will come together. It's very slow at first, and painful, even though I could read Kana and had N5, I suffered reading the "warning" screens on the 3ds even though they're for kids, some of the words did not make sense, but the context was implied.
That's it, as for the games:
Pokemon is great, Zelda is also great, but if you really want to excel -
Karaoke.
You can go to youtube, and find karaoke songs to listen too - the 3dS joysound app stopped/died, but it's still on the WiiU and on the Switch and it is excellent, it offers near 100% furigana (except for very very simple kanji) and being forced to sing along makes you vocal quick.
You can also youtube "karaoke battle" or general karaoke after songs.
"カラオケバテル”
”カラオケ”
I personally enjoy lots of J-pop (which made learning the language much more easily/motivated) so I used songs I knew such as Tatsuhiro Yamashita
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rzBvkcHUz4
山下達郎 RIDE ON TIME （カラオケ）
And then just drilled on that as if it was memory cards or study drilling.
Pokemon games are good, zelda is great. Mario isn't per se as there isn't much "text" The inkling for a bit of puzzle makes it more that you need to "understand" what the meaning is, as it's different in English.
Context is much more inferred then stated in Japanese.
Phoenix Wright Professor Layton Animal Crossing
Then you can go onto some normal plain jane ds games, final fantasy and Square Enix titles are great once you're nearing the end of intermediate understanding.
Ever since the 3DS launch I found myself hoping for an upgraded version that would render at a higher resolution. 400x240 has always looked terrible to me for 3D graphics.
[deleted]
Coming soon--All your favorite 3DS classics on the Nintendo Switch for $20 each!
Finally portable gaming console platform is dead now. Why portable-only form factor isn't accepted well nowadays? (Switch is the replacement with hybrid design)
Phones have replaced it for the majority of people. The same way they killed mp3 players and point-and-shoot cameras by being good enough.
Are there any other programs like SmileBasic? Maybe Squeak, APL/J/K, Lisp?
Or maybe are there any better ways to input text into a 3DS?
Or maybe are there any better ways to input text into a 3DS?